Re: Fw: [Israel.pm] Officially announcing the Israeli Perl Workshop (ILPW) 2013!
I think it's fantastic that they've organized this, but why in the world did they schedule it to be held on Purim?? Moshe On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 11:11 PM, Shlomi Fish wrote: > Hi all, > > forwarding from p...@perl.org.il . Also see: > > http://act.perl.org.il/ilpw2013/ > > Regards, > > Shlomi Fish > > Begin forwarded message: > > Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2012 13:54:23 +0200 > From: sawyer x > To: Perl in Israel > Subject: [Israel.pm] Officially announcing the Israeli Perl Workshop (ILPW) > 2013! > > > *Israel Perl Workshop (ILPW) 2013.* > > Dates: *Purim, February 24th - 25h, 2013*. > > Last year (2012), we held a Perl workshop to promote Perl and FOSS (Free > and Open Source Software) which included talks on various and guests from > around the world. It was deemed very successful and we decided to organize > another one: a bigger one! > > This year's workshop will have a few changes, the highlights being: > >- It will be *two days long*. >- A very special gust: *Larry Wall*!!112 >- Low attendance fee. >- Wider crowd / more attendees > > *Two days?* > Yes! Well, not exactly. A day and a half. > > We've been satisfied with the amount of talks in the previous workshop, but > the scheduled was rather tight, and we had to forgo some plans we had, such > as tutorials and a hackathon. We attempt to rectify that in the next > workshop. > > We have yet to finalize the schedule, but we hope to use the additional > half a day to incorporate hacking sessions and longer talks like tutorials. > > *Special guest: Larry Wall* > In Perl-land, the mark of a highly-successful event is one that includes > the very man in charge of creating this language we enjoy immensely: Larry > Wall. Larry visits many events, provides a fun and casual atmosphere along > with deep knowledge, understanding, and a handful of humor. While Gloria > Wall will be visiting us, she will drag Larry along with her. > > We are excited and delighted to have Gloria and Larry join us for this > event. > > *(Low) attendance fee:* > Our previous event was free of charge, which sounds good in theory but in > practice created many problems for us. Our main problem was having an > accurate measure of attendance, which proved difficult once it was a simple > click to approve attendance without having any requirement to actually show > up. > > While the event was very well received and enjoyed a large number of > participants, it was difficult for us to gage our requirements and > expenses. Also, for a larger event our current funding budget is still > somewhat lacking. Having a low attendance fee will allow us to know better > the number of attending persons and will give us another financial kick to > have a smooth event. > > The attendance fee will have the usual options of Personal, Corporate and > the Early Bird Special. > > *Wider crowd:* > ILPW2012 had eighty (80) attendees which is a rather fine number. This > time, however, we intend to reach out to 120-150 people. One of the ways we > intend to do so is to make the event more facilitating to other > technologies that intersect with Perl, such as Web, Databases, System > Administration (and DevOps), Gaming, and more. > > We hope to host talks on various subjects and reach out to other > communities to participate in the event and enrich us in subjects not > necessarily strictly Perl. > > *Sponsoring:* > > So far we've secured kickstart funding from HaMakor organization, which is > much appreciated. This will help us get in gear. We thank HaMakor for > sponsoring and helping promote such events. > > *We need your help!* > > We could *really* use your help. While we have big plans, we are > short-handed and will greatly appreciate any help you may be able to > provide. If you want this event to be everything you're hoping for, you can > make that a reality by pitching in and lending your hand. > > *Sponsorship:* We're still looking for more sponsors. You can help contact > companies, inquiring about sponsorship opportunities. > > *Talks:* We're low on talks. If you've never spoken at an event, you're > suitable! If you've done something cool/interesting/useful, you're > suitable! If you do Perl and have some wisdom to share, you're suitable! If > you would like to showcase modules (yours or not), you're suitable! Please > contact us to submit a talk. We've flexible on subjects. > > *Publicity:* In order to reach a wider audience, we will need to take this > on the road. And by “on the road”, we actually mean “on the internet”. This > means contacting other groups, contacting websites and related news > outlets, writing press releases and so on. A great event isn't great if > nobody knows about it. > > Please contact either Gabor Szabo (gabor AT szabgab DOT com) or Sawyer X > (xsawyer AT cpan DOT org) to coordinate any and all efforts. We will also > see you at the upcoming Tel Aviv Perl Mongers meetings, where we could > exchange ideas in person. And lastly, the official > Isra
Re: ניצחנו ...
