[FairfieldLife] Re: Rescue Proposal for Saving Fairfield-Life

[TurquoiseB]

Great idea. Except, in point #2 below, let's pick 
several different people, with completely different 
points of view and things in life that they consider 
"interesting," and allow them *each* to select a 
list of the five posts of the day they consider 
most interesting. Then they'd each post them to a 
centralized list, and what we'd have...uh...Fairfield 
Life as it is today.  :-)

Saints preserve us from would-be "editors" who want
forums that they had no hand in creating, caring for,
and nurturing to conform to *their* ideas of what is
interesting and proper. 

Start your own list, edit away, post on it what you 
think are "the best of Fairfield Life," and see who 
bothers to read it. Somehow I suspect it'll have a 
membership -- and readership -- of one.


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Hagen J. Holtz"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Since many years I am a fan of this list, but I do not find time to
read the 50 - 100 daily messages. So I check the list on random basis
with the uncomfortable back-ground feeling to sometimes miss essential
developments. So I got a "bath-tube session" idea to restructure the
list without depriving it from it's self-reinforcing tendency. My
proposal:
> 
> 1. Someone, who is versified, prepares a link for all members of the
list, in order to put in their real names combined with their
FairfieldLife-identity and a short description of who they are.
> 
> 2. Each of these self-revealing members gets the honestly task to
moderate the commentaries of the list for let's say one week in a year
in sequential rotation, passing the task to the next member, in order
to compress them down to the 10 most interesting contributions of the day.
> 
> 3. In order to be technically affordable, the candidates, who want
to be part of this "race" send their commentaries as usual to the
well-known list address plus to this special link. By this act the
variety and freedom of commenting contributions does not get
diminished and noone can argue against it by suspecting a new
censorship. On the other hand this artifice would help all earnest
members, who have little time and were predominantly interested in
grasping the essentials, to regularly be part of the list and keeping
the thread.
> 
> For some stupid reason, being greeted with smiles by ma family, I
kept the last 100,000 Fairfield-mails like a nostalgic collector
without even reading them. This gives me at least the neurotic
certainty to possess them in order "to be" with you :-).
> 
> If someone would assist me I could take initiative to prepare such a
link, which we may call in future "Fairfield.Essential" or so.
> 
> And there is another advantage regarding this idea. By this act we
can elegantly get sorted out the wheat from the chaff without
offending anybody's freedom to say what he wants at any moment he
wants. And it is also positive that the main list even with all its
scrap continues, because you save the chance to see and judge
eventually different from the contemporarily leading moderator and do
not feel restricted in whatever manner. 
> 
> I have understanding that for some of you it may sound more
complicated but I am inclined to see it more in terms of quality gain
by increasing complexity instead of deterrent aggregation of
frustrating and demotivating opaques. 
> 
> Being with you and your special thoughts about it and agog of your
commentaries about this idea.
> 
> Hagen

[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme

[nablusoss1008]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>  
> In a message dated 3/29/2007 3:28:43 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> 
>  
>  
>  
> --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
(mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) 
> ,  Lsoma@ wrote:
> >
> > 
> > In a message dated 3/29/2007 2:11:45  P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, 
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED])   
writes:
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Questions &  Answers
> > 
> > Q. Is there any specific date for Maitreya's  appearance?
> > A. Most people imagine that world events (and the coming  of a 
> World 
> > Teacher is certainly a world event) take place  according to 
> precise 
> > dates. They imagine that all Hierarchical  decisions are designed 
> for 
> > dates written in stone. This is  assuredly not the case. The 
> Masters 
> > predict certain happenings to  take place around a certain time 
but 
> > They know that humanity has  freewill and therefore has an 
enormous 
> > influence on the precise  timing of a given event. The Masters 
work 
> in 
> > 2,000 year cycles,  so for Them really precise timing is not a 
> major 
> > consideration.  No one knows the exact date on which Maitreya 
will 
> > take up His open  work but everyone can understand that it is 
very, 
> > very soon. 
> >  Since Maitreya will not at first reveal His name and status the 
> onus  
> > is on each one of us to recognize Him by what He says and does. 
In  
> > this way people will be recognizing the expression of their 
> >  aspiration for the future of humanity, rather than simply 
> > following  `The Teacher'.
> > 
> > Q. Is it still expected there will be a  worldwide stock-market 
> crash 
> > before Maitreya's public emergence?  
> > A. No, not necessarily, but the economic movement of the world 
is  
> > towards such a slump, which would probably increase once 
Maitreya  
> > starts His public work. 
> > 
> > Q. (1) Does the US  administration truly believe that Iran is 
> trying 
> > to build a  nuclear weapon or do they just want to remove the 
> Iranian 
> >  president from power? 
> > (2) Does the hypocrisy of trying to pressure  other nations into 
> not 
> > creating their own atomic weapons  programme, while America has a 
> > large nuclear arsenal, not occur to  those in power in the US 
> > government?
> > A. (1) Yes, I believe  they do. (2) Presumably not!
> > 
> > Q. The US-backed Iraqi cabinet  have approved a new oil law that 
is 
> > set to give foreign companies the  long-term contracts and safe 
> legal 
> > framework they have been  waiting for, but which has rattled 
labour 
> > unions and international  campaigners, who say oil production 
> should 
> > remain in the hands of  Iraqis. This means that Iraqi oil is up 
for 
> > grabs â€" and Iraq is now  forced to consider all tenders. 
> > (1) Was Iraq pressured into agreeing  to this bill? (2) If there 
> was 
> > such pressure was it exerted by  the USA to benefit its own oil 
> > companies? (3) Were other countries  also involved? 
> > (1) Yes. (2) Yes. (3) No.
> > 
> > Q. If a new  Messiah comes does this mean that the end of the 
world 
> is 
> >  near?
> > A. Maitreya is here, as the World Teacher. Is this the end? On  
the 
> > contrary â€" this is the beginning of a new time for 
humanity.  But 
> a 
> > humanity chastened and relieved of its illusions and  
> destructiveness. 
> > For two thousand years, the Christian groups  have taught this 
> account 
> > of the return of the Christ, coming on a  cloud in the last days 
of 
> > the world, the `end days'. This, I submit,  is a completely wrong 
> > interpretation of Christian scriptures which  has distorted 
> > Christians' expectations of the Christ's return. The  so-called 
> `end 
> > times' are to do not with the end of the world but  with the end 
of 
> > the Age of Pisces, inaugurated by the Christ through  Jesus 2,000 
> > years ago. He promised to return, at "such a time as you  think 
not" 
> â€" 
> > to inaugurate the new age, that of Aquarius. This  time He has 
come 
> > Himself to expand the teaching given through Jesus  and to 
prepare 
> the 
> > world for the Aquarian experience. 
> >  What we have to look forward to is not the end of the world, 
which 
> >  will not take place for millions of years ahead, but for the 
> creation  
> > of a new civilisation based on higher and truer spiritual values  
> than 
> > were possible for humanity at the time of Jesus. Jesus  Himself, 
> now a 
> > Master, works with the Christ on a daily basis and  will reform 
the 
> > Christian churches and teaching, as His part in the  Great Plan. 
> > 
> > Q. We are asked, quite rightly, to tell as many  people as we can 
> > about the emergence of Maitreya. Do we refer to him  as Maitreya, 
> or 
> > the `World Teacher' or do we announce him as the  `Christ'? It 
> seems 
> > vital that those carrying out this task are  `on the ball' as it 
> were, 
> > so that the knowledge given is  accurately 

RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans

[Rick Archer]

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of llundrub
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:39 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans

 

Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you would pool your money and
buy a couple houses next door to each other in New Orleans and make
meditation centers here. This city is at the start of a huge boom where for
real it's all possibilities. 

If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another dunking. 

[FairfieldLife] Your representative in China

[peetumelwani]

Working in China

I'm interested in being a representative for companies dealing with 
Chin on a regular basis. I am the director of a representative 
office (totally legit) in Shantou, China with the head office in 
Hong Kong. 

If your company works with China , it may (or may not) help to have 
a representative there - a sort of office - whereby factories can 
relate to if they need to deal with any issues. 

Obviously we could also offer a sort of liason between you and the 
factories or agents you are working with. Basically, we're there and 
you guys are here -  its like being in two places - and that may 
ease things up a bit. 

So if that does help, we could work something out - I could be a 
representative travelling to various factories, or making calls, or 
even inspecting. I think we could work out a monthly fee based on 
the work required or a commision base. 

Whatever it is - you can expect honesty and loyalty.

The company i own deals with Toys, so everything is set up and we 
could expand into other things with you. I have over 4 years 
experience in toys and other gift and electronic items , and even 
garments. 

If your company is interested, please do let me know. I am leaving 
on Sunday Morning, however. In anycase, we can stay in touch through 
email.

All the best

Peetu Melwani
+641 233 8021 (till sunday)
+86 13802333020

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme

[lurkernomore20002000]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:

snip
>
 The reason I post the link to ShareInternational is to inspire anyone 
> with interest to read and learn for themselves. I do not see that 
> that could cause a problem for anyone.

I rather enjoy hearing about Creme.  I find many of his comments to be 
pretty much on target.  I will say Lsoma's comment about sucking on 
Creme's nipple to be apropos.  BTW, Nablus, are you just too DAMN GOOD 
to snip your posts?

lurk
>

RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans

[gullible fool]

> If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another
> dunking. 

Which would make the place only slightly more humid.

--- Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Behalf Of llundrub
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:39 AM
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans
> 
>  
> 
> Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you
> would pool your money and
> buy a couple houses next door to each other in New
> Orleans and make
> meditation centers here. This city is at the start
> of a huge boom where for
> real it's all possibilities. 
> 
> If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another
> dunking. 
> 
> 



 

It's here! Your new message!  
Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar.
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/

RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans

[llundrub]

Sure as shit, but my house will still stand yet again.

 

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Rick Archer
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 7:02 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans

 

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of llundrub
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:39 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans

 

Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you would pool your money and
buy a couple houses next door to each other in New Orleans and make
meditation centers here. This city is at the start of a huge boom where for
real it's all possibilities. 

If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another dunking. 

 

[FairfieldLife] I'm the spirit of Giving

[llundrub]

I am sponsoring a monthly Mahamritunjaya in which I will include Maharishi
Mahesh Yogi from now on- every month - for his continued health and
longevity. May Maharishi be around yet a long time. Thank you Maharishi for
all you have done.  

RE: [FairfieldLife] I'm the spirit of Giving

[llundrub]

I meant "in the spirit of giving" 

 

From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of llundrub
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 8:47 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] I'm the spirit of Giving

 

I am sponsoring a monthly Mahamritunjaya in which I will include Maharishi
Mahesh Yogi from now on- every month - for his continued health and
longevity. May Maharishi be around yet a long time. Thank you Maharishi for
all you have done.  

 

RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Orleans

[llundrub]

I haven't seen much crime but I live Uptown. It's certainly no more
dangerous than any other big city and crime is more spread out. The way this
city always was and will be is that from block to block neighborhoods form,
either safe or sorry. You should be reading the papers here as development
plans for the city are coming out. It's just so much potential! Money will
be pouring into everything since the city is still threadbare. And I'm
starting to have jinseks for the whole city. I am setting the peg and
calling it. If there is a rapture like situation on Earth for humans then it
will start right here where I am. Because the meek, and all that, and we are
certainly meek here. For this reason I have chosen to pour my money into
sponsoring jinseks for the residents of this city. If people live here they
simply deserve a better quality of life since we here live at God and
nature's whim. Right now. But in the future people will figure out ways of
working with nature, like building huge turbines which turn hurricanes into
an energy reserve. If George Bush and his enemies don't kill us all first.

-Original Message-
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Robert Gimbel
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:55 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Orleans

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you would pool your 
money and
> buy a couple houses next door to each other in New Orleans and make
> meditation centers here. This city is at the start of a huge boom 
where for
> real it's all possibilities.
>
That sounds great, but the way thing sound on the media, well they make 
it sound like it's like a war zone there- what's true anyway?? Is it 
safe to walk the streets there, or what?
r.g.



To subscribe, send a message to:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Or go to: 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/
and click 'Join This Group!' 
Yahoo! Groups Links

[FairfieldLife] Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government

[Rick Archer]

From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM
To: Rick Archer
Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government

 

 

Dear Rick.

Yeasterday I received the result from the Court Case between the TMO and the
State in Norway regarding that the TMO did want the Monopoly of the words
Transcendental Meditation and TM.

 

I was a wittness on behalf of the State in Norway and I am happy to tell you
that the TMO lost regarding the Monopoly of the words Transcendental
meditation and won the Trademark of the words TM.

 

The Court says that Transcendental Meditation is a description of a state of
consciousness and knowbody can own a description. They also lost because the
TMO has not been consistent in using the words Transcendental meditation.
They have used TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. Maharishis
Techniques in books and advertisements. The Court says also that it is a
need to be free regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do - in the
papers it is referred to my domene www.transcendentalmeditation.no and that
I teach in free time - because I have an other full time job too. The TMO
would not tell how many initiations they had done last year  - I was open
about how many I have teached. The TMO made a point of the Agreement forms
that the TM-Teachers has signed - so did I. The Court did not consider that.
The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - and after he die, who
will be the owner of the TMO and all his techniques.

