[Elecraft] You probably do not need a K4HD for SO2R contesting

[Bob Wilson, N6TV]

Old Subject line was:  "K4 Panadapter Display"

This is in response to the post by NJ8M, excerpted below.

I've been testing a pair of K4D (not HD) radios for SO2R (Single Op Two
Radio) contesting at my QTH, which has one tower, closely-spaced monoband
antennas, and 1500W output.  I'm using Array Solutions 200W W3NQN Bandpass
filters and Top Ten Devices coax stubs.  There are two or more contest
stations on the mountains above me (K6TD's remote, and W6NL) that are
line-of-sight, and they can produce very loud signals, S9 +50 dB or more
off the back of my beams.

The front end of the K4D performs just as well, as far as I can tell, as
the two K3 radios I used before, which had 8 pole crystal filters (the
Inrad 500 Hz 8-pole crystal was my favorite).  I've heard no "AGC pumping"
or "desense" on the K4D, from either of these loud stations a few kHz away,
though I can hear their transmitted phase noise, and see it on the K4
scope.  I can transmit on one band and listen on an adjacent band, and
though I hear my harmonics or IMD for neighborhood non-linear devices in
certain directions, the K4D receiver doesn't "block" when I transmit on the
other.

As I've mentioned before, the K4D audio is a vast improvement over the K3
and K3S, which really helps when you're lucky enough to attract a pileup.
The QSK is better too, which helps when you're calling in a pileup.

Furthermore, you DO NOT need to tap multiple times to switch to the RX
antenna, as seen in the recent live demo by WA6HHQ.  What Eric did not get
to demonstrate is that there is an ANT CFG menu option that allows you to
select which antennas you want the RX ANT button to cycle through.  When
that option is selected, a single tap of the RX ANT button toggles the
receiver between the TX ANT and RX1 antennas, say, instead of popping up a
menu, so the K4D can work the same as the K3.  You can also toggle an RX
ANT in and out from the keyboard of your logging software, simply by
sending a host command with a function key. Or you can cycle through
multiple RX antennas with each tap.  The same applies to the TX antennas.

The 8 K-POD buttons can also be used to send host commands (or "macros") to
do anything you can do with a button, or several buttons.

The only time the K4HD model might be best would be when there are two rigs *on
the same band*, such as at Field Day, or at a large DXpedition, or at a
large Multi-Multi station with a RUN and MULT stations on the same band.

And, as I understand it, the plan is that a K4D can be field upgradable to
an K4HD model at a later date.  What remains to be seen, though, is if the
"ripple" in the roofing filters of the HD module introduces any pileup
mush, which was one explanation for why the K3 and K3S still had some
pileup mush, even after the K3 AGC settings and RF Gain were properly
adjusted as recommended here
.
Time will tell.  As of now, I haven't heard any pileup mush (RX IMD or
Audio IMD) in the K4D.

As for noise blanking and noise reduction, it's not something I can offer
an opinion about, because I prefer to leave both OFF, as I did on my K3.

73,
Bob, N6TV
K4 Field Tester

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 9:15 AM Morgan Bailey  wrote:


> For me I need a bomb proof front end for a high RF environment, namely
> SO2R on a city lot using the same antenna for 2 radios at the same time
> with band pass filters and multiplexers that offer 100db of rejection. To
> date no SDR only radio offers what a superhet offers. Until the HD model is
> implemented, the K4 is not the radio for me.  If I were to be a one radio
> shack radio user and not 2 for SO2R, it would be my first choice. For
> instance, the IC7300 and IC7610, both are fantastic radios. Put another RF
> source remotely near them and the ADC is overloaded and the AGC
> pumps/attacks and you hear nothing. Both are a massive failure when using
> SO2R or at Field Day. The second thing that I need, being in a large city
> is the ability of the receiver to deal with intermittent noise problems.
> Line noise and the increased noise floor that highly populated areas hit
> the front end of a receiver has to be ameliorated by the receiver.
> Algorithms for noise blanking, and digital noise reduction and a tunable
> passband capability without ringing and loss of weak signal detection is
> what is needed. That is a tall order. Narrowing down the frequency by a
> superhet front end and adding band pass filters to help with this will cut
> the work of the ADC down due to the decreased spectrum that needs to be
> converted. Then the FPGA and DSP sections do not have to process so much
> data and this should speed up the response time and will add increased
> selectivity, hopefully.  But until the HD is implemented this is not going
> to happen.
>


> Morgan Bailey NJ8M
>
>
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[Elecraft] K4 Panadaptor Display

[Ray Spreadbury via Elecraft]

As the originator of this thread I would like to comment on the answers 
received so far.

There have been suggestions that:
1. You can’t do it, except by using a quadrant monitor which can accept say 4 
inputs!
2. You can achieve a similar result by using the N1MM Spectrum Display!
3. You can do it with a bit of easily available splitter hardware!
4. You can achieve a similar result by using an SDR display with your K4!
5. You can maybe do it by using some additional software – possibly the K4RV 
remote software currently in development?

It seems to me that it would be a really good idea if Wayne or someone else 
from Elecraft could please clarify the situation and possibilities?

For completeness, my original question was:
I wonder if it is possible to show the K4 panadaptor(s) display as a separate 
floating window on the external monitor? 
So that for example you could have your logging program windows open as well as 
a separately floating K4 panadaptor display showing on the same monitor.
73 Ray G3XLG

73 Ray G3XLG

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Re: [Elecraft] You probably do not need a K4HD for SO2R contesting

[Jim Brown]

Bob is a top contester, often operates from top contesting stations, and 
I strongly value his comments. I'm not far from Bob, or W6NL and K6TD's 
remote (both mountaintop stations, line of sight). Last I heard, W6NL is 
running Yaesu rigs, lots of phase noise and clicks; I don't know what 
K6TD is running, but I suspect Flex. W0YK and K6XX are very close by, 
both mountaintops. K6XX is VERY clean, only five miles N. We can work 
500 Hz apart on CW, both running legal limit. YK and XX are also running 
K4s; I'm runing K3s with updated synth boards.


73, Jim K9YC

On 1/27/2021 12:56 AM, Bob Wilson, N6TV wrote:

Old Subject line was:  "K4 Panadapter Display"

This is in response to the post by NJ8M, excerpted below.

I've been testing a pair of K4D (not HD) radios for SO2R (Single Op Two
Radio) contesting at my QTH, which has one tower, closely-spaced monoband
antennas, and 1500W output.  I'm using Array Solutions 200W W3NQN Bandpass
filters and Top Ten Devices coax stubs.  There are two or more contest
stations on the mountains above me (K6TD's remote, and W6NL) that are
line-of-sight, and they can produce very loud signals, S9 +50 dB or more
off the back of my beams.

