Re: When to sudo apt clean?
On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 10:57:55PM -0700, Steve Sobol wrote: > On 2023-06-23 21:59, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: > > On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 05:29:22PM -0700, Steve Sobol wrote: > > > > [...] > > > > > I'd much rather err on the side of extreme caution. If something > > > goes bump, > > > I'm screwed. > > > > To be fair, autoremove can improve safety: when it removes old kernel > > versions > > filling up your boot partition. > > Yes. My comment was about dist-upgrade, not autoremove. Point taken. I wouldn't run this one automatically. It can and will remove packages from time to time, so you better know what happened :-) Cheers -- t signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
On 2023-06-23 21:59, to...@tuxteam.de wrote: On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 05:29:22PM -0700, Steve Sobol wrote: [...] I'd much rather err on the side of extreme caution. If something goes bump, I'm screwed. To be fair, autoremove can improve safety: when it removes old kernel versions filling up your boot partition. Yes. My comment was about dist-upgrade, not autoremove.
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 05:29:22PM -0700, Steve Sobol wrote: [...] > I'd much rather err on the side of extreme caution. If something goes bump, > I'm screwed. To be fair, autoremove can improve safety: when it removes old kernel versions filling up your boot partition. Having a new kernel install failing because -ENOSPC has bitten some of us around here at least once :-) Cheers -- t signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: FOSS tool to do general stats from text indata
On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 10:20:50PM +0200, Emanuel Berg wrote: > Is there a CLI and FOSS tool that creates stats from text > indata - e.g., > > $ txt2stats path/to/indata/*.txt > > I mean a general tool, but with options to tweak the report > included, of course. If you can bear some tweaking, R is it. Cheers -- t signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: FOSS tool to do general stats from text indata
On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 10:20:50PM +0200, Emanuel Berg wrote: > Is there a CLI and FOSS tool that creates stats from text > indata - e.g., > > $ txt2stats path/to/indata/*.txt > > I mean a general tool, but with options to tweak the report > included, of course. > > To produce neat stats, maybe even figures, and generate fun > facts of the kind > >The longest word that occurs more frequently than 0.01 ... > >The most common words to start a sentence ... > >Average paragraph length ... > >And even more crazy facts and stuff that you never think >about until the stats tell you! > > What do we have on that area? A basic search finds this web tool: https://www.usingenglish.com/resources/text-statistics/ Otherwise, I think you'll have to write your own -- or hire someone (like me :^) to write one for you. -- Joel Roth
Re: Fwd: Problem verifying iso file
Interesting. Your suggested command reports Debian-12.0.0-and64-DVD-1.iso OK Followed by 20 lines of failed to read Debian-12.0.0-amd64-DVD-x.iso where x is in 2-20 These are I suppose lines from the full set of Debian DVD's So the DVD iso I burned and used to install Debian is OK Thank you, I'll know better next time On 6/23/23 19:17, DdB wrote: Am 24.06.2023 um 00:09 schrieb Thomas George: I tried md5sum SHA512SUMS.txt debian-12.0.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso The outputs do not match Seriously? i would have tried sha512sum -c ShA512SUMS.txt in the folder, where the iso can be found. gl next time DdB
Re: FOSS tool to do general stats from text indata
On Fri, 23 Jun 2023 23:05:10 +0200 Emanuel Berg wrote: > paulf wrote: > > > I don't know about all of your wishlist, but gnuplot is the > > proper tool for taking data from, say, a CSV file, and > > putting it into graphs of various types. > > Well, gnuplot is great obviously but is more a tool to > visualize data, organized data, here we need a tool to analyze > and find patterns in data that is in its original, raw form. What you desire sounds like a job for AI. And that's beyond my ken. Paul -- Paul M. Foster Personal Blog: http://noferblatz.com Company Site: http://quillandmouse.com Software Projects: https://gitlab.com/paulmfoster
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
