Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[André Schnabel]

Hi,


Am 23.06.2010 19:45, schrieb André Schnabel:

Hi,


Am 23.06.2010 18:44, schrieb Frank Mau:

Ok, restored module CUI for all languages (if available). TMX files
comes tomorrow.


any chance to get it for German as well? .. if it is to complicated,
I'll wait for the TMX.


Ok, I built my tmx yesterday -  and get automatic translation for the 
moved strings. So, I can handle the issue.


Thanks,

André

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[André Schnabel]

Hi,

I'm not Friedel, but ... ;)

Am 24.06.2010 01:33, schrieb Goran Rakic:



What I see as missing from pomigrate2 is that PO catalogs should be
actually read on migration, relaying just on filenames is not reliable
enough.


Did anybody try to build a tmx from old translations using po2tmx and 
then pretranslate? I did it yesterday an all the "moved" strings got 
translated. Only problem in XLIFF is, that pretranslate adds the strings 
as suggestion, not as translation (It was much better for XLIFF to add 
as translation and mark as 100% match).





= Contexts everywhere =


oo2xliff gives you the full context ;)



= Merge reading all catalogs =


using tmx gives you what you want. Iv you use xliff as format for 
translation files, you could even correctly mark how the segment was 
translated and decide later hwo to deal with such segments 
(auto-approve, review ...)



*sigh* it's like battling against thousands of tools that process binary 
.doc files where you could have a small number of better tools that can 
easily process odf, because it is xml.



Regards,

André

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Khoem Sokhem]

On Tuesday 22 June 2010 11:29:29 ព្រឹក Khoem Sokhem បាន​សរសេរ ៖
> Hello,
>
> I saw the file in .../devel/DEV300/DEV300_m83/Build-1/POT/ only 1KB of
> size. I think it is not a valid POT file for translating.
> Could  the file be located other location beside the a bove location?

Where can I get DEV300_m83 for UI translating for Beta release ?

Thank for your response.
Sokhem

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Goran Rakic]

У сре, 23. 06 2010. у 10:04 +0200, F Wolff пише:
> > 
> > Hmm .. I'm not really keen of having "yet another tool". If we are 
> > working on something, this should be done within translate toolkit.
> 
> The tool that Goran mentions, pomigrate2 is supposed to handle this to
> some extent.  Goran, can you maybe help us see what is currently missing
> in pomigrate2 to handle this situation?

Hi Friedel, all

Thank you for your comments. I do not know a lot about translate toolkit
source, so please forgive me if I say something wrong here. What I would
like it to have your feedback on some ideas and this may lead to a
better work flow or better tools. I should say that I am very happy to
be able to use Translate toolkit. It helps me a lot to create better
translations for OpenOffice.org, as I am sure it helps many others.

What I see as missing from pomigrate2 is that PO catalogs should be
actually read on migration, relaying just on filenames is not reliable
enough.

I think about OpenOffice.org as a single gettext domain. This split to
many PO files that we have is to help us managing translations but these
files are not different domains. In KDE or GNOME you do not get string
moved from the Minesweeper game to the email client between releases
while in OpenOffice.org it is easy to have string moved between modules.

Using pomigrate2 with compendium option enabled is close to what I would
like and I can usually get better result when using it but using
compendium with the current from POT files as generated by oo2po is not
the same as moving as messages are merged together. I want to apply
compendium after the messages are moved to get fuzzy matching against
new strings, but I would like to have existing translation simply moved
between files.

As pomigrate2 relies on filenames it also can give a huge bloat. When
testautmation was included in the m83 SDF by mistake we got a new UI.po
file in the testautomation directory with 3 new messages. pomigrate2
found a large UI.po file in the source three and copied hundreds of
messages kept as deprecated translation memory. Three new messages where
actually left as untranslated. :)


= Contexts everywhere = 

First I would like if oo2po could provide msgctxt field to all messages
and not just for duplicates inside a single PO file. Resource IDs that
could be found in the SDF file are exactly what gettext context field is
designed for.

I know that this will create a lot of repetitive messages but we all
learned long ago that every string should have its context. Different
languages make distinction between noun and verb or have rich morphology
and require different word forms for different adjective case etc. 
 
Translators can always auto apply translation memory to quickly
translate same messages with different contexts and poconflicts can be
used to check if message is translated differently while it should not
be. I believe there is no any drawback from using contexts with all
messages.


