[CTRL] Bank of England in court over BCCI collapse

2004-01-13 Thread Jim Rarey
-Caveat Lector-



http://news.ft.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=FT.com/StoryFT/FullStoryc=StoryFTcid=1073280984276p=1012571727088




  
  

  


  









  
  

  
 



  
  

  


  


  
  


  
  

  



  
  

  


  

  Bank of England in court over BCCI 
collapse

  By Nikki Tait

  Published: January 13 2004 10:14 | Last Updated: 
January 13 2004 10:14

  

  
The reputation of the Bank of England is in the dock on 
Tuesday,as it faces on the beginning of a court case in London 
over its role in the world's biggest bank fraud.
The case of the liquidator of Bank of Credit and Commerce 
International versus the Old Lady of Threadneedle Streethas 
taken more than a decade to come to court andis expected to 
last 18 months and could cost the bank £1bn in damages.
It is a saga which one Bank official described as having "the 
ghastly inevitability of a Greek tragedy". His comment in January 
1987 came in an internal supervisory department memo as debate over 
how to handle the maverick BCCI intensified between international 
regulators.
Four years later, the insight proved painfully accurate: the 
long-suspect, Middle Eastern-owned bank collapsed owing more than 
£10bn. Even after the likes of Enron and Parmalat, it still counts 
as one of the world's biggest corporate demises. On Tuesday, the Old 
Lady can only hope cool reason rather than Greek histrionics will 
permeate courtroom 73 at the Royal Courts of Justice.
Deloitte  Touche, the BCCI liquidators, are alleging that 
officials in the central bank's supervisory division were so 
reckless in the way they oversaw BCCI that they wittingly put 
depositors at risk.
The Bank has statutory immunity against charges of negligence 
but, after a long legal fight, the liquidators have won the right to 
bring the case as a more demanding "misfeasance in public office" 
claim. This is a rarely-argued tort, although it has been invoked 
recently by Railtrack shareholders in their damages case against the 
Department for Transport. It requires the claimants to prove bad 
faith - in effect, dishonesty - on the Bank's part.
The potential sums involved are substantial. Since BCCI's 
collapse, DT has recovered and repaid to creditors about 75 per 
cent of their money. But if the liquidators can prove the Bank's 
misfeasance stretched back to the first BCCI licensing decision in 
1980, damages against the Bank, including interest, could yield 
another £1bn.
The sheer dimensions of the case will be extraordinary. Gordon 
Pollock, a top-charging barrister with a flamboyant turn of phrase, 
will open proceedings for the liquidators on Tuesday.
He will remain on his feet for the next two to three months, 
detailing the allegations against the Bank.
In large part, the liquidators' case will depend on the 
truckloads of paper records to which its lawyers have won access. 
Much of this involves material which Lord Bingham - then a senior 
judge and now the senior law lord - saw when he produced a critical 
report on the BCCI fiasco in 1992. But already, in pre-trial 
hearings, Mr Pollock has made clear that the liquidators contend 
there is other evidence which, it is claimed, Lord Bingham did not 
see.
Only in March or April will Nicholas Stadlen QC, the bank's 
senior barrister and another who has made it into the £1m-a-year 
club, get the chance to reply.
On behalf of the Bank, he is expectedly to deny strongly any 
suggestion of dishonesty by its supervisory department staff. By 
late spring or early summer, the Bank will start calling witnesses 
to bolster its case. Three former governors - Lord Richardson, Lord 
Kingsdown (better known as Robin Leigh-Pemberton) and Sir Edward 
George, will take the stand, although is not alleged that they were 
guilty of misfeasance, but rather that they were misled by the 
supervisory department.
After that, the six surviving senior supervisory department 
officials who dealt with BCCI - including 

[CTRL] IUFO: PLEASE CIRCULATE NATIONALLY: MAYBE THIS IS AN ANSWER (fwd)

2004-01-13 Thread William Bacon
-Caveat Lector-

I pledge Allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America and to
the REPUBLIC for which it stands,  one Nation under God,indivisible,with
liberty and justice for all.

 visit my web site at
http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon My ICQ# is 79071904
for a precise list of the powers of the Federal Government linkto:
http://www.voicenet.com/~wbacon/Enumerated.html

-- Forwarded message --
Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 09:28:57 -0500
From: walt [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: IUFO: PLEASE CIRCULATE NATIONALLY:   MAYBE THIS IS AN ANSWER

FW: PLEASE CIRCULATE NATIONALLY:   MAYBE THIS IS AN ANSWERThis makes perfect sense. 
And don't impeach the president empeach the corporation he sits on. YES!


-  PLEASE CIRCULATE NATIONALLY: MAYBE THIS IS AN ANSWER



(Cool.)  I've always wanted to live in Arizona.  Cindy
Patriots, Veterans, all  maybe this is an answer ...  we need to consider passing 
this onto all individual states, and demand the state rep's consider the reality of 
this situation ...

Its time to wake up these legislators to the reality of BUSH's goals to turn Amerika 
into a Nazi police state .

Please read ..


ARIZONA SECESSION MARTIAL LAW

Sat Jan 10 00:31:52 2004
64.140.158.81

Arizona makes secession preparations State resolution creates 'insurance policy' 
against martial law
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3904bd214df5.htm 
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3904bd214df5.htm
By Julie Foster

© WorldNetDaily.com

An Arizona state legislative committee has approved a resolution calling for the 
dissolution of the federal government in the event that it abolishes the U.S. 
Constitution, declares martial law or confiscates firearms -- scenarios some say are 
not unrealistic. Critics of the resolution, however, call the measure a total waste 
of time.

Rep. Karen Johnson, a Mesa Republican and chair of the House Committee on Federal 
Mandates and States' Rights, authored the resolution which  the committee approved 
3-2. Only the committee's vice-chair, Republican Rep. Gail Griffin, abstained from 
voting.

Specifically, House Concurrent Resolution 2034 outlines the origin of the United 
States, emphasizing the sovereignty of the states and their constitutional right to 
establish a new federal government for themselves by following the precedent 
established by Article VII, Constitution of the United States, in which nine of the 
existing thirteen states dissolved the existing Union under the Articles of 
Confederation and automatically superceded the Articles.

It also articulates constitutional violations committed by the federal government as 
justification for the measure, saying ... the fifty current principals, or 
signatories, to the [Constitution] have done well in honoring and obeying it, yet the 
federal agent has, for decades, violated it in both word and spirit. The many 
violations of the Constitution of the United States by the federal  government include 
disposing of federal property without the approval of Congress, usurping jurisdiction 
from the states in such matters as abortion and firearms rights and seeking control of 
public lands within state borders, says the resolution.

By adopting HRC 2034, Arizona states its intention to dissolve the current federal 
government with the approval of 34 other states and, in essence, start over. 
Participating states would re-ratify and re-establish the present Constitution as the 
charter for the formation of a new federal government, to be followed by the election 
of a new Congress and President and the reorganization of a new judiciary, in keeping 
with the original intent of the founding fathers. Individual members of the military 
will return to their respective states and report to the governor until a new 
president is elected.

In addition, each state will assume a prorated portion of the national debt and will 
own all land within its  borders. After the new government is formed, the remaining 15 
states will be permitted to join the revised union upon application, as was the case 
with the original union.

A three-year veteran to the Arizona Legislature, Johnson told the Sierra Times the 
resolution is insurance policy. If the federal government declares martial law or 
attempts to confiscate guns, the states shouldn't have to put up with that, she said.

Joseph Stumph, well-known author and historian, testified in favor of the resolution 
at the hearing.

We're proposing that if things get as bad as they could get, that these states won't 
allow the federal government to put us into a one-world government, said Stumph, who 
is publishing a similar proposal in his home state of Utah. I don't expect we'll get 
35 states to sign on. The American people are not educated enough on this yet, he 
added.

