Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Sebastian Kuzminsky]

Matt Shaver wrote:
> Not that I know of, although I'm not in charge of the compile farm, nor
> am I a release manager. There are scripts to run specific HAL related
> tests (emc2/scripts/tests). If GUI functional tests were to be added,
> there is a list of open source winrunner type systems here:
> http://www.opensourcetesting.org/functional.php
> 
> Of these, this looks friendly and non-threatening:
> https://fedorahosted.org/dogtail/
> 
> The "traditional" tool for test automation is this:
> http://expect.nist.gov/
> 
> IIRC, Fred Proctor at NIST started accumulating expect driven test cases
> way back in the day, but I doubt they have survived the many source code
> tree revisions, if they were ever even committed to CVS to begin with.
> 
> Thanks,
> Matt
> 
> On Thu, 2009-04-23 at 14:09 -0500, Alan wrote:
>> Matt,
>> Just curious if ya'll use anything for testing like winrunner against emc2
>> builds?  Or even file name diff on new builds out of cvs?
>> Just curious.  
>> I know s/w like winrunner (and the like) are pricey but they do automate
>> build testing.  Maytbe someone from one of these companies could donate to
>> the emc cause?

Hi Alan, i run one of emc2's automated build/test robots, so i can speak 
to this issue a bit.

The system I run is here: 
.  It monitors 
three of our branches (2.2, 2.3, and Trunk), and whenever anyone commits 
to those branches, it does nine separate builds.  The nine builds are 
three different configurations (sim, realtime-rip, and realtime debian 
package building) on three different platforms (Ubuntu Dapper, Ubuntu 
Hardy, and Debian Lenny).

The sim and realtime-rip builds run the emc2 test suite (in the "tests/" 
directory in the CVS repo).

In addition, i do occasional (manual) runs of emc2 through Coverity's 
Prevent .  The results are available to anyone 
who's interested, you just have to ask for an account.  I intend to some 
day roll Prevent into the buildbot, but i haven't gotten around to it yet.

Now, all that said, I'd personally really like *more* automated testing 
of emc2.  I'd love to see some kind of unit tests, possibly using the 
Check framework .  I dont know anything 
about WinRunner, but if someone wanted to work on it, i'd be happy to 
try to add it to our buildbot.


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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Matt Shaver]

Not that I know of, although I'm not in charge of the compile farm, nor
am I a release manager. There are scripts to run specific HAL related
tests (emc2/scripts/tests). If GUI functional tests were to be added,
there is a list of open source winrunner type systems here:
http://www.opensourcetesting.org/functional.php

Of these, this looks friendly and non-threatening:
https://fedorahosted.org/dogtail/

The "traditional" tool for test automation is this:
http://expect.nist.gov/

IIRC, Fred Proctor at NIST started accumulating expect driven test cases
way back in the day, but I doubt they have survived the many source code
tree revisions, if they were ever even committed to CVS to begin with.

Thanks,
Matt

On Thu, 2009-04-23 at 14:09 -0500, Alan wrote:
> Matt,
> Just curious if ya'll use anything for testing like winrunner against emc2
> builds?  Or even file name diff on new builds out of cvs?
> Just curious.  
> I know s/w like winrunner (and the like) are pricey but they do automate
> build testing.  Maytbe someone from one of these companies could donate to
> the emc cause?
> 
> Thanks,
> Alan
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Matt Shaver [mailto:m...@mattshaver.com] 
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2009 12:50 PM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system
> 
> On Thu, 2009-04-23 at 08:38 -0600, Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
> > Are you running with the hm2 stepgen's maxvel and maxaccel 5% higher 
> > than the TP's [AXIS_?]MAX*, and still getting following errors?
> 
> I just looked at the particular .ini and .hal files, and, I am sad to
> report, no. I was in a big hurry and somehow forgot to copy these
> parameters from the "prototype lathe" config files to the "production
> lathe" config files.
> 
> I'll have to try again next time I get access to a machine.
> 
> Sorry again for the confusion!
> 
> Thanks,
> Matt
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Sebastian Kuzminsky]

Matt Shaver wrote:
> On Thu, 2009-04-23 at 08:38 -0600, Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
>> Are you running with the hm2 stepgen's maxvel and maxaccel 5% higher 
>> than the TP's [AXIS_?]MAX*, and still getting following errors?
> 
> I just looked at the particular .ini and .hal files, and, I am sad to
> report, no. I was in a big hurry and somehow forgot to copy these

Well I for one am *glad*, not sad, for that report!  ;-)

I bet giving the machine a bit of accel & velocity headroom over the 
trajectory planner will fix things right up.