 

The TMO tried to stop me from being a wittness - they wrote a letter to the
Court in forhand of the Court Case and almost demanded the Court not to
allow me to be a wittness. Not a smart thing to do - I think.

 

In the Court Case - it was really a difference between Ole Markman (The
lawyer of the TMO - Danish TM-Teacher - with no Carisma - pale and grey -
talking the language of the TMO - telling that I (Ingegerd) do not keep the
knowledge pure - not easy to understand for common people) and the Lawyer of
the Norwegian Government, a very smart man.

 

Some other Norwegian teachers of Transcendental meditation is happy too -
they are very successfull in their teaching.

 

You are free to use this as you like - send it to FFL if you want.

 

Ingegerd Espås

 

[FairfieldLife] Re: today on MOU

[BillyG.]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shukra69" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> quite an interesting speech from Maharishi today about komalangam of
> Raam, the number system, nouns and gyan shakti vs kriya shakti , the 
> verb , the word system, the upangas, the six systems, forward and
> backward, the zero as mandal , circle motion-self referral,check it out

Interesting lecture, however without foundation, most people won't
understand it. Having a little foundation I would surmise he was
talking about the 'macrocosmic' self referral nature of Brahm...or
Brahma the personal God, the purusha.

When we as jivas experience this self referral state we become the 1-0
purusha. That is, you 'come back' and experience the Self and hence
you are not considered 0 but 1-0, sort of a dichotomy of the manifest
and unmanifest

[FairfieldLife] Because of TM

[dhamiltony2k5]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
  
> It's not that hard to track the market on most all of the news web 
> sites.  It's been going through some problems lately so the assertion 
> that it is doing well is rather bunk, much like saying the sky is 
>blue 
> when in reality it is cloudy.
>

yes, in FF, someone here (a TM'er) was telling that one friend of 
theirs who goes to the domes was exclaiming how well investments are 
going `because of the pundits', while another friend who also is an 
active dome participant next was recounting how poorly investments were 
going since the arrival of the pundits. 

-Doug in FF


 
> Personally I think the real intention of the ME is to take people who 
> would have otherwise become activists for change and accomplished 
some, 
> diverted and sitting on their butts meditating instead.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government

[dhamiltony2k5]

You mean, Transcendental Meditation is not unique, to TM?  Oh no, 
there goes our true-believer TM paradigm.  But, damn that scorpion 
Norwegian court.  Besides, they are just a bunch of Norwegians, what 
do they really know about spiritual things?  Natural law is our truth.

-Governor for the A of E Hamilton in FF



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM
> To: Rick Archer
> Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Dear Rick.
> 
> Yeasterday I received the result from the Court Case between the 
TMO and the
> State in Norway regarding that the TMO did want the Monopoly of the 
words
> Transcendental Meditation and TM.
> 
>  
> 
> I was a wittness on behalf of the State in Norway and I am happy to 
tell you
> that the TMO lost regarding the Monopoly of the words Transcendental
> meditation and won the Trademark of the words TM.
> 
>  
> 
> The Court says that Transcendental Meditation is a description of a 
state of
> consciousness and knowbody can own a description. They also lost 
because the
> TMO has not been consistent in using the words Transcendental 
meditation.
> They have used TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. 
Maharishis
> Techniques in books and advertisements. The Court says also that it 
is a
> need to be free regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do -
 in the
> papers it is referred to my domene www.transcendentalmeditation.no 
and that
> I teach in free time - because I have an other full time job too. 
The TMO
> would not tell how many initiations they had done last year  - I 
was open
> about how many I have teached. The TMO made a point of the 
Agreement forms
> that the TM-Teachers has signed - so did I. The Court did not 
consider that.
> The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - and after he 
die, who
> will be the owner of the TMO and all his techniques.
> 
>  
> 
> The TMO tried to stop me from being a wittness - they wrote a 
letter to the
> Court in forhand of the Court Case and almost demanded the Court 
not to
> allow me to be a wittness. Not a smart thing to do - I think.
> 
>  
> 
> In the Court Case - it was really a difference between Ole Markman 
(The
> lawyer of the TMO - Danish TM-Teacher - with no Carisma - pale and 
grey -
> talking the language of the TMO - telling that I (Ingegerd) do not 
keep the
> knowledge pure - not easy to understand for common people) and the 
Lawyer of
> the Norwegian Government, a very smart man.
> 
>  
> 
> Some other Norwegian teachers of Transcendental meditation is happy 
too -
> they are very successfull in their teaching.
> 
>  
> 
> You are free to use this as you like - send it to FFL if you want.
> 
>  
> 
> Ingegerd Espås
>

Re: [FairfieldLife] Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government

[Lsoma]

 
In a message dated 3/30/2007 10:49:12 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 
 
 
 
 
 
From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:iespas@ Ingegerd Espå
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM
To: Rick  Archer
Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian  Government

 


 
Dear  Rick.
 
Yeasterday I received the  result from the Court Case between the TMO and the 
State in Norway regarding  that the TMO did want the Monopoly of the words 
Transcendental Meditation  and TM.
 

 
I was a wittness on behalf  of the State in Norway and I am happy to tell you 
that the TMO lost  regarding the Monopoly of the words Transcendental 
meditation and won the  Trademark of the words TM.
 

 
The Court says that  Transcendental Meditation is a description of a state of 
consciousness and  knowbody can own a description. They also lost because the 
TMO has not been  consistent in using the words Transcendental meditation. 
They have used  TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. Maharishis 
Techniques in books  and advertisements. The Court says also that it is a need 
to be 
free  regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do - in the papers it  is 
referred to my domene _www.transcendentalmwww.transcww_ 
(http://www.transcendentalmeditation.no/)   and that I teach in free time - 
because I have an other 
full time job too.  The TMO would not tell how many initiations they had done 
last year  -  I was open about how many I have teached. The TMO made a point 
of the  Agreement forms that the TM-Teachers has signed - so did I. The Court 
did  not consider that. The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - 
and  after he die, who will be the owner of the TMO and all his  techniques.
 

 
The TMO tried to stop me  from being a wittness - they wrote a letter to the 
Court in forhand of the  Court Case and almost demanded the Court not to allow 
me to be a wittness.  Not a smart thing to do - I think.
 

 
In the Court Case - it was  really a difference between Ole Markman (The 
lawyer of the TMO - Danish  TM-Teacher - with no Carisma - pale and grey - 
talking 
the language of the  TMO - telling that I (Ingegerd) do not keep the 
knowledge pure - not easy to  understand for common people) and the Lawyer of 
the 
Norwegian Government, a  very smart man.
 

 
Some other Norwegian  teachers of Transcendental meditation is happy too - 
they are very  successfull in their teaching.
 

 
You are free to use this as  you like - send it to FFL if you want.
 

 
Ingegerd  Espås
 




 


>Very interesting. Ingegerd Espas has spiritual courage. The judge has a  
very honest question to the TMO
" The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - and after he die, who  
will be the owner of the TMO and all his techniques. Maybe the passing over of 
 MMY will make legal issues between the TMO and other
affiliates a very interesting time. The purity could slip right through  
their hands. God knows the purity of the teaching could use other places that 
it  
feels more comfortable growing in. Lsoma.



** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

[FairfieldLife] Re: New Orleans

[larry.potter]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> Sure as shit, but my house will still stand yet again.
> 

I wasn't aware that you actually own it. anyway I do remember the 
lovely colorful rooms and pictures of deities on the walls
or was it the ceiling.. via the photos you posted here the other day.
You must be missing that.. I hope New Orleans will recover to
it's full potential.

gl

> 
> From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Behalf Of Rick Archer
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 7:02 AM
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans
> 
>  
> 
> From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Behalf Of llundrub
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:39 AM
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans
> 
>  
> 
> Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you would pool your 
money and
> buy a couple houses next door to each other in New Orleans and make
> meditation centers here. This city is at the start of a huge boom 
where for
> real it's all possibilities. 
> 
> If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another dunking.
>

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government

[Lsoma]

 
In a message dated 3/30/2007 11:18:04 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 
 
 
You mean, Transcendental Meditation is not unique, to TM? Oh no, 
there  goes our true-believer TM paradigm. But, damn that scorpion 
Norwegian  court. Besides, they are just a bunch of Norwegians, what 
do they really  know about spiritual things? Natural law is our truth. 


-Governor for the A of E Hamilton in FF 
>Please Hamilton. Natural law does not live in the TMO. I was told I  could 
not participate in the America Invincibility course because I am a  practicing 
astrologer and a certified Yoga teacher. They questinoned my love  for MMY in 
the name of the purity of the teaching. Maybe if some of the  teachers of TM 
would speak up about the conservative gueidlines for their  fellow Sidha's they 
would consider relaxing them. Most of the governors are  sneaking around the 
guidelines and lying to get into the dome or stay there.  The lack of 
spiritual courage among Governors is not acting in accordance with  natural 
law. If 
you want to be a true Governor you would have to be at least  honest with what 
is going on around you.  
Lou Valentino. Volunteer of the Intergalactic Confederation from the fourth  
level of the sixth dimension. How's that for a label. And yes, i  will support 
my fellow Sidha's, meditators and Governors who have been  judged unfairly by 
the Department for the Development of Consciousness. As the  world continues 
to blow itself up, this Department continues to make choices  that are not in 
alignment with Guru Dev. They may be in alignment with MMY but  it just goes 
to show that MMY may need some improvement in his own awareness  as to what is 
going on in his own back yard. 

--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) 
,  "Rick Archer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> From: Ingegerd Espås  [mailto:iespas@ From
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM
>  To: Rick Archer
> Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian  Government
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dear  Rick.
> 
> Yeasterday I received the result from the Court Case  between the 
TMO and the
> State in Norway regarding that the TMO did  want the Monopoly of the 
words
> Transcendental Meditation and  TM.
> 
> 
> 
> I was a wittness on behalf of the State  in Norway and I am happy to 
tell you
> that the TMO lost regarding  the Monopoly of the words Transcendental
> meditation and won the  Trademark of the words TM.
> 
> 
> 
> The Court says  that Transcendental Meditation is a description of a 
state of
>  consciousness and knowbody can own a description. They also lost 
because  the
> TMO has not been consistent in using the words Transcendental  
meditation.
> They have used TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep  meditation. 
Maharishis
> Techniques in books and advertisements. The  Court says also that it 
is a
> need to be free regarding to compete  activities as i (Ingegerd) do -
in the
> papers it is referred to my  domene www.transcendentalm papers it pa
and that
> I teach  in free time - because I have an other full time job too. 
The TMO
>  would not tell how many initiations they had done last year - I 
was  open
> about how many I have teached. The TMO made a point of the  
Agreement forms
> that the TM-Teachers has signed - so did I. The  Court did not 
consider that.
> The Court made a point that MMY is a  very old man - and after he 
die, who
> will be the owner of the TMO  and all his techniques.
> 
> 
> 
> The TMO tried to  stop me from being a wittness - they wrote a 
letter to the
> Court  in forhand of the Court Case and almost demanded the Court 
not to
>  allow me to be a wittness. Not a smart thing to do - I think.
> 
>  
> 
> In the Court Case - it was really a difference between Ole  Markman 
(The
> lawyer of the TMO - Danish TM-Teacher - with no  Carisma - pale and 
grey -
> talking the language of the TMO -  telling that I (Ingegerd) do not 
keep the
> knowledge pure - not  easy to understand for common people) and the 
Lawyer of
> the  Norwegian Government, a very smart man.
> 
> 
> 
>  Some other Norwegian teachers of Transcendental meditation is happy 
too  -
> they are very successfull in their teaching.
> 
>  
> 
> You are free to use this as you like - send it to FFL if you  want.
> 
> 
> 
> Ingegerd  Espås
>


 


 



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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme

[Lsoma]

 
In a message dated 3/30/2007 5:56:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 
 