The resolution was introduced Jan. 26, and now needs to be approved by the Arizona 
House.  Should HRC 2034 successfully 

[CTRL] How to Lose Your Job in Talk Radio

2004-01-13 Thread William Shannon
http://www.amconmag.com/1_19_04/article3.html



February 2, 2004 issue
Copyright  2004 The American Conservative


How to Lose Your Job in Talk Radio
Clear Channel gags an antiwar conservative.
By Charles Goyette

Imagine these startling headlines with the nation at war in the Pacific six months after Dec. 7, 1941: No Signs of Japanese Involvement in Pearl Harbor Attack! Faulty Intelligence Cited; Wolfowitz: Mistakes Were Made. 

Or how about an equally disconcerting World War II headline from the European theater: German Army Not Found in France, Poland, Admits President; Rumsfeld: Oops!, Powell Silent; Bring Em On, Says Defiant FDR. 

It seems to me that when there is reason to go to war, it should be self-evident. The Secretary of State should not need to convince a skeptical world with satellite photos of a couple of Toyota pickups and a dumpster. And faced with a legitimate casus belli, it should not be hard to muster an actual constitutional declaration of war. Now in the absence of a meaningful Iraqi role in the 9/11 attack and the mysterious disappearance of those fearsome Weapons of Mass Destruction, there might be some psychic satisfaction to be had in saying, I told you so! But it sure isnt doing my career as a talk-show host any good. 

The criterion of self-evidence was only one of dozens of objections I raised before the elective war in Iraq on my afternoon drive-time talk show on KFYI in Phoenix. Many of the other arguments are familiar to readers of The American Conservative.

But the case for war was a shape-shifter, skillfully morphing into a new rationale as quickly as the old one failed to withstand scrutiny. For a year before the war, I scrambled to keep up with the latest incarnations of the neocon case. Most were pitifully transparent and readily exposed. (Besides the aluminum tubes and the trailers that had Bush saying, Gotcha, does anyone remember those death-dealing drones? Never have third-world, wind-up, rubber-band, balsa-wood airplanes instilled so much fear in so many people.) Still, my management didnt like my being out of step with the presidents parade of national hysteria, and the war-fevered spectators didnt care to be told they were suffering illusions. So after three years, I was replaced on my primetime talk show by the Frick and Frack of Bushophiles, two giggling guys who think everything our tongue-tied president does is Most excellent, dude! I have been relegated to the later 710 p.m. slot, when most people, even in a congested commuting market like Phoenix, are already home watching TV. 

Why did this happen? Why only a couple of months after my company picked up the option on my contract for another year in the fifth-largest city in the United States, did it suddenly decide to relegate me to radio Outer Darkness? The answer lies hidden in the oil-and-water incompatibility of these two seemingly disconnected phrases: Criticizing Bush and Clear Channel. 

Criticizing Bush? Well then, must I be some sort of rug-chewing liberal? Not even close. As a boy, I stood on the grass in a small Arizona town square when Barry Goldwater officially began his 1964 presidential run. And I was there for the last official event of the Goldwater campaign. My job was to recruit and manage my fellow junior-high and high-school conservatives in a phone bank operation, calling supporters to fill up as many buses as possible to help pack the stadiuma show of strength for the nations television viewers. Of course thats an insignificant role to play in a presidential campaign, but it was pretty heady stuff for a 14-year-old kid from Flagstaff. 

I broke with Goldwater in 1976 over his decision to back Gerald Ford instead of Ronald Reagan for the Republican presidential nomination. Ford was a perfectly decent, if ordinary, Republican (who could have taught the big-spending W. Bush a thing or two about the use of the veto!). But I took my conservatism seriously. Reagan was clearly the champion of the conservative cause. 

Perhaps Im just anti-military? No. I am proud of my honorable service and of the Army Commendation Medal I was awarded. I also spent a good deal of time in the 1980s as a member of the Speakers Bureau of High Frontier, promoting Reagans Strategic Defense Initiative, a defense policy unlike todays in that it was actually designed to defend the American people. 

I have been a Republican precinct committeeman; my county Republican Party elected me its Man of the Year in 1988; I have written speeches for conservative candidates and office holders; and I have been employed by statewide and national political organizations and campaigns, including the National Conservative Political Action Committee. Despite my disappointment in Goldwater for not supporting Reagan, I was there when a small band of the faithfulno more than four or five of usgathered for a potluck dinner to support the creation of a brand-new public-policy think tank named after Mr. Conservative. The enterprise 

[CTRL] Fwd: Sitting On A String

2004-01-13 Thread Kris Millegan
-Caveat Lector-
 
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---BeginMessage---
-Caveat Lector-

Gary North's REALITY CHECK

Issue 309  January 13, 2004


SITTING ON A STRING

 Something very strange is going on.  It has been going
on since August.  The U.S. money supply is shrinking.

 I hope you will take a few seconds and click through
to the charts published by the Federal Reserve Bank of St.
Louis.  The St. Louis FED has been diligent for decades in
making available charts and tables regarding the money
supply, as well as other key statistics.  I trust the long-term
consistency of this information.

 If you will see for yourself what is going on, you
will be able to understand this report with less confusion,
meaning your confusion will stay even with mine.  I assure
you, what the graphs reveal has confused me.  But I think
it's better for all concerned if we see the evidence before
we start speculating about causes.

 First, take a look at MZM, money of zero maturity.
This indicator I regard as the most relevant monetary
indicator, because it is closest to the characteristic
feature of money: instant spendability.  Here, the decline
is most prominent.

http://research.stlouisfed.org/publications/usfd/page6.pdf

 This is not a minor downward blip.  This is a full-
scale decline.  It has been going on for six months.  The
free market, through its innumerable transactions, is
shrinking the money supply.

 Second, look at M-2.  This is a traditional indicator.
I have followed it intermittently for three decades.  The
monetarist school of economics, once led by Milton
Friedman, used to pay more attention to M-2, which includes
time deposits (savings accounts), than to M-1 (currency
plus checking accounts), although I don't know if this is
still true of most monetarists.  This statistic tells the
same story, but less radically.

http://research.stlouisfed.org/publications/usfd/page6.pdf

 Third, look at the adjusted monetary base.  This
monetary component is the one that the Federal Reserve
System controls.  It reveals the FED's holdings of assets,
mainly U.S. government debt certificates.  The monetary
base is what Friedman has called high-powered money.  This
base supplies the reserves that the commercial banking
system uses to create loans, and hence money.  Here, things
are less clear.  Notice that the graph peaked in late
October.  It had gyrated after late August.  As you can
see, the general trend was upward, but slowly, until
November.  Then, it stabilized through December, and has
now started down.

 What is going on?  If the monetary base is stable, at
least peak to peak, but MZM and M2 are falling, what is
causing the disconnect between FED monetary policy and the
market's use of monetary reserves?

 One answer is the rise in the supply of currency,
i.e., pieces of paper with dead politicians' pictures on
them.  There was a steady upward move until late July.
Then the rate of increase itself increased.  Also note the
parallel decline in small time (savings) deposits.

http://research.stlouisfed.org/publications/usfd/page14.pdf

 When currency increases, the ability of the banking
system to increase the number of loans decreases.  When a
depositor goes to his bank and withdraws currency, the bank
can no longer use his money to make loans.  When he pulls
out currency and refuses to deposit it in another bank, the
banking system cannot make new loans.  It must call in old
loans.  When the currency supply rises faster than the
increase of the monetary base, banks cannot increase the
money they lend by the same percentage increase as the
monetary base.