And then we'll have to think of something else to do at Fest  ;-)


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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Matt Shaver]

On Thu, 2009-04-23 at 08:38 -0600, Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
> Are you running with the hm2 stepgen's maxvel and maxaccel 5% higher 
> than the TP's [AXIS_?]MAX*, and still getting following errors?

I just looked at the particular .ini and .hal files, and, I am sad to
report, no. I was in a big hurry and somehow forgot to copy these
parameters from the "prototype lathe" config files to the "production
lathe" config files.

I'll have to try again next time I get access to a machine.

Sorry again for the confusion!

Thanks,
Matt



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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Rob Jansen]

Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
> I'm glad that worked :-)
> I'm hoping that i'll get stepgen maxaccel=0 working soonish, then we'll 
> make that the default and the user will just set [AXIS] stuff correctly 
> and things'll work.
>   
Just let me know when it's done. I'd be happy to cvs the new sources and 
test this.

Rob

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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Sebastian Kuzminsky]

Rob Jansen wrote:
> Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
>> Are you running with the hm2 stepgen's maxvel and maxaccel 5% higher 
>> than the TP's [AXIS_?]MAX*, and still getting following errors?
>>   
> I changed the hm2 stepgen and maxvel to values that are a bit higher 
> than the AXIS_ values - this works perfectly!
> Might be worth adding this to the manual, otherwise I might be seen as 
> an hm2 guru :-)

I'm glad that worked  :-)

I'm hoping that i'll get stepgen maxaccel=0 working soonish, then we'll 
make that the default and the user will just set [AXIS] stuff correctly 
and things'll work.


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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Rob Jansen]

Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
> Matt Shaver wrote:
>   
> ...
>   
> Are you running with the hm2 stepgen's maxvel and maxaccel 5% higher 
> than the TP's [AXIS_?]MAX*, and still getting following errors?
>   
I changed the hm2 stepgen and maxvel to values that are a bit higher 
than the AXIS_ values - this works perfectly!
Might be worth adding this to the manual, otherwise I might be seen as 
an hm2 guru :-)

Thanks,

Rob

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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Sebastian Kuzminsky]

Matt Shaver wrote:
> On Wed, 2009-04-22 at 22:10 -0600, Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
>> In the awesome future, the hm2 stepgen will have a mode where it blindly 
>> follows the trajectory planner's command, trusting it to accelerate in a 
>> reasonable way.
> 
> I eagerly await the awesome future!
> 
> I did get a chance to test the changes you made in 2.3beta and I was
> still able to get following errors, but I hope to work with you on this
> in Wichita!

Are you running with the hm2 stepgen's maxvel and maxaccel 5% higher 
than the TP's [AXIS_?]MAX*, and still getting following errors?


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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Rob Jansen]