 
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) 
,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> 
> In a message dated 3/29/2007 3:28:43  P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED])   writes:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In  _FairfieldLife@ --- In  _Fair
(mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
(mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) )  
> , Lsoma@ wrote:
> >
> > 
> > In a message  dated 3/29/2007 2:11:45 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, 
> >  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  [EMAIL PROTECTED]@yahoogroupno_re_ 
(mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) )  
writes:
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
>  > Questions & Answers
> > 
> > Q. Is there any  specific date for Maitreya's appearance?
> > A. Most people imagine  that world events (and the coming of a 
> World 
> > Teacher is  certainly a world event) take place according to 
> precise 
>  > dates. They imagine that all Hierarchical decisions are designed 
>  for 
> > dates written in stone. This is assuredly not the case. The  
> Masters 
> > predict certain happenings to take place around  a certain time 
but 
> > They know that humanity has freewill and  therefore has an 
enormous 
> > influence on the precise timing of  a given event. The Masters 
work 
> in 
> > 2,000 year  cycles, so for Them really precise timing is not a 
> major 
>  > consideration. No one knows the exact date on which Maitreya 
will  
> > take up His open work but everyone can understand that it is  
very, 
> > very soon. 
> > Since Maitreya will not at  first reveal His name and status the 
> onus 
> > is on each  one of us to recognize Him by what He says and does. 
In 
> > this  way people will be recognizing the expression of their 
> >  aspiration for the future of humanity, rather than simply 
> >  following `The Teacher'.
> > 
> > Q. Is it still expected  there will be a worldwide stock-market 
> crash 
> > before  Maitreya's public emergence? 
> > A. No, not necessarily, but the  economic movement of the world 
is 
> > towards such a slump,  which would probably increase once 
Maitreya 
> > starts His  public work. 
> > 
> > Q. (1) Does the US administration  truly believe that Iran is 
> trying 
> > to build a nuclear  weapon or do they just want to remove the 
> Iranian 
> >  president from power? 
> > (2) Does the hypocrisy of trying to  pressure other nations into 
> not 
> > creating their own  atomic weapons programme, while America has a 
> > large nuclear  arsenal, not occur to those in power in the US 
> >  government?
> > A. (1) Yes, I believe they do. (2) Presumably  not!
> > 
> > Q. The US-backed Iraqi cabinet have approved a  new oil law that 
is 
> > set to give foreign companies the  long-term contracts and safe 
> legal 
> > framework they have  been waiting for, but which has rattled 
labour 
> > unions and  international campaigners, who say oil production 
> should 
>  > remain in the hands of Iraqis. This means that Iraqi oil is up 
for  
> > grabs â€" and Iraq is now forced to consider all tenders.  
> > (1) Was Iraq pressured into agreeing to this bill? (2) If there  
> was 
> > such pressure was it exerted by the USA to benefit  its own oil 
> > companies? (3) Were other countries also involved?  
> > (1) Yes. (2) Yes. (3) No.
> > 
> > Q. If a new  Messiah comes does this mean that the end of the 
world 
> is  
> > near?
> > A. Maitreya is here, as the World Teacher. Is  this the end? On 
the 
> > contrary â€" this is the beginning  of a new time for 
humanity. But 
> a 
> > humanity  chastened and relieved of its illusions and 
> destructiveness. 
>  > For two thousand years, the Christian groups have taught this 
>  account 
> > of the return of the Christ, coming on a cloud in the  last days 
of 
> > the world, the `end days'. This, I submit, is a  completely wrong 
> > interpretation of Christian scriptures which  has distorted 
> > Christians' expectations of the Christ's return.  The so-called 
> `end 
> > times' are to do not with the end of  the world but with the end 
of 
> > the Age of Pisces, inaugurated  by the Christ through Jesus 2,000 
> > years ago. He promised to  return, at "such a time as you think 
not" 
> â€" 
> > to  inaugurate the new age, that of Aquarius. This time He has 
come 
>  > Himself to expand the teaching given through Jesus and to 
prepare  
> the 
> > world for the Aquarian experience. 
> >  What we have to look forward to is not the end of the world, 
which  
> > will not take place for millions of years ahead, but for the  
> creation 
> > of a new civilisation based on higher and  truer spiritual values 
> than 
> > were possible for humanity  at the time of Jesus. Jesus Himself, 
> now a 
> > Master,  works with the Christ on a daily basis and will reform 
the 
> >  Christian churches and teaching, as His part in the Great Plan. 
> >  
> > Q. We are asked, quite rightly, to tell as many people as we can  
> > about the emergence of Maitreya

RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: today on MOU

[llundrub]

Good surmise finally, whatever it meant.

-Original Message-
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of BillyG.
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 9:53 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: today on MOU

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shukra69" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> quite an interesting speech from Maharishi today about komalangam of
> Raam, the number system, nouns and gyan shakti vs kriya shakti , the 
> verb , the word system, the upangas, the six systems, forward and
> backward, the zero as mandal , circle motion-self referral,check it out

Interesting lecture, however without foundation, most people won't
understand it. Having a little foundation I would surmise he was
talking about the 'macrocosmic' self referral nature of Brahm...or
Brahma the personal God, the purusha.

When we as jivas experience this self referral state we become the 1-0
purusha. That is, you 'come back' and experience the Self and hence
you are not considered 0 but 1-0, sort of a dichotomy of the manifest
and unmanifest




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RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Orleans

[llundrub]

Why would I be missing that. It didn't go anywhere. I painted over the
Trishakti stupidly, thinking I would paint the entire Kalachakra mandala
someday, throughout the entire house. I had meant for that from the start.
At any rate I'm happy Trishakti, Guru Datta, and Ganesha were behind it all.


-Original Message-
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of larry.potter
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 10:30 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Orleans

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> Sure as shit, but my house will still stand yet again.
> 

I wasn't aware that you actually own it. anyway I do remember the 
lovely colorful rooms and pictures of deities on the walls
or was it the ceiling.. via the photos you posted here the other day.
You must be missing that.. I hope New Orleans will recover to
it's full potential.

gl

> 
> From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Behalf Of Rick Archer
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 7:02 AM
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans
> 
>  
> 
> From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Behalf Of llundrub
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:39 AM
> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans
> 
>  
> 
> Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you would pool your 
money and
> buy a couple houses next door to each other in New Orleans and make
> meditation centers here. This city is at the start of a huge boom 
where for
> real it's all possibilities. 
> 
> If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another dunking.
>




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[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Tiring contributions: (Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers ...

[Lsoma]

 
In a message dated 3/30/2007 1:21:50 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 
 
  





 

These kind of  elaborations remind me to the predicitions of reincarnation of 
Jesus in  order to save the world. They are hardly of any practical use and 
do contain  too many aspects, which cannot be proven and do only create a 
spirit of  dependence and powerlessness regarding one's own way of unfoldment. 
So I 
 basically agree to the commentator at the end of this endless  monolog.
 
It seems as if  there are also  people in this list in order to fill it with 
all kinds of misleading  and tedious indoctrinations. This makes it difficult 
to distinguish  upright essential and worth-while discussion points against 
prosy watering  downs.
 
Work of undercover  agents in order to thin out the interest of readers ? - 
One of the  charming ways to jam spiritual enhancement. We have to be alert  !
 

Hagen  






 I agree with you Hagelin. Thanks for the support. Lsoma.

 

> Questions & Answers
> 
> Q. Is there any  specific date for Maitreya's appearance?
> A. Most people imagine that  world events (and the coming of a 
World 
> Teacher is certainly a  world event) take place according to 
precise 
> dates. They  imagine that all Hierarchical decisions are designed 
for 
>  offensive to say that 
some 
> of the miracles are very amusing,  like gems popping out from under 
> someone's big toe.
> A. I  quite agree. When people come to know the Masters more 
closely 
>  they will recognize that They are filled with the joy of life and 
>  have an extraordinary and quick sense of humour. The inventiveness 
of  
> their imagination is one of the outstanding qualities of their  
> activity.   and so on and  on

>
Lsoma; with all due respect; do  you really want us to belive that 
you are communicating with archangels  ? 
What if you are being manipulated by your own grandiose ego  ?




> For the record. Human beings don't need to  wait for anyone form up above 
to save them or teach us how to love one  another. You tell me I'm the one who 
is egotistical. Maybe if you stop  sucking on the nipple of Benjamin Creame 
you could find out who you really  are stop attacking those who disagree with 
your chosen masters of pure love.  You love to use the FFL forum to promote 
your 
masters and then lead people  to Benjamin Creams website to recruit them. FFL 
should be a forum for  discussion on relevant topics of spirituality. Try to 
think outside of the  Maitreya box that he is trying to build around you. If 
you continue to judge  me you might want to ask Benjamin Creame about me. Tell 
him I am a volunteer  from the fourth level
of the sixth dimension. Maybe he can open your mind  up a bit. If not, I 
don't care about other peoples judgments regarding my  spiritual journey. To be 
frank, I'm so tired of so many people following so  many teachers and claiming 
to have the Avatar of the century. My message is  clear as a teacher: Stop 
looking for someone else to do it for you. You have  and always will have the 
power to change any situation that is manifesting  in the world or in your 
personal life. Anyone or any organization claiming  to have the power to change 
you 
without having any faith that you can stand  on your own feet is taking your 
self-empowerment away from you. There is too  much attention these days on 
who's 
Guru is going to save them and the  world.
I think I've make my point. And this information is  from me directly not an 
angel or guide or whatever. And, I never said that I  communicate with seven 
dimensional masters or archangels as you call them.  Some of the information I 
get is from other individuals who do soul  transfrerence readings. They are 
recommended to me highly by close friends.  Try to respond to some ot the 
information that I post instead of the need to  point the finger at me so 
quickly 
that your mind remains closed to anyone  elses story. Lsoma.




.
 
  





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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme

[Lsoma]

 
In a message dated 3/30/2007 12:02:28 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 
 
 
 
 
 
Tell him I am  a volunteer from the fourth level
 
of the sixth  dimension.  
---We  all have our weird shit. I was Aliester Crowley in my  
last  life. 
You sound  like Aliester Crowley. Lsoma.




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme

[nablusoss1008]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "lurkernomore20002000" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008  
> wrote:
> 
> snip
> >
>  The reason I post the link to ShareInternational is to inspire 
anyone 
> > with interest to read and learn for themselves. I do not see that 
> > that could cause a problem for anyone.
> 
> I rather enjoy hearing about Creme.  I find many of his comments to 
be 
> pretty much on target.  I will say Lsoma's comment about sucking on 
> Creme's nipple to be apropos.  BTW, Nablus, are you just too DAMN 
GOOD 
> to snip your posts?
> 
> lurk
> >

Agreed, Benjamin Creme is often very spot on even though some of what 
he says may lay ahead and is difficult to verify, as one poster 
pointed out earlier. (Maitreyas open work in the world. That is 
unless you have met Him ofcourse; thousands of people have, I have 
not.)

This Lsoma fellow have made these claims before simply because he has 
not bothered to check the real story. I doubt that he ever read 
ShareInternational, because if he did he would see, among other 
things, that Benjamin Creme is very altruistic indeed and does never, 
ever denounce anyone. I am sure he would greet Lsoma with great 
respect, just as he does to everyone else, "high" or "low". He can be 
rather frank about some issues like capitalism and American foreign 
politics, but he seems balanced and very, very well informed. He is 
in constant telephatic contact with his Master from whom he receives 
the detailed information.
Sometimes I wish I had more of that respectful quality myself :-) 
Benjamin Creme is not my Guru and I have met him only once. I have 
said this before, but for some it seems difficult to grasp that some 
information is just pure gold and highly interesting, and I 
appreciate that you appreciate it lurk. Particulary for TM'ers that 
should have developed a rather strong intuition, because I have never 
heard Mr. Creme state something that Maharishi has not in one way or 
the other already said. Creme's information is just more detailed.

I'm not too familiar with some of the jargon here; what is "snipping 
a post" ?

[FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government

[nablusoss1008]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "dhamiltony2k5" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> You mean, Transcendental Meditation is not unique, to TM?  Oh no, 
> there goes our true-believer TM paradigm.  But, damn that scorpion 
> Norwegian court.  Besides, they are just a bunch of Norwegians, what 
> do they really know about spiritual things?  Natural law is our truth.
> 
> -Governor for the A of E Hamilton in FF

The Government of Norway, how can they be involved in this case ? I 
don't get it. Anyway, if "they" do not see that it was Maharishi that 
invented and spent 30 years to let the world know about TM, and that it 
is unique I think they have a problem. Transcendental Meditation is not 
a state of consciousness, it is a mental technique. That the judges, 
the fools in court, was not able to understand this is not very 
surprising. Maharishi once commented that "Norway is a long and narrow 
country, inhabited by narrowminded people." They are a greedy bunch of 
consumers; not very spiritual at all. And the socalled "independent 
teachers", why are they ? I think it boils down to the same thing; 
greed - they want to collect the money for themselves. They got 
everything they know about meditation from Maharishi, now they want to 
cash in. I know it is not that simple, but I still feel that it's 
discusting.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government

[cardemaister]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>  
> In a message dated 3/30/2007 10:49:12 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> 
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
> From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:iespas@ Ingegerd Espå
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM
> To: Rick  Archer
> Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian  Government
> 
>  
> 
> 
>  
> Dear  Rick.
>  
> Yeasterday I received the  result from the Court Case between the 
TMO and the 
> State in Norway regarding  that the TMO did want the Monopoly of 
the words 
> Transcendental Meditation  and TM.
>  
> 
>  
> I was a wittness on behalf  of the State in Norway and I am happy 
to tell you 
> that the TMO lost  regarding the Monopoly of the words 
Transcendental 
> meditation and won the  Trademark of the words TM.
>  
> 
>  
> The Court says that  Transcendental Meditation is a description of 
a state of 
> consciousness and  knowbody can own a description. They also lost 
because the 
> TMO has not been  consistent in using the words Transcendental 
meditation. 
> They have used  TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. 
Maharishis 
> Techniques in books  and advertisements. The Court says also that 
it is a need to be 
> free  regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do - in the 
papers it  is 
> referred to my domene _www.transcendentalmwww.transcww_ 
> (http://www.transcendentalmeditation.no/) 

More accurately:

http://www.transcendentalmeditasjon.no/

Re: [FairfieldLife] Rescue Proposal for Saving Fairfield-Life

[Bhairitu]

What a joke.  Why do you think that a complicated method is going make 
anything better?  I bet you believe that the world should have one 
global government with lots of fucking rules too!  Such an 
*unenlightened* idea.