 Since August, the monetary base has stayed almost
constant.  The currency component of the money supply has
increased.  So far, this tells us that the non-currency
components of the 

[CTRL] Fwd: shanghai'd again Re: [cia-drugs] Re: (Pan Am 103 bombing) (Cover Story)

2004-01-13 Thread Kris Millegan
-Caveat Lector-
 
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---BeginMessage---
-Caveat Lector-






Linda Minor wrote:

  
  
  
  
  
  
  CHOY DAVID LOO
 China 1987
  
Goddard,D.
Coleman,L. Trail of the Octopus. 1993 (200-1)
  
  
  

I just read the book. Coleman is the only one telling us
who "Lovejoy" is. Loo Choy is not indexed, perhaps a
way of saying that Goddard and Coleman are certain
Loo Choy is Lovejoy. If PanAm 103 and the McKee
commission and their evidence had not been destroyed
the end game would have put Russell Opium Trust out
of business like in China when opium was legalized.
That much risk would justify an elaborate undertaking
perhaps rivalling the JFK assassination for complexity
and sophistication. Through Coleman we see things
narrow down to CIA guns/drugs asset Monzer al-Kassar,
DEA agent Michael Hurley, and Loo Choy. The question
is how were Hurley and Lovejoy connected? When
Hurley took fifty confidential informants who should
not have ever seen each other or known who the others'
DEA handlers were and paraded them at lunch in front
of a delegation of Bulgarians, that was the capstone on
plausible deniability for any linkage to CIA in particular.
Lovejoy was also deniable in that he was a double agent
for hire by any party, thus conceivably by the Iranians.

How did Loo Choy learn from Hurley's operation that McKee
and Gannon would be on PanAm 103 the next day? How
would he be expected to handle that end? Would he be
expected to need help? Loo Choy must have been using US
assets because the Iranians would have been in a far better
position to use Lebanese assets on Cyprus to snoop and bug
Hurley(DEA Cyprus).

-Bob


  
  
-
Original Message - 
From:
Bob

To:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent:
Sunday, January 11, 2004 1:00 AM
Subject:
shanghai'd again Re: [cia-drugs] Re: (Pan Am 103 bombing) (Cover Story)


There is no David Loo Choy in the index to Trail of the
OTOpus, only David Lovejoy pages 19,143,201,225,236,
256-8,275. By the same token 2 x panam103 = page 206,
the only page where both Kevin Gannon and Bill "my
friends call me Kevin" Donleavy are indexed for the same
page.
  





Please let us stay on topic and be civil.-Home Page- www.cia-drugs.org 
OM






Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cia-drugs/
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.






www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---End Message---


[CTRL] Fwd: Is Bush a fascist?

2004-01-13 Thread Kris Millegan
-Caveat Lector-
 
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---BeginMessage---
-Caveat Lector-

Hundreds of millions of people the world over (myself included) have
described GW Bush as a fascist. Recently there have been countless
mainstream articles and columns denouncing those who dare make this
comparison as well as those who dare to bring up the Bush families
documented historical connection to financing Hitler and the eugenics
movement. Are we misusing the word fascism, engaging in stupid name-calling
as our critics claim, or is there a real basis for making this comparison?
Before one can answer the question, Is it fair to call GW Bush, the Bush
family or the Bush administration fascist? we must understand what fascism
is. Here are some definitions including some from Benito Mussolini. It's
impossible to read these definitions and not see the direct correlation
between everything the Bush administration does and fascism. What's more, if
you are a NYC street artist or vendor, you will see that the BID (Business
Improvement District) efforts to exterminate vending is also fascism in
action, or as Mussolini himself called it corporatism. -RL

Fascism should more properly be called corporatism, since it is the merger
of state and corporate power. - Benito Mussolini

fas·cism( P )  Pronunciation Key  (fshzm)
n.
often Fascism
A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a
dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition
through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent
nationalism and racism.
A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of
government.
Oppressive, dictatorial control.



[Italian fascismo, from fascio, group, from Late Latin fascium, from Latin
fascis, bundle.]


fas·cistic (f-shstk) adj.
Word History: It is fitting that the name of an authoritarian political
movement like Fascism, founded in 1919 by Benito Mussolini, should come from
the name of a symbol of authority. The Italian name of the movement,
fascismo, is derived from fascio, bundle, (political) group, but also
refers to the movement's emblem, the fasces, a bundle of rods bound around a
projecting axe-head that was carried before an ancient Roman magistrate by
an attendant as a symbol of authority and power. The name of Mussolini's
group of revolutionaries was soon used for similar nationalistic movements
in other countries that sought to gain power through violence and
ruthlessness, such as National Socialism.

Source: The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth
Edition

fascism
n : a political theory advocating an authoritarian hierarchical government
(as opposed to democracy or liberalism)

There is the great silent, continuous struggle; the struggle between the
State and the individual; between the State which demands and the Individual
who attempts to evade such demands. Because the individual, left to himself,
unless he be a saint or a hero, always refuses to pay taxes, obey laws, or
go to war.
- Benito Mussolini




Rense.com



The 14 Defining  Characteristics Of Fascism
Free Inquiry
Spring 2003
5-11-3

Dr. Lawrence Britt has examined the fascist regimes of Hitler (Germany),
Mussolini (Italy), Franco (Spain), Suharto (Indonesia) and several Latin
American regimes. Britt found 14 defining characteristics common to each:
1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism - Fascist regimes tend to make
constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other
paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing

[CTRL] Fwd: Exclude Profiteers of the Holocaust from Commemoration

2004-01-13 Thread Kris Millegan
-Caveat Lector-
 
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---BeginMessage---
-Caveat Lector-




- Original Message - 
From: CBGnetwork 

To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Monday, January 12, 2004 11:59 AM
Subject: "Exclude Profiteers of the Holocaust from 
Commemoration"



OPEN LETTER to the German 
Government; the foundation "Denkmal für die Ermordeten Juden Europas (Monument 
for the Murdered Jews of Europe)" as well as the BAYER AG

Coalition against BAYER 
Dangers (CBG) is condemning participation of the BAYER-Group in the building of 
the monument for the Murdered Jews of Europe in 
Berlin

The CBG spokesman Hubert 
Ostendorf said: "Profiteers of the holocaust must be excluded from 
commemoration"

As recently revealed, the 
BAYER-group is involved as a contractor in the construction of the 
holocaust-monument in Berlin. The company was heavily involved in the murder of 
the European jews by the Nazi-regime. Hubert Ostendorf of the Coalition against 
BAYER Dangers (CBG) says:" The profiteers of the holocaust must be excluded from 
this commemoration". CBG has been throwing light on the history and recent 
developments of BAYER for 25 years now (www.CBGnetwork.org).

It was BAYER´s boss, Carl Duisberg, 
who worked out the idea of setting up the disastrous chemical-cartel IG FARBEN. 
Already in World War I he invented the "System of Forced Labour" and he 
supported the financing of the Nazi Party early in its history. IG FARBEN 
profited in every imaginable way from the Nazis including the use of forced 
labour, deadly experiments on inmates and the delivery of the 
"Extermination-Gas" ZYKLON B by their subsidiary company 
DEGESCH..

During the years 1933-1945 
IG-FARBEN multiplied their property considerably, not at least by the 
exploitation of hundred of thousands of forced labour convicts. At the Nuremberg 
IG FARBEN trial the later chairman of BAYER´s supervisory board, Fritz ter Meer, 
was sentenced as war criminal. Ter Meer gave evidence at the trials that forced 
labour convicts were not harmed exceptionally, "for they would have been killed 
anyhow." For instance by experiments in the concentration camps, with the 
participation of BAYER´s physicians. 

CBG believes that all companies 
which helped to install the Nazi-regime and which profited from the criminal 
dictatorship, should be excluded from the building of the Monument for the 
Murdered Jews of Europe in Berlin. Even now, the bereaved and their descendants 
are not properly compensated. This fact is not altered by the foundation for the 
compensation of forced labour convicts, backed up by the Federal Government and 
the industry, whose purpose in reality is to offer very little to those affected 
and to reject legal claims.

