Re: [Elecraft] K3 - AFSK anamoly? No replies, try again

[Richard Ferch]

Don, as described that was NOT the opposite sideband. On the video the 
stronger signal was at 14091.883 kHz on the dial. That is the frequency 
of the mark tone; the space tone would have been at 14091.713 kHz. The 
pitch in use was 915 Hz mark, so the suppressed carrier frequency would 
be 14092.798 kHz and the center of the filter bandpass (the notch in the 
dual passband filter pattern) would be at 14091.798 kHz (1000 Hz below 
the suppressed carrier).


The second slightly weaker signal in the video was at 14091.720 kHz, 
i.e. the higher of its two tones was virtually coincident with the lower 
of the two tones from the first signal, and the second tone would be 170 
Hz lower, at 14091.650 kHz.


A true opposite sideband signal response would have been at 
14093.713/14093.883 kHz, nowhere near what was observed.


This resembles audio IMD more than an opposite sideband response. For 
example, a heavily overdriven audio signal with two overlapping 
simultaneous tones at 915 Hz and 1085 Hz might develop spurs at 745 Hz 
and/or 1255 Hz, and one of those spurs combined with one of the intended 
tones in the first signal would look a lot like the second signal in the 
video.


My next question would be, do you see something similar if the dual 
passband filter option is turned off, or only when it is turned on? I am 
wondering whether some kind of aliasing phenomenon could exist in the 
dual passband filter that might account for this.


73,
Rich VE3KI


W3FPR wrote:


For strong signals the filtering may let some of the opposite sideband
get through the filters.
What is the relative S-meter reading for the true sideband and the
opposite sideband?


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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Alan]

On 2/18/2016 9:52 PM, Scott Manthe wrote:

At more than $6000 per unit (in 2006 dollars), I'm not sure 600 people
would pony up the cash.


That's only $4 per watt, not too bad.  The KXPA100-F is twice that!  :=)

Alan N1AL


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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Clay Autery]

One amp to rule then all... I'd sell blood, body parts and my mountain
bike to have one...

And in response to the other guy...  not a fanboi...  just appreciate
nice stuff.

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(318) 518-1389

On 2/18/2016 9:52 PM, Scott Manthe wrote:
> At more than $6000 per unit (in 2006 dollars), I'm not sure 600 people
> would pony up the cash. I saw the both KPA800 and KPA1500 at Dayton
> and that's the closest I've come to actually drooling over a piece of
> amateur gear. The KPA1500 TXed 1800 watts into a dummy load for the
> entire hamfest. I'd love to have one. It'd be fun to know who has the
> demo units, I could come up with a Harley to trade... :)
>
> 73,
> Scott N9AA
>
>
> On 2/18/16 9:29 PM, Clay Autery wrote:
>> If there were 600 folks willing to pony up the cash to pre-order, I'll
>> bet they might consider dusting that shelf off and pulling it down for
>> some production planning.
>>
>> I'd do it...  only 599 to go.  
>>
>> __
>> Clay Autery, KG5LKV
>> (318) 518-1389
>>
>>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Scott Manthe]

At more than $6000 per unit (in 2006 dollars), I'm not sure 600 people 
would pony up the cash. I saw the both KPA800 and KPA1500 at Dayton and 
that's the closest I've come to actually drooling over a piece of 
amateur gear. The KPA1500 TXed 1800 watts into a dummy load for the 
entire hamfest. I'd love to have one. It'd be fun to know who has the 
demo units, I could come up with a Harley to trade... :)


73,
Scott N9AA


On 2/18/16 9:29 PM, Clay Autery wrote:

If there were 600 folks willing to pony up the cash to pre-order, I'll
bet they might consider dusting that shelf off and pulling it down for
some production planning.

I'd do it...  only 599 to go.  

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(318) 518-1389




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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Michael Cozzi]

Well, I really dislike fanboism. But the Elecraft equipment I own 
is outstanding.


So I'm two.

598

Michael KD8TUT

On 2/18/2016 9:29 PM, Clay Autery wrote:

If there were 600 folks willing to pony up the cash to pre-order, I'll
bet they might consider dusting that shelf off and pulling it down for
some production planning.

I'd do it...  only 599 to go.  

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Clay Autery, KG5LKV
(318) 518-1389

On 2/18/2016 7:31 PM, Gary wrote:

And shelved. Not about to see the light of day anytime soon.