Dude, that article is a year old. 2012/7/14 Doron Ofek > > > עם דמעות שחונקות את הגרון , > עם עייפות שלא נגמרת , עם עצבים מרוטים ... > כל מה שנשאר לי זה כוח ללחוש .. ניצחנו . > > http://www.nrg.co.il/online/1/ART2/272/372.html > > > אני מקווה , שהשיח הזה יחלחל מהמחאה, לפוליטיקה , ומשם לכל מקום אחר . > > כמובן, שיש לא מעט אנשים מהמקור, אשר עשו , עושים, ויעשו עבודת קודש בתנועת > המחאה .. אנשים , שעזרו ועוזרים לשנות את השיח במחאה - ומשם , לשאר המדינה . > אני לא רוצה להזכיר שמות , כי בטוח שאני אפספס רבים (ואני לא מוכן לקחת על > עצמי פיספוס כזה) > > דורון > > > ___ > Discussions mailing list > Discussions@hamakor.org.il > http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions > ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
עירא: *"סטולמן, כל עוד לא נחת בנתב"ג, לא יכול להגיד מילה נגד חרם אקדמי, ומהיכרותי אותו זה מאוד בוער לו להגיד את זה כשהוא יגיע לכאן."* You're wrong: Stallman sympathizes with the Palestinian boycott of Israeli academia, and he does *not* intend to criticize them for it. And he's saying so straight out, right now: http://www.itwire.com/opinion-and-analysis/open-sauce/47491-stallman-does-not-blame-palestinians-for-boycott (Here's a cached version<http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?sclient=psy&hl=en&site=&source=hp&q=cache%3Awww.itwire.com%2Fopinion-and-analysis%2Fopen-sauce%2F47491-stallman-does-not-blame-palestinians-for-boycott&rlz=1R2ADRA_enIL415&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&pbx=1>if the page is still down.) Looks like you don't know Stallman nearly as well as you thought you did. Moshe 2011/5/30 Ira Abramov 2011/5/30 Moshe Z. Matitya 2011/5/30 Ira Abramov hama...@ira.abramov.org סטולמן, כל עוד לא נחת בנתב"ג, לא יכול להגיד מילה נגד חרם אקדמי, ??? למה לא?? ומהיכרותי אותו זה מאוד בוער לו להגיד את זה כשהוא יגיע לכאן. אז למה שהוא לא יגיד את זה כבר עכשיו? כי אז עלולים לבטל לו את הטיסות וכולנו מפסידים, במיוחד הקהל שלו לא ישמע את דעתו, רק המארגנים. נראה מדבריו שהוא מעדיף להגיע ולהרביץ תורה בקהל מאזינים גדול יותר, ובצדק. אם רוצים פתרון פשרה - אז בואו נקיים את ההרצאות אבל ללא סטולמן. זה דווקא רעיון טוב. אם לא אצליח לשכנע אתכם אחרת, בבקשה. אני אשמח אז אם לפחות נעשה שימוש בקשריו של גיא שפר, סטולמן, ומי שיוכל לעזור, ונזמין להרצאות תושבי שטחים, ונדגיש שהסיבה היא גם שיתוף פעולה, וגם קריאה להסרת החרם האקדמי. ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
(1) I don't see any evidence in what Stallman wrote, and in what you said that he wrote, that indicates he is opposed to the academic boycott at all. Your claim that he really is secretly opposed to it, but is keeping it quiet so that he can spring it on the Palestinians at the last minute as a surprise -- seems baseless and smacks of spin control. (2) If you are, in fact, correct when you say that Stallman is opposed to the academic boycott -- this means that Stallman, because he accepted a financial sponsorship, is now censoring himself from stating his opinion on a fundamental issue of freedom, because that opinion runs counter to the anti-freedom policies of his financial sponsors. That's the same Richard Stallman, celebrated champion of freedom, who regularly attacks the Open Source community because he finds their devotion to the absolute and inviolable priciples of freedom to be insufficiently "pure"! If that's the case, then Stallman is nothing less than a complete and utter hypocrite. Why should anyone be interested in coming to hear a speech given by such a hypocrite, and hear him pontificate about the priciples of "freedom" that he himself tramples on? Moshe 2011/5/30 Ira Abramov > > > 2011/5/30 Moshe Z. Matitya > > >> >> 2011/5/30 Ira Abramov hama...@ira.abramov.org >> >> >>> סטולמן, כל עוד לא נחת בנתב"ג, לא יכול להגיד מילה נגד חרם אקדמי, >>> >> >> ??? >> למה לא?? >> >> >>> ומהיכרותי אותו זה מאוד בוער לו להגיד את זה כשהוא יגיע לכאן. >>> >> >> אז למה שהוא לא יגיד את זה כבר עכשיו? >> > > כי אז עלולים לבטל לו את הטיסות וכולנו מפסידים, במיוחד הקהל שלו לא ישמע את > דעתו, רק המארגנים. נראה מדבריו שהוא מעדיף להגיע ולהרביץ תורה בקהל מאזינים > גדול יותר, ובצדק. > > > >> >> >>> אם רוצים פתרון פשרה - אז בואו נקיים את ההרצאות אבל ללא סטולמן. >>> >> >> זה דווקא רעיון טוב. >> >> > > אם לא אצליח לשכנע אתכם אחרת, בבקשה. אני אשמח אז אם לפחות נעשה שימוש בקשריו > של גיא שפר ונזמין להרצאות תושבי שטחים, ונדגיש שהסיבה היא גם שיתוף פעולה, וגם > קריאה להסרת החרם > > ___ > Discussions mailing list > Discussions@hamakor.org.il > http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions > ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
