Re: [Elecraft] K3 Problem Solved!!!!

[Vic Rosenthal]

Glad it works, but this is strange. I always do firmware updates with the P3 in 
line.

Vic 4X6GP/K2VCO 

> On Aug 22, 2015, at 2:46 AM, pastor...@verizon.net wrote:
> 
> Well, it seems that the prolific cables do work with windows 10 and the K3. 
> Evidently you can't connect the cable to the P3 and then to the K3. It must 
> be connected directly to the K3. Once I did that the firmware loaded and 
> everything is back to normal. Hopefully Howard at Elecraft will read this. 
> Thanks to all the people that told me to connect the cable directly to the 
> K3. Mark Griffin, KB3Z
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[Elecraft] PS question answered - tnx to all!

[Charles Yahrling]

I got great info including some actual measurements from W4BQF that jived
with mine, once I took corrective action by shortening the power lead and
eliminating the dual fuses. Findings:

- starting T/S by eliminating the simplest (and most notorious) suspect is
still a great idea

-  I was reminded my Astron VS-35M does not have voltage sense capability,
so some V drop shown on FP will be normal (but not 2+ vdc!)

-  accordingly, to measure any voltage sag on my PS I must measure at the
PS terminals (K9YC et al)

- pay attention to the tx power indicator when operating. I had been
ignoring that until I noticed it was showing more power than usual (at
100W) after the fix.

FWIW in 50 years of soldering, the only connections I've had to repair are
the ones that were crimped but not soldered.  This is a mandatory
anti-corrosion hack for salt water boating, along with RTV for good
measure.

I do not take the K3 sailing 

great info, great list.
many thanks!
-- 
de AB1VL
NAQCC #6799

ab1vl.com
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Re: [Elecraft] P3 1.34/SVGA 1.21 BETA Firmware available

[mike]

Thanks for all the suggestion on and off list. It is not an issue of not know
which file or where to find it, rather I am not able to get to the Elecraft
ftp site. Clearly the problem is on my end of it. Only recent change here is
upgrading to Windows 10. I will have to look closer as to why my browser now
has a problem with FTP. Thanks es 73  ..mike  AI6II



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[Elecraft] KX3 audio distorted with AGC on, fine with AGC off

[Juhani Ahvenainen]

The firmware version in my KX3 is MCU 02.33, DSP 01.33. The AGC (menu) 
parameters are at their default values. If you turn off AGC (menu AGC MD) the 
audio is fine. If you turn AGC on the audio is very clearly distorted on 
signals stronger than about S7. The stronger the signal the worse the 
distortion.

Using different sets of headphones or PC speakers of good quality makes no 
difference. I have tried tweaking the AGC parameters (AGC*THR especially) and I 
have backed up and restored the configuration with the utility PC program. 
Switching between 14 V and 12 V power supplies seems to make no difference. 
What else can you do? Unfortunately, this issue takes the joy out of using the 
otherwise great radio.

73, Juhani OH5YU
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Re: [Elecraft] P3TXMON Question?

[Hank Garretson]

On Fri, Aug 21, 2015 at 11:19 PM, Edward R Cole  wrote:

When I need to know accurate power readings my best instrument is either
> scope and good 50-ohm termination, or using my HP432A mw power meter.  Its
> about 1/2 dB accurate.


Isn't "1/2 dB accurate" the same as "12 percent accuracy"?

73,

Hank, W6SX
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Re: [Elecraft] KX3 audio distorted with AGC on, fine with AGC off

[d...@lightstream.net]

Juhani,

I've encountered this as well. It's particularly noticeable with some of
the wide ESSB sig's which tend to use less compression and no doubt have a
higher peak to average ratio than most other signals on the band.

I've found that reducing the RF gain control to about -10 to -12, helps
quite a bit. For me, the granularity of the AF gain is too coarse.
Sometimes, even a setting of "1" is too much when I'm wearing headphones
(depending upon the particular phones). For that reason, I reduced the RF
gain, and in so doing discovered the side benefit that itsignificantly
reduced or eliminated the distortion you mention.

73,
Dale
WA8SRA


> The firmware version in my KX3 is MCU 02.33, DSP 01.33. The AGC (menu)
> parameters are at their default values. If you turn off AGC (menu AGC MD)
> the audio is fine. If you turn AGC on the audio is very clearly distorted
> on signals stronger than about S7. The stronger the signal the worse the
> distortion.
>
> Using different sets of headphones or PC speakers of good quality makes no
> difference. I have tried tweaking the AGC parameters (AGC*THR especially)
> and I have backed up and restored the configuration with the utility PC
> program. Switching between 14 V and 12 V power supplies seems to make no
> difference. What else can you do? Unfortunately, this issue takes the joy
> out of using the otherwise great radio.
>
> 73, Juhani OH5YU


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Re: [Elecraft] P3TXMON Question?

[Wes (N7WS)]

Maybe "really precise" is a stretch when you're using scalar instrumentation.

Considering the money we put into rigs and antennas, the ~$500 price of the 
DG8SAQ Vector Network Analyzer is affordable.


I can remember the days when I had to have some precision attenuation 
measurements made on a piece of equipment and it took an airplane ride to a 
sister facility where an HP8410 network analyzer resided in a 
temperature-controlled clean room.


Later I was able to purchase one of the first HP8510s ($250K) for my work lab. 
It was rack-mounted and weighed a couple of hundred pounds. At that time NBS 
(NIST) wouldn't even certify 3.5mm (SMA) standards.  BTW, a set of test cables 
was >$3K.  Imagine trying to convince Management that these were throw away 
items after so many connect-disconnect cycles.


Now I have the VNWA 3 analyzer in my home lab.  I can hold it in my hand and 
within its frequency range, it is every bit as good as the HP and the software 
is a whole lot more powerful.


Radio-wise, we live in magical times.

Wes  N7WS

On 8/21/2015 11:19 PM, Edward R Cole wrote:


But for really precise SWR I use directional couplers and calibrated open, 
short and 50-ohm terms.  They are never subjected to over +10 dBm.  Return 
loss is what is actually measured and one can use a conversion chart to 
determine SWR.  If I had the money then a VNA is the optimum instrument.  But 
the average ham does not need that.


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[Elecraft] OT Power Measurements

[Bob McGraw - K4TAX]

Seems that I somewhat stirred the pot on this topic with my suggestion 
of using a Bird 43P or LP-100a.In this regard with a Bird 43 
instrument, proper choice of a slug is necessary.  Thus if one wishes to 
measure 10 watts or so then a slug of the proper full scale range, both 
in power and frequency,  should be used.   In no way would I suggest or 
imply a 100 watt slug be used to measure 10 watts.


We seem to overlook the point the Bird meter, as well as most other ham 
type power meters, are voltage devices.  In this regard, the accurate 
power measurement relies on the calibration at precisely 50 ohms.  Any 
other Z, resistive or reactive basically negates the accuracy of these 
devices.  Now used as a means to determine SWR, they work OK as one is 
comparing two different power values obtained with the same instrument 
at the same point in the feed line and using a calculator or nomograph 
to determine actual SWR values.


One of the few instruments to calculate the true power is the LP-100a in 
as much as it has two sensors which are used to  measure both voltage 
and current.  At this point the Z component is insignificant to a larger 
degree.


As to using an oscilloscope, again the calibration is a critical point 
in accuracy plus the resolution accuracy or the ability of one to 
determine the actual value of the trace as displayed.And too, the 
accuracy of the dummy load becomes a significant factor.As a rule we 
presume most dummy loads are 50 ohms, but are they?  I have four 
different ones, all showing a difference in R value, yet are a 
"supposed" to be 50 ohm loads.


As someone else stated, all of this is determined by the accuracy of the 
items being used to measure power and the operator understanding and 
knowing the limitations of the measurement system.


