[Dorset] Google Wave
For those who haven't spotted this yet, and if you have the time, (1 hr 20 mins actually), get over to http://wave.google.com/ and have a look at Google's latest product, due for launch later this year. The video is in high definition and is well worth watching all the way through, otherwise you'll miss one of the many innovations. The team is headed up by the two brothers who developed Google Maps. As a taster, Google's aspiration for this is to replace or enhance all current forms of communication, including email, instant messaging (including twitter etc), blogging, collaborative editing, bug tracking and just about anything else you can think of. I just watched the whole thing and probably averaged a wow every 10 minutes or so. The good news is that most of the code is going to be Open Sourced and the protocols are open too. Google have already been collaborating with two other organisations who have produced their own clients for this. They say that they gained so much when people innovated on top of Google Maps (which they hadn't intended originally), that they've set out to promote that from the start with Wave. So have a look and let us know what you think of it. -- Terry Coles 64 bit computing with Kubuntu Linux -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
Terry Coles wrote: > So have a look and let us know what you think of it. > > Stunning - I watched it earlier - they've put a massive amount of work and thought into it and I reckon it'll be massive once folk get their collective, collaborative heads around it. Sean -- www.funkygibbins.me.uk -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
On Friday 29 May 2009, Terry Coles wrote: > The good news is that most of the code is going to be Open Sourced and the > protocols are open too. Google have already been collaborating with two > other organisations who have produced their own clients for this. They say > that they gained so much when people innovated on top of Google Maps (which > they hadn't intended originally), that they've set out to promote that from > the start with Wave. And just to make sure: 'Subject to the terms and conditions of this License, Google and its affiliates hereby grant to you a perpetual, worldwide, non-exclusive, no- charge, royalty-free, irrevocable (except as stated in this License) patent license for patents necessarily infringed by implementation of this specification.' See http://www.waveprotocol.org/patent-license. -- Terry Coles 64 bit computing with Kubuntu Linux -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
Slightly surprised there hasn't been more noise about this. Maybe they should have made a quicker 'highlights' video since possibly the length might put a lot of potential viewers off. I went from 'Wow' to 'OK, and..' to 'hmm... dunno' during the course of the talk & demo. Yes there is some very nice technology there, and yes they have put a lot of work in. And once you get the idea of the API (which they did explain in principle quite clearly) then the demos started to become 'more of the same'. (Although some of the server-side robots were impressive!) I did find myself wondering how well it would hold up in a less favourable network environment: whether the latency might become a problem. And finally, although there still is a wow-factor there, I find myself wondering just how I would actually see it being used. I don't really think there is that much call for picture sharing and real time collaborative editing, and it seemed like it was addressing requirements I don't have. I'd quite like to be persuaded otherwise... Maybe something to discuss over a beer tomorrow. -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 19:47:22 +0100, Victor Churchill wrote: > > I did find myself wondering how well it would hold up in a less > favourable network environment: whether the latency might become a > problem. > This is something that concerned me. There is more and more reliance on the network being always on and reliable. Added to the confidentiality of storing all your conversations on a server outside your control. I lost it (attention) after about 20 minutes so echo the requirement for a shorted punchy video about its features. All of it made sense although it would be nice to see some sort of identification and integrity measures (me being paranoid and all that). Si -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
Simon P Smith wrote: > On Tue, 2 Jun 2009 19:47:22 +0100, Victor Churchill > wrote: >> I did find myself wondering how well it would hold up in a less >> favourable network environment: whether the latency might become a >> problem. >> > > This is something that concerned me. There is more and more reliance > on the network being always on and reliable. Added to the confidentiality > of storing all your conversations on a server outside your control. > > I lost it (attention) after about 20 minutes so echo the requirement for a > shorted punchy video about its features. All of it made sense although it > would be nice to see some sort of identification and integrity measures (me > being paranoid and all that). I don't think you're being paranoid. I noticed that the presentation didn't mention security, or wave-spam, or anything bad at all. There is some discussion of such things on the wave forum though -- the Google people claim to be aware of and planning for such problems. It all looked very clever, but does, as Si says, require a fast and reliable network: maybe we'll have one of those one day. cheers Chris -- Chris Dennis cgden...@btinternet.com Fordingbridge, Hampshire, UK -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
I can see it being used on company intranets where security and network spped won't be an issue and features such as colaborative editing etc will be more useful. I had some concerns about everything being sored on another server if using it over the internet and what the security would be like, on that front I thought the part of the demo where they showed differnet servers talking to each other, so maybe you could set it up with a client and server on each PC making into a peer to peer system with nothing stored on an external server -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