The front end of the K4D performs just as well, as far as I can tell, as
the two K3 radios I used before, which had 8 pole crystal filters (the
Inrad 500 Hz 8-pole crystal was my favorite).  I've heard no "AGC pumping"
or "desense" on the K4D, from either of these loud stations a few kHz away,
though I can hear their transmitted phase noise, and see it on the K4
scope.  I can transmit on one band and listen on an adjacent band, and
though I hear my harmonics or IMD for neighborhood non-linear devices in
certain directions, the K4D receiver doesn't "block" when I transmit on the
other.

As I've mentioned before, the K4D audio is a vast improvement over the K3
and K3S, which really helps when you're lucky enough to attract a pileup.
The QSK is better too, which helps when you're calling in a pileup.

Furthermore, you DO NOT need to tap multiple times to switch to the RX
antenna, as seen in the recent live demo by WA6HHQ.  What Eric did not get
to demonstrate is that there is an ANT CFG menu option that allows you to
select which antennas you want the RX ANT button to cycle through.  When
that option is selected, a single tap of the RX ANT button toggles the
receiver between the TX ANT and RX1 antennas, say, instead of popping up a
menu, so the K4D can work the same as the K3.  You can also toggle an RX
ANT in and out from the keyboard of your logging software, simply by
sending a host command with a function key. Or you can cycle through
multiple RX antennas with each tap.  The same applies to the TX antennas.

The 8 K-POD buttons can also be used to send host commands (or "macros") to
do anything you can do with a button, or several buttons.

The only time the K4HD model might be best would be when there are two rigs *on
the same band*, such as at Field Day, or at a large DXpedition, or at a
large Multi-Multi station with a RUN and MULT stations on the same band.

And, as I understand it, the plan is that a K4D can be field upgradable to
an K4HD model at a later date.  What remains to be seen, though, is if the
"ripple" in the roofing filters of the HD module introduces any pileup
mush, which was one explanation for why the K3 and K3S still had some
pileup mush, even after the K3 AGC settings and RF Gain were properly
adjusted as recommended here
.
Time will tell.  As of now, I haven't heard any pileup mush (RX IMD or
Audio IMD) in the K4D.

As for noise blanking and noise reduction, it's not something I can offer
an opinion about, because I prefer to leave both OFF, as I did on my K3.

73,
Bob, N6TV
K4 Field Tester

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 9:15 AM Morgan Bailey  wrote:



For me I need a bomb proof front end for a high RF environment, namely
SO2R on a city lot using the same antenna for 2 radios at the same time
with band pass filters and multiplexers that offer 100db of rejection. To
date no SDR only radio offers what a superhet offers. Until the HD model is
implemented, the K4 is not the radio for me.  If I were to be a one radio
shack radio user and not 2 for SO2R, it would be my first choice. For
instance, the IC7300 and IC7610, both are fantastic radios. Put another RF
source remotely near them and the ADC is overloaded and the AGC
pumps/attacks and you hear nothing. Both are a massive failure when using
SO2R or at Field Day. The second thing that I need, being in a large city
is the ability of the receiver to deal with intermittent noise problems.
Line noise and the increased noise floor that highly populated areas hit
the front end of a receiver has to be ameliorated by the receiver.
Algorithms for noise blanking, and digital noise reduction and a tunable
passband capability without ringing and loss of weak signal detection is
what is needed. That is a tall 

[Elecraft] K2.Unable to undertake VCO alignment.

[M Bak]

Issue. Unable to undertake VCO alignment. Voltage at R30 fixed at 24mV.



The VCO oscillator test (Alignment and test Part II p 63) has passed. Well
the frequency is 7.98MHz rather than 8->10 but that conceivably could be
within the bounds of measurement error.



In the VCO alignment test a DMM (Keysight U1271) clamped onto the left side
end of R30 reads 24mV no matter what the setting of L30.



I have looked everywhere over the appropriate circuitry but can see no
issues. Including triple checking T5 which is 100% wound and fitted
properly.



I made the measurements from troubleshooting (PLL Reference Oscillator and
VCO P 10) and got:-



Reference Oscillator Output  0.72

VCO Output 0.24

VCO Buffer Output 0.59

All measurements are at the low end of the acceptable range but just in
spec.





I measured voltages in the area and have noted the following:-



1. U4 (MC145170) pin 7 CLK/SCK is at 5v as against the specified 0v.

2. U4 pin 13 PDOUT is at 5v rather than 4v. This feeds the inverting
input of U6B causing the output to be low.

3. The gate input of Q18 is 0 rather than -1.





I am at a loss as to what to check next and any suggestions would be most
welcome. BTW I also have a ½ decent scope so can probe with that assuming I
can figure out what I should be seeing. The K2 is a brilliant kit but
seriously different to tube amps. which is my usual playpen.


Thanks
-- 
If you are afraid you are living in the future. If you are sad you are
living in the past. If you are content you are living in the now.
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Re: [Elecraft] Why more power-efficient at or below 3 W?

[Rick M0LEP]

That'd help to explain why I was able to eke a last QSO out of a fading 
battery by winding the power down (as mentioned in an article in this 
February's RadCom). It was the only SOTA summit-to-summit I managed that 
day, too!

Of course, next time, I'll try to remember to charge ALL my batteries 
properly before setting off up to a summit, and then also put them ALL 
in my pack

On Tue 26 Jan Wayne Burdick wrote:
> There are two windings on the PA output transformer: 1:1 and 1:4. We 
> select one of these based on power level, battery voltage, and in some 
> cases, operating mode.
> 
> In the 1:1 setting, the PA drain impedance is 50 ohms, making it more 
> efficient for at power levels, reducing current drain.
> 
> In the 1:4 setting, the PA drain impedance is 12.5 ohms; the 
> transformer steps it back up to 50 ohms for the low-pass filters. In 
> this case it's more efficient at higher power levels, at the expense 
> of higher current drain.

-- 
73, Rick, M0LEP   (KX3 #3281)

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[Elecraft] Mac/USB/K3s/FT8 Revisited

[Richard]

HELP!

If you’re using a MAC connected to a K3s via a USB CABLE in order to run WSJT-X 
(FT8)… and it works right, please e-mail me AT MY HOME E-MAIL ADDRESS:

flat...@comcast.net 

I have been struggling for a month to get it to work for me. I’ve come close, 
but no cigar. Kind reflector folks have helped a lot, but I’m still not there.

Remember —

flat...@comcast.net 

Thank you.