CBG welcomes the intention of the 
government to document the history of the companies which participated in the 
crimes of the Nazi-regime and insists that this must be a permanent part of the 
monument. CBG is offering to make available materials for this 
exhibition.


for more information please 
contact:
Coalition against BAYER-dangerswww.CBGnetwork.org[EMAIL PROTECTED]Fax: (+49) 
211-333 940 Tel: (+49) 211-333 911please send an e-mail for 
receiving the English newsletter Keycode BAYER free of charge


Please help us. Our international 
campaigns are expensive to run. We receive no public support and depend entirely 
on your donations. 

Please send checks to: CBG, 
Postfach 15 04 18, 40081 Duesseldorf, Germany 

or by bank transfer to bank account 
number 8016 533 000 at GLS Bank, Germany sort code: 430 609 67

BIC/SWIFT Code: GENODEM1GLS(Bank 
Identifier Code)

IBAN: DE88 4306 0967 8016 5330 
00(International Bank Account Number)

Please note that bank transfers 
within Europe are usually no more costly than within your own country, if you 
quote the BIC and IBAN 
numbers
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a 

[CTRL] Fwd: Exclude Profiteers of the Holocaust from Commemoration

2004-01-13 Thread Kris Millegan
-Caveat Lector-
 
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---BeginMessage---
-Caveat Lector-




- Original Message - 
From: CBGnetwork 

To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Monday, January 12, 2004 11:59 AM
Subject: "Exclude Profiteers of the Holocaust from 
Commemoration"



OPEN LETTER to the German 
Government; the foundation "Denkmal für die Ermordeten Juden Europas (Monument 
for the Murdered Jews of Europe)" as well as the BAYER AG

Coalition against BAYER 
Dangers (CBG) is condemning participation of the BAYER-Group in the building of 
the monument for the Murdered Jews of Europe in 
Berlin

The CBG spokesman Hubert 
Ostendorf said: "Profiteers of the holocaust must be excluded from 
commemoration"

As recently revealed, the 
BAYER-group is involved as a contractor in the construction of the 
holocaust-monument in Berlin. The company was heavily involved in the murder of 
the European jews by the Nazi-regime. Hubert Ostendorf of the Coalition against 
BAYER Dangers (CBG) says:" The profiteers of the holocaust must be excluded from 
this commemoration". CBG has been throwing light on the history and recent 
developments of BAYER for 25 years now (www.CBGnetwork.org).

It was BAYER´s boss, Carl Duisberg, 
who worked out the idea of setting up the disastrous chemical-cartel IG FARBEN. 
Already in World War I he invented the "System of Forced Labour" and he 
supported the financing of the Nazi Party early in its history. IG FARBEN 
profited in every imaginable way from the Nazis including the use of forced 
labour, deadly experiments on inmates and the delivery of the 
"Extermination-Gas" ZYKLON B by their subsidiary company 
DEGESCH..

During the years 1933-1945 
IG-FARBEN multiplied their property considerably, not at least by the 
exploitation of hundred of thousands of forced labour convicts. At the Nuremberg 
IG FARBEN trial the later chairman of BAYER´s supervisory board, Fritz ter Meer, 
was sentenced as war criminal. Ter Meer gave evidence at the trials that forced 
labour convicts were not harmed exceptionally, "for they would have been killed 
anyhow." For instance by experiments in the concentration camps, with the 
participation of BAYER´s physicians. 

CBG believes that all companies 
which helped to install the Nazi-regime and which profited from the criminal 
dictatorship, should be excluded from the building of the Monument for the 
Murdered Jews of Europe in Berlin. Even now, the bereaved and their descendants 
are not properly compensated. This fact is not altered by the foundation for the 
compensation of forced labour convicts, backed up by the Federal Government and 
the industry, whose purpose in reality is to offer very little to those affected 
and to reject legal claims.

CBG welcomes the intention of the 
government to document the history of the companies which participated in the 
crimes of the Nazi-regime and insists that this must be a permanent part of the 
monument. CBG is offering to make available materials for this 
exhibition.


for more information please 
contact:
Coalition against BAYER-dangerswww.CBGnetwork.org[EMAIL PROTECTED]Fax: (+49) 
211-333 940 Tel: (+49) 211-333 911please send an e-mail for 
receiving the English newsletter Keycode BAYER free of charge


Please help us. Our international 
campaigns are expensive to run. We receive no public support and depend entirely 
on your donations. 

Please send checks to: CBG, 
Postfach 15 04 18, 40081 Duesseldorf, Germany 

or by bank transfer to bank account 
number 8016 533 000 at GLS Bank, Germany sort code: 430 609 67

BIC/SWIFT Code: GENODEM1GLS(Bank 
Identifier Code)

IBAN: DE88 4306 0967 8016 5330 
00(International Bank Account Number)

Please note that bank transfers 
within Europe are usually no more costly than within your own country, if you 
quote the BIC and IBAN 
numbers
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a 

[CTRL] Fwd: Hilarious Dubya site w/recorded quotes

2004-01-13 Thread Kris Millegan
-Caveat Lector-
 
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---BeginMessage---
-Caveat Lector-

Check this out:

http://www.praesentia.us/archives/dishonestdubya.html



www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---End Message---


[CTRL] Fwd: [Spy News] U.S. Firm to Run Iraqi TV

2004-01-13 Thread Kris Millegan
-Caveat Lector-
 
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---BeginMessage---
-Caveat Lector-

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A8313-2004Jan11.html

U.S. Firm to Run Iraqi TV
Harris Corp. Also to Operate National Newspaper
By Walter Pincus
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, January 12, 2004; Page A13

The Pentagon has awarded a $96 million contract to a U.S. communications
equipment maker to run Saddam Hussein's old television and radio network,
now called al-Iraqiya, for the next 12 months, the chairman of the company
said last week.

Harris Corp., based in Melbourne, Fla., will operate the national newspaper
formerly run by Hussein's son Uday, in addition to running the broadcast
network, said Howard L. Lance, chairman of the company.

When Hussein's government fell in April, the state-run broadcast stations
and newspaper were seized. In the months since, they have been run by a U.S.
defense contractor, Science Applications International Corp. (SAIC).

Under SAIC direction, the stations have not drawn viewers and listeners
because their content was considered too pro-United States. In addition,
there has been turnover in the non-Iraqi management and turmoil within the
Iraqi staff, many of whom were holdovers from the previous dispensation. The
day before Hussein was captured last month, 30 Iraqi reporters and producers
were fired, and al-Iraqiya did not get the news of his arrest on the air for
almost 24 hours.

Lance said last week he and two partners hope soon to have up and running a
high-quality news and entertainment network.

The partners are the Lebanese Broadcasting Corp. (LBC) and a Kuwaiti
publishing and telecommunications company, Al-Fawares. Harris will manage
the project and supply the equipment. LBC will be the source of the
electronic programming and will conduct training.

Running the newspaper and training its journalists will be handled by
Al-Fawares, which publishes a newspaper in Kuwait and prints Newsweek in
Arabic.

Although the Pentagon contract runs for a year, there is some question about
what will happen to the newspaper and stations -- collectively known as the
Iraq Media Network (IMN) -- when the Coalition Provisional Authority turns
over sovereignty to a new Iraq government, scheduled for July 1. Lance said
last week he did not know what was going to happen, but he pledged to make
the network a high-quality organization, whether it becomes state-run or
remains under Pentagon control after July.

Sen. Richard G. Lugar (R-Ind.), chairman of the Foreign Relations Committee,
recently voiced concern about the U.S. media program in Iraq and
specifically about the IMN. He has told the White House he expects the State
Department to take responsibility for supervising the IMN after July 1.

We don't want U.S. taxpayers paying $100 million for some new Iraqi
government over there to take over, Mark Helmke, a senior aide to Lugar on
the committee, said last week. The chairman wants to make sure that the new
contract leads to an independent, free press.