= Merge reading all catalogs =

Having msgctxt/msgid, a smarter pomigrate2 could just look for a exact
match when merging translations with new POT files. This could be
implemented either by building a compendium and asking msgmerge to do it
or having a smarter dedicated code traversing every message from new
templates.

Removed messages could be kept as deprecated translation memory in the
most probably file (same if it exists, in the file where most of the
messages are moved or, finally, in the file with the most similar
filename).

Now if for any reason resource ID changes we will always have good fuzzy
matching working on that string.

I did not do any tests but I strongly believe this will keep all
translations when messages are moved and resource ID stay the same and
still provide a good fuzzy match if resource ID changes.


= Some unrelated comments =

I wrote a wrapper around msgmerge to add --previous flag when called
from pomigrate2. That is very useful option of msgmerge when reviewing
fuzzy matches. I like even more ediff output style as provided by
Pology[1] (run posieve diff-previous lang.po after msgmerge --previous)
but that can be handled later by editors.

When using version control (we are using Subversion repository for
Serbian OpenOffice.org translations) pomerge from translate toolkit
makes a mess. It outputs all messages, not just a modified ones making
version control diffs hard to comprehend.

I like the speed of pogrep and the power of pofilter but for merging
correction back I use Pology and posieve with merge_corr_tree sieve.
(with pogrep output in ui-check run posieve merge_corr_tree ui
-spathdelta:ui:ui-check to merge fixes).

It goes over all catalogs in the ui three, looking for same in the
ui-check three and updates only modified messages keeping very nice
diffs. It would be great to have pomerge doing the same.


Best regards,
Goran Rakic

[1]
http://techbase.kde.org/Localization/Tools/Pology/PO_Embedded_Diffing#Lightweight_Diffing_when_Updating

Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[André Schnabel]

Hi,


Am 23.06.2010 18:44, schrieb Frank Mau:

Ok, restored module CUI for all languages (if available). TMX files
comes tomorrow.


any chance to get it for German as well? .. if it is to complicated, 
I'll wait for the TMX.


Thanks,

André

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Valter Mura]

In data mercoledì 23 giugno 2010 19:21:14, Rafaella Braconi ha scritto:

> This is great news! Thank you Frank for all your work!
> 
> @ all Pootle Users:
> as Frank has said, the previous translations have been restored. You can
> now proceed with the translation work.
> 
> Kind Regards,
> Rafaella

Thanks for the info,

regards,
-- 
Valter
Registered Linux User #466410  http://counter.li.org
Kubuntu Linux: www.kubuntu.org
OpenOffice: www.openoffice.org

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Rafaella Braconi]

This is great news! Thank you Frank for all your work!

@ all Pootle Users:
as Frank has said, the previous translations have been restored. You can 
now proceed with the translation work.


Kind Regards,
Rafaella

Frank Mau ha scritto:
Ok, restored module CUI for all languages (if available). TMX files 
comes tomorrow.


Cheers,
Frank

Rafaella Braconi schrieb:

Hi Paolo, All,


There is no need to provide them for italian, I created by myself 
using 3.2.1 translations and made it available to translators.
Of course having them in an official repository would be better, but 
it not a big issue..
  
Frank just told me that he will be providing the OOo 3.2.1 tmx files. 
Also, he is restoring the status of the CUI module by using the 
previous translations.


So please stay tuned and wait till the status of the 
http://pootle.sunvirtuallab.com/xx/openoffice_org/cui folder is 
restored. This applies to all languages.


Thanks,
Rafaella

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Frank Mau]

Ok, restored module CUI for all languages (if available). TMX files 
comes tomorrow.


Cheers,
Frank

Rafaella Braconi schrieb:

Hi Paolo, All,


There is no need to provide them for italian, I created by myself 
using 3.2.1 translations and made it available to translators.
Of course having them in an official repository would be better, but 
it not a big issue..
  
Frank just told me that he will be providing the OOo 3.2.1 tmx files. 
Also, he is restoring the status of the CUI module by using the previous 
translations.


So please stay tuned and wait till the status of the 
http://pootle.sunvirtuallab.com/xx/openoffice_org/cui folder is 
restored. This applies to all languages.


Thanks,
Rafaella

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Rafaella Braconi]

Hi Martin

Martin Srebotnjak ha scritto:

Now I am furious, I have a fully localized m83 and now I will have to -
what?
  

sorry I was not clear. This refers to the ones translating with Pootle.
Glad to be far away from furious translators ;-) .

Rafaella

Lp, m.

2010/6/23 Rafaella Braconi 

  

Hi Paolo, All,




There is no need to provide them for italian, I created by myself using
3.2.1 translations and made it available to translators.
Of course having them in an official repository would be better, but it
not a big issue..