You'd better not let Stallman know that, or he'll never agree to come... :-) On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 10:13 AM, Simon Montagu wrote: ואל תקראו לי נאיבי. יש לי נסיון של הרבה שנים של שיתוף פעולה בין ישראל לארצות ערב בתחום התוכנה, גם בעולם התוכנה הקניינית... ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
2011/5/30 Ira Abramov hama...@ira.abramov.org סטולמן, כל עוד לא נחת בנתב"ג, לא יכול להגיד מילה נגד חרם אקדמי, ??? למה לא?? ומהיכרותי אותו זה מאוד בוער לו להגיד את זה כשהוא יגיע לכאן. אז למה שהוא לא יגיד את זה כבר עכשיו? אם רוצים פתרון פשרה - אז בואו נקיים את ההרצאות אבל ללא סטולמן. זה דווקא רעיון טוב. משה ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
אם אתה מתנגד לחרם האקדמי, אז אני ממליץ לא לשתף פעולה איתו. אם קבלת תנאי שאוסר על הופעה בשום אוניברסיטה ישראלית זאת לא כניעה לחרם, אז תגיד, מה זה *כן * כניעה לחרם?? אני נגד ה"פתרון" הזה. אני גם נגד כל נסיון להתחננן מהטמבל הזה שיברך אותנו עם הוד נוכחותו. משה On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 9:24 AM, Ira Abramov wrote: אני ממש נגד החרם האקדמי, אבל אני מבין שאתה מפרש את הנסיון להוציא את ההרצאות לאולם פרטי ולעקוף את החרם ככניעה ולא כפתרון? אם הגישה של אלי, משה ושלך מנצחת, אז אנחנו באמת מבזבזים פה זמן מקלדת יקר, כי אין פתרון שיצליח להשקיט את כל הצדדים, וסטולמן יחטוף בישראל אות קין שזה מצער ואולי אפילו פוגע בקהילה. זו אולי לא יריה משמעותית ברגל אבל זה חתך ניר מאוד לא נעים באגודל. אם אין לי תמיכה במציאת אולמות (קרובים ככל הניתן גאוגרפית לאוניברסיטאות שבהן בוטלו ההרצאות, שיהיה ברור!), אז אני אעזוב עכשיו ולא אתחיל אפילו לבזבז את זמני. לעומת זאת אם יש מי שכן מוכן לפתרון, אני מוכן להשקיע את זמני הלא פנוי לטובת הפתרון, ואפילו לארגן אולם לא קטן בירושלים, בתקווה להביא לשם גם קהל גדול לא יהודי. בשלב זה אני מציע שנפסיק אם כך להתווכח ופשוט נצביע בעד ונגד הפתרון. On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 09:07, Ram-on Agmon wrote: המקור לא היתה שותפה באף שלב בביקור הנוכחי של סטולמן בארץ, ואני לא חושב שהיא צריכה להתחיל להיכנס לקלחת כרגע. באופן עקרוני, אני נגד שיתוף פעולה עם חרם כל שהוא על איזה שהוא מוסד אקדמי. ישראלי או פלסטיני. רם און On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 9:04 AM, E L wrote: Fine, I accept what you say, now the only thing left to decide is if hamakor is going to give a hand to boycotting Israeli academy. I call everyone to boycott any lecture of RMS until he agrees to give up that silly notion. Ely On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 8:55 AM, Ira Abramov wrote: I thought we found a nice resolution here - RMS *wants* to speak in Israel, he explained how we can go about it, he's still going to give talks at the Palestinian venues and I bet he will use those to educate them about how academic boycotting is a bad thing. He can't possibly gain anything by saying now that he won't support academic boycotts, because then his trip may be canceled. Stop calling it "selling his soul", he's doing the correct, pragmatic thing! Now can we please all grow up and stop dragging this discussion into the local politics? Our goal should be to find new halls now and show that free software's ideas are beyond the local problems of one region or another, or we are no better than his Palestinian hosts or the people of Mint that Omer keeps reminding us of in his signature. On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 08:40, E L wrote: Says who? No one asked him if he is willing to lecture in Israel for money, you are just assuming that. I'm pretty