Dorrance Smith, a former ABC News producer and an adviser to President Bush
and President George H.W. Bush, works in Baghdad as a senior media adviser
to the coalition authority. He recently added the IMN to his
responsibilities, according to Washington and Baghdad government sources.

Smith's first job in Iraq was to create a 24-hour television feed for local
U.S. television stations, bypassing the networks, which U.S. officials
complained were emphasizing negative news from Iraq.

The former Hussein network is not the only Iraq media project being run by
the U.S. government. The authorities, using money generated by Iraqi oil
sales, are working to set up an FM radio station south of Baghdad within 30
days to compete with local religious broadcasters. It is the latest move in
the broader, sometimes faltering, effort to present the viewpoints of the
United States and 

[CTRL] Fwd: 3 Flaws of Bush's Plan

2004-01-13 Thread Kris Millegan
-Caveat Lector-
 
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---BeginMessage---
-Caveat Lector-

Bush plan's 3 flaws

By Janice Fine, 1/11/2004

UNDOCUMENTED WORKERS are the dirty little secret of the American
economy. It is a great step forward that President Bush is acknowledging
their plight with clarity and compassion with his immigration proposal.
But his solution falls short of the mark.

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2004/
01/11/bush_plans_3_flaws/

In essence, the proposal is a guest worker program: Employers, after
alleging that they have tried to fill their available positions with US
nationals with no success, would be empowered to hire temporary foreign
workers. These workers would be issued three-year work permits that
might be renewable for another three years. This temporary worker
program is not linked to normal permanent residency and citizenship
immigration tracks, and participants would have no greater advantage in
applying for a green card.

Historically, guest worker programs have always worked to the advantage
of American industry, but they have often undercut low wage workers in
these sectors and created lives of incredible hardship for the guest
workers themselves.

There are three fundamental problems with the president's plan.

First, the proposal gives too much power to employers. For the past
year, I have been conducting a national study on low-wage immigrants in
the workforce. The problems are depressingly similar in every city and
town I have visited and every industry I have observed: unpaid wages,
forced overtime, sky-high rates of injury on the job, discrimination,
sexual harassment, and unjust firings. Workers who speak up are fired
and blacklisted. Employers routinely ignore government regulations, and
government monitoring in most of these industries is terribly
inadequate, at best.

The bottom line is this: Employers in heavily immigrant, low-wage
sectors already have too much power, workers are already too afraid to
come forward, and government is unable to effectively provide
protection. The president's proposal, because it requires employers to
sponsor workers' temporary work visas and maintain their employment,
will make these guest workers even more powerless against employer
abuses than they already are. And imagine how much more reluctant
undocumented workers will be to take action when they know that their
employers now not only hold the power to extend or deny the legal right
to work -- but also know who among their employees are undocumented.

Second, by requiring workers to access the program through employers,
the proposal fails to take current labor market realities into account.
About half of current undocumented workers are in the informal sector.
They are gardeners, day-laborers, domestic workers, nannies,
dishwashers, and other service workers. Mostly, they are paid only in
cash by employers who report nothing. Since these types of employers are
unlikely to participate in the program, large numbers of workers will
have no way of accessing it. Others work for subcontractors who ply
their wares in the garment trade and other manufacturing industries --
going in and out of business frequently. Will these subcontractors even
bother to apply for visas for their workers? And what will happen to
workers after these businesses close? Does the visa follow the worker or
the job? Finally, what about the taxi-drivers, childcare providers, and
others who are nominally self-employed? What happens to them? Third,
because the proposal provides legal status for a temporary time period
and is completely separated from the green card process, it doesn't
provide enough of an incentive for undocumented workers to want to
participate. If you are working now, and your desire is to stay
permanently, why would you out yourself to the authorities and risk
deportation after three years?

A 

[CTRL] The USS Liberty Bombshell

2004-01-13 Thread William Shannon
-Caveat Lector-
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/11/5/194813.shtml



The U.S.S. Liberty Bombshell 
Reed Irvine
Thursday, Nov. 6, 2003

 

On June 8, 1967, the U.S.S. Liberty, then the world's most sophisticated intelligence-gathering ship, came under attack in the eastern Mediterranean. After a two-hour attack by planes and torpedo boats, 70 percent of its 294-man crew were either dead or wounded. The attack was launched by a friendly country, Israel, which three days earlier had begun its six-day war with Egypt and was preparing to invade Syria the next day. 

The Chronicle of the 20th Century, which briefly records newsworthy events in chronological order, says for its entry on June 8, 1967: "Sinai: Israelis accidentally attack U.S. ship, killing 10 and injuring 100." That reflects the inadequate and inaccurate reporting by the news media at the time of the attack.

This deplorable incident has festered like an infected wound for 36 years. Israel insisted that its pilots mistook the Liberty for an Egyptian freighter, a claim that those members of the crew who survived the attack deride. They charge that the Israelis conducted aerial surveillance of the Liberty for six hours before they attacked it.

They and others familiar with the ship say that it was flying a large American flag, which was replaced by an even larger flag when it was destroyed by the attackers.
They also point out that the claim the ship was mistaken for an old Egyptian freighter is absurd. As an intelligence ship it was loaded with antennas and carried a large satellite dish on an elevated structure near the stern. It was four times as large as an old Egyptian freighter, and its identification numbers were painted on the bow in white letters 10 feet high. 

If the numbers couldn't be seen by the Israeli pilots, they could not have been missed by the torpedo boats that fired on the lifeboats deployed by the Liberty.

The Liberty Alliance, an organization formed to counteract the lies said to have been told to justify the Israeli attack and the cover-up by President Lyndon Johnson, deployed its forces on Capitol Hill on Oct. 22, 2003. The chairman of the Liberty Alliance, Adm. Thomas H. Moorer, former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, presided over the news conference in the Rayburn House Office Building. 

The most stunning revelation was a statement by Capt. Ward Boston, the senior legal counsel for the Navy's Court of Inquiry into the attack on the Liberty. His statement was read by Rear Adm. Merlin Staring, a former judge advocate general of the Navy. Following are portions of what he read.

The late Admiral Isaac Kidd and I were given only one week to gather evidence for the Navy's official investigation. Despite the short amount of time we were given, we gathered a vast amount of evidence, including hours of heartbreaking testimony from the young survivors.

 

The evidence was clear. Both Adm. Kidd and I believed with certainty that this attack, which killed 34 American sailors and injured 172 others, was a deliberate effort to sink an American ship and murder its entire crew. I am certain that the Israeli pilots that undertook the attack, as well as their superiors who had ordered the attack, were aware that the ship was American.



I saw our flag, which had visibly identified the ship as American, riddled with bullet holes, and heard testimony that made it clear that the Israelis intended that there be no survivors. Not only did the Israelis attack the ship for over two hours with napalm, gunfire and hundreds of rockets and missiles, Israeli torpedo boats machine-gunned three life boats that had been launched in an attempt to save the crew  a war crime. 

After saying he was moved to speak out by a book titled "The Liberty Incident" by Jay Cristol, he described it as an attempt to whitewash the facts. He then dropped a bombshell, saying, "I have firsthand knowledge from many personal conversations with Admiral Kidd that President Lyndon Johnson and Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara personally ordered him to cover up the true facts and conclude the attack was a case of mistaken identity despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary." 

He did not mention that LBJ also rescinded an order to send carrier-based fighter planes that were only 15 minutes away to defend the Liberty.

The Liberty Alliance is pressing for an official, openly conducted reinvestigation of the tragedy that will consider this new testimony, along with the evidence that was suppressed or ignored. 

Some say that cover-ups ordered by presidents can't succeed because someone in the know will talk. Capt. Boston has finally talked. He and the Liberty survivors deserve a hearing  

www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, 

[CTRL] Tempers Flare At USS Liberty Event

2004-01-13 Thread William Shannon
-Caveat Lector-
As I reported yesterday, the event featured no less than 2 Israeli agents on the panel and NO survivors and if it weren't for James Bamford the event would have been a total sham. 
Two living USS Liberty survivors were in attendance but only one was allowed to speak briefly during Q  A before being silenced and the sister of a Liberty victim was also treated shabbily and ultimately silenced. 