73
Bob, K4TAX
K3S s/n 10,163

On 8/22/2015 9:00 AM, Hank Garretson wrote:

On Fri, Aug 21, 2015 at 11:19 PM, Edward R Cole  wrote:

When I need to know accurate power readings my best instrument is either

scope and good 50-ohm termination, or using my HP432A mw power meter.  Its
about 1/2 dB accurate.


Isn't "1/2 dB accurate" the same as "12 percent accuracy"?

73,

Hank, W6SX
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Re: [Elecraft] normal K3 voltage drop on TX

[Jerry Moore]

Guys, there may be new/better information out there, and I’m agreeable to be 
wrong. 

 

I just know that our Government spends millions/billions to over research 
everything. What follows is excerpts from the US Navy Electricity and 
Electronics Training Series, Module 4, Chapter and page is included as 
reference.

 

The format of the reference: -

 

2-11 - The increased use of crimp-on terminals is due to the limitations of 
soldered terminals. The quality

of soldered connections depends mostly upon the operator's skill. Other 
factors, such as temperature, flux,

cleanliness, oxides, and insulation damage due to heat, also add to defective 
connections. Solder-type

connections are covered later in this chapter.

An advantage of the crimp-on solderless terminal lugs is that they require 
relatively little operator

skill to use. Another advantage is that the only tool needed is the crimping 
tool. This allows terminal lugs

to be applied with a minimum of time and effort. The connections are made 
rapidly, are clean, and

uniform in construction. Because of the pressures exerted and the material 
used, the crimped connection

or splice, properly made, is both mechanically and electrically sound.

 

My comments: I wasn’t able to find the “limitations of soldered terminals” 
listed. My best guess is that the limits are more based on correct 
process/skill at the onset to prevent cold joints AND loss of wire flexibility 
near the connection. The loss of flexibility potentially being more susceptible 
to weakening/breaks due to vibration – conjecture on my part. 

 

 

 

2-24 - Do not tin wires that are to be crimped to

solderless terminals or splices.

 

I found a source for the modules online - http://jacquesricher.com/NEETS/

 

 

Jerry Moore

AE4PB, K3S soon

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Re: [Elecraft] normal K3 voltage drop on TX

[Jerry Moore]

Fair enough Tom :) , 
I've not had the pleasure of doing microwave other than
fixing/troubleshooting radar (APS 180/APS 80). My Navy training didn't
include soldering/crimping for radar other than cannon/other connections.
It's been a long time and I don't recall the magnetron connection types as
we generally would only replace crystals or the whole unit if there was an
issue. I did get to change a waveguide and test it with a sweep cart once.
That was a lot of fun. 



-Original Message-
From: Chester Alderman [mailto:alderm...@windstream.net] 
Sent: Friday, August 21, 2015 11:01 PM
To: 'Jerry Moore'; elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] normal K3 voltage drop on TX

You should be sure to NEVER say that around a microwave person! As long as
you stay in HF, crimps may be OK. As a retired microwave circuit and systems
design engineer, there will never be a crimped anything in my ham station.
Saying 'crimped' is better than soldered is the same as saying you don't
know what you are talking about! Just my opinion of course.

73,
Tom - W4BQF



-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jerry
Moore
Sent: Friday, August 21, 2015 9:38 PM
To: Bob McGraw - K4TAX; elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] normal K3 voltage drop on TX

I respectfully disagree. A properly made crimp is superior to a soldered
connection. The key word being properly made. If you don't have the correct
tools to do a proper crimp then a good compromise is to solder the
connection after crimping, however, that's only to comply with connection
best practice to establish a good mechanical and electrical connection. A
proper crimp serves to mechanically weld the conductors together.
Jer, AE4PB
K3S TBA
 
 

his email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
alderm...@windstream.net


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[Elecraft] F.S. or trade Pam Code Cube

[Joe W2KJ]

Howdy Gang:

I have a like new Palm Code Cube in like-new condition (used only a couple of 
times)  that I would like to trade for an Idiom Press CMOS4 keyer in like 
condition.

The Palm Code Cube is the one that plugs into the Palm mini paddle.

Or I will sell it outright for $75 shipped.

73, Joe W2KJ
I QRP, therefore I am
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Re: [Elecraft] normal K3 voltage drop on TX

[Jerry Moore]

Nice NASA geek type reading on connections and such. I'm sure the
information is largely out of date but still has a ton of really good info. 

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19750010203.pdf



-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Edward
R Cole
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2015 2:03 AM
To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] normal K3 voltage drop on TX

I agree with Bob, but as 45-years experience has taught me.

Properly crimped bright new copper wire is fine.  Take a look several years
later (also compare contact resistance; probably best measured as voltage
drop under load).  If you live in the desert where humidity never rises
above 25% you may not see any change.  Put the same crimped connector
100-foot from salt water and less than three years it will turn green and
start to fail.  Put on a boat with no sealant and the connector will fall
apart.

Solder the connector after crimping to that bright new copper wire and those
problems will be lessened.  ON a boat only airtight sealant will ensure long
life.  I find where I want to ensure lowest contact resistance soldering
after crimping works.

But if the wire is subject to repeated movement or vibrational forces the
soldered connection will break whereas crimp-only seems more resilient.
Spacecraft use crimped-only connectors (subject to high g-force vibration in
launch and extreme temperature variations).  But then there is no air in
space and thus no moisture to corrode.

For ordinary shack wiring of a ham station crimp+ solder causes no harm.  I
use it where ever I want to ensure the lowest voltage drop under load.

Most of those NAPA wire crimpers are a poor excuse for a real tool - but
probably what most of us use. My coax crimpers are properly racheting
crimpers and produce a good contact.  Still I do not like them in situations
where the cable sees a lot of movement.  Good old compression back nut
construction is best.  I'm talking about N, BNC, TNC, sma, 7/16, etc.
PL-259's are used only if I have to.

73, Ed - KL7UW

--
From: Bob McGraw - K4TAX 
To: Jerry Moore , elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] normal K3 voltage drop on TX
Message-ID: <55d7d678.80...@blomand.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed

Properly it must be crimped   A N  D   soldered.  Both are required.
Are you saying a crimped and soldered connection is worse than a crimped
only connection?

My military experience says there first must be a mechanical connection made
{crimp or wrap} and then follow with an electrical connection
{solder}.   And RCA stipulated this practice in all of their broadcast
equipment.

73
Bob, K4TAX
K3S s/n 10,163



73, Ed - KL7UW
http://www.kl7uw.com
 "Kits made by KL7UW"
Dubus Mag business:
 dubus...@gmail.com

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[Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[K8AC]

I had been using an Elecraft USB/serial cable with my recently acquired K2
and the PC communications worked properly.  In debugging a software problem,
it was suggested that I try using a real serial port, which I did. 
Unfortunately, I was unaware that I wasn't supposed to use a standard RS232
cable.  So now, the K2's port won't work with the USB/serial cable either
and I assume that the interface in the KPA-100 was damaged.  I guess that U4
(MAX 1406) is a prime suspect for failure in this case.  Any suggestions?



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[Elecraft] New K3s and P3 Issues

[Amateur Radio Operator N5GE]

The K3S is great! , but now I'm having trouble setting up the P3.

I hooked the P3 up with the cables furnished with the K3S and now I'm
having some issues with the P3.

1. I didn't change on the P3 settings, except loading the latest
non-beta firmware.

2. Now I can't get the U shaped cursor to display.  I've tryed all of
the cursor settings in both FixTrack and FixMode with no sucess.

Can someone please tell me how to make the U shaped cursors display
again? 

Thanks,

Amateur Radio Operator 
N5GE

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[Elecraft] W2/P3TXMON directional couplers

[Ian]

Just curious if anyone knows the insertion loss for the W2 or P3TXMON
directional couplers?  The manuals don't specify.  Part numbers are
different but they sure look the same!