sure he will find some other excuse. Probably they wont agree to share expenses with Israelis. Or threaten him to chose either the PA or Israel. One thing is sure, a lot less people will want to hear him anyhow, who wants to hear a freedom activist that sell his soul for money? Ely On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 8:12 AM, Omer Zak wrote: In other words, Stallman's cancellation of speeches in Israeli universities is indeed a victory in the worldwide attempt to promote academic boycott of Israel. I understand that it is a battle which can be won by means of some money. So let's arrange funding for Stallman's trip to our area to replace Palestinian funds, and without the kind of strings that the Palestinians attached to their funds. Where to send my 100NIS contribution? --- Omer Zak On Mon, 2011-05-30 at 08:02 +0300, Ira Abramov wrote: > I'm pretty suree RMS' reply bounced so here I am quoting it for all of > you. he sent me a longer reply in person and they both confirm what I > thought - he's more interested in fulfilling his original obligation > and use it for promoting collaboration. > > Moreover, he says the ban imposed on him is NOT Israel in its > entirety, but only the Universities (the private Shenkar College seems > kosher according to him). The weird but sensible thing to do is find > lecture halls outside the universities and there would be no conflict. > > I think there are now several people in the readers who should > marinade their hats for making this a bigger political issue than it > really is. > > I'll be posting his personal replies to me in my blog later, and > sending them to the papers. > > On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 07:36, Richard Stallman wrote: >I saw that you sent an E-mail message canceling all of your > talks > in Israel= in the upcoming visit. > > > Not all of them -- only the ones at universities. It is the > universities that the funders object to. I have one planned > talk > which is not at a university, which I still plan to give. > > I will forward your message to them. I hope you can indeed > work > something out, because cooperation between Israelis and > Palestinians > is good. > > Another possible approach is to find other venues for the > other talks > I was goi
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
I second that. Moshe On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 9:04 AM, E L wrote: > Fine, I accept what you say, now the only thing left to decide is if > hamakor > is going to give a hand to boycotting Israeli academy. > I call everyone to boycott any lecture of RMS until he agrees to give up > that silly > notion. > > Ely > > > > On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 8:55 AM, Ira Abramov wrote: > >> I thought we found a nice resolution here - RMS *wants* to speak in >> Israel, he explained how we can go about it, he's still going to give talks >> at the Palestinian venues and I bet he will use those to educate them about >> how academic boycotting is a bad thing. He can't possibly gain anything by >> saying now that he won't support academic boycotts, because then his trip >> may be canceled. Stop calling it "selling his soul", he's doing the correct, >> pragmatic thing! >> >> Now can we please all grow up and stop dragging this discussion into the >> local politics? Our goal should be to find new halls now and show that free >> software's ideas are beyond the local problems of one region or another, or >> we are no better than his Palestinian hosts or the people of Mint that Omer >> keeps reminding us of in his signature. >> >> >> On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 08:40, E L wrote: >> >>> Says who? >>> No one asked him if he is willing to lecture in Israel for money, >>> you are just assuming that. I'm pretty sure he will find some other >>> excuse. >>> Probably they wont agree to share expenses with Israelis. Or threaten him >>> to chose either the PA or