Hagen J. Holtz wrote:
> Since many years I am a fan of this list, but I do not find time to read the 
> 50 - 100 daily messages. So I check the list on random basis with the 
> uncomfortable back-ground feeling to sometimes miss essential developments. 
> So I got a "bath-tube session" idea to restructure the list without depriving 
> it from it's self-reinforcing tendency. My proposal:
>
> 1. Someone, who is versified, prepares a link for all members of the list, in 
> order to put in their real names combined with their FairfieldLife-identity 
> and a short description of who they are.
>
> 2. Each of these self-revealing members gets the honestly task to moderate 
> the commentaries of the list for let's say one week in a year in sequential 
> rotation, passing the task to the next member, in order to compress them down 
> to the 10 most interesting contributions of the day.
>
> 3. In order to be technically affordable, the candidates, who want to be part 
> of this "race" send their commentaries as usual to the well-known list 
> address plus to this special link. By this act the variety and freedom of 
> commenting contributions does not get diminished and noone can argue against 
> it by suspecting a new censorship. On the other hand this artifice would help 
> all earnest members, who have little time and were predominantly interested 
> in grasping the essentials, to regularly be part of the list and keeping the 
> thread.
>
> For some stupid reason, being greeted with smiles by ma family, I kept the 
> last 100,000 Fairfield-mails like a nostalgic collector without even reading 
> them. This gives me at least the neurotic certainty to possess them in order 
> "to be" with you :-).
>
> If someone would assist me I could take initiative to prepare such a link, 
> which we may call in future "Fairfield.Essential" or so.
>
> And there is another advantage regarding this idea. By this act we can 
> elegantly get sorted out the wheat from the chaff without offending anybody's 
> freedom to say what he wants at any moment he wants. And it is also positive 
> that the main list even with all its scrap continues, because you save the 
> chance to see and judge eventually different from the contemporarily leading 
> moderator and do not feel restricted in whatever manner. 
>
> I have understanding that for some of you it may sound more complicated but I 
> am inclined to see it more in terms of quality gain by increasing complexity 
> instead of deterrent aggregation of frustrating and demotivating opaques. 
>
> Being with you and your special thoughts about it and agog of your 
> commentaries about this idea.
>
> Hagen
>   

[FairfieldLife] Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[curtisdeltablues]

Just in case you are not already sick of this topic...

I think I understand your point of view.  Sounds reasonable.  I also
understand that you don't find my take on it reasonable.  Fair enough.
 It was my reaction to the wording of MMY's announcement about Guru
Dev that changed my view of him from "stodgy old time religion guy" to
more of a self promoter using miracles as a hook.  But our discussion
has definitely bought out a need to find out what specific miracles
MMY claimed for GD.  In any case I have addressed some points you felt
I had missed. FWIW.


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> As an aside, the tradition of the day was to
> deliver a kid to an adult teacher to take care of
> him. Letting him walk off was just as much an
> aberration of parental responsibility as it is today.

Judy If there was anything they could have done
about it, that is. If they'd handed him over
to a teacher, and the kid didn't find him
congenial, he'd most likely have walked away
from the teacher.

ME Buz !  Sorry, the correct parenting answer was to take care of
your underage child.  No one gets off the hook by claiming that kids
can walk away.  Good parents don't let them, no exceptions.  Rich ones
get even less slack.  They could have hired a shadow person to follow
GD around everywhere for about 2 cents a day.


[I wrote:]
> MMY, as I said, didn't imply any particular miracle
> in that particular piece. In the other piece you
> just quoted, he made a general pro forma reference,
> pretty much de rigeur for a realized Indian master.
>
> When you hear someone introduce a candidate for
> office as "The next president of the United States,"
> and the candidate then loses the election, do you
> then say to yourself, "That scoundrel who introduced
> the candidate before the election was lying"?
>
> I'm not sure where you got the idea about how
> realized people get introduced, ever been to India?

Judy; No, but I've read plenty of testimonials
about purportedly realized teachers.

ME; I am not challenging your familiarity with spiritual people, just
how they get introduced.  You are claiming that it was common to
mention a teacher's siddhis in his intro.  I maintain that only crass
teachers would use it.  It is hokey spirituality.

Ever seen another supposedly realized
> guy get introduced? This is a made up perspective.
> It is just as likely that mentioning Sidhis is just
> as tacky for religious people in India as here.
> Remember he was representing a high formal office.

Judy: I should think that would make claims for siddhis--
especially such siddhis as omniscience--even more
appropriate.

> My Indian friends here view sidhis claims as
> ludicrously as we view the healing claims of
> televangelists.

ME: I wouldn't doubt it, but isn't that a bit of a
self-selected sample? How likely is it that
Indians who took such claims for granted would
be those you would make friends with in the
first place?

Judy: They are self-selected because the most pious Indians won't
leave the country.  My point was that their culture makes the same
distinctions we do concerning televangelists and serious spiritual
people.  Claiming miracles is an indication of slippery intent in both
cultures.  I have plenty of religious and spiritually minded friends
who still view making claims of miracles as a televangelist trick to
bamboozle naive people.  I don't sort friends by beliefs but by behavior.

Also, this promotion of Guru Dev took place
decades earlier than your sojourns in India,
not that long after India won its independence
from the British. It's not impossible that
modern skepticism about such things was a lot
less common back then.

ME: Very possible. 

> The closer example would be Benny Hin's claims of
> curing cancer being met with the appropriate skepticism.
> Claiming unproven miracles to market spirituality is
> crass and deserves to be ridiculed.

That may be, but the issue here is whether MMY
actually made such claims, as opposed to a pro
forma statement, as I said, about unspecified
abilities.


> Your example about the candidate has nothing to do with
> this. MMY is not claiming what he will become in the
> future, he is claiming it is true now.

Judy: It isn't a perfect analogy, but it makes the
point. It's the same type of pro forma claim.
It's expected, a formula. If the candidate weren't
introduced that way, you'd wonder why not.

ME: I don't think you know if this is a pro forma claim in Indian
culture at any time.  It puts him in the Sai Baba camp of people using
miracle claims to enhance their image.  We are left with our differing
opinions without all the facts.  You see his making miracle claims as
not big deal.  I view it as a character issue.

Claiming that a
> person is God's gift to India is exaggeration for effect.
> Claiming miracles to influence superstitions people
> is MMY being P.T. Barnum.

Judy: But *he didn't claim any miracles*, Curtis.
He made

[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme

[nablusoss1008]

Hey, wait a minute Lsoma; why so uptight ? Why do you want me to 
recognize Lord Ashtar, someone I have heard nothing about 0, ? He is 
probably a great soul !

I see that I hurt your feelings when I pointed out that hardly any of 
your predictions for 2006 went through. I am sorry about that, should 
never have made that comment though I was correct and you were wrong. 
I think your predictions for 2007 looks much better. We all have our 
ups and downs.

Regarding your "hate" towards Maitreya I have no comments. Events 
will unfold itself in perfect harmony. Some will think of Him as the 
great Satan, particularily amongst the fundamentalistic population in 
every religion. 

Now just one last comment before I refuse to answer any of your 
outbursts until you actually read what Benjamin Creme writes, what 
you obviously have not done; Jesus of Nasareth is not the Christ. The 
Christ, Iman Madhi, Krisha, Maitreya Buddha, The Messiah and many of 
the Awaited is now in incarnation having created a Mahavirupta body 
in the Himalayas and transported Himself to London in 1977. His name 
is Maitreya. 13 of the 33 Masters have also taken birth at this time. 
Brahmananda Saraswathi is currently not in incarnation.  Jesus of 
Nasareth is one of Them and is currently and for the last 600 years 
residing in Italy. His particular interest, among many other things, 
has been the Church i Latin America.

For TM'ers this is hardly a surprise. "Heaven will walk on earth - in 
this generation."
-Maharishi

Don't be critical. Why not practise that which you have said in 
former posts; we should all rather be working together !

With the deepest respect for you and your work Lsoma !
Nablusoss

http://www.shareintl.org

Q. Why, if Maitreya appears before 600 or even more people at a 
meeting of a religious group in Britain ¯  as in Edinburgh and York 
¯  do we see nothing about it in the media?

BC: The people before whom he appears are in every case 
fundamentalist Christians of one persuasion or another; 
denominationally they vary tremendously, but the consistent factor is 
that they are all extremely dogmatic in their beliefs. Maitreya 
appears to them to `soften them up.' These are the groups from whom, 
throughout the world, he expects the major opposition and rejection. 
If he appears as the World Teacher and they are expecting the Teacher 
in their own terms ¯  as the Christ, Maitreya Buddha, Krishna, the 
Imam Mahdi, the Messiah ¯  with their very fixed views they would be 
inclined to reject him. 

The most important thing is the creation of the healing waters, which 
is done first. When Maitreya has magnetized the waters, in due course 
¯  it might take a few weeks ¯  he finds a group of fundamentalists 
in a town nearby and appears before them. He speaks to them in their 
own language and many healings take place during the process. He does 
not say: "I am Maitreya"; "I am the Christ"; or "I am the Imam 
Mahdi," he just appears, out of the blue but in a form which they 
will recognize ¯  as he did in Nairobi in Kenya, on 11 June 1988, an 
appearance of which we have photographs. 

Maitreya leaves it to the groups, in the thoughtform in which he has 
appeared to them, to recognize him or not. Some of them will 
say: "Beware, it could be the anti-christ: before the Christ comes, 
the anti-christ is coming." That is why they do not speak out, and if 
they do not speak the media does not speak. Occasionally at these 
meetings there have been representatives of religious newspapers who 
do not write about it. Why not? I think they do not know what to do 
with this information: it is too `hot.' 

Either they believe it is the Christ or they believe it is the anti-
christ; or they are mystified because he has not said who he is. 
Perhaps 80 per cent of the people believe they had an experience of 
the Christ, or the Mahdi, or the Messiah ¯  whomever it happened to 
be ¯  and they are perfectly content to accept that and just wait for 
something more to happen in connection with it. That must do 
something to their awareness, even if they do not talk about it 
except among themselves. When eventually they see Maitreya on 
television they will say: "That's the one who appeared to us ¯  
perhaps he is all right after all; perhaps he is not the anti-christ."

The appearance in Nairobi was reported and photographed because the 
editor of the Swahili edition of the Kenya Times was present and 
wrote it up. It was picked up by various media and was a two-day 
wonder around the world. The media in general, as ordinary men and 
women, are deeply, profoundly sceptical, and professionally, not only 
sceptical, but cynical in the extreme.

 

Q. How are we to know for certain that Lord Maitreya is not the false 
Christ?

BC: There is not only one 'false Christ.' There are several well-
known teachers who believe themselves, or are believed by their 
followers, to be the Christ, and from my personal experience alone I 
know of score

RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government

[llundrub]

The scorpion is the root of union.

-Original Message-
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of dhamiltony2k5
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 10:12 AM
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian
Government

You mean, Transcendental Meditation is not unique, to TM?  Oh no, 
there goes our true-believer TM paradigm.  But, damn that scorpion 
Norwegian court.  Besides, they are just a bunch of Norwegians, what 
do they really know about spiritual things?  Natural law is our truth.

-Governor for the A of E Hamilton in FF



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM
> To: Rick Archer
> Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Dear Rick.
> 
> Yeasterday I received the result from the Court Case between the 
TMO and the
> State in Norway regarding that the TMO did want the Monopoly of the 
words
> Transcendental Meditation and TM.
> 
>  
> 
> I was a wittness on behalf of the State in Norway and I am happy to 
tell you
> that the TMO lost regarding the Monopoly of the words Transcendental
> meditation and won the Trademark of the words TM.
> 
>  
> 
> The Court says that Transcendental Meditation is a description of a 
state of
> consciousness and knowbody can own a description. They also lost 
because the
> TMO has not been consistent in using the words Transcendental 
meditation.
> They have used TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. 
Maharishis
> Techniques in books and advertisements. The Court says also that it 
is a
> need to be free regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do -
 in the
> papers it is referred to my domene www.transcendentalmeditation.no 
and that
> I teach in free time - because I have an other full time job too. 
The TMO
> would not tell how many initiations they had done last year  - I 
was open
> about how many I have teached. The TMO made a point of the 
Agreement forms
> that the TM-Teachers has signed - so did I. The Court did not 
consider that.
> The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - and after he 
die, who
> will be the owner of the TMO and all his techniques.
> 
>  
> 
> The TMO tried to stop me from being a wittness - they wrote a 
letter to the
> Court in forhand of the Court Case and almost demanded the Court 
not to
> allow me to be a wittness. Not a smart thing to do - I think.
> 
>  
> 
> In the Court Case - it was really a difference between Ole Markman 
(The
> lawyer of the TMO - Danish TM-Teacher - with no Carisma - pale and 
grey -
> talking the language of the TMO - telling that I (Ingegerd) do not 
keep the
> knowledge pure - not easy to understand for common people) and the 
Lawyer of
> the Norwegian Government, a very smart man.
> 
>  
> 
> Some other Norwegian teachers of Transcendental meditation is happy 
too -
> they are very successfull in their teaching.
> 
>  
> 
> You are free to use this as you like - send it to FFL if you want.
> 
>  
> 
> Ingegerd Espås
>




To subscribe, send a message to:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Or go to: 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/
and click 'Join This Group!' 
Yahoo! Groups Links

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[curtisdeltablues]

This section was reversed by speaker name, sorry!

