[Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
I have a really dumb question: For those that want a "bug mode" on the K3, why is it not possible to wire a set of paddles (or even a single lever keyer) with the dot going to the paddles input and the dash going to the straight key input? -- John Fritze Jr K2QY k...@arrl.net ACACES president 2014 Albany County RACES Radio Officer ARES ENY DEC Northern District Hudson Div. Asst. Director Twitter: @k2qy 401 261 4996 (cell) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Maybe an even dumber question: Why do you need a bug mode? The radio doesn't know you are using a bug, or a straight key, does it? 73 de W6OGC Jim Allen On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 11:45 AM, John Fritze wrote: > I have a really dumb question: > > For those that want a "bug mode" on the K3, why is it not possible to wire > a set of paddles (or even a single lever keyer) with the dot going to the > paddles input and the dash going to the straight key input? > > -- > John Fritze Jr > K2QY > k...@arrl.net > ACACES president 2014 > Albany County RACES Radio Officer > ARES ENY DEC Northern District > Hudson Div. Asst. Director > Twitter: @k2qy > 401 261 4996 (cell) > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to jalleninv...@gmail.com > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
At the same time, I'd like to have a selection of "nothing" on at least the ring input of the key jack. (Actually my request is for the KX3, but I assume they work the same way.) With "Nothing" selected on the ring and "KEY" selected on the tip, the key input would be compatible with mono 1/8" plugs. 73 - Jim K8MR In a message dated 12/7/2014 5:19:28 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, fritzej...@gmail.com writes: I have a really dumb question: For those that want a "bug mode" on the K3, why is it not possible to wire a set of paddles (or even a single lever keyer) with the dot going to the paddles input and the dash going to the straight key input? -- John Fritze Jr K2QY __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
You can certainly do that, but when I've tried it in the past I found that the feel is totally different from a mechanical "bug" (semi-automatic key). To the point that I basically couldn't send with it. Alan N1AL On 12/07/2014 09:45 AM, John Fritze wrote: I have a really dumb question: For those that want a "bug mode" on the K3, why is it not possible to wire a set of paddles (or even a single lever keyer) with the dot going to the paddles input and the dash going to the straight key input? __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
I have tried that, but (at least on my K3) there is a timing interaction between the paddle input and the straight key input that delays the first dah when crossing over from a dit to a dah in same character. There is no issue when crossing over from a dah to a dit. In other words, I could send a "B" just fine, but couldn't send "V". There maybe some adjustment I could have made, but I didn't pursue it. The delay I encountered isn't related to the semi break-in delay adjustment on the front panel. 73, Bill - NA5DX On 12/8/2014 7:17 AM, elecraft-requ...@mailman.qth.net wrote: Message: 1 Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2014 12:45:23 -0500 From: John Fritze To:elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 I have a really dumb question: For those that want a "bug mode" on the K3, why is it not possible to wire a set of paddles (or even a single lever keyer) with the dot going to the paddles input and the dash going to the straight key input? -- John Fritze Jr K2QY k...@arrl.net ACACES president 2014 Albany County RACES Radio Officer ARES ENY DEC Northern District Hudson Div. Asst. Director Twitter: @k2qy 401 261 4996 (cell) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
A real "bug" works fine works fine in the straight key jack, but some would like their paddles to send automatic dits and manual dahs like a bug. 73, Bill - NA5DX On 12/8/2014 7:17 AM, elecraft-requ...@mailman.qth.net wrote: Message: 2 Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2014 11:48:32 -0600 From: Jim Allen To: John Fritze Cc: elecraft Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Maybe an even dumber question: Why do you need a bug mode? The radio doesn't know you are using a bug, or a straight key, does it? 73 de W6OGC Jim Allen On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 11:45 AM, John Fritze wrote: >I have a really dumb question: > >For those that want a "bug mode" on the K3, why is it not possible to wire >a set of paddles (or even a single lever keyer) with the dot going to the >paddles input and the dash going to the straight key input? > >-- >John Fritze Jr >K2QY >k...@arrl.net >ACACES president 2014 >Albany County RACES Radio Officer >ARES ENY DEC Northern District >Hudson Div. Asst. Director >Twitter: @k2qy >401 261 4996 (cell) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Well It would be extremely hard to duplicate the "feel" and timing of a mechanical bug in anything electronic. The application of timing from the dit side on a bug is NOT linear with the code speed. The time interval to move the bar from not ditting to the point where it does dit is FIXED without any relationship to dit speed. Also the delay varies depending on how hard you hit the bug with your thumb. Then once the bar is moved to ditting, thereafter it dits at the speed based on the placement of the weight. There also is a difficult to predict minor additional delay because the end of the weighted bar does not move immediately, but with the buildup of tension in the bending point of the bar. If that were not enough, my Vibroplex has seven different adjustments that will vary one or the other or all of these mechanical delays. Anyone who ever learned to send perfect tape machine code with a bug simply got used to those delays