Israel. >>> >>> One thing is sure, a lot less people will want to hear him anyhow, >>> who wants to hear a freedom activist that sell his soul for money? >>> >>> Ely >>> >>> >>> On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 8:12 AM, Omer Zak wrote: >>> In other words, Stallman's cancellation of speeches in Israeli universities is indeed a victory in the worldwide attempt to promote academic boycott of Israel. I understand that it is a battle which can be won by means of some money. So let's arrange funding for Stallman's trip to our area to replace Palestinian funds, and without the kind of strings that the Palestinians attached to their funds. Where to send my 100NIS contribution? --- Omer Zak On Mon, 2011-05-30 at 08:02 +0300, Ira Abramov wrote: > I'm pretty suree RMS' reply bounced so here I am quoting it for all of > you. he sent me a longer reply in person and they both confirm what I > thought - he's more interested in fulfilling his original obligation > and use it for promoting collaboration. > > Moreover, he says the ban imposed on him is NOT Israel in its > entirety, but only the Universities (the private Shenkar College seems > kosher according to him). The weird but sensible thing to do is find > lecture halls outside the universities and there would be no conflict. > > I think there are now several people in the readers who should > marinade their hats for making this a bigger political issue than it > really is. > > I'll be posting his personal replies to me in my blog later, and > sending them to the papers. > > On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 07:36, Richard Stallman wrote: >I saw that you sent an E-mail message canceling all of your > talks > in Israel= in the upcoming visit. > > > Not all of them -- only the ones at universities. It is the > universities that the funders object to. I have one planned > talk > which is not at a university, which I still plan to give. > > I will forward your message to them. I hope you can indeed > work > something out, because cooperation between Israelis and > Palestinians > is good. > > Another possible approach is to find other venues for the > other talks > I was going to give in Israel. -- Linux Mint is insecure by design as it won't accept contributions (bug reports) from Israelis who choose to defend themselves against suicide bombers: http://eclelef.blogspot.com/2009/05/palestine_03.html My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/ My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone. They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which I may be affiliated in any way. WARNING TO SPAMMERS: at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> Discussions mailing list >>> Discussions@hamakor.org.il >>> http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/lis
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
Ira Abramov: "*Stop calling it 'selling his soul', he's doing the correct, pragmatic thing!"* *"Immorality is the sin of placing pragmatism over one's ideals."* -- Richard Stallman Moshe ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
Ira Abramov: *"The weird but sensible thing to do is find lecture halls outside the universities and there would be no conflict."* Yes, let's see how weird we can get and how much we can contort ourselves to accomodate the academic boycott of Israel. Perhaps we should also make sure that there are no Israeli flags visible at the site where he speaks... Moshe ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
Steve G.: *"He now has involved himself with a political storm that will do little to help the open source community." * That isn't something that's likely to disturb Stallman. He very much dislikes the Open Source community (it is a "watered-down alternative" to free software in his juvenile terminological dogma), and he consistently says negative things about it. Moshe ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
