Re: [EVDL] My Experience with eMotorWerks

[Ken Olum via EV]

I bought a Pro 40 in 2015, even though I only have an 20A outlet in my
garage and upgrading is not simple because the garage is connected to
the house by a buried cable.  I got it with the idea that I might take
it with me and plug in to people's range outlets or at campgrounds,
though I never have.

I adjusted the maximum current to 16A using the app, but every so often
the charger would trip the circuit breaker and I would wake up to an
uncharged car.  I was completely unable to get any help from eMotorWerks
support.  Fortunately, this charger was open source. (Is it still?  I
couldn't find the source today.)  Reading the source I discovered that
when the charger cannot connect to the server for 90 seconds, it forgets
the server current limit.  What an awful design!  It should keep the
last current limit that it saw.

Fortunately I was able to open up the charger and adjust the
potentiometer that gives a hardware limit on the current draw, so now
I'm able to charge reliably, no thanks to eMotorWerks.  If I ever wanted
to use it for higher currents I would have to adjust the hardware
again.

Ken
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Re: [EVDL] My Experience with eMotorWerks

[Cor van de Water via EV]

Damon,
Thanks for sharing your experience.
We are very aware of the issue you are reporting.

First a full disclosure:
As of this morning (Jan 7, 2019), I will be responsible for all hardware 
(electronics) development at eMotorWerks.
This means I can influence the future (not the past, did not get the flux 
capacitor to work yet).

Now for a bit of background:
The WiFi chip in the JuiceBox is updated using the service of a 3rd party. We 
are responsible for the development and testing of the code, then we push it to 
the cloud and it is transferred (OTA) outside of our control. We can only 
prepare a release and pull the trigger. That process has not always worked well 
as you have noticed, for that I can only offer an apology, not a solution. The 
communication with the 3rd party is outside my direct observation so I do not 
know the exact status and whether the issues that we were experiencing in the 
OTA are now solved or not, I can ask my colleague for an update.
As far as I have heard, we do understand the issue and the circumstances 
leading to it better and the 3rd party has taken steps to avoid “bricking” the 
WiFi of the JuiceBoxes in the field.
We have a stake in good working JuiceBoxes that are internet connected, since 
we sell not only JuiceBoxes (so it is our name attached to the product) but 
also Energy Services, which means for example that for owners who opt to allow 
remote control of their charging, we can provide added value to charge your EV 
on Renewable Energy only, for example. Or not charge when the grid is (almost) 
overloaded. The latter is part of a package that can pay you a monthly bonus 
for allowing the grid operator to delay your charging for a certain amount of 
time.
You are also getting benefit of the internet connection in the form of feedback 
in an App on your phone or a webpage on your computer, showing the status and 
history of the charging.
Lots of features and while most of it already works, we are also continually 
improving so we welcome feedback to hear from you what it is that you need.

This all to say that we want JuiceBoxes to connect to the internet, so if you 
want you can re-open the ticket and get the WiFi connectivity fixed instead of 
having a box without all the smarts.
Your choice, of course.
Regards,
Cor.

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Damon Henry via EV
Sent: Monday, January 7, 2019 2:57 PM
To: EV List
Cc: Damon Henry
Subject: [EVDL] My Experience with eMotorWerks

Last year I bought an EV Juicebox 40.  I did not opt for the Pro model because 
I did not see much value in the internet side of the product.  I mostly liked 
the fact that I could max out my circuit with it even though I do not currently 
have any vehicles which charge at that high of a rate.  Still even the non-pro 
version comes with some internet dependent features some of which were 
interesting enough to me to connect the charger to my WiFi and download the App 
on my phone.  Then last summer I got an email telling me that eMotorWerks had 
tried to push out an update to my charger that had disabled the WiFi and it was 
no longer online.  They needed it back to fix the problem and offered me a free 
replacement which they were willing to ship out first and then let me return 
mine.  That seemed reasonable and the whole exchange process was pretty 
painless.  It just took a few emails and a couple of forms, and they paid for 
everything.