It should read: 
Judy:I wouldn't doubt it, but isn't that a bit of a
self-selected sample? How likely is it that
Indians who took such claims for granted would
be those you would make friends with in the
first place?

Me: They are self-selected because the most pious Indians won't
leave the country. My point was that their culture makes the same
distinctions we do concerning televangelists and serious spiritual
people. Claiming miracles is an indication of slippery intent in both
cultures. I have plenty of religious and spiritually minded friends
who still view making claims of miracles as a televangelist trick to
bamboozle naive people. I don't sort friends by beliefs but by behavior.



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Just in case you are not already sick of this topic...
> 
> I think I understand your point of view.  Sounds reasonable.  I also
> understand that you don't find my take on it reasonable.  Fair enough.
>  It was my reaction to the wording of MMY's announcement about Guru
> Dev that changed my view of him from "stodgy old time religion guy" to
> more of a self promoter using miracles as a hook.  But our discussion
> has definitely bought out a need to find out what specific miracles
> MMY claimed for GD.  In any case I have addressed some points you felt
> I had missed. FWIW.
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"
>  wrote:
> 
> > As an aside, the tradition of the day was to
> > deliver a kid to an adult teacher to take care of
> > him. Letting him walk off was just as much an
> > aberration of parental responsibility as it is today.
> 
> Judy If there was anything they could have done
> about it, that is. If they'd handed him over
> to a teacher, and the kid didn't find him
> congenial, he'd most likely have walked away
> from the teacher.
> 
> ME Buz !  Sorry, the correct parenting answer was to take care of
> your underage child.  No one gets off the hook by claiming that kids
> can walk away.  Good parents don't let them, no exceptions.  Rich ones
> get even less slack.  They could have hired a shadow person to follow
> GD around everywhere for about 2 cents a day.
> 
> 
> [I wrote:]
> > MMY, as I said, didn't imply any particular miracle
> > in that particular piece. In the other piece you
> > just quoted, he made a general pro forma reference,
> > pretty much de rigeur for a realized Indian master.
> >
> > When you hear someone introduce a candidate for
> > office as "The next president of the United States,"
> > and the candidate then loses the election, do you
> > then say to yourself, "That scoundrel who introduced
> > the candidate before the election was lying"?
> >
> > I'm not sure where you got the idea about how
> > realized people get introduced, ever been to India?
> 
> Judy; No, but I've read plenty of testimonials
> about purportedly realized teachers.
> 
> ME; I am not challenging your familiarity with spiritual people, just
> how they get introduced.  You are claiming that it was common to
> mention a teacher's siddhis in his intro.  I maintain that only crass
> teachers would use it.  It is hokey spirituality.
> 
> Ever seen another supposedly realized
> > guy get introduced? This is a made up perspective.
> > It is just as likely that mentioning Sidhis is just
> > as tacky for religious people in India as here.
> > Remember he was representing a high formal office.
> 
> Judy: I should think that would make claims for siddhis--
> especially such siddhis as omniscience--even more
> appropriate.
> 
> > My Indian friends here view sidhis claims as
> > ludicrously as we view the healing claims of
> > televangelists.
> 
> ME: I wouldn't doubt it, but isn't that a bit of a
> self-selected sample? How likely is it that
> Indians who took such claims for granted would
> be those you would make friends with in the
> first place?
> 
> Judy: They are self-selected because the most pious Indians won't
> leave the country.  My point was that their culture makes the same
> distinctions we do concerning televangelists and serious spiritual
> people.  Claiming miracles is an indication of slippery intent in both
> cultures.  I have plenty of religious and spiritually minded friends
> who still view making claims of miracles as a televangelist trick to
> bamboozle naive people.  I don't sort friends by beliefs but by
behavior.
> 
> Also, this promotion of Guru Dev took place
> decades earlier than your sojourns in India,
> not that long after India won its independence
> from the British. It's not impossible that
> modern skepticism about such things was a lot
> less common back then.
> 
> ME: Very possible. 
> 
> > The closer example would be Benny Hin's claims of
> > curing cancer being met with the appropriate skepticism.
> > Claiming unproven miracles to market spirituality is
> > crass and deserves to be ridiculed.
> 
> That may be, but the issue h

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[Marek Reavis]

Curtis, without snipping any of your post (below) or spending a whole 
lot more time or words on the subject, it seems pretty clear that 
Guru Dev, himself, believed in siddhis and miracles, as is obvious 
from Paul Mason's site with quotes from him exactly on that subject, 
as well as the bios of him which are allegedly based on stories he 
told himself.  In "The Whole Thing, The Real Thing" he claims his 
guru, Swamiji Krishnanad, raised a boy from the dead and there's also 
the story of the Aghori Mahatma who put on the spectacular diorama of 
the divinities (as well as a deluge of blood and bones) for Guru 
Dev's benefit while Guru Dev was doing sadhana in some jungle 
somewhere.

And the Indian teachers and gurus I've read (Yogananda immediately 
comes to mind), all presume the miraculous as being part and parcel 
of enlightened life.

So it doesn't seem odd or particularly perfidious on Brahmachari 
Mahesh's part to make such claims about Guru Dev, whether or not Guru 
Dev himself claimed to possess them.  Basically, the belief in 
siddhis are part of the Indian culture and as such, even a person of 
integrity and prudence, steeped in that culture, would accept as true 
the reality of miracles that have no empirical proof to substantiate 
them.  It's just a way of looking at the world.

**

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Just in case you are not already sick of this topic...
> 
> I think I understand your point of view.  Sounds reasonable.  I also
> understand that you don't find my take on it reasonable.  Fair 
enough.
>  It was my reaction to the wording of MMY's announcement about Guru
> Dev that changed my view of him from "stodgy old time religion guy" 
to
> more of a self promoter using miracles as a hook.  But our 
discussion
> has definitely bought out a need to find out what specific miracles
> MMY claimed for GD.  In any case I have addressed some points you 
felt
> I had missed. FWIW.
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"
>  wrote:
> 
> > As an aside, the tradition of the day was to
> > deliver a kid to an adult teacher to take care of
> > him. Letting him walk off was just as much an
> > aberration of parental responsibility as it is today.
> 
> Judy If there was anything they could have done
> about it, that is. If they'd handed him over
> to a teacher, and the kid didn't find him
> congenial, he'd most likely have walked away
> from the teacher.
> 
> ME Buz !  Sorry, the correct parenting answer was to take care 
of
> your underage child.  No one gets off the hook by claiming that kids
> can walk away.  Good parents don't let them, no exceptions.  Rich 
ones
> get even less slack.  They could have hired a shadow person to 
follow
> GD around everywhere for about 2 cents a day.
> 
> 
> [I wrote:]
> > MMY, as I said, didn't imply any particular miracle
> > in that particular piece. In the other piece you
> > just quoted, he made a general pro forma reference,
> > pretty much de rigeur for a realized Indian master.
> >
> > When you hear someone introduce a candidate for
> > office as "The next president of the United States,"
> > and the candidate then loses the election, do you
> > then say to yourself, "That scoundrel who introduced
> > the candidate before the election was lying"?
> >
> > I'm not sure where you got the idea about how
> > realized people get introduced, ever been to India?
> 
> Judy; No, but I've read plenty of testimonials
> about purportedly realized teachers.
> 
> ME; I am not challenging your familiarity with spiritual people, 
just
> how they get introduced.  You are claiming that it was common to
> mention a teacher's siddhis in his intro.  I maintain that only 
crass
> teachers would use it.  It is hokey spirituality.
> 
> Ever seen another supposedly realized
> > guy get introduced? This is a made up perspective.
> > It is just as likely that mentioning Sidhis is just
> > as tacky for religious people in India as here.
> > Remember he was representing a high formal office.
> 
> Judy: I should think that would make claims for siddhis--
> especially such siddhis as omniscience--even more
> appropriate.
> 
> > My Indian friends here view sidhis claims as
> > ludicrously as we view the healing claims of
> > televangelists.
> 
> ME: I wouldn't doubt it, but isn't that a bit of a
> self-selected sample? How likely is it that
> Indians who took such claims for granted would
> be those you would make friends with in the
> first place?
> 
> Judy: They are self-selected because the most pious Indians won't
> leave the country.  My point was that their culture makes the same
> distinctions we do concerning televangelists and serious spiritual
> people.  Claiming miracles is an indication of slippery intent in 
both
> cultures.  I have plenty of religious and spiritually minded friends
> who still view making claims of miracles as a televangelist trick to
> bamboozle naive people.  I don

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme

[Lsoma]

 
In a message dated 3/30/2007 1:41:59 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 
 
 

Hey, wait a minute Lsoma; why so uptight ? Why do you want me to  
recognize Lord Ashtar, someone I have heard nothing about 0, ? He is  
probably a great soul !

I see that I hurt your feelings when I  pointed out that hardly any of 
your predictions for 2006 went through. I  am sorry about that, should 
never have made that comment though I was  correct and you were wrong. 
I think your predictions for 2007 looks much  better. We all have our 
ups and downs.

Regarding your "hate"  towards Maitreya I have no comments. Events 
will unfold itself in perfect  harmony. Some will think of Him as the 
great Satan, particularily amongst  the fundamentalistic population in 
every religion. 

Now just one  last comment before I refuse to answer any of your 
outbursts until you  actually read what Benjamin Creme writes, what 
you obviously have not  done; Jesus of Nasareth is not the Christ. The 
Christ, Iman Madhi, Krisha,  Maitreya Buddha, The Messiah and many of 
the Awaited is now in incarnation  having created a Mahavirupta body 
in the Himalayas and transported Himself  to London in 1977. His name 
is Maitreya. 13 of the 33 Masters have also  taken birth at this time. 
Brahmananda Saraswathi is currently not in  incarnation. Jesus of 
Nasareth is one of Them and is currently and for the  last 600 years 
residing in Italy. His particular interest, among many  other things, 
has been the Church i Latin America.

For TM'ers this  is hardly a surprise. "Heaven will walk on earth - in 
this  generation."
-Maharishi

Don't be critical. Why not practise that  which you have said in 
former posts; we should all rather be working  together !

With the deepest respect for you and your work Lsoma  !
Nablusoss
> Yes. I did mention how different groups should meditate together or at  
least at the same time of day in the past. However, you said it was dangerous  
for people to meditate together according to Lord Meitreya. I appriciate your  
recognition that my 2007 predictions are on target. I know you think i'm  
egotistical but I am a volunteer from the sixth dimension. Therefore, my  
commitment to the inner core group of vounteers is very strong since the time  
is near 
for a visit from other races. There are 50,000 different races.  Spaceships 
will be landing not to save people but to educate the masses of how  the 
Pleidians live. It is the Pleideans that are most protective of planet  earth. 
Lord 
Ashstar is the leader of this massive evacuation if  nessassary or to implement 
a new way of living or us. MMY will pass over in  July or August which sets 
into motion a new energy matrix for the TMO. I  look forward to the new and 
more enlightening society that will dawn from  2008 to 2012. Good luck with 
your 
journey and I'm sure that everyone  will find their own way.  
Sincerely, 
Lou Valentino 

Q. Why, if Maitreya appears before 600 or even  more people at a 
meeting of a religious group in Britain ¯ as in Edinburgh  and York 
¯ do we see nothing about it in the media?

BC: The people  before whom he appears are in every case 
fundamentalist Christians of one  persuasion or another; 
denominationally they vary tremendously, but the  consistent factor is 
that they are all extremely dogmatic in their  beliefs. Maitreya 
appears to them to `soften them up.' These are the  groups from whom, 
throughout the world, he expects the major opposition  and rejection. 
If he appears as the World Teacher and they are expecting  the Teacher 
in their own terms ¯ as the Christ, Maitreya Buddha, Krishna,  the 
Imam Mahdi, the Messiah ¯ with their very fixed views they would be  
inclined to reject him. 

The most important thing is the creation  of the healing waters, which 
is done first. When Maitreya has magnetized  the waters, in due course 
¯ it might take a few weeks ¯ he finds a group  of fundamentalists 
in a town nearby and appears before them. He speaks to  them in their 
own language and many healings take place during the  process. He does 
not say: "I am Maitreya"; "I am the Christ"; or "I am the  Imam 
Mahdi," he just appears, out of the blue but in a form which they  
will recognize ¯ as he did in Nairobi in Kenya, on 11 June 1988, an  
appearance of which we have photographs. 

