Re: Question about Desktop Environments
Vikki Roemer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 11:27 AM, Klein Moebius <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > * Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > >[?] > > >> > > >> Touche. But if I told my wife I married her for her cookies... > > > > > >Of course. Only at his peril does a man tells his wife the real > > >reason he married her. > > > > Shhh! > > Pfft, we all know why men marry us. Well, those of us who don't > hide behind delusions... 'Cause it's the only way we'll get mewling brats screaming up the place? Or did you mean your money? > Which is why most women won't listen to us when they're told the > real reason why. :P Most men just do what they're told. It's easier that way. Blame their fathers. Most women are clearly insane, just like the men they marry. -- Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced. (*)http://blinkynet.net/comp/uip5.html Linux Counter #80292 - -http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1855.htmlPlease, don't Cc: me. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 11:27 AM, Klein Moebius <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > * Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > > >> Touche. But if I told my wife I married her for her cookies... > >> > >Of course. Only at his peril does a man tells his wife the real > >reason he married her. > > Shhh! Pfft, we all know why men marry us. Well, those of us who don't hide behind delusions... Which is why most women won't listen to us when they're told the real reason why. :P -- Vikki Roemer Registered Linux user #280021 "Sometimes the lights all shinin' on me; Other times I can barely see. Lately it occurs to me what a long, strange trip its been." -- Grateful Dead, "Truckin'" -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 03:27:20PM -0600, Monique Y. Mudama wrote: ... > Perhaps that should be > > s/If women are so weak they can't/If women have better things to do > than/ very likely... > > But I don't really know, just having noticed this subthread right > abotu now, and not sufficiently motivated to go back and find the > origin. Did a lot of women who used to post here recently stop doing > so? not that I'm aware of. This thread was just a typical OT ramble that stemmed from something else. > > I really have no business in this discussion, since I just a couple of > days ago thought, "Hrm, I should resubscribe to debian-user and see > what's up." Back in the day, I can't remember anyone doing anything > particularly offensive to women on this list. Certainly nothing on > par with the slashdot and thedailywtf noise. I think the most offensive thing to women on this list would be exclamations about how easier it is to understand package foo than our . Although admittedly, there haven't been as many women in the mix lately as say a few months ago. A signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/18/08 16:27, Monique Y. Mudama wrote: > On 2008-03-18, Ron Johnson penned: >> On 03/18/08 15:05, Paul Johnson wrote: >>> What outcry? Ron's got a point. Seems like all the ladies went to >>> debian-women or something. >> Serena Cantor & Michelle Konzack are the only two that I can think >> of on this list. And debian-women doesn't seem very busy. >> >> If women are so weak that they can't stand up for themselves when >> guys start to get rude and obnoxious, there are bigger problems >> afoot. > > Perhaps that should be > > s/If women are so weak they can't/If women have better things to do > than/ That can be (and has been) debated endlessly, but is even further OT than the current thread. > But I don't really know, just having noticed this subthread right > abotu now, and not sufficiently motivated to go back and find the > origin. Did a lot of women who used to post here recently stop doing > so? > > I really have no business in this discussion, since I just a couple of > days ago thought, "Hrm, I should resubscribe to debian-user and see > what's up." Back in the day, I can't remember anyone doing anything > particularly offensive to women on this list. Certainly nothing on > par with the slashdot and thedailywtf noise. > >> - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA >> >> "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife > > I read the quote, got moderately offended, read the attribution, > considered, decided she may have a point. > > For values of "women" not including myself, of course. > > I do wonder what the intent of including that in your sig is, especially > in a primarily-male environment. I tried to email you privately about this, but then noticed your address. If you want to