It did bug me a bit that they had botched an over the air update.  I have spent 
a career in IT with large portions of it dedicated to automatically updating 
networked computers, so I have some sensitivity to the caution needed to 
successfully pull this type of thing off.

I got the replacement charger and hooked it up to my WiFi.  Then a couple of 
months later I noticed that it was once again not connected to my WiFi. I 
opened a ticket with their support organization and asked them if they had 
perhaps once again busted my charger for me.  They did not directly answer that 
question, but did once again offer to exchange the unit.

At this point I did not jump on the exchange.  First of all I did not feel like 
doing the paperwork again even though it was fairly easy.  Mostly though it 
bothered me that they possibly kept breaking my charger.  Not in a way that 
kept my cars from charging, but how was I to know that would always be the 
case.  I kept dragging my feet on the exchange as well as badgering them for a 
root cause.  Eventually they claimed that the WiFi chip goes into a safe mode 
when it experiences a weak wifi signal.  This did not sound right to me on many 
levels, although perhaps it is true.  My charger is physically perhaps 6 feet 
away from my Access Point.  Also, if it were hardware related why would they 
ship me a new unit with the same problem as the one they had to replace 
already?  Maybe I am being too skeptical...

Eventually, I decided I would go forward with the exchange, but not connect the 
new charger 

Re: [EVDL] My Experience with eMotorWerks

[Jay Summet via EV]

I have the JuiceBox Pro 40 (for the last 4-5 years now).  Once or twice 
in that time it has dropped off my wifi, but I was able to get it back 
on by power cycling it, and following the "initial setup" procedure. 
(i.e. it had gone to a "safe mode" and lost my wifi password, but I was 
able to reset it and get it back on the network without shipping it back.)


In all cases the EVSE still charged my vehicle, even if it had lost 
network connectivity.


EMotorWorks has been very accommodating for other issues I've had with 
it (that ended up being a problem with my charger in the vehicle, not 
the EVSE), and I've been happy with their service and product.


If I need a new EVSE I plan on buying their current Pro 40 model (which 
now comes with UL certification.mine is old enough it was before 
they spent the money for the certification, although basically the same 
unit.)


Jay

On 1/7/19 5:57 PM, Damon Henry via EV wrote:

Last year I bought an EV Juicebox 40.  I did not opt for the Pro model because 
I did not see much value in the internet side of the product.  I mostly liked 
the fact that I could max out my circuit with it even though I do not currently 
have any vehicles which charge at that high of a rate.  Still even the non-pro 
version comes with some internet dependent features some of which were 
interesting enough to me to connect the charger to my WiFi and download the App 
on my phone.  Then last summer I got an email telling me that eMotorWerks had 
tried to push out an update to my charger that had disabled the WiFi and it was 
no longer online.  They needed it back to fix the problem and offered me a free 
replacement which they were willing to ship out first and then let me return 
mine.  That seemed reasonable and the whole exchange process was pretty 
painless.  It just took a few emails and a couple of forms, and they paid for 
everything.

It did bug me a bit that they had botched an over the air update.  I have spent 
a career in IT with large portions of it dedicated to automatically updating 
networked computers, so I have some sensitivity to the caution needed to 
successfully pull this type of thing off.

I got the replacement charger and hooked it up to my WiFi.  Then a couple of 
months later I noticed that it was once again not connected to my WiFi. I 
opened a ticket with their support organization and asked them if they had 
perhaps once again busted my charger for me.  They did not directly answer that 
question, but did once again offer to exchange the unit.