Bill.



http://www.thecouriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,8381251%5E1702,00.html



Tempers flare on spy-ship sinking
By Matthew Lee in Washington
13jan04

A STATE Department conference has failed to quell the raging controversy over Israel's attack on a US spy ship during the 1967 Arab-Israeli war, as an expert panel was unable to agree whether the strike was intentional.

All but one of four panelists said they either accepted or tended to accept Israel's stated explanation  that the attack on the USS Liberty had been a case of tragic misidentification and an accident.

A senior State Department official said Washington had not changed its initial, nearly 35-year-old assessment that the attack was the result of "gross negligence" on the part of the Israeli military, but not an intentionally hostile act against the United States.

But survivors and families of victims of the incident, many of whom believe Israel deliberately attacked the ship, angrily charged the State Department with helping cover up Israel's role.

Controversy has raged for years over the June 8, 1967, attack on the Liberty, a US signals intelligence ship, in international waters off the Sinai Peninsula. Israeli jets and torpedo boats struck the ship, killing 34 US sailors and wounding 171. 

Israel maintains that its forces mistook the Liberty for an Egyptian warship, but many dispute the Israeli account and demand a new investigation of the sinking.

The senior State Department official said the panel, part of a two-day conference on the 1967 war, had not intended to re-evaluate long-standing US acceptance of the Israeli explanation.

"In many respects, I think this is kind of a classic binational case of Murphy's Law: everything that could possibly go wrong on either side did," the official said after the panel adjourned.

The official said nothing presented in new documents released today as part of the US diplomatic history of the 1967 war had changed the evaluation of Israel's explanation at the time.

"The unprovoked attack on the Liberty constitutes a flagrant act of gross negligence for which the Israeli government should be held completely responsible," the official quoted the US conclusion as saying.

However, that official and others, all of whom participated in the conference, admitted it was unlikely the panel had closed the matter or stemmed any of the controversy surrounding the case.

"I don't know if we settled anything, but I think perhaps we've shed a little light on different aspects of this question," Marc Susser, the State Department historian, told the conference.

One leading sceptic of the Israeli explanation is James Bamford, the author of several books on US intelligence.

Bamford, who repeated his call for a new investigation into the incident, argues that the Israelis intentionally sank the Liberty to cover up a massacre of Egyptian prisoners of war on the Sinai.

Then US president Lyndon Johnson's administration hid the facts to avoid harming ties with Israel, Bramford claims.

Bramford urged in a 2001 book that intelligence data from a US spy plane in the area be released to shed light on the attack.

David Hatch, technical director for the Centre for Cryptologic History, said at least some of those intercepts, released by the ultra-secret National Security Agency last year, indicated that the Israelis had not deliberately targeted a US vessel.

"While falling short of proof, the intercepts to me suggest strongly that the Israeli attackers did not know they were aiming deadly fire at a vessel belonging to the United States," Hatch told the panel.

The senior State Department official agreed with that analysis, although he allowed that there were still "some documents that could not be declassified" for the conference.

The conference also heard from Michael Oren, an Israeli historian, and Jay Cristol, a federal judge, both of whom have published investigations into the incident that have supported the Israeli explanation.

The panelists and their conclusions clearly irritated some in the audience, who appeared to believe that the United States was letting Israel  which paid $US12 million ($15.49 million) in compensation afterwards  get away with murder.

"There have been so many half-truths and misstatements made up here today," Liberty survivor Joseph Lentini said angrily before being cut-off by Susser.

"Let's hear from another survivor, one more survivor, two Israelis and one survivor," protested an unidentified man when Susser tried to end the question and answer period. "One more 

[CTRL] A Swedish study links mobile phones to brain damage. In rats

2004-01-13 Thread Smart News
-Caveat Lector-









http://www.popsci.com/popsci/medicine/article/0,12543,573349,00.html
Popular Science Fresh Fears Over Cellphones
Neuroscience: A Swedish study links mobile phones to brain damage. In rats, anyway. 
by Elizabeth Svoboda February 2004 "The safety of cellphones has been called into question, again. This time the scientific community is paying very close attention." 
"Meanwhile, the research world is scrambling to replicate Salford's surprising results. His team exposed 32 rats to 2 hours of microwave radiation from GSM cellphones. Researchers attached the phones to the sides of the rats' small cages using coaxial cables -- allowing for intermittent direct exposure -- and varied the intensity of radiation in each treatment group to reflect the range of exposures a human cellphone user might experience over the same time period. Fifty days after the 2-hour exposure, the rat brains showed significant blood vessel leakage, as well as areas of shrunken, damaged neurons. The higher the radiation exposure level, the more damage was apparent. The controls, by contrast, showed little to no damage. If human brains are similarly affected, Salford says, the damage could produce measurable, long-term mental deficits." 
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om


[CTRL] Fwd: [cia-drugs] List of Records from the Rockefeller Commission's Investigation of the CIA

2004-01-13 Thread Kris Millegan
-Caveat Lector-
 
www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---BeginMessage---
-Caveat Lector-


List of Records from the Rockefeller Commission's Investigation of the CIA


Click here for the listing(PDF format, 2.5 megs)
Left-click to open the fileRight-click to save the file to your hard driveMac users: Control-click to save the file
The above listing of 12,700 documents has been generally unavailable until now. Thanks to DC-area researcher Michael Ravnitzky, we can now see the titles of—and request copies of—material from the 1975 presidential commission that examined CIA misdeeds. (Instructions for requesting are below.) This material includes information on CIA domestic mail surveillance, human experimentation, assassinations of leaders, and the Agency's other "family jewels," plus depositions from Henry Kissinger, William Casey, and other spooks and powerbrokers.
Six sets of these records were produced, of which this set, the Ford Library set, and a set in the custody of the Rockefeller University Archive Center at Pocantico Hills in North Tarrytown, N.Y. are the only ones known to be extant. The original "family jewels" files remain in the custody of the CIA.
The final report of the Rockefeller Commission is here.
http://www.thememoryhole.org/spy/rockefeller-register.htm Check out the new MSN 9 Dial-up — fast & reliable Internet access with prime features!


Please let us stay on topic and be civil.-Home Page- www.cia-drugs.org 
OM









Yahoo! Groups Sponsor


  ADVERTISEMENT 









Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/cia-drugs/
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.






www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=""ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om
---End Message---


[CTRL] AUSTRALIAN GOVERNMENT AGENTS BOMB SYDNEY

2004-01-13 Thread William Shannon
-Caveat Lector-
http://www.joevialls.co.uk/aus/howard.html



AUSTRALIAN GOVERNMENT AGENTS BOMB SYDNEY 
Agent Provocateurs prepare weapons for lethal false-flag "Terrorist" attack 
  
Copyright Joe Vialls, 14 January 2004 


According to an Australian police spokesman, on Saturday morning a huge "car bomb" rocked western Sydney with a boom that could he heard up to 35 kilometers away. Doonside resident Rodney Gonzalez, who lives more than 3km from the abandoned Government radio station situated near the epicenter of the blast, said his family woke at 6.45am to an unnerving experience they thought was an earthquake. "There was a huge boom and the whole house shook," Mr Gonzales said, "We've had a lot of accidents in this area, but nothing has scared us as much as this because of the house shaking." 
    
The bomb left a crater twelve feet wide and six feet deep, and once more according to police, "spread bits of the car over 350 metres, smashing it so completely that neither its model nor make could be identified from the wreckage". They subsequently enlarged on this theme by claiming "Fragments were later found a kilometer away." This is ridiculous and misleading of course. When a car bomb detonates, there are always big pieces of wreckage left for analysis. 
    