Sebastian,

Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
> Some other thoughts on the hm2-stepper config you linked in an earlier 
> email:
>
> You dont need a BASE_PERIOD for hostmot2 - the base thread is in the FPGA.
>
> Your SERVO and TRAJ periods are both 100,000 ns, which is pretty 
> aggressive, 1,000,000 ns is more typical.  But if this works for you, great!
>   
I know, you mentioned the BASE_PERIOD before. I have been playing around 
a lot with these timings.
I had the SERVO and TRAJ periods set to different values; all the same 
at 100,000 up to 2,000,000 or at different values (BASE < SERVO < TRAJ) 
as suggested by the manual and with/without the BASE_PERIOD.
> For AXIS_0, your steplen and stepspace are both 2500 ns, so your max 
> step rate is 200 K steps/second.  Your scale is 640 steps/inch.  This 
> gives a max speed of 200K/640 = 312.5 inches/second.  Wow.  But you're 
> specifying an [AXIS_0]MAX_VELOCITY of only 25...  Something's not adding 
> up there.  I didnt check the other axes.
I wish that were true. The speed is in mm, not inches.
The steplen and stepspace values are the max. values for the stepper 
controllers (400 kHz max. step frequency was given in the specs, I set 
my system to use 200 kHz max). These are the hardware limitations of the 
stepper controllers.
MAX_VELOCITY is determined by the stepper motors which is set to 25 
mm/sec (or 1.5 m/min) for XYZ axes. This is how I think the files should 
be set up: the stepspace/len values specifying the driver's limitations 
and the MAX_VELOCITY specifying the motor/mechanics speed.
I am thinking of buying new motors/drivers that are able to run at 
higher speeds but with a gantry of about 60 kilos these will never reach 
the max 20 m/s (X travel is < 2 meters).

Thanks,

Rob


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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Matt Shaver]

On Wed, 2009-04-22 at 22:10 -0600, Sebastian Kuzminsky wrote:
> In the awesome future, the hm2 stepgen will have a mode where it blindly 
> follows the trajectory planner's command, trusting it to accelerate in a 
> reasonable way.

I eagerly await the awesome future!

I did get a chance to test the changes you made in 2.3beta and I was
still able to get following errors, but I hope to work with you on this
in Wichita!

Thanks,
Matt



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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Sebastian Kuzminsky]

Rob Jansen wrote:
> So next thing to do is to set the m5i20.00.stepgen.0.maxaccel/maxvel a 
> bit bigger and see what happens.

I think the above configuration change should fix the problem you're 
seeing.  Take a look at the "stepper/stepper_mm.ini" config, it 
specifies both an [AXIS_?]MAX_ACCELERATION and an 
[AXIS_n]STEPGEN_MAXACCEL.  The MAX_ACCELERATION is used by the 
trajectory planner and the STEPGEN_MAXACCEL is used by the stepgen 
driver (in core_stepper.hal).  STEPGEN_MAXACCEL is 4% higher than 
MAX_ACCELERATION, this gives the stepgen enough headroom to catch up 
when the trajectory planner takes off, and avoids the following error.

In the awesome future, the hm2 stepgen will have a mode where it blindly 
follows the trajectory planner's command, trusting it to accelerate in a 
reasonable way.  But this isn't really ready yet.


Some other thoughts on the hm2-stepper config you linked in an earlier 
email:

You dont need a BASE_PERIOD for hostmot2 - the base thread is in the FPGA.

Your SERVO and TRAJ periods are both 100,000 ns, which is pretty 
aggressive, 1,000,000 ns is more typical.  But if this works for you, great!

For AXIS_0, your steplen and stepspace are both 2500 ns, so your max 
step rate is 200 K steps/second.  Your scale is 640 steps/inch.  This 
gives a max speed of 200K/640 = 312.5 inches/second.  Wow.  But you're 
specifying an [AXIS_0]MAX_VELOCITY of only 25...  Something's not adding 
up there.  I didnt check the other axes.


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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Rob Jansen]

Alex Joni wrote:
> You didn't say what emc2 version you're using.
> hm2-stepper has been reworked for 2.3.0, so you might have better success 
> with that.
>   
Yes, I am using 2.3.0. The version I compiled from CVS end of last week 
so the one without the humming and dithering in the motors.
> * you can run the hm2 stepgen with the same limit as emc2 (this has caused 
> some issues with jogging, where the machine accelerates at max_accel
> * you can run the hm2 stepgen with some headroom on accel (setp 
> m5i20.0.stepgen.0.max_accel [AXIS_0]STEPGEN_MAXACCEL <- or something like 
> that).
I got thinking about this when I walked home last night from my toolshop 
(even before reading the tips I got).
Currently I have my  m5i20.00.stepgen.0.maxaccel etc. settings all the 
same as the AXIS_0[MAX_ACCELERATION] setting in the ini file.