and accommodated for them unconsciously in their wrist and thumb movement. Those who did not accommodate had an immediately recognizable "swing" to their "fist". Also, in the "fist" discussion, there were many that sent dits at one speed and dahs at another. The resulting sent CW was as easily recognizable at anyone's voice. On a mechanical bug, a B would send differently than a V, because the the dit pressure in the B would have to be advanced in timing to prevent a too long spacing between the dah and the first dit. Since the dah is a simple mechanical press, the dits are uncousciously started whenever they need to. In the V, the correct space between the last dit and the dah is easy. Someone whose muscle memory had the unconscious adjustment for all the mechanical issue, now using an uncompensated electronic device would find themselves overwriting the opening dah of the B with the dits, now being sent too soon. IMHO, someone who goes from operating a real mechanical bug to some electronic rube goldberg is going to stumble all over it because the programming to allow dits at one speed and dahs at another WITH the fixed bar movement delay, etc, is an expenditure of commercial funds that ain't gonna happen in a for-profit enterprise. Those of you who want to program an electronic bug WITH the appropriate mechanical biases employed, you go right ahead with your own time and money. Some of us will test it for you and see if it FEELS or SENDS like a bug. Then someone tell me we should put that firmware in a K3 because ??? 73, Guy K2AV On Mon, Dec 8, 2014 at 11:16 AM, Bill Breeden wrote: > > A real "bug" works fine works fine in the straight key jack, but some > would like their paddles to send automatic dits and manual dahs like a bug. > > 73, > > Bill - NA5DX > > On 12/8/2014 7:17 AM, elecraft-requ...@mailman.qth.net wrote: > >> Message: 2 Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2014 11:48:32 -0600 From: Jim Allen < >> jalleninv...@gmail.com> To: John Fritze Cc: >> elecraft Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on >> K3? Message-ID: > ypz9jqi2n...@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >> Maybe an even dumber question: Why do you need a bug mode? The radio >> doesn't know you are using a bug, or a straight key, does it? 73 de W6OGC >> Jim Allen On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 11:45 AM, John Fritze < >> fritzej...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> >I have a really dumb question: >>> > >>> >For those that want a "bug mode" on the K3, why is it not possible to >>> wire >>> >a set of paddles (or even a single lever keyer) with the dot going to >>> the >>> >paddles input and the dash going to the straight key input? >>> > >>> >-- >>> >John Fritze Jr >>> >K2QY >>> >k...@arrl.net >>> >ACACES president 2014 >>> >Albany County RACES Radio Officer >>> >ARES ENY DEC Northern District >>> >Hudson Div. Asst. Director >>> >Twitter: @k2qy >>> >401 261 4996 (cell) >>> >> > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to k2av@gmail.com > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
I received a K1EL K14 Keyer in the mail from Joel, W4BBJ, who offered it to me when I reported having trouble learning to use my paddle with Iambic keying (using the k3 internal keyer). The K14 offers six keying modes: 1- Iambic-A 2- Iambic-B 3- Ultimatic 4- straight key 5- Dit priority 6- Dash priority Not sure I would ever use the last two, but I am eager to try out Ultimatic mode to see if it feels more natural for me. The plus is 12 programable messages, two callsign memories, beacon mode, programmable delays, message stacking, etc. etc. with no computer. I'll be able to store five standard eme messages with additional memory left. I can see it running my 6m in beacon and my 10-GHz beacon with no extra hardware. Big plus was the two radio connections so I can have both my Bencher and straight key available for either K3 or KX3 at the throw of a switch. Loving it already ;-) Thanks to Joel for the nice offer - and it looks quite nicely assembled! 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com "Kits made by KL7UW" Dubus Mag business: dubus...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
And don't forget the tactile feedback provided to your fingers by the momentum of the weight and the arm swinging back and forth. I suspect that those who want this haven't a clue about actually using a mechanical bug. Vic K2VCO/4X6GP > On Dec 9, 2014, at 2:20 AM, Guy Olinger K2AV wrote: > > Well > > It would be extremely hard to duplicate the "feel" and timing of a > mechanical bug in anything electronic. The application of timing from the > dit side on a bug is NOT linear with the code speed. The time interval to > move the bar from not ditting to the point where it does dit is FIXED > without any relationship to dit speed. Also the delay varies depending on > how hard you hit the bug with your thumb. Then once the bar is moved to > ditting, thereafter it dits at the speed based on the placement of the > weight. > > There also is a difficult to predict minor additional delay because the end > of the weighted bar does not move immediately, but with the buildup of > tension in the bending point of the bar. > > If that were not enough, my Vibroplex has seven different adjustments that > will vary one or the other or all of these mechanical delays. > > Anyone who ever learned to send perfect tape machine code with a bug simply > got used to those delays and accommodated for them unconsciously in their > wrist and thumb movement. Those who did not accommodate had an immediately > recognizable "swing" to their "fist". Also, in the "fist" discussion, there > were many that sent dits at one speed and dahs at another. The resulting > sent CW was as easily recognizable at anyone's voice. > > On a mechanical bug, a B would send differently than a V, because the the > dit pressure in the B would have to be advanced