73, Ian N8IK 

 

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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Don Wilhelm]

Anyone who has purchased a used K2 needs to take notice, lest it happen 
to you too.


That connector is marked AUX I/O for exactly that reason, it is not a 
computer RS-232 connector even though it contains TXD, RXD and signal 
ground.  As a result, one must always use the special cable that is 
built as part of the KPA100 to connect to a computer serial port.


You are not likely to have damaged anything in the KPA100 when 
connecting a standard serial cable to the K2, although KPA100 U6 may 
have a damaged output at pin 6, and the inductors located just behind 
the DE-9 connector should be checked for continuity.
The TXD and RXD signals in the serial cable will connect to U4 just the 
same as if the special cable were used.


You could have also damaged the computer serial port because pin 1 was 
grounded by the K2.


You will find most of the damage will be in the base K2.
Internal signals AUXBUS and VRFDET could have caused the MCU IC to be 
damaged as well as the KSB2.
The fact that the 8R voltage rail appears on that connector, that may 
have caused further damage.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 8/22/2015 1:19 PM, K8AC wrote:

I had been using an Elecraft USB/serial cable with my recently acquired K2
and the PC communications worked properly.  In debugging a software problem,
it was suggested that I try using a real serial port, which I did.
Unfortunately, I was unaware that I wasn't supposed to use a standard RS232
cable.  So now, the K2's port won't work with the USB/serial cable either
and I assume that the interface in the KPA-100 was damaged.  I guess that U4
(MAX 1406) is a prime suspect for failure in this case.  Any suggestions?



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[Elecraft] TXMON vs Lp-100A test

[Chester Alderman]

The below are ham radio test results, NOT engineering test lab results.
(This is what an inquisitive ham does on a Saturday to keep from going out
in the 96 degree/84% humidity to cut grass.)


I have been doing some 'informative' test on my P3 TXMON verses my LP-100A
Vector wattmeter. As we all are aware, the difference of a couple of digits
in the digital readout is typically insignificant.

K3 s/n 8895 and P3 with TXMON installed. K3 connected through my Alpha 9500
(turned off) and my TXMON TX Directional Coupler (DC) to the 9500 RF output,
using a male/male adapter. The DC is connected via a four foot RG-232 coax
to my Bird 500w dummy load.
I first connected the DC and the LP-100A DC in series, at the RF output
connector of the 9500; the K3 was in CW mode and I was keying with my 1916
Blue Racer bug.

I set the K3 to its reading of 100 watts. The 100A read 106.7 watts and SWR
= 1.05:1. The TXMON read 107.0 watts and SWR =1.00:1 {The TXMON is actually
readying the input SWR of the 100A DC}

Then using the TXMON, I set the Pout reading of the K3 to exactly 100 watts.
The 100A read 97 watts.

I then adjusted the K3 for exactly 100 watts on the 100A and using the TXMON
(menu) SCALE CAL, I adjusted the TXMON to 100 watts, resulting in  SCALE CAL
(default setting = 500) to 514, closely agreeing with the 100A reading. (The
last digit of the PEP reading continuously changed each time I keyed the
K3).

My personal conclusion is the TXMON agrees with the 100A VERY close and
truthfully adjusting SCALE CAL is not necessary as these are all
uncontrolled test results. The reading of TXMON SWR was close enough to the
100A to be a non-issue.


*

This is probably of little interest to most, but it is something I always do
just for my own information because I used to operate QRQ at speeds over 100
wpm..

For non-contest keying I use a very old logging program produced by VE6YP,
called YPlog. This program generates CW using Windows internal sound
generation thereby eliminating the 'CW stutter' generated by all Windows
operating PC systems I/O output ports, i.e. Serial and Parallel ports. One
must build a very simple audio detector, driving a simple NPN transistor to
key any radio. I have watched this program on my O'scope, running the 'Quick
Brown Fox' message on a different radio (Icom) at 160 wpm and working
flawless.

My first impression of QRQ keying of the 'improved' firmware for the K3 was
that, to my ear, the K3 was capable of about 95 wpm before the characters
started losing spacing. In testing this a couple of days ago, with the TXMON
installed in my P3, I found out the RF keying waveform from my K3 could
actually go up between 115 and 120 wpm before character spacing began to
wilt! So it was certainly better than my 'old' ears!


8

NOTE: This is something I did out of curiosity of my own. I share it with
the reflector just for informational purposes.

My personal opinion of the TXMON is that it's Pout and SWR readings are very
close to the accuracy of an LP-100A, but of course it was not designed to
provide the rest of the excellent capabilities of the LP-100A.
 
73,
Tom - W4BQF



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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Floyd Sense]

Hi Don.  I'm sure you're aware that the RS232 spec includes the 
description of voltage levels, and if you're going to refer to an 
interface as RS232 (as Elecraft does in many places) then you're 
implying that the normal RS232 signal levels will be used.  A user 
shouldn't be required to read a one hundred page manual before plugging 
in a connector when every other such connector works in the conventional 
way.  Having been a designer using RS232 interfaces 45 years ago, I 
would have been executed had I designed something like this.


Anyway, maybe you can help me determine what areas to focus on in the 
repair.  Here's what I know:


1. The RF chokes RFC6-9 are all intact.
2. The ALC is functioning properly - the power control properly controls 
the output
3. U1 in the KPS-100 appears to be functioning as the relays are being 
activated at the right time as I switch through the bands.
4. Data sent from Hyperterminal through the USB/serial converter to the 
K2 shows up on Pin 6 of the KPA-100 U4 (the Max1706) and can be seen at 
pin 26 of the K2 MCU (U6).  But, the K2 doesn't act on the commands that 
are  sent.
5. The voltage on pin 5 of U4 (MAX1406) is -15.4 VDC, seems that 
indicates U4 is toast?


I haven't observed any other problems.  I found the document written by 
Gary Surrency and Tom Hammond regarding this situation.  Which leads me 
to some questions:


1.  Reference is made to possible damage to the KSB2.  Do you know what 
the symptom would be in that case?
2.  Apparently, any damage to the MCU IC might be isolated to just the 
input from the interface - pin 26.  I say that because everything else 
appears to function normally.  Are you aware of anything else I might 
check for regarding the MCU function?


73, Floyd


On 8/22/2015 3:16 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
Anyone who has purchased a used K2 needs to take notice, lest it 
happen to you too.


That connector is marked AUX I/O for exactly that reason, it is not a 
computer RS-232 connector even though it contains TXD, RXD and signal 
ground.  As a result, one must always use the special cable that is 
built as part of the KPA100 to connect to a computer serial port.


You are not likely to have damaged anything in the KPA100 when 
connecting a standard serial cable to the K2, although KPA100 U6 may 
have a damaged output at pin 6, and the inductors located just behind 
the DE-9 connector should be checked for continuity.
The TXD and RXD signals in the serial cable will connect to U4 just 
the same as if the special cable were used.


You could have also damaged the computer serial port because pin 1 was 
grounded by the K2.


You will find most of the damage will be in the base K2.
Internal signals AUXBUS and VRFDET could have caused the MCU IC to be 
damaged as well as the KSB2.
The fact that the 8R voltage rail appears on that connector, that may 
have caused further damage.


73,
Don W3FPR



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Re: [Elecraft] New K3s and P3 Issues

[Mike K2MK]

Menu, Cursors, knob press

What you are probably experiencing is that when you first press the menu
button the first thing to come up is FW Rev. You have to turn the knob
counter clockwise before you see Cursors.