discuss it, contact me off-list. > The "feel" would be different in a > more evenly distributed crowd. I don't feel, I think. But that's probably just as inflammatory as what my wife says... - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD4DBQFH4Dd3S9HxQb37XmcRAtYYAKC5TK/6P2vJY8qWI+IB00vwbnZI/ACXe//I VXSaSUFEn6DJs6WD9PyguA== =7waU -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On 2008-03-18, Ron Johnson penned: > On 03/18/08 15:05, Paul Johnson wrote: >> What outcry? Ron's got a point. Seems like all the ladies went to >> debian-women or something. > > Serena Cantor & Michelle Konzack are the only two that I can think > of on this list. And debian-women doesn't seem very busy. > > If women are so weak that they can't stand up for themselves when > guys start to get rude and obnoxious, there are bigger problems > afoot. Perhaps that should be s/If women are so weak they can't/If women have better things to do than/ But I don't really know, just having noticed this subthread right abotu now, and not sufficiently motivated to go back and find the origin. Did a lot of women who used to post here recently stop doing so? I really have no business in this discussion, since I just a couple of days ago thought, "Hrm, I should resubscribe to debian-user and see what's up." Back in the day, I can't remember anyone doing anything particularly offensive to women on this list. Certainly nothing on par with the slashdot and thedailywtf noise. > - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA > > "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife I read the quote, got moderately offended, read the attribution, considered, decided she may have a point. For values of "women" not including myself, of course. I do wonder what the intent of including that in your sig is, especially in a primarily-male environment. The "feel" would be different in a more evenly distributed crowd. -- monique Help us help you: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
* Paul Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-03-18 13:05:00 -0700]: > What outcry? Ron's got a point. Seems like all the ladies went to > debian-women or something. Hmm. Maybe so. -- Regards, Klein When a man assumes a public trust, he should consider himself as public property. -- Thomas Jefferson signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/18/08 15:05, Paul Johnson wrote: > On Tuesday 18 March 2008 10:02:48 am Klein Moebius wrote: >> * Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-03-18 11:56:47 -0500]: >>> Don't worry. You can count on one hand the number of women on this >>> list, and still have 3 left over. >> Uh,oh - Let the outcry begin! > > What outcry? Ron's got a point. Seems like all the ladies went to > debian-women or something. Serena Cantor & Michelle Konzack are the only two that I can think of on this list. And debian-women doesn't seem very busy. If women are so weak that they can't stand up for themselves when guys start to get rude and obnoxious, there are bigger problems afoot. - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFH4CZzS9HxQb37XmcRAqfKAKDPwAsGxWaPsxTow7n3cT5rdVu0fgCcCBZy 53ZXd3L76yLIcjG68glgOyE= =5QHx -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Tuesday 18 March 2008 10:02:48 am Klein Moebius wrote: > * Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-03-18 11:56:47 -0500]: > > Don't worry. You can count on one hand the number of women on this > > list, and still have 3 left over. > > Uh,oh - Let the outcry begin! What outcry? Ron's got a point. Seems like all the ladies went to debian-women or something. -- Paul Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
* Andrew Sackville-West <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-03-18 10:36:19 -0700]: > /me ducks You may have to move to another planet, not just duck! -- Regards, Klein It's a recession when your neighbour loses his job; it's a depression when you lose yours. -- Harry S. Truman signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 11:56:47AM -0500, Ron Johnson wrote: > On 03/18/08 11:27, Klein Moebius wrote: > > * Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > > >>> Touche. But if I told my wife I married her for her cookies... > >>> > >> Of course. Only at his peril does a man tells his wife the real > >> reason he married her. > > > > Shhh! > > Don't worry. You can count on one hand the number of women on this > list, and still have 3 left over. That means we have 100% more than the minimum required to ensure that they all know... /me ducks A signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
* Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-03-18 11:56:47 -0500]: > Don't worry. You can count on one hand the number of women on this > list, and still have 3 left over. Uh,oh - Let the outcry begin! -- Regards, Klein The hardest thing in the world to understand is the income tax. -- Albert Einstein signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/18/08 11:27, Klein Moebius wrote: > * Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > >>> Touche. But if I told my wife I married her for her cookies... >>> >> Of course. Only at his peril does a man tells his wife the real >> reason he married her. > > Shhh! Don't worry. You can count on one hand the number of women on this list, and still have 3 left over. - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFH3/RPS9HxQb37XmcRAq5NAKCZLh8nj7SmlJMLfigonWVO/+gydACgh9SJ OZltXaixMPvn+JIKqIJXgtM= =4u6L -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
* Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: >> Touche. But if I told my wife I married her for her cookies... >> >Of course. Only at his peril does a man tells his wife the real >reason he married her. Shhh! -- Regards, Klein Ever wonder if taxation without representation might have been cheaper? signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
* Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-03-17 20:07:02 -0500]: > > *MY* mother was ever so glad to see BOTH Wordstar and WordPerfect > > go. And she bakes better cookies than yours does. > > But probably not better than my wife. > Touche. But if I told my wife I married her for her cookies... -- Regards, Klein If Patrick Henry thought that taxation without representation was bad, he should see how bad it is with representation. signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/17/08 22:24, Paul Johnson wrote: > On Monday 17 March 2008 06:33:37 pm Ron Johnson wrote: >> On 03/17/08 20:14, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: >> [snip] >> >>> My dad would be quite at home in front of my VT520; he hasn't been here >>> since I bought it. I remember going to his work (insurance >>> underwriter) when I was a kid; I remember all the green-screens. >> VTs are useful, because they are small. But I'd *never* voluntarily >> use one, because the scrollback buffer of a VT emulator is just way >> too useful. > > I could have sworn I've encountered real VTs with scrollback. Maybe a handful of pages, like the Linux console has, but nothing like the ability to specify 10's of thousands of lines of scrollback buffer. Which has saved my butt on more than a few occasions... - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFH30xzS9HxQb37XmcRAkMTAKCt0cXrhPKVARwOF994OgFUJ479mwCdECMk 3ggoZGeOg5obThv8W22o8vw= =bkrK -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Monday 17 March 2008 06:33:37 pm Ron Johnson wrote: > On 03/17/08 20:14, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: > [snip] > > > My dad would be quite at home in front of my VT520; he hasn't been here > > since I bought it. I remember going to his work (insurance > > underwriter) when I was a kid; I remember all the green-screens. > > VTs are useful, because they are small. But I'd *never* voluntarily > use one, because the scrollback buffer of a VT emulator is just way > too useful. I could have sworn I've encountered real VTs with scrollback. -- Paul Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
Munra wrote: On Mar 15, 8:00 pm, Jonathan Jacobs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: GNOME and KDE are the ones that I have. But, is there one out there that looks like XP. I am going to install Debian on my mothers computer and she is running...slowly...XP. Every other comment out of my mom, about the computer, is that it is running slowly. I have already removed any spyware and whatnot and I have cleaned the reg. It is about time that I upgraded her pc to Debian. Just need a desktop environment that looks like XP..any suggestions? Well, maybe this http://tecnicoslinux.com.ar/web/node/125 could work is based in Kubuntu. Nice work. Does it also simulate an occasional BSOD? ;-) -- Raj Kiran Grandhi -- Politics is for the moment. An equation is for eternity. -- Albert Einstein -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Mar 15, 8:00 pm, Jonathan Jacobs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > GNOME and KDE are the ones that I have. But, is there one out there > that looks like XP. I am going to install Debian on my mothers > computer and she is running...slowly...XP. Every other comment out > of my mom, about the computer, is that it is running slowly. I have > already removed any spyware and whatnot and I have cleaned the > reg. It is about time that I upgraded her pc to Debian. Just need a > desktop environment