Gary

-Original Message-
From: "Steve" 
Sent: ‎19/‎02/‎2016 11:18 AM
To: "Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS" 
Cc: "elecraft@mailman.qth.net" 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

In Dayton - 7 or 8 years ago, Elecraft was quietly showing what I recall was a 
1.5kw solid state amp - perhaps as much as 2kw?  Anyway they were running it 
key down into a dummy load at the FDIM hotel (I think it dimmed the lights on 
the floor).  While it did not look like a prototype, it evidently was a “proof 
of concept”.  I thought they were seeking FCC approval at the time… but nothing 
seen since then.

73,
Steve
aa8af


On Feb 18, 2016, at 12:38 PM, Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS  wrote:

Hi all,

I am so sorry to bother you over here.
Is there any rumour about the fat brother of KPA500... something like
KPA1500 or so, please?

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - AFSK anamoly? No replies, try again

[Mike Murray]

Don,

If I recall correctly, the main signal was around S9 and the image at S7 or
so.

Mike

On Thu, Feb 18, 2016 at 5:30 PM, Don Wilhelm  wrote:

> Mike,
>
> For strong signals the filtering may let some of the opposite sideband get
> through the filters.
> What is the relative S-meter reading for the true sideband and the
> opposite sideband?
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 2/18/2016 11:56 AM, Mike Murray wrote:
>
>> After doing some more testing in last weekends RTTY contest, it appears
>> that I made an erroneous statement as to what I was hearing and where.
>> What I found is that as I tune down in frequency and find a signal that
>> will decode, if I then tune down another 170 Hz I'll hear the inverted
>> signal.  Still using dual passband DSP filter at 400 Hz and 400 Hz, 8 pole
>> roofing filter as before.  I have a brief video on uTube showing the
>> effect
>> at:
>>
>>
>>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Clay Autery]

If there were 600 folks willing to pony up the cash to pre-order, I'll
bet they might consider dusting that shelf off and pulling it down for
some production planning.

I'd do it...  only 599 to go.  

__
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(318) 518-1389

On 2/18/2016 7:31 PM, Gary wrote:
> And shelved. Not about to see the light of day anytime soon.
> 
> Gary
>
> -Original Message-
> From: "Steve" 
> Sent: ‎19/‎02/‎2016 11:18 AM
> To: "Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS" 
> Cc: "elecraft@mailman.qth.net" 
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500
>
> In Dayton - 7 or 8 years ago, Elecraft was quietly showing what I recall was 
> a 1.5kw solid state amp - perhaps as much as 2kw?  Anyway they were running 
> it key down into a dummy load at the FDIM hotel (I think it dimmed the lights 
> on the floor).  While it did not look like a prototype, it evidently was a 
> “proof of concept”.  I thought they were seeking FCC approval at the time… 
> but nothing seen since then. 
>
> 73,
> Steve
> aa8af
>
>> On Feb 18, 2016, at 12:38 PM, Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS  wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I am so sorry to bother you over here.
>> Is there any rumour about the fat brother of KPA500... something like
>> KPA1500 or so, please?
> __
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Gary]

And shelved. Not about to see the light of day anytime soon.

Gary

-Original Message-
From: "Steve" 
Sent: ‎19/‎02/‎2016 11:18 AM
To: "Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS" 
Cc: "elecraft@mailman.qth.net" 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

In Dayton - 7 or 8 years ago, Elecraft was quietly showing what I recall was a 
1.5kw solid state amp - perhaps as much as 2kw?  Anyway they were running it 
key down into a dummy load at the FDIM hotel (I think it dimmed the lights on 
the floor).  While it did not look like a prototype, it evidently was a “proof 
of concept”.  I thought they were seeking FCC approval at the time… but nothing 
seen since then. 

73,
Steve
aa8af

> On Feb 18, 2016, at 12:38 PM, Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I am so sorry to bother you over here.
> Is there any rumour about the fat brother of KPA500... something like
> KPA1500 or so, please?