in timing to prevent a too > long spacing between the dah and the first dit. Since the dah is a simple > mechanical press, the dits are uncousciously started whenever they need to. > In the V, the correct space between the last dit and the dah is easy. > Someone whose muscle memory had the unconscious adjustment for all the > mechanical issue, now using an uncompensated electronic device would find > themselves overwriting the opening dah of the B with the dits, now being > sent too soon. > > IMHO, someone who goes from operating a real mechanical bug to some > electronic rube goldberg is going to stumble all over it because the > programming to allow dits at one speed and dahs at another WITH the fixed > bar movement delay, etc, is an expenditure of commercial funds that ain't > gonna happen in a for-profit enterprise. > > Those of you who want to program an electronic bug WITH the appropriate > mechanical biases employed, you go right ahead with your own time and > money. Some of us will test it for you and see if it FEELS or SENDS like a > bug. Then someone tell me we should put that firmware in a K3 because ??? > > 73, Guy K2AV __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
I have the K1EL K42, Ed. Built it last Spring for the fun of it as much as anything. It was a very nice kt and the final product seems excellent. This thread title has been making me chuckle a bit: How often do hams ask for bugs in their equipment? :- So I have a weird sense of humor :-) Phil W7OX On 12/8/14 9:56 PM, Edward R Cole wrote: I received a K1EL K14 Keyer in the mail from Joel, W4BBJ, who offered it to me when I reported having trouble learning to use my paddle with Iambic keying (using the k3 internal keyer). The K14 offers six keying modes: 1- Iambic-A 2- Iambic-B 3- Ultimatic 4- straight key 5- Dit priority 6- Dash priority Not sure I would ever use the last two, but I am eager to try out Ultimatic mode to see if it feels more natural for me. The plus is 12 programable messages, two callsign memories, beacon mode, programmable delays, message stacking, etc. etc. with no computer. I'll be able to store five standard eme messages with additional memory left. I can see it running my 6m in beacon and my 10-GHz beacon with no extra hardware. Big plus was the two radio connections so I can have both my Bencher and straight key available for either K3 or KX3 at the throw of a switch. Loving it already ;-) Thanks to Joel for the nice offer - and it looks quite nicely assembled! 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com "Kits made by KL7UW" Dubus Mag business: dubus...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Phil, You got a chuckle with your comment. Probably even more "humorous" is that I am not a "CW guy", so why am I buying a keyer?? Well, I did start out ham radio on CW as a Novice (KN8MWA) mainly 40m, so I am not totally a "CW virgin" ;-) But I struggled to pass my 13wpm test before the FCC and essentially let life overcome my further efforts for the next 24 years (college/career...). So after moving to Alaska in fall of 1979 and getting my first sled dog in 1980, dog mushing captured my interest so that I signed in 1982 up to run an Iditarod Sled Dog Race ham station in a remote check point on the trail - what fun! But there was a hitch - check points scattered over 1200 miles of trail used 80/40m to communicate with HQ in Anchorage. I had to get my General Class - had six months to get up to 13wpm! With the use of cassette tapes (remember those?) I passed my 13wpm test at the Anchorage FCC Office and decided to take my Advanced (AL7EB) test and passed it, too. But after passing the test I still was not a CW op. 1998 I decided to do "moon-bounce" (eme) and what was used? Uhuh = CW. Fortunately, I obtained my first pc in 1996 and there was a keyboard CW program so I did not have to send by hand (only had my original Novice straight key). But receiving super-weak CW is still by ear! 15-18wpm is favored for eme. 2010 I bought my K3 and decided to buy a paddle (Bencher-2) to try automatic CW and made a royal mess of that! I reverted to the old straight key (though I got rusty after all the years of nonuse). So I am actually going to try out the "bug" mode with the keyer. Push one way string of dots, push back and get string of dashes. I will not send faster than 18wpm so that ought to work OK. Let you know how it goes after a couple weeks! ;-) 73, Ed - KL7UW PS: I waited until 2000 to upgrade to Extra after CW requirement was lowered to 13wpm. Date: Tue, 09 Dec 2014 08:46:26 -0800 From: Phil Wheeler To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3? Message-ID: <54872762.3040...@socal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed I have the K1EL K42, Ed. Built it last Spring for the fun of it as much as anything. It was a very nice kt and the final product seems excellent. This thread title has been making me chuckle a bit: How often do hams ask for bugs in their equipment? :- So I have a weird sense of humor :-) Phil W7OX 73, Ed - KL7UW http://www.kl7uw.com "Kits made by KL7UW" Dubus Mag business: dubus...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Ed, I think you will have a better time with Ultimatic mode than Bug mode - especially with dual lever paddles. Actually it is about the same - close the dit side and get a string of dits, then close the dah side (even if the dit side is still closed) and you get a string of dahs. In other words, the last lever closed determines whether there is a string of dits or dahs. It still allows dit and dah inserting - for instance with a "K" start with the dah paddle, then before the dah is complete, tap the dit paddle quickly (leaving the dah paddle closed) - the dit will be inserted between the two dahs - just have to remove fingers from both paddles after the last dah. With Bug mode, there is no relationship between the dits and dahs, except that the dahs are manually formed. The timing relationship is difficult because you have to do it audiably from the sidetone rather than depending on the tactile feedback that one gets with a real bug. 73, Don W3FPR On 12/9/2014 3:46 PM, Edward R Cole wrote: 2010 I bought my K3 and decided to buy a paddle (Bencher-2) to try automatic CW and made a royal mess of that! I reverted to the old straight key (though I got rusty after all the years of nonuse). So I am actually going to try out the "bug" mode with the keyer. Push one way string of dots, push back and get string of dashes. I will not send faster than 18wpm so that ought to work OK. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
