Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Students will quit submitting the works found on the Web when the chances are very good they will be easily caught. That's pretty easy given Google and other search engines into which a few "suspicious words" will generate the original source of the material. In the meantime, students who search the Web and use it constructively will enjoy nice benefits. At 11:30 PM -0400 9/30/04, Maria Cervone wrote: This is a good first thought for knowledge sharing. One word of caution, though: teachers are already struggling with a rampant problem of students purchasing term papers on the internet and turning them in as if it were their own work. If term papers were included in Wikipedia, it would make it all the more easy for students to cheat. I personally don't understand why a student would want to do so, as little knowledge is gained when the effort is minimal. Unfortunately all too many students haven't learned that yet... Maria Cervone masters student School of Information University of Michigan -- John W. Hibbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.bfranklin.edu/johnhibbs About Global Learn Day http://www.bfranklin.edu/gldd Eugene, Oregon, USA TEL: +1 541 343 9389 cell +1 541 337 4233 ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
RE: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Taran, a book that you may be interested in is: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0807043117/qid=1096844013/sr=8 -3/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i3_xgl14/104-7604935-7983908?v=glance&s=books&n=507846 Silencing the Past: Power and the Production of History by Michel-Rolph Trouillot This book, primarily dealing with Haiti, promotes the idea that we can gain a broader and more accurate view of history by striving to listen to a broader spectrum of voices. Thanks, Katy Pearce FLEX-PAX Cluster Director -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Taran Rampersad Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2004 9:22 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; The Digital Divide Network discussion group Subject: Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online Christopher Foster wrote: >On the subject of Wikipedia, I saw this interesting piece in EthanZ's blog today (http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/ethan/) that has particular relevance to the digital divide: > >"Amazing though it is, Wikipedia is not flawless. It's got a problem common to almost all peer production projects: people work on what they want to work on... > >Most of the people who work on Wikipedia are white, male technocrats from the US and Europe. They're especially knowledgeable about certain subjects - technology, science fiction, libertarianism, life in the US/Europe - and tend to write about these subjects. As a result, the resource tends to be extremely deep on technical topics and shallow in other areas. Nigeria's brilliant author, Chinua Achebe gets a 1582 byte "stub" of an article, while the GSM mobile phone standard gets 16,500 bytes of main entry, with dozens of related articles. > >This caught the eye of Wikipedia contributor Xed, who identified this as a systemic, structural bias in the Wikipedia system. He's launched a project called CROSSBOW - Committee Regarding Overcoming Serious Systemic Bias On Wikipedia - which is looking for ways to address these biases and increase the number of articles on less-covered topics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Xed/CROSSBOW)" > > >Chris Foster > > The same could be done by encouraging people to contribute. You'll note in the article, emphasis mine...: 'Taran Rampersad *didn't* *complain* when he failed to find anything on his hometown in the online encyclopedia Wikipedia. Instead, he simply wrote his own entry for San Fernando, Trinidad and Tobago." My answer is - the same one I gave at CARDICIS (http://www.cardidicis.org) when people complained of the same - "Write. Quit talking and write". Apparently I practice what I preach. Isn't it odd that the people described as the majority of people who work on the Wikipedia... isn't it odd that it's the same majority that has internet access? How completely odd. It couldn't be a coincidence. Complaining about insufficient representation is irrelevant when the people complaining aren't contributing - or aren't helping other than pointing out that the people without access aren't contributing. Once people have access to the internet, they can contribute freely - without prejudice. With the Wikipedia, the problem is mostly the Digital Divide - not the other way around. Want to fix this bias? Get more people on the internet. It's that simple. It costs me $80 US/month to have these discussions on a small 128K ADSL line - and I'm doing good. Think about it. If people want to write history, they need to take ownership of their pens. Making those pens more available... *that* is the digital divide. -- Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linuxgazette.com http://www.a42.com http://www.worldchanging.com http://www.knowprose.com http://www.easylum.net " It requires greater courage to preserve inner freedom, to move on in one's inward journey into new realms, than to stand defiantly for outer freedom."- Rollo May ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message. ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > In a message dated 9/28/2004 8:24:11 PM Eastern Standard Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > My answer is - the same one I gave at CARDICIS > (http://www.cardidicis.org) when people complained of the same - > "Write. > Quit talking and write". Apparently I practice what I preach. Isn't it > odd that the people described as the majority of people who work > on the > Wikipedia... isn't it odd that it's the same majority that has > internet > access? How completely odd. It couldn't be a coincidence. > > Complaining about insufficient representation is irrelevant when the > people complaining aren't contributing - or aren't helping other than > pointing out that the people without access aren't contributing. Once > people have access to the internet, they can contribute freely - > without > prejudice. > > I Think that practicing what you preach is great. My take on it is to > get people to know who , what , why, when, how and where. I keep > talking about education, it does not mean that is has to be formal, > but if we know what it is, can demonstrate why it is a great tool to > use, and how to, we can then after telling people where it is, get > them on the road to the use of it. > Since I am a woman, I take a lot of pride in negotiating technology > use because even I get intimidated by the ways in which we, the people > who use it, explain it. I am not even going to talk about the manuals, > they drive me insane sometimes, but the same people who write them > write for those who make paper airplanes , and I still have a few > technology kitchen things that I had to think, sit, explore, take > apart, redo and etc.. and finally they work. > Education is a lot of things. I am not always talking about formal > schooling. But mass education benefits lots of people , it may take > too look one by one to get things going. You think? Getting people online is the first step. Formal education has a place; informal education permeates. -- Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linuxgazette.com http://www.a42.com http://www.worldchanging.com http://www.knowprose.com http://www.easylum.net " It requires greater courage to preserve inner freedom, to move on in one's inward journey into new realms, than to stand defiantly for outer freedom."