Richard Kunc
W4KBX
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Re: [Elecraft] Mac/USB/K3s/FT8 Revisited

[David Ferrington, M0XDF]

I am sure other Mac users (me included), would like to know of your experience. 
I haven’t tried this yet, but will do some day.
Please reply to list.
73 de David, M0XDF (K3 #174, P3 #108)
-- 
The lame man who keeps the right road outstrips the runner who takes a wrong 
one. The more active and swift the latter is, the further he will go astray.
-Francis Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) 

> On 27 Jan 2021, at 13:53, Richard  wrote:
> 
> HELP!
> 
> If you’re using a MAC connected to a K3s via a USB CABLE in order to run 
> WSJT-X (FT8)… and it works right, please e-mail me AT MY HOME E-MAIL ADDRESS:
> 
> flat...@comcast.net 
> 
> I have been struggling for a month to get it to work for me. I’ve come close, 
> but no cigar. Kind reflector folks have helped a lot, but I’m still not there.
> 
> Remember —
> 
> flat...@comcast.net 
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Richard Kunc
> W4KBX
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Re: [Elecraft] David Ferrington - Mac/USB/K3s/FT8 Revisited

[Richard]

David,

YIKES! Give me a while compress the problems and disappointment down to about 
ten pages! The USB cable approach has a lot going for it — IF you can make it 
work. I’m (still) determined to get there.

I’ll back to you ASAP.

Richard

> On Jan 27, 2021, at 9:01 AM, David Ferrington, M0XDF  
> wrote:
> 
> I am sure other Mac users (me included), would like to know of your 
> experience. I haven’t tried this yet, but will do some day.
> Please reply to list.
> 73 de David, M0XDF (K3 #174, P3 #108)
> -- 
> The lame man who keeps the right road outstrips the runner who takes a wrong 
> one. The more active and swift the latter is, the further he will go astray.
> -Francis Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) 
> 
>> On 27 Jan 2021, at 13:53, Richard > > wrote:
>> 
>> HELP!
>> 
>> If you’re using a MAC connected to a K3s via a USB CABLE in order to run 
>> WSJT-X (FT8)… and it works right, please e-mail me AT MY HOME E-MAIL ADDRESS:
>> 
>> flat...@comcast.net  > >
>> 
>> I have been struggling for a month to get it to work for me. I’ve come 
>> close, but no cigar. Kind reflector folks have helped a lot, but I’m still 
>> not there.
>> 
>> Remember —
>> 
>> flat...@comcast.net  > >
>> 
>> Thank you.
>> 
>> Richard Kunc
>> W4KBX
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>> 
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm 
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>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 
>> 
>> Message delivered to m0...@alphadene.co.uk 

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Re: [Elecraft] David Ferrington - Mac/USB/K3s/FT8 Revisited

[David Ferrington, M0XDF]

Thank you Richard
73 de David, M0XDF
-- 
There is no pillow so soft as a clear conscience. -French proverb

> On 27 Jan 2021, at 14:17, Richard  wrote:
> 
> David,
> 
> YIKES! Give me a while compress the problems and disappointment down to about 
> ten pages! The USB cable approach has a lot going for it — IF you can make it 
> work. I’m (still) determined to get there.
> 
> I’ll back to you ASAP.
> 
> Richard
> 
>> On Jan 27, 2021, at 9:01 AM, David Ferrington, M0XDF > > wrote:
>> 
>> I am sure other Mac users (me included), would like to know of your 
>> experience. I haven’t tried this yet, but will do some day.
>> Please reply to list.
>> 73 de David, M0XDF (K3 #174, P3 #108)
>> -- 
>> The lame man who keeps the right road outstrips the runner who takes a wrong 
>> one. The more active and swift the latter is, the further he will go astray.
>> -Francis Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) 

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[Elecraft] K3 KIO3B boards fix

[Randy Lake]

Anyone on the list able to check out my 3 KIO3B boards ? Elecraft has that
on backorder.
The reason for asking is that I lost comm, via USB, with the radio. The
computer sees no COM port and no Audio card.
Please ?

-- 
Randy Lake N1KWF
73 Gunn Rd.
Keene,NH
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[Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage

[Joseph Shuman via Elecraft]

There is a difference between stupidity and ignorance.  I claim ignorance.

My shack is a room in a barn attic space, separate from the house, no HVAC so 
cooling is one window and heating is a space heater (when I am working the 
waves).  Otherwise storage is ambient temp in the room.  Winter temps typically 
down to low 20s, summer up to 90s.  Sunny summer temp in the shack gets up to 
120.  My concerns are leaving the KX2 (#3007) and KXPA100 (#2802) in the shack 
and the effects of daily cycling the temp, especially in winter.  My “internet 
research” (maybe an oxymoron?) has such varied opinions it is worthless.  What 
say you, my fellow Elecraft faithful?

Keeping Watch-
shu
Joe Shuman, NZ8P

Unless someone like you 
cares a whole awful lot, 
nothing is going to get better. 
It’s not.-Dr. Seuss
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Re: [Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage

[Louandzip via Elecraft]

 My gut feel says typical steady indoor condx would be better, but I've had 
some rigs in a commercial storage unit for a number of years with no 
heating/cooling and CO ambient temps.  I'm sure it got significantly over 100F 
in there during the summer and likely into the single digits F in the winter. 
The rigs are still working FB, including 20 yo K2 and K1. I kept a FT1000MP in 
an uninsulated attic for a few years and I'm sure it got to well over 100F in 
there.  It's still FB too.

In some situations with higher humidity, daily temp variations can lead to 
condensing conditions, which I don't think would be good.  I ran into that in 
my New England garage, but didn't keep any ham gear in there. 
On Wednesday, January 27, 2021, 8:20:47 AM MST, Joseph Shuman via Elecraft 
 wrote:  
 
 There is a difference between stupidity and ignorance.  I claim ignorance.

My shack is a room in a barn attic space, separate from the house, no HVAC so 
cooling is one window and heating is a space heater (when I am working the 
waves).  Otherwise storage is ambient temp in the room.  Winter temps typically 
down to low 20s, summer up to 90s.  Sunny summer temp in the shack gets up to 
120.  My concerns are leaving the KX2 (#3007) and KXPA100 (#2802) in the shack 
and the effects of daily cycling the temp, especially in winter.  My “internet 
research” (maybe an oxymoron?) has such varied opinions it is worthless.  What 
say you, my fellow Elecraft faithful?

Keeping Watch-
shu
Joe Shuman, NZ8P

Unless someone like you 
cares a whole awful lot, 
nothing is going to get better. 
It’s not.        -Dr. Seuss
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Re: [Elecraft] WTB: P3 Panadpter

[Wes]

I never had a P3, but used an SDR-IQ running SpectraVue software as an 
alternative.  Of course it requires a computer but if you're logging on one 
already port sharing works fine.


SpectraVue "knows" the Elecraft frequency conversion and offers perfect 
tracking, demodulation (if you want it and can stand the latency) and 
point-n-click tuning. My K3S is now semi-retired and the main rig is a TS-890 
with a built-in display which is adequate, but the SDR-IQ still has better 
resolution and the other features mentioned above,  (I couldn't wait any longer 
for a K4)


Wes N7WS

On 1/26/2021 6:06 PM, Paul GACEK via Elecraft wrote:

I realize many of us are scavenging for K3 related stuff but long story short 
I’m looking for a working P3 either with or without the VGA option.

