Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc 2.9.0 hangs
On 2020-02-02 17:00, Jon Elson wrote: On 02/02/2020 05:04 PM, Thomas D. Dean wrote: On 2020-02-01 20:46, Jon Elson wrote: On 02/01/2020 08:35 PM, Thomas D. Dean wrote: I have been using linuxcnc 2.9.0~Pre0 from sources, run in place. Until today, it has worked, mostly. Before today, about 2x per week it would freeze and I had to cycle power to get it working. Now, linuxcnc freezes. Does it ONLY freeze when LinuxCNC is running? But, just keep working if you DON'T start LinuxCNC? In that case, the most likely problem is the BASE_THREAD has too short a period. Try increasing the BASE_THREAD period in the .ini file and see if that fixes it. I changed the BASE_THREAD period by a factor of 10x then 100x, with the same result. The OS seems to run fine. I did: > cd RTAI/linuxcnc > git pull > cd src > make clean > make > sudo make setuid All this went OK. Elapsed time 20 min, or so. OK, so ONLY your GUI is freezing? One other thing is if you load a very long and complex toolpath, then the 3D preview window can lock up for a long time. The hang was on initial linuxcnc startup. No toolpath was loaded. The machine was hung, the clock was not updating, the mouse pointer would not move, the machine did not respond to the keyboard (ctrl-alt-f3, etc), the machine did not respond to pings. Tom Dean ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc 2.9.0 hangs
On 2020-02-02 22:06, N wrote: Pretty sure I use buster on several machines. You use linuxcnc with buster? Tom Dean ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc 2.9.0 hangs
> On 2020-02-01 20:46, Jon Elson wrote: > > On 02/01/2020 08:35 PM, Thomas D. Dean wrote: > >> I have been using linuxcnc 2.9.0~Pre0 from sources, run in place. > >> Until today, it has worked, mostly. Before today, about 2x per week > >> it would freeze and I had to cycle power to get it working. Now, > >> linuxcnc freezes. > >> > > Does it ONLY freeze when LinuxCNC is running? But, just keep working if > > you DON'T start LinuxCNC? > > In that case, the most likely problem is the BASE_THREAD has too short a > > period. Try increasing > > the BASE_THREAD period in the .ini file and see if that fixes it. > > > > I changed the BASE_THREAD period by a factor of 10x then 100x, with the > same result. Had similar problems and removed graphics card, used the builtin instead and it started to work. Pretty sure I use buster on several machines. ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Open source CNC architecture --> EMC, Electro Magnetic Compability
> ... > The EMC(squared) corporation threatened to sue over anything > that used "EMC" in it, > and so the name had to be changed. LinuxCNC is totally the > continued development > of EMC2, just under a different name. > > Jon Also avoid confusion with Electro Magnetic Compability (EMC) which happen to be a more or less common problem then using servo drives. ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc 2.9.0 hangs
On 2020-02-02 17:02, Jon Elson wrote: On 02/02/2020 06:32 PM, Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote: So the problem started right after you upgraded to the new RTAI kernel? That's where I'd look for a problem first. Ohhh! I NEVER, EVER, update the kernel on a LinuxCNC system. In fact, I NEVER update the kernel on ANY Linux system that has any custom or special drivers on it, as then the drivers can get out of sync with the kernel. If you want a new kernel for some reason, then it is best to just re-install the whole system. My problem started AFTER I used 'apt --fix-broken install'. Since then, I have nothing that worked. I used linuxcnc for at least a month after I started using the git build.+ History, Starting in late November and early December: 1. Install stretch 2. Upgrade to buster, as noted in earlier posts. 3. Git clone ... 4. Install depends 5. configure and build. After this, I DID NOT upgrade the kernel. linuxcnc worked OK, for at least a month. = New Installation of linuxcnc I installed linuxcnc 'stretch' from the iso. 'Wheezy' has too much jitter. I installed a new disk drive and installed to it. After the install, I upgraded linuxcnc from 1:2.7.14 to 1:2.7.15 via apt. Linuxcnc 1:2.7.15 'wheezy' works fine. Max Jitter: Servo 4727 Base 8773 Tom Dean ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc 2.9.0 hangs
On 02/02/2020 06:32 PM, Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote: So the problem started right after you upgraded to the new RTAI kernel? That's where I'd look for a problem first. Ohhh! I NEVER, EVER, update the kernel on a LinuxCNC system. In fact, I NEVER update the kernel on ANY Linux system that has any custom or special drivers on it, as then the drivers can get out of sync with the kernel. If you want a new kernel for some reason, then it is best to just re-install the whole system. Jon ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc 2.9.0 hangs