— Rollo May ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Maria Cervone wrote: > This is a good first thought for knowledge sharing. One word of > caution, though: teachers are already struggling with a rampant > problem of students purchasing term papers on the internet and turning > them in as if it were their own work. If term papers were included in > Wikipedia, it would make it all the more easy for students to cheat. I > personally don't understand why a student would want to do so, as > little knowledge is gained when the effort is minimal. Unfortunately > all too many students haven't learned that yet... My personal thought is that the education system generally has a culture of 'passing' instead of 'learning'. This isn't to demean the work of some really good professionals out there - rather, it's an observation of a problem that professionals encounter. Too often when I taught I was asked, "What do I need to do to pass?". When I responded, "Learn", I got quite a few blank looks. My view is that even if a course is failed, the student should take something from it. Of course, administration tends to view things differently, since the priorities are different... and I wonder if consistently we have not made administration a priority in education. There's a lot of money spent in academia, but this money tends to go toward administratia - buildings, desks, computers, classrooms, etc... not much actually goes into the curriculum. We measure learning by certificates... to get these certificates, students have to pass so can we fault them for simply focusing on passing? Looking back, I was always at odds with the curriculum. All the cool stuff wasn't on it. It was dry and dull... academia seemed like a tomb (and this was over 10 years ago). I guess this is why I have my 6 year old niece building Pascal's triangle. It isn't homework... but using her basic math skills (and reinforcing them), she's building something of 'her own'. Wait until I help her discover some of the cool stuff she can do with it :-) Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linuxgazette.com http://www.a42.com http://www.worldchanging.com http://www.knowprose.com http://www.easylum.net " It requires greater courage to preserve inner freedom, to move on in one's inward journey into new realms, than to stand defiantly for outer freedom."— Rollo May ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
This is a good first thought for knowledge sharing. One word of caution, though: teachers are already struggling with a rampant problem of students purchasing term papers on the internet and turning them in as if it were their own work. If term papers were included in Wikipedia, it would make it all the more easy for students to cheat. I personally don't understand why a student would want to do so, as little knowledge is gained when the effort is minimal. Unfortunately all too many students haven't learned that yet... Maria Cervone masters student School of Information University of Michigan On Sep 30, 2004, at 4:40 PM, Jacqueline A. Morris wrote: My first thought would be for term papers that students write to be published on Wiki - so students can (in any discipline) do research on a topic, and write the paper/entry - correct any errors that the teacher finds, and then create the entry on the Wikipedia. Given the number of term papers that are written by students worldwide, we'd get a lot of content very quickly. Then they'd also be sharing the knowledge that they have gained. Jacqueline A. Morris ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
RE: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
My first thought would be for term papers that students write to be published on Wiki - so students can (in any discipline) do research on a topic, and write the paper/entry - correct any errors that the teacher finds, and then create the entry on the Wikipedia. Given the number of term papers that are written by students worldwide, we'd get a lot of content very quickly. Then they'd also be sharing the knowledge that they have gained. Jacqueline A. Morris -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, 29 September 2004 11:24 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online First of all, it is a joy to learn from you and to know about all of these new technologies. I keep learning and catching up. I was impressed by what Andy shared with us. I looked at Noah's , statement.. and thought How do we invite, attract, explain and involve teachers in meaningful ways in this conversation? What is the gateway to this material for use in schools? Pros and cons. I did note that few women were involved in this great conversation. . I may have missed it, ie how do we share to inform teachers of Wikis ie best practices in using them?. I have a lot of time most of the time. How do we create enough time for teachers to explore, evaluate, add, augment, and try out these new practices? With the current policies in education, how do we allow, create , share possibilities for educational use in this very NCLB testing , memorization era? Teachers want to know. Andy said...that Tim Berners Lee said... What I'd like to see happen: I'd like to see lots of curricula like the MIT open courseware initiative being picked up by K-12 The tricky thing is that when you try to put down things like encyclopedia articles, like Wikipedia, you really need to keep education materials sown together. So I'd love to see a student be able to fly through this courseware, maybe in 3-D, following his or her interests. I know it takes a huge amount of efforts to keep these things [like Wikipedia and the Open Courseware Project] up to date, and I'd like to see teachers help contribute to it There are some amazing projects out there.. so how do we share with teachers? With whose permission? Students can work together when they can interact with simulations, with teachers, but particularly with each other. And for that we need lots of tools, lots of standards, lots of technology. There's lots of work to do out there Bugscope http://bugscope.beckman.uiuc.edu/ The Bugscope