I also realize that Elecraft has an interest list but just not sure what 
timeframe (post 2021?) a P3 will be available.

In 2019, I spent a fair amount of time building a LP SO2R SSB station using 2 
sets of KX3/KX3/KXPA100 but have since moved on from that and trying a QRO 
approach based around my K3s.

See details of my madness at 
https://nomadic.blog/2019/10/22/suitcase-dxpedition-so2r-why-drive-a-boring-bmw-m-series-when-you-can-have-a-ferrari/
 


Contact me off list if you have a P3 you are will to part with or alternatively 
know where I might find one.

Paul
W6PNG/M0SNA


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Re: [Elecraft] K2.Unable to undertake VCO alignment.

[Douglas Hagerman via Elecraft]

I am suffering from a similar problem in the midst of applying the various 
upgrades. My BFO test numbers are good,
4917.13 kHz
4912.16 kHz
4.97 kHz range

but when I try the VCO linearization process, I see 11090 flash and then get 
error 232. I have not checked the VFO against a reference frequency. I have 
tried two different crystals and several different L31 values.

My planned next step is to assemble the RF probe and see if I can figure out 
what is going on.

Doug, W0UHU.

> From: M Bak mailto:mark.adrian.ba...@gmail.com>>
> 
> Issue. Unable to undertake VCO alignment. 

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Re: [Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage

[David Olean]

I would worry about condensation. I live in New England. New England is 
the only part of the country except for the coastline in WA, where there 
is a positive water budget typically. In other words, more rain falls 
than is evaporated or used up.  My ham shack is 1/2 mile from my house 
and was unheated. It was hard on the equipment.  Very hot wx was not a 
problem but cold temps and then the arrival of warmer and moist air 
would produce water droplets all over the gear.  Transformers would stay 
very cold and the water would drip off of them when the temps warmed a 
little bit.  Anything that used high voltage was subject to explosions 
if you were foolhardy to turn them on. It was all due to the water.


What I did was install a propane heater with a special thermostat that 
allowed operation down to 32 degrees. I set the temp to around 40 F.  
That keeps most of the condensation at bay. I also put in a solar heater 
on a south facing outside wall, and it pumps warmer air inside if the 
Sun is out. On a sunny winter day in January it will be 50 degrees in 
the room during the day. I have had no trouble with this setup. I am 
just about through with my 1st 100 lb propane tank and January is just 
about finished, so the cost is not too bad. You must use a vented 
propane heater. The unvented ones, or portable K1 space heaters like 
Kerosuns etc all produce water vapor and are no good for what we want.   
Maybe in a desert climate things will be different, but that is what 
works for me.


I have an unheated room as well, but only keep rugged stuff there in 
winter. Homebrew KW amps etc seem to do OK. I would never leave a KX 
anything there however. Been there. Done that!


K1WHS

On 1/27/2021 10:18 AM, Joseph Shuman via Elecraft wrote:

There is a difference between stupidity and ignorance.  I claim ignorance.

My shack is a room in a barn attic space, separate from the house, no HVAC so 
cooling is one window and heating is a space heater (when I am working the 
waves).  Otherwise storage is ambient temp in the room.  Winter temps typically 
down to low 20s, summer up to 90s.  Sunny summer temp in the shack gets up to 
120.  My concerns are leaving the KX2 (#3007) and KXPA100 (#2802) in the shack 
and the effects of daily cycling the temp, especially in winter.  My “internet 
research” (maybe an oxymoron?) has such varied opinions it is worthless.  What 
say you, my fellow Elecraft faithful?

Keeping Watch-
shu
Joe Shuman, NZ8P

Unless someone like you
cares a whole awful lot,
nothing is going to get better.
It’s not.-Dr. Seuss
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Re: [Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage

[Alan - G4GNX]

My shack is in the attic of a single storey building in the UK. I have a 
similar setup with a roof window for ventilation and light. It can get 
up to 104 degrees in Summer, even with a small evaporative air 
conditioner in use. It doesn't normally get too cold in Winter because 
the room's fed by part of the main heating system.


I leave a PC, network server, network hub and phone charger running 
24/7. My K3, KPA500, KAT500, IC-9700, IC-7100 and a Wouxun multi-band 
plus all PSUs, rotator controllers, monitor screens stay there 
permanently (all switched off) and are turned on and used as necessary, 
several times a week. I have had no issues so far. ;-)


BTW any would-be burglars reading this, don't bother - we have a very 
good security system, linked to the Police. :-D


73,

Alan. G4GNX


-- Original Message --
From: "Joseph Shuman via Elecraft" 
To: "Elecraft Mail Server" 
Sent: 27/01/2021 15:18:04
Subject: [Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage


There is a difference between stupidity and ignorance.  I claim ignorance.

My shack is a room in a barn attic space, separate from the house, no HVAC so 
cooling is one window and heating is a space heater (when I am working the 
waves).  Otherwise storage is ambient temp in the room.  Winter temps typically 
down to low 20s, summer up to 90s.  Sunny summer temp in the shack gets up to 
120.  My concerns are leaving the KX2 (#3007) and KXPA100 (#2802) in the shack 
and the effects of daily cycling the temp, especially in winter.  My “internet 
research” (maybe an oxymoron?) has such varied opinions it is worthless.  What 
say you, my fellow Elecraft faithful?

Keeping Watch-
shu
Joe Shuman, NZ8P



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[Elecraft] Elecraft K4 question

[Wayne Suite]

Does the K4 cover the 2200m and 630m ham bands, like the flex radios do?

Also when are the group 3 orders shipping?

Thanks,
Kd5spx
-- 
Sent from my ipad
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Re: [Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage

[George Thornton]

Wet is much more of a problem with electronic equipment than 100 plus degree 
heat.

I live in Western Washington, my locality has about the same total rainfall as 
the middle east coast states but we rarely have downpours.  It just drizzles 
and mists all the time.  

I have owned boats in this climate and I know proximity to water greatly 
magnifies the problem.   Electrical connections corrode quickly in a damp 
marine environment.  I used to have to go through my boat wiring system and 
clean contacts annually to keep the lights functioning.

A small heat source does wonders to lower humidity.   Even an incandescent 
lightbulb can help in small spaces.  Just running your radio generates heat 
that dissipates humidity within the radio..

I have a wood shop in an unheated garage. I have to keep a heat source in there 
in the winter to keep the tools dry, otherwise my tools will rust away.

