Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 7:51 AM, Phil Steitz phil.ste...@gmail.com wrote: I am not so sure about that. I guess it depends on what kind of simple scripts you are willing to use to automate things and how much you care about being certain that that things are working and you know exactly what is going on. Personally, I would prefer that this machinery be visible and not require web gui games or plaintext passwords to work. I like the way tomcat does this and I will volunteer to develop and document a similar set of Ant tasks for Commons if others are willing to move back to replicating o.a.c groupIds from p.a.o. Phil, my simple script is the POM. With Nexus, my manual steps are typically reduced to copying the -src and -bin files out of the repository (wget's good for that and it copies the whole directory at one go) and copying these to the dist directory. Honestly, there are some things remaining like setting the -current links, updating the README and perhaps the KEYS file and fixing the permissions. But these are left to do anyways. What's wrong with that procedure? Jochen -- Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone. John Maynard Keynes (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Keynes) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On 8/2/11 11:09 PM, Jochen Wiedmann wrote: On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 7:51 AM, Phil Steitz phil.ste...@gmail.com wrote: I am not so sure about that. I guess it depends on what kind of simple scripts you are willing to use to automate things and how much you care about being certain that that things are working and you know exactly what is going on. Personally, I would prefer that this machinery be visible and not require web gui games or plaintext passwords to work. I like the way tomcat does this and I will volunteer to develop and document a similar set of Ant tasks for Commons if others are willing to move back to replicating o.a.c groupIds from p.a.o. Phil, my simple script is the POM. With Nexus, my manual steps are typically reduced to copying the -src and -bin files out of the repository (wget's good for that and it copies the whole directory at one go) and copying these to the dist directory. Honestly, there are some things remaining like setting the -current links, updating the README and perhaps the KEYS file and fixing the permissions. But these are left to do anyways. What's wrong with that procedure? Nothing, other than that is exactly what I do and I know exactly what is going on. I don't see any real saving, that's all and I see no need to bring in proprietary gui-based software into the mix or to wget stuff from remote hosts. Nobody else seems to care about this, but you actually should perform a step that I don't - which is to verify the hashes after you move the stuff to dist/ Phil Jochen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 8:28 AM, Phil Steitz phil.ste...@gmail.com wrote: Nothing, other than that is exactly what I do and I know exactly what is going on. I don't see any real saving, that's all and I see no need to bring in proprietary gui-based software into the mix or to wget stuff from remote hosts. Nobody else seems to care about this, but you actually should perform a step that I don't - which is to verify the hashes after you move the stuff to dist/ Why should I? They have been built by Maven or Nexus automatically? -- Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone. John Maynard Keynes (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Keynes) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On 8/2/11 11:30 PM, Jochen Wiedmann wrote: On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 8:28 AM, Phil Steitz phil.ste...@gmail.com wrote: Nothing, other than that is exactly what I do and I know exactly what is going on. I don't see any real saving, that's all and I see no need to bring in proprietary gui-based software into the mix or to wget stuff from remote hosts. Nobody else seems to care about this, but you actually should perform a step that I don't - which is to verify the hashes after you move the stuff to dist/ Why should I? They have been built by Maven or Nexus automatically? When you transfer files on the Internet, they can get corrupted in transit. This is why we *have* hashes on the files. When you put the files on p.a.o and we VOTE on the bits there, you can just move them to /dist without worrying about integrity. And I seriously hope nothing is being built by nexus :) Phil - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