that looks like XP..any suggestions? > Well, maybe this http://tecnicoslinux.com.ar/web/node/125 could work is based in Kubuntu. > Jonathan > ---Have a good day > Good Things To Say When You're Stressed at work. > > 20. "Wait...I'm trying to imagine you with a personality" > > -- > To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/17/08 20:14, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: [snip] > > My dad would be quite at home in front of my VT520; he hasn't been here > since I bought it. I remember going to his work (insurance > underwriter) when I was a kid; I remember all the green-screens. VTs are useful, because they are small. But I'd *never* voluntarily use one, because the scrollback buffer of a VT emulator is just way too useful. > Then again, he did math on a Facit mechanical calculator. Long division > was fun on that! And he walked around on tip-toes, because the earth was still warm... - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFH3xvxS9HxQb37XmcRAu2dAKDaYaHktnEcntysYYvI30Mao6MIeACdF8pm wCuB/pU4ldq8P6lOgsf6tk4= =FISK -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Mon, Mar 17, 2008 at 07:05:30PM -0500, Ron Johnson wrote: > On 03/17/08 12:38, Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > > On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 03:20:36PM -0400, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: > >> On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 01:48:13PM -0500, Jonathan Jacobs wrote: > >>> I will also tell her that I will install Debian and migrate her email > >>> and word documents over for her. > >> Enjoy teaching her LaTex while she's at it. May as well get her away > >> from "word" into a real system. > > > > this is not necessarily as inappropriate as others have > > suggested. *My* mother (wild generalizations based on one anecdotal > > case follows...) would likely greatly appreciate a CLI based > > editor. All totalled, she has probably processed 10x more words in WP > > 5.1 or so than in all the gui editors combined. Its highly likely that > > an older person may be more comfortable in that environment just from > > past experience. I should probably talk to her about that and see if > > she wants to move "back" to something like that... > > e3 and joe emulate WordStar, if she's *really* old-school. Good'ol mc with mcedit are great. My dad would be quite at home in front of my VT520; he hasn't been here since I bought it. I remember going to his work (insurance underwriter) when I was a kid; I remember all the green-screens. Then again, he did math on a Facit mechanical calculator. Long division was fun on that! Doug. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/17/08 19:46, Klein Moebius wrote: > * Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-03-17 19:05:30 -0500]: > > >> e3 and joe emulate WordStar, if she's *really* old-school. >> > *MY* mother was ever so glad to see BOTH Wordstar and WordPerfect > go. And she bakes better cookies than yours does. But probably not better than my wife. - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFH3xW2S9HxQb37XmcRAkwuAKDMCY6kFKd4YjQDTEDk+6QllBIXWQCg2B/e 2EeCOueHiknJVaw3WLKvF6Y= =oTQC -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
* Ron Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-03-17 19:05:30 -0500]: > e3 and joe emulate WordStar, if she's *really* old-school. > *MY* mother was ever so glad to see BOTH Wordstar and WordPerfect go. And she bakes better cookies than yours does. -- Regards, Klein If built in great numbers, motels will be used for nothing but illegal purposes. -- J. Edgar Hoover signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/17/08 12:38, Andrew Sackville-West wrote: > On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 03:20:36PM -0400, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: >> On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 01:48:13PM -0500, Jonathan Jacobs wrote: >>> I will also tell her that I will install Debian and migrate her email >>> and word documents over for her. >> Enjoy teaching her LaTex while she's at it. May as well get her away >> from "word" into a real system. > > this is not necessarily as inappropriate as others have > suggested. *My* mother (wild generalizations based on one anecdotal > case follows...) would likely greatly appreciate a CLI based > editor. All totalled, she has probably processed 10x more words in WP > 5.1 or so than in all the gui editors combined. Its highly likely that > an older person may be more comfortable in that environment just from > past experience. I should probably talk to her about that and see if > she wants to move "back" to something like that... e3 and joe