73,
Mike K2MK


N5GE wrote
> The K3S is great! , but now I'm having trouble setting up the P3.
> 
> I hooked the P3 up with the cables furnished with the K3S and now I'm
> having some issues with the P3.
> 
> 1. I didn't change on the P3 settings, except loading the latest
> non-beta firmware.
> 
> 2. Now I can't get the U shaped cursor to display.  I've tryed all of
> the cursor settings in both FixTrack and FixMode with no sucess.
> 
> Can someone please tell me how to make the U shaped cursors display
> again? 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Amateur Radio Operator 
> N5GE





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[Elecraft] Rose's K3 Cases

[GRANT YOUNGMAN]

I know this is old news for a lot of you, but after a long time (ser 2090 - 
about) with a K3, I’m finally going to take my K3/P3 on the road.  Just got a 
set of cases from Rose Kopp — K3 DXpedition, and standard P3 case.  They are 
just exquisite.

If you have a K3, or are a newbie with a K3/K3S, you should be looking at these 
cases.  

Grant NQ5T
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Re: [Elecraft] Rose's K3 Cases

[Jerry Moore]

Pictures or website? Little r if more appropriate.
Jer
 
> On August 22, 2015 at 5:09 PM GRANT YOUNGMAN  wrote:
>
>
> I know this is old news for a lot of you, but after a long time (ser 2090 -
> about) with a K3, I’m finally going to take my K3/P3 on the road. Just got a
> set of cases from Rose Kopp — K3 DXpedition, and standard P3 case. They are
> just exquisite.
>
> If you have a K3, or are a newbie with a K3/K3S, you should be looking at
> these cases.
>
> Grant NQ5T
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Re: [Elecraft] Rose's K3 Cases

[GRANT YOUNGMAN]

Go to Elecraft’s home page and scroll down to the bottom or ..

> http://www.smugmug.com/gallery/7058736_hZbo4/1/452236459_Bc3aF#!i=452236478&k=W8SXP2M
>  
> 
Grant NQ5T




> On Aug 22, 2015, at 4:22 PM, Jerry Moore  wrote:
> 
> Pictures or website? Little r if more appropriate.
> Jer
>  
> > On August 22, 2015 at 5:09 PM GRANT YOUNGMAN  > > wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > I know this is old news for a lot of you, but after a long time (ser 2090 - 
> > about) with a K3, I’m finally going to take my K3/P3 on the road. Just got 
> > a set of cases from Rose Kopp — K3 DXpedition, and standard P3 case. They 
> > are just exquisite.
> > 
> > If you have a K3, or are a newbie with a K3/K3S, you should be looking at 
> > these cases. 
> > 
> > Grant NQ5T

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[Elecraft] KX3 help

[Thaire Bryant]

Thank you all for your suggestions.  Wayne got back to me immediately (even
with a 9 hour time difference) and in two emails

Had the problem diagnosed and I was able to make a repair.  Issue was 2M
module I had just installed.  I operated with a swiss

army knife and am back in business!  

 

I love this company and this radio!

 

73,

Thaire  W2APF

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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Don Wilhelm]

Floyd,

You say the voltage at U4 pin 5 is -15.4 volts, and that *may* be a 
perfectly valid voltage - that is a MARK.
It should not be constantly that way, so check U4 pin 12 - if it is 
zero, then the MAX1406 is behaving properly in response.  That line 
originates from the MCU (Control Board U6) pin 25, and should be +5v 
under normal conditions, but pulses to zero when the K2 sends data.


If you find KPA100 U4 pin 12 at 5 volts while pin 5 is going negative, 
then replace U4.
OTOH, if U4 pin 12 is at zero volts, suspect the K2 MCU or some problem 
on the signal line between those points.
As a quick check on whether the base K2 or KPA100 is pulling that signal 
to zero, remove the KPA100 ribbon cable, then power the base K2 and see 
whether CB U6 pin 25 goes to +5v with the ribbon cable removed.  If it 
stays at 0 volts, remove the MCU and make a resistance measurement on U6 
pin 25 to make sure it is not shorted - if you read a high resistance, 
replace the MCU IC.


The most likely symptom if the KSB2 board has been damaged from plugging 
in a serial cable is that you could have damaged  either the KSB2 MCU 
(AUXBUS line), or Q1 (high voltage on the VRFDET line or the ALC line 
can do damage).


Note that if you were previously connecting the USB to serial adapter 
directly to the KPA100 AUX I/O connector, it may be possible that no 
damage would occur *if* the voltage out of the adapter did not exceed 5 
volts and never went negative.  In the PC world of short RS-232 
signalling, some try to "get away' with those levels, where a real 
serial card will typically have voltages in excess of +/-12 volts.
So if you did not previously use the special cable, you will need to 
build one - the instructions are in the KPA100 manual page 60.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 8/22/2015 4:28 PM, Floyd Sense wrote:


Anyway, maybe you can help me determine what areas to focus on in the 
repair.  Here's what I know:


1. The RF chokes RFC6-9 are all intact.
2. The ALC is functioning properly - the power control properly 
controls the output
3. U1 in the KPS-100 appears to be functioning as the relays are being 
activated at the right time as I switch through the bands.
4. Data sent from Hyperterminal through the USB/serial converter to 
the K2 shows up on Pin 6 of the KPA-100 U4 (the Max1706) and can be 
seen at pin 26 of the K2 MCU (U6).  But, the K2 doesn't act on the 
commands that are  sent.
5. The voltage on pin 5 of U4 (MAX1406) is -15.4 VDC, seems that 
indicates U4 is toast?


I haven't observed any other problems.  I found the document written 
by Gary Surrency and Tom Hammond regarding this situation.  Which 
leads me to some questions:


1.  Reference is made to possible damage to the KSB2.  Do you know 
what the symptom would be in that case?
2.  Apparently, any damage to the MCU IC might be isolated to just the 
input from the interface - pin 26.  I say that because everything else 
appears to function normally.  Are you aware of anything else I might 
check for regarding the MCU function?


73, Floyd


On 8/22/2015 3:16 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
Anyone who has purchased a used K2 needs to take notice, lest it 
happen to you too.


That connector is marked AUX I/O for exactly that reason, it is not a 
computer RS-232 connector even though it contains TXD, RXD and signal 
ground.  As a result, one must always use the special cable that is 
built as part of the KPA100 to connect to a computer serial port.


You are not likely to have damaged anything in the KPA100 when 
connecting a standard serial cable to the K2, although KPA100 U6 may 
have a damaged output at pin 6, and the inductors located just behind 
the DE-9 connector should be checked for continuity.
The TXD and RXD signals in the serial cable will connect to U4 just 
the same as if the special cable were used.


You could have also damaged the computer serial port because pin 1 
was grounded by the K2.


You will find most of the damage will be in the base K2.
Internal signals AUXBUS and VRFDET could have caused the MCU IC to be 
damaged as well as the KSB2.
The fact that the 8R voltage rail appears on that connector, that may 
have caused further damage.


73,
Don W3FPR






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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[K8AC]

OK - many thanks, Don.  I'll get busy looking at those things.