I may have missed the part in the documentation where it is explained 
that the values from the AXIS setting sections in the ini file are used 
by the EMC trajectory planner and the m5i20.00.stepgen.0.maxaccel values 
are used by the stepgen controller in the FPGA. If there is a timing 
difference between the two, EMC could trip the joint following error 
when the 5i20 lags behing. This is explained in the servo section but 
not mentioned for steppers - and I now got to the point where I 
understand that the hostmot2 steppers are fully controlled by the 
stepgen controllers in the FPGA and act like a servo system towards EMC.
I was tempting to walk back and try but at that time is was 11 pm. Now 
it is about 5:30 am and I still have to do some homework for a course I 
am having this week ...
So next thing to do is to set the m5i20.00.stepgen.0.maxaccel/maxvel a 
bit bigger and see what happens.

Thanks,

Rob

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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Chris Radek]

On Wed, Apr 22, 2009 at 10:32:33PM +0200, Rob Jansen wrote:
> 
> whatever I try I keep having joint 
> following errors.

what emc version?


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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Eric H. Johnson]

Alex,

Well yea, then start backing it back down. But I got fooled on that because
I did not increase FError enough to see a difference, and hence started
looking at other parameters. Sort of like he is doing now. This is just
proving that FError is the parameter you want to look at adjusting.

Regards,
Eric


Having such a large FERROR is bogus imo.
Basicly you're telling the machine it can deviate 100 units from path, and
you don't mind...

It's probably less bad in mm, but still worlds away from a precise part.



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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Alex Joni]

Having such a large FERROR is bogus imo.
Basicly you're telling the machine it can deviate 100 units from path, and 
you don't mind...

It's probably less bad in mm, but still worlds away from a precise part.

Regards,
Alex

> Rob,
>
> Have you tried adjusting FError and Min_FError?  You can increase FError 
> by
> quite a bit, say 100 or higher if necessary. In my case that got rid of 
> most
> of the following errors. The one instance I would still get them is in a
> sequence of G0 moves, such as retract, move, plunge (I am using a laser, 
> so
> I can get away with it ). Between the move and the plunge, I would
> occasionally get following errors. If you get these, then increase
> Min_FError until they go away.
>
> Regards,
> Eric
>
>
>
> the past week(s) I have been working on getting  my hostmot2 system 
> running
> with the Mesa 5i20 card and stepper motors.
> Up to a certain point this is a success. But there still is this problem
> with joint following errors - whatever I try I keep having joint following
> errors.
>
> I tried different values for all kinds of parameters but things only seem 
> to
> work reliable when I put in extreme high numbers for the MAX_ACCEL values
> (1000 instead of the wanted 100). Then I do not see any joint following
> errors but the abrupt start/stop of the machine is not good for the
> mechanics...
>
> The parport configuration on the same machine runs perfectly well with
> MAX_VELOCITY=25 and MAX_ACCELERATION=100 (mm/s) but the hostmo2
> configuration keeps having problems.
> I tried lots of different timing where BASE_PERIOD,SERVO_PERIOD and
> TRAJ_PERIOD are small, larger, different values or the same but nothing
> seems to help.
>
> I am getting kind of desperate. With the 5i20 hostmot2 configuration 
> things
> only are working as long as I keep my jog under ~400 mm/min as soon as I 
> go
> higher (and up to the max 1500 mm/min) the joint following error appears 
> on
> any of the axis as soon as I jog by repeated presses of the keyboard jogs
> quickly after each other.
>
> What causes this joint following error and how to fix it?
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Alex Joni]

You didn't say what emc2 version you're using.
hm2-stepper has been reworked for 2.3.0, so you might have better success 
with that.
(basicly it's using a similar code to the software step generator).

Try it out, but remember there are a couple of things that you can still do 
to 2.3.0:
* you can run the hm2 stepgen without accel limits (leaving it at 0 will 
allow it to accel as it shoul - based on the values that come from the 
Trajectory Planner)
* you can run the hm2 stepgen with the same limit as emc2 (this has caused 
some issues with jogging, where the machine accelerates at max_accel
* you can run the hm2 stepgen with some headroom on accel (setp 
m5i20.0.stepgen.0.max_accel [AXIS_0]STEPGEN_MAXACCEL <- or something like 
that).