project is an educational outreach program for K-12 classrooms. The project provides a resource to classrooms so that they may remotely operate a scanning electron microscope to image "bugs" at high magnification. The microscope is remotely controlled in real time from a classroom computer over the Internet using a web browser. Bugscope provides a state-of-the-art microscope resource for teachers that can be readily integrated into classroom activities. The classroom has ownership of the project - they design their own experiment and provide their own bugs to be imaged in the microscope. The Bugscope project is primarily oriented towards K-12 classrooms and there is no cost to participate in the project. Some of the work is involving teachers in meaningful practice in education with professional development and support.. see www.eot.org EOT-PACI Projects These projects are undertaken by and in association with partners of the Education, Outreach and Training Partnership for Advanced Computational Infrastructure (EOT-PACI). With an emphasis on how projects may be used by students, teachers, science and engineering professionals, government planners and the general public, EOT-PACI invites everyone to take advantage of the wide variety of useful tools, resources, workshops and technological know-how generated by the more than thirty collaborating organizations of EOT-PACI. Biology Student Workbench http://www.eot.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=print pa ge&artid=7 The Biology Workbench is widely recognized as a significant bioinformatics resource that provides a suite of interactive tools which draw on a host of biology databases and allows people to compare molecular sequences using high performance computing facilities, visualize and manipulate molecular structures, and generate phylogenetic hypotheses. ChemSense ChemSense is an NSF-funded research project to examine the impact of representational tools, chemical investigations, and classroom discourse on chemistry learning. http://www.eot.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewa rt icle&artid=10 First a conversation needs to be started about linking technol
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Christopher Foster wrote: . . . Most of the people who work on Wikipedia are white, male technocrats from the US and Europe. They're especially knowledgeable about certain subjects - technology, science fiction, libertarianism, life in the US/Europe - and tend to write about these subjects. As a result, the resource tends to be extremely deep on technical topics and shallow in other areas. I think this problem will correct itself over time. I think it reflects the development of content on the WWW. When the web was young, most of the content was oriented towards the hard sciences. For instance I searched for Alports Syndrome and got one hit. A few years later, the same search provided almost 500 hits. The sites available covered treatment, history, support groups and related diseases. It took awhile for the social sciences and general public to become aware of the web and to exploit it. We're seeing the same thing with Wikipedia. Personally, I think it is a great educational resource. It offers students the opportunity to do real work, make a real contribution to society. The jargon is "authentic assessment". Language arts teachers have a source of text for editing and discussing grammar. At senior levels, the discussion could get into accessible text and global language. Social studies students can either add to or correct existing articles or create entries describing their communities. Students in other disciplines can add entries, verify facts and add references. While elementary and secondary students may not be expert in any field, they can become expert about a particular entry or portion thereof. On a more esoteric level, students can learn what it means to become part of a learning community. The Wikipedia community has guidelines, expectations, and sanctions. This will aid their entry into any community in which they wish to pursue their vocational or avocational goals. This is important to me, because I believe that the purpose of education should be to help students acquire the skills, knowledge, and attitudes needed to be a part of the communities in which they pursue their goals. The article "One Child -- Many Communities: Recasting the Purpose of Education" at http://www.ecn.ab.ca/~ljp/edarticles/onechild.htm -- Larry Phillips FutureCraft http://www.ecn.ab.ca/~ljp Quantum 2000: Education for Today and Tomorrow http://www.ecn.ab.ca/quantum Alberta Consumers' Association http://www.ecn.ab.ca/consumer Conversations about education Ed Conversation mailing list http://www.topica.com/lists/edconversation/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
First of all, it is a joy to learn from you and to know about all of these new technologies. I keep learning and catching up. I was impressed by what Andy shared with us. I looked at Noah's , statement.. and thought How do we invite, attract, explain and involve teachers in meaningful ways in this conversation? What is the gateway to this material for use in schools? Pros and cons. I did note that few women were involved in this great conversation. . I may have missed it, ie how do we share to inform teachers of Wikis ie best practices in using them?. I have a lot of time most of the time. How do we create enough time for teachers to explore, evaluate, add, augment, and try out these new practices? With the current policies in education, how do we allow, create , share possibilities for educational use in this very NCLB testing , memorization era? Teachers want to know. Andy said...that Tim Berners Lee said... What Iâd like to see happen: Iâd like to see lots of curricula like the MIT open courseware initiative being picked up by K-12 The tricky thing is that when you try to put down things like encyclopedia articles, like Wikipedia, you really need to keep education materials sown together. So Iâd love to see a student be able to fly through this courseware, maybe in 3-D, following his or her interests. I know it takes a huge amount of efforts to keep these things [like Wikipedia and the Open Courseware Project] up to date, and Iâd like to see teachers help contribute to it There are some amazing projects out there.. so how do we share with teachers? With whose permission? Students can work together when they can interact with simulations, with teachers, but particularly with each other. And for that we need lots of tools, lots of standards, lots of technologyâ Thereâs lots of work to do out there Bugscope http://bugscope.beckman.uiuc.edu/ The Bugscope project is an educational outreach program for K-12 classrooms. The project provides a resource to classrooms so that they may remotely operate a scanning electron microscope to image "bugs" at high magnification. The