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net  On 
Behalf Of David Olean
Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 2021 9:42 AM
To: Joseph Shuman ; Elecraft Mail Server 

Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage

I would worry about condensation. I live in New England. New England is the 
only part of the country except for the coastline in WA, where there is a 
positive water budget typically. In other words, more rain falls than is 
evaporated or used up.  My ham shack is 1/2 mile from my house and was 
unheated. It was hard on the equipment.  Very hot wx was not a problem but cold 
temps and then the arrival of warmer and moist air would produce water droplets 
all over the gear.  Transformers would stay very cold and the water would drip 
off of them when the temps warmed a little bit.  Anything that used high 
voltage was subject to explosions if you were foolhardy to turn them on. It was 
all due to the water.

What I did was install a propane heater with a special thermostat that allowed 
operation down to 32 degrees. I set the temp to around 40 F. That keeps most of 
the condensation at bay. I also put in a solar heater on a south facing outside 
wall, and it pumps warmer air inside if the Sun is out. On a sunny winter day 
in January it will be 50 degrees in the room during the day. I have had no 
trouble with this setup. I am just about through with my 1st 100 lb propane 
tank and January is just about finished, so the cost is not too bad. You must 
use a vented propane heater. The unvented ones, or portable K1 space heaters 
like Kerosuns etc all produce water vapor and are no good for what we want. 
Maybe in a desert climate things will be different, but that is what works for 
me.

I have an unheated room as well, but only keep rugged stuff there in winter. 
Homebrew KW amps etc seem to do OK. I would never leave a KX anything there 
however. Been there. Done that!

K1WHS

On 1/27/2021 10:18 AM, Joseph Shuman via Elecraft wrote:
> There is a difference between stupidity and ignorance.  I claim ignorance.
>
> My shack is a room in a barn attic space, separate from the house, no HVAC so 
> cooling is one window and heating is a space heater (when I am working the 
> waves).  Otherwise storage is ambient temp in the room.  Winter temps 
> typically down to low 20s, summer up to 90s.  Sunny summer temp in the shack 
> gets up to 120.  My concerns are leaving the KX2 (#3007) and KXPA100 (#2802) 
> in the shack and the effects of daily cycling the temp, especially in winter. 
>  My “internet research” (maybe an oxymoron?) has such varied opinions it is 
> worthless.  What say you, my fellow Elecraft faithful?
>
> Keeping Watch-
> shu
> Joe Shuman, NZ8P
>
> Unless someone like you
> cares a whole awful lot,
> nothing is going to get better.
> It’s not.-Dr. Seuss
> __
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>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> k1...@metrocast.net
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delivered to gthorn...@thorntonmostullaw.com 
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Re: [Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage

[Dennis Moore]

I think what's getting overlooked in many of the replies is the effect 
of the repeated expansion/contraction cycles of daily operation on the 
equipment. I'm not discounting the comments about moisture, but this is 
how we get socketed components slowly working their way out. You might 
want to open things up occasionally and make sure things are still 
seated, cables still fully connected etc. This will happen much more 
frequently in cold winters than in warm summers.


73, Dennis NJ6G

On 1/27/2021 07:18, Joseph Shuman via Elecraft wrote:

There is a difference between stupidity and ignorance.  I claim ignorance.

My shack is a room in a barn attic space, separate from the house, no HVAC so 
cooling is one window and heating is a space heater (when I am working the 
waves).  Otherwise storage is ambient temp in the room.  Winter temps typically 
down to low 20s, summer up to 90s.  Sunny summer temp in the shack gets up to 
120.  My concerns are leaving the KX2 (#3007) and KXPA100 (#2802) in the shack 
and the effects of daily cycling the temp, especially in winter.  My “internet 
research” (maybe an oxymoron?) has such varied opinions it is worthless.  What 
say you, my fellow Elecraft faithful?

Keeping Watch-
shu
Joe Shuman, NZ8P

Unless someone like you
cares a whole awful lot,
nothing is going to get better.
It’s not.-Dr. Seuss

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Re: [Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage

[David Haines]

David is right on all counts, from my experience.  Anybody with an 
unheated workshop here in Maine knows the problem of a mild spell 
causing water to condense on a tractor that has been sitting in a 10 
degree F. barn.  One answer is never to let your equipment get too cold, 
hence a heater, maybe even a heating pad under the K3? Another is to use 
a vapor barrier to keep the moisture out of the shack?  Maybe keep the 
equipment in an airtight chest?  This can get complicated and depends 
very much on local conditions, but deserves attention.


Another david
KC1DNY

On 1/27/2021 12:42 PM, David Olean wrote:
I would worry about condensation. I live in New England. New England 
is the only part of the country except for the coastline in WA, where 
there is a positive water budget typically. In other words, more rain 
falls than is evaporated or used up.  My ham shack is 1/2 mile from my 
house and was unheated. It was hard on the equipment.  Very hot wx was 
not a problem but cold temps and then the arrival of warmer and moist 
air would produce water droplets all over the gear.  Transformers 
would stay very cold and the water would drip off of them when the 
temps warmed a little bit. Anything that used high voltage was subject 
to explosions if you were foolhardy to turn them on. It was all due to 
the water.


What I did was install a propane heater with a special thermostat that 
allowed operation down to 32 degrees. I set the temp to around 40 F.  
That keeps most of the condensation at bay. I also put in a solar 
heater on a south facing outside wall, and it pumps warmer air inside 
if the Sun is out. On a sunny winter day in January it will be 50 
degrees in the room during the day. I have had no trouble with this 
setup. I am just about through with my 1st 100 lb propane tank and 
January is just about finished, so the cost is not too bad. You must 
use a vented propane heater. The unvented ones, or portable K1 space 
heaters like Kerosuns etc all produce water vapor and are no good for 
what we want.   Maybe in a desert climate things will be different, 
but that is what works for me.


I have an unheated room as well, but only keep rugged stuff there in 
winter. Homebrew KW amps etc seem to do OK. I would never leave a KX 
anything there however. Been there. Done that!


K1WHS

On 1/27/2021 10:18 AM, Joseph Shuman via Elecraft wrote:
There is a difference between stupidity and ignorance.  I claim 
ignorance.


My shack is a room in a barn attic space, separate from the house, no 
HVAC so cooling is one window and heating is a space heater (when I 
am working the waves).  Otherwise storage is ambient temp in the 
room.  Winter temps typically down to low 20s, summer up to 90s.  
Sunny summer temp in the shack gets up to 120.  My concerns are 
leaving the KX2 (#3007) and KXPA100 (#2802) in the shack and the 
effects of daily cycling the temp, especially in winter.  My 
“internet research” (maybe an oxymoron?) has such varied opinions it 
is worthless.  What say you, my fellow Elecraft faithful?


Keeping Watch-
shu
Joe Shuman, NZ8P

Unless someone like you
cares a whole awful lot,
nothing is going to get better.
It’s not.    -Dr. Seuss
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Re: [Elecraft] MH2 mic and the K3

[Clark Macaulay]

And a Mea Culpa from me.