emulate WordStar, if she's *really* old-school. - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFH3wdKS9HxQb37XmcRAnj9AJsETbC1Ajr+yhv/WhCkgQ4L2NlEDQCfX/eh gd/FVsNCLudxgRDXqty8eh8= =7VLT -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 03:20:36PM -0400, Douglas A. Tutty wrote: > On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 01:48:13PM -0500, Jonathan Jacobs wrote: > > I will also tell her that I will install Debian and migrate her email > > and word documents over for her. > > Enjoy teaching her LaTex while she's at it. May as well get her away > from "word" into a real system. this is not necessarily as inappropriate as others have suggested. *My* mother (wild generalizations based on one anecdotal case follows...) would likely greatly appreciate a CLI based editor. All totalled, she has probably processed 10x more words in WP 5.1 or so than in all the gui editors combined. Its highly likely that an older person may be more comfortable in that environment just from past experience. I should probably talk to her about that and see if she wants to move "back" to something like that... A signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 05:50:47PM -0700, Paul Johnson wrote: > On Sunday 16 March 2008 12:20:36 pm Douglas A. Tutty wrote: > > On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 01:48:13PM -0500, Jonathan Jacobs wrote: > > > I will also tell her that I will install Debian and migrate her email > > > and word documents over for her. > > > > Enjoy teaching her LaTex while she's at it. May as well get her away > > from "word" into a real system. > > The sarcasm and negativity is unwarranted for what is ultimately a relatively > minor change in UI for the audience's prospective. I was being neither sarcastic nor negative. If the user doesn't need to interoperate with other Word users, there's no need to stick with OO just to write letters and notes. Plain text in a text editor (pick one, any one) for the odd note and LaTex for typeset documents. A LaTex template with lots of comments e.g. "place address here, end lines with "\\"" is very straightforward to use and produces nice looking letters. Doug. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 08:29:21PM -0400, Kevin Mark wrote: > On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 07:34:04PM -0500, Jonathan Jacobs wrote: > > GNOME and KDE are the ones that I have. But, is there one out there > > that looks like XP. I am going to install Debian on my mothers computer > > and she is running...slowly...XP. Every other comment out of my mom, > > about the computer, is that it is running slowly. I have already removed > > any spyware and whatnot and I have cleaned the reg. It is about time > > that I upgraded her pc to Debian. Just need a desktop environment that > > looks like XP..any suggestions? > > > Hi Jonathan, > I would suggest that you get many different live-cd distros with > different look and feel: > ubuntu > kubuntu > pclinuxos > etc. > And then tell her to try these differnt ones and see which seems easist > to her. Gnu/Linux does not have somethat that would fool her to think > its XP, so you can´t pull the switch-o-roo without her noticing. Tell Would Windows 95 be close? You should still be able to pick up fvwm95 or at least a config and adapt it to the latest fvwm. :-) -- Chris. ==
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Douglas A. Tutty wrote: > On Mon, Mar 17, 2008 at 10:57:27AM +1100, Rich Healey wrote: > >> Second enlightenment! >> >> It's worth noting that enlightenment is not a DE, (they call it a >> desktop shell), but really it's so much more, because it is whatever you >> make it. >> >> you can run shelfless and have the whole screen to play with, or you can >> bury yourself in widgets and gadgets, making everything shiny as hell >> and meaning you only need to glance over to see what you neeed. >> >> IMHO it's the most customisable thing out there. > > Just not easily. E.g. changing font size requires changing the theme. > I understand that the new version will allow changing fonts on-the-fly. > > I also couldn't figure out how to have icon buttons. E.g., click this > button to open Konqueror. > > I use Icewm. > > Doug. > Was this meant to be aimed at the list? Anyway, changing fonts is not something you often need to do, and in .038 i had an issue with the fonts and one of my favourite themes, it was simple change to allow the theme to change, and since restarting E doesn't close anything that you're working on (excepting E dialog boxes) the "i have to restart" argument hardly applies. this is one of it's major strengths anyway, if E segfaults (hey, it is still alpha) you just start E again and carry