Maitreya leaves it to the  groups, in the thoughtform in which he has 
appeared to them, to recognize  him or not. Some of them will 
say: "Beware, it could be the anti-christ:  before the Christ comes, 
the anti-christ is coming." That is why they do  not speak out, and if 
they do not speak the media does not speak.  Occasionally at these 
meetings there have been representatives of  religious newspapers who 
do not write about it. Why not? I think they do  not know what to do 
with this information: it is too `hot.' 

Either  they believe it is the Christ or they believe it is the anti-
christ; or  they are mystified because he

[FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government

[ffia1120]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> The Government of Norway, how can they be involved in this case ? I 
> don't get it. Anyway, if "they" do not see that it was Maharishi 
that 
> invented and spent 30 years to let the world know about TM, and 
that it 
> is unique I think they have a problem. Transcendental Meditation is 
not 
> a state of consciousness, it is a mental technique. That the 
judges, 
> the fools in court, was not able to understand this is not very 
> surprising. Maharishi once commented that "Norway is a long and 
narrow 
> country, inhabited by narrowminded people." They are a greedy bunch 
of 
> consumers; not very spiritual at all. And the socalled "independent 
> teachers", why are they ? I think it boils down to the same thing; 
> greed - they want to collect the money for themselves. They got 
> everything they know about meditation from Maharishi, now they want 
to 
> cash in. I know it is not that simple, but I still feel that it's 
> discusting.

Re: Maharishi once commented that "Norway is a long and narrow
country, inhabited by narrowminded people." 

Does MMY ever have anything NICE to say about anybody (besides the 
TBs who he criticizes as well) or any country? He sure does a lot of 
criticizing and what does that accomplish? It makes him look very 
small.

As to why teachers are independent -- are you really that clueless? 
Or do you have no memory of the recent past? TM teachers were told 
that if they did not get "re-certified" that they were no longer TM 
teachers in the eyes of the TMO. This is what (IMO) has alienated 
hundreds (thousands?) of loyal, dedicated TM teachers and is the 
primary reason that when the big call went out last summer for TMers 
to congregate in FF, most of the govs (and fed up sidhas) stayed 
home. MMY bit the hand that fed him on the re-certification decision, 
IMO.

[FairfieldLife] 18 video lectures/instructions by Goenka re his 10-day Vipassana course

[claudiouk]

Haven't checked out the whole series but this first video I found very 
interesting..

the first "breathing meditation" technique plus interesting 
observations abaout "subtler" awareness, general course instructions:
http://uk.video.yahoo.com/video/play?vid=202317&fr=yfp-t-501

In fact this is the "first" but maybe less interesting video:
http://uk.video.yahoo.com/video/play?ei=UTF-8&b=2&vid=202315&gid=164791

Whole series of lectures:
http://uk.video.yahoo.com/video/group?gid=164791

Goenka is the guru who introduced Vipassana in Indian prisons:
Doing Time, Doing Vipassana":
http://homepage.mac.com/vajranatha/FileSharing2.html
http://www.prison.dhamma.org/

UK centre: http://www.dipa.dhamma.org/

If I were not doing TM I would be intrigued enough to try the 10-day 
course myself!!

[FairfieldLife] Romance on the Spiritual Path

[TurquoiseB]

It happens, right?

And it's often more complicated for those pursuing
a strong spiritual path than it is for those who are
not, right?

I mean, added to all the other normal, everyday 
impediments to finding a cool person to hook up with, 
there's all this God stuff. Or eternity stuff, or 
Absolute stuff, or whatever you want to call it. 
There are a number of additional hurdles to overcome.

There's the "Will this guy/gal one day get a wild
spiritual hair up his ass and decide to dump me and
go live in a cave in the Himalayas" thang. There's
the "This is a pretty small, incestuous community, 
and if it doesn't work out between him/her and me,
how am I going to handle running into him at courses
for decades to come" thang. There's the "Will Maharishi
throw me out of the movement if I ball this guy/gal" 
thang. There's the *karma* thang. There are just SO 
many "thangs."

So I thought it might be fun to ask for people's
romance stories here. I know I have a few, and I'd 
be willing to bet that you guys have more than a few
yourselves.

[FairfieldLife] "Stop the Dolphin and Whale killings in Taiji" -online petition

[Alen Z.]

Dear Friends,

I have just read and signed the online petition:

  "Stop the Dolphin and Whale killings in Taiji"

hosted on the web by PetitionOnline.com, the free online petition
service, at: 

  http://www.PetitionOnline.com/golfinho/

I personally agree with what this petition says, and I think you might 
agree, too.  If you can spare a moment, please take a look, and consider
signing yourself.

Best wishes,

 
-
We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love
(and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.

Re: [FairfieldLife] Romance on the Spiritual Path

[Sal Sunshine]

On Mar 30, 2007, at 2:10 PM, TurquoiseB wrote:


It happens, right?

And it's often more complicated for those pursuing
a strong spiritual path than it is for those who are
not, right?


I'm not at all sure of that, Barry.  I think to some extent it's just 
an excuse many of us use. :)  I don't think the social situation in our 
W culture is very healthy, and leaves a lot of people on the outside 
looking in, as it were.  Whether being on a 'spiritual path' makes it 
more difficult is impossible to say, IMO.  But since I believe that 
most are on some sort of path or other I would disagree there's 
anything inherently more difficult about a spiritual one.  Especially 
since it's often impossible to define exactly what a 'spiritual path' 
actually is.


Sal

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[curtisdeltablues]

As always I am glad you weighed in Marek!  I agree with what you said
up to a point.  Certainly Guru Dev had such beliefs and may have
viewed his own experiences as proof of miracles.  Since I am not
inclined to believe in River Goddesses giving monetary boons to
people, I still think there was some monkey business surrounding this
claim.  It is either objectively true or not and he knew which it was.

Yogananda with his movie star disciples is in the same Hindu
televangelist camp as MMY in my book.  He was huckstering spirituality
in the West for cash.  I have some pious Indian friends from Gujarat.
 Their view of guys like MMY matches my own.  I think there is a
legitimate distinction in most cultures between the guys marketing
spirituality with stories of magical powers, and the more traditional
conservative view.  It believe that this distinction is important to
religious people the world over.  I used to put Guru Dev in a
different category from MMY in this regard.  Now I am not so sure. 

I get that my point means nothing to people who are inclined to take
Yoganandas claims of miracles as factually true and the same for Guru
Dev's miracles.  My view may only have importance in how I am
constructing distinctions between different types of religious people.
 It is a work in progress.  So far I think that people making claims
of miracles to gain spiritual credibility are more suspect than those
who do not.  It reflects the boundaries of my own thinking based on
seeing too many people claim stuff that just isn't true.  I am opened
to any demonstration of miracles that includes professional magicians.
 I would love to have seen some of the stuff Turq reports.  But since
I have not, I am still skeptical till I see something substantial.  So
with that starting point when I see a claim of miracles my antenna go
up.  I am not inclined to believe that living alone for a long time
gave Guru Dev super powers.  If he is claiming to have seen Krishna
like Yogananda did, I figure, so have I under long meditation
influence.  But if he claims to have a box that gives cash, I view
this claim differently.  It is another class of delusion or con.  Once
the claim reaches an objective level, it gets the same treatment for
me that any physical claim gets.  All subjective experiences are given
a total pass from me because I know how compelling they can be.  As I
said, work in progress!

This topic can be used in so many ways.  It is a way to explore where
we are drawing our different lines.  I need to dig up my "Whole Thing
Real Thing" book.  I bought one from Dr. Varma years ago.




--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Marek Reavis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> Curtis, without snipping any of your post (below) or spending a whole 
> lot more time or words on the subject, it seems pretty clear that 
> Guru Dev, himself, believed in siddhis and miracles, as is obvious 
> from Paul Mason's site with quotes from him exactly on that subject, 
> as well as the bios of him which are allegedly based on stories he 
> told himself.  In "The Whole Thing, The Real Thing" he claims his 
> guru, Swamiji Krishnanad, raised a boy from the dead and there's also 
> the story of the Aghori Mahatma who put on the spectacular diorama of 
> the divinities (as well as a deluge of blood and bones) for Guru 
> Dev's benefit while Guru Dev was doing sadhana in some jungle 
> somewhere.
> 
> And the Indian teachers and gurus I've read (Yogananda immediately 
> comes to mind), all presume the miraculous as being part and parcel 
> of enlightened life.
> 
> So it doesn't seem odd or particularly perfidious on Brahmachari 
> Mahesh's part to make such claims about Guru Dev, whether or not Guru 
> Dev himself claimed to possess them.  Basically, the belief in 
> siddhis are part of the Indian culture and as such, even a person of 
> integrity and prudence, steeped in that culture, would accept as true 
> the reality of miracles that have no empirical proof to substantiate 
> them.  It's just a way of looking at the world.
> 
> **
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" 
>  wrote:
> >
> > Just in case you are not already sick of this topic...
> > 
> > I think I understand your point of view.  Sounds reasonable.  I also
> > understand that you don't find my take on it reasonable.  Fair 
> enough.
> >  It was my reaction to the wording of MMY's announcement about Guru
> > Dev that changed my view of him from "stodgy old time religion guy" 
> to
> > more of a self promoter using miracles as a hook.  But our 
> discussion
> > has definitely bought out a need to find out what specific miracles
> > MMY claimed for GD.  In any case I have addressed some points you 
> felt
> > I had missed. FWIW.
> > 
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues"
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > > As an aside, the tradition of the day was to
> > > deliver a kid to an adult teacher to take care of
> > > him. Letting him walk off was just as much

Re: [FairfieldLife] Romance on the Spiritual Path

[Bhairitu]

TurquoiseB wrote:
> It happens, right?
>
> And it's often more complicated for those pursuing
> a strong spiritual path than it is for those who are
> not, right?
>
> I mean, added to all the other normal, everyday 
> impediments to finding a cool person to hook up with, 
> there's all this God stuff. Or eternity stuff, or 
> Absolute stuff, or whatever you want to call it. 
> There are a number of additional hurdles to overcome.
>
> There's the "Will this guy/gal one day get a wild
> spiritual hair up his ass and decide to dump me and
> go live in a cave in the Himalayas" thang. There's
> the "This is a pretty small, incestuous community, 
> and if it doesn't work out between him/her and me,
> how am I going to handle running into him at courses
> for decades to come" thang. There's the "Will Maharishi
> throw me out of the movement if I ball this guy/gal" 
> thang. There's the *karma* thang. There are just SO 
> many "thangs."
>
> So I thought it might be fun to ask for people's
> romance stories here. I know I have a few, and I'd 
> be willing to bet that you guys have more than a few
> yourselves.
I found that many women on the "spiritual path" were into rescuing "hurt 
puppies" or guys that had little interest in spiritual things but 
perceived as needing some help.  The guy became their project.  I 
recognized this easily because my niece was that way and the family was 
often critical of her "projects" that usually wound up in disaster.  I 
bet you're seen this phenomena too.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Romance on the Spiritual Path

[authfriend]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> On Mar 30, 2007, at 2:10 PM, TurquoiseB wrote:
> 
> > It happens, right?
> >
> > And it's often more complicated for those pursuing
> > a strong spiritual path than it is for those who are
> > not, right?
> 
> I'm not at all sure of that, Barry.  I think to some extent
> it's just an excuse many of us use. :)  I don't think the social 
> situation in our W culture is very healthy, and leaves a lot of 
> people on the outside looking in, as it were.  Whether being on 
> a 'spiritual path' makes it more difficult is impossible to say,
> IMO.  But since I believe that most are on some sort of path or 
> other I would disagree there's anything inherently more difficult 
> about a spiritual one.  Especially since it's often impossible to 
> define exactly what a 'spiritual path' actually is.

Well said.

I've had long-term relationships both on and off
the spiritual path, such as it may be, and never
found the former to be more complicated than the
latter. If anything, the shared commitment has 
served as a kind of glue that has made it easier
to get past other kinds of obstacles and conflicts
with the relationship intact.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Romance on the Spiritual Path

[TurquoiseB]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> On Mar 30, 2007, at 2:10 PM, TurquoiseB wrote:
> 
> > It happens, right?
> >
> > And it's often more complicated for those pursuing
> > a strong spiritual path than it is for those who are
> > not, right?
> 
> I'm not at all sure of that, Barry.  I think to some extent 
> it's just an excuse many of us use. :)  I don't think the 
> social situation in our W culture is very healthy, and 
> leaves a lot of people on the outside looking in, as it 
> were.  Whether being on a 'spiritual path' makes it more 
> difficult is impossible to say, IMO.  But since I believe 
> that most are on some sort of path or other I would disagree 
> there's anything inherently more difficult about a spiritual 
> one.  Especially since it's often impossible to define 
> exactly what a 'spiritual path' actually is.