I have a MH2 that I use very infrequently with my K2 and it works well.
When the question was asked, I noted the instructions were different for
the K3 but failed to read them carefully.  I should have tried my MH2 on my
K3 before offering advice.

I have only a casual interest in SSB and the MH2 will come in handy for
those few special event stations I enjoy working.

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 6:10 PM NJMike  wrote:

> Gentlemen, thank you very much.  One of the nice things about Elecraft is
> all
> the good feedback you get from users!
>
> Mike NJ2OM
>
>
>
> --
> Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/
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[Elecraft] Roofing filters and DSP bandwidth tuning

[NJMike]

If I understand it correctly, as you turn the bandwidth knob
counterclockwise, the filter narrows.  At some point, it hits the next
roofing filter and thennarrows more?  Just trying to understand so I can
get the right filters.  Rig A (below) is what Elecraft recommends for my
operating profile.

What would be the difference between the following three examples, as far as
how narrow the bandwidth could actually be adjusted?

Rig A with 2.8, 2.1, 400, 250, 200 filters
Rig B with 2.8, 2.1, 400, 250 filters
Rig C with 2.8, 2.1, 400, 200 filters



--
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Re: [Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage

[Rich NE1EE]

On 2021-01-27 12:42:-0500, David Olean wrote:

>I would worry about condensation. I live in New England. New England

I too live in NE, and I used a dehumidifier. That got me two things: the RH 
lowered, and the residual heat dumped to the space. It was pretty warm, and I 
set the machine to 40%. Otherwise, I don't recommend using such a space for the 
reasons others have mentioned.

~R~
72/73 de Rich NE1EE
The Dusty Key
On the banks of the Piscataqua

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft K4 question

[Wayne Burdick]

> On Jan 27, 2021, at 10:04 AM, Wayne Suite  wrote:
> 
> Does the K4 cover the 2200m and 630m ham bands, like the flex radios do?

The K4 receives on these bands. Transmit output can be taken from the XVTR OUT 
jack, and is about +10 dBm.

73,
Wayne
N6KR


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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft K4 question

[Wayne Suite]

Ok, thanks.

On Wed, Jan 27, 2021 at 12:54 Wayne Burdick  wrote:

>
> > On Jan 27, 2021, at 10:04 AM, Wayne Suite  wrote:
> >
> > Does the K4 cover the 2200m and 630m ham bands, like the flex radios do?
>
> The K4 receives on these bands. Transmit output can be taken from the XVTR
> OUT jack, and is about +10 dBm.
>
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
>
> --
Sent from my ipad
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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing filters and DSP bandwidth tuning

[john]

These are roofing filters, they do not effect how narrow the bandwidth  
can be adjusted.  FWIW, I have both the 400 and 250 8 pole filters. If  
money is an issue, I believe that there is very little bandwidth  
difference between the two.


John KK9A


NJ Mike wrote:

If I understand it correctly, as you turn the bandwidth knob
counterclockwise, the filter narrows.  At some point, it hits the next
roofing filter and thennarrows more?  Just trying to understand so I can
get the right filters.  Rig A (below) is what Elecraft recommends for my
operating profile.

What would be the difference between the following three examples, as far as
how narrow the bandwidth could actually be adjusted?

Rig A with 2.8, 2.1, 400, 250, 200 filters
Rig B with 2.8, 2.1, 400, 250 filters
Rig C with 2.8, 2.1, 400, 200 filters

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Re: [Elecraft] Another Elecraft K4 question

[Dave Cole]

Does the K4 do temp compensation like the K3 does, in very small steps? 
If so, is the step size the same as the K3?


I used to do dopplergrams using my old 756 PRO III, but with the K3 the 
frequency corrections are in steps and mess up the dopplergrams...


73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 1/27/21 10:54 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:



On Jan 27, 2021, at 10:04 AM, Wayne Suite  wrote:

Does the K4 cover the 2200m and 630m ham bands, like the flex radios do?


The K4 receives on these bands. Transmit output can be taken from the XVTR OUT 
jack, and is about +10 dBm.

73,
Wayne
N6KR


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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft K4 question

[WILLIE BABER]

Can you say or know about when k4 will be available from " in stock" units?
73, Will, wj9b
CWops #1085
CWA Advisor levels II and III
http://cwops.org/ 

On Wednesday, January 27, 2021, 10:57:36 AM PST, Wayne Burdick 
 wrote:  
 
 
> On Jan 27, 2021, at 10:04 AM, Wayne Suite  wrote:
> 
> Does the K4 cover the 2200m and 630m ham bands, like the flex radios do?

The K4 receives on these bands. Transmit output can be taken from the XVTR OUT 
jack, and is about +10 dBm.

73,
Wayne
N6KR


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Re: [Elecraft] Another Elecraft K4 question

[Wayne Burdick]

After a brief warmup, the K4's short-term reference lock deviation is 
approximately +/- 0.1 to 0.2 Hz at an operating frequency of 14 MHz. It scales 
linearly with frequency. This is roughly 5x tighter than the equivalent spec 
for the K3, so I'm guessing you wouldn't see it in a dopplergram. That said, we 
haven't tested it that way yet.

73,
Wayne
N6KR



> On Jan 27, 2021, at 12:16 PM, Dave Cole  wrote:
> 
> Does the K4 do temp compensation like the K3 does, in very small steps? If 
> so, is the step size the same as the K3?
> 
> I used to do dopplergrams using my old 756 PRO III, but with the K3 the 
> frequency corrections are in steps and mess up the dopplergrams...
> 
> 73, and thanks,
> Dave (NK7Z)
> https://www.nk7z.net
> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
> 
> On 1/27/21 10:54 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
>>> On Jan 27, 2021, at 10:04 AM, Wayne Suite  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Does the K4 cover the 2200m and 630m ham bands, like the flex radios do?
>> The K4 receives on these bands. Transmit output can be taken from the XVTR 
>> OUT jack, and is about +10 dBm.
>> 73,
>> Wayne
>> N6KR
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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing filters and DSP bandwidth tuning

[Fred Jensen]

NJ Mike:  If I understand your question, the answer is "Yes, as you 
narrow the DSP BW with the 'WIDTH" knob, the roofing filters will switch 
such that the narrowest filter that still includes the DSP BW will be 
selected".


To your second question, the ultimate BW is set by the DSP, and on my 
K3, that's 50 Hz.  It doesn't really matter what roofing filter is 
selected.  The xtal filters are in the 1st IF [8 MHz] and their primary 
[maybe only] purpose is to suppress strong signals outside the DSP BW 
that would activate the AGC and affect the level of the desired signal 
inside the DSP BW, even though you can't hear them.  It follows that 
you'd probably like the selection of roofing filters to follow the DSP 
BW as closely as possible.  You won't see any difference between your 
Rigs A, B, and C.