73, Floyd


On 8/22/2015 6:33 PM, Don Wilhelm-4 [via Elecraft] wrote:
> Floyd,
>
> You say the voltage at U4 pin 5 is -15.4 volts, and that *may* be a
> perfectly valid voltage - that is a MARK.
> It should not be constantly that way, so check U4 pin 12 - if it is
> zero, then the MAX1406 is behaving properly in response.  That line
> originates from the MCU (Control Board U6) pin 25, and should be +5v
> under normal conditions, but pulses to zero when the K2 sends data.
>
> If you find KPA100 U4 pin 12 at 5 volts while pin 5 is going negative,
> then replace U4.
> OTOH, if U4 pin 12 is at zero volts, suspect the K2 MCU or some problem
> on the signal line between those points.
> As a quick check on whether the base K2 or KPA100 is pulling that signal
> to zero, remove the KPA100 ribbon cable, then power the base K2 and see
> whether CB U6 pin 25 goes to +5v with the ribbon cable removed.  If it
> stays at 0 volts, remove the MCU and make a resistance measurement on U6
> pin 25 to make sure it is not shorted - if you read a high resistance,
> replace the MCU IC.
>
> The most likely symptom if the KSB2 board has been damaged from plugging
> in a serial cable is that you could have damaged  either the KSB2 MCU
> (AUXBUS line), or Q1 (high voltage on the VRFDET line or the ALC line
> can do damage).
>
> Note that if you were previously connecting the USB to serial adapter
> directly to the KPA100 AUX I/O connector, it may be possible that no
> damage would occur *if* the voltage out of the adapter did not exceed 5
> volts and never went negative.  In the PC world of short RS-232
> signalling, some try to "get away' with those levels, where a real
> serial card will typically have voltages in excess of +/-12 volts.
> So if you did not previously use the special cable, you will need to
> build one - the instructions are in the KPA100 manual page 60.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 8/22/2015 4:28 PM, Floyd Sense wrote:
>
> >
> > Anyway, maybe you can help me determine what areas to focus on in the
> > repair.  Here's what I know:
> >
> > 1. The RF chokes RFC6-9 are all intact.
> > 2. The ALC is functioning properly - the power control properly
> > controls the output
> > 3. U1 in the KPS-100 appears to be functioning as the relays are being
> > activated at the right time as I switch through the bands.
> > 4. Data sent from Hyperterminal through the USB/serial converter to
> > the K2 shows up on Pin 6 of the KPA-100 U4 (the Max1706) and can be
> > seen at pin 26 of the K2 MCU (U6).  But, the K2 doesn't act on the
> > commands that are  sent.
> > 5. The voltage on pin 5 of U4 (MAX1406) is -15.4 VDC, seems that
> > indicates U4 is toast?
> >
> > I haven't observed any other problems.  I found the document written
> > by Gary Surrency and Tom Hammond regarding this situation.  Which
> > leads me to some questions:
> >
> > 1.  Reference is made to possible damage to the KSB2.  Do you know
> > what the symptom would be in that case?
> > 2.  Apparently, any damage to the MCU IC might be isolated to just the
> > input from the interface - pin 26.  I say that because everything else
> > appears to function normally.  Are you aware of anything else I might
> > check for regarding the MCU function?
> >
> > 73, Floyd
> >
> >
> > On 8/22/2015 3:16 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
> >> Anyone who has purchased a used K2 needs to take notice, lest it
> >> happen to you too.
> >>
> >> That connector is marked AUX I/O for exactly that reason, it is not a
> >> computer RS-232 connector even though it contains TXD, RXD and signal
> >> ground.  As a result, one must always use the special cable that is
> >> built as part of the KPA100 to connect to a computer serial port.
> >>
> >> You are not likely to have damaged anything in the KPA100 when
> >> connecting a standard serial cable to the K2, although KPA100 U6 may
> >> have a damaged output at pin 6, and the inductors located just behind
> >> the DE-9 connector should be checked for continuity.
> >> The TXD and RXD signals in the serial cable will connect to U4 just
> >> the same as if the special cable were used.
> >>
> >> You could have also damaged the computer serial port because pin 1
> >> was grounded by the K2.
> >>
> >> You will find most of the damage will be in the base K2.
> >> Internal signals AUXBUS and VRFDET could have caused the MCU IC to be
> >> damaged as well as the KSB2.
> >> The fact that the 8R voltage rail appears on that connector, that may
> >> have caused further damage.
> >>
> >> 73,
> >> Don W3FPR
> >>
> >
> >
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Jim Brown]

Hi Floyd,

I've owned and operated a pair of K2s, both of which I bought used. 
Elecraft makes it very clear that the DB9 connector on the K2 is NOT an 
RS232 interface, that it is not RS232 compliant, and that a standard 
RS232 cable should NOT be used. Rather, the DB9 connector provides both 
serial control AND several control functions.


The DB9 connector is a generic part, and can be used for many things 
besides RS232.  It is also well known that while the RS232 Standard 
defines voltage levels, MANY modern products produce far less than those 
levels.


I've owned a lot of gear in my lifetime, and the first thing I do is 
open the manual, study it, study the wiring of the various connectors, 
study the specs, and study the operating instructions.


73, Jim K9YC



On Sat,8/22/2015 1:28 PM, Floyd Sense wrote:
Hi Don. I'm sure you're aware that the RS232 spec includes the 
description of voltage levels, and if you're going to refer to an 
interface as RS232 (as Elecraft does in many places) then you're 
implying that the normal RS232 signal levels will be used.  A user 
shouldn't be required to read a one hundred page manual before 
plugging in a connector when every other such connector works in the 
conventional way.  Having been a designer using RS232 interfaces 45 
years ago, I would have been executed had I designed something like this. 


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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Richard W. Solomon]

It seems to me that using a DB-9 connector for non-RS232 uses is taking the 
Easy way out.
There are numerous other connectors that could be used to alleviate any 
Misunderstanding. 

Not everyone goes through manuals with a fine tooth comb to locate the 
"gotchas".

73, Dick, W1KSZ

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim
Brown
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2015 4:25 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

Hi Floyd,

I've owned and operated a pair of K2s, both of which I bought used. 
Elecraft makes it very clear that the DB9 connector on the K2 is NOT an
RS232 interface, that it is not RS232 compliant, and that a standard
RS232 cable should NOT be used. Rather, the DB9 connector provides both
serial control AND several control functions.

The DB9 connector is a generic part, and can be used for many things besides
RS232.  It is also well known that while the RS232 Standard defines voltage
levels, MANY modern products produce far less than those levels.

I've owned a lot of gear in my lifetime, and the first thing I do is open
the manual, study it, study the wiring of the various connectors, study the
specs, and study the operating instructions.

73, Jim K9YC



On Sat,8/22/2015 1:28 PM, Floyd Sense wrote:
> Hi Don. I'm sure you're aware that the RS232 spec includes the 
> description of voltage levels, and if you're going to refer to an 
> interface as RS232 (as Elecraft does in many places) then you're 
> implying that the normal RS232 signal levels will be used.  A user 
> shouldn't be required to read a one hundred page manual before 
> plugging in a connector when every other such connector works in the 
> conventional way.  Having been a designer using RS232 interfaces 45 
> years ago, I would have been executed had I designed something like this.

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Re: [Elecraft] P3 1.34/SVGA 1.21 BETA Firmware available

[mike]

Turns out it was my Xfinity hardware firewall. Didn't know it had changed.
All is good now. ;>)  ..mike  AI6II



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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[K8AC]

Hi Jim.  Well, when this incident occurred, I was deep into working on 
an associated software problem and needed to quickly try the PC serial 
port directly.  I agree with you comment about reading the manual and in 
fact I did so just a couple of weeks back when I acquired this unit.  
Unfortunately, at my age, I don't always recall 100% of what I read.  
Now that I have this problem, of course I remember reading all about 
needing the special cable

But, I disagree regarding the use of the DB9 connector on the K2. Having 
worked on tons of gear with communications ports, I've never run into 
one that purportedly used an RS232 interface, but would self-destruct if 
a real RS232 interface were attached.  The KPA-100 manual clearly 
describes it as an RS232 interface and the schematic has it labeled as 
such.  If it doesn't support RS232 voltage levels, then it isn't an 
RS232 interface in my book.  And I know that there are devices that use 
a DB9 connector but are not RS232 compliant, but that isn't the issue here.

In the document that Gary Surrency and Tom Hammond wrote on the subject 
several years ago, they clearly pointed out the need for a more 
prominent label warning of the possible consequences of connecting the 
wrong cable.  Had I seen such a warning, I'd have remembered the reason 
for it and would have avoided the problem. At any rate, the worst result 
should be a failure to communicate and not the destruction of several 
important components in the unit.  Having read many of your writings, I 
doubt that you'd have ever designed something with that sort of risk 
involved.

