Re: [css-d] unwanted borders around a tags in IE8
dave higgs wrote: Hi On the six button menu at www.autobarn-cars.co.uk I see boxes around my links in IE8. They are not there in Firefox or Chrome. Each of the six buttons has the below javascript which does the rollover effect. I am here showing the last two buttons, buttons 5 and 6 Button 6 has no javascript and noa tag because this particular code resides in the contact.htm page itself so I do not need to have button 6 respond as it goes nowhere (we are already at the contact.htm page) When I temporarily surround the img tag in button 6 with aA tag (just like button 5), the box appears which tells me thea tag is causing the box problem I hope that explains the problem sufficiently as this is my first post many thanks in advance for your advice Well, where does one start ? The real problem, as far as I can see, is that whilst you are using JavaScript to accomplish the effects for which you are aiming, there is no evidence at all from the code that you have posted that you are also using CSS, and this is a list that is intended to deal with CSS-related issues. If you are using CSS, and you can point us to it, then we may be able to offer some help, but whilst I too have many questions related to cross-browser compatibility using JavaScript, I do not believe that this is the most appropriate forum in which to raise them Philip Taylor __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] unwanted borders around a tags in IE8
2011-11-29 12:28, dave higgs wrote:
On the six button menu at www.autobarn-cars.co.uk I see boxes around
my links in IE8.
They are not there in Firefox or Chrome.
The reason is that browsers traditionally draw borders around images
that are links or, more exactly, for any img element that is inside an
a element that has an href attribute. Some browsers have abandoned the
tradition.
To suggest that no such border be drawn, use
img { border: none; }
in your stylesheet.
Yucca
P.S. The tradition was based on the idea that users need to see that an
image is a link from its appearance. The border color also reflects the
state of the link (unvisited, visited, active, hovered). But authors did
not like this idea in situations where they thought that it was obvious
which images are links
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Re: [css-d] unwanted borders around a tags in IE8
On 11/29/11 6:04 AM, Jukka K. Korpela wrote:
2011-11-29 12:28, dave higgs wrote:
On the six button menu at www.autobarn-cars.co.uk I see boxes around
my links in IE8.
They are not there in Firefox or Chrome.
The reason is that browsers traditionally draw borders around images
that are links or, more exactly, for any img element that is inside
an a element that has an href attribute. Some browsers have
abandoned the tradition.
To suggest that no such border be drawn, use
img { border: none; }
in your stylesheet.
Yucca
P.S. The tradition was based on the idea that users need to see that
an image is a link from its appearance. The border color also reflects
the state of the link (unvisited, visited, active, hovered). But
authors did not like this idea in situations where they thought that
it was obvious which images are links
Above +1.
aside
You may want to fix your broken doctype.
~d
--
Desktop. Laptop. Tablet. Mobile!
http://chelseacreekstudio.com/
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Re: [css-d] unwanted borders around a tags in IE8
On Tue, 29 Nov 2011 10:28:38 -, dave higgs wrote: | Hi | On the six button menu at www.autobarn-cars.co.uk I see boxes around my links in IE8. They are not there in Firefox or Chrome. Each of the six buttons has the below javascript which does the rollover effect. I am here showing the last two buttons, buttons 5 and 6 | Button 6 has no javascript and no a tag because this particular code resides in the contact.htm page itself so I do not need to have button 6 respond as it goes nowhere (we are already at the contact.htm page) snip You also have a bunch of errors in your html: http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.autobarn-cars.co.uk%2F -- David Postill Dance your Life - Biodanza in Holland - http://www.danceyourlife.eu __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] unwanted borders around a tags in IE8
Philip oops, you are right. Although I do use an external style sheet, the suspect HTML code does not have any CSS applied to it so I am in the wrong list! Thanks anyway for your kind reply. I'll go and try and find an appropriate list regards Dave - Original Message - From: Philip TAYLOR p.tay...@rhul.ac.uk To: dave higgs da...@higgsy.com Cc: css-d@lists.css-discuss.org Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2011 10:34 AM Subject: Re: [css-d] unwanted borders around a tags in IE8 dave higgs wrote: Hi On the six button menu at www.autobarn-cars.co.uk I see boxes around my links in IE8. They are not there in Firefox or Chrome. Each of the six buttons has the below javascript which does the rollover effect. I am here showing the last two buttons, buttons 5 and 6 Button 6 has no javascript and noa tag because this particular code resides in the contact.htm page itself so I do not need to have button 6 respond as it goes nowhere (we are already at the contact.htm page) When I temporarily surround the img tag in button 6 with aA tag (just like button 5), the box appears which tells me thea tag is causing the box problem I hope that explains the problem sufficiently as this is my first post many thanks in advance for your advice Well, where does one start ? The real problem, as far as I can see, is that whilst you are using JavaScript to accomplish the effects for which you are aiming, there is no evidence at all from the code that you have posted that you are also using CSS, and this is a list that is intended to deal with CSS-related issues. If you are using CSS, and you can point us to it, then we may be able to offer some help, but whilst I too have many questions related to cross-browser compatibility using JavaScript, I do not believe that this is the most appropriate forum in which to raise them Philip Taylor __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Border: Double
On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 17:36, Paceaux pace...@madebypaceaux.com wrote:
There's another CSS3 trick you can try, but I don't think it has as wide
support as the box-shadow trick. You *do* add border and outline, and then
apply outline-offset:
border: 1px solid #444;
outline: 3px solid #444;
outline-offset: 3px;
Just a word of warning to anyone using outline and Opera: Opera renders the
outline on top of everything, even if it would normally be invisible. This
makes outline useless to anyone with a complex layout who cares about Opera
support.