73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

NJ Mike wrote:

If I understand it correctly, as you turn the bandwidth knob
counterclockwise, the filter narrows.  At some point, it hits the next
roofing filter and thennarrows more?  Just trying to understand so 
I can

get the right filters.  Rig A (below) is what Elecraft recommends for my
operating profile.

What would be the difference between the following three examples, as 
far as

how narrow the bandwidth could actually be adjusted?

Rig A with 2.8, 2.1, 400, 250, 200 filters
Rig B with 2.8, 2.1, 400, 250 filters
Rig C with 2.8, 2.1, 400, 200 filters


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Re: [Elecraft] K4 QSK

[Rick Tavan]

Several readers challenged me appropriately on the glowing report below
because I had not done my K4 QSK testing under crowded band conditions as
in a contest. Right - I hadn't encountered any but I was so happy with what
I heard on quiet bands that I couldn't refrain from commenting.

Today I got on the 19Z CWT to give it a try. Unfortunately, I had some
pretty bad local RFI. It sounded like arcing from an intermittent, loose
electrical connection, possibly induced by recent high winds here, and made
weak signals hard to copy. The K4 NB helped some but it wasn't the test I
had intended ... unless you're looking for a report that the noise was
quite audible while transmitting - it was.  I almost gave up in disgust
after 22 minutes but put the 'phones back on for the last 11 minutes of the
event and was delighted to find the noise completely gone! So I did get in
11 minutes of a reasonable, single-band evaluation (20M). And it was good!
QSK remained solid. There were a few low level artifacts I hadn't heard
before, probably due to an amplified speaker at this location that I wasn't
using but had not powered off. At 20Z the CWT ended, the band went quiet,
and I did a little more transmitting to confirm that QSK on the empty band
sounded no different than during the CWT. This was *not a comprehensive or
conclusive test*, but it's very encouraging - the QSK did not degrade under
these busier band conditions. I'll try to clean up my audio distribution
setup and report any differences.

73,

/Rick N6XI

On Fri, Jan 22, 2021 at 11:43 AM Rick Tavan  wrote:

> I've had a chance to try the latest improvements to QSK on the field test
> K4. It's great, close to the theoretical optimum of sounding like a code
> practice oscillator running in the background!  Remarkably, it sounds the
> same in TEST mode as when transmitting 100W barefoot, 1200W (ICOM 1000
> vacuum relay),  or 1500W (KPA1500 PIN diode), internal keyer or external
> WinKey emulator. No, it's not perfect. I don't hear much received signal
> between dits at 50 WPM, but I do hear something noticeable when there's a
> signal there. And at a more realistic 38 WPM, sending actual code, I can
> tell *immediately* when there's something on frequency. Wayne tells me
> that he has a few more tricks up his sleeve that can make it better yet,
> but it's already among the best QSK setups I've ever experienced. Way to
> go, Elecraft!
>
> /Rick N6XI
>
> --
>
> Rick Tavan
> Truckee and Saratoga, CA
>


-- 
--

Rick Tavan
Truckee and Saratoga, CA
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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing filters and DSP bandwidth tuning

[Jim Brown]

On 1/27/2021 12:14 PM, j...@kk9a.com wrote:
FWIW, I have both the 400 and 250 8 pole filters. If money is an issue, 
I believe that there is very little bandwidth difference between the two.


I have both as well in all my radios. I can clearly hear the difference 
when switching between them. I mostly use the 250 Hz filter for CW and 
the 500 Hz filter for RTTY.


73, Jim K9YC
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[Elecraft] Preventing Condensation

[Steve Stutman]

 Hi All,

Condensation on surfaces, to include the interior and exterior of
equipment, is a function of ambient temperature and relative humidity.

At a given RH, we know the temperature at which condensation occurs as the
Dew Point.

I agree with previous posts that increasing temperature (above the Dew
Point) will prevent condensation and suggest that this is a lot easier in
"drafty" volumes than is reducing the humidity.

I have a very well insulated house in New England with an uninsulated
drafty basement shack; somewhat better than a tent.

I suggest that to prevent condensation in and on gear, it is simpler and
more economical to just leave the gear on.

Enough heat is produced, in my experience, and it is produced in the right
place.

We are not worried about filament lifetime in modern gear.

Leaving a large Xcvr on consumes maybe 20-40W, while heating my shack 15F
degrees electrically, consumes over 2kW.

73,

Steve

KL7JT
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Re: [Elecraft] Shack Equipment Storage

[Josh Fiden]

These barn thermostats are inexpensive. I have one running an oil filled 
electric heater so shack doesn’t drop below 50F when not in use. Keeps gear 
from getting so cold there’s condensation when it warms during the day. 

https://www.qcsupply.com/10004-peco-thermostat-tf115.html

No endorsement of this vendor, first listing I found for my thermostat. 

73,
Josh W6XU

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 27, 2021, at 9:42 AM, David Olean  wrote:
> 

> I would worry about condensation..
> 
> What I did was install a propane heater with a special thermostat that 
> allowed operation down to 32 degrees. I set the temp to around 40 F.  That 
> keeps most of the condensation at bay. 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] VK4

[Jim Borowski]

Use of boot camp is unacceptable. Native OS is the right way to do it.Jim 
K9TFSent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device
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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing filters and DSP bandwidth tuning

[john]

I have 8 pole 400 Hz filters in my K3s's, not 500 Hz as well as 250 Hz.
According to W0YK's presentation linked below the 400 filter has a bandwidth
of 435 and the 250 filter has a bandwidth of 370. This data is for 8 pole
crystal filters made by Inrad, I am not sure what filters Elecraft currently
sells. 

http://www.nccc.cc/archived_meetings/pdf/K3%20Filters,%20Jan%202009.pdf  

John KK9A


Jim Brown K9YC wrote:

On 1/27/2021 12:14 PM, john at kk9a.com wrote:
> FWIW, I have both the 400 and 250 8 pole filters. If money is an issue, 
> I believe that there is very little bandwidth difference between the two.

I have both as well in all my radios. I can clearly hear the difference 
when switching between them. I mostly use the 250 Hz filter for CW and 
the 500 Hz filter for RTTY.

73, Jim K9YC

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Re: [Elecraft] K2.Unable to undertake VCO alignment.

[Don Wilhelm]

What were the results of the PLL Reference Oscillator test - especially 
the high frequency at TP3? - the frequencies please.


The 5 volts on the SCK signal is normal.

Do not wear out the slug in L30!

Is this a new build or the result of upgrades to an old K2?
Do you have an oscilloscope with a 10X probe?

73,
Don W3FPR

On 1/27/2021 6:59 AM, M Bak wrote:

Issue. Unable to undertake VCO alignment. Voltage at R30 fixed at 24mV.



The VCO oscillator test (Alignment and test Part II p 63) has passed. Well
the frequency is 7.98MHz rather than 8->10 but that conceivably could be
within the bounds of measurement error.