on, nothing lost. Also e supports desktop icons, just enable it in the relevant dialog (maybe in appearance, i forget) then create a .desktop in ~/Desktop , there's also a wizard somewhere.. i forget, i'm not really a fan of desktop icons, i only use them when i'm too lazy to mount media manually. Regards Rich Healey -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFH3cZ0LeTfO4yBSAcRAlm5AKCoJGD8poUSor9S3XJntFsVN0olngCeJ5En ZjdNlYT180Yvnxa1CVOnDoc= =RsaP -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Sunday 16 March 2008 12:20:36 pm Douglas A. Tutty wrote: > On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 01:48:13PM -0500, Jonathan Jacobs wrote: > > I will also tell her that I will install Debian and migrate her email > > and word documents over for her. > > Enjoy teaching her LaTex while she's at it. May as well get her away > from "word" into a real system. The sarcasm and negativity is unwarranted for what is ultimately a relatively minor change in UI for the audience's prospective. -- Paul Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
Douglas A. Tutty wrote: > On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 01:48:13PM -0500, Jonathan Jacobs wrote: >> I will also tell her that I will install Debian and migrate her email >> and word documents over for her. > > Enjoy teaching her LaTex while she's at it. May as well get her away > from "word" into a real system. I disagree that LaTex is the "real system" for "word" users! I think the replacement for word would be either oowriter (from openoffice.org) or texmacs or something along those lines. hth raju -- Kamaraju S Kusumanchi http://www.people.cornell.edu/pages/kk288/ http://malayamaarutham.blogspot.com/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 01:48:13PM -0500, Jonathan Jacobs wrote: > I will also tell her that I will install Debian and migrate her email > and word documents over for her. Enjoy teaching her LaTex while she's at it. May as well get her away from "word" into a real system. Doug. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
Thanks to everyone out there who gave me suggestions on how to approach this problem. I have decided to test some of your ideas on my Debian machine first [ ie. themes] and then ask her if she wants the problem of having a slow machine to go away...I will also tell her that I will install Debian and migrate her email and word documents over for her. Thanks to everyone who gave me ideas. Jonathan ---Have a good day GREAT TRUTHS ABOUT GROWING OLD: 3) When you fall down, you wonder what else you can do while you're down there; -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 07:34:04PM -0500, Jonathan Jacobs wrote: > GNOME and KDE are the ones that I have. But, is there one out there > that looks like XP. I am going to install Debian on my mothers > computer and she is running...slowly...XP. Every other comment out > of my mom, about the computer, is that it is running slowly. I have > already removed any spyware and whatnot and I have cleaned the > reg. It is about time that I upgraded her pc to Debian. Just need a > desktop environment that looks like XP..any suggestions? You may be underestimating your mother. This is a common problem. Think of all the new things she has seen in her life (don't know how old you are or how old your mother is). My mother started out picking up lumps of coal that had fallen off the truck to take home to heat the house, wrote with a nib and inkwell, graduating to a fountain pen when the family could afford __one__, later to the ball-point-pen. Then, all of a sudden, her son (me) decides that he wants a computer instead of a car and in 1987-8 goes out and buys an IBM PS/2-70-A21, a database called Paradox, Word Perfect, Fortran compiler, AutoCad... (spending more than on a new Pickup Truck) and says something like "you know mom, you don't have to keep the church records on scraps of paper anymore". So my then 60-year-old mother learns WordPerfect and Paradox (with a handy cheat-sheet). Mothers are surprising creatures. Take a page from any change-management and system-design textbook. Identify the problems. Conduct market research (ask your mother). Engage her in what she wants. Perhaps she doesn't want a Desktop Environment at all. Perhaps she wants Enlightenment window manager. I'd suggest you save copies of the screenshots for all the DTEs and WMs into a directory and perhaps burn them to CD then give the CD to you mother to see what she likes the __look__ of, and watch how she works to see which features she would use most and which she would miss the most. Create a short-list, then install them all on a Debian box, allowing her to choose which to start on login. Doug. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/15/08 21:06, Raj Kiran Grandhi wrote: > Jonathan Jacobs wrote: >> GNOME and KDE are the ones that I have. But, is there one out there >> that looks like XP. I am going to install Debian on my mothers >> computer and she is running...slowly...XP. Every other comment out of >> my mom, about the computer, is that it is running slowly. I have >> already removed any spyware and whatnot and I have cleaned the reg. >> It is about time that I upgraded her pc to Debian. Just need a >> desktop environment that looks like XP..any suggestions? >> >> Jonathan > > If the hardware is fairly recent (< 4 years old), running gnome or kde > on it should not be any problem. I have heard that kde looks more like > windows than gnome, but with the right theme, it should be possible to > make gnome look like windows too. > > IMHO, it would be easier to convince your mother to make the switch to > linux rather than trying to make her believe she is running windows. No > matter what you try, if she has been using windows for a couple of > years, she is bound to find out for herself that it is not windows. > Instead, you can tell her that the reason for the computer being slow > was the result of all the malware and that there is a better > alternative, linux, which doesn't have this problem. I agree 100%. She must know that this is *not* XP! Some things won't work exactly like they do in Windows. GNOME with the Crux theme and a blue-grey "Selected colors" should be comfortable on her eyes. However, reassure her that it will be "close enough" to XP that she won't feel like she's in an alien land. This will be especially easy if she's already using Firefox & Thunderbird. > That is what I did in my father-in-law's case. Sure I had to set things > up for him a little bit. Install skype and set up the internet > connection. But after that he is a happy linux user (ubuntu in this > case) and comments on how easy his computer has become to use. You know, though, that this will make Windows "safe enough": - - install Firefox, Thunderbird & OOo - - remove the IE, Outlook and MSO icons so she can't run them - - setting her up with a restricted account on the XP box, changing the Administrator password - - putting it behind a consumer firewalling router - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFH3KJ7S9HxQb37XmcRAj2aAJ0ZDyvXGiXnVuIYYcMIapZ4sxebhACdETI2 /eI7EMN0A0nynlV80yDhV98= =AzX5 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03/15/08 20:02, Amit Uttamchandani wrote: > On Sat, 15 Mar 2008 19:34:04 -0500 > Jonathan Jacobs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> GNOME and KDE are the ones that I have. But, is there one out there >> that looks like XP. I am going to install Debian on my mothers >> computer and she is running...slowly...XP. Every other comment out >> of my mom, about the computer, is that it is running slowly. I have >> already removed any spyware and whatnot and I have cleaned the >> reg. It is about time that I upgraded her pc to Debian. Just need a >> desktop environment that looks like XP..any suggestions? >> > > Hi there, > > First of all let me tell your mother will be extremely happy with > Debian... > > Then I understand that she will want to use a desktop that she > has been familiar with but If you customize a GNU/Linux desktop... > it will be a lot easier to use than XP. She does not need to worry > about items in the menu tray...complicated UIs... > > I suggest start her out with a simple desktop like > openbox/fluxbox and customize it for her. It will be extremely fast. > The can simply just click icons of the programs that she wants > to use and voila thats it. Check out this link and consider it... Stop smoking that loco weed! > http://www.linux.com/feature/128940 > > Good luck and post back your results... > > amit > > - -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "Working with women is a pain in the a**." My wife -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFH3J3rS9HxQb37XmcRAn8OAKDOU+1yJVshHxbA7lDrE5TCFQVt6gCgtRRL YgVEu0XjRVdRVjGmIv7NhjQ= =OY8/ -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Saturday 15 March 2008 05:34:04 pm Jonathan Jacobs wrote: > GNOME and KDE are the ones that I have. But, is there one out there > that looks like XP. I am going to install Debian on my mothers > computer and she is running...slowly...XP. Every other comment out > of my mom, about the computer, is that it is running slowly. I have > already removed any spyware and whatnot and I have cleaned the > reg. It is about time that I upgraded her pc to Debian. Just need a > desktop environment that looks like XP..any suggestions? KDE's Redmond theme will probably be the closest analogue that has any reasonable amount of software written for it. -- Paul Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