I learned on a Vibroplex single lever paddle and a Hallicrafters HA-1 TO Keyer. That was in the 60s. Single lever paddles appear to have gone the way, as most of the current rigs (K3 included) do not well support such a key. Hence, I built a little box with a couple of 2032 batteries in it, a keyer chip, and a pot. It is attached to the side of my trusty single lever paddle. I connect it to my 480 or K3 as I would a straight key or a bug. No big deal to me. Of course, I am old fashioned. Imagine, still using a single lever paddle in this modern age of whatevers that can number messages or entries, self log, and maybe even time the turkey roast. Bill W2BLC K-Line __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Bill and all, There are single lever paddles to be had (but not inexpensive ones). There are two manufacturers of paddles that offer single lever varieties. I am the proud owner of a K3ZN KNSLR single lever paddle set. Tony does make very find paddles and other keying devices, smooth as silk. Begali also makes single lever models. There may be others, but those are the two I know about without doing a Google search. I do have a couple others that are in the 'junk' category. Some dual lever paddles can be altered to provide single lever action by placing a fixed spacer between the two paddles, but that works on some, but not others. If the pivot pins are between the finger grips and the contacts, that will not work, but if the contacts are between the pivots and the finger grips, the spacer solution will work fine. 73, Don W3FPR On 12/9/2014 7:35 PM, W2BLC wrote: I learned on a Vibroplex single lever paddle and a Hallicrafters HA-1 TO Keyer. That was in the 60s. Single lever paddles appear to have gone the way, as most of the current rigs (K3 included) do not well support such a key. Hence, I built a little box with a couple of 2032 batteries in it, a keyer chip, and a pot. It is attached to the side of my trusty single lever paddle. I connect it to my 480 or K3 as I would a straight key or a bug. No big deal to me. Of course, I am old fashioned. Imagine, still using a single lever paddle in this modern age of whatevers that can number messages or entries, self log, and maybe even time the turkey roast. Bill W2BLC K-Line __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to w3...@embarqmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
> Single lever paddles appear to have gone the way, Vibroplex, Begali, Schurr (Scheurnemann) and others still offer single lever paddles. most of the current rigs (K3 included) do not well support such a key Any of the rigs, including the K3, that include keyers work just fine with single lever paddles. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 2014-12-09 7:35 PM, W2BLC wrote: I learned on a Vibroplex single lever paddle and a Hallicrafters HA-1 TO Keyer. That was in the 60s. Single lever paddles appear to have gone the way, as most of the current rigs (K3 included) do not well support such a key. Hence, I built a little box with a couple of 2032 batteries in it, a keyer chip, and a pot. It is attached to the side of my trusty single lever paddle. I connect it to my 480 or K3 as I would a straight key or a bug. No big deal to me. Of course, I am old fashioned. Imagine, still using a single lever paddle in this modern age of whatevers that can number messages or entries, self log, and maybe even time the turkey roast. Bill W2BLC K-Line __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to li...@subich.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
The internal keyers on several rigs I have used, including the K3, do not well support the single lever paddle. They are progressive, offering versions of Iambic keying only. If they did function properly with a single lever paddle - then why do you suppose I built a keyer to use with my paddle? Bill W2BLC K-Line __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Bill - I don't understand what you mean by "They are progressive...". I use a single lever paddle, and have for years, with my IC-7000, with a borrowed IC-756 Pro III, and for about 3 years now, with my K3. Dave - K9FN On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 8:56 PM, W2BLC wrote: > The internal keyers on several rigs I have used, including the K3, do not > well support the single lever paddle. They are progressive, offering > versions of Iambic keying only. If they did function properly with a > single lever paddle - then why do you suppose I built a keyer to use with > my paddle? > > Bill W2BLC K-Line > > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to dpbu...@gmail.com > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Here is another single lever paddle: http://www.americanmorse.com/bushwhacker.htm Pretty decent bang for the buck. 73, Bob K2TK On 12/9/2014 8:37 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > Single lever paddles appear to have gone the way, Vibroplex, Begali, Schurr (Scheurnemann) and others still offer single lever paddles. most of the current rigs (K3 included) do not well support such a key Any of the rigs, including the K3, that include keyers work just fine with single lever paddles. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 2014-12-09 7:35 PM, W2BLC wrote: I learned on a Vibroplex single lever paddle and a Hallicrafters HA-1 TO Keyer. That was in the 60s. Single lever paddles appear to have gone the way, as most of the current rigs (K3 included) do not well support such a key. Hence, I built a little box with a couple of 2032 batteries in it, a keyer chip, and a pot. It is attached to the side of my trusty single lever paddle. I connect it to my 480 or K3 as I would a straight key or a bug. No big deal to me. Of course, I am old fashioned. Imagine, still using a single lever paddle in this modern age of whatevers that can number messages or entries, self log, and maybe even time the turkey roast. Bill W2BLC K-Line __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
