Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
I am using an Alinco DM-330M power supply. Across the output of the power supply I have a 26 AH battery. If the AC power quits I have many hours to shut down the K3. I have the output of the power supply set to 13.8 V. Should it be slightly higher? How much? Sometimes I do not even turn on the power supply when I get on the air. I keep looking for a power outage, less QRM, QRN. 73, Ty, W1TF (GA), K3 # 696 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
Keep in mind that I've powered down my K3 many, many times by pulling the plug, not hitting the POWER button, with no problems whatsoever. That's why I asked Wayne about it when the issue came up before and he said that it is *possible* for data to be corrupted *if* a write process is going on when power is pulled. Data writes happen in response to many things. One of the engineers would have to list them. But it's obvious that problem doesn't crop of often! One caveat to my experience is that when I "pulled the plug" I had the K3 on the bench in bits, not when I'm operating. It's unlikely I've adjusted any controls or pressed any buttons that might trigger a data write for some time before the power was removed. I'm not losing any sleep over the possibility of a "problem" should I lose mains power suddenly (which happens often in our area). Even if such a power loss happened and caused a data issue, I know I can reload from my pc and be up and running again quickly. It only became an issue when someone who had long been in the habit of simply pulling the "big switch" on his power supply suddenly noticed something odd next time he operated and so I looked into it. I mention it here today for the same reason. It's such an infrequent issue that it's worth knowing about should you experience a power loss and then notice something "funny" about your K3 afterward. The fix is easy and quick. Ron AC7AC -Original Message- Joe, Many thanks for your help. I had been toying with the idea of buying a K3 for use at another QTH, but there the mains supply is not 100% reliable. If bad things can happen if the 13.8V supply shuts down as the result of a mains outage, that is serious. 73, Geoff GM4ESD __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
Personally, I don't see that as a major jeopardy. A UPS is fairly cheap (certainly in comparison to a K3), kicks in within milliseconds, and should easily give you enough time to do an orderly shutdown. Most modern UPS's link to the computer via USB and will provide an orderly shutdown to the computer, so it might even be possible for Windows to execute some sort of script to send the PS0 command to the K3 before it shuts the computer down. In any case, I think the jeopardy for the K3 is not worse than what can happen to your computer if it loses the AC mains during a system disk write operation. The potential loss of valuable data and/or having to reinstall the operating system is a total pain. 73, Dave AB7E Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy wrote: > Joe, > > Many thanks for your help. > > I had been toying with the idea of buying a K3 for use at another QTH, but > there the mains supply is not 100% reliable. If bad things can happen if the > 13.8V supply shuts down as the result of a mains outage, that is serious. > > 73, > Geoff > GM4ESD > > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
Joe, Many thanks for your help. I had been toying with the idea of buying a K3 for use at another QTH, but there the mains supply is not 100% reliable. If bad things can happen if the 13.8V supply shuts down as the result of a mains outage, that is serious. 73, Geoff GM4ESD Joe Planisky wrote on Sunday, June 07, 2009 5:45 PM > From the owners manual (page 44 in rev D2): > > "Remote Power On/Off > > A remote-control system can pull the POWER ON line to ground (ACC > connector, pg. 18) to turn the K3 ON. To turn it OFF, the controller > must send the K3 a "PS0;" remote-control command via the RS232 interface, > then deactivate the POWER ON signal. This sequence ensures that > nonvolatile memory is updated correctly before shut-down." > > Note that it doesn't say how long it takes to update the NVRAM after the > above process is completed. In other words, how soon after deactivating > the POWER ON signal can I shut down the 13.8V supply? > > 73 > -- > Joe KB8AP > > > On Jun 7, 2009, at 9:10 AM, Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy wrote: > >> >> Is there any interface available on the K3 which would allow an external >> automatic protective shutdown system to meet this requirement, rather >> than >> having to press the POWER button by hand? __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
Hi Joe, Give it half a second (literally). In practice it should never take more than 100-200 ms, but this will give you some margin. I'll also note this in the Owner's Manual. 73, Wayne N6KR On Jun 7, 2009, at 9:45 AM, Joe Planisky wrote: > From the owners manual (page 44 in rev D2): > > "Remote Power On/Off > > A remote-control system can pull the POWER ON line to ground (ACC > connector, pg. 18) to turn the K3 ON. To turn it OFF, the controller > must send the K3 a "PS0;" remote-control command via the RS232 > interface, then deactivate the POWER ON signal. This sequence ensures > that nonvolatile memory is updated correctly before shut-down." > > Note that it doesn't say how long it takes to update the NVRAM after > the above process is completed. In other words, how soon after > deactivating the POWER ON signal can I shut down the 13.8V supply? > > 73 > -- > Joe KB8AP --- http://www.elecraft.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