On 02/02/2020 05:04 PM, Thomas D. Dean wrote: On 2020-02-01 20:46, Jon Elson wrote: On 02/01/2020 08:35 PM, Thomas D. Dean wrote: I have been using linuxcnc 2.9.0~Pre0 from sources, run in place. Until today, it has worked, mostly. Before today, about 2x per week it would freeze and I had to cycle power to get it working. Now, linuxcnc freezes. Does it ONLY freeze when LinuxCNC is running? But, just keep working if you DON'T start LinuxCNC? In that case, the most likely problem is the BASE_THREAD has too short a period. Try increasing the BASE_THREAD period in the .ini file and see if that fixes it. I changed the BASE_THREAD period by a factor of 10x then 100x, with the same result. The OS seems to run fine. I did: > cd RTAI/linuxcnc > git pull > cd src > make clean > make > sudo make setuid All this went OK. Elapsed time 20 min, or so. OK, so ONLY your GUI is freezing? One other thing is if you load a very long and complex toolpath, then the 3D preview window can lock up for a long time. Jon ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] install problems
On Fri, 31 Jan 2020 at 19:50, dave engvall wrote: > so I grabbed a new disc and installed stretch ... iso. > Looks pretty, comes up nicely. > > However invoking linuxcnc only brings up the ---sim stuff. I can get at > other stuff thru by-interface but in frustration manually copied the > 5i20.ini, hm2-servo.hal, in to configs and edited the ini to reflect > reasonable values for my system. Asked for tklinuxcnc because it is > easy. All that will come up is axis. Are you saying that the Stretch ISO does not run tklinuxcnc configs? -- atp "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics." — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912 ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Open source CNC architecture
On 02/02/2020 02:34 PM, Gene Heskett wrote: On Sunday 02 February 2020 14:14:16 Rafael Skodlar wrote: EMC (Enhanced Machine Control) seems to have fizzled out. No it hasn't, but the other emc objected to the name so it was changed to LinuxCNC, several years ago, and it sure as hell hasn't died. OK, for those who don't know, the original EMC (Enhanced Machine Control) was written by NIST (National Institutes of Standards and Technology) and provided to the first outside users in about 1996. It had stagnated due to some limitations in scope (much having to do with things like lathe threading). John Kasunich spent over a year hacking some major entanglements apart and inserting HAL between major components of EMC to create EMC2 in about 2005. This made such things as lathe threading, rigid tapping, inventive homing sequences, tool changers, etc. much more flexible. The EMC(squared) corporation threatened to sue over anything that used "EMC" in it, and so the name had to be changed. LinuxCNC is totally the continued development of EMC2, just under a different name. Jon ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc 2.9.0 hangs
On 2/1/20 10:23 PM, Thomas D. Dean wrote: On 2020-02-01 20:46, Jon Elson wrote: On 02/01/2020 08:35 PM, Thomas D. Dean wrote: I have been using linuxcnc 2.9.0~Pre0 from sources, run in place. Until today, it has worked, mostly. Before today, about 2x per week it would freeze and I had to cycle power to get it working. Now, linuxcnc freezes. Does it ONLY freeze when LinuxCNC is running? But, just keep working if you DON'T start LinuxCNC? In that case, the most likely problem is the BASE_THREAD has too short a period. Try increasing the BASE_THREAD period in the .ini file and see if that fixes it. This has been working for several months. Today, I used apt --fix-broken install which removed the (broken?) linuxcnc package and now I have this problem. I initially installed from a DVD, linuxcnc 2.7.14, in Oct 2019. Then, upgraded to buster. Is it possible something from linuxcnc* or linuxcnc-dev* needed for running from the git sources? I use run-in-place. Tom Dean = upgrade to buster cd ~/RTAI wget http://www.linuxcnc.org/temp/linux-headers-4.14.148-rtai-amd64.deb wget http://www.linuxcnc.org/temp/linux-image-4.14.148-rtai-amd64.deb wget http://www.linuxcnc.org/temp/linuxcnc-dev_2.8.0~pre1_amd64.deb wget http://www.linuxcnc.org/temp/linuxcnc-doc-en_2.8.0~pre1_all.deb wget http://www.linuxcnc.org/temp/linuxcnc_2.8.0~pre1_amd64.deb wget http://www.linuxcnc.org/temp/rtai-modules-4.14.148_5.2.3-linuxcnc_amd64.deb sudo bash cd /etc/apt mv sources.list sources.list.bak cat sources.list.bak | sed 's/stretch/buster/g' > sources.list exit sudo apt-get update sudo apt-get upgrade sudo apt-get dist-upgrade hostnamectl sudo reboot cd ~/RTAI sudo apt-get install linux-image-4.14.148-rtai-amd64.deb sudo apt-get install linux-headers-4.14.148-rtai-amd64.deb sudo apt-get install rtai-modules-4.14.148_5.2.3-linuxcnc_amd64.deb sudo apt-get install linuxcnc_2.8.0~pre1_amd64.deb sudo apt-get install linuxcnc-dev_2.8.0~pre1_amd64.deb sudo apt-get install linuxcnc-doc-en_2.8.0~pre1_all.deb So the problem started right after you upgraded to the new RTAI kernel? That's where I'd look for a problem first. -- Sebastian Kuzminsky ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc 2.9.0 hangs