On 2023-06-23 16:54, Emanuel Berg wrote: Ah, don't worry, it is safe, I've done it a lot. I don't doubt that it is quite safe, most of the time. But I run my servers on Ubuntu and Debian. (Mostly Ubuntu right now; slowly migrating to Debian.) I get paid for hosting, as well as work I do that requires the use of my VPS's. I'd much rather err on the side of extreme caution. If something goes bump, I'm screwed. But actually even if something goes wrong, it is still a good idea since then it is the upgrade process that must be debugged at the other end, the command is fine. Spoken like someone who doesn't run live servers in production... :)
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
Emanuel Berg writes: > But if I have to do an in-place upgrade, I'm going to sit and watch it > happen... just in case something goes wrong. I think has been about twenty years since I've had an in-place upgrade from oldstable to stable go wrong. -- John Hasler j...@sugarbit.com Elmwood, WI USA
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
Steve Sobol wrote: In general people don't want to dist-upgrade automatically. >>> >>> Seconded. >> >> I'm not following, when these functions are invoked, be it >> scheduled by some other software or by the user from the >> shell, they are intended to do their work automatically >> (non-interactively) if that is what you mean? > > Dist-upgrade makes major changes to your system, updating > dozens of packages, and pointing the OS at different > APT repos. Well, not always, right? But yes, that's the intension. > Automating such changes would be a very bad idea. [...] But > if I have to do an in-place upgrade, I'm going to sit and > watch it happen... just in case something goes wrong. Ah, don't worry, it is safe, I've done it a lot. But actually even if something goes wrong, it is still a good idea since then it is the upgrade process that must be debugged at the other end, the command is fine. -- underground experts united https://dataswamp.org/~incal
Re: Fwd: Problem verifying iso file
On Jun 23, 2023, Thomas George wrote: > I thought I had posted this to the debianlist but somehow it seems to have > been posted to myself [...] > > What am i doing wrong? > [...] > I tried md5sum SHA512SUMS.txt SHA512SUMS.sign.txt If you're trying to verify the signature on the checksum file, you need to use gpg: gpg --verify SHA512SUMS.sign.txt SHA512SUMS.txt Then, to verify the iso itself, you need to use sha512sum: sha512sum --ignore-missing -c SHA512SUMS.txt Note that all three files -- the *iso, the SHA512 checksums, and the GPG signature -- need to be in the same directory for this to work. HTH :) -- |_|O|_| |_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert |O|O|O| PGP: DDAB 23FB 19FA 7D85 1CC1 E067 6D65 70E5 4CE7 2860 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Fwd: Problem verifying iso file
Am 24.06.2023 um 00:09 schrieb Thomas George: > I tried md5sum SHA512SUMS.txt debian-12.0.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso > > The outputs do not match Seriously? i would have tried sha512sum -c ShA512SUMS.txt in the folder, where the iso can be found. gl next time DdB
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
On 2023-06-23 15:26, Emanuel Berg wrote: Steve Sobol wrote: In general people don't want to dist-upgrade automatically. Seconded. I'm not following, when these functions are invoked, be it scheduled by some other software or by the user from the shell, they are intended to do their work automatically (non-interactively) if that is what you mean? Dist-upgrade makes major changes to your system, updating dozens of packages, and pointing the OS at different APT repos. (Debian, and downstream distros like Ubuntu, have separate repos for each release.) Automating such changes would be a very bad idea. Personally, I avoid doing in-place upgrades from one Debian/Ubuntu release to another. Given the low cost and quick turnaround time involved in spinning up a new VPS, I will almost always spin up a new VM instead, and move services and data from the old one to the new one. But if I have to do an in-place upgrade, I'm going to sit and watch it happen... just in case something goes wrong.
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
Steve Sobol wrote: >> In general people don't want to dist-upgrade automatically. > > Seconded. I'm not following, when these functions are invoked, be it scheduled by some other software or by the user from the shell, they are intended to do their work automatically (non-interactively) if that is what you mean? -- underground experts united https://dataswamp.org/~incal
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
Dan Ritter wrote:
> It seems unlikely to me that you want to do an autoremove
> before you have done an upgrade.
a1 is to maintain and a2 is to upgrade, so the idea is to
always upgrade from a maintained state, that's why a2 first
calls a1. One could do a1 after a2 as well as
before, actually.
> apt autoremove calls apt-get autoremove. Doing that twice
> seems unwise or useless.