Just felt that a word of reassurance may be worthwhile. My older K3 (#228) has now worked about 35000 QSOs in Africa with appalling power problems - switching off the rig before the PSU would be a luxury indeed. Also losing power while transmitting has been quite frequent (and unavoidable). The K3 appears to be brilliantly able to cope with such misfortunes - and it is equally good at shutting down if something goes adrift. One day I may be unlucky but to date it has been great. 73 Nick G3RWF. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
From the owners manual (page 44 in rev D2): "Remote Power On/Off A remote-control system can pull the POWER ON line to ground (ACC connector, pg. 18) to turn the K3 ON. To turn it OFF, the controller must send the K3 a "PS0;" remote-control command via the RS232 interface, then deactivate the POWER ON signal. This sequence ensures that nonvolatile memory is updated correctly before shut-down." Note that it doesn't say how long it takes to update the NVRAM after the above process is completed. In other words, how soon after deactivating the POWER ON signal can I shut down the 13.8V supply? 73 -- Joe KB8AP On Jun 7, 2009, at 9:10 AM, Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy wrote: > > Is there any interface available on the K3 which would allow an > external > automatic protective shutdown system to meet this requirement, > rather than > having to press the POWER button by hand? __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
I don't know, Geoff. That sounds like a good question for Wayne and the support gang at: k3supp...@elecraft.com I became aware of it only after several people brought up issues on the main reflector and I asked Wayne directly because I had never seen a problem with simply pulling the power cord or shutting off the supply. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy [mailto:gm4...@btinternet.com] Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 9:11 AM To: Ron D'Eau Claire Cc: Elecraft Discussion List Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: > An orderly shutdown requires the POWER button be pressed on the K3 before > the power supply is shut down. --- Ron, Is there any interface available on the K3 which would allow an external automatic protective shutdown system to meet this requirement, rather than having to press the POWER button by hand? 73, Geoff GM4ESD __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: > An orderly shutdown requires the POWER button be pressed on the K3 before > the power supply is shut down. --- Ron, Is there any interface available on the K3 which would allow an external automatic protective shutdown system to meet this requirement, rather than having to press the POWER button by hand? 73, Geoff GM4ESD __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
Sid - Any good computer UPS will keep the K3 running for 32 seconds. I wouldn't transmit during that time, however, unless you allow for that in your UPS's capacity. I recently bought a large-capacity APC unit for our plasma TV to isolate it from the mains (Florida is lightning capital of the world) from Amazon.com. Monty K2DLJ > This brings up the question of what is a good UPS for the K3 and usually > attendant computer? > I live in a rural area and I have the entire house on a 15 KW backup > generator but it requires 32 seconds to kick in. This morning we lost > power for 5 seconds and I was fortunate the "brains" didn't get scrambled. > Sid > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
This brings up the question of what is a good UPS for the K3 and usually attendant computer? I live in a rural area and I have the entire house on a 15 KW backup generator but it requires 32 seconds to kick in. This morning we lost power for 5 seconds and I was fortunate the "brains" didn't get scrambled. Sid Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: > Glad to hear it was such an easy fix, Maarten! But you do bring up an issue > that has appeared on the reflector before: the K3 *wants* an orderly > shutdown sequence to avoid unusual and troublesome issues. > > It's easy to forget that radios like the K3 are more "computer" than "radio" > - at least as many of us know "radios", Hi! > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