Sample:
style
#a, #b {
height: 100px;
width: 100px;
position: absolute;
border: 1px solid green;
}
#b {
border: 1px inset red;
background-color: blue;
}
#aa {
margin: 30px auto;
height: 40px;
width: 40px;
background-color: pink;
outline: 1px solid pink;
}
/style
/head
body
div id=adiv id=aa/div/div
div id=b/div
/body
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[css-d] [media queries] support for *-device-pixel-ratio
Hello everybody, looking into the possibilities of CSS media queries I found several sources that recommend using /min-device-pixel-ratio/ (and friends) to check for high-resolution screens. Apparently this is implemented in the form of several prefixed versions in webkit, Opera and Gecko. Alas, the Media Queries CSS3-spec [1] does not mention it. Is this query supported? Will it be supported in the future? Is its usage recommended? As always, pointers, hints, nudges in the right direction are very much appreciated. Jørgen Lang [1]: http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-mediaqueries/ __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] unwanted borders around a tags in IE8
2011-11-29 14:00, dave higgs wrote:
Although I do use an external style sheet, the
suspect HTML code does not have any CSS applied to it so I am in the
wrong list!
The question was on-topic in the list as it was about a presentational
feature, and although CSS did not create the problem, it can solve it.
(I guess people may have been confused because you mentioned the use of
JavaScript and quoted a block of JavaScript code. That code does not
relate to the question; it's functionality, not presentation, and the
issue is exactly the same if JavaScript execution is disabled.)
Although the borders around an image that is a link _can_ be removed
using HTML, too (using the attribute border=0 in each img tag), the
CSS way (img { border: 0 }) is simpler and keeps the markup cleaner.
A completely different approach would be to replace the images by styled
text, using a background image for the texts. The image would then be
like the current images but without any text (and similarly for the
hover version). There would be no image border issue then. There would
be the issue of link colors and underline for the texts, but they can be
handled easily in CSS.
Such a technique is usually better because it is more flexible. If you
wish to change some of texts in the links or add a link, you wouldn't
need to edit any images. And there is no alt text issue (now there is -
your img tags are missing alt attributes). The drawback (if it is a
drawback) is that you could only use such fonts that are supported by
people's browsers (or use web fonts, @font face), and if users force
their preferences on fonts sizes (which is what they _can_ do), the
texts might run out of button-like image backgrounds.
Yucca
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Re: [css-d] [media queries] support for *-device-pixel-ratio
On 11/29/11 8:58 AM, Joergen W. Lang wrote: looking into the possibilities of CSS media queries I found several sources that recommend using /min-device-pixel-ratio/ (and friends) to check for high-resolution screens. Apparently this is implemented in the form of several prefixed versions in webkit, Opera and Gecko. Jørgen Lang [1]: http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-mediaqueries/ Nothing beats putting up a page and trying stuff out and personally seeing if whatever works or not. It probably does work in some situations for some authors particularly those who dwell in the twilight zone of setting desktop and laptop content fonts at less or far less than default... the 10px, 11px, and 12px for primary content crowd, for example. Authors who may not be in that crowd may find that this will do the trick for desktop, laptop, tablets, and mobile handsets meta name=viewport content=width=device-width. I don't think there is a definitive answer to your question, other than that-- it depends. ~d -- Desktop. Laptop. Tablet. Mobile! http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Border: Double
Thanks, Mark!
Is this a known defect/bug in Opera?
I can't imagine a scenario where I'd intentionally apply an outline to an
invisible element. But, I can see this as a good bit of information where
we've gotten our selectors wrong, or some sort of JavaScript was applied
incorrectly - and we see a box on our page for no good reason. I use outline
for doing wireframes, so this is good to know.
My guess is that this happens because outline is not supposed to be part of the
layout - unlike border. I think I read in Meyer's book Smashing CSS that the
outline is meant to be drawn around the element. So it looks like Opera maybe
is following the letter of the law, while the other browsers are assuming you
don't want to outline what's invisible.