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Anthony Scandurra]

You can see pictures here:

http://www.n6ie.com/Elecraft.html

73, Tony K4QE

On Thu, Feb 18, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Steve  wrote:

> In Dayton - 7 or 8 years ago, Elecraft was quietly showing what I recall
> was a 1.5kw solid state amp - perhaps as much as 2kw?  Anyway they were
> running it key down into a dummy load at the FDIM hotel (I think it dimmed
> the lights on the floor).  While it did not look like a prototype, it
> evidently was a “proof of concept”.  I thought they were seeking FCC
> approval at the time… but nothing seen since then.
>
> 73,
> Steve
> aa8af
>
> > On Feb 18, 2016, at 12:38 PM, Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS  wrote:
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I am so sorry to bother you over here.
> > Is there any rumour about the fat brother of KPA500... something like
> > KPA1500 or so, please?
>
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Steve]

In Dayton - 7 or 8 years ago, Elecraft was quietly showing what I recall was a 
1.5kw solid state amp - perhaps as much as 2kw?  Anyway they were running it 
key down into a dummy load at the FDIM hotel (I think it dimmed the lights on 
the floor).  While it did not look like a prototype, it evidently was a “proof 
of concept”.  I thought they were seeking FCC approval at the time… but nothing 
seen since then. 

73,
Steve
aa8af

> On Feb 18, 2016, at 12:38 PM, Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I am so sorry to bother you over here.
> Is there any rumour about the fat brother of KPA500... something like
> KPA1500 or so, please?

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - AFSK anamoly? No replies, try again

[Don Wilhelm]

Mike,

For strong signals the filtering may let some of the opposite sideband 
get through the filters.
What is the relative S-meter reading for the true sideband and the 
opposite sideband?


73,
Don W3FPR

On 2/18/2016 11:56 AM, Mike Murray wrote:

After doing some more testing in last weekends RTTY contest, it appears
that I made an erroneous statement as to what I was hearing and where.
What I found is that as I tune down in frequency and find a signal that
will decode, if I then tune down another 170 Hz I'll hear the inverted
signal.  Still using dual passband DSP filter at 400 Hz and 400 Hz, 8 pole
roofing filter as before.  I have a brief video on uTube showing the effect
at:




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Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Knob Removal

[Clay Autery]

Search Google for "non-marring trim tool"...  go crazy...

Here is a set available at your local Harbor Freight for $8.00.

Second from the left should work nicely.

http://www.harborfreight.com/5-piece-auto-trim-and-molding-tool-set-67021.html

__
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(318) 518-1389

On 2/18/2016 3:39 PM, Al Gulseth wrote:
> Ken,
>
> Do you happen to know the mfg/part # of the tool? Is it metal or plastic?
>
> TNX/73, Al
>
> On Thu February 18 2016 1:19:25 pm elecraft-requ...@mailman.qth.net wrote:
>> You might consider investing in an inexpensive automotive trim removal
>> tool. The one I use from Advance Auto is non-marring and has multiple edges
>> for sliding into the tiniest apertures - you know the crack in which you
>> tried to use that screwdriver and messed up the powder coat finish?
>> Ken - ke4rg
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Jim Miller]

On Thu, Feb 18, 2016 at 7:14 PM, Clay Autery  wrote:

> IF y'all make them, I am FIRST on the list of pre-orders.  :-)
>


Ahem, no cuts in line. It starts back there...

:-)

jim ab3cv
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Clay Autery]

REALLY would like one of those in the 1500 trim...  Maybe a "Limited
Edition".  I'd rather have an Elecraft HP PA, than any other maker...
and the bit about the substantial overhead gets me wanting to write a check!

IF y'all make them, I am FIRST on the list of pre-orders.  :-)

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On 2/18/2016 2:47 PM, Ken K6MR wrote:
> No rumors. Best we can do is photos of the original prototype.
>
> http://www.n6ie.com/Elecraft.html
>
> Maybe someday…
>
> Ken K6MR
>
> From: Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS
> Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2016 09:39
> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: [Elecraft] KPA1500
>
> Hi all,
>
> I am so sorry to bother you over here.
> Is there any rumour about the fat brother of KPA500... something like
> KPA1500 or so, please?
>
> best regards,
> 73 - Petr, OK1RP
>
>
>
>
> -
> http://ok1rp.blogspot.com
> --
> View this message in context: 
> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/KPA1500-tp7614288.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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[Elecraft] KIO3 Wanted

[John Perlick]

I need a KIO3 to repair a K3.  If you upgrade to the K3S, you have an extra.  
Please make me an offer for your used KIO3.

John K0UM
Jperlick at ariacorp dot com
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - AFSK anamoly? No replies, try again

[Joe Subich, W4TV]

Are you *absolutely sure* you are using the 400 Hz IF filter?  By ear,
it sounds as if you have a wider IF filter that is centered on the
carrier and allowing the image to reach the DSP.

Since your display shows FL4, is it possible that you have all your
filters reversed?