microscope is remotely controlled in real time from a classroom computer over the Internet using a web browser. Bugscope provides a state-of-the-art microscope resource for teachers that can be readily integrated into classroom activities. The classroom has ownership of the project - they design their own experiment and provide their own bugs to be imaged in the microscope. The Bugscope project is primarily oriented towards K-12 classrooms and there is no cost to participate in the project. Some of the work is involving teachers in meaningful practice in education with professional development and support.. see www.eot.org EOT-PACI Projects These projects are undertaken by and in association with partners of the Education, Outreach and Training Partnership for Advanced Computational Infrastructure (EOT-PACI). With an emphasis on how projects may be used by students, teachers, science and engineering professionals, government planners and the general public, EOT-PACI invites everyone to take advantage of the wide variety of useful tools, resources, workshops and technological know-how generated by the more than thirty collaborating organizations of EOT-PACI. Biology Student Workbench http://www.eot.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=printpa ge&artid=7 The Biology Workbench is widely recognized as a significant bioinformatics resource that provides a suite of interactive tools which draw on a host of biology databases and allows people to compare molecular sequences using high performance computing facilities, visualize and manipulate molecular structures, and generate phylogenetic hypotheses. ChemSense ChemSense is an NSF-funded research project to examine the impact of representational tools, chemical investigations, and classroom discourse on chemistry learning. http://www.eot.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewart icle&artid=10 First a conversation needs to be started about linking technology people with teachers and some kind of time sharing and understanding. I saw Tim Berners Lee at WSIS or RSIS or both, but the problem is that those of us who talk about technology and get it, don't actually translate the great educational practices, ideas, and ways of working to teachers. http://education.sdsc.edu/enrich Language: en Description: The San Diego Supercomputer Center and Balboa Elementary have pooled their resources to create a learning project that has the kids coming back for more. The Math Technology Project was created to develop students\' interest in mathematics, using the broad spectrum of technology that we have today as tools to assist in the learning process. The basic goal is to develop the students\' thinking patterns to go beyond written directions, by teaching more diverse problem solving a
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Audrey Borus wrote: > Taran-- bravo. Well put. There is a raging debate in higher ed too > about accepting any web content. It's foolish IMHO. As as come up over > and over again--good research requires a variety of sources. Thank you. Comments for and against the Wikipedia caused me to write this, which I think is actually better: Standing On The Shoulders of Giants: http://www.worldchanging.com/archives/001293.html#more -- Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linuxgazette.com http://www.a42.com http://www.worldchanging.com http://www.knowprose.com http://www.easylum.net " It requires greater courage to preserve inner freedom, to move on in one's inward journey into new realms, than to stand defiantly for outer freedom."— Rollo May ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Christopher Foster wrote: >On the subject of Wikipedia, I saw this interesting piece in EthanZ's blog today >(http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/ethan/) that has particular relevance to the digital >divide: > >"Amazing though it is, Wikipedia is not flawless. It's got a problem common to almost >all peer production projects: people work on what they want to work on... > >Most of the people who work on Wikipedia are white, male technocrats from the US and >Europe. They're especially knowledgeable about certain subjects - technology, science >fiction, libertarianism, life in the US/Europe - and tend to write about these >subjects. As a result, the resource tends to be extremely deep on technical topics >and shallow in other areas. Nigeria's brilliant author, Chinua Achebe gets a 1582 >byte "stub" of an article, while the GSM mobile phone standard gets 16,500 bytes of >main entry, with dozens of related articles. > >This caught the eye of Wikipedia contributor Xed, who identified this as a systemic, >structural bias in the Wikipedia system. He's launched a project called CROSSBOW - >Committee Regarding Overcoming Serious Systemic Bias On Wikipedia - which is looking >for ways to address these biases and increase the number of articles on less-covered >topics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Xed/CROSSBOW)" > > >Chris Foster > > The same could be done by encouraging people to contribute. You'll note in the article, emphasis mine...: 'Taran Rampersad *didn't* *complain* when he failed to find anything on his hometown in the online encyclopedia Wikipedia. Instead, he simply wrote his own entry for San Fernando, Trinidad and Tobago." My answer is - the same one I gave at CARDICIS (http://www.cardidicis.org) when people complained of the same - "Write. Quit talking and write". Apparently I practice what I preach. Isn't it odd that the people described as the majority of people who work on the Wikipedia... isn't it odd that it's the same majority that has internet access? How completely odd. It couldn't be a coincidence. Complaining about insufficient representation is irrelevant when the people complaining aren't contributing - or aren't helping other than pointing out that the people without access aren't contributing. Once people have access to the internet, they can contribute freely - without prejudice. With the Wikipedia, the problem is mostly the Digital Divide - not the other way around. Want to fix this bias? Get more people on the internet. It's that simple. It costs me $80 US/month to have these discussions on a small 128K ADSL line - and I'm doing good. Think about it. If people want to write history, they need to take ownership of their pens. Making those pens more available... *that* is the digital divide. -- Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linuxgazette.com http://www.a42.com http://www.worldchanging.com http://www.knowprose.com http://www.easylum.net " It requires greater courage to preserve inner freedom, to move on in one's inward journey into new realms, than to stand defiantly for outer freedom."â Rollo May ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