OK, thanks, fixed!
> apt-get check is an extremely basic fast check to see if the
> cache is in place. Running it after update is useless -- any
> failure would appear in update first.
OK!
> In general people don't want to dist-upgrade automatically.
> Maybe you do.
Well, none of this is automated necessarily, these commands
can be run by the user explicitely from the shell, it is how
I use them. I don't install a lot of things from the repos but
when I do the system get the implied sanity check by those
piles of commands.
Now they look like this:
a1 () {
sudo apt-get -qq check
sudo apt-get -qq update
sudo apt-get -qq autoremove
sudo aptitude -q=99 autoclean
apt -a list --upgradable
}
a2 () {
a1
sudo apt-get -qq upgrade
sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
}
Here is the whole file yanked if you are into this part of the
Debianverse ...
#! /bin/zsh
#
# this file:
# https://dataswamp.org/~incal/conf/.zsh/apt
alias am='aptitude show'
alias as='aptitude search'
alias ar='sudo apt-get -qq remove'
alias ap='sudo apt-get -qq purge'
package-versions () {
apt list -a $1
}
alias vers=package-versions
apt-install () {
apt-get-update
sudo apt-get -qq install $@
}
alias ai=apt-install
apt-reinstall () {
apt-get-update
sudo apt-get -qq reinstall $@
}
alias aii=apt-reinstall
a1 () {
sudo apt-get -qq check
sudo apt-get -qq update
sudo apt-get -qq autoremove
sudo aptitude -q=99 autoclean
apt -a list --upgradable
}
a2 () {
a1
sudo apt-get -qq upgrade
sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
}
require-bin () {
local bins=($@)
local all_good=true
local fun=$funcstack[2]
echo "checking requirements for"
echo "\n ${fun}\n"
for b in $bins; do
echo -n "$b: "
type $b &> /dev/null
if (( ! $? )); then
set-color green
echo OK
else
set-color red
echo fail
all_good=false
fi
reset-color
done
if ( ! $all_good ); then
echo "\nnot all"
return 1
else
echo "\nall systems ready"
return 0
fi
}
apt-installed () {
apt list --installed
}
apt-get-update () {
sudo apt-get -qq update
}
apt-get-upgrade () {
apt-get-update
if [ $# > 0 ]; then
sudo apt-get -qq install --only-upgrade $@
else
sudo apt-get -qq upgrade
fi
}
alias au=apt-get-upgrade
apt-get-upgrade-dist () {
apt-get-update
sudo apt-get -qq dist-upgrade
}
command-to-pack () {
if [[ $# = 1 ]]; then
local cmd=$1
local whereis_path=$(whereis $cmd | awk '{print $2}')
local bin=$(readlink -e $whereis_path)
if [[ -z $bin ]]; then
local fun=$funcstack[1]
echo\
"$fun error: no such command (\"$cmd\")"\
"\nNB: $fun deals with installed software," \
"\nto track the package of any binary, use" \
"\n$ bin-to-pack BINARY-NAME" >&2
return
fi
bin-to-pack $bin
else
echo "syntax: $0 COMMAND" >&2
fi
}
alias cmd2pack=command-to-pack
bin-to-pack () {
local fs=($@)
deb-file-to-pack $fs
file-to-pack $fs
}
alias bin2pack=bin-to-pack
pack-to-file () {
local pack=$1
local only_bins=$2
local fs=("${(@f)$(dpkg --listfiles $pack)}")
if [[ $only_bins == 1 ]]; then
for f in $fs; do
[[ -x $f && ! -d $f ]] && echo $f
done
else
for f in $fs; do
[[ -f $f ]]&& echo $f
done
fi | sort
}
alias files-from=pack-to-file
pack-to-bin () {
local pack=$1
pack-to-file $pack 1 # only_bins
}
alias bins-from=pack-to-bin
deb-file-to-pack () {
local fs=($@)
dpkg --search $fs 2> /dev/null | cut -d ':' -f 1
}
file-to-pack () {
sudo apt-file update > /dev/null
apt-file search $@
}
alias file-there=file-to-pack
get-source () {
apt-get -qq source $@
}
alias get-src=get-source
get-command-source () {
if [[ $# = 1 ]]; then
local cmd=$1
get-source $(cmd2pack $cmd)
else
echo "syntax: $0 COMMAND" >&2
fi
}
# aptitude search -F %V "?exact-name(units)"
file-url () {
local pack=$1
local ver=$(dpkg-query -f '${Version}\n' -W $pack)
local file=$2
local url=https://sources.debian.org/data/main/u/$pack/$ver/$file
echo $url
}
--
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal
Fwd: Problem verifying iso file