  

Frank just told me that he will be providing the OOo 3.2.1 tmx files. Also,
he is restoring the status of the CUI module by using the previous
translations.

So please stay tuned and wait till the status of the
http://pootle.sunvirtuallab.com/xx/openoffice_org/cui folder is restored.
This applies to all languages.

Thanks,
Rafaella


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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Martin Srebotnjak]

Haha, OK, great!

Lp, m.

2010/6/23 Rafaella Braconi 

> Hi Martin
>
> Martin Srebotnjak ha scritto:
>
>  Now I am furious, I have a fully localized m83 and now I will have to -
>> what?
>>
>>
> sorry I was not clear. This refers to the ones translating with Pootle.
> Glad to be far away from furious translators ;-) .
>
> Rafaella
>
>  Lp, m.
>>
>> 2010/6/23 Rafaella Braconi 
>>
>>
>>
>>> Hi Paolo, All,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
 There is no need to provide them for italian, I created by myself using
 3.2.1 translations and made it available to translators.
 Of course having them in an official repository would be better, but it
 not a big issue..




>>> Frank just told me that he will be providing the OOo 3.2.1 tmx files.
>>> Also,
>>> he is restoring the status of the CUI module by using the previous
>>> translations.
>>>
>>> So please stay tuned and wait till the status of the
>>> http://pootle.sunvirtuallab.com/xx/openoffice_org/cui folder is
>>> restored.
>>> This applies to all languages.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Rafaella
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
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>
>

Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Martin Srebotnjak]

Now I am furious, I have a fully localized m83 and now I will have to -
what?

Lp, m.

2010/6/23 Rafaella Braconi 

> Hi Paolo, All,
>
>
>> There is no need to provide them for italian, I created by myself using
>> 3.2.1 translations and made it available to translators.
>> Of course having them in an official repository would be better, but it
>> not a big issue..
>>
>>
> Frank just told me that he will be providing the OOo 3.2.1 tmx files. Also,
> he is restoring the status of the CUI module by using the previous
> translations.
>
> So please stay tuned and wait till the status of the
> http://pootle.sunvirtuallab.com/xx/openoffice_org/cui folder is restored.
> This applies to all languages.
>
> Thanks,
> Rafaella
>
>
> -
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>
>

Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Rafaella Braconi]

Hi Olivier,

Hi Rafaella & dev's

I would like to express my deep disapointment with this situation.

I just can't figure why we, translators, have to fix code refactoring 
l10n issues, without any early notice and with apparently not a 
miminal concern from the developers with respect to the overload they 
inflict to us. Our job is not a lesser job, and we produce what our NL 
users see first-hand in the software.


I am not concerned on re-work thru automatic cut-&-paste on something 
already done long time ago. I am concerned on the error and mistakes 
we will for sure introduce each time we have to edit a po file that 
has been committed years before, with almost no backup or easy 
traceback procedure to recover the precise string used at that time. 
As said in this thread, it is the same workload as if it was new.


So, I beg you to work on how to stop this.

I am fully with you and I'll make sure this will be handled with priority.
Also, please note that Frank is restoring the status of the CUI module 
by using the previous translations. It's taking some time since this is 
a manual work.
So please stay tuned and wait till the status of the 
http://pootle.sunvirtuallab.com/xx/openoffice_org/cui folder is 
restored. This applies to all languages.


Kind Regards,
Rafaella



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[l10n-dev] Re: [native-lang] Re: [l10n-dev] local domain name contact

[Charles-H. Schulz]

Shalom Lior,


Le Mon, 21 Jun 2010 19:09:47 +0200,
Sophie  a écrit :

> 
> Hi Lior,
> Lior Kaplan wrote:
> > Hi,
> > 
> > I'm not sure who to contact, so I'm asking the list for an advice.
> > 
> > I'd like to use openoffice.org.il for the new translation
> > coordination. Who can I talk with about using this domain?
> > It's already registered to Sun, and appear (through an iframe)  at
> > http://he.openoffice.org
> > 
> > I can even handle having he.openoffice.org for my use.
> 
> First, it's nice to see you on board :-)
> For the domain, you should ask on the NLC list (cced here) and Louis
> or Charles will be able to grant you the necessary rights. And note,
> we do not use country domains but languages.
> 
> For coordination of the translation, I think the wiki will be easier
> to manage for your team. Just open a category under 
> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/HE and add the flag of the 
> category in the page and use it as you need, it's your space.
> 

Sophie is quite right. Am I to understand that you're taking over the
lead of the Hebrew project?