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV


On 2/18/2016 11:56 AM, Mike Murray wrote:

After doing some more testing in last weekends RTTY contest, it appears
that I made an erroneous statement as to what I was hearing and where.
What I found is that as I tune down in frequency and find a signal that
will decode, if I then tune down another 170 Hz I'll hear the inverted
signal.  Still using dual passband DSP filter at 400 Hz and 400 Hz, 8 pole
roofing filter as before.  I have a brief video on uTube showing the effect
at:

*http://tinyurl.com/hxykq9c *

Anyone have additional thoughts as to what's causing this or where I should
look next?

Mike - W0AG

On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 9:41 PM, Wes (N7WS)  wrote:


Assuming that when the OP says "tuning" he is turning the VFO knob, then
here's my take.  All of the worry about roofing filters (gad how I hate
that term) is for nothing. The crystal filters in conjunction with
so-called hardware AGC are there to protect the delicate 2nd mixer from
overload in the presence of strong signals. (Conventional wisdom says
"protect the DSP" but the mixer is way weaker than the DSP. )

Absent that condition, the demodulation BW is set in DSP and non-hardware
AGC is developed in that same bandwidth.  Depending upon the strength of
the desired signal and AGC threshold and slope, some amount of AGC will be
developed when the desired signal is within the DSP BW.  Hence there is
some amount of gain reduction in play.  When you tune to the opposite
sideband, that AGC gain reduction goes away, raising the amplitude of the
unwanted sideband with respect to the desired signal.  In other words, you
cannot measure opposite sideband rejection unless 1) the gain remains
constant or 2) some amount of known attenuation is included and accounted
for in the calculation.  This is pretty much what Lyle was talking about
earlier.

One more thing.  If we understand that a superhetrodyne receiver is
nothing more than a narrow BPF that can be tuned over the spectrum then
that "roofing filter" that overlays the DSP filter tunes right along with
it.   The belief that somehow when you tune "below zero beat" the crystal
filter stays put while the DSP passband moves is silly.

Wes  N7WS




On 1/7/2016 3:24 PM, Mike Murray wrote:


Joe, et.al.,

I finally got back to the shack to check the setup.  It looks like I was
actually using a 1.8 kHz SSB roofing filter in conjunction with the 500 Hz
dual PB DSP filter.  I also checked the filter offsets which were all at
0.0 (all 8 pole) and I was using AFSK A mode.  Is the effect I'm seeing
due
to use of the 1.8 filter or do I have more research to do?

Thanks for everyone's input and patience - seems like the learning curve
is
getting worse with age.

Mike - W0AG

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 6:14 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV
wrote:

Since I'm new to RTTY, I probably didn't describe my question in



correct terminology - I mainly only operate CW. I'll try again

And I'll ask my questions again ... what *ROOFING FILTER* and what DSP

bandwidth are you using?

As Eric said in reply to your posting, this sounds like the offset is
incorrect on the roofing filter and allowing you to tune "past" zero
beat.  This is particularly true if you are using the SSB filter and
a wide DSP setting instead of the more typical CW filter (500 Hz)
centered on the mark/space tones (915/1085 Hz in your case).

Note: RTTY is typically lower sideband with MARK being the lower audio
tone and space being the higher audio tone because of the "reversal"
that occurs in the audio to RF translation.  In the K3 AFSK A is LSB
but DATA A is USB ... if you are using them interchangeably that may
also be causing you some confusion.

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 1/6/2016 6:47 PM, Mike Murray wrote:

Bob, Joe, Bill & Mike,


Since I'm new to RTTY, I probably didn't describe my question in correct
terminology - I mainly only operate CW.  I'll try again

I'm using DATA A/AFSK A, setup for low tones (915/170) and the RTTY
dual-PB
filter.  To illustrate what I'm hearing/seeing, imagine tuning down from
14.090 until you hear and can decode an RTTY signal.  Then continue
tuning
down 915 Hz (to what I probably erroneously referred to as zero beat)
and
then down another 915 Hz, I can now hear the same signal but inverted
(slightly weaker, but definitely there).  It is not decodeable, but it
is
definitely there.  I assumed (yeah, I know) that the opposite sideband
should be suppresed, but I think that's what I'm hearing.  Any advice
will
be appreciated.

Mike - W0AG

__





__

Re: [Elecraft] KX3 Knob Removal

[Al Gulseth]

Ken,

Do you happen to know the mfg/part # of the tool? Is it metal or plastic?