Le 03/08/2011 08:40, Phil Steitz a écrit : On 8/2/11 11:30 PM, Jochen Wiedmann wrote: On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 8:28 AM, Phil Steitzphil.ste...@gmail.com wrote: Nothing, other than that is exactly what I do and I know exactly what is going on. I don't see any real saving, that's all and I see no need to bring in proprietary gui-based software into the mix or to wget stuff from remote hosts. Nobody else seems to care about this, but you actually should perform a step that I don't - which is to verify the hashes after you move the stuff to dist/ Why should I? They have been built by Maven or Nexus automatically? When you transfer files on the Internet, they can get corrupted in transit. This is why we *have* hashes on the files. When you put the files on p.a.o and we VOTE on the bits there, you can just move them to /dist without worrying about integrity. And I seriously hope nothing is being built by nexus :) I am also worried about a closed tool like Nexus being used to publish Apache stuff. Luc Phil - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
I am also worried about a closed tool like Nexus being used to publish Apache stuff. Luc This is curious, indeed. I always wondered why we use Nexus instead of eating our own dog food Apache Archiva[1], but worried to receive a reply why didn't you RTFM on http://xyz...; :P Have a nice day!!! Simo [1] http://archiva.apache.org/ http://people.apache.org/~simonetripodi/ http://www.99soft.org/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 8:45 AM, Luc Maisonobe luc.maison...@free.fr wrote: I am also worried about a closed tool like Nexus being used to publish Apache stuff. That discussion was made years ago, when Nexus was introduced. And, for the record, I strongly opposed Nexus at that time in favour of other solutions, in particular Archiva, for that very reason. Now that we have Nexus, I won't fight such wars again and again. It's there and it's gonna stay. Just like Jira, or Confluence, for that matter, and I can't remember similar discussions in that area. Jochen -- Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone. John Maynard Keynes (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Keynes) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On 03/08/2011 06:36, Jochen Wiedmann wrote: On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 4:29 PM, Mark Thomas ma...@apache.org wrote: What benefits do we get by using Nexus A real lot of work saved. (Beleave me. I've been RM for the same projects with and without Nexus and it's really a difference.) I fail to see why this is the case. Tomcat releases to the Maven repos and to /dist and doesn't go anywhere near Nexus yet is still minimal effort. An entire release takes 2-3 minutes of actual effort (and about 90 minutes of waiting for stuff to upload). Mark - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On Aug 2, 2011, at 11:45 PM, Luc Maisonobe wrote: I am also worried about a closed tool like Nexus being used to publish Apache stuff. Nexus is not completely closed. There is a community version that contains 90% of the functionality. That said, I really don't want to go look at the source code for any of the repository managers. Ralph - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 6:32 AM, Henri Yandell flame...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 9:30 PM, Phil Steitz phil.ste...@gmail.com wrote: On 8/2/11 5:22 PM, Henri Yandell wrote: On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 7:23 AM, Emmanuel Bourg ebo...@apache.org wrote: Are we still going to deploy Maven artifacts by SCPing to m2-ibiblio-rsync-repository on people.apache.org? I've been discussing the permissions issue for the old groupIds on Nexus with the Infra team (i.e components using the old groupId commons-componentname need a specific configuration on the snapshot and release repositories). Brian Demers kindly proposed to allow the deployment of all commons-* groups on Nexus, but it would require to block the deployment through people.apache.org to avoid metadata conflicts. Do we all agree on using exclusively Nexus for our releases? I would prefer to leave the door open to release more point releases of [pool] and [dbcp] 1.x using the working scripts that i have, so pls do not nuke those. The new versions are in the org.apache groupId tree, so we will have no choice but to use nexus for those. I will have agree to use nexus for the maven repo bits, but prefer to create the actual release artifacts locally, examine them, call a VOTE on them and move the same bits to /dist. Personally, I would rather see us move back the other way (use the Tomcat setup, with Ant tasks pushing to p.a.o/rysnch), but I can see I am in the minority here, so will not stand in the way. Well, I'm in the same minority and I'm not aware it's a minority (have we taken a vote from those release managing?). Me too. When maven works, its great - but when it doesn't it makes you want to tear your hair out. The only releases I've done using the release plugin were commons-parent the build plugin. That was a while ago, but more often than not there were issues. Niall Nexus, Maven release-plugin, they all fire off my keep-it-simple warning flags. They mistake magic for simplicity. Hen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On 8/3/11 1:37 PM, Niall Pemberton wrote: On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 6:32 AM, Henri Yandell flame...