Best,
Charles-H. Schulz.



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[l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Rafaella Braconi]

Hi Paolo, All,


There is no need to provide them for italian, I created by myself using 
3.2.1 translations and made it available to translators.
Of course having them in an official repository would be better, but it 
not a big issue..
  
Frank just told me that he will be providing the OOo 3.2.1 tmx files. 
Also, he is restoring the status of the CUI module by using the previous 
translations.


So please stay tuned and wait till the status of the 
http://pootle.sunvirtuallab.com/xx/openoffice_org/cui folder is 
restored. This applies to all languages.


Thanks,
Rafaella

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Paolo Pozzan]

In data mercoledì 23 giugno 2010 01:00:16, Valter Mura ha scritto:
> In data martedì 22 giugno 2010 14:42:35, Rafaella Braconi ha scritto:
> > > Please take a look, for instance, at the CUI folder as it
> > > contains all strings for the options, the dialogs, tab pages and
> > > customization. This is something ready from the begining of the
> > > project. Other folders seems to have the same problem, and I
> > > have no way to easily point what went wrong.
> > 
> > the problem is always that whenever there is a resource shifting
> > it's very difficult to keep the translations... I wonder if 3.2
> > tmx files would help to recover old translations.
> > 
> > They can be found at:
> > http://ooo.services.openoffice.org/pub/OpenOffice.org/cws/upload/lo
> > calizati on/tmx32/
> 
> I do confirm, with regret, I cannot found an updated tmx for
> Italian...
> 
> Ciao

There is no need to provide them for italian, I created by myself using 
3.2.1 translations and made it available to translators.
Of course having them in an official repository would be better, but it 
not a big issue..

Paolo

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Frank Mau]

Hi Friedel et al.,
good to know you're making progress in version 2.x. Btw. we ordered a 
new Pootle server for the OO.o community so we can get rid of the old 
infrastructure. We may need your help Friedel to set up a Pootle 2.x on 
the machine (and yes with a Linux ;-) ). That's the good news the bad 
one is, we won't have this server in place for the current 3.3 
translation round, sorry.


Cheers,
Frank

F Wolff schrieb:

Op Di, 2010-06-22 om 14:42 +0200 skryf Rafaella Braconi:

Hi Olivier,


Hi everybody


On 22.06.10 11:59, Olivier Hallot wrote:

Hi Rafaella

It is (so far) in the UI.

Please take a look, for instance, at the CUI folder as it contains all 
strings for the options, the dialogs, tab pages and customization. 
This is something ready from the begining of the project. Other 
folders seems to have the same problem, and I have no way to easily 
point what went wrong.
the problem is always that whenever there is a resource shifting it's 
very difficult to keep the translations... I wonder if 3.2 tmx files 
would help to recover old translations.


They can be found at: 
http://ooo.services.openoffice.org/pub/OpenOffice.org/cws/upload/localization/tmx32/
In summary, pt-BR UI got back to 90% of translated strings (from 100%) 
and that does not seem correct with respect to the new features 
announced for OO 3.3.


On a side note, I really think we need a version control on the po 
files...

I think that a more powerful translation memory in Pootle would help...


I am surprised to hear that the PO files aren't in version control - it
has many advantages, so I would strongly recommend it.  Translation
memory in Pootle will solve some of the issues we are talking about, but
I still believe we need a way to find specific versions of the
translations reliably.

The upcoming version of Pootle has made good progress towards giving
translation memory in the online translation interface.  Although the
final bits aren't implemented yet, I hope we can have it reasonably
soon.  I'd really appreciate it if people can get involved - at least
for working towards a user interface for it.  For the case of OOo
(especially if stuff moved around), I think using TMX files during the
upgrade and/or pomigrate2 is still the better solution anyway, since a
cleaner migration to a new version means less review work, whereas
translation memory would mean more information for translators, but
requiring lots of review.

Keep well
Friedel


--
Recently on my blog:
http://translate.org.za/blogs/friedel/en/content/emotions-and-localisation


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Re: [l10n-dev] Translation of the new Thank YOU page

[Frank Mau]

Hi Alexandro,
you're right, the HTML code is old fashioned and yes it should be. We 
drive a little bit more conservative to support old browser. So there is 
no need to redesign the page, there is only the desire for translation ;-)


Cheers,
Frank

Pls.
Alexandro Colorado schrieb:

I upload the localization for spanish here:
http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=112610

I most say that the HTML is very crude, having lots of deprecated tags
and styling embedded in the page as opposed of using CSS. For example
has  tags instead of  and use of tables instead of DIV.
Maybe should be improved HTML code to at least a more modern age. It
lacks a DoctType and really looks like an HTML 4.01 page.