At this point I did not jump on the exchange.  First of all I did not feel like 
doing the paperwork again even though it was fairly easy.  Mostly though it 
bothered me that they possibly kept breaking my charger.  Not in a way that 
kept my cars from charging, but how was I to know that would always be the 
case.  I kept dragging my feet on the exchange as well as badgering them for a 
root cause.  Eventually they claimed that the WiFi chip goes into a safe mode 
when it experiences a weak wifi signal.  This did not sound right to me on many 
levels, although perhaps it is true.  My charger is physically perhaps 6 feet 
away from my Access Point.  Also, if it were hardware related why would they 
ship me a new unit with the same problem as the one they had to replace 
already?  Maybe I am being too skeptical...

Eventually, I decided I would go forward with the exchange, but not connect the 
new charger to my WiFi.  Then I would have the functionality I paid for if I 
ever decided I want it, but not have to worry about any unwanted updates.  
Alas, I took too long making up my mind and they closed the support ticket for 
me, so rather than have them reopen it, I just decided to keep my current 
charger as is.

I did send a note to their Customer Service department letting them know of my 
dissatisfaction and that I would not be buying any additional chargers from 
them or recommending them to fellow EVrs.  It is very possible that I will be 
adding a second Level 2 charger in my garage in the near future, but it will 
not be another JuiceBox.

Damon
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Re: [EVDL] My Experience with eMotorWerks

[Damon Henry via EV]

Mine has WiFi only, no Ethernet port.  I think that is the case with all their 
chargers, but I have not thoroughly researched it. Regardless, an improper 
update could just as easily break an Ethernet connection as a WiFi connection.  
For instance it could reset the Gateway address leaving the charger unable to 
reach the internet.

Damon

From: gsb...@protonmail.com 
Sent: Monday, January 7, 2019 3:12 PM
To: Damon Henry via EV
Cc: Damon Henry
Subject: Re: [EVDL] My Experience with eMotorWerks

That’s unfortunate. Do they not offer the ability to hardwire it to your modem 
or router to ensure no connectivity issues?
I personally try to do that with anything that has a wired and wireless ability 
if at all possible for the best possible performance, whether it’s a smart TV, 
XBox, Play Station, or an EV charger for that matter.

Grant

Sent from ProtonMail Mobile


On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 17:57, Damon Henry via EV 
mailto:ev@lists.evdl.org>> wrote:
Last year I bought an EV Juicebox 40. I did not opt for the Pro model because I 
did not see much value in the internet side of the product. I mostly liked the 
fact that I could max out my circuit with it even though I do not currently 
have any vehicles which charge at that high of a rate. Still even the non-pro 
version comes with some internet dependent features some of which were 
interesting enough to me to connect the charger to my WiFi and download the App 
on my phone. Then last summer I got an email telling me that eMotorWerks had 
tried to push out an update to my charger that had disabled the WiFi and it was 
no longer online. They needed it back to fix the problem and offered me a free 
replacement which they were willing to ship out first and then let me return 
mine. That seemed reasonable and the whole exchange process was pretty 
painless. It just took a few emails and a couple of forms, and they paid for 
everything.

It did bug me a bit that they had botched an over the air update. I have spent 
a career in IT with large portions of it dedicated to automatically updating 
networked computers, so I have some sensitivity to the caution needed to 
successfully pull this type of thing off.

I got the replacement charger and hooked it up to my WiFi. Then a couple of 
months later I noticed that it was once again not connected to my WiFi. I 
opened a ticket with their support organization and asked them if they had 
perhaps once again busted my charger for me. They did not directly answer that 
question, but did once again offer to exchange the unit.

At this point I did not jump on the exchange. First of all I did not feel like 
doing the paperwork again even though it was fairly easy. Mostly though it 
bothered me that they possibly kept breaking my charger. Not in a way that kept 
my cars from charging, but how was I to know that would always be the case. I 
kept dragging my feet on the exchange as well as badgering them for a root 
cause. Eventually they claimed that the WiFi chip goes into a safe mode when it 
experiences a weak wifi signal. This did not sound right to me on many levels, 
although perhaps it is true. My charger is physically perhaps 6 feet away from 
my Access Point. Also, if it were hardware related why would they ship me a new 
unit with the same problem as the one they had to replace already? Maybe I am 
being too skeptical...

