Re: Website Translation Solution Proposal
On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:41 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: 2) Propagating a project wide change across all language subsites and requiring translation, e,g., a project-wide announcement on the home page or a new release that needs to be noted on the download page. Is there a mechanism in place for at least announcing in each supported language that there's significant news in English (translators appreciated)? Don
Re: Website Translation Solution Proposal
If we think of having CMS interacting with pootle or google, we should coordinate with Infra, so it can a solution available to all project within ASF. rgds Jan I. Ps. I am not sure how this scaled with the earlier proposal/idea from rob, on the wiki maintenance thread. On 20 February 2013 18:41, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: I'd recommend that we take this discussion to the dev list... On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:23 PM, Samer Mansour samer...@gmail.com wrote: Kadal, That is not a sustainable or scalable solution, not all volunteers have time to create separate pages for over 60+ languages, we also don't have the administrative power to support all those pages created. Which ever solution we do implement, you and other translators will be able to edit the translation directly from the CMS to correct grammatical errors. No need to manually create more pages or forked assets. If we go with Google's you'll be able to feed google with better translations and improve their service for your community. If we go with Pootle we potentially would be able to host more languages than Google can offer. This is the trade off between the two services. Both would require some coding on my part, so its negligible. But both solutions scale. It might be worth considering the kinds of maintenance (at the content level) that we should think about when designing a new solution: 1) Supporting a new language and creating a new language-specific subsite. 2) Propagating a project wide change across all language subsites and requiring translation, e,g., a project-wide announcement on the home page or a new release that needs to be noted on the download page. 3) Announcements for only a single language page, e.g., announcement of a local user conference in Spain 4) Editing of additional pages that are specific for a given language, e.g., description of bidi/RTL features for Arabic, links to French support forum. I think 1 and 2 above could be handled well with Pootle. That way the translators who already translate the AOO UI and help files could also translate the website pages using the same tools. The challenge is to find a way to do the customizations of points 3 and 4. But note that these are not translations, but content authored originally in the native language. Maybe something in the page generation from the template can discover the existence of additional pages and automatically add them to the navigation? -Rob I need to take Rob's advice and tackle only a subset of pages we want to translate by pootle and how we can leverage other less important pages with Google. Samer On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:01 PM, Kadal Amutham vka...@gmail.com wrote: I just checked that, it is utterly useless. At least for Tamil, I will translate all the pages manually, make it into HTML and give it to you With Warm Regards V.Kadal Amutham 919444360480 914422396480 On 20 February 2013 21:35, Samer Mansour samer...@gmail.com wrote: Kadal this is getting off topic. Please use http://translate.google.com/?sl=ta to translate from Tamil to English or any language for your needs. On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 10:58 AM, Kadal Amutham vka...@gmail.com wrote: Amazing! How did you get that? Even though the translation is not good, it is a good attempt. We can expect things to improve in the days to come. I could not read it fully the translated version. Can you give me the full translated text? With Warm Regards V.Kadal Amutham 919444360480 914422396480 On 20 February 2013 21:22, Samer Mansour samer...@gmail.com wrote: It is broken up, but it sounds like a story about a guru leaving his village. Tamil is in a alpha, so its not the greatest but Google Translate has the ability to override translations. eg. We would ask our translators to click improve this translation, then users will be presented the translation from our translators (not the computerized one currently there). See this for example: http://s12.postimage.org/bngjt1xot/Untitled.png On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 9:51 AM, Kadal Amutham vka...@gmail.com wrote: I have just uploaded a tamil page with google translate service. The page is running at thewink.in/indexTest http://thewink.in/indexTest.html ,html with google translate service. Check whether you can read the page in English With Warm Regards V.Kadal Amutham 919444360480 914422396480 On 20 February 2013 19:58, Samer Mansour samer...@gmail.com wrote: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=does+google+translate+tamil http://translate.google.com/about/ Yes. On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:20 AM, Kadal Amutham vka...@gmail.com wrote:
Re: Website Translation Solution Proposal
This is an early investigation, I'm not familiar with Pootle. I will check to see if we can create a process to notify translators when something needs translating, such as their mailing list. In either situation I think we'll be gaining more translations with less overhead work. Its an improvement. Which pages we choose depends on what needs to be completed in each scope. I say we start with a small scope when we do eventually come up with a solution. That way we can go revert if its not working well. We should start with the Why page for this reason. Rob, If locale specific announcements don't happen often we could consider this. We could simply announce content for all locales, a conference in Spain isn't limited to those who read Spanish, or live there. A language release, isn't limited to a country or set of countries, as immigrants to other countries could use it. Am I forgetting any other cases for locale specific announcements? Plus its great PR for all locales to hear we're global. My only concern is if there is multiple locale specific announcements a week, it may get busy looking, but it doesn't seem like its happening now. Samer On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:55 PM, Donald Whytock dwhyt...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:41 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: 2) Propagating a project wide change across all language subsites and requiring translation, e,g., a project-wide announcement on the home page or a new release that needs to be noted on the download page. Is there a mechanism in place for at least announcing in each supported language that there's significant news in English (translators appreciated)? Don