TNX/73, Al

On Thu February 18 2016 1:19:25 pm elecraft-requ...@mailman.qth.net wrote:
>
> You might consider investing in an inexpensive automotive trim removal
> tool. The one I use from Advance Auto is non-marring and has multiple edges
> for sliding into the tiniest apertures - you know the crack in which you
> tried to use that screwdriver and messed up the powder coat finish?
> Ken - ke4rg
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[Elecraft] Cooling fan for KX3

[Jim Rodenkirch]

Instead of spending oodles of bucks for a 3rd party heat sink (for the few
times I key up the KX3 a lot over short periods of time, e.g., CQ 160 CW
contest, JT9/JT65 modes) I was thinkin' of utilizing a small fan, mounted in
some fashion, to provide some extra cooling..anyone done that?

Pics of what you did would be appreciated - reply off line...72 de Jim R.
K9JWV



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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Ken K6MR]

No rumors. Best we can do is photos of the original prototype.

http://www.n6ie.com/Elecraft.html

Maybe someday…

Ken K6MR

From: Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS
Sent: Thursday, February 18, 2016 09:39
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] KPA1500

Hi all,

I am so sorry to bother you over here.
Is there any rumour about the fat brother of KPA500... something like
KPA1500 or so, please?

best regards,
73 - Petr, OK1RP




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[Elecraft] K3/100 For Sale

[Jim Shaw]

I have upgraded to the new K3S and have my K3/100 for sale.  I purchased it
as a kit, S/N 5508, on 5/27/11.  It's been in a non-smoking environment
sharing a desktop with two other HF rigs, so it has not seen full-time duty.
The following are included:

K3/100 - paid 1900
KAT3 ATU - paid 300
KXV3A RX Ant., IF Out and Xverter Interface - paid 110
KFL3A 1.8kHz 8-pole roofing filter - paid 131
KFL3A 2.1kHz 8-pole roofing filter - paid 131
KFL3A 2.8kHz 8-pole roofing filter-2.7 swap - paid 121
KFL3A 6.0kHz 8-pole filter - paid 131
KBPF3 Gen Coverage RX Module - paid 140
PR6 6m Preamp - paid 150
Original box, Elecraft/Cady manuals, Nifty manual.

I also did the 12VDC OUT Current Modification to power the P3 Video/FFT
Adapter.  I am keeping the MH-2 mic and P3 to go with the K3S.

My cost then was roughly $3,100, cost now for similar K3S, albeit better
specs, roughly $4,200.  I'm asking $2500 plus shipping from Dayton, Ohio.
If interested, please e-mail me at jsh...@woh.rr.com.  Prefer PayPal.  Thanx
for your time.

73
Jim
AL7BA

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Re: [Elecraft] Audio Mixer in the Ham Shack

[Mark Goldberg]

I also use a mixer and I use a bigger one, a Behringer 1622FX. It has
two stereo mixing busses, Main and Sub, so really four channels. You
can route any input to either or both and fade from left to right as
you wish. I have all the sources from rigs and the PC sound card and
mics going to inputs.

I route anything I want to transmit with to the Main mix and take
those outputs, through attenuators to the inputs to the rigs, in my
case, left to one rig and right to the other.

I route anything I want to hear to the Sub mix and have the headphones
and external speakers connected to that. This is very flexible, I
guess I could even set up a crossband repeater where it was legal to
do so! The sub mix also goes to a tape out to the pc sound card input,
so I can record off the air and play back what was recorded.

There are many mixers with this type of setup. I bought this one used
on Craigslist. It does not have a USB interface, which is desirable,
so it was not too expensive.

I also use the usb audio interface to the rig, in my case another
manufacture's but the K3s has usb also. You wind up with many sound
cards in the PC, and most programs allow you to choose the input and
output sound card.

If you screw up with the selections you can get awful feedback!

73,

Mark
W7MLG

On Thu, Feb 18, 2016 at 9:12 AM, Joe DeVincentis  wrote:
> I’m using a mixing board for my setup as well.  I used a SoundCraft EPM-8 
> (EPM-6) will also work.  The 8 says 8 channels, but it’s really 12.  8 mono 
> and 2 stereo.  Right now I only have  KX3, a nice used K3 is in the very near 
> future and is why I set this up.
>
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Re: [Elecraft] KPA1500

[Amateur Radio Operator N5GE]

On Thu, 18 Feb 2016 10:38:03 -0700 (MST), you wrote:

No.