Regards,
Alex


- Original Message - 
From: "Rob Jansen" 
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
Sent: Wednesday, April 22, 2009 11:34 PM
Subject: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system


> forgot a link to my configs: http://www.myvoice.nl/freesmachine/configs/
>
> The "elan" config is the old parport config, hm2-stepper the hostmot2
> stepper motor config.
>
> Rob
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Eric H. Johnson]

Rob,

Have you tried adjusting FError and Min_FError?  You can increase FError by
quite a bit, say 100 or higher if necessary. In my case that got rid of most
of the following errors. The one instance I would still get them is in a
sequence of G0 moves, such as retract, move, plunge (I am using a laser, so
I can get away with it ). Between the move and the plunge, I would
occasionally get following errors. If you get these, then increase
Min_FError until they go away.

Regards,
Eric



the past week(s) I have been working on getting  my hostmot2 system running
with the Mesa 5i20 card and stepper motors.
Up to a certain point this is a success. But there still is this problem
with joint following errors - whatever I try I keep having joint following
errors.

I tried different values for all kinds of parameters but things only seem to
work reliable when I put in extreme high numbers for the MAX_ACCEL values
(1000 instead of the wanted 100). Then I do not see any joint following
errors but the abrupt start/stop of the machine is not good for the
mechanics...

The parport configuration on the same machine runs perfectly well with
MAX_VELOCITY=25 and MAX_ACCELERATION=100 (mm/s) but the hostmo2
configuration keeps having problems.
I tried lots of different timing where BASE_PERIOD,SERVO_PERIOD and
TRAJ_PERIOD are small, larger, different values or the same but nothing
seems to help.

I am getting kind of desperate. With the 5i20 hostmot2 configuration things
only are working as long as I keep my jog under ~400 mm/min as soon as I go
higher (and up to the max 1500 mm/min) the joint following error appears on
any of the axis as soon as I jog by repeated presses of the keyboard jogs
quickly after each other.

What causes this joint following error and how to fix it?



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[Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Rob Jansen]

forgot a link to my configs: http://www.myvoice.nl/freesmachine/configs/

The "elan" config is the old parport config, hm2-stepper the hostmot2 
stepper motor config.

Rob

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[Emc-users] Help configuring hostmot2 stepper system

[Rob Jansen]

Hi,

the past week(s) I have been working on getting  my hostmot2 system 
running with the Mesa 5i20 card and stepper motors.
Up to a certain point this is a success. But there still is this problem 
with joint following errors - whatever I try I keep having joint 
following errors.

I tried different values for all kinds of parameters but things only 
seem to work reliable when I put in extreme high numbers for the 
MAX_ACCEL values (1000 instead of the wanted 100). Then I do not see any 
joint following errors but the abrupt start/stop of the machine is not 
good for the mechanics...

The parport configuration on the same machine runs perfectly well with 
MAX_VELOCITY=25 and MAX_ACCELERATION=100 (mm/s) but the hostmo2 
configuration keeps having problems.
I tried lots of different timing where BASE_PERIOD,SERVO_PERIOD and 
TRAJ_PERIOD are small, larger, different values or the same but nothing 
seems to help.

I am getting kind of desperate. With the 5i20 hostmot2 configuration 
things only are working as long as I keep my jog under ~400 mm/min as 
soon as I go higher (and up to the max 1500 mm/min) the joint following 
error appears on any of the axis as soon as I jog by repeated presses of 
the keyboard jogs quickly after each other.

What causes this joint following error and how to fix it?

Regards,

Rob

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around Java (TM) technology - register by April 22, and save
$200 on the JavaOne (SM) conference, June 2-5, 2009, San Francisco.
300 plus technical and hands-on sessions. Register today. 
Use priority code J9JMT32. http://p.sf.net/sfu/p
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