> They are progressive, offering versions of Iambic keying only. The fact that a keyer offers Iambic A/Iambic B has *nothing* to do with the ability to support a single lever paddle. I have used single lever paddles with the Iambic keyers in Icom (IC-706mkIIg), Yaesu (FT-1000D, FT-1000MP MKV, FT-2000) and Elecraft (K3) with no issues. The iambic features of the keyer are not active unless both left and right contacts are closed at the same time - which is a physical impossibility with a single lever paddle. > then why do you suppose I built a keyer to use with my paddle? I have no idea why you built a totally unnecessary keyer to use with your paddle. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 2014-12-09 8:56 PM, W2BLC wrote: The internal keyers on several rigs I have used, including the K3, do not well support the single lever paddle. They are progressive, offering versions of Iambic keying only. If they did function properly with a single lever paddle - then why do you suppose I built a keyer to use with my paddle? Bill W2BLC K-Line __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to li...@subich.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Agreed on "bang for the buck"; another in that category IMHO is the Kent SP-1. I have both, with a slight edge to the Kent, but YMMV. And, for the op who wants the feel of a bug with an electronic keyer, the Vibroplex "VibroKeyer" is still in production... fifty years after it was introduced 73, Al On Tue December 9 2014 8:11:51 pm Bob wrote: > Here is another single lever paddle: > > http://www.americanmorse.com/bushwhacker.htm > > Pretty decent bang for the buck. > > 73, > Bob > K2TK > > On 12/9/2014 8:37 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > > > Single lever paddles appear to have gone the way, > > > > Vibroplex, Begali, Schurr (Scheurnemann) and others still offer single > > lever paddles. > > > >> most of the current rigs (K3 included) do not well support such a key > > > > Any of the rigs, including the K3, that include keyers work just fine > > with single lever paddles. > > > > 73, > > > >... Joe, W4TV > > > > On 2014-12-09 7:35 PM, W2BLC wrote: > >> I learned on a Vibroplex single lever paddle and a Hallicrafters HA-1 TO > >> Keyer. That was in the 60s. > >> > >> Single lever paddles appear to have gone the way, as most of the current > >> rigs (K3 included) do not well support such a key. Hence, I built a > >> little box with a couple of 2032 batteries in it, a keyer chip, and a > >> pot. It is attached to the side of my trusty single lever paddle. I > >> connect it to my 480 or K3 as I would a straight key or a bug. No big > >> deal to me. > >> > >> Of course, I am old fashioned. Imagine, still using a single lever > >> paddle in this modern age of whatevers that can number messages or > >> entries, self log, and maybe even time the turkey roast. > >> > >> Bill W2BLC K-Line > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to wb5...@centurytel.net __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
I agree, the single lever Kent (SP-1) is a good value for the price. Very well made and has a good solid feel. http://www.dxengineering.com/parts/kmk-sp-1 73, Bill - NA5DX On 12/9/2014 9:41 PM, elecraft-requ...@mailman.qth.net wrote: Message: 31 Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2014 21:41:28 -0600 From: Al Gulseth To:elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3? Message-ID:<201412092141.29162.wb5...@centurytel.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Agreed on "bang for the buck"; another in that category IMHO is the Kent SP-1. I have both, with a slight edge to the Kent, but YMMV. And, for the op who wants the feel of a bug with an electronic keyer, the Vibroplex "VibroKeyer" is still in production... fifty years after it was introduced 73, Al __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Folks, I actually have a "real" Vibroplex, given to me by a friend who was a Coast Guard Radioman. It has all the problems of a basic Vibroplex, mainly dots way too fast. I tried putting a little cable clamp on it as some of my crew did years ago, but that adds a lot of inertia and probably accounts for why I slap my iambic paddle around now ... no squeezing. My Lionel J-36, beat up as it was, ran just fine and I had the only perfect fist on the radio. :-) Once I moved to electronic keyers, of increasing complexity, I can't go back to a bug, nor do I want to, I'm old and manual dexterity is waning [along with other things]. 