On the subject of Wikipedia, I saw this interesting piece in EthanZ's blog today (http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/ethan/) that has particular relevance to the digital divide: "Amazing though it is, Wikipedia is not flawless. It's got a problem common to almost all peer production projects: people work on what they want to work on... Most of the people who work on Wikipedia are white, male technocrats from the US and Europe. They're especially knowledgeable about certain subjects - technology, science fiction, libertarianism, life in the US/Europe - and tend to write about these subjects. As a result, the resource tends to be extremely deep on technical topics and shallow in other areas. Nigeria's brilliant author, Chinua Achebe gets a 1582 byte "stub" of an article, while the GSM mobile phone standard gets 16,500 bytes of main entry, with dozens of related articles. This caught the eye of Wikipedia contributor Xed, who identified this as a systemic, structural bias in the Wikipedia system. He's launched a project called CROSSBOW - Committee Regarding Overcoming Serious Systemic Bias On Wikipedia - which is looking for ways to address these biases and increase the number of articles on less-covered topics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Xed/CROSSBOW)" Chris Foster ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
We have always had "levels" of publishing, some involving peer review, others editorial over-sight, and some with outright control and censorship. And then there has always been the corner pub and the gathering around the water fountain. The need for informational "gatekeepers" is clear enough for libraries and the news media where people come in the belief that the information has some level of "integrity". To a degree, it relieves us of the responsibility [or we like to think it does..] for critical thought.But... We all know that with that claim of integrity comes idealogical "spin", perhaps unintentional and benign, but there none the less. And, there is of course the problem of access. Anyone can be a consumer, but it can be pretty difficult to get your published thoughts past the gatekeepers, and there are voices that don't get heard. Freedom of thought and expression is only one piece of the divide; without a communication channel that works for everyone, we end up talking [in vain] to ourselves. Wikis, Blogs, and whatever comes next, INMHO, are of great value specifically because they are accessible tools for communication to -> everyone <-. They are an excellent example of technology used to bridge the divide. If teen agers and thought-challenged adults get exposed to unfiltered information and have to develop critical thinking skills, perhaps that's a good thing. . Thomas A Webb http://www.ospueblo.com - Open Source and Educational Resources http://wordwonder.com - For Readers and Thinkers Taran Rampersad wrote: Perhaps, with such worry, people who are thought qualified will contribute and assist in this instead of criticizing it. This has always made me wonder what the real issue is - it's as simple as getting involved. But I suppose change is something that - despite always happening - causes problems for some. But anyone who criticizes the Wikipedia is in good company: ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Hi Tom, When you say it was corrected half an hour later, did you correct it or was it corrected by someone else? The reason I ask is that many of the entries on Wikipedia have a group of people contributing and monitoring what's written. Each entry has an associated discussion board and update history, so you can track the changes, so the entries get managed by teams of people. For example, I was updating the entry on blogs and had to stop for a couple of hours, so I saved what I'd done, hoping to get back to it very quickly. When I came back, the changes I'd started to make had either been removed or completed for me by others, so the entry wouldn't be left hanging, so to speak. So a team of people work to get a consensus for a particular definition and then serve as guardians; others may come in and change it, but you'll have to argue why your changes are needed in the discussion space, or your changes may revert back to what they were prior to your edits. This leads to the issue of entry stability and neutrality, which is quite common for entries that are geopolitical in nature. For example, if you look up the entry for Kurdistan, you'll see a message at the top saying that the following article's neutrality is being challenged: ie, someone is arguing the author(s) wrote the entry in such a way that it offers an unacceptable amount of bias. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurdistan Another examples is the entry for Neanderthals; the article's neutrality is being questions due to disagreement in the scientific community over their extinction. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neanderthals If you look at the entry's talk page, you'll see recent comments from users challenging its accuracy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk%3AHomo_neanderthalensis Articles on wikipedia are expected to convey a Neutral Point of View (NPOV). If an article appears to deviate from this, users may dispute it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia%3ANPOV_dispute Wikipedia is also working on ways to measure consensus and stability; the goal is to achieve enough consensus for an entry so that entry is stable enough to share via CD-ROM or another format without worry that the definition is wrong, biased, or dated. This process still needs further development, but they're striving towards creating processes so an entry will have a "seal of approval" regarding its accuracy, then use Wikipedians (contributors) to police the entry and ensure its stability. Another thing I like about the wikipedia is that it's a great way to promote relevant resources that have broad copyright licenses. For example, most of my contributions to Wikipedia relate to photos and videos relevant to particular entries. If you look at the entry for Music of Mauritius (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_of_Mauritius) or Muscat, Oman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscat%2C_Oman), you'll see that I've contributed a digital photo for each entry, plus a link to a gallery of other relevent photos of mine, which may be re-used and redistributed for noncommercial purposes based on a Creative Commons license. So if you're a student doing a website about Oman or Creole culture, you can use the Wikipedia to find my photos and video clips, then incorporate them on your site without any worries about copyright violation. I may not contribute to the history sections of these entries, but I can contribute in other ways that users won't have to wonder if my content is "accurate" or not. Wikipedia is far from perfect, and I wouldn't recommend anyone to use it as a sole source in their