On Tuesday 02 Jun 2009, Victor Churchill wrote: > I did find myself wondering how well it would hold up in a less > favourable network environment: whether the latency might become a > problem. Two things here. First of all, networks are beginning to get faster and more reliable, so in time I believe the performance will be there. The second point is that as someone else said, companies will be able to run this over their intranet and even with offsite nodes, the performance should be pretty good if they have fast inter-site connections. > And finally, although there still is a wow-factor there, I find myself > wondering just how I would actually see it being used. I don't really > think there is that much call for picture sharing and real time > collaborative editing, and it seemed like it was addressing > requirements I don't have. I'd quite like to be persuaded otherwise... We use Groove at work for collaborative development with IEEE Standards and it's pretty good, even though the product was bought by Microsoft and you can no longer buy it without buying Office 2007, (no surprises there then). I say that it's pretty good, but it's not a patch on Google Wave. We could do some really powerful stuff if we went over to Wave and save money too. > Maybe something to discuss over a beer tomorrow. ;-( I just got back from Chester. -- Terry Coles 64 bit computing with Kubuntu Linux -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
Terry Coles wrote: > On Tuesday 02 Jun 2009, Victor Churchill wrote: > >> I did find myself wondering how well it would hold up in a less >> favourable network environment: whether the latency might become a >> problem. >> > > Two things here. First of all, networks are beginning to get faster and more > reliable, so in time I believe the performance will be there. The second > point is that as someone else said, companies will be able to run this over > their intranet and even with offsite nodes, the performance should be pretty > good if they have fast inter-site connections. > Latency doesn't seem to be a problem for e-mails or existing instant messaging. They did say that it doesn't have to do updates per-key-press, you can send a message as a whole. (Well, will be able to when they implement that bit!) I thought it all looked quite good. -- Andrew. -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
On Thu, 2009-06-04 at 22:24 +0100, Andrew Morgan wrote: > Terry Coles wrote: > > On Tuesday 02 Jun 2009, Victor Churchill wrote: > > > >> I did find myself wondering how well it would hold up in a less > >> favourable network environment: whether the latency might become a > >> problem. > >> > > > > Two things here. First of all, networks are beginning to get faster and > > more > > reliable, so in time I believe the performance will be there. The second > > point is that as someone else said, companies will be able to run this over > > their intranet and even with offsite nodes, the performance should be > > pretty > > good if they have fast inter-site connections. > > > Latency doesn't seem to be a problem for e-mails or existing instant > messaging. > They did say that it doesn't have to do updates per-key-press, you can > send a message as a whole. (Well, will be able to when they implement > that bit!) > > I thought it all looked quite good. > > -- > > Andrew. > > from today's observer. I think I like this guys writing. http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2009/jun/07/media-business-google-wave But he doesn't answer the question about who is going to pay to store all this stuff that we do with Wave, who owns it, and how long it has to be kept for legal reasons. He keeps his other stuff here. Note the 'living without Microsoft' link http://www.briefhistory.com/footnotes/ Peter M. -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
On Sun, 2009-06-07 at 17:29 +0100, Peter Merchant wrote: > But he doesn't answer the question about who is going to pay to store > all this stuff that we do with Wave, who owns it, and how long it has to > be kept for legal reasons. That depends where it's stored. Wave is a distributed system, like conventional email, IRC, or Jabber, the instant messaging service it is built upon. Different Wave service providers will have different answers to those questions. -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
Hi Terry, > For those who haven't spotted this yet, and if you have the time, (1 > hr 20 mins actually), get over to http://wave.google.com/ and have a > look at Google's latest product, due for launch later this year. I've not managed to do that, even now. Partly it's the amount of time required, and partly that I tend to find videos provide a low signal to noise and I'm stuck at their speed. The written word can be more useful and I've just read http://mashable.com/2009/05/28/google-wave-guide/ which seems to explain some of it quite well. How much it's missed out, I obviously don't know. :-) So if there's others like me who'd like to know what it's all about, and whether to invest 100 minutes of your time in the video, that may be worth a read first. Cheers, Ralph. -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, 2009-06-03 20:00 Dorset LUG: http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ Chat: http://www.mibbit.com/?server=irc.blitzed.org&channel=%23dorset List info: https://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/dorset
Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
2009/6/10 Ralph Corderoy :
>
> I've not managed to do that, even now. Partly it's the amount of time
> required, and partly that I tend to find videos provide a low signal to
> noise and I'm stuck at their speed. The written word can be more useful
> and I've just read http://mashable.com/2009/05/28/google-wave-guide/
> which seems to explain some of it quite well. How much it's missed out,
> I obviously don't know. :-)
>
> So if there's others like me who'd like to know what it's all about, and
> whether to invest 100 minutes of your time in the video, that may be
> worth a read first.
Hi Ralph,
Seems like others have had the same issue ("80 minutes!?") as there is
a "Readers' Digest Condensed" version (more just someone's selected
highlights, actually) at [1]. Although TBH I don't know how useful the
video snippets would be on their own if you hadn't already seen the
full length version.
OT, I think I do tend to agree with you about the effectiveness of the
medium - you can't easily 'skim' a video ;-)
But OTOH [2] I've just downloaded an open source software package
(Kompozer) and found myself looking for a nice entry level 'howto'
video on the web rather than a user guide doc... hey well, nobody's
consistent *all* the time!
[1]
http://lifehacker.com/5285944/the-google-wave-highlight-reel?skyline=true&s=x
[2] wow. what an acronym-fest. Three in one message.
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Re: [Dorset] Google Wave
Hi Victor,
> Seems like others have had the same issue ("80 minutes!?") as there is
> a "Readers' Digest Condensed" version (more just someone's selected
> highlights, actually) at [1]. Although TBH I don't know how useful the
> video snippets would be on their own if you hadn't already seen the
> full length version.
>
> [1]
> http://lifehacker.com/5285944/the-google-wave-highlight-reel?skyline=true&s=x
Thanks, very useful. I'll make the time to watch the whole shebang
having seen those.
Cheers,
Ralph.
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