Eventually, I decided I would go forward with the exchange, but not connect the 
new charger to my WiFi. Then I would have the functionality I paid for if I 
ever decided I want it, but not have to worry about any unwanted updates. Alas, 
I took too long making up my mind and they closed the support ticket for me, so 
rather than have them reopen it, I just decided to keep my current charger as 
is.

I did send a note to their Customer Service department letting them know of my 
dissatisfaction and that I would not be buying any additional chargers from 
them or recommending them to fellow EVrs. It is very possible that I will be 
adding a second Level 2 charger in my garage in the near future, but it will 
not be another JuiceBox.

Damon
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Re: [EVDL] My Experience with eMotorWerks

[Grant via EV]

That’s unfortunate. Do they not offer the ability to hardwire it to your modem 
or router to ensure no connectivity issues?
I personally try to do that with anything that has a wired and wireless ability 
if at all possible for the best possible performance, whether it’s a smart TV, 
XBox, Play Station, or an EV charger for that matter.

Grant

Sent from ProtonMail Mobile

On Mon, Jan 7, 2019 at 17:57, Damon Henry via EV  wrote:

> Last year I bought an EV Juicebox 40. I did not opt for the Pro model because 
> I did not see much value in the internet side of the product. I mostly liked 
> the fact that I could max out my circuit with it even though I do not 
> currently have any vehicles which charge at that high of a rate. Still even 
> the non-pro version comes with some internet dependent features some of which 
> were interesting enough to me to connect the charger to my WiFi and download 
> the App on my phone. Then last summer I got an email telling me that 
> eMotorWerks had tried to push out an update to my charger that had disabled 
> the WiFi and it was no longer online. They needed it back to fix the problem 
> and offered me a free replacement which they were willing to ship out first 
> and then let me return mine. That seemed reasonable and the whole exchange 
> process was pretty painless. It just took a few emails and a couple of forms, 
> and they paid for everything.
>
> It did bug me a bit that they had botched an over the air update. I have 
> spent a career in IT with large portions of it dedicated to automatically 
> updating networked computers, so I have some sensitivity to the caution 
> needed to successfully pull this type of thing off.
>
> I got the replacement charger and hooked it up to my WiFi. Then a couple of 
> months later I noticed that it was once again not connected to my WiFi. I 
> opened a ticket with their support organization and asked them if they had 
> perhaps once again busted my charger for me. They did not directly answer 
> that question, but did once again offer to exchange the unit.
>
> At this point I did not jump on the exchange. First of all I did not feel 
> like doing the paperwork again even though it was fairly easy. Mostly though 
> it bothered me that they possibly kept breaking my charger. Not in a way that 
> kept my cars from charging, but how was I to know that would always be the 
> case. I kept dragging my feet on the exchange as well as badgering them for a 
> root cause. Eventually they claimed that the WiFi chip goes into a safe mode 
> when it experiences a weak wifi signal. This did not sound right to me on 
> many levels, although perhaps it is true. My charger is physically perhaps 6 
> feet away from my Access Point. Also, if it were hardware related why would 
> they ship me a new unit with the same problem as the one they had to replace 
> already? Maybe I am being too skeptical...
>
> Eventually, I decided I would go forward with the exchange, but not connect 
> the new charger to my WiFi. Then I would have the functionality I paid for if 
> I ever decided I want it, but not have to worry about any unwanted updates. 
> Alas, I took too long making up my mind and they closed the support ticket 
> for me, so rather than have them reopen it, I just decided to keep my current 
> charger as is.
>
> I did send a note to their Customer Service department letting them know of 
> my dissatisfaction and that I would not be buying any additional chargers 
> from them or recommending them to fellow EVrs. It is very possible that I 
> will be adding a second Level 2 charger in my garage in the near future, but 
> it will not be another JuiceBox.
>
> Damon
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