I thought I had posted this to the debianlist but somehow it seems to have been posted to myself Weeks went by with no response from the list so I gave up, burnt the iso to dvd and used it install bookworm on a new pc. The installation went smoothly and I am using the new pc. Should I be concerned with the failed verification and if so what should I do about it. Tom Forwarded Message Subject:Problem verifying iso file Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2023 16:45:45 -0400 From: Thomas George To: Tom What am i doing wrong? I downloaded SHA512SUMS.txt, SHA512SUMS.sign.txt. SHA256SUMS.txt. SHA256SIMS.sign.txt, and debian-12.0.0-amd64 -DVD-1.iso I tried md5sum SHA512SUMS.txt SHA512SUMS.sign.txt The outputs do not match. I tried md5sum SHA512SUMS.txt debian-12.0.0-amd64-DVD-1.iso The outputs do not match I tried all the variations of the above. The outputs do not match Please help
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
On 2023-06-23 14:14, Dan Ritter wrote: It seems unlikely to me that you want to do an autoremove before you have done an upgrade. I'd not say unwise. Useless, pointless, perhaps; but it doesn't hurt anything. autoremove removes packages that were installed as dependencies of other packages that were "orphaned" (meaning any package(s) that installed those dependent packages are no longer installed). Running it two or more times in a row, or running it when you haven't uninstalled packages since the last time you ran autoremove, is pointless, but will have absolutely no effect. In general people don't want to dist-upgrade automatically. Seconded.
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
Emanuel Berg wrote:
> Default User wrote:
>
> > I am considering just running sudo apt clean (or sudo
> > apt-get clean) [...]
>
> This is what I eventually landed at and it has worked ever
> since - a1 is to maintain, a2 to upgrade as well.
>
> #! /bin/zsh
>
> a1 () {
> sudo apt-get -qq update
> sudo aptautoremove >&2 2> /dev/null
> sudo apt-get -qq autoremove
> sudo aptitude -q=99 autoclean
> sudo apt-get -qq check
> apt -a list --upgradable
> }
It seems unlikely to me that you want to do an autoremove before
you have done an upgrade.
apt autoremove calls apt-get autoremove. Doing that twice seems
unwise or useless.
apt-get check is an extremely basic, fast check to see if the
cache is in place. Running it after update is useless --
any failure would appear in update first.
> a2 () {
> a1
> sudo apt-get -qq upgrade
> sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
> }
In general people don't want to dist-upgrade automatically.
Maybe you do.
-dsr-
Re: FOSS tool to do general stats from text indata
paulf wrote: > I don't know about all of your wishlist, but gnuplot is the > proper tool for taking data from, say, a CSV file, and > putting it into graphs of various types. Well, gnuplot is great obviously but is more a tool to visualize data, organized data, here we need a tool to analyze and find patterns in data that is in its original, raw form. But just to promote gnuplot further, as I got happy just by you mentioning it, here is a cool diagram I once did: https://dataswamp.org/~incal/pimgs/comp/hits.png And some others: https://dataswamp.org/~incal/figures/gnuplot/ Not a gnuplot veteran! But absolutely cool software. -- underground experts united https://dataswamp.org/~incal
Re: FOSS tool to do general stats from text indata
On Fri, 23 Jun 2023 22:20:50 +0200 Emanuel Berg wrote: > Is there a CLI and FOSS tool that creates stats from text > indata - e.g., > > $ txt2stats path/to/indata/*.txt > > I mean a general tool, but with options to tweak the report > included, of course. > > To produce neat stats, maybe even figures, and generate fun > facts of the kind > >The longest word that occurs more frequently than 0.01 ... > >The most common words to start a sentence ... > >Average paragraph length ... > >And even more crazy facts and stuff that you never think >about until the stats tell you! > > What do we have on that area? I don't know about all of your wishlist, but gnuplot is the proper tool for taking data from, say, a CSV file, and putting it into graphs of various types. Paul -- Paul M. Foster Personal Blog: http://noferblatz.com Company Site: http://quillandmouse.com Software Projects: https://gitlab.com/paulmfoster
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
Default User wrote:
> I am considering just running sudo apt clean (or sudo
> apt-get clean) [...]