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 9:30 PM, Phil Steitz phil.ste...@gmail.com wrote: On 8/2/11 5:22 PM, Henri Yandell wrote: On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 7:23 AM, Emmanuel Bourg ebo...@apache.org wrote: Are we still going to deploy Maven artifacts by SCPing to m2-ibiblio-rsync-repository on people.apache.org? I've been discussing the permissions issue for the old groupIds on Nexus with the Infra team (i.e components using the old groupId commons-componentname need a specific configuration on the snapshot and release repositories). Brian Demers kindly proposed to allow the deployment of all commons-* groups on Nexus, but it would require to block the deployment through people.apache.org to avoid metadata conflicts. Do we all agree on using exclusively Nexus for our releases? I would prefer to leave the door open to release more point releases of [pool] and [dbcp] 1.x using the working scripts that i have, so pls do not nuke those. The new versions are in the org.apache groupId tree, so we will have no choice but to use nexus for those. I will have agree to use nexus for the maven repo bits, but prefer to create the actual release artifacts locally, examine them, call a VOTE on them and move the same bits to /dist. Personally, I would rather see us move back the other way (use the Tomcat setup, with Ant tasks pushing to p.a.o/rysnch), but I can see I am in the minority here, so will not stand in the way. Well, I'm in the same minority and I'm not aware it's a minority (have we taken a vote from those release managing?). Me too. When maven works, its great - but when it doesn't it makes you want to tear your hair out. The only releases I've done using the release plugin were commons-parent the build plugin. That was a while ago, but more often than not there were issues. Hmm Based on comments on this thread, looks like I may not be in the minority on this. I am willing to do the following: 0) Either a) create an Ant deployment script similar to what Tomcat uses [1] or b) create a generic bash script that can be run from p.a.o to deploy from ~rm/foo-x.y.x-RCw 1) Update the web site docs so we have full and working documentation Either of the options in 0) require that we move back to publishing from ibiblio-rsync from p.a.o (and we have to be able to get this reverted - not sure this is even possible at this point, but we could ask). If we decide to start publishing snapshots, we can use the same approach for these. Phil Niall Nexus, Maven release-plugin, they all fire off my keep-it-simple warning flags. They mistake magic for simplicity. Hen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On 8/3/11 2:14 PM, Phil Steitz wrote: On 8/3/11 1:37 PM, Niall Pemberton wrote: On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 6:32 AM, Henri Yandell flame...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 9:30 PM, Phil Steitz phil.ste...@gmail.com wrote: On 8/2/11 5:22 PM, Henri Yandell wrote: On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 7:23 AM, Emmanuel Bourg ebo...@apache.org wrote: Are we still going to deploy Maven artifacts by SCPing to m2-ibiblio-rsync-repository on people.apache.org? I've been discussing the permissions issue for the old groupIds on Nexus with the Infra team (i.e components using the old groupId commons-componentname need a specific configuration on the snapshot and release repositories). Brian Demers kindly proposed to allow the deployment of all commons-* groups on Nexus, but it would require to block the deployment through people.apache.org to avoid metadata conflicts. Do we all agree on using exclusively Nexus for our releases? I would prefer to leave the door open to release more point releases of [pool] and [dbcp] 1.x using the working scripts that i have, so pls do not nuke those. The new versions are in the org.apache groupId tree, so we will have no choice but to use nexus for those. I will have agree to use nexus for the maven repo bits, but prefer to create the actual release artifacts locally, examine them, call a VOTE on them and move the same bits to /dist. Personally, I would rather see us move back the other way (use the Tomcat setup, with Ant tasks pushing to p.a.o/rysnch), but I can see I am in the minority here, so will not stand in the way. Well, I'm in the same minority and I'm not aware it's a minority (have we taken a vote from those release managing?). Me too. When maven works, its great - but when it doesn't it makes you want to tear your hair out. The only releases I've done using the release plugin were commons-parent the build plugin. That was a while ago, but more often than not there were issues. Hmm Based on comments on this thread, looks like I may not be in the minority on this. I