73, Fred K6DGW - Northern California Contest Club - CU in the 50th Running of the Cal QSO Party 3-4 Oct 2015 - www.cqp.org On 12/9/2014 7:41 PM, Al Gulseth wrote: Agreed on "bang for the buck"; another in that category IMHO is the Kent SP-1. I have both, with a slight edge to the Kent, but YMMV. And, for the op who wants the feel of a bug with an electronic keyer, the Vibroplex "VibroKeyer" is still in production... fifty years after it was introduced __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Go for a Winkey chip based box, which includes the MicroHam line and the Winkey "house models", and set the mode to "Ultimatic" to use with your single lever paddle. It is the most "natural" by far for someone raised on a mechanical bug and who just can't get themselves to do Iambic. Any box with a keyer chip based on any version of WinKey has IambicA, IambicB and Ultimatic as choices of keying modes. This would be any of the Winkey boxes of course, the MicroHam contest boxes, and others I can't recall at the moment. A single lever paddle and Ultimatic in the Winkey chip have long been my favorite as I was never able to make the transition from mechanical bug to dual lever paddle and the Iambic methods. Guy plus Iambic plus dual lever paddle = sloppy, awful, mistake-ridden code. Just can't do it. Ultimatic plus dual lever paddle = decent code, but after a while my hand cramps. Given the various things that have to go on controlling a contest station and the very useful integration of functions, I have a MicroHam "CW Keyer" which was my first MicroHam purchase and now a MicroHam u2R which very nicely works my K3 and K2 side-by-side. I have never looked back. Some of my friends have the very reasonably priced Winkey USB keyers, and some earlier Winkey boxes, which allow either a logging program or the paddle to drive the output which goes into the K3 straight key jack (not the paddle). I still use a Vibrokeyer single lever paddle which I've had since the 70's, but am seriously looking at the current crop of magnetic single lever paddles. The paddle is plugged into the u2R. For field day, I take along the small MicroHam CW Keyer instead, which provides the complete functionality for N1MM+ to drive it from my laptop. The MicroHam boxes, and the USB Winkey boxes connect to the PC with a USB cable, and provide RS232 signal lines to the transceiver for CAT and command functions. With N1MM+ running, the paddle CW speed is always the same as the box knob or the N1MM+ speed. In N1MM+ the box speed knob also runs the N1MM+ CW speed up and down just like the page up and down keys. It's a very slick station integration, and I do NOT have to use dual lever or my Iambic enemy, and I can switch back and forth with a real bug without my brain blowing fuses. 73, Guy K2AV On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 9:13 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > > > They are progressive, offering versions of Iambic keying only. > > The fact that a keyer offers Iambic A/Iambic B has *nothing* to do > with the ability to support a single lever paddle. I have used single > lever paddles with the Iambic keyers in Icom (IC-706mkIIg), Yaesu > (FT-1000D, FT-1000MP MKV, FT-2000) and Elecraft (K3) with no issues. > The iambic features of the keyer are not active unless both left and > right contacts are closed at the same time - which is a physical > impossibility with a single lever paddle. > > > then why do you suppose I built a keyer to use with my paddle? > > I have no idea why you built a totally unnecessary keyer to use with > your paddle. > > 73, > > ... Joe, W4TV > > > > On 2014-12-09 8:56 PM, W2BLC wrote: > >> The internal keyers on several rigs I have used, including the K3, do >> not well support the single lever paddle. They are progressive, offering >> versions of Iambic keying only. If they did function properly with a >> single lever paddle - then why do you suppose I built a keyer to use >> with my paddle? >> >> Bill W2BLC K-Line >> >> >> __ >> Elecraft mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net >> >> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net >> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html >> Message delivered to li...@subich.com >> >> __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to k2av@gmail.com > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
On Tue,12/9/2014 8:53 PM, Guy Olinger K2AV wrote: Any box with a keyer chip based on any version of WinKey has IambicA, IambicB and Ultimatic as choices of keying modes. This would be any of the Winkey boxes of course, the MicroHam contest boxes, and others I can't recall at the moment. Also the wonderful Yankee Clipper Contest Club's SO2R box. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Ed - KL7UW wrote: > >The K14 offers six keying modes: >1- Iambic-A >2- Iambic-B >3- Ultimatic >4- straight key >5- Dit priority >6- Dash priority > And others have also identified: 7- Mechanical bug 8- CMOS Superkeyer (Logikeyer) That list would be a reasonable 'industry-wide benchmark' for the keying/timing modes that a premium CW transceiver like the K3 should offer as built-in options. Each one of those keying modes has a significant real-world following. Translation: there are significant numbers of K3 users who NEED that specific timing mode in order to operate close to their personal top speed. What K3 users *don't* need is to be told to use an external keyer, an adapter or some other workaround. We already know the workarounds because - even after 7 years - the K3 still needs them. 73 from Ian GM3SEK __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Ian, The K14 and its kin are devices specializing in being keyers; and that's all they were intended to do. Expecting the K3 to have the keying capabilities of one of the specialized K1EL products seems a bit much. A better 'industry-wide benchmark' might be to compare the K3 with other high-end ham transceivers with regard to the keying modes they provide. Phil W7OX On 12/10/14 12:44 AM, Ian White wrote: Ed - KL7UW wrote: The K14 offers six keying modes: 1- Iambic-A 2- Iambic-B 3- Ultimatic 4- straight key 5- Dit priority 6- Dash priority And others have also identified: 7- Mechanical bug 8- CMOS Superkeyer (Logikeyer) That list would be a reasonable 'industry-wide benchmark' for the keying/timing modes that a premium CW transceiver like the K3 should offer as built-in options. Each one of those keying modes has a significant real-world following. Translation: there are significant numbers of K3 users who NEED that specific timing mode in order to operate close to their personal top speed. What K3 users *don't* need is to be told to use an external keyer, an adapter or some other workaround. We already know the workarounds because - even after 7 years - the K3 still needs them. 73 from Ian GM3SEK __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Phil, The Kenwood TS-990S offers "Straight Key", "Paddle", or "Paddle (Bug Key Mode)". In addition it offers Iambic mode A and Iambic mode B when using the electronic keyer. 