When I get everything working again, I plan to document in detail what 
fails, how to determine if it had failed and what to do about it.  
Current documentation on that is rather lacking and I'll bet that there 
are scores of K2s out there with the same problem.

73, Floyd - K8AC


On 8/22/2015 7:26 PM, Jim Brown-10 [via Elecraft] wrote:
> Hi Floyd,
>
> I've owned and operated a pair of K2s, both of which I bought used.
> Elecraft makes it very clear that the DB9 connector on the K2 is NOT an
> RS232 interface, that it is not RS232 compliant, and that a standard
> RS232 cable should NOT be used. Rather, the DB9 connector provides both
> serial control AND several control functions.
>
> The DB9 connector is a generic part, and can be used for many things
> besides RS232.  It is also well known that while the RS232 Standard
> defines voltage levels, MANY modern products produce far less than those
> levels.
>
> I've owned a lot of gear in my lifetime, and the first thing I do is
> open the manual, study it, study the wiring of the various connectors,
> study the specs, and study the operating instructions.
>
> 73, Jim K9YC
>
>





--
View this message in context: 
http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K2-KPA100-RS232-interface-repair-tp7606571p7606587.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Re: [Elecraft] KX3 help

[Peter Lambert]

Hello Thaire,

Could you share this fix please ?.

73's Peter VK4JD

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Thaire
Bryant
Sent: Sunday, 23 August 2015 8:30 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] KX3 help

Thank you all for your suggestions.  Wayne got back to me immediately (even
with a 9 hour time difference) and in two emails

Had the problem diagnosed and I was able to make a repair.  Issue was 2M
module I had just installed.  I operated with a swiss

army knife and am back in business!  

 

I love this company and this radio!

 

73,

Thaire  W2APF

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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Bob McGraw - K4TAX]

The K3S has a RJ-45 connector for the RS-232 communications.  Now that's 
different!   Of course they supply a cable with a RJ-45 on one end and a 
DB-9F on the other.  And then to keep everybody happy, there is what 
appears to be a 15 pin VGA connector that is the ACC connector to 
provide band data and such.  The manual clearly states "This is not a 
VGA video connector".


Yes it is very important to read and understand the manual before 
plugging or inserting any connector into any hole on any radio today.  
It seems most hams think if it plugs in, then it should work.


73
Bob, K4TAX
K3S s/n 10,163

On 8/22/2015 7:17 PM, Richard W. Solomon wrote:

It seems to me that using a DB-9 connector for non-RS232 uses is taking the
Easy way out.
There are numerous other connectors that could be used to alleviate any
Misunderstanding.

Not everyone goes through manuals with a fine tooth comb to locate the
"gotchas".

73, Dick, W1KSZ

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim
Brown
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2015 4:25 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

Hi Floyd,

I've owned and operated a pair of K2s, both of which I bought used.
Elecraft makes it very clear that the DB9 connector on the K2 is NOT an
RS232 interface, that it is not RS232 compliant, and that a standard
RS232 cable should NOT be used. Rather, the DB9 connector provides both
serial control AND several control functions.

The DB9 connector is a generic part, and can be used for many things besides
RS232.  It is also well known that while the RS232 Standard defines voltage
levels, MANY modern products produce far less than those levels.

I've owned a lot of gear in my lifetime, and the first thing I do is open
the manual, study it, study the wiring of the various connectors, study the
specs, and study the operating instructions.

73, Jim K9YC



On Sat,8/22/2015 1:28 PM, Floyd Sense wrote:

Hi Don. I'm sure you're aware that the RS232 spec includes the
description of voltage levels, and if you're going to refer to an
interface as RS232 (as Elecraft does in many places) then you're
implying that the normal RS232 signal levels will be used.  A user
shouldn't be required to read a one hundred page manual before
plugging in a connector when every other such connector works in the
conventional way.  Having been a designer using RS232 interfaces 45
years ago, I would have been executed had I designed something like this.

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Problem Solved!!!!

[Alan]

On 08/22/2015 02:49 AM, Vic Rosenthal wrote:

Glad it works, but this is strange. I always do firmware updates with the P3 in 
line.


The one time that doesn't work is if the K3 is in manual 
firmware-download mode, perhaps due to a failure of a previous download. 
 For that, the P3 should be bypassed.  The easiest way to ensure that 
is to unplug its power connector.


Alan N1AL

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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Phil Wheeler]

Most of us built our K2/KPA100/KAT100 way back; 
that was the only way you could buy them, not 
factory-built nor factory-assembled. That did 
require that we apply the "fine tooth comb" 
approach to the manual, since we soldered every 
connection to every part. As a result I'm still, 
12 years or so after building my KPA100, aware of 
the issue.


73, Phil W7OX

On 8/22/15 5:17 PM, Richard W. Solomon wrote:

It seems to me that using a DB-9 connector for non-RS232 uses is taking the
Easy way out.
There are numerous other connectors that could be used to alleviate any
Misunderstanding.

Not everyone goes through manuals with a fine tooth comb to locate the
"gotchas".

73, Dick, W1KSZ

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim
Brown
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2015 4:25 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

Hi Floyd,

I've owned and operated a pair of K2s, both of which I bought used.
Elecraft makes it very clear that the DB9 connector on the K2 is NOT an
RS232 interface, that it is not RS232 compliant, and that a standard
RS232 cable should NOT be used. Rather, the DB9 connector provides both
serial control AND several control functions.

The DB9 connector is a generic part, and can be used for many things besides
RS232.  It is also well known that while the RS232 Standard defines voltage
levels, MANY modern products produce far less than those levels.

I've owned a lot of gear in my lifetime, and the first thing I do is open
the manual, study it, study the wiring of the various connectors, study the
specs, and study the operating instructions.

73, Jim K9YC



On Sat,8/22/2015 1:28 PM, Floyd Sense wrote:

Hi Don. I'm sure you're aware that the RS232 spec includes the
description of voltage levels, and if you're going to refer to an
interface as RS232 (as Elecraft does in many places) then you're
implying that the normal RS232 signal levels will be used.  A user
shouldn't be required to read a one hundred page manual before
plugging in a connector when every other such connector works in the
conventional way.  Having been a designer using RS232 interfaces 45
years ago, I would have been executed had I designed something like this.


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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Don Wilhelm]

The RJ-45 connector is now defined in the RS-232 standard, as is the 
DE-9 and DB-25.
Of course, Ethernet also uses the RJ-45 connector, as do multi-line 
telephone sets.  Those are *not* interchangeable functions.  You would 
not want to plug an RJ-45 RS-232 cable into your RJ-45 ethernet router 
jack or into your multi-line telephone system.

Make no assumptions about connectors, for they are a "just a connector".

Another example:
The older PCs used the DB-25 for a printer port.  How do you tell the 
difference between a printer port and a 25 pin serial port connector? - 
you refer to the manual for the device in question and look for a 
clearly defined label.
At our church, there is a sound console that has a DB-25 connector - 
should I assume that is a printer port, or a serial port just because 
those are connectors commonly used for those applications - of course 
not - the connector on the sound console is for expansion devices.


So, know what you are plugging into before connecting cables (even if 
they fit) - if it is labeled as RS-232, then plug away, but if it is 
labeled with anything different, check the manual before plugging.  That 
fact goes for any device with a connector, it is not just for the K2.


As another parallel, RCA jacks are used for many purposes - antenna 
connections, audio connections, and yes even power connections. Would 
you plug anything into an RCA jack assuming it was an audio connector 
without carefully heeding the label or referring to the equipment manual?