As with an air crash, dense objects including engines, gearboxes, wheels and axles are invariably recovered more or less intact for identification, which was certainly the case after Air France Concorde 4590 hit the ground near Paris at more than 250 miles per hour. Though this reality would not be very obvious to a couple of general duties police constables in the Doonside area, it certainly would be to the five hundred or so "instant response" counter-terrorist experts who should have arrived less than thirty minutes later to secure the perimeter, and then track down and capture the guilty "terrorists". 
    
Unfortunately, despite this being "easily the biggest bomb ever detonated in Sydney", the counter-terrorist experts stayed in bed. Where there should have been 100+ armed SOG officers diligently probing the tree line with automatic weapons and rocket launchers, there were none. Where there should have been tactical helicopters frantically scouring the area for escaping terrorists, there were none. Where there should have been fire engines and ambulances looking for survivors and/or body parts, there were none. 
    
You do not have to take my word for this. The photographs spread across this page were taken at one-hour interval starting 30 minutes after the weapon exploded, and show very clearly that no one bothered to show up at all. Remember once again that this was touted by authorities as "easily the biggest bomb ever detonated in Sydney". Now take a very careful look at the photos, because unlike the Australian Government, they cannot lie. 

If the counter-terrorist teams and emergency services had arrived as required in their assortment of heavy vehicles, there would be fresh tire tracks all over the grass, but there are no tire tracks. The counter-terrorist teams would then have conducted a meticulous line-search through the grassed areas looking for clues, while their specially-trained tracker dogs would have been hunting for a scent. All of this would leave hundreds if not thousands of fresh footprints all over the grass, but there are only a handful of footprints to be seen. 
    
Next would come the counter-terrorist forensic teams, who would mark and tape the position of every fragment that might reasonably be connected to the awesome blast, leaving the entire field festooned with luminescent red cones, and with several hundred yards of  bright yellow "Crime Scene" tape fluttering in the breeze. In less than three hours, the entire area would have resembled a fairground. Now then, can you see any luminescent red cones, even one, or a solitary inch of bright yellow Crime Scene tape? 
    
Because Australia maintains an incredibly high terrorist alert status dictated jointly by the American and Israeli Ambassadors in Canberra, you can rest assured that the counter-terrorist teams would have reacted like lighting and swarmed all over Doonside in less than an hour, unless they were specifically ordered not to do so by a very senior bureaucrat in Canberra, himself acting on the direct orders of Prime Minister John Howard. On this evidence alone, it is proved that the Doonside blast was initiated by a person or persons unknown, working inside the Australian Federal Government structure. 
    
It gets much worse than this. The Australian Government, in the form of Attorney General Philip Ruddock, has stated that the bomb was constructed of materials easily obtained without a license, specifically Ammonium Nitrate. A single casual glance at the crime scene is sufficient to prove this statement is absolute rubbish. When crude ANFO [Ammonium Nitrate Fuel Oil] low-explosive 

Re: [CTRL] AUSTRALIAN GOVERNMENT AGENTS BOMB SYDNEY

2004-01-13 Thread Daniel Harrison
-Caveat Lector-

i live in sydney and felt the explosion the other day, there is many
inconsistancies with the official story and the facts, but knowing honestly
how dumb and unproductive our government is (honestly there absolutely
hopeless) i cant see anyone in our government having enough brain power to
plan this, normally australian politicians just ass kiss america or any other
democratic country...

besides i think i remember hearing something about his father saying how the
guys hobby was something to do with bomb building as it intrestind him i can
understand that as the same intrests myself and many others i know and often
we get togeather and nut out problems in our own miniture hobby devices ...

anyways seems a conspiricy could be cookin here but dont go jumping the gun
too  quickly as  australians have a habbit of doin stupid things!

-Daniel


On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 12:35, you wrote:
 -Caveat Lector-

 http://www.joevialls.co.uk/aus/howard.html



 AUSTRALIAN GOVERNMENT AGENTS BOMB SYDNEY
 Agent Provocateurs prepare weapons for lethal false-flag Terrorist attack

 Copyright Joe Vialls, 14 January 2004


 According to an Australian police spokesman, on Saturday morning a huge
 car bomb rocked western Sydney with a boom that could he heard up to 35
 kilometers away. Doonside resident Rodney Gonzalez, who lives more than 3km
 from the abandoned Government radio station situated near the epicenter of
 the blast, said his family woke at 6.45am to an unnerving experience they
 thought was an earthquake. There was a huge boom and the whole house
 shook, Mr Gonzales said, We've had a lot of accidents in this area, but
 nothing has scared us as much as this because of the house shaking.

 The bomb left a crater twelve feet wide and six feet deep, and once more
 according to police, spread bits of the car over 350 metres, smashing it
 so completely that neither its model nor make could be identified from the
 wreckage. They subsequently enlarged on this theme by claiming Fragments
 were later found a kilometer away. This is ridiculous and misleading of
 course. When a car bomb detonates, there are always big pieces of wreckage
 left for analysis.
 As with an air crash, dense objects including engines, gearboxes, wheels
 and axles are invariably recovered more or less intact for identification,
 which was certainly the case after Air France Concorde 4590 hit the ground
 near Paris at more than 250 miles per hour. Though this reality would not
 be very obvious to a couple of general duties police constables in the
 Doonside area, it certainly would be to the five hundred or so instant
 response counter-terrorist experts who should have arrived less than
 thirty minutes later to secure the perimeter, and then track down and
 capture the guilty terrorists.
 Unfortunately, despite this being easily the biggest bomb ever detonated
 in Sydney, the counter-terrorist experts stayed in bed. Where there should
 have been 100+ armed SOG officers diligently probing the tree line with
 automatic weapons and rocket launchers, there were none. Where there should
 have been tactical helicopters frantically scouring the area for escaping
 terrorists, there were none. Where there should have been fire engines and
 ambulances looking for survivors and/or body parts, there were none.

 You do not have to take my word for this. The photographs spread across
 this page were taken at one-hour interval starting 30 minutes after the
 weapon exploded, and show very clearly that no one bothered to show up at
 all. Remember once again that this was touted by authorities as easily the
 biggest bomb ever detonated in Sydney. Now take a very careful look at the
 photos, because unlike the Australian Government, they cannot lie.

 If the counter-terrorist teams and emergency services had arrived as
 required in their assortment of heavy vehicles, there would be fresh tire
 tracks all over the grass, but there are no tire tracks. The
 counter-terrorist teams would then have conducted a meticulous line-search
 through the grassed areas looking for clues, while their specially-trained
 tracker dogs would have been hunting for a scent. All of this would leave
 hundreds if not thousands of fresh footprints all over the grass, but there
 are only a handful of footprints to be seen.

 Next would come the counter-terrorist forensic teams, who would mark and
 tape the position of every fragment that might reasonably be connected to
 the awesome blast, leaving the entire field festooned with luminescent red
 cones, and with several hundred yards of  bright yellow Crime Scene tape
 fluttering in the breeze. In less than three hours, the entire area would
 have resembled a fairground. Now then, can you see any luminescent red
 cones, even one, or a solitary inch of bright yellow Crime Scene tape?