Ira: One can hardly help but notice that in his reply to Eddie, Stallman once again passed up the opportunity to add your missing half sentence about how much he really wanted to find a compromise instead, and how terribly difficult the decision was for him to make. But I have no doubt that must be what he was thinking... Moshe On Sun, May 29, 2011 at 5:32 PM, Ira Abramov wrote: > Sure, just like Obama's refusal to show his birth certificate was proof > that he's a secret Muslim Kenyan communist. It speaks VOLUMES to people who > prefer the voices in their heads, or look for conspiracy theories > everywhere, or more likely just trying to build a straw man argument. Either > way, you are jumping the gun. > > However, I suggested we wait and not pass judgement until we get more input > from him. > > As I said, I have approached him, informed him that this is quickly blowing > out of proportions, and suggested he delivers a slightly more detailed > explanation than his laconic message yesterday. I am not saying you are > wrong, I'm saying you are over-blowing this. It would take Glen Beck at > least another week before he would call RMS a suicide bomber, but at your > rate it would take you less than 24 hours. > > Cool down. let the man explain himself before you continue the smears. > > > To criticize my actions is anyone's right. However, what you are >> doing is stretching my views into something else (which didn't come >> from me) and claiming that makes me a liar. That is not valid. >> > > Eddie got his reply it seems. I hope he'll reply to the rest of us soon. > > Ira > > 2011/5/29 Moshe Z. Matitya > >> But in point of fact, he did *not* add any such statement. And that >> omission speaks volumes. >> >> >> 2011/5/29 Ira Abramov >> >>> אם רק היה מוסיף חצי משפט שהוא ניסה להגיע להגיע לפשרה לפני שהגיע להחלטה, >>> או שההחלטה לא קלה לו, היה יותר ברור מה קרה פה. >>> >> >> ___ >> Discussions mailing list >> Discussions@hamakor.org.il >> http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions >> > > > ___ > Discussions mailing list > Discussions@hamakor.org.il > http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions > ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
How amusing. If I didn't know who wrote the statement below, I might venture a guess that it was a reply by Bill Gates to an attack by Richard Stallman... :-) Moshe On Sun, May 29, 2011 at 5:30 PM, Edward Aronovich wrote: > This is the reply that arrived. > FYI > > -Original Message- > From: Richard Stallman [mailto:r...@gnu.org] > Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2011 5:21 PM > To: Edward Aronovich > Subject: Re: I have to cancel the speeches at universities > >However, personally I start to doubt your truthfulness about > freedom. >Boycotting the Israeli Universities since you get funds from >Palestinians means that you accepted the Palestinians proprietary >license. > > To criticize my actions is anyone's right. However, what you are > doing is stretching my views into something else (which didn't come > from me) and claiming that makes me a liar. That is not valid. > > -- > Dr Richard Stallman > President, Free Software Foundation > 51 Franklin St > Boston MA 02110 > USA > www.fsf.org, www.gnu.org > Skype: No way! That's nonfree (freedom-denying) software. > Use free telephony http://directory.fsf.org/category/tel/ > ___ > Discussions mailing list > Discussions@hamakor.org.il > http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions > > ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
But in point of fact, he did *not* add any such statement. And that omission speaks volumes. 2011/5/29 Ira Abramov אם רק היה מוסיף חצי משפט שהוא ניסה להגיע להגיע לפשרה לפני שהגיע להחלטה, או שההחלטה לא קלה לו, היה יותר ברור מה קרה פה. ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