73, Harry K1RSA -Original Message- From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Phil Wheeler Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 9:41 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3? Ian, The K14 and its kin are devices specializing in being keyers; and that's all they were intended to do. Expecting the K3 to have the keying capabilities of one of the specialized K1EL products seems a bit much. A better 'industry-wide benchmark' might be to compare the K3 with other high-end ham transceivers with regard to the keying modes they provide. Phil W7OX On 12/10/14 12:44 AM, Ian White wrote: > Ed - KL7UW wrote: >> The K14 offers six keying modes: >> 1- Iambic-A >> 2- Iambic-B >> 3- Ultimatic >> 4- straight key >> 5- Dit priority >> 6- Dash priority >> > And others have also identified: > 7- Mechanical bug > 8- CMOS Superkeyer (Logikeyer) > > That list would be a reasonable 'industry-wide benchmark' for the > keying/timing modes that a premium CW transceiver like the K3 should > offer as built-in options. > > Each one of those keying modes has a significant real-world following. > Translation: there are significant numbers of K3 users who NEED that > specific timing mode in order to operate close to their personal top > speed. > > What K3 users *don't* need is to be told to use an external keyer, an > adapter or some other workaround. We already know the workarounds > because - even after 7 years - the K3 still needs them. > > > 73 from Ian GM3SEK __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to hwhi...@maine.rr.com --- This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active. http://www.avast.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Thanks for following my suggestion, Harry. Phil W7OX On 12/10/14 7:02 AM, Harry White wrote: Phil, The Kenwood TS-990S offers "Straight Key", "Paddle", or "Paddle (Bug Key Mode)". In addition it offers Iambic mode A and Iambic mode B when using the electronic keyer. 73, Harry K1RSA -Original Message- From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Phil Wheeler Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 9:41 AM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3? Ian, The K14 and its kin are devices specializing in being keyers; and that's all they were intended to do. Expecting the K3 to have the keying capabilities of one of the specialized K1EL products seems a bit much. A better 'industry-wide benchmark' might be to compare the K3 with other high-end ham transceivers with regard to the keying modes they provide. Phil W7OX On 12/10/14 12:44 AM, Ian White wrote: Ed - KL7UW wrote: The K14 offers six keying modes: 1- Iambic-A 2- Iambic-B 3- Ultimatic 4- straight key 5- Dit priority 6- Dash priority And others have also identified: 7- Mechanical bug 8- CMOS Superkeyer (Logikeyer) That list would be a reasonable 'industry-wide benchmark' for the keying/timing modes that a premium CW transceiver like the K3 should offer as built-in options. Each one of those keying modes has a significant real-world following. Translation: there are significant numbers of K3 users who NEED that specific timing mode in order to operate close to their personal top speed. What K3 users *don't* need is to be told to use an external keyer, an adapter or some other workaround. We already know the workarounds because - even after 7 years - the K3 still needs them. 73 from Ian GM3SEK __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
>Ian, > >The K14 and its kin are devices specializing in >being keyers; and that's all they were intended to >do. Expecting the K3 to have the keying >capabilities of one of the specialized K1EL >products seems a bit much. > >A better 'industry-wide benchmark' might be to >compare the K3 with other high-end ham >transceivers with regard to the keying modes they >provide. > >Phil W7OX > I wouldn't ever ask for all the facilities of a specialized keyer. The wider range of timing options is the only exception, because significant numbers of K3 users NEED a specific timing mode other than Curtis A or Curtis B in order to gain full access to the K3's internal keyer. This is particularly important for the K3 because paddle-sent RTTY and PSK are accessible only through the internal keyer. As regards the comparisons with other high-end transceivers, I would NEVER expect Elecraft to settle for being 'ordinary' or 'average' - not in this way or any other. 73 from Ian GM3SEK >-Original Message- >From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of >Phil Wheeler >Sent: 10 December 2014 14:41 >To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net >Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3? > >On 12/10/14 12:44 AM, Ian White wrote: >> Ed - KL7UW wrote: >>> The K14 offers six keying modes: >>> 1- Iambic-A >>> 2- Iambic-B >>> 3- Ultimatic >>> 4- straight key >>> 5- Dit priority >>> 6- Dash priority >>> >> And others have also identified: >> 7- Mechanical bug >> 8- CMOS Superkeyer (Logikeyer) >> >> That list would be a reasonable 'industry-wide benchmark' for the >> keying/timing modes that a premium CW transceiver like the K3 should >> offer as built-in options. >> >> Each one of those keying modes has a significant real-world following. >> Translation: there are significant numbers of K3 users who NEED that >> specific timing mode in order to operate close to their personal top >> speed. >> >> What K3 users *don't* need is to be told to use an external keyer, an >> adapter or some other workaround. We already know the workarounds >> because - even