 Because Australia maintains an incredibly high terrorist alert status
 dictated jointly by the American and Israeli Ambassadors in Canberra, you
 can 

[CTRL] The Latin America Factor in the Scandal at Parmalat

2004-01-13 Thread Jim Rarey
-Caveat Lector-



Citigroup apparently involved. - JR

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/13/business/worldbusiness/13latin.html?pagewanted=printposition=



  
  
 
  

  January 13, 2004
  The Latin America Factor in the Scandal at 
  ParmalatBy TONY SMITH
  


  
  ÃO PAULO, Brazil, Jan. 12 - Was South America the 
  problem with Parmalat?
  The company's founder, Calisto Tanzi, who is in police custody in 
  Italy, has hinted to investigators that the accounting fraud uncovered at 
  Parmalat was driven partly by a need to hide huge losses at the company's 
  South American operations. A lawsuit by an 
  American pension fund accuses Citigroup 
  of helping Parmalat cover a gap in its balance sheet created by a 
  Brazilian subsidiary. And an important figure in the 
  widening investigation, Giovanni Bonici, returned to Italy and surrendered 
  to the authorities last week after briefly hiding in Venezuela, where he 
  once ran Parmalat's local unit.
  But many analysts doubt that Parmalat's operations in South America, 
  unprofitable though they are, could possibly have brought down a giant 
  dairy and food company with operations in 31 countries.
  Senior executives of the main South American unit, Parmalat Brasil, 
  said they were "flabbergasted" and "overwhelmed" by assertions that it had 
  helped propel Parmalat's sudden dive into insolvency. As they fight a 
  daily battle to keep Parmalat Brasil running, they expressed fury at the 
  bad news from the home office in Italy. "What we are reading in the papers 
  should not even be on the business pages, but in the crime section," fumed 
  one executive, speaking on condition of anonymity. 
  Parmalat went on a buying spree here in the 1990's that some in the 
  Brazilian business community called aggressive and others said bordered on 
  reckless, highlighted by a 1998 deal to acquire Batavia, a major dairy 
  cooperative, for $160 million. With little thought given to synergy or 
  economies of scale, the company's empire grew to 17 plants across the 
  country. By splashing out heavily on advertising and marketing, including 
  some prominent sports sponsorships, Parmalat built a strong brand name and 
  rose to second place in the Brazilian dairy industry.
  What it did not build was profitability. Parmalat Brasil has lost money 
  every year since 1998, when it first began publishing results. But the 
  company's managers insist that they have been making good progress under 
  Ricardo Gonçalves, who took over as chief executive in late 2001 - 
  streamlining operations to seven plants, putting more emphasis on 
  higher-margin products like yogurts, cheeses and fruit juices, and 
  narrowing the net loss to $28 million in the first three quarters of 2003, 
  down from $76 million for 2002. 
  Those losses come nowhere close to explaining the parent company's 
  woes, analysts and executives said. And the units in Argentina, Chile, 
  Colombia, Ecuador, Paraguay, Uruguay and Venezuela are all considerably 
  smaller operations than the one in Brazil. 
  "Yes, part of the problems could stem from Latin America, but we're 
  talking about billions of dollars that have disappeared," said Rafael 
  Guedes, director in Brazil of the Fitch credit-rating agency. "It would 
  seem hardly probable that a Latin American unit could produce such a big 
  hole.
  "And even if it were true, surely action should have been taken to 
  close a business that was hemorrhaging so much money. Better a horrible 
  end than endless horror."
  Even so, Parmalat Brasil depended on cash injections from the parent 
  company that stopped coming when the group's financial problems became 
  evident late last year. In December, Parmalat Brasil failed to pay $17 
  million due to about a fifth of its milk suppliers. The unit has 
  approached its banks about renegotiating $200 million in loans, and has 
  even resorted to barter with some suppliers, paying them off in processed 
  powdered milk instead of cash. 
  The Brazilian Securities and Exchange Commission has said it is 
  rechecking last year's financial reports from Parmalat Brasil, which is 
  listed on the São Paulo Stock Exchange. But a spokesman for the 
  commission, Ricardo Gontijo, said it had no jurisdiction over two other 
  holding companies in Parmalat's complicated corporate structure that are 
  incorporated in Brazil, because the two are not publicly traded. 
  Parmalat's copious use of such holding companies and subsidiaries - it 
  reportedly has more than 100 around the world - appears to be at the heart 
  of its troubles, especially its Cayman Islands-based Bonlat Financing 
  

[CTRL] [usa-tesla] The Cesspools of Canuckistan (fwd)

2004-01-13 Thread Party of Citizens
-Caveat Lector-

-- Forwarded message --
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 20:32:16 -0800
From: Party of Citizens [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: CANADA-L  Political,Social,Cultural,Economic Issues in Canada
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [usa-tesla] The Cesspools of Canuckistan (fwd)

-- Forwarded message --
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 20:18:10 -0800 (PST)
From: Party of Citizens [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Fred Bach [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],
 [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [usa-tesla] The Cesspools of Canuckistan

 * http://www.geocities.com/CITIZENS_ASSEMBLY **
 $$$   Capital punishment is not just penalty for poverty$$$

On Mon, 12 Jan 2004, Fred Bach wrote:

   A primer on Mass/Energy conversion is given at the bottom.

= the crap of Scientism

 L M Hooters wrote:
 
  All matter has both mass and weight. As was stated earlier, weight is simply
  the amount of force exerted on matter by a gravitational field.

  Mass, on the other hand, relates to the volume of matter involved.

True, if all other things are constant.  Mass can be related to
the volume of water at a given temperature but only if the
item under consideration is made to float.

  Mass is usually
  measured as displacement in cubic inches or centimeters.

Ergo it is VOLUME? What a shithead response!

No it isn't, except in the shitting business.  Mass is actually
measured in kilograms.  In your case it's kilograms of sea water.
MASS IS RELATED TO THE DISPLACEMENT ONLY IF THIS MASS FLOATS, or
is put into a floating container.  IF IT SINKS, ALL BETS ARE OFF.

The mass of Scientism, ie the mass of the college physics texts is only
a NUMBER, a holy number to mindlesss bimbos like u, the adherents of
Scientism and the Crapmeitser of Discovery, Ivan-the-Shithead; and what
kind of mass floats on the top of a cesspool?

We need a REAL THEORETICAL PHYSICIST HERE like Marcus-the-Martini-Shaker.

Zandu Goldbar
$
POC Financier




Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/usa-tesla/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
 http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om


[CTRL] [usa-tesla] The Cesspools of Canuckistan (fwd)

2004-01-13 Thread Party of Citizens
-Caveat Lector-

-- Forwarded message --
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 20:18:10 -0800 (PST)
From: Party of Citizens [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Fred Bach [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],
 [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [usa-tesla] The Cesspools of Canuckistan

 * http://www.geocities.com/CITIZENS_ASSEMBLY **
 $$$   Capital punishment is not just penalty for poverty$$$

On Mon, 12 Jan 2004, Fred Bach wrote:

   A primer on Mass/Energy conversion is given at the bottom.

= the crap of Scientism

 L M Hooters wrote:
 
  All matter has both mass and weight. As was stated earlier, weight is simply
  the amount of force exerted on matter by a gravitational field.

  Mass, on the other hand, relates to the volume of matter involved.

True, if all other things are constant.  Mass can be related to
the volume of water at a given temperature but only if the
item under consideration is made to float.

  Mass is usually
  measured as displacement in cubic inches or centimeters.

Ergo it is VOLUME? What a shithead response!

No it isn't, except in the shitting business.  Mass is actually
measured in kilograms.  In your case it's kilograms of sea water.
MASS IS RELATED TO THE DISPLACEMENT ONLY IF THIS MASS FLOATS, or
is put into a floating container.  IF IT SINKS, ALL BETS ARE OFF.

The mass of Scientism, ie the mass of the college physics texts is only
a NUMBER, a holy number to mindlesss bimbos like u, the adherents of
Scientism and the Crapmeitser of Discovery, Ivan-the-Shithead; and what
kind of mass floats on the top of a cesspool?

We need a REAL THEORETICAL PHYSICIST HERE like Marcus-the-Martini-Shaker.

Zandu Goldbar
$
POC Financier




Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/usa-tesla/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
 http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

www.ctrl.org
DECLARATION  DISCLAIMER
==
CTRL is a discussion  informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic
screeds are unwelcomed. Substance—not soap-boxing—please!   These are
sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths, mis-
directions and outright frauds—is used politically by different groups with
major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought.
That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and
always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no
credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply.

Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector.

Archives Available at:

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
A HREF=http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ctrl/A

To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Om