[FairfieldLife] Re: Rescue Proposal for Saving Fairfield-Life
Great idea. Except, in point #2 below, let's pick several different people, with completely different points of view and things in life that they consider "interesting," and allow them *each* to select a list of the five posts of the day they consider most interesting. Then they'd each post them to a centralized list, and what we'd have...uh...Fairfield Life as it is today. :-) Saints preserve us from would-be "editors" who want forums that they had no hand in creating, caring for, and nurturing to conform to *their* ideas of what is interesting and proper. Start your own list, edit away, post on it what you think are "the best of Fairfield Life," and see who bothers to read it. Somehow I suspect it'll have a membership -- and readership -- of one. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Hagen J. Holtz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Since many years I am a fan of this list, but I do not find time to read the 50 - 100 daily messages. So I check the list on random basis with the uncomfortable back-ground feeling to sometimes miss essential developments. So I got a "bath-tube session" idea to restructure the list without depriving it from it's self-reinforcing tendency. My proposal: > > 1. Someone, who is versified, prepares a link for all members of the list, in order to put in their real names combined with their FairfieldLife-identity and a short description of who they are. > > 2. Each of these self-revealing members gets the honestly task to moderate the commentaries of the list for let's say one week in a year in sequential rotation, passing the task to the next member, in order to compress them down to the 10 most interesting contributions of the day. > > 3. In order to be technically affordable, the candidates, who want to be part of this "race" send their commentaries as usual to the well-known list address plus to this special link. By this act the variety and freedom of commenting contributions does not get diminished and noone can argue against it by suspecting a new censorship. On the other hand this artifice would help all earnest members, who have little time and were predominantly interested in grasping the essentials, to regularly be part of the list and keeping the thread. > > For some stupid reason, being greeted with smiles by ma family, I kept the last 100,000 Fairfield-mails like a nostalgic collector without even reading them. This gives me at least the neurotic certainty to possess them in order "to be" with you :-). > > If someone would assist me I could take initiative to prepare such a link, which we may call in future "Fairfield.Essential" or so. > > And there is another advantage regarding this idea. By this act we can elegantly get sorted out the wheat from the chaff without offending anybody's freedom to say what he wants at any moment he wants. And it is also positive that the main list even with all its scrap continues, because you save the chance to see and judge eventually different from the contemporarily leading moderator and do not feel restricted in whatever manner. > > I have understanding that for some of you it may sound more complicated but I am inclined to see it more in terms of quality gain by increasing complexity instead of deterrent aggregation of frustrating and demotivating opaques. > > Being with you and your special thoughts about it and agog of your commentaries about this idea. > > Hagen
[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > In a message dated 3/29/2007 3:28:43 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > > > > --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) > , Lsoma@ wrote: > > > > > > In a message dated 3/29/2007 2:11:45 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) writes: > > > > > > > > > > Questions & Answers > > > > Q. Is there any specific date for Maitreya's appearance? > > A. Most people imagine that world events (and the coming of a > World > > Teacher is certainly a world event) take place according to > precise > > dates. They imagine that all Hierarchical decisions are designed > for > > dates written in stone. This is assuredly not the case. The > Masters > > predict certain happenings to take place around a certain time but > > They know that humanity has freewill and therefore has an enormous > > influence on the precise timing of a given event. The Masters work > in > > 2,000 year cycles, so for Them really precise timing is not a > major > > consideration. No one knows the exact date on which Maitreya will > > take up His open work but everyone can understand that it is very, > > very soon. > > Since Maitreya will not at first reveal His name and status the > onus > > is on each one of us to recognize Him by what He says and does. In > > this way people will be recognizing the expression of their > > aspiration for the future of humanity, rather than simply > > following `The Teacher'. > > > > Q. Is it still expected there will be a worldwide stock-market > crash > > before Maitreya's public emergence? > > A. No, not necessarily, but the economic movement of the world is > > towards such a slump, which would probably increase once Maitreya > > starts His public work. > > > > Q. (1) Does the US administration truly believe that Iran is > trying > > to build a nuclear weapon or do they just want to remove the > Iranian > > president from power? > > (2) Does the hypocrisy of trying to pressure other nations into > not > > creating their own atomic weapons programme, while America has a > > large nuclear arsenal, not occur to those in power in the US > > government? > > A. (1) Yes, I believe they do. (2) Presumably not! > > > > Q. The US-backed Iraqi cabinet have approved a new oil law that is > > set to give foreign companies the long-term contracts and safe > legal > > framework they have been waiting for, but which has rattled labour > > unions and international campaigners, who say oil production > should > > remain in the hands of Iraqis. This means that Iraqi oil is up for > > grabs ââ¬" and Iraq is now forced to consider all tenders. > > (1) Was Iraq pressured into agreeing to this bill? (2) If there > was > > such pressure was it exerted by the USA to benefit its own oil > > companies? (3) Were other countries also involved? > > (1) Yes. (2) Yes. (3) No. > > > > Q. If a new Messiah comes does this mean that the end of the world > is > > near? > > A. Maitreya is here, as the World Teacher. Is this the end? On the > > contrary ââ¬" this is the beginning of a new time for humanity. But > a > > humanity chastened and relieved of its illusions and > destructiveness. > > For two thousand years, the Christian groups have taught this > account > > of the return of the Christ, coming on a cloud in the last days of > > the world, the `end days'. This, I submit, is a completely wrong > > interpretation of Christian scriptures which has distorted > > Christians' expectations of the Christ's return. The so-called > `end > > times' are to do not with the end of the world but with the end of > > the Age of Pisces, inaugurated by the Christ through Jesus 2,000 > > years ago. He promised to return, at "such a time as you think not" > ââ¬" > > to inaugurate the new age, that of Aquarius. This time He has come > > Himself to expand the teaching given through Jesus and to prepare > the > > world for the Aquarian experience. > > What we have to look forward to is not the end of the world, which > > will not take place for millions of years ahead, but for the > creation > > of a new civilisation based on higher and truer spiritual values > than > > were possible for humanity at the time of Jesus. Jesus Himself, > now a > > Master, works with the Christ on a daily basis and will reform the > > Christian churches and teaching, as His part in the Great Plan. > > > > Q. We are asked, quite rightly, to tell as many people as we can > > about the emergence of Maitreya. Do we refer to him as Maitreya, > or > > the `World Teacher' or do we announce him as the `Christ'? It > seems > > vital that those carrying out this task are `on the ball' as it > were, > > so that the knowledge given is accurately
RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of llundrub Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:39 AM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you would pool your money and buy a couple houses next door to each other in New Orleans and make meditation centers here. This city is at the start of a huge boom where for real it's all possibilities. If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another dunking.
[FairfieldLife] Your representative in China
Working in China I'm interested in being a representative for companies dealing with Chin on a regular basis. I am the director of a representative office (totally legit) in Shantou, China with the head office in Hong Kong. If your company works with China , it may (or may not) help to have a representative there - a sort of office - whereby factories can relate to if they need to deal with any issues. Obviously we could also offer a sort of liason between you and the factories or agents you are working with. Basically, we're there and you guys are here - its like being in two places - and that may ease things up a bit. So if that does help, we could work something out - I could be a representative travelling to various factories, or making calls, or even inspecting. I think we could work out a monthly fee based on the work required or a commision base. Whatever it is - you can expect honesty and loyalty. The company i own deals with Toys, so everything is set up and we could expand into other things with you. I have over 4 years experience in toys and other gift and electronic items , and even garments. If your company is interested, please do let me know. I am leaving on Sunday Morning, however. In anycase, we can stay in touch through email. All the best Peetu Melwani +641 233 8021 (till sunday) +86 13802333020 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: snip > The reason I post the link to ShareInternational is to inspire anyone > with interest to read and learn for themselves. I do not see that > that could cause a problem for anyone. I rather enjoy hearing about Creme. I find many of his comments to be pretty much on target. I will say Lsoma's comment about sucking on Creme's nipple to be apropos. BTW, Nablus, are you just too DAMN GOOD to snip your posts? lurk >
RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans
> If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another > dunking. Which would make the place only slightly more humid. --- Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On Behalf Of llundrub > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:39 AM > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans > > > > Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you > would pool your money and > buy a couple houses next door to each other in New > Orleans and make > meditation centers here. This city is at the start > of a huge boom where for > real it's all possibilities. > > If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another > dunking. > > It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/