/email
signature id=paceaux
Frank M Taylor
http://frankmtaylor.com
@paceaux
/signature
On Nov 29, 2011, at 6:42 AM, Mark Richards wrote:
On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 17:36, Paceaux pace...@madebypaceaux.com wrote:
There's another CSS3 trick you can try, but I don't think it has as wide
support as the box-shadow trick. You *do* add border and outline, and then
apply outline-offset:
border: 1px solid #444;
outline: 3px solid #444;
outline-offset: 3px;
Just a word of warning to anyone using outline and Opera: Opera renders the
outline on top of everything, even if it would normally be invisible. This
makes outline useless to anyone with a complex layout who cares about Opera
support.
Sample:
style
#a, #b {
height: 100px;
width: 100px;
position: absolute;
border: 1px solid green;
}
#b {
border: 1px inset red;
background-color: blue;
}
#aa {
margin: 30px auto;
height: 40px;
width: 40px;
background-color: pink;
outline: 1px solid pink;
}
/style
/head
body
div id=adiv id=aa/div/div
div id=b/div
/body
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[css-d] CSS WAS NOT Being Picked Up By Most Browsers
Hi Everyone, Just started building out a new site I'm working on and I just figured out why there were only 2 browsers picking up the CSS, Safari Chrome, while the rest didn't and yet both my CSS and document validated. I had text/javascript under the type attribute of my link tags. It has since been corrected but I'm left wondering why the document actually validated as well written mark up? Elli Vizcaino Helping artists, entrepreneurs and small businesses look like rock stars knock the socks off the competition! http://www.e7flux.com __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] CSS WAS NOT Being Picked Up By Most Browsers
2011-11-29 19:07, Elli Vizcaino wrote: Just started building out a new site I'm working on and I just figured out why there were only 2 browsers picking up the CSS, Safari Chrome, while the rest didn't and yet both my CSS and document validated. I had text/javascript under the type attribute of my link tags. If a browser interprets the content as CSS, then that's a bug. The purpose of the type attribute in link rel=stylesheet ... is to specify the stylesheet language. It is in practice defaulted to CSS, and CSS is for most purposes the only stylesheet language that can be used for HTML documents. But if you do specify the attribute, then the browser is required to interpret the content according to it. And since JavaScript is not a stylesheet language, the contents should be ignored. In practice it is best to omit the type attribute, since it serves no useful purpose but can cause harm if misspelled. Markup validators in the old (SGML) sense of the word only verify compliance to a formalized syntax. For the type attribute, this basically means anything goes. In HTML5 validation, the attribute value is checked to be a correctly formed Internet media type, such as foo/bar, but it does not even check that the type is a registered one, still less that denotes (for example) a stylesheet. Yucca __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] CSS WAS NOT Being Picked Up By Most Browsers
In practice it is best to omit the type attribute, since it serves no useful purpose but can cause harm if misspelled. Thanks! I thought the type attribute was required. So w/o it, a document will still validate and be interpreted as it should be? Elli Vizcaino Helping artists, entrepreneurs and small businesses look like rock stars knock the socks off the competition! http://www.e7flux.com __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] CSS WAS NOT Being Picked Up By Most Browsers
2011-11-29 19:39, Elli Vizcaino wrote: In practice it is best to omit the type attribute, since it serves no useful purpose but can cause harm if misspelled. Thanks! I thought the type attribute was required. It's required in HTML 4. In HTML5 drafts, it isn't. So w/o it, a document will still validate and be interpreted as it should be? Browsers treat the content as a CSS stylesheet, yes. No, the HTML markup won't validate, unless you're using HTML5. Yucca __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] CSS WAS NOT Being Picked Up By Most Browsers
2011-11-29 19:39, Elli Vizcaino wrote: In practice it is best to omit the type attribute, since it serves no useful purpose but can cause harm if misspelled. Thanks! I thought the type attribute was required. It's required in HTML 4. In HTML5 drafts, it isn't. So w/o it, a document will still validate and be interpreted as it should be? Browsers treat the content as a CSS stylesheet, yes. No, the HTML markup won't validate, unless you're using HTML5. Yucca Got it. Thanks! Elli __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
[css-d] using image in background of h1 heading
Hello,
I am trying to make an image as a background on an h1. Here is my test page:
http://sbctc.edu/college/_i-ctclinkTEST.aspx .