If you've never noticed much of a difference from
the mainstream of life, cool. I guess I have. Like 
when your girlfriend is as psychic as you are, and
when you hook up, you really "hook up."  :-)

Like the connection is 24/7, wherever in the world
you find yourselves, together or apart. You'd prob-
ably have to have the music to go with this to get
it completely, but the best statement I know of 
about his state of affairs (so to speak) is from
Bruce Cockburn, in his song, "Live On My Mind."
He wrote it while continents away from the woman
he was writing it to. Or maybe he wasn't.


See you standing in the door against the dark
Fireflies around you like a crown of sparks
You blow me a kiss that blurs my vision
Blurs the human condition

You're the ocean ringing in my brain
You are my island ripe with cane
Catch the scent of strange flowers when you pass
Fluid motion like the wind in grass

It's your eyes I want to see
Looking into mine
Got you live on my mind
All the time

Light me like incense in the night
Light me like a candle burning bright
Light me like a searchlight in the sky
Time means nothing when I look in your eyes

It's your eyes I want to see
Looking into mine
Got you live on my mind
All the time

It's your eyes I want to see
Looking into mine
Got you live on my mind
All the time

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[authfriend]

Curtis, Marek has made my points more 
authoritatively and far more succinctly than
I've been able to do, so I'll bow out, except
for this:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> > > Your thinking is so very rigid when it suits
> > > your purposes, and so very flexible when that
> > > works better for you.
> > >
> > > Agreed. It has taken me years of self development
> > > to achieve this.
> > 
> > Judy: And you're *proud* of insisting on the evidence
> > when it confirms your beliefs and ignoring it
> > when it doesn't??
> > 
> > Me: I don't see how trying to characterize my thinking
> > process in a negative way advances our discussion Judy.
> > I am not soliciting your help in my general thinking
> > style.

You weren't soliciting my help in understanding
Guru Dev and MMY either.

Why would you be soliciting help anyway if you
aren't aware you need it?

Just think of it as a random act of kindness.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[curtisdeltablues]

Condescension is not kindness. 


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Curtis, Marek has made my points more 
> authoritatively and far more succinctly than
> I've been able to do, so I'll bow out, except
> for this:
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" 
>  wrote:
> 
> > > > Your thinking is so very rigid when it suits
> > > > your purposes, and so very flexible when that
> > > > works better for you.
> > > >
> > > > Agreed. It has taken me years of self development
> > > > to achieve this.
> > > 
> > > Judy: And you're *proud* of insisting on the evidence
> > > when it confirms your beliefs and ignoring it
> > > when it doesn't??
> > > 
> > > Me: I don't see how trying to characterize my thinking
> > > process in a negative way advances our discussion Judy.
> > > I am not soliciting your help in my general thinking
> > > style.
> 
> You weren't soliciting my help in understanding
> Guru Dev and MMY either.
> 
> Why would you be soliciting help anyway if you
> aren't aware you need it?
> 
> Just think of it as a random act of kindness.
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[Marek Reavis]

Comment below:

**

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> As always I am glad you weighed in Marek!  I agree with what you 
said
> up to a point.  Certainly Guru Dev had such beliefs and may have
> viewed his own experiences as proof of miracles.  Since I am not
> inclined to believe in River Goddesses giving monetary boons to
> people, I still think there was some monkey business surrounding 
this
> claim.  It is either objectively true or not and he knew which it 
was.
> 
> Yogananda with his movie star disciples is in the same Hindu
> televangelist camp as MMY in my book.  He was huckstering 
spirituality
> in the West for cash.  I have some pious Indian friends from 
Gujarat.
>  Their view of guys like MMY matches my own.  I think there is a
> legitimate distinction in most cultures between the guys marketing
> spirituality with stories of magical powers, and the more 
traditional
> conservative view.  It believe that this distinction is important to
> religious people the world over.  I used to put Guru Dev in a
> different category from MMY in this regard.  Now I am not so sure. 
> 
> I get that my point means nothing to people who are inclined to take
> Yoganandas claims of miracles as factually true and the same for 
Guru
> Dev's miracles.  My view may only have importance in how I am
> constructing distinctions between different types of religious 
people.
>  It is a work in progress.  So far I think that people making claims
> of miracles to gain spiritual credibility are more suspect than 
those
> who do not.  It reflects the boundaries of my own thinking based on
> seeing too many people claim stuff that just isn't true.  I am 
opened
> to any demonstration of miracles that includes professional 
magicians.
>  I would love to have seen some of the stuff Turq reports.  But 
since
> I have not, I am still skeptical till I see something substantial.  
So
> with that starting point when I see a claim of miracles my antenna 
go
> up.  I am not inclined to believe that living alone for a long time
> gave Guru Dev super powers.  If he is claiming to have seen Krishna
> like Yogananda did, I figure, so have I under long meditation
> influence.  But if he claims to have a box that gives cash, I view
> this claim differently.  It is another class of delusion or con.  
Once
> the claim reaches an objective level, it gets the same treatment for
> me that any physical claim gets.  All subjective experiences are 
given
> a total pass from me because I know how compelling they can be.  As 
I
> said, work in progress!
> 
> This topic can be used in so many ways.  It is a way to explore 
where
> we are drawing our different lines.  I need to dig up my "Whole 
Thing
> Real Thing" book.  I bought one from Dr. Varma years ago.
> 

**snip to end**

Curtis, I totally agree that the real discussion between us on this 
subject is just where we draw the lines in our understanding and 
belief of who these guys are and what they stand for.  And like you, 
and for some time, I have distinguished in my mind Maharishi from 
Guru Dev precisely because I felt that Guru Dev lived a life 
consciously chosen to be (and apparently successfully lived) separate 
from the distractions and temptations that may have affected 
Maharishi's life decisions.

Bottom line for me, however, is that there is something in the life 
of Guru Dev, as and to the degree I know it, that inspires me.  In 
the video of the French Tibetan monk, when he comments near the 
beginning of his talk about when he first went to the Himalayas and 
met the Buddhist monks, he found that he didn't just want to learn 
what they knew, he wanted to *be* the way they were.  He recognized 
some quality of consciousness in them that he wanted as well.

When I first met Maharishi that's exactly what I felt.  Whatever it 
was that he had, I wanted That, too.  I wanted to *be* That.  And 
besides that, I wanted to be a good man, a good person, a person of 
compassion and virtue.  Nothing of what I have subsequently heard or 
read of Maharishi's possible failings as a man or a teacher have 
convinced me that he is not awake in pure consciousness, Awake in 
Brahman.  However, he just isn't a role model for the other relative 
personal virtues that I esteem.  But, based on everything I have 
heard or read about Guru Dev, I feel that his character and 
personality are totally worthy of emulation, reverence and respect.  
To me he is a Buddha and I revere him as such.

Would it come to light, however, that he had personal failures as a 
human being that I have no inkling of now, of course I would be 
disappointed (just as I have been disappointed with some of 
Maharishi's personal characteristics), but the ideal, which to me he 
represents, would still be alive in me as an ideal to pursue and 
strive for. Guru Dev is a representation, in my consciousness, of 
exactly what I feel he should be, and as such, is perfect.  Perfect 
B

[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme

[lurkernomore20002000]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
snip

> Benjamin Creme is not my Guru and I have met him only once. I have 
> said this before, but for some it seems difficult to grasp that some 
information is just pure gold and highly interesting, and I 
> appreciate that you appreciate it lurk.

Yea, he seems pretty right on, on many things.
> 
> I'm not too familiar with some of the jargon here; what is "snipping 
> a post" ?

Ok, I am playing moderator here, (so I am not counting this as one of 
my five)  

Snipping:  When you reply to a post, you can edit and "snip" out parts 
that you don't need, or want.  Just use your cursor and backspace 
parts to delete, or left click and hold and move up to "block out" a 
section, then backspack.  Isn't this familiar to you?

lurk


>

[FairfieldLife] Auspicious Days for the Month of April 2007

[jiva jivazz]

Note: forwarded message attached.



 

TV dinner still cooling? 
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You appear to be using an email application that won't properly display
the graphical (or HTML) version of our Yagya newsletter. Please visit
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[FairfieldLife] A House Divided will not Long Stand

[dhamiltony2k5]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ffia1120 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> As to why teachers are independent -- are you really that clueless? 
> Or do you have no memory of the recent past? TM teachers were told 
> that if they did not get "re-certified" that they were no longer TM 
> teachers in the eyes of the TMO. This is what (IMO) has alienated 
> hundreds (thousands?) of loyal, dedicated TM teachers and is the 
> primary reason that when the big call went out last summer for TMers 
> to congregate in FF, most of the govs (and fed up sidhas) stayed 
> home. MMY bit the hand that fed him on the re-certification decision, 
> IMO.
>

Good practical observation about the situation here now with the TM 
community.
Yes, it is that now classical theme: `A house divided will not long 
stand'.

http://showcase.netins.net/web/creative/lincoln/speeches/house.htm

a fascinating thing about the situation is that there is not language 
of reconcilliation extended by any of them up there.  'Their truth goes 
marching on'.  It is getting to be a pretty small group.

-Old Governor Doug in FF

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[authfriend]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Condescension is not kindness.

That wasn't condescension, it was snark.

In response to pomposity.
 

> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > Curtis, Marek has made my points more 
> > authoritatively and far more succinctly than
> > I've been able to do, so I'll bow out, except
> > for this:
> > 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" 
> >  wrote:
> > 
> > > > > Your thinking is so very rigid when it suits
> > > > > your purposes, and so very flexible when that
> > > > > works better for you.
> > > > >
> > > > > Agreed. It has taken me years of self development
> > > > > to achieve this.
> > > > 
> > > > Judy: And you're *proud* of insisting on the evidence
> > > > when it confirms your beliefs and ignoring it
> > > > when it doesn't??
> > > > 
> > > > Me: I don't see how trying to characterize my thinking
> > > > process in a negative way advances our discussion Judy.
> > > > I am not soliciting your help in my general thinking
> > > > style.
> > 
> > You weren't soliciting my help in understanding
> > Guru Dev and MMY either.
> > 
> > Why would you be soliciting help anyway if you
> > aren't aware you need it?
> > 
> > Just think of it as a random act of kindness.

[FairfieldLife] Braincell and the Universe

[Vaj]

http://sprott.physics.wisc.edu/pickover/pc/brain-universe.html

[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme

[Richard J. Williams]

Also, try top posting and stop changing the 
subject line. The search engine on Yahoo! 
already sucks - don't make it worse. If you 
have anything worthwhile to say, don's say 
it in the subject line - start a new topic. 

Yahoo! Groups sucks as a newsreader - can't 
even hardly follow along a thread the way 
the lines are all jumbled up. Judy and 
TurquoisB seem to be the only respondents 
here who know how to format a line with 
the ENTER key. Go figure.

lurk wrote:
> Snipping:  When you reply to a post, you 
> can edit and "snip" out parts that you 
> don't need, or want.  

[FairfieldLife] Milarepa, the movie

[Vaj]

http://milarepamovie.com/

By the same team as "The Cup"

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[Richard J. Williams]

Marek Reavis wrote:
> But, based on everything I have heard or 
> read about Guru Dev, I feel that his 
> character and personality are totally 
> worthy of emulation, reverence and respect.
>
>From what I've read, Rajaram Mishra fully supported
the Indian varnashramadharma system. That's why 
he didn't include Mr. Varma on the list of worthy 
successors in his will. Mahesh was of the Sudra 
caste from a family of scribes, and thus not 
eligible for the title of sannyasin. 

It may be that Rajaram was am arch conservative 
as well - not a single woman was included in his 
will either. Which is odd, since he supposedly 
worshipped the Goddess Saraswati. I wouldn't be 
surprised if Guru Dev fully supported the 
conservative party in Indian politics as well. 
Apparently Mr. Mishra was addicted to betel 
leaves and enjoyed a good chew after every meal. 

So, how are you going to emulate these qualities, 
not to mention the idea of total celibacy and 
skipping the whole stage of a householder? I 
mean, it's great to respect holy men, but emulation 
of them is not for this age. I once read a story
about Ramakrishna that related how he refused to
sleep with his own wife. Go figure. 

Yes, I like Brahmananda, Maharishi and Yogananda,
and lots of other teachers too, but it's probably 
counterproductive for anyone on the spiritual 
path to indulge in a cult of personality and 
insinuate that their teacher is divinity itself
and thus try to emulate their behavior. MMY is a 
case in point - so is Trungpa or Fredrick Lentz.
One drank hisself to death and the other killed 
hisself with a dog collar around his neck. 

Be your own Guru.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[Richard J. Williams]

Ccurtis wrote:
> So far I think that people making claims
> of miracles to gain spiritual credibility 
> are more suspect than those who do not.
>
Well, it would be pretty difficult to find 
a "spiritual" person who didn't believe in 
spirits, ergo, a miracle, since every 
materialist knows that there are no spirits 
- only claims. But, are you saying that 
there are spiritual materialists who make 
no claims of miracles or spirits? That would 
be a contradiction in terms, would it not?