am willing to do the following: 0) Either a) create an Ant deployment script similar to what Tomcat uses [1] or b) create a generic bash script that can be run from p.a.o to deploy from ~rm/foo-x.y.x-RCw 1) Update the web site docs so we have full and working documentation Either of the options in 0) require that we move back to publishing from ibiblio-rsync from p.a.o (and we have to be able to get this reverted - not sure this is even possible at this point, but we could ask). If we decide to start publishing snapshots, we can use the same approach for these. Forgot the link: [1] http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/tomcat/trunk/res/maven/mvn-pub.xml Phil Niall Nexus, Maven release-plugin, they all fire off my keep-it-simple warning flags. They mistake magic for simplicity. Hen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
Are we still going to deploy Maven artifacts by SCPing to m2-ibiblio-rsync-repository on people.apache.org? I've been discussing the permissions issue for the old groupIds on Nexus with the Infra team (i.e components using the old groupId commons-componentname need a specific configuration on the snapshot and release repositories). Brian Demers kindly proposed to allow the deployment of all commons-* groups on Nexus, but it would require to block the deployment through people.apache.org to avoid metadata conflicts. Do we all agree on using exclusively Nexus for our releases? Emmanuel Bourg - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On 02/08/2011 15:23, Emmanuel Bourg wrote: Are we still going to deploy Maven artifacts by SCPing to m2-ibiblio-rsync-repository on people.apache.org? I've been discussing the permissions issue for the old groupIds on Nexus with the Infra team (i.e components using the old groupId commons-componentname need a specific configuration on the snapshot and release repositories). Brian Demers kindly proposed to allow the deployment of all commons-* groups on Nexus, but it would require to block the deployment through people.apache.org to avoid metadata conflicts. Do we all agree on using exclusively Nexus for our releases? What benefits do we get by using Nexus and what extra hoops do we have to jump through to get them compared to just using scp? Mark - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On 2 August 2011 15:29, Mark Thomas ma...@apache.org wrote: On 02/08/2011 15:23, Emmanuel Bourg wrote: Are we still going to deploy Maven artifacts by SCPing to m2-ibiblio-rsync-repository on people.apache.org? I've been discussing the permissions issue for the old groupIds on Nexus with the Infra team (i.e components using the old groupId commons-componentname need a specific configuration on the snapshot and release repositories). Brian Demers kindly proposed to allow the deployment of all commons-* groups on Nexus, but it would require to block the deployment through people.apache.org to avoid metadata conflicts. Do we all agree on using exclusively Nexus for our releases? What benefits do we get by using Nexus and what extra hoops do we have to jump through to get them compared to just using scp? The benefits are: * metadata is automatically updated * intercepts all uploads, so cannot accidentally deploy to live repo * automatically checks that signing keys are publicly available * ensures that the artifacts voted on are the ones actually deployed Nexus is automatically used if the gid is o.a.commons. One just has to use mvn deploy and the artifacts will be uploaded to the staging area. The extra steps that have to be done are: 1) Close the staging repo once all the artifacts have been uploaded. This makes the staging area visible for release votes. 2a) Publish the staging repo once the release vote has passed. This allows the artifacts to propagate to Maven Central. OR 2b) Drop the staged artifacts, and re-roll the release. Mark - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 7:23 AM, Emmanuel Bourg ebo...@apache.org wrote: Are we still going to deploy Maven artifacts by SCPing to m2-ibiblio-rsync-repository on people.apache.org? I've been discussing the permissions issue for the old groupIds on Nexus with the Infra team (i.e components using the old groupId commons-componentname need a specific configuration on the snapshot and release repositories). Brian Demers kindly proposed to allow the deployment of all commons-* groups on Nexus, but it would require to block the deployment through people.apache.org to avoid metadata conflicts. Do we all agree on using exclusively Nexus for our releases? I use the Commons release process: http://commons.apache.org/releases/index.html Meaning, that if you replace that with something of equal depth that is Nexus related, then I'll do my best to adapt. Until then I'll follow the docs (and then upload my Maven jars as an afterthought). Please make sure there's no part of the doc that says put your passphrase/password in a plaintext file :) Hen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On 8/2/11 5:22 PM, Henri Yandell wrote: On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 7:23 AM, Emmanuel Bourg ebo...