On 2020-02-01 20:46, Jon Elson wrote: On 02/01/2020 08:35 PM, Thomas D. Dean wrote: I have been using linuxcnc 2.9.0~Pre0 from sources, run in place. Until today, it has worked, mostly. Before today, about 2x per week it would freeze and I had to cycle power to get it working. Now, linuxcnc freezes. Does it ONLY freeze when LinuxCNC is running? But, just keep working if you DON'T start LinuxCNC? In that case, the most likely problem is the BASE_THREAD has too short a period. Try increasing the BASE_THREAD period in the .ini file and see if that fixes it. I changed the BASE_THREAD period by a factor of 10x then 100x, with the same result. The OS seems to run fine. I did: > cd RTAI/linuxcnc > git pull > cd src > make clean > make > sudo make setuid All this went OK. Elapsed time 20 min, or so. Tom Dean ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Open source CNC architecture
On Sunday 02 February 2020 14:14:16 Rafael Skodlar wrote: > On 2020-01-29 09:35, Stuart Stevenson wrote: > > On Wed, Jan 29, 2020 at 3:34 AM Les Newell > > wrote: > > ... snip > > > Another story > > In 1997 I purchased a 5 axis license from OpenCNC (MDSI2). OpenCNC > > (closed source) ran on QNX RTOS (closed source) using hardware from > > a list of . The Open meant OpenCNC didn't have hardware to sell but > > they supported a limited list of approved vendors (all closed > > source). The hardware vendors were very proud of their offerings. I > > ended up with three 5 axis machines running OpenCNC. I had to have a > > license to run each machine. Software and hardware was something > > just south of USD20,000.00 per machine. One of the machines was > > running OpenCNC (QNX) until 2017. > > Open had a slightly different meaning than we think of open today. > > :) I will say I liked their product. Their total package including > > documentation was complete enough I was able to install, configure > > and run it with minimal contact with OpenCNC staff. They were very > > helpful and knowledgeable. A very polished organization. I purchased > > their API and would probably still be running their software today > > but in the next release they left QNX and settled exclusively on > > Windows and Venturcom RTOS. They would no longer support QNX. I > > almost cried. I called my contact and told him they just lost me as > > I would not purposely install Windows on my machine. For me this was > > preLinux. I came from (I am no VMS guru) VMS and Windows. I know the > > difference between a productive OS and a pretty OS. I am almost glad > > OpenCNC took the direction they took because if they had not left > > QNX I probably would not have found LinuxCNC. > > They were not visionaries or they would port their application to > Linux. > > > When I bought the software OpenCNC was already in one of the big > > three in Detroit. The requirement was OpenCNC has to look and > > respond EXACTLY like all the other controls in the shop. I was told > > it took the tech department in said shop one day to develop the > > human interface screen and MDSI configured OpenCNC to run just like > > all the other controls in the shop. I don't know if that project is > > ongoing. > > > > A 300 man shop South of Wichita started installing OpenCNC after I > > had completed my installs. I knew a couple of the techs installing > > OpenCNC there and a couple operators running it. All reports were > > the techs and the operators loved it and lobbied for it to be > > installed on every machine. I don't know if that project is ongoing > > as my contacts have either died or retired > > > A four or five man group from Cessna visited my shop to evaluate > > OpenCNC. I believe it was an operator, a maintenance tech, a > > software developer and a finance guy. They installed it on at least > > one flat bed router. Reports are they loved it. Modern Machine Shop > > did a feature on the Cessna install. I don't know if that project > > is ongoing. > > I love reading such stories. Reminds me of a book I was reading about > a tiny lathe secretly built by American POWs in one of Japanese > concentration camps during WWII. > > > Bruce Norse (of Compact II by MDSI and OpenCNC by MDSI2) started > > what became OpenCNC to develop a factory automation application. > > This was to collect information from any and all controls in the > > factory and present it to management. Somewhere around 2000 Briggs > > and Stratton bought MDSI with the plan to utilize the factory > > management software world wide. I am not sure how that worked out > > but in relation to OpenCNC it seemed to stop development. > > > > All of this was during the 1997 through the 2001 time frame. I don't > > know why OpenCNC seemed to go into hibernation then as it was used > > and loved by small shops and very large shops. Maybe Briggs stopped > > it on purpose or with Bruce no longer in ultimate charge there was > > no overriding dream to develop it further. > > Mach guys don't get it either. Their saddle on ... never mind. > Their narrow minded software might die by 1000 CNC cuts. > > > The "OPEN" world had an opportunity to grow and flourish at that > > time and seemed to just fizzle. > > That was dot.com downfall when some of the best went down, Sun > Microsystems, SGI, etc. > > ... snip > > > EMC (Enhanced Machine Control) seems to have fizzled out. No it hasn't, but the other emc objected to the name so it was changed to LinuxCNC, several years ago, and it sure as hell hasn't died. > > That's frustrating indeed. Local Home Brew Robotics Club had an > interesting presentation about ROS (Robot OS) used at Amazon. They are > developing virtual environment to test code written for robotics use. > As we know, robots also use RT kernel in some instances. > > If a giant like Amazon is able to see $$$ in simulating robotics > environments for developers then it might be just a matter of time >