Re: Website Translation Solution Proposal
On 20 February 2013 19:18, Samer Mansour samer...@gmail.com wrote: This is an early investigation, I'm not familiar with Pootle. I will check to see if we can create a process to notify translators when something needs translating, such as their mailing list. In either situation I think we'll be gaining more translations with less overhead work. Its an improvement. I happen to be quite familiar with both mdtext and pootle. It would be techinally easy to write a script, that takes mdtext and updates the pootle database (using po file structure), and of course going back again is merely a question of updating svn. Notifying translators, might be just as easy, and can be done with methods already in place, using e.g. bugzilla. Create an issue in each langauge, and ask translators to watch the issue. the script that updates pootle, would then only need to make a comment in bugzilla. rgds jan I. Which pages we choose depends on what needs to be completed in each scope. I say we start with a small scope when we do eventually come up with a solution. That way we can go revert if its not working well. We should start with the Why page for this reason. Rob, If locale specific announcements don't happen often we could consider this. We could simply announce content for all locales, a conference in Spain isn't limited to those who read Spanish, or live there. A language release, isn't limited to a country or set of countries, as immigrants to other countries could use it. Am I forgetting any other cases for locale specific announcements? Plus its great PR for all locales to hear we're global. My only concern is if there is multiple locale specific announcements a week, it may get busy looking, but it doesn't seem like its happening now. the real problem, I think is to get a web structure that support these languages and makes it easy to jump between them. Samer On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:55 PM, Donald Whytock dwhyt...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:41 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: 2) Propagating a project wide change across all language subsites and requiring translation, e,g., a project-wide announcement on the home page or a new release that needs to be noted on the download page. Is there a mechanism in place for at least announcing in each supported language that there's significant news in English (translators appreciated)? Don
Re: Website Translation Solution Proposal
On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 1:18 PM, Samer Mansour samer...@gmail.com wrote: This is an early investigation, I'm not familiar with Pootle. I will check to see if we can create a process to notify translators when something needs translating, such as their mailing list. In either situation I think we'll be gaining more translations with less overhead work. Its an improvement. Which pages we choose depends on what needs to be completed in each scope. I say we start with a small scope when we do eventually come up with a solution. That way we can go revert if its not working well. We should start with the Why page for this reason. Rob, If locale specific announcements don't happen often we could consider this. We could simply announce content for all locales, a conference in Spain isn't limited to those who read Spanish, or live there. A language release, isn't limited to a country or set of countries, as immigrants to other countries could use it. Am I forgetting any other cases for locale specific announcements? Plus its great PR for all locales to hear we're global. My only concern is if there is multiple locale specific announcements a week, it may get busy looking, but it doesn't seem like its happening now. There are two different things that maybe I was not sufficiently distinguishing: 1) Let's call the top center blue thing we have the announcement 2) And then call the column of additional messages we have on the right news. We could make the assumption that the announcement string is project-wide and should be translated for each NL page. Note that the announcement is typically a string and a URL. So the string is Here is important news about XXX and the URL points to a page or blog post containing details. At the very least we should translate the announcement string. But in many cases we'll also translate the supporting page. But in some cases we won't. So this might end up being something where we look for a translation but have a fallback to English if no translation is found. The news column is similar, but I think there it might make sense to have language-specific announcements also. A data-driven approach might suggest keeping these announcements together in one place, maybe an RSS or ATOM feed, and then have metadata that describes its use. For example, this announcement should run from date A to date B in all languages, while this other announcement is only in German between these dates, and this third announcement (say a call for volunteers) can be done any time there is room, but treat it as lower priority. Then we could rotate in announcements on a daily basis without requiring explicit page and column placement. But maybe not start with that complexity. Getting consistent use of a template (any template) will make it easier to roll out more complicated processing later. So treating announcements and news as site-wide for now is a good starting point. Regards, -Rob Samer On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:55 PM, Donald Whytock dwhyt...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 12:41 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: 2) Propagating a project wide change across all language subsites and requiring translation, e,g., a project-wide announcement on the home page or a new release that needs to be noted on the download page. Is there a mechanism in place for at least announcing in each supported language that there's significant news in English (translators appreciated)? Don
Re: Website Translation Solution Proposal
Hi 2013/2/20 Samer Mansour samer...@gmail.com: This is an early investigation, I'm not familiar with Pootle. I will check to see if we can create a process to notify translators when something needs translating, such as their mailing list. In either situation I think we'll be gaining more translations with less overhead work. Its an improvement. Maybe we can use Website Meta Language - WML[1] [1]http://thewml.org/ I gave some examples in other thread[2] and we can get it sync easy and with some tools to monitoring the outdated pages[3]. [2]http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.apache.openoffice.devel/1361 [3]http://www.debian.org/devel/website/stats/pt#outdated The problem is my time to reorganize and help this question, but I see that this resource (WML) can be a good solution. Regards, Claudio