@apache.org wrote: Are we still going to deploy Maven artifacts by SCPing to m2-ibiblio-rsync-repository on people.apache.org? I've been discussing the permissions issue for the old groupIds on Nexus with the Infra team (i.e components using the old groupId commons-componentname need a specific configuration on the snapshot and release repositories). Brian Demers kindly proposed to allow the deployment of all commons-* groups on Nexus, but it would require to block the deployment through people.apache.org to avoid metadata conflicts. Do we all agree on using exclusively Nexus for our releases? I would prefer to leave the door open to release more point releases of [pool] and [dbcp] 1.x using the working scripts that i have, so pls do not nuke those. The new versions are in the org.apache groupId tree, so we will have no choice but to use nexus for those. I will have agree to use nexus for the maven repo bits, but prefer to create the actual release artifacts locally, examine them, call a VOTE on them and move the same bits to /dist. Personally, I would rather see us move back the other way (use the Tomcat setup, with Ant tasks pushing to p.a.o/rysnch), but I can see I am in the minority here, so will not stand in the way. Phil I use the Commons release process: http://commons.apache.org/releases/index.html Meaning, that if you replace that with something of equal depth that is Nexus related, then I'll do my best to adapt. Until then I'll follow the docs (and then upload my Maven jars as an afterthought). Please make sure there's no part of the doc that says put your passphrase/password in a plaintext file :) Hen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 9:30 PM, Phil Steitz phil.ste...@gmail.com wrote: On 8/2/11 5:22 PM, Henri Yandell wrote: On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 7:23 AM, Emmanuel Bourg ebo...@apache.org wrote: Are we still going to deploy Maven artifacts by SCPing to m2-ibiblio-rsync-repository on people.apache.org? I've been discussing the permissions issue for the old groupIds on Nexus with the Infra team (i.e components using the old groupId commons-componentname need a specific configuration on the snapshot and release repositories). Brian Demers kindly proposed to allow the deployment of all commons-* groups on Nexus, but it would require to block the deployment through people.apache.org to avoid metadata conflicts. Do we all agree on using exclusively Nexus for our releases? I would prefer to leave the door open to release more point releases of [pool] and [dbcp] 1.x using the working scripts that i have, so pls do not nuke those. The new versions are in the org.apache groupId tree, so we will have no choice but to use nexus for those. I will have agree to use nexus for the maven repo bits, but prefer to create the actual release artifacts locally, examine them, call a VOTE on them and move the same bits to /dist. Personally, I would rather see us move back the other way (use the Tomcat setup, with Ant tasks pushing to p.a.o/rysnch), but I can see I am in the minority here, so will not stand in the way. Well, I'm in the same minority and I'm not aware it's a minority (have we taken a vote from those release managing?). Nexus, Maven release-plugin, they all fire off my keep-it-simple warning flags. They mistake magic for simplicity. Hen - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 4:29 PM, Mark Thomas ma...@apache.org wrote: What benefits do we get by using Nexus A real lot of work saved. (Beleave me. I've been RM for the same projects with and without Nexus and it's really a difference.) -- Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone. John Maynard Keynes (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Keynes) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
Re: Nexus vs rsync-repository releases
On 8/2/11 10:36 PM, Jochen Wiedmann wrote: On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 4:29 PM, Mark Thomas ma...@apache.org wrote: What benefits do we get by using Nexus A real lot of work saved. (Beleave me. I've been RM for the same projects with and without Nexus and it's really a difference.) I am not so sure about that. I guess it depends on what kind of simple scripts you are willing to use to automate things and how much you care about being certain that that things are working and you know exactly what is going on. Personally, I would prefer that this machinery be visible and not require web gui games or plaintext passwords to work. I like the way tomcat does this and I will volunteer to develop and document a similar set of Ant tasks for Commons if others are willing to move back to replicating o.a.c groupIds from p.a.o. Phil - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org