Jonathan Jacobs wrote: GNOME and KDE are the ones that I have. But, is there one out there that looks like XP. I am going to install Debian on my mothers computer and she is running...slowly...XP. Every other comment out of my mom, about the computer, is that it is running slowly. I have already removed any spyware and whatnot and I have cleaned the reg. It is about time that I upgraded her pc to Debian. Just need a desktop environment that looks like XP..any suggestions? Jonathan If the hardware is fairly recent (< 4 years old), running gnome or kde on it should not be any problem. I have heard that kde looks more like windows than gnome, but with the right theme, it should be possible to make gnome look like windows too. IMHO, it would be easier to convince your mother to make the switch to linux rather than trying to make her believe she is running windows. No matter what you try, if she has been using windows for a couple of years, she is bound to find out for herself that it is not windows. Instead, you can tell her that the reason for the computer being slow was the result of all the malware and that there is a better alternative, linux, which doesn't have this problem. That is what I did in my father-in-law's case. Sure I had to set things up for him a little bit. Install skype and set up the internet connection. But after that he is a happy linux user (ubuntu in this case) and comments on how easy his computer has become to use. -- Raj Kiran Grandhi -- At the source of every error which is blamed on the computer, you will find at least two human errors, including the error of blaming it on the computer. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Sat, 15 Mar 2008 19:34:04 -0500 Jonathan Jacobs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > GNOME and KDE are the ones that I have. But, is there one out there > that looks like XP. I am going to install Debian on my mothers > computer and she is running...slowly...XP. Every other comment out > of my mom, about the computer, is that it is running slowly. I have > already removed any spyware and whatnot and I have cleaned the > reg. It is about time that I upgraded her pc to Debian. Just need a > desktop environment that looks like XP..any suggestions? > Hi there, First of all let me tell your mother will be extremely happy with Debian... Then I understand that she will want to use a desktop that she has been familiar with but If you customize a GNU/Linux desktop...it will be a lot easier to use than XP. She does not need to worry about items in the menu tray...complicated UIs... I suggest start her out with a simple desktop like openbox/fluxbox and customize it for her. It will be extremely fast. She can simply just click icons of the programs that she wants to use and voila thats it. Check out this link and consider it... http://www.linux.com/feature/128940 Good luck and post back your results... amit -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Question about Desktop Environments
On Sat, Mar 15, 2008 at 07:34:04PM -0500, Jonathan Jacobs wrote: > GNOME and KDE are the ones that I have. But, is there one out there > that looks like XP. I am going to install Debian on my mothers computer > and she is running...slowly...XP. Every other comment out of my mom, > about the computer, is that it is running slowly. I have already removed > any spyware and whatnot and I have cleaned the reg. It is about time > that I upgraded her pc to Debian. Just need a desktop environment that > looks like XP..any suggestions? > Hi Jonathan, I would suggest that you get many different live-cd distros with different look and feel: ubuntu kubuntu pclinuxos etc. And then tell her to try these differnt ones and see which seems easist to her. Gnu/Linux does not have somethat that would fool her to think its XP, so you can´t pull the switch-o-roo without her noticing. Tell her it will be faster, virus free, something new to try and something that can you can help her customize to her liking. Think: wall paper, font size, themes,... Make it a game to have fun with... The worst that can happen is that she goes back to her XP and seems how slow it is ;-) -K -- | .''`. == Debian GNU/Linux == | my web site: | | : :' : The Universal |mysite.verizon.net/kevin.mark/| | `. `' Operating System| go to counter.li.org and | | `-http://www.debian.org/ |be counted! #238656 | | my keyserver: subkeys.pgp.net | my NPO: cfsg.org | |join the new debian-community.org to help Debian! | |___ Unless I ask to be CCd, assume I am subscribed ___|