I wonder what software did this page, is very outdated. Anyone else notice this?
Should webdev group go through the code of this page?


On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 9:29 AM, Rafaella Braconi
 wrote:

Dear All,

this is a headsup that we are going to redirect all Thank you pages for
which we haven't received translations to the English Thank you page. If
this shouldn't be done for your language and you still want to deliver a
translated thank you page, please let me know by Thursday, June 24th CEST
COB.

Thanks,
Rafaella

On 11.06.10 18:02, Rafaella Braconi wrote:

Dear All,

the new Thank YOU page
 is now online and
ready to be translated - for all the ones who would like to see it in their
language.
The *Thank YOU page* is displayed by the the OpenOffice.org update
notifications. When an OpenOffice.org user gets notified that there is a new
version available, during the product download, the browser opens and
displays the Thank YOU page.
I've created a wiki page with a few instructions on how to proceed to
translate this page at:
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Translation_for_ThankYou_Page

Kind Regards,
Rafaella

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[Rafaella Braconi]

Hi Valter,

Valter Mura ha scritto:

In data martedì 22 giugno 2010 14:42:35, Rafaella Braconi ha scritto:

  

Please take a look, for instance, at the CUI folder as it contains all
strings for the options, the dialogs, tab pages and customization.
This is something ready from the begining of the project. Other
folders seems to have the same problem, and I have no way to easily
point what went wrong.
  

the problem is always that whenever there is a resource shifting it's
very difficult to keep the translations... I wonder if 3.2 tmx files
would help to recover old translations.

They can be found at:
http://ooo.services.openoffice.org/pub/OpenOffice.org/cws/upload/localizati
on/tmx32/


I do confirm, with regret, I cannot found an updated tmx for Italian... 
  

me neither. Let me check and come back to you.

Rafaella

Ciao
  


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Re: [l10n-dev] Translation of the new Thank YOU page

[Rafaella Braconi]

Thank you, Alexandro for pointing this out. I am forwarding you feedback.

Rafaella

Alexandro Colorado ha scritto:

I upload the localization for spanish here:
http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=112610

I most say that the HTML is very crude, having lots of deprecated tags
and styling embedded in the page as opposed of using CSS. For example
has  tags instead of  and use of tables instead of DIV.
Maybe should be improved HTML code to at least a more modern age. It
lacks a DoctType and really looks like an HTML 4.01 page.

I wonder what software did this page, is very outdated. Anyone else notice this?
Should webdev group go through the code of this page?


On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 9:29 AM, Rafaella Braconi
 wrote:
  

Dear All,

this is a headsup that we are going to redirect all Thank you pages for
which we haven't received translations to the English Thank you page. If
this shouldn't be done for your language and you still want to deliver a
translated thank you page, please let me know by Thursday, June 24th CEST
COB.

Thanks,
Rafaella

On 11.06.10 18:02, Rafaella Braconi wrote:


Dear All,

the new Thank YOU page
 is now online and
ready to be translated - for all the ones who would like to see it in their
language.
The *Thank YOU page* is displayed by the the OpenOffice.org update
notifications. When an OpenOffice.org user gets notified that there is a new
version available, during the product download, the browser opens and
displays the Thank YOU page.
I've created a wiki page with a few instructions on how to proceed to
translate this page at:
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Translation_for_ThankYou_Page

Kind Regards,
Rafaella

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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[F Wolff]

Op Wo, 2010-06-23 om 07:55 +0200 skryf André Schnabel:
> Hi,

Hallo Goran, André, everybody.


> Am 22.06.2010 21:39, schrieb Goran Rakic:
> > У уто, 22. 06 2010. у 16:10 -0300, Olivier Hallot пише:
> >> Hi Rafaella&  dev's
> >>
> >> I would like to express my deep disapointment with this situation.
> >
> > I will second that, but for what I know the problem here is in our PO
> > toolkit, not in the process how developers work. Things can easily
> > improve by creating a new tool for merging POTs created from SDF file
> > with old PO files that could cope up with code moving from one module
> > into another.
> >
> > If there are no voices against it I can work on this during July so we
> > can test and improve it later and make it ready for next release cycle.
> 
> 
> Hmm .. I'm not really keen of having "yet another tool". If we are 
> working on something, this should be done within translate toolkit. The 
> pretranslate tool from translate toolkit is supposed to do exactly what 
> we need - unfortunately it doesn't work the way we need it.