It works fine, but is there some way to make the text display if images are
off? Right now it is positioned off the page. I wish there c
Here is the css:
h1.headerReplacement {
text-indent: -px;
width: 135px;
height: 40px;
background: url('/imgs/it/ctcLink.jpg') no-repeat;
}
Angela French
Internet Specialist
State Board for Community and Technical Colleges
360-704-4316
afre...@sbctc.edu
http://www.checkoutacollege.com/
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Re: [css-d] Border: Double
On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 11:14, Paceaux pace...@madebypaceaux.com wrote: Is this a known defect/bug in Opera? I can't imagine a scenario where I'd intentionally apply an outline to an invisible element. But, I can see this as a good bit of information where we've gotten our selectors wrong, or some sort of JavaScript was applied incorrectly - and we see a box on our page for no good reason. I use outline for doing wireframes, so this is good to know. My guess is that this happens because outline is not supposed to be part of the layout - unlike border. I think I read in Meyer's book Smashing CSS that the outline is meant to be drawn around the element. So it looks like Opera maybe is following the letter of the law, while the other browsers are assuming you don't want to outline what's invisible. According to http://my.opera.com/community/forums/topic.dml?id=264982 This is by design, they assume that this is what the spec wanted, even though they seem to be completely alone in this regard, and as far as I'm concerned, this behaviour is useless. Mark __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] using image in background of h1 heading
2011-11-29 22:04, Angela French wrote:
I am trying to make an image as a background on an h1.
Here is my test page: http://sbctc.edu/college/_i-ctclinkTEST.aspx .
It works fine, but is there some way to make the text display if images are off?
I'm afraid there isn't:
Most image replacement techniques suffer from serious accessibility
problems for users who turn images off [...] but CSS on.
http://css-discuss.incutio.com/wiki/Image_Replacement
Is there any reason not to use the simple method, which does not need
CSS at all but may be augmented with it:
h1img alt=C.T.C. Link src=/imgs/it/ctcLink.jpg/h1
You would then probably want to set
h1 { margin: 0; }
h1 img { vertical-align: bottom; }
to remove the default margins and the effect of the image sitting on the
baseline of text; they could disturb the layout when the image is used
(normal case).
You could additionally have font and color settings, which would mostly
have no effect on the image but would style the text (on good browsers
at least) when the alt text is used instead.
However, font size would affect the height, so it would probably be best
to set the h1 element's line-height to the height of the image, e.g.
h1 img { line-height: 32px; }
This means that the font size should be something that probably sits
well for that line-height. This could even be one of the rare cases
where they are good reasons to set the font size in pixels in an author
(page) stylesheet.
This approach also means that when the page is printed, the heading is
included, as an image (when images are on) or as (styled) text. Image
replacement techniques may fail on printing: the heading isn't there at
all, as an image or as text.
Yucca
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Re: [css-d] [media queries] support for *-device-pixel-ratio
Am 29.11.11 17:11, schrieb David Laakso: On 11/29/11 8:58 AM, Joergen W. Lang wrote: looking into the possibilities of CSS media queries I found several sources that recommend using /min-device-pixel-ratio/ (and friends) to check for high-resolution screens. Apparently this is implemented in the form of several prefixed versions in webkit, Opera and Gecko. [...] I don't think there is a definitive answer to your question, other than that-- it depends. Oh, sorry. Let me rephrase. My initial questions Is this query supported? Will it be supported in the future? Is its usage recommended? were referring to support/endorsement by any official specification or recommendation. Did I miss something? Yet, if anybody out there knows more, I'd appreciate your answer. Jørgen Lang __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] Border: Double
On Nov 30, 2011, at 5:07 AM, Mark Richards wrote: According to http://my.opera.com/community/forums/topic.dml?id=264982 This is by design, they assume that this is what the spec wanted, even though they seem to be completely alone in this regard, and as far as I'm concerned, this behaviour is useless. Seems to me that Opera has a completely different reading of Appendix E than everybody else. At least as far as the level where outline is painted (and I think the wording of said appendix E changed slightly since that forum thread –2009– to make clear what should happen). Iirc, old geckos had a similar bug, Firefox 2.0 or thereabout ? Philippe -- Philippe Wittenbergh http://l-c-n.com/ __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
Re: [css-d] [media queries] support for *-device-pixel-ratio
On Nov 30, 2011, at 6:16 AM, Joergen W. Lang wrote: Is this query supported? Will it be supported in the future? Is its usage recommended? were referring to support/endorsement by any official specification or recommendation. Did I miss something? Yet, if anybody out there knows more, I'd appreciate your answer. As far as I can tell, those queries are not yet part of any official document. Presumably it will go into a future css4-mediaqueries module (I see no reason why it wouldn't happen, given extensive prefixed browsers support, but my crystal ball is rather cloudy and I can't see the future :-( ) Note that Opera – as of 10.5 – uses a slightly different value that Gecko/WebKit: @media screen and (min--moz-device-pixel-ratio: 1.5), screen and (-webkit-min-device-pixel-ratio:1.5), only screen and (-o-min-device-pixel-ratio: 3/2) Philippe -- Philippe Wittenbergh http://l-c-n.com/ __ css-discuss [css-d@lists.css-discuss.org] http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/ List policies -- http://css-discuss.org/policies.html Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