Glad to hear it was such an easy fix, Maarten! But you do bring up an issue that has appeared on the reflector before: the K3 *wants* an orderly shutdown sequence to avoid unusual and troublesome issues. An orderly shutdown requires the POWER button be pressed on the K3 before the power supply is shut down. One may be able to shut off the K3 by shutting off the power supply many times, perhaps hundreds of times, without problem, but there's always a chance. Indeed, before I understood the situation, I did just that without incident literally hundreds of times while working on the documentation. It's easy to forget that radios like the K3 are more "computer" than "radio" - at least as many of us know "radios", Hi! The issue is whether the MCU is writing anything to memory at the moment of power loss. If a data write sequence happens to be underway when power is removed, there will be a data loss that may cause a wide range of symptoms. That never happens when the POWER button is used. When you press the POWER button, any processes that need completion are finished automatically before the K3 shuts down. IIRC, the recovery from a 'scrambled' K3 caused by suddenly removing the supply power was to do a full reloading of the firmware. I don't recall whether anyone had to reset the K3 and start over, but that's not a big issue if you've saved your configuration. Ron AC7AC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
Thank you Dave for your reply, but it was a entirely different "problem". I'm embarrassed like you won't believe. Before posting my problem on the reflector I thought I had checked everything to make sure that is was a genuine problem. After an hour of doing something else, I turned the K3 back on and went through all the knobs once more to find out that the MIC gain was set to "0". I had been playing with the MIC gain earlier before and I guess at some point turned the knob counter clockwise. Why? I do not have a clue. I'm glad though that my "problem" is fixed without having to repair anything. Except for my ego that is... Best 73, A embarrassed person 2009/6/7 Dave, G4AON > I had a similar "oops" with my K3, a faulty cable/adapter on the KEY input > socket caused my K3 to go to full CW carrier output on 6m, in a hurry to > stop the transmission, I turned the power supply mains off as the K3's > controls seemed to be locked... Big mistake, the uncontrolled power down of > the K3 while transmitting somehow seems to have put out RF on the KXV3 RF > IN/OUT line and damaged an external 6m pre-amp that was in use at the time. > > There are two issues here: > > 1. If a power supply fails the K3 doesn't seem to do an orderly shutdown if > it's transmitting at the time of power failure. > > 2. The KXV3 shouldn't be able to output TX RF power from the receive > external filter/pre-amp sockets. > > I have repaired my 6m pre-amp (not the Elecraft PR6), but am wary of using > the K3 on 6m again, my TS480SAT doesn't need a pre-amp and will continue to > be my radio of choice for 6m. > > 73 Dave, G4AON > K3/100 #80 > - > > Today I was playing with my K3 AGC settings to learn more about them. At > some point I had placed my Heil Pro Set Plus on top of the K3. A strong > signal presented itself resulting in a increased audio level from the K3’s > speaker. Unfortunately VOX was still on and the K3 started transmitting. I > quickly tried to disengage the VOX but mistakenly hit the power button. > > When I turned the K3 back on it wouldn’t transmit anymore. > __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
I had a similar "oops" with my K3, a faulty cable/adapter on the KEY input socket caused my K3 to go to full CW carrier output on 6m, in a hurry to stop the transmission, I turned the power supply mains off as the K3's controls seemed to be locked... Big mistake, the uncontrolled power down of the K3 while transmitting somehow seems to have put out RF on the KXV3 RF IN/OUT line and damaged an external 6m pre-amp that was in use at the time. There are two issues here: 1. If a power supply fails the K3 doesn't seem to do an orderly shutdown if it's transmitting at the time of power failure. 2. The KXV3 shouldn't be able to output TX RF power from the receive external filter/pre-amp sockets. I have repaired my 6m pre-amp (not the Elecraft PR6), but am wary of using the K3 on 6m again, my TS480SAT doesn't need a pre-amp and will continue to be my radio of choice for 6m. 73 Dave, G4AON K3/100 #80 - Today I was playing with my K3 AGC settings to learn more about them. At some point I had placed my Heil Pro Set Plus on top of the K3. A strong signal presented itself resulting in a increased audio level from the K3’s speaker. Unfortunately VOX was still on and the K3 started transmitting. I quickly tried to disengage the VOX but mistakenly hit the power button. When I turned the K3 back on it wouldn’t transmit anymore. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] K3 not transmitting anymore
Today I was playing with my K3 AGC settings to learn more about them. At some point I had placed my Heil Pro Set Plus on top of the K3. A strong signal presented itself resulting in a increased audio level from the K3’s speaker. Unfortunately VOX was still on and the K3 started transmitting. I quickly tried to disengage the VOX but mistakenly hit the power button. When I turned the K3 back on it wouldn’t transmit anymore. Not with the mic connected to the rear panel nor from the frond panel. Using VOX of XMIT button makes no difference. The only way the K3 will transmit is when I use the internal ATU. The recorded messages from de DVR worked at first but turning the power off and on once more resulted in the loss of the recorded messages and I am not able to transmit new messages. In TEST mode it is exactly the same, no audio from the mic. I’m afraid I really “foecked oep” this time and that I will have to contact Elecraft and do some repair work :-( 73, Maarten PD2R __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