The tool that Goran mentions, pomigrate2 is supposed to handle this to
some extent.  Goran, can you maybe help us see what is currently missing
in pomigrate2 to handle this situation?  We should file a bug for the
Translate Toolkit to ensure that we can prioritise this and try to fix
this for everyone's benefit.


> At least not for xliff - did anybody try with .po?
> 
> I also did not check, how "successfull" pretranslate works with 
> translation memories. Unfortunately pretranslate manpage gives no 
> information, what format to use as translation memory file.
> 
> In fact - for my own workflow (using xliff files, OLTE and built in 
> translation memory which is based on the translations I did so far) 
> gives ~ 60% automatic transaltions for the "moved" strings.
> My translatoin memory does not contain all the previus translations, 
> therefore the rather low rate. Unfortunately there is no german tmx file 
> at ooo.services :(
> 
> 
> 
> So for me - before starting a new tool I'd recommend:
> - to provide .tmx files based on previous translations for all languages
> - try to improve translate toolkit
> - teach developers about the workload some acitivities cause here, that 
> seem to be very simple for developers and find some way to move l10n 
> strings along with the original english strings

I agree with all of this.  Several tools, such as our own Virtaal, can
use the TMX file to provide speedup to translators when working.

We shouldn't underestimate the difference in value between identifier
matched TM, and source text matched TM - matching perfectly on
identifier and source text is the first prise, and would mean that no
review of the string would be necessary (in principle).  Matching on
source text only (as you would with TMX files) would need review, in my
opinion (at least for anything shorter).

So please, let us work together to fix whatever we need on the tools
side (including for teams using XLIFF :-)

 - We need to migrate translations well if source code moves, without
translators needing to do a lot of work.  I believe pomigrate2 is at
least a step in the right direction, maybe with some outstanding work.

 - We need to ensure that up-to-date translation memories are available
for people to use (regardless of whether source code moves or not).

Keep well
Friedel


--
Recently on my blog:
http://translate.org.za/blogs/friedel/en/content/emotions-and-localisation


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Re: [l10n-dev] IMPORTANT: OpenOffice.org 3.3 - translation schedule

[F Wolff]

Op Di, 2010-06-22 om 14:42 +0200 skryf Rafaella Braconi:
> Hi Olivier,

Hi everybody

> On 22.06.10 11:59, Olivier Hallot wrote:
> > Hi Rafaella
> >
> > It is (so far) in the UI.
> >
> > Please take a look, for instance, at the CUI folder as it contains all 
> > strings for the options, the dialogs, tab pages and customization. 
> > This is something ready from the begining of the project. Other 
> > folders seems to have the same problem, and I have no way to easily 
> > point what went wrong.
> 
> the problem is always that whenever there is a resource shifting it's 
> very difficult to keep the translations... I wonder if 3.2 tmx files 
> would help to recover old translations.
> 
> They can be found at: 
> http://ooo.services.openoffice.org/pub/OpenOffice.org/cws/upload/localization/tmx32/
> >
> > In summary, pt-BR UI got back to 90% of translated strings (from 100%) 
> > and that does not seem correct with respect to the new features 
> > announced for OO 3.3.
> >
> > On a side note, I really think we need a version control on the po 
> > files...
> I think that a more powerful translation memory in Pootle would help...

I am surprised to hear that the PO files aren't in version control - it
has many advantages, so I would strongly recommend it.  Translation
memory in Pootle will solve some of the issues we are talking about, but
I still believe we need a way to find specific versions of the
translations reliably.

The upcoming version of Pootle has made good progress towards giving
translation memory in the online translation interface.  Although the
final bits aren't implemented yet, I hope we can have it reasonably
soon.  I'd really appreciate it if people can get involved - at least
for working towards a user interface for it.  For the case of OOo
(especially if stuff moved around), I think using TMX files during the
upgrade and/or pomigrate2 is still the better solution anyway, since a
cleaner migration to a new version means less review work, whereas
translation memory would mean more information for translators, but
requiring lots of review.

Keep well
Friedel


--
Recently on my blog:
http://translate.org.za/blogs/friedel/en/content/emotions-and-localisation


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[l10n-dev] Dba : typo in source string

[Sophie]

Hi all,

For information, I've open this issue
http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=112617

Kins regards
Sophie

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