In the VCO alignment test a DMM (Keysight U1271) clamped onto the left side
end of R30 reads 24mV no matter what the setting of L30.



I have looked everywhere over the appropriate circuitry but can see no
issues. Including triple checking T5 which is 100% wound and fitted
properly.



I made the measurements from troubleshooting (PLL Reference Oscillator and
VCO P 10) and got:-



Reference Oscillator Output  0.72

VCO Output 0.24

VCO Buffer Output 0.59

All measurements are at the low end of the acceptable range but just in
spec.





I measured voltages in the area and have noted the following:-



1. U4 (MC145170) pin 7 CLK/SCK is at 5v as against the specified 0v.

2. U4 pin 13 PDOUT is at 5v rather than 4v. This feeds the inverting
input of U6B causing the output to be low.

3. The gate input of Q18 is 0 rather than -1.





I am at a loss as to what to check next and any suggestions would be most
welcome. BTW I also have a ½ decent scope so can probe with that assuming I
can figure out what I should be seeing. The K2 is a brilliant kit but
seriously different to tube amps. which is my usual playpen.


Thanks


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Re: [Elecraft] K2.Unable to undertake VCO alignment.

[Don Wilhelm]

Doug,

Are you on 40 meters?

Did you measure the PLL Reference oscillator range (counter probe in 
TP3)?  What were the frequencies?


Any chance you replaced Q19 during the upgrade process?  If so, where 
did you get it?


73,
Don W3FPR

On 1/27/2021 12:22 PM, Douglas Hagerman via Elecraft wrote:

I am suffering from a similar problem in the midst of applying the various 
upgrades. My BFO test numbers are good,
4917.13 kHz
4912.16 kHz
4.97 kHz range

but when I try the VCO linearization process, I see 11090 flash and then get 
error 232. I have not checked the VFO against a reference frequency. I have 
tried two different crystals and several different L31 values.

My planned next step is to assemble the RF probe and see if I can figure out 
what is going on.

Doug, W0UHU.


From: M Bak mailto:mark.adrian.ba...@gmail.com>>

Issue. Unable to undertake VCO alignment.

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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing filters and DSP bandwidth tuning

[David Woolley]

On 27/01/2021 20:35, Fred Jensen wrote:
   It follows that you'd probably like the selection of roofing filters 
to follow the DSP BW as closely as possible.


Having the roofing filter too close to the DSP filter is not necessarily 
a good thing, as the roofing filters are likely to have worse passband 
ripples and will have non-linear phase responses, which can compromise 
digital modes.  At least some of the DSP filters are finite impulse 
response, meaning they are also linear phase, which means that pulses 
will not get smeared out.


--
David Woolley

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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing filters and DSP bandwidth tuning

[Fred Jensen]

True.  Statement was focused on preventing AGC action from signals 
outside the DSP BW and to do that, you'd like the roofing filters to 
include the DSP BW but not much more.  The "effective" BW of the xtal 
filters is also something larger than the 2.5 kHz or 0.5 kHz or 0.25 kHz 
in the name ... more poles = steeper skirts. Phase response is fairly 
irrelevant on CW and almost so on SSB.  If you're operating digital 
modes, phase response [and passband ripple] becomes important if the 
desired signal BW fills the filter BW.


73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 1/27/2021 3:06 PM, David Woolley wrote:

On 27/01/2021 20:35, Fred Jensen wrote:
   It follows that you'd probably like the selection of roofing 
filters to follow the DSP BW as closely as possible.


Having the roofing filter too close to the DSP filter is not 
necessarily a good thing, as the roofing filters are likely to have 
worse passband ripples and will have non-linear phase responses, which 
can compromise digital modes.  At least some of the DSP filters are 
finite impulse response, meaning they are also linear phase, which 
means that pulses will not get smeared out.




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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing filters and DSP bandwidth tuning

[Jim Brown]

On 1/27/2021 2:48 PM, j...@kk9a.com wrote:

I have both as well in all my radios. I can clearly hear the difference
when switching between them. I mostly use the 250 Hz filter for CW and
the 500 Hz filter for RTTY.


Sorry, I mis-spoke. I have the 8-pole 250 Hz and 400 Hz filters, but I 
set the DSP IF for 500 Hz for RTTY. I'm well aware how similarly they 
measure -- W0YK and I did that independently in 2008-9 when we first 
installed them.


73, Jim
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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing filters and DSP bandwidth tuning

[Jim Brown]

On 1/27/2021 3:06 PM, David Woolley wrote:
Having the roofing filter too close to the DSP filter is not necessarily 
a good thing, as the roofing filters are likely to have worse passband 
ripples and will have non-linear phase responses, which can compromise 
digital modes.  At least some of the DSP filters are finite impulse 
response, meaning they are also linear phase, which means that pulses 
will not get smeared out.


K1JT strongly urges 3kHz or greater IF bandwidths for his modes, and for 
exactly that reason. And it's why top RTTY contesters have abandoned the 
K3's dual-peak filter in favor of 500 Hz IF bandwidth. My professional 
life in audio system design taught me that speech intelligibility is 
degraded by time/phase distortion and suspected the result would be the 
same with RTTY, but I was derided when I started preaching that to RTTY 
guys. Several years later, author of the 2Tone RTTY software G3YYD said 
the same thing, and folks started believing it. It's also why I find 
that the 2.1 kHz 8-pole provides better speech intelligibility than the 
1.8 kHz filter.


Years ago, I tried using narrow SSB realignments of the K2's CW crystal 
filters in contests. I had carefully tweaked them per the build 
instructions, noting that their amplitude response looked like the 
profile of a mountain range. I wasn't surprised that those settings made 
signals much harder to copy. The SSB TX filter sounded fine on RX.


When I switched from the 2.7 kHz 5-pole filters to the 2.8 kHz filters 
for TX in one of my K3s I noticed considerably less incidental AM on 
RTTY, and immediately converted the other two. I didn't do that in the 
2nd RX, because I only use it for weak signal CW work on the lower bands.


73, Jim K9YC


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[Elecraft] Secure that AX-1 whip

[Mitch Johnson via Elecraft]

This is more of an amusing story than a warning.  Me and my wife were doing 
some radio stuff on the KX2 a while back.  We were playing with the AX-1 whip 
antenna, not literally playing with it, actual Ham radio stuff.  Anyway, just 
as my wife was transmitting the antenna fell over, my quick cat-like reflex 
reached out and grabbed that antenna so it wouldn’t fall over, the equally 
quick cat-like reflex let go of the antenna and let it fall over when I 
received a bit of a shock.

My advice, don’t do what I did, it wasn’t the best thing to do, and yes, 
10watts is a bit of an eye opener.

Thought I’d share a bit of whatever this was,

Take care and 73,

Mitch Johnson/KN4ONH
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