Re: [Emc-users] Open source CNC architecture
On 2020-01-29 09:35, Stuart Stevenson wrote: On Wed, Jan 29, 2020 at 3:34 AM Les Newell wrote: ... snip Another story In 1997 I purchased a 5 axis license from OpenCNC (MDSI2). OpenCNC (closed source) ran on QNX RTOS (closed source) using hardware from a list of . The Open meant OpenCNC didn't have hardware to sell but they supported a limited list of approved vendors (all closed source). The hardware vendors were very proud of their offerings. I ended up with three 5 axis machines running OpenCNC. I had to have a license to run each machine. Software and hardware was something just south of USD20,000.00 per machine. One of the machines was running OpenCNC (QNX) until 2017. Open had a slightly different meaning than we think of open today. :) I will say I liked their product. Their total package including documentation was complete enough I was able to install, configure and run it with minimal contact with OpenCNC staff. They were very helpful and knowledgeable. A very polished organization. I purchased their API and would probably still be running their software today but in the next release they left QNX and settled exclusively on Windows and Venturcom RTOS. They would no longer support QNX. I almost cried. I called my contact and told him they just lost me as I would not purposely install Windows on my machine. For me this was preLinux. I came from (I am no VMS guru) VMS and Windows. I know the difference between a productive OS and a pretty OS. I am almost glad OpenCNC took the direction they took because if they had not left QNX I probably would not have found LinuxCNC. They were not visionaries or they would port their application to Linux. When I bought the software OpenCNC was already in one of the big three in Detroit. The requirement was OpenCNC has to look and respond EXACTLY like all the other controls in the shop. I was told it took the tech department in said shop one day to develop the human interface screen and MDSI configured OpenCNC to run just like all the other controls in the shop. I don't know if that project is ongoing. A 300 man shop South of Wichita started installing OpenCNC after I had completed my installs. I knew a couple of the techs installing OpenCNC there and a couple operators running it. All reports were the techs and the operators loved it and lobbied for it to be installed on every machine. I don't know if that project is ongoing as my contacts have either died or retired > A four or five man group from Cessna visited my shop to evaluate OpenCNC. I believe it was an operator, a maintenance tech, a software developer and a finance guy. They installed it on at least one flat bed router. Reports are they loved it. Modern Machine Shop did a feature on the Cessna install. I don't know if that project is ongoing. I love reading such stories. Reminds me of a book I was reading about a tiny lathe secretly built by American POWs in one of Japanese concentration camps during WWII. Bruce Norse (of Compact II by MDSI and OpenCNC by MDSI2) started what became OpenCNC to develop a factory automation application. This was to collect information from any and all controls in the factory and present it to management. Somewhere around 2000 Briggs and Stratton bought MDSI with the plan to utilize the factory management software world wide. I am not sure how that worked out but in relation to OpenCNC it seemed to stop development. All of this was during the 1997 through the 2001 time frame. I don't know why OpenCNC seemed to go into hibernation then as it was used and loved by small shops and very large shops. Maybe Briggs stopped it on purpose or with Bruce no longer in ultimate charge there was no overriding dream to develop it further. Mach guys don't get it either. Their saddle on ... never mind. Their narrow minded software might die by 1000 CNC cuts. The "OPEN" world had an opportunity to grow and flourish at that time and seemed to just fizzle. That was dot.com downfall when some of the best went down, Sun Microsystems, SGI, etc. ... snip EMC (Enhanced Machine Control) seems to have fizzled out. That's frustrating indeed. Local Home Brew Robotics Club had an interesting presentation about ROS (Robot OS) used at Amazon. They are developing virtual environment to test code written for robotics use. As we know, robots also use RT kernel in some instances. If a giant like Amazon is able to see $$$ in simulating robotics environments for developers then it might be just a matter of time before we see them do the same thing with CNC. Forget about dead end PC motherboards and parallel port! LinuxCNC is largely the result of 4 of 5 guys giving their time and intelligence to the project. In no particular order I thank Matt, Jeff, Chris, John and Stephen. Their contributions were done without profit motive. Another group of men with contributions far in excess of their profit motive is Jon, Peter and Steve. What a group of fine men. This lis