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[curtisdeltablues]

Richard, 

I was thinking that mainstream religious types don't talk about
miracles much. They talk about love.  They feel uncomfortable with
people who claim miracles.  So they might be spiritual and believe in
God, but not buy that some preacher can heal cancer by shouting at
you.  I think this is the majority of religious Americans.  By the
time you figure out how watered down their version of spirituality is,
you find it is more similar than different from an Atheist's view of
our lot in life.  A place where shit happens and no one seems to have
a hotline to the big guy or we wouldn't have Guinea worms. (Google
ride this at your own peril)  I think some people believe in a vague
"great spirit" and, like the deists, don't feel that God has much to
do with our lives after creation.  So that was what I was thinking,
religious people who believe in God but are pretty skeptical about
miracle claims outside their scriptures, East or West. 

Thanks for asking.  Any insight is appreciated. 



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Richard J. Williams"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Ccurtis wrote:
> > So far I think that people making claims
> > of miracles to gain spiritual credibility 
> > are more suspect than those who do not.
> >
> Well, it would be pretty difficult to find 
> a "spiritual" person who didn't believe in 
> spirits, ergo, a miracle, since every 
> materialist knows that there are no spirits 
> - only claims. But, are you saying that 
> there are spiritual materialists who make 
> no claims of miracles or spirits? That would 
> be a contradiction in terms, would it not?
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues

[Marek Reavis]

Reply below:

**

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Richard J. Williams"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Marek Reavis wrote:
> > But, based on everything I have heard or 
> > read about Guru Dev, I feel that his 
> > character and personality are totally 
> > worthy of emulation, reverence and respect.
> >
> From what I've read, Rajaram Mishra fully supported
> the Indian varnashramadharma system. That's why 
> he didn't include Mr. Varma on the list of worthy 
> successors in his will. Mahesh was of the Sudra 
> caste from a family of scribes, and thus not 
> eligible for the title of sannyasin. 
> 
> It may be that Rajaram was am arch conservative 
> as well - not a single woman was included in his 
> will either. Which is odd, since he supposedly 
> worshipped the Goddess Saraswati. I wouldn't be 
> surprised if Guru Dev fully supported the 
> conservative party in Indian politics as well. 
> Apparently Mr. Mishra was addicted to betel 
> leaves and enjoyed a good chew after every meal. 
> 
> So, how are you going to emulate these qualities, 
> not to mention the idea of total celibacy and 
> skipping the whole stage of a householder? I 
> mean, it's great to respect holy men, but emulation 
> of them is not for this age. I once read a story
> about Ramakrishna that related how he refused to
> sleep with his own wife. Go figure. 
> 
> Yes, I like Brahmananda, Maharishi and Yogananda,
> and lots of other teachers too, but it's probably 
> counterproductive for anyone on the spiritual 
> path to indulge in a cult of personality and 
> insinuate that their teacher is divinity itself
> and thus try to emulate their behavior. MMY is a 
> case in point - so is Trungpa or Fredrick Lentz.
> One drank hisself to death and the other killed 
> hisself with a dog collar around his neck. 
> 
> Be your own Guru.
>
**end**

Excellent comments, thank you.

Absolutely, we are our own guru; the utilization of Divine Teachers,
living or dead, and images of God, is only a projection of our own
highest sense of Self onto an 'other' so we have something to put
Attention on; basically a movement, either as an intermediary step
towards a clearer sense of Self, or as end in itself if you find just
the perfect configuration in a projection (the Shri Yantra comes to
mind as non-representational but perfect projection).

Guru Dev is a hero to me.  The fact that he was a monk, and that
Maharishi's whole program came wrapped in a type of spiritual glamour
regarding monkish virtues (even though Maharishi famously taught
"meditation for householders"), certainly informs some of my emulation
of Guru Dev; but I meant 'emulation' more as to integrity and focus
rather than specific lifestyle or ashrama.  The speculation that he
was likely a very traditional and conservative Brahmin Hindu who
probably espoused political and social views that I wouldn't share,
also doesn't affect my sense of reverence and affection. So too,
whatever tastes he may have cultivated or addictions he may have
cherished; betel, coffee, bhang, tea or chillum -- who cares.  These
things are all expressions of the cultural and political milieu into
which a personality is born and steeped in.

But the cult of personality seems to be a fundamental human
characteristic.  The key, I guess, is to find (or project) a
personality that is worthy of the cult, regardless of where in time or
where in the world it was formed.  Generally speaking, Buddhism seems
to have gotten that pretty right.  Christianity, less so, in my
opinion; same with Islam.  Hinduism seems robust but very spotty.

Anyway, thanks again for the post.

Marek

[FairfieldLife] Spiritual Life, Saints, M Effect,

[new . morning]

Hello,

I have not posted in a while, and lapsed in reading for a good part of
that. The five post limit looks good. But discussion seems a bit
stilted sometimes. Its a pity to cap great diologues like Curtis and
Marek's -- if they have more to say in a day in their saints
discussion. But overall the new FFL seems like the older FFL of 2-3
years ago which many of us were quite fond of. 

Some some themes (or broad extrapolations of them in my head) have
caught my attention in an interconnected sort of way. and shou

1) What is spiritual life?

2) What characterizes a saint and his/her life?

3) "Tale tales" told by and of Saints

4) Does the ME diminish by distance for example like like gravity and
light -- 1/distance^2?

5) What is relationship between spiritual people

Some thoughts, which are hardly new and sound quite trite in words,
but for me, several creates a strong "flip" of life -- sort of like
the foreground/background optical illusions, when its "groked" and
actually siumply lived. 

1) Primarily satisfaction from THAT, that constant inner dipping,
drinking at the well, amidst both the enticing and enthralling films
(life / karmic roll-outs, life circumstances, roles and
responsibilities we assume) and  painfilly bad ones. We can 
still be really into the film, enthusiastically, but not living for it
-- or craving release from it. Just keep drinking the nectar from the
well and um, "take it as it comes" (or as it flies off the fan). Trite
words, but a refreshing lovely thing when lived. 

2) Deeply living above. Every saint, living deep values of THAT inside
and outside, all have very diverse karma's they are living out -- and
some taken on from students. Judging a saints life from outer
circumstances, personality, habits etc is totally missing what they
are. Its as "off" as judging ones life as "good" if good times are
rolling and bad when they are not. 

3) Some saints feel no shame in telling tale tales -- and some
stranger than life true ones -- if it sucks some into living the
above. Effective communicators paint effective picturs that motivate
action towards something. If its a good thing the listener gets to
from the process, all can laugh later at the tall tales. Was
Yogananda's vision of Krishna an embellished tale or a reality? Dunno,
but it got my attention. It may have not been Krishna, but it was, i am
sure, something in that direction.

On the other hand, if the tall tales are used to manipulate, control
distort, impress and extort, its a bad thing. How to distiguish? Not
sure. Be skeptical I guess. And be open to being entertained and
insprired within that skepticism. Charlie Lutes told lots of "tall
tales", in my book, and in doing so inspired many on a path that
helped them. TMO has told some tall tales that for some
have run them down hill.

4) Why should FF crime, hog farm etc be more diminished by proximity
to MD, Domes etc more than in San Francisco or Moscow? We seem to
automatically assume a distance effect from groupd YF, Saints, Darshan
etc. Yet if those things operate at finest level, or beyond, then
effect should / could be evenly distributed across great distance. 
Darshan of saints is very special. Proximity. But you can have darshan
of any saint at any time by closing eyes and just be with that saint.
Effects can be powerful. Relates to point 2. What is the Saint? Their
outer lives, and proximity/locality, or a universal, fairly
unlocalized expression of THAT?  

5) Satisfaction primarily from THAT and not from the other. Odd
sounding structure to some I am sure. But eliminates co-dependence and
all. Using the pain of separation and longing to be with lover as
intense back drop to find satisfaction in THAT as anchor. My relations
of the past have most always been the reverse -- due to my
shortcomings and not being above to hold onto THAT when
those huge WAVEs come.  

Comments and other angles or views most welcome.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Spiritual Life, Saints, M Effect,

[lurkernomore20002000]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:

Was it just me, or could anyone else not slog through these points?  
Kinda like someone dumping a truckload of manure on a little flower. 
Or someone calling a call in radio show and asking about 10 
questions.  Be selective, or bring up one point every few days.

lurk
>
> Hello,
> 
> I have not posted in a while, and lapsed in reading for a good 
part of
> that. The five post limit looks good. But discussion seems a bit
> stilted sometimes. Its a pity to cap great diologues like Curtis 
and
> Marek's -- if they have more to say in a day in their saints
> discussion. But overall the new FFL seems like the older FFL of 2-3
> years ago which many of us were quite fond of. 
> 
> Some some themes (or broad extrapolations of them in my head) have
> caught my attention in an interconnected sort of way. and shou
> 
> 1) What is spiritual life?
> 
> 2) What characterizes a saint and his/her life?
> 
> 3) "Tale tales" told by and of Saints
> 
> 4) Does the ME diminish by distance for example like like gravity 
and
> light -- 1/distance^2?
> 
> 5) What is relationship between spiritual people
> 
> Some thoughts, which are hardly new and sound quite trite in words,
> but for me, several creates a strong "flip" of life -- sort of like
> the foreground/background optical illusions, when its "groked" and
> actually siumply lived. 
> 
> 1) Primarily satisfaction from THAT, that constant inner dipping,
> drinking at the well, amidst both the enticing and enthralling 
films
> (life / karmic roll-outs, life circumstances, roles and
> responsibilities we assume) and  painfilly bad ones. We can 
> still be really into the film, enthusiastically, but not living 
for it
> -- or craving release from it. Just keep drinking the nectar from 
the
> well and um, "take it as it comes" (or as it flies off the fan). 
Trite
> words, but a refreshing lovely thing when lived. 
> 
> 2) Deeply living above. Every saint, living deep values of THAT 
inside
> and outside, all have very diverse karma's they are living out -- 
and
> some taken on from students. Judging a saints life from outer
> circumstances, personality, habits etc is totally missing what they
> are. Its as "off" as judging ones life as "good" if good times are
> rolling and bad when they are not. 
> 
> 3) Some saints feel no shame in telling tale tales -- and some
> stranger than life true ones -- if it sucks some into living the
> above. Effective communicators paint effective picturs that 
motivate
> action towards something. If its a good thing the listener gets to
> from the process, all can laugh later at the tall tales. Was
> Yogananda's vision of Krishna an embellished tale or a reality? 
Dunno,
> but it got my attention. It may have not been Krishna, but it was, 
i am
> sure, something in that direction.
> 
> On the other hand, if the tall tales are used to manipulate, 
control
> distort, impress and extort, its a bad thing. How to distiguish? 
Not
> sure. Be skeptical I guess. And be open to being entertained and
> insprired within that skepticism. Charlie Lutes told lots of "tall
> tales", in my book, and in doing so inspired many on a path that
> helped them. TMO has told some tall tales that for some
> have run them down hill.
> 
> 4) Why should FF crime, hog farm etc be more diminished by 
proximity
> to MD, Domes etc more than in San Francisco or Moscow? We seem to
> automatically assume a distance effect from groupd YF, Saints, 
Darshan
> etc. Yet if those things operate at finest level, or beyond, then
> effect should / could be evenly distributed across great distance. 
> Darshan of saints is very special. Proximity. But you can have 
darshan
> of any saint at any time by closing eyes and just be with that 
saint.
> Effects can be powerful. Relates to point 2. What is the Saint? 
Their
> outer lives, and proximity/locality, or a universal, fairly
> unlocalized expression of THAT?  
> 
> 5) Satisfaction primarily from THAT and not from the other. Odd
> sounding structure to some I am sure. But eliminates co-dependence 
and
> all. Using the pain of separation and longing to be with lover as
> intense back drop to find satisfaction in THAT as anchor. My 
relations
> of the past have most always been the reverse -- due to my
> shortcomings and not being above to hold onto THAT when
> those huge WAVEs come.  
> 
> Comments and other angles or views most welcome.
>

[FairfieldLife] Posting quotas

[Rick Archer]

I've been pretty caught up in my work. Everybody is pretty much within the
5-post limit, except for bad boy Kirk, but I guess we're cutting him some
slack because he won't be able to post on days when he's working. Besides, I
never have been able to control the guy, and who would want to? Anyway,
thanks to all for keeping things pretty civil. If there's something you need
to bring to my attention, put my name in the subject line, or I might miss
it. 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Milarepa, the movie

[TurquoiseB]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> http://milarepamovie.com/
> 
> By the same team as "The Cup"

It looks wonderful, although the "from the same team"
thing is a little misleading. It's like the tagline
for "The 300" that says, "from the creator of Sin City,"
implying the same director when it isn't.

But that's just an industry pet peeve of mine -- I look 
forward to seeing this film. Thanks for mentioning it.

[FairfieldLife] Guru Dev in a closet?

[cardemaister]

According to my TM teacher's story over 25 years ago,
as I recall the end of it, Guru Dev once pointed to
a closet in a corner, and told his disciples to say
"Jai Guru Dev", and take him out of that closet, if
they needed him, when he was on a trip.
I wonder if anybody else has heard anything even
remotely similar.

My teacher is  Piscean, ruled by Neptune. I wonder if he made that
story up. OTOH, I might of course have misunderstood what
he told us...