A connector is "just a connector".  Just because it looks like the 
connector in one piece of gear that you happen to be familiar with does 
not mean it serves the same purpose on everything else.  Take DIN 
connectors as an example - they are common on many pieces of ham gear.  
Why would one assume that a 6 pin DIN connector on a Yaesu transceiver 
has the same pinout as that on an Icom.  I hope I have made my point and 
will belabor it no more.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 8/22/2015 8:31 PM, Bob McGraw - K4TAX wrote:
The K3S has a RJ-45 connector for the RS-232 communications.  Now 
that's different!   Of course they supply a cable with a RJ-45 on one 
end and a DB-9F on the other.  And then to keep everybody happy, there 
is what appears to be a 15 pin VGA connector that is the ACC connector 
to provide band data and such.  The manual clearly states "This is not 
a VGA video connector".


Yes it is very important to read and understand the manual before 
plugging or inserting any connector into any hole on any radio today.  
It seems most hams think if it plugs in, then it should work.




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[Elecraft] P3 or Sub Rx?

[ae4pb]

Just wondering what DXers who have the K3/K3s think. My main mode will be CW
with my objective being DX primarily. With this in mind it's been suggested
that the P3 would be more useful than the SubReceiver. I'm starting to
rethink that and just wondering which is the most useful for DX? I won't be
getting the SVGA adapter unless I get it pre-owned and need it.

Thanks in advance.. just getting close.. 13 days and a wakeup :)

Jerry Moore
AE4PB, K3S SN # TBA

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[Elecraft] Weekly SSB Net Announcement

[Ian Kahn]

All,

The weekly Elecraft SSB net will take place Sunday, August 23, at 18:00
UTC, on 14.3035 +/-. I will be net control from the suburbs north of
Atlanta, GA. Hopefully band conditions will be better than they've been the
last couple of weeks.

Talk to everyone tomorrow.

73 de,

--Ian
Ian Kahn, KM4IK
Roswell, GA  EM74ua
km4ik@gmail.com
10-10 #74624  North Georgia Chapter #2038
PODXS 070 #1962
K3 #281, P3 #688 KAT500 #860, KPA500 #1468
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Re: [Elecraft] P3 or Sub Rx?

[Guy Olinger K2AV]

>From here for me as a sample of one, it's a winner to actually listen
to my split transmit frequency leaving the main RX tuned to the DX.
Using diversity on 160/80/40 to hear really weak ones is remarkable.
So I'd go with the SubRX first. But that's just MY answer, there are a
thousand variations.

More than that, I think being confined to "either/or" is a loser.
There are keen advantages and usefulnesses to one not served by the
other. Kind of like shall I buy four tires or a steering wheel for my
car. I have both. I have the P3SVGA because the significantly
increased definition is useful to me for a more detailed display of
technical aspects of signals. Also, it's useful in contests in ways
the smaller display doesn't show nearly as well (again MY personal
impressions).

In the end the answer, like a lot of your other posed questions, is
really a *very* personal question with very individual answers. No
simple answers, not really. It's your budget, your druthers.

Best thing is to go somewhere someone has one and operate them
yourself, even if that is a three hour drive, and significantly
inconvenient. Make your decision based on what *YOU* saw and heard.

73, Guy K2AV

On Sat, Aug 22, 2015 at 9:38 PM,   wrote:
> Just wondering what DXers who have the K3/K3s think. My main mode will be CW
> with my objective being DX primarily. With this in mind it's been suggested
> that the P3 would be more useful than the SubReceiver. I'm starting to
> rethink that and just wondering which is the most useful for DX? I won't be
> getting the SVGA adapter unless I get it pre-owned and need it.
>
> Thanks in advance.. just getting close.. 13 days and a wakeup :)
>
> Jerry Moore
> AE4PB, K3S SN # TBA
>
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Re: [Elecraft] P3 or Sub Rx?

[Don Wilhelm]

Jerry,

If you are used to a single receiver without a panadapter, then you are 
used to using your ears.
So, I would suggest that the SubRX would be the first choice for DX 
operation.  You can monitor the DX frequency in one ear and the pileup 
in the other - tuning a bit should reveal the station that the DX is 
currently working.  You can then decide your best transmit frequency, 
and the timing of your call.


OTOH, if you are used to using a panadapter and are adept at visually 
determining the station the DX is working, then the P3 may suit your 
needs better.


Of course, having both is a great advantage, but I understand if your 
budget must restrict your initial choice to one or the other.


What I am saying is to expand on your current operating experience. 
Doing a "quantum leap" to something you are not now familiar with may 
not be the best solution for you.  We all respond differently to 
stimulus, so consider what you are familiar with.  The K3 can enhance 
your horizons, but it is an easier learning curve if you do it gradually 
rather than in one giant step.


The greatest thing about Elecraft is that you can add these things 
incrementally - you do not have to decide on the "best package" at the 
start.  Begin where you think is the best minimum package for you, and 
add to that after you have experience and budget to take advantage of 
other options to add to your operating enjoyment.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 8/22/2015 9:38 PM, ae...@carolinaheli.com wrote:

Just wondering what DXers who have the K3/K3s think. My main mode will be CW
with my objective being DX primarily. With this in mind it's been suggested
that the P3 would be more useful than the SubReceiver. I'm starting to
rethink that and just wondering which is the most useful for DX? I won't be
getting the SVGA adapter unless I get it pre-owned and need it.




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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Jim Brown]

On Sat,8/22/2015 5:17 PM, Richard W. Solomon wrote:

It seems to me that using a DB-9 connector for non-RS232 uses is taking the 
Easy way out. There are numerous other connectors that could be used to 
alleviate any Misunderstanding.


I see it quite differently. The K2 was a kit, designed to be built by 
mere mortals, not machines. The DB-series connectors are widely 
available from good industrial sources and are easy to work on. There's 
also the matter of panel real estate. Yes, there are other connectors, 
but I can't think of a decent alternative that fits the above objectives.


73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Richard W. Solomon]

You say Tomato, I say Tomatoe.

73, Dick, W1KSZ

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim
Brown
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2015 9:15 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

On Sat,8/22/2015 5:17 PM, Richard W. Solomon wrote:
> It seems to me that using a DB-9 connector for non-RS232 uses is taking
the Easy way out. There are numerous other connectors that could be used to
alleviate any Misunderstanding.

I see it quite differently. The K2 was a kit, designed to be built by mere
mortals, not machines. The DB-series connectors are widely available from
good industrial sources and are easy to work on. There's also the matter of
panel real estate. Yes, there are other connectors, but I can't think of a
decent alternative that fits the above objectives.

73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Mickey Baker]

RJ45 is commonly used for RS232C. Millions of Cisco routers and switches built 
over the past 20+ years use this arrangement, as do many other devices. I have 
a half dozen of these cables - they once were shipped with the router. Although 
I don't know for sure, I'll bet the pinout is the same as Cisco. 

I can make up 10 RJ45 connectors in the time it takes to make a soldered DB9. 

Historically, RS232 was used in electromagnetic applications where there was a 
need to drive a relay with line levels. Since modern equipment doesn't need 
this - since TTL became commonplace in the 1970's - and since many lower power 
devices no longer have 12V power supplies, it has been practice to observe a 
ONE state at a voltage of 3V+. 