Nadav: *"And even if Stallman were this evil, Israel-hating radical like other people quickly judged him to be, it certainly doesn't reflect anything on the free software movement as a whole..."* While I disagree with much of the rest of your analysis, I certainly agree with that part 100%. It would be a terrible mistake to conflate Stallman's political views with the whole of the free software movement, which certainly does not deserve to be besmirched by association. I would even go further than that: I note that Stallman is more than a little bit of a fruitcake, and a great many things that he says do not reflect the views of the majority of members of the free software movment. (Examples that come to mind are his tirades against the Open Source movement, against usage of the name "Linux" or even "Penguin", and his general insistence that the rest of the world conform to his own bizarre, personally-invented lexicon of Politically Correct terminology...) Moshe On Sun, May 29, 2011 at 4:49 PM, Nadav Har'El wrote: > On Sun, May 29, 2011, Gabor Szabo wrote about "Re: FW: I have to cancel the > speeches at universities": > > But again, I doubt that the real reason the Palestinians wanted him to > > skip Israel > > is the money. > > Obviously, I don't think the reason why the *Palestinians* wanted him to > skip > Israel was the money - the reason is that they, believe it or not, don't > like > us. But I do think, however, that the reason why *Stallman* is skipping > Israel > *is* the money, not that he doesn't like us. > > Perhaps the problem can be made clear by a similar (and completely > hypothetical) situation, but without all the heated patriotism of both > sides: > > Imagine that Cellcom and Orange are two Israeli companies in bitter > competition. One day Cellcom invites Richard Stallman for giving a talk in > Cellcom's HQ, paying for his flight, hotel, and other expenses. Orange hear > this, and smell an oportunity: They can invite Stallman for free (or almost > free), because his flight is already paid for, and Orange's HQ is just a > few > miles from Cellcom's! So Orange does invite Stallman, and Stallman accepts. > > A while later, Cellcom discovers that Stallman will also visit Orange, and > are > furious: Stallman is flying on their invitation, on their expense, and > their > bitter enemy Orange will benefit from his presence? No way, Jose! Cellcom > quickly write Stallman a demand: If do don't cancel your plans to also > visit > Orange, you are no longer welcome to visit us. And of course, we won't pay > for the trip. > > Stallman doesn't like the situation, but doesn't have many options: He > understands why Cellcom doesn't want to benefit Orange (although he has no > personal grudge against either Cellcom or Orange), and he *did* promise > Cellcom first to visit them. Moreover, Orange never offered to finance his > trip, so if he doesn't take the money from Cellcom, he won't be able to > visit > neither of them. > > I think when you use the words "Cellcom" and "Orange", it becomes clearer > that > Stallman isn't evil here, and didn't make any unreasonable decision. He > found himself wedged between two bitter enemies, between a proverbial rock > and a hard place. Finding himself in this situation doesn't make him evil, > any more than it makes him a saint. > > And even if Stallman were this evil, Israel-hating radical like other > people > quickly judged him to be, it certainly doesn't reflect anything on the free > software movement as a whole - any more than quirks in Albert Einstein's > personality or personal life reflect on the importance or success of his > theory, or physics as a whole. > > Nadav. > > > > -- > Nadav Har'El| Sunday, May 29 2011, 25 Iyyar > 5771 > n...@math.technion.ac.il > |- > Phone +972-523-790466, ICQ 13349191 |Why do we drive on a parkway and park > on > http://nadav.harel.org.il |a driveway? > ___ > Discussions mailing list > Discussions@hamakor.org.il > http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions > > ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