after 7 years - the K3 still needs them. >> >> >> 73 from Ian GM3SEK > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 3:44 AM, Ian White wrote: > > That list would be a reasonable 'industry-wide benchmark' for the > keying/timing modes that a premium CW transceiver like the K3 should > offer as built-in options. > /rant mode on/ [Medical warning: delete this message now without reading if rants cause you to break out in hives or have other side effects] I specifically do not agree that Ian's list should be a benchmark. The only fully debugged version of a lot of those is copyrighted code in a WinKey product. Ask K1EL how much development and debugging time is vested in that, how many solved once-perplexing problems are now water under the bridge in that mature code. Should we be presuming that some non-licensed code-from-scratch version, even from the gifted crew at Elecraft, could emerge without some significant learning curve that duplicates K1EL's experience in some measure? Part of the problem with the no-external-boxes-need-apply take on this, for many of the rather marvelous contest function integration boxes (like my MicroHam u2R), to make it work the WinKey chip needs to be IN THE BOX, fully integrated. This is so the state of all connected devices can be situationally managed from the BOX's firmware, a really ridiculous task to export to a transceiver. Ask the MicroHam people how much work that firmware has been over the years. Since integrating all of the box functions into the K3 is never going to happen, I have to buy the integration box for the contests anyway. I have the more-than-quite-adequate WinKey functionality in my u2R box. It comes on with the K3, and my paddle is plugged into the u2R for all operations at the shack. So I really would prefer that Elecraft spend their time on stuff that MUST be done in the transceiver, rather than turn half the firmware into accessory routines, which by nature would be an endless source of complaints. (Cue sound of soulful violins) "Why doesn't my transceiver only blow smoke out of my right ear instead of my left when I'm operating SO2R and focus is on the left transceiver?" There are some number of ham entrepreneurs out there (like K4PN, etc) who might do a WinKey chip based add-on board to go inside a K3, **IF** he felt the market was a hundred times the size of the complainer's list here on the reflector, and he could actually charge enough to cover what it cost him, with a little reasonable profit tacked on. Maybe MicroHam could take that on. From here they have the best vantage point to pull it off. My K3 won't wipe my b*tt either, but I'm quite content to leave that means hanging on the WC wall, and effect all that separately, and yes, (gasp) operate it manually manually. Again, it is all too easy to presume or spend someone else's time and money. Bad habit. Wayne and company have been fantastic at sorting out all the stuff, picking out the essentials to spend time on. More more than ANY rig I have seen since 1958, the K3 represents a sure classic, fully-fleshed-out rig that serves just about any operating paradigm. AND, HE IS STILL DOING FIRMWARE-ONLY STUFF FOR FREE (!!!). Match that anywhere else in hamdom. Two WRTC's in a row, and WHAT rig was used most by the teams? By far, no other rig in second place? In this case people are voting with their bank balance. Those numbers are statistically very serious. By a very wide margin, those paying voters have declared the K3 AS the industry-wide benchmark, Ian's contrary declaration notwithstanding. **IF** Wayne, for his own reasons, decides to add Ultimatic to the list of keyer methods, I will certainly enjoy it in a very few specific situations across the year. But whatever else, for me the most annoying CW exercise will be trying to operate the maddening dual-lever paddle on Iambic A on a run I picked up sliding in as relief to a live operating position, and can't stop to switch around cords and menu settings without losing the cool run frequency. And there is nothing Wayne can add to a K3 to help me out. For me none of the various frustrations voiced here rise anywhere near that level. The one great satisfaction I have where I multi-op is that all the rigs at all the positions are K3's, and I always have the benefit of K3 continuing development at every position, and so am always operating the number one rig in the world. I have quit pushing on Elecraft for things that aren't firmware bugs or aren't firmware design choices where 7 or 8 years of field operation have uncovered unintended consequences. Wayne is far, far better at sorting out the stuff than I. And he knows what to do to stay in business. What would all you complainers do if Elecraft went out of business? /rant mode off/ 73, Guy K2AV __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Well said, thank you! Bill W2BLC K-Line __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
Nicely put Guy. My WK3USB has totally replaced my Logikey K5 for everything...not just contests. I think I'll try "Bug Mode" this afternoon, or maybe Ultimatic. I always thought Elecraft should have licensed the WK2/3 chip from K1EL like Micro Ham did. -- R. Kevin Stover AC0H ARRL FISTS #11993 SKCC #215 NAQCC #3441 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bug mode on K3?
There is ample amounts of kool-aid flooding around here still i see...:-) Gary Vk1ZZ K3, KX3, KPA500-FT, KAT500-FT,P3. On 14/12/2014 1:39 AM, "Kevin Stover" wrote: > Nicely put Guy. > My WK3USB has totally replaced my Logikey K5 for everything...not just > contests. > I think I'll try "Bug Mode" this afternoon, or maybe Ultimatic. > I always thought Elecraft should have licensed the WK2/3 chip from K1EL > like Micro Ham did. > > -- > R. Kevin Stover > AC0H > ARRL > FISTS #11993 > SKCC #215 > NAQCC #3441 > > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to vk1zzg...@gmail.com > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