If you really want some detail, check out the data sheet on your favorite RS232 
driver chip. Here's an example:
http://cds.linear.com/docs/en/datasheet/11801afb.pdf

73,

Mickey N4MB

> On Aug 22, 2015, at 8:31 PM, Bob McGraw - K4TAX  wrote:
> 
> The K3S has a RJ-45 connector for the RS-232 communications.  Now that's 
> different!   Of course they supply a cable with a RJ-45 on one end and a 
> DB-9F on the other.  And then to keep everybody happy, there is what appears 
> to be a 15 pin VGA connector that is the ACC connector to provide band data 
> and such.  The manual clearly states "This is not a VGA video connector".
> 
> Yes it is very important to read and understand the manual before plugging or 
> inserting any connector into any hole on any radio today.  It seems most hams 
> think if it plugs in, then it should work.
> 
> 73
> Bob, K4TAX
> K3S s/n 10,163
> 
>> On 8/22/2015 7:17 PM, Richard W. Solomon wrote:
>> It seems to me that using a DB-9 connector for non-RS232 uses is taking the
>> Easy way out.
>> There are numerous other connectors that could be used to alleviate any
>> Misunderstanding.
>> 
>> Not everyone goes through manuals with a fine tooth comb to locate the
>> "gotchas".
>> 
>> 73, Dick, W1KSZ
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim
>> Brown
>> Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2015 4:25 PM
>> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair
>> 
>> Hi Floyd,
>> 
>> I've owned and operated a pair of K2s, both of which I bought used.
>> Elecraft makes it very clear that the DB9 connector on the K2 is NOT an
>> RS232 interface, that it is not RS232 compliant, and that a standard
>> RS232 cable should NOT be used. Rather, the DB9 connector provides both
>> serial control AND several control functions.
>> 
>> The DB9 connector is a generic part, and can be used for many things besides
>> RS232.  It is also well known that while the RS232 Standard defines voltage
>> levels, MANY modern products produce far less than those levels.
>> 
>> I've owned a lot of gear in my lifetime, and the first thing I do is open
>> the manual, study it, study the wiring of the various connectors, study the
>> specs, and study the operating instructions.
>> 
>> 73, Jim K9YC
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sat,8/22/2015 1:28 PM, Floyd Sense wrote:
>>> Hi Don. I'm sure you're aware that the RS232 spec includes the
>>> description of voltage levels, and if you're going to refer to an
>>> interface as RS232 (as Elecraft does in many places) then you're
>>> implying that the normal RS232 signal levels will be used.  A user
>>> shouldn't be required to read a one hundred page manual before
>>> plugging in a connector when every other such connector works in the
>>> conventional way.  Having been a designer using RS232 interfaces 45
>>> years ago, I would have been executed had I designed something like this.
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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Jim Brown]

On Sat,8/22/2015 9:28 PM, Richard W. Solomon wrote:

You say Tomato, I say Tomatoe.


My Dad, who was from Ipswich, MA, said tomatoe. :)

73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] P3 or Sub Rx?

[Keith Onishi]

I got the SubRX first as a must item for DXing with K3, because I have another 
TRX with dual receiver capability. One of my friends got P3 and has repeatedly 
talked about P3 how it has excellently and effectively worked on chasing DX 
stations. Almost one year from having got my K3, I decided to add P3 to my K3. 
Now, my K3 with both the SubRX and P3 is my main gear for DXing.
I would suggest to have the SubRX first. Of course, having both is the best.

73 de JH3SIF, Keith


2015/08/23 10:38、  のメッセージ:

> Just wondering what DXers who have the K3/K3s think. My main mode will be CW
> with my objective being DX primarily. With this in mind it's been suggested
> that the P3 would be more useful than the SubReceiver. I'm starting to
> rethink that and just wondering which is the most useful for DX? I won't be
> getting the SVGA adapter unless I get it pre-owned and need it.
> 
> Thanks in advance.. just getting close.. 13 days and a wakeup :)
> 
> Jerry Moore
> AE4PB, K3S SN # TBA
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

[Richard W. Solomon]

Not to flog this horse any further, but I direct you to page 85 of the K2 
Manual where the DB-9 connector is labeled ..."RS-232 and AUX I/O"... .

Is it RS-232 or not ??? Is it mis-labeled  

73, Dick, W1KSZ

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Mickey
Baker
Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2015 9:32 PM
To: Bob McGraw - K4TAX
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair

RJ45 is commonly used for RS232C. Millions of Cisco routers and switches
built over the past 20+ years use this arrangement, as do many other
devices. I have a half dozen of these cables - they once were shipped with
the router. Although I don't know for sure, I'll bet the pinout is the same
as Cisco. 

I can make up 10 RJ45 connectors in the time it takes to make a soldered
DB9. 

Historically, RS232 was used in electromagnetic applications where there was
a need to drive a relay with line levels. Since modern equipment doesn't
need this - since TTL became commonplace in the 1970's - and since many
lower power devices no longer have 12V power supplies, it has been practice
to observe a ONE state at a voltage of 3V+. 

If you really want some detail, check out the data sheet on your favorite
RS232 driver chip. Here's an example:
http://cds.linear.com/docs/en/datasheet/11801afb.pdf

73,

Mickey N4MB

> On Aug 22, 2015, at 8:31 PM, Bob McGraw - K4TAX 
wrote:
> 
> The K3S has a RJ-45 connector for the RS-232 communications.  Now that's
different!   Of course they supply a cable with a RJ-45 on one end and a
DB-9F on the other.  And then to keep everybody happy, there is what appears
to be a 15 pin VGA connector that is the ACC connector to provide band data
and such.  The manual clearly states "This is not a VGA video connector".
> 
> Yes it is very important to read and understand the manual before plugging
or inserting any connector into any hole on any radio today.  It seems most
hams think if it plugs in, then it should work.
> 
> 73
> Bob, K4TAX
> K3S s/n 10,163
> 
>> On 8/22/2015 7:17 PM, Richard W. Solomon wrote:
>> It seems to me that using a DB-9 connector for non-RS232 uses is 
>> taking the Easy way out.
>> There are numerous other connectors that could be used to alleviate 
>> any Misunderstanding.
>> 
>> Not everyone goes through manuals with a fine tooth comb to locate 
>> the "gotchas".
>> 
>> 73, Dick, W1KSZ
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of 
>> Jim Brown
>> Sent: Saturday, August 22, 2015 4:25 PM
>> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
>> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KPA100 RS232 interface repair
>> 
>> Hi Floyd,
>> 
>> I've owned and operated a pair of K2s, both of which I bought used.
>> Elecraft makes it very clear that the DB9 connector on the K2 is NOT 
>> an
>> RS232 interface, that it is not RS232 compliant, and that a standard
>> RS232 cable should NOT be used. Rather, the DB9 connector provides 
>> both serial control AND several control functions.
>> 
>> The DB9 connector is a generic part, and can be used for many things 
>> besides RS232.  It is also well known that while the RS232 Standard 
>> defines voltage levels, MANY modern products produce far less than those
levels.
>> 
>> I've owned a lot of gear in my lifetime, and the first thing I do is 
>> open the manual, study it, study the wiring of the various 
>> connectors, study the specs, and study the operating instructions.
>> 
>> 73, Jim K9YC
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sat,8/22/2015 1:28 PM, Floyd Sense wrote:
>>> Hi Don. I'm sure you're aware that the RS232 spec includes the 
>>> description of voltage levels, and if you're going to refer to an 
>>> interface as RS232 (as Elecraft does in many places) then you're 
>>> implying that the normal RS232 signal levels will be used.  A user 
>>> shouldn't be required to read a one hundred page manual before 
>>> plugging in a connector when every other such connector works in the 
>>> conventional way.  Having been a designer using RS232 interfaces 45 
>>> years ago, I would have been executed had I designed something like
this.
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> 
> 

Re: [Elecraft] normal K3 voltage drop on TX

[aj4tf]

Bob,
Crimped connections are superior to soldered connections in a high
vibration, high stress environment. 
The solder will fracture after exposure to vibration and/or temperature
cycles. With a proper crimp tool
(not the one from Harbor Freight!) the resistance of a proper crimped
connection will be no higher than 
that of a soldered connection.   The TE/Amp PROIII hand crimp tool is $213
at Digikey...The Amphenol 
hex die crimper for RG-8, RG213, etc. is $112.

But, soldered connections are fine for a ham shack.

de AJ4TF 






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