>Hi all,
>
>I am so sorry to bother you over here.
>Is there any rumour about the fat brother of KPA500... something like
>KPA1500 or so, please?
>
>best regards,
>73 - Petr, OK1RP
>
>
>
>
>-
>http://ok1rp.blogspot.com

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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 Standby to Operate problem

[Mark Goldberg]

Is there an asterisk on the display of the KPA500? If there is, it
thinks it is in TX mode even if the rig is not in transmit. I had that
problem and it was a poorly soldered resistor on the front panel
board, but a shorted TX line (RCA cable) would do the same thing.
Elecraft replaced the board. You should not have an asterisk when you
switch to operate until you key the transmitter.

Hope this helps.

73,

Mark
W7MLG

On Thu, Feb 18, 2016 at 8:41 AM, Michael Shortland
 wrote:
> My KPA500 [#934] has developed a fault in Receive mode.   The strength of the 
> signal received by the K3 driving the amplifier reduces significantly when 
> the KPA500 is switched from Standby to Operate using the front panel 
> pushbutton.  The S meter displays a 3 to 5  ‘S’ point reduction in signal 
> strength on all bands when this happens.   The amplifier appears to operate 
> correctly in all other respects and will deliver 500W to my KAT500.No 
> fault is indicated on the amplifier front panel.
>
> Is this a known problem, eg a faulty TR Switch?
>
> 73 Mike G0EFO
>
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
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[Elecraft] KPA1500

[Petr, OK1RP/M0SIS]

Hi all,

I am so sorry to bother you over here.
Is there any rumour about the fat brother of KPA500... something like
KPA1500 or so, please?

best regards,
73 - Petr, OK1RP




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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - AFSK anamoly? No replies, try again

[Mike Murray]

After doing some more testing in last weekends RTTY contest, it appears
that I made an erroneous statement as to what I was hearing and where.
What I found is that as I tune down in frequency and find a signal that
will decode, if I then tune down another 170 Hz I'll hear the inverted
signal.  Still using dual passband DSP filter at 400 Hz and 400 Hz, 8 pole
roofing filter as before.  I have a brief video on uTube showing the effect
at:

*http://tinyurl.com/hxykq9c *

Anyone have additional thoughts as to what's causing this or where I should
look next?

Mike - W0AG

On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 9:41 PM, Wes (N7WS)  wrote:

> Assuming that when the OP says "tuning" he is turning the VFO knob, then
> here's my take.  All of the worry about roofing filters (gad how I hate
> that term) is for nothing. The crystal filters in conjunction with
> so-called hardware AGC are there to protect the delicate 2nd mixer from
> overload in the presence of strong signals. (Conventional wisdom says
> "protect the DSP" but the mixer is way weaker than the DSP. )
>
> Absent that condition, the demodulation BW is set in DSP and non-hardware
> AGC is developed in that same bandwidth.  Depending upon the strength of
> the desired signal and AGC threshold and slope, some amount of AGC will be
> developed when the desired signal is within the DSP BW.  Hence there is
> some amount of gain reduction in play.  When you tune to the opposite
> sideband, that AGC gain reduction goes away, raising the amplitude of the
> unwanted sideband with respect to the desired signal.  In other words, you
> cannot measure opposite sideband rejection unless 1) the gain remains
> constant or 2) some amount of known attenuation is included and accounted
> for in the calculation.  This is pretty much what Lyle was talking about
> earlier.
>
> One more thing.  If we understand that a superhetrodyne receiver is
> nothing more than a narrow BPF that can be tuned over the spectrum then
> that "roofing filter" that overlays the DSP filter tunes right along with
> it.   The belief that somehow when you tune "below zero beat" the crystal
> filter stays put while the DSP passband moves is silly.
>
> Wes  N7WS
>
>
>
>
> On 1/7/2016 3:24 PM, Mike Murray wrote:
>
>> Joe, et.al.,
>>
>> I finally got back to the shack to check the setup.  It looks like I was
>> actually using a 1.8 kHz SSB roofing filter in conjunction with the 500 Hz
>> dual PB DSP filter.  I also checked the filter offsets which were all at
>> 0.0 (all 8 pole) and I was using AFSK A mode.  Is the effect I'm seeing
>> due
>> to use of the 1.8 filter or do I have more research to do?
>>
>> Thanks for everyone's input and patience - seems like the learning curve
>> is
>> getting worse with age.
>>
>> Mike - W0AG
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 6:14 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV
>> wrote:
>>
>> Since I'm new to RTTY, I probably didn't describe my question in
>>>
 correct terminology - I mainly only operate CW. I'll try again

 And I'll ask my questions again ... what *ROOFING FILTER* and what DSP
>>> bandwidth are you using?
>>>
>>> As Eric said in reply to your posting, this sounds like the offset is
>>> incorrect on the roofing filter and allowing you to tune "past" zero
>>> beat.  This is particularly true if you are using the SSB filter and
>>> a wide DSP setting instead of the more typical CW filter (500 Hz)
>>> centered on the mark/space tones (915/1085 Hz in your case).
>>>
>>> Note: RTTY is typically lower sideband with MARK being the lower audio
>>> tone and space being the higher audio tone because of the "reversal"
>>> that occurs in the audio to RF translation.  In the K3 AFSK A is LSB
>>> but DATA A is USB ... if you are using them interchangeably that may
>>> also be causing you some confusion.
>>>
>>> 73,
>>>
>>>... Joe, W4TV
>>>
>>>
>>> On 1/6/2016 6:47 PM, Mike Murray wrote:
>>>
>>> Bob, Joe, Bill & Mike,

 Since I'm new to RTTY, I probably didn't describe my question in correct
 terminology - I mainly only operate CW.  I'll try again

 I'm using DATA A/AFSK A, setup for low tones (915/170) and the RTTY
 dual-PB
 filter.  To illustrate what I'm hearing/seeing, imagine tuning down from
 14.090 until you hear and can decode an RTTY signal.  Then continue
 tuning
 down 915 Hz (to what I probably erroneously referred to as zero beat)
 and
 then down another 915 Hz, I can now hear the same signal but inverted
 (slightly weaker, but definitely there).  It is not decodeable, but it
 is
 definitely there.  I assumed (yeah, I know) that the opposite sideband
 should be suppresed, but I think that's what I'm hearing.  Any advice
 will
 be appreciated.

 Mike - W0AG

 __

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>>>
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Re: [Elecraft] Audio Mixer in the Ham Shack

[Joe DeVincentis]

I’m using a mixing board for my setup as well.  I used a SoundCraft EPM-8 
(EPM-6) will also work.  The 8 says 8 channels, but it’s really 12.  8 mono and 
2 stereo.  Right now I only have  KX3, a nice used K3 is in the very near 
future and is why I set this up.

Channel 1: Microphone
Channel 2: Output from USB sound card
Channel 7: Receive main from KX3
Channel 8: Receive sub from KX3

Aux 1:  Mic input to KX3
Monitor Left: Left speaker
Monitor Right: Right speaker
Master Mix Left: RX Main for USB sound card
Master Mix Right: RX Sub for USB sound card

The K3s will plug in as follows:

Channel 5: Receive main from K3s
Channel 6: Receive sub from K3s
Aux2: Mic input to KX3.

I can mute individual channels, adjust volume and EQ for each. 

I can dial down the monitors so I’m not hearing the speakers if I want to be 
silent during digital modes.  Also using the faders on channel 1 and 2, I can 
mix it into the monitors during transmit so I can hear myself.

I will have make a box to switch the PTT, keyer to the proper radio.  Not a big 
deal.

The other cool thing is I can adjust what I hear in each ear of the headphones 
when running Dual watch on the KX3.  Plus I can swap the ears with a turn of 
the knob so the watch matches what I see on the PX3 (e.g. which ever frequency 
is lower goes to the left ear, the higher frequency goes to the right).  That 
way ears match the visual. 

Most of this setup came from W3YY (http://w3yy.com/audio_control_system.htm).  
He has it setup with isolators and level shifters since pro equipment runs at 
higher levels than consumer.  I also used the isolators and line level 
shifters.  Works well.

I’m planing on setting the headphone output of the computer into one of the 
stereo channels.  That way I can use the same speakers for music when I’m not 
on the radio.  