This is what I eventually landed at and it has worked ever
since - a1 is to maintain, a2 to upgrade as well.
#! /bin/zsh
a1 () {
sudo apt-get -qq update
sudo aptautoremove >&2 2> /dev/null
sudo apt-get -qq autoremove
sudo aptitude -q=99 autoclean
sudo apt-get -qq check
apt -a list --upgradable
}
a2 () {
a1
sudo apt-get -qq upgrade
sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
}
Full source with all other apt stuff I have, suggestions
welcome:
https://dataswamp.org/~incal/conf/.zsh/apt
--
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal
FOSS tool to do general stats from text indata
Is there a CLI and FOSS tool that creates stats from text indata - e.g., $ txt2stats path/to/indata/*.txt I mean a general tool, but with options to tweak the report included, of course. To produce neat stats, maybe even figures, and generate fun facts of the kind The longest word that occurs more frequently than 0.01 ... The most common words to start a sentence ... Average paragraph length ... And even more crazy facts and stuff that you never think about until the stats tell you! What do we have on that area? -- underground experts united https://dataswamp.org/~incal
Re: OT: Pedantic, yet wrong
On 23 Jun 2023 17:56, Fred wrote: Or you could try Devuan which is Debian without systemd. I did, when I didn't know Debian still had sysv. But since you can do it on Debian directly, I don't see the point now. Maybe more polished packages, ie. no surprises like "if you install this package, I'll remove sysv" ? I admit I didn't use Devuan a lot, so can't really compare.
Re: OT: Pedantic, yet wrong
On 6/23/23 08:12, zithro wrote: On 23 Jun 2023 16:41, mick.crane wrote: On 2023-06-23 11:58, Nicolas George wrote: Andy Smith (12023-06-23): It seemed fine the way it was. The only reason why I didn't answer is that I don't know anything about removing systemd! Me I know just a little about it, enough to know that discussion with people who want to remove it but are not already capable of doing it by themselves is a waste of time. It's a subjective thing. It is what it is but I do feel warmth towards those try to make it work without systemd. it's not particularly logical. mick Yes, init freedom is subjective, it's like using Firefox or Chrome. It's not a matter of logic ; ) I have some Debians with sysvinit, some with systemd, both work. Switching from systemd to sysv following the Debian wiki page was painless, although I mostly did it on "small hosts", with not much packages installed. Maybe installs with many packages are harder to manage ? Because you have to be careful during package management, some commands would propose to remove sysv and install systemd instead ! I guess not all packages are "sysv aware" (or rather non-systemd aware). I suggest non-systemd init users (sysv, rc,...) to use --dry-run and --no-install-recommends during package management, it can help. But for the OP, who iirc asked if he should switch to sysv -before- or -after- the bookworm update, I have no idea. I updated sysv- and systemd-based Debians from bullseye to bookworm without problems, but didn't try the switch since, from a bookworm host. YMMV ! Or you could try Devuan which is Debian without systemd.
Re: OT: Pedantic, yet wrong
On 23 Jun 2023 16:41, mick.crane wrote: On 2023-06-23 11:58, Nicolas George wrote: Andy Smith (12023-06-23): It seemed fine the way it was. The only reason why I didn't answer is that I don't know anything about removing systemd! Me I know just a little about it, enough to know that discussion with people who want to remove it but are not already capable of doing it by themselves is a waste of time. It's a subjective thing. It is what it is but I do feel warmth towards those try to make it work without systemd. it's not particularly logical. mick Yes, init freedom is subjective, it's like using Firefox or Chrome. It's not a matter of logic ; ) I have some Debians with sysvinit, some with systemd, both work. Switching from systemd to sysv following the Debian wiki page was painless, although I mostly did it on "small hosts", with not much packages installed. Maybe installs with many packages are harder to manage ? Because you have to be careful during package management, some commands would propose to remove sysv and install systemd instead ! I guess not all packages are "sysv aware" (or rather non-systemd aware). I suggest non-systemd init users (sysv, rc,...) to use --dry-run and --no-install-recommends during package management, it can help. But for the OP, who iirc asked if he should switch to sysv -before- or -after- the bookworm update, I have no idea. I updated sysv- and systemd-based Debians from bullseye to bookworm without problems, but didn't try the switch since, from a bookworm host. YMMV !
Re: OT: Pedantic, yet wrong
On 2023-06-23 11:58, Nicolas George wrote: Andy Smith (12023-06-23): It seemed fine the way it was. The only reason why I didn't answer is that I don't know anything about removing systemd! Me I know just a little about it, enough to know that discussion with people who want to remove it but are not already capable of doing it by themselves is a waste of time. It's a subjective thing. It is what it is but I do feel warmth towards those try to make it work without systemd. it's not particularly logical. mick
Re: When to sudo apt clean?
On Fri, 2023-06-23 at 10:51 +0500, Stanislav Vlasov wrote: > 2023-06-23 4:44 GMT+05:00, Default User : > > > Other than that, is there any good reason not to do sudo apt clean? > > Only if you have many machines which share /var/cache/apt (via nfs > for example) > > You may use `apt-get autoclean` for cleanup non-donwloadable .deb's, > if you want store packages for offline reinstall > Okay, thanks guys. That's what I thought. :)
Re: OT: Pedantic, yet wrong
Andy Smith (12023-06-23): > It seemed fine the way it was. The only reason why I didn't answer > is that I don't know anything about removing systemd! Me I know just a little about it, enough to know that discussion with people who want to remove it but are not already capable of doing it by themselves is a waste of time. Regards, -- Nicolas George
Re: OT: Pedantic, yet wrong
Hello, On Fri, Jun 23, 2023 at 10:06:04AM +, Ottavio Caruso wrote: > I though it would have been easier to read if I had forwarded it. > In hindsight, I could have just copied it over. It seemed fine the way it was. The only reason why I didn't answer is that I don't know anything about removing systemd! Cheers, Andy -- https://bitfolk.com/ -- No-nonsense VPS hosting
Re: OT: Forwarding and top posting (was: Re: OT: Pedantic, yet wrong)
Hello, On Thu, Jun 22, 2023 at 04:24:47PM -0700, Manphiz wrote: > Personally I don't have a strong preference either way, but would like > to hear more opinions on this. The complaint about a top-posted forwarded message just because it had a contextual hint at the top, seemed excessive to me. I would have done the same as the OP without thinking anything of it. Cheers, Andy -- https://bitfolk.com/ -- No-nonsense VPS hosting
Re: Follow recent stable Python versions
Hello, everybody out there! Thank you for your answers. I realize I have not made myself clear, my bad. Indeed, I do not want to change the Python version of the whole distribution: I do not want to mess up the system. My need is to follow the up-to-date Python stable version for my own developments—and yes, I should, and already do, use virtual environments for my own developments. So, in fact, my question was: what is the best practice to install a specific version of Python alongside the version of the system without messing up the system. I would rather use a solution as automatic as possible. Reading your answers, it turns out that pinning is not a solution. Understood. There is the option to compile the new version from source, but this is really not automatic, and my experience is that you easily make mistakes when you repeatedly do the same task. I would rather not use that option. Pyenv seems to be a tool made for what I need to do. The thing is, as far as I know, there is no package in the distribution for it. Though, the procedure to install it is well described (https://realpython.com/intro-to-pyenv/), and there is a pyenv-update plgugin to keep it up to date—well, I prefer using the package manager, but anyway. There is an official Docker image for Python (https://hub.docker.com/_/python/), but Pyenv seems to be more fitted to manage a specific virtual environment for each project. What does experience Python developers on Debian recommend? Best regards. -- Yoann LE BARS https://le-bars.net/yoann/