You know, I had thought of saying pretty much the same thing to you. But I didn't, because I respect and honor your right to free speech... 2011/5/29 Ira Abramov > אם אין לך מה לתרום חוץ מרעל, אתה לא חייב לתרום כלום. זה לא מקדם ולא משפר. > ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
Oh yes, for sure. And not only that -- it will also make the PA realize that they should stop torturing and executing gay people, and they'll stop publishing children's schoolbooks that refer to Jews as "the sons of pigs and monkeys who must all be killed". Furthermore, I expect that as soon as Hamas realizes that we are "turning the other cheek" to Richard Stallman, they will immediately renounce terrorism, stop launching rockets at us, and release Gilad Shalit. And Hassan Nasrallah will be suddenly filled with a warm, fuzzy feeling of brotherly love, and he'll come out of his bunker and join together with us in Jerusalem in singing "Kumbaya"... 2011/5/29 Tomer Cohen > גם אני חושב שכדאי לרתום את התקרית הזאת לטובתנו, ולהציג את קהילת התוכנה > החופשית בארץ כשוחרי שלום ואוהבי הזולת, ולשים את הדעות הפוליטיות שלנו בצד. > כתוצאה מכך לא רק שאנחנו נצא טוב, אלא שגם אותם אנשים שחשבו שזה ליגיטימי לקבוע > לאדם היכן מותר לו לדבר והיכן אסור עשויים להבין מכך את גודל הטעות שהם עושים. > > ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
Re: FW: I have to cancel the speeches at universities
Nir: I'm not sure I understand what you think Stallman needs to "clarify" about his behavior. He already stated quite clearly what his reason is for cancelling: His Palestinian hosts allegedly informed him that if he speaks in Israel, then he is no longer welcome to speak by them. What part of that did you not understand? If you are implying that there is a deeper, unstated reason for Stallman's cancellation, which he chose not to mention -- well, I would tend to agree with that. But there is no need to demand any "clarification" from him in order to find out what it is: Stallman is a radical anti-Israel extremist, as a brief Google search will reveal rather quickly. It is thus hardly surprising that he cancelled his appearance here; the only surprise was that he ever agreed to it in the first place, before "coming to his senses". I would also venture an educated guess that Stallman's Palestinian hosts were actually *not* the people who raised objections to his speaking engagements here. Far more likely that the objectors were anti-Israel BDS activists from the US college campus scene, who are Stallman's buddies. As Eddie correctly wrote in his reply to Stallman, cancelling the talks is Stallman's legitimate right. People have the right to go and to speak, or not to, wherever they please -- even if their motivations are hateful and morally repugnant, as they most certainly are in Stallman's case. But by the same token, the rest of us have the right, and perhaps even the obligation, to loudly publicize and condemn that morally repugnant behavior. As U.S. Supreme Court Justice Louis Brandeis wrote, "Sunlight is the best disinfectant". Moshe On Sun, May 29, 2011 at 10:13 AM, Nir Aides wrote: > Hi, > > This is my first post to this mailing list and regretfully on such a > discussion. > > Why on earth did you people go and put this story on slashdot? > Are you 10 years old? > Are you nuts? > > Did any of you try to reach Stallman in an attempt to clarify his notice or > fix the situation? > This entire discussion is silly and childish at best. > > Nir > > > > 2011/5/29 Shai Berger > >> On Sunday 29 May 2011 02:02:12 Omer Zak wrote: >> > פרסמתי בסלאשדוט. >> >> קישור? אני לא רואה את זה בעמוד הראשי כרגע, וגם לא בחיפושים על "RMS" או >> "Stallman". >> >> ___ >> Discussions mailing list >> Discussions@hamakor.org.il >> http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions >> > > > ___ > Discussions mailing list > Discussions@hamakor.org.il > http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions > ___ Discussions mailing list Discussions@hamakor.org.il http://hamakor.org.il/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discussions