research. But I wouldn't recommend _any_ source as the sole source. (My wife was a researcher for National Geographic, so we have an inside joke that whenever I make some claim about something she asks me if I have three sources for it.) Fortunately, the vast majority of Wikipedians know that people are skeptical about the accuracy of their content, so they work quite hard to debate entries, achieve consensus, and record-keep the changes made. It gives people who have expertise or knowledge the ability to share it, but under the watchful eyes of fellow Wikipedians who won't hesitate to challenge your assumptions or your accuracy. The more people contribute to it, the bigger it gets, but hopefully the more accurate gets as well. Just find two other sources, and if you find an inaccuracy, raise a red flag, or fix it! :-) Tom Lowenhaupt wrote: I know what you mean. Last week I was demonstrating what a wiki was to my son and entered "Jeffrey looks like a monkey." in wikipedia's monkey citation. Having a good sense of humor, Jeffrey understood the nature of a wiki. (It was corrected a 1/2 hour later.) -- -- Andy Carvin Program Director EDC Center for Media & Community acarvin @ edc . org http://www.digitaldividenetwork.org http://www.edwebproject.org/andy/blog/ -- ___
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
My opinion is that WIKIS are yet another useful source of valuable information, that must be dealt with in a responseable way.. WIKIS are not a professional journal in which properly audited and filtered scientici papers appear... you don't send a WIKI to several colleagues to provide their opinion to a magazine editor !!! BUT, I fully agree with amigo Taran, who I had the great pleasure of meeting in person at the CARDICIS meeting in St Lucia, that WIKIS are here to stay, and should receive our support, as yet another option open to those of us that want a better world ! Prof. Arnaldo Coro Antich [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While the Wikis have their place in the online world, I would offer a word of caution before we applaud this source so loudly. Unfortunately, our students...speaking from a high school perspective...do not realize that the information found in the Wikis is written by anyone and therefore negates the reliability as well as the authenticity of the information contained on the site. Students need to realize that based on acceptable web site evaluation criteria, this is not a "reputable" site. Neither I nor the teachers at my high school will accept any research information taken from a "wiki". As we try to bridge the Digital Divide let's give all Internet users the opportunity to locate information that is reliable and accurate. Alot of Internet users are of the opinion that everything found on the Web is true and the Wikis only foster that mistaken opinion. That is truly a noble gesture where everyone can "create something larger than what one person can make" but how accurate is the information that is being added? What Internet users need is the ability to evaluate information which I and my colleagues are trying to do. Unfortunately, when a web site such as the Wikipedia gets so much positive publicity it becomes very difficult to explain why this site is not a good source of information. IMHO... ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Judy, I know what you mean. Last week I was demonstrating what a wiki was to my son and entered "Jeffrey looks like a monkey." in wikipedia's monkey citation. Having a good sense of humor, Jeffrey understood the nature of a wiki. (It was corrected a 1/2 hour later.) But I differ when you say "this site is not a good source of information." Perhaps it's not being a "trusted source" is a more accurate description. But showing the potential quality of a wiki might be a good media lesson. And a million high schoolers "monkeying" around with the wikipedia might put a deserved asterisk on this source. Tom Lowenhaupt a - Original Message - From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Monday, September 27, 2004 9:32 PM Subject: Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online While the Wikis have their place in the online world, I would offer a word of caution before we applaud this source so loudly. Unfortunately, our students...speaking from a high school perspective...do not realize that the information found in the Wikis is written by anyone and therefore negates the reliability as well as the authenticity of the information contained on the site. Students need to realize that based on acceptable web site evaluation criteria, this is not a "reputable" site. Neither I nor the teachers at my high school will accept any research information taken from a "wiki". As we try to bridge the Digital Divide let's give all Internet users the opportunity to locate information that is reliable and accurate. Alot of Internet users are of the opinion that everything found on the Web is true and the Wikis only foster that mistaken opinion. That is truly a noble gesture where everyone can "create something larger than what one person can make" but how accurate is the information that is being added? What Internet users need is the ability to evaluate information which I and my colleagues are trying to do. Unfortunately, when a web site such as the Wikipedia gets so much positive publicity it becomes very difficult to explain why this site is not a good source of information. IMHO... -- Judy Gardner Library/Media Specialist Lebanon High School Lebanon, PA Virtual Reference Desk Volunteer __ Switch to Netscape Internet Service. As low as $9.95 a month -- Sign up today at http://isp.netscape.com/register Netscape. Just the Net You Need. New! Netscape Toolbar for Internet Explorer Search from anywhere on the Web and block those annoying pop-ups. Download now at http://channels.netscape.com/ns/search/install.jsp ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message. ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > While the Wikis have their place in the online world, I would offer a > word of caution before we applaud this source so loudly. Unfortunately, > our students...speaking from a high school perspective...do not realize > that the information found in the Wikis is written by anyone and > therefore negates the reliability as well as the authenticity of the > information contained on the site. Students need to realize that based > on acceptable web site evaluation criteria, this is not a "reputable" > site. Neither I nor the teachers at my high school will accept any > research information taken from a "wiki". I humbly suggest that Wiki's are precisely a useful tool, properly disclaimered, as are articles from say, the New York Times -- given the apologies the NYT has been made with regards to Jayson Blair and their pre-Iraq war statements. Wikis with rigorous editorial control and a sufficient number of authors can be much better than "official" sources. In teaching high school students, please remind them to question ALL their sources, not just those created using large numbers of people with new technolgies. Check this article, about a controversy with regard to a story about Wiki's - essentially the story claimed Wiki's were disreputable, and in my opinion, this claim has not yet been proved. http://www.corante.com/importance/archives/005925.php And more: http://www.corante.com/many/archives/2004/08/29/wikipedia_reputation_and_the_wemedia_project.php And read ongoing criticism (noting both its strengths and weaknesses) at the Many2Many Blog: http://www.corante.com/many/ > As we try to bridge the Digital Divide let's give all Internet users the > opportunity to locate information that is reliable and accurate. Alot > of Internet users are of the opinion that everything found on the Web is > true and the Wikis only foster that mistaken opinion. The problem here is not wikis or any website, but a failure to question the information we are presented with day to day. It's not just wikis that misinform - tv, books, leaders, governments, people can all do this very human thing. Wikis are not necessarily a manifestation of such misinformation, indeed they can be a candle in the dark of ignorance. Don't go by me though, browse some entries yourself: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_divide Microsoft Encarta, another encyclopedia, has no entry for this topic. But they have an entry in their definition: http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/refpages/search.aspx?q=digital+divide http://encarta.msn.com/dictionary_561538498/digital_divide.html Or try another entry, this one about the 9/11 attacks: First one on Encarta: http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_701509060/September_11_Attacks.html And now one on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11 Which is the richer presentation, which provides more background? Which provides more links to other sources of information? I would say hands down in all cases where I have done this comparison in areas about which I have done some research of my own, Wikipedia wins hands down. I urge you to see for yourself before dismissing the site as the work of anyone, and as not a reliable source. > That is truly a noble gesture where everyone can "create something > larger than what one person can make" but how accurate is the > information that is being added? Take a look at the guidelines for the authors of Wikipedia (bias: I have contributed to a few articles): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Policies_and_guidelines#Content_guidelines > What Internet users need is the ability to evaluate information which I > and my colleagues are trying to do. Unfortunately, when a web site such > as the Wikipedia gets so much positive publicity it becomes very > difficult to explain why this site is not a good source of information. I don't think you can explain away the value of Wikipedia. What is the purpose of your explaining? If anything, students should be taught not just to take *your* word for anything. They should learn to be critical thinkers about all the information that comes their way. But hey, I'm just some guy on the internet. Decide for yourself based on your own research. I'm confident in my opinions, because I have done my own research. Joe -- Joe Crawford Web Building, Blogging, Product Evangelist e: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://artlung.com/blog/ - being myself aim: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sandiegoblog.com - daily san diego t: +1 (619) 516-4550 http://websandiego.org/ - community f: +1 (928) 752-6311 http://lamphost.net/ - get web hosting ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Perhaps, with such worry, people who are thought qualified will contribute and assist in this instead of criticizing it. This has always made me wonder what the real issue is - it's as simple as getting involved. But I suppose change is something that - despite always happening - causes problems for some. But anyone who criticizes the Wikipedia is in good company: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Criticisms The Wikipedia is not perfect. But I sincerely doubt that you will find any book, any magazine... that is 100% accurate. Why? Because the information is all disconnected, and subject to the issues of publishing. Ironically, this has roots to the Royal Society - which itself started the first documented 'Open Content' movement: "...ought to have their eyes in all parts, and to receive information from every quarter of the earth, they ought to have a constant universal intelligence: all discoveries should be brought to them: the Treasuries of all former times should be laid open before them." --Sprat, History of Royal Society, p.20 The irony is that those published even through the Royal Society did become published by staying in grace of the Royal Society. This happened with Sir Isaac Newton's works, until Hooke died. So there's a history of problems not only with the accuracy of published works - but with the published works themselves. So there has been a bias from those in publishing - even in the esteemed Royal Society. But what's the difference? Why, it should be apparent. The bias is given to the people instead of people who control printing presses. But would anyone care to disagree with the Sprat quotation above? Dare you? Then there's this, "The Lies and Fallacies of the Encyclopaedia Brittanica", by Joseph McCabe: http://www.infidels.org/library/historical/joseph_mccabe/lies_of_britannica.html And, of course, a personal favourite: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Errors_in_the_Encyclop%C3%A6dia_Britannica_which_have_been_corrected_in_Wikipedia No, I think that the Wikipedia is as accurate as anything else. In fact, it has a higher chance of being accurate in a timely manner because it does not fall under the constraints of print publishing. With writing, editing, printing, publishing, errata... we're looking at years before new things get out. That's very scarey, especially when education requires more and more information to be compressed in less time for students - otherwise we'd have some very old people entering the job market. And I offer this, as someone who has taught as well: If students believe everything that they read, they aren't educated - they are robots. Everything should be challenged, and that includes the Wikipedia. Especially the Wikipedia! Use your criticism, but use it constructively. So here's the challenge, Judy - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library Please see if you find anything wrong - and if you do, please fix it. You're worried about misinformation, and I completely understand. But that's why books have references - as does the Wikipedia. Always check the references. What worries me is when people in authority effectively burn books. That is worrisome. And censoring resources, IMHO, is the equivalent of burning books. Especially resources that hyperlink to each other and point to research resources which students can use. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >While the Wikis have their place in the online world, I would offer a word of caution >before we applaud this source so loudly. Unfortunately, our students...speaking from >a high school perspective...do not realize that the information found in the Wikis is >written by anyone and therefore negates the reliability as well as the authenticity >of the information contained on the site. Students need to realize that based on >acceptable web site evaluation criteria, this is not a "reputable" site. Neither I >nor the teachers at my high school will accept any research information taken from a >"wiki". >As we try to bridge the Digital Divide let's give all Internet users the opportunity >to locate information that is reliable and accurate. Alot of Internet users are of >the opinion that everything found on the Web is true and the Wikis only foster that >mistaken opinion. > >That is truly a noble gesture where everyone can "create something larger than what >one person can make" but how accurate is the information that is being added? What >Internet users need is the ability to evaluate information which I and my colleagues >are trying to do. Unfortunately, when a web site such as the Wikipedia gets so much >positive publicity it becomes very difficult to explain why this site is not a good >source of information. > >IMHO... > > -- Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linuxgazette.com http://www.a42.com http://www.worldchanging.com http://www.knowprose.com http://www.easylum.net " It requires greater courage to preserve inner freedom, to move on in one's inward journey int
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
While the Wikis have their place in the online world, I would offer a word of caution before we applaud this source so loudly. Unfortunately, our students...speaking from a high school perspective...do not realize that the information found in the Wikis is written by anyone and therefore negates the reliability as well as the authenticity of the information contained on the site. Students need to realize that based on acceptable web site evaluation criteria, this is not a "reputable" site. Neither I nor the teachers at my high school will accept any research information taken from a "wiki". As we try to bridge the Digital Divide let's give all Internet users the opportunity to locate information that is reliable and accurate. Alot of Internet users are of the opinion that everything found on the Web is true and the Wikis only foster that mistaken opinion. That is truly a noble gesture where everyone can "create something larger than what one person can make" but how accurate is the information that is being added? What Internet users need is the ability to evaluate information which I and my colleagues are trying to do. Unfortunately, when a web site such as the Wikipedia gets so much positive publicity it becomes very difficult to explain why this site is not a good source of information. IMHO... -- Judy Gardner Library/Media Specialist Lebanon High School Lebanon, PA Virtual Reference Desk Volunteer __ Switch to Netscape Internet Service. As low as $9.95 a month -- Sign up today at http://isp.netscape.com/register Netscape. Just the Net You Need. New! Netscape Toolbar for Internet Explorer Search from anywhere on the Web and block those annoying pop-ups. Download now at http://channels.netscape.com/ns/search/install.jsp ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
btw, if you go to the Yahoo homepage (www.yahoo.com), the article about Taran is now being displayed prominently on the right side of the page. ac Taran Rampersad wrote: Andy Carvin wrote: Congratulations to Taran for being the lead-in to this AP story, courtesy of Yahoo News... -ac Thanks. It is kind of cool how the first thing in the article is my name. 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online Taran Rampersad didn't complain when he failed to find anything on his hometown in the online encyclopedia Wikipedia. Instead, he simply wrote his own entry for San Fernando, Trinidad and Tobago. Wikipedia is unique for an encyclopedia because anybody can add, edit and even erase. And the Wikipedia is just one — albeit the best known — of a growing breed of Internet knowledge-sharing communities called Wikis. http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040926/ap_on_hi_te/sharing_knowledge_online Interesting point: I don't know that this will make it in the local newspapers in Trinidad and Tobago... I will look later today. Why do I think it wouldn't? Such stories don't really make the news in Trinidad and Tobago. Go figure. ;-) -- -- Andy Carvin Program Director EDC Center for Media & Community acarvin @ edc . org http://www.digitaldividenetwork.org http://www.edwebproject.org/andy/blog/ -- ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Andy Carvin wrote: > btw, if you go to the Yahoo homepage (www.yahoo.com), the article > about Taran is now being displayed prominently on the right side of > the page. > > ac It's not about me, it's about the Wikipedia...I'm just one of many, and I was the one interviewed... There are many, many others - and if there is one thing that anyone should take from this - it's the importance of large groups of people working together to create something larger than what any one person could make. And making it available to everyone else. For the People, by the People sound familiar? ;-) -- Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linuxgazette.com http://www.a42.com http://www.worldchanging.com http://www.knowprose.com http://www.easylum.net " It requires greater courage to preserve inner freedom, to move on in one's inward journey into new realms, than to stand defiantly for outer freedom."— Rollo May ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] 'Wikis' Offer Knowledge-Sharing Online
Bill McIver wrote: > > Taran, > > Why not send them the story? > > Often times stories don't make it because they simply don't > know about them. Consider it a test of an hypothesis. If I'm wrong, then I'm happy. If I'm right, then there is an issue to be resolved. And... I did give them an opportunity. I dumped it on an email list where local reporters find information. -- Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linuxgazette.com http://www.a42.com http://www.worldchanging.com http://www.knowprose.com http://www.easylum.net " It requires greater courage to preserve inner freedom, to move on in one's inward journey into new realms, than to stand defiantly for outer freedom."— Rollo May ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