73,
Joe - KO8V

> On Feb 17, 2016, at 5:28 PM, Joel Black  wrote:
> 
> Yep, I’ve looked and there is a *lot* of information on this reflector about 
> the subject.
> 
> I have worked with David Anderson, GM4JJJ, on setting up my KX3 trying to 
> minimize the connecting and disconnecting of cables to my Focusrite 2i2 sound 
> card. The more I thought about the advice he gave me, the more curious I 
> became. I got to the point of could I connect my K3 too? Problem is that I 
> know very little about audio mixers so please go easy on me. I have been 
> reading and looking online for several days now.
> 
> I have read through Jim Brown’s, K9YC, documentation on his page and I can 
> handle what needs to be done there.
> 
> Here’s the potential scenario:
> 
> I have a K3 and a KX3. I have one sound card to share between the two of 
> them. Yes, I do realize that just adding another sound card may be the 
> simplest thing to do at this point. I have thought of that and that solution 
> is not off the table. I have the Focusrite 2i2 sound card. This is a fairly 
> new purchase and so far I am pleased with its performance. I have a mic for 
> each radio - the MH2 for the K3 and the MH3 for the KX3. I could see where 
> going to just one studio-type mic would be beneficial. With the TX and RX EQs 
> in both radios, I really do not need the parametric EQ of a mixer.
> 
> I also use an FM-only VHF radio for local repeater contacts but consider it 
> out of scope.
> 
> What I have been looking at is an 8-channel audio mixer (either the Mackie 
> ProFX8v2 or the Alesis Multimix 8 USB). My thoughts are:
> 
> Install a single mic into mic input one on the mixer. This mic would serve 
> both the K3 and the KX3.
> Have the LINE OUT from the K3 into Inputs 3 and 4
> Have the SPKR OUT from the K3 into Inputs 5 and 6
> Have the SPKR OUT from the KX3 into Inputs 7 and 8
> Have the Focusrite 2i2 LINE IN L and R to Main Out L and R on the mixer
> Have the Focusrite LINE OUT L to Input 2 on the mixer.
> 
> Now I run into trouble. The Mackie has ST (studio?) return. I could run the L 
> to LINE IN on the K3 and R to MIC IN on the K3 but I cannot figure out how to 
> get MIC IN wired to the KX3. The Alesis adds an AUX SEND. Could I use that to 
> feed the MIC IN of the KX3?
> 
> I realize this borders on off-topic for this group so if you’d rather respond 
> directly, I understand and I apologize for using the bandwidth for what may 
> seem like an off-topic subject to some.
> 
> 73,
> Joel - W4JBB
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This list 

[Elecraft] KPA500 Standby to Operate problem

[Michael Shortland]

My KPA500 [#934] has developed a fault in Receive mode.   The strength of the 
signal received by the K3 driving the amplifier reduces significantly when the 
KPA500 is switched from Standby to Operate using the front panel pushbutton.  
The S meter displays a 3 to 5  ‘S’ point reduction in signal strength on all 
bands when this happens.   The amplifier appears to operate correctly in all 
other respects and will deliver 500W to my KAT500.    No fault is indicated on 
the amplifier front panel.

Is this a known problem, eg a faulty TR Switch?

73 Mike G0EFO


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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[Elecraft] KPA 500 Standby to Operate fault

[michael...@talktalk.net]

I'm new to this mailing list and not sure if my recent question has got through 
to members. I want to know why the signal passing through my KPA500  to my K3 
on receive is attenuated by 3-5 'S' points on any band when I switch the amp 
manually from Standby to Operate. Is this a known issue and if so how can I fix 
it?

73  Mike G0EFO


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Re: [Elecraft] K3s Odd sound vibrations Edit - Hypothesis, Steps, Conclusion, and Request.

[Wes (N7WS)]

I don't think you're an idiot.  I've reported a few defects to Elecraft over the 
last 8 years.  Usually they get fixed and are sometimes folded into production.  
There are thousands of guys using K3s that include a fix that was developed 
using my radio as a prototype after I demonstrated it to an Elecraft engineer.  
(It also involved vibration by the way and two months in the Elecraft hospital)


I've had similar experiences recently with the same chorus singing, "We don't 
see it here", when I reported issues with the ARRL NPOTA website and the 
software for my DG8SAQ network analyzer.  Even posting screen shots won't 
convince some of the naysayers.  It takes one other guy saying he sees it too, 
then it gets addressed.  In the DG8SAQ case, he saw it personally and fixed the 
software.  Of course, he's competent, the ARRL problem is ongoing.


Don't let them get you down.


On 2/17/2016 4:23 PM, Jerry Moore wrote:

Anyway, I'm putting myself in time out because the general consensus seems
to be that I'm a complete idiot with a speaker buzzing sound that none of
the other 11k users can hear because they don't use the speaker even after
I've taken the time to logically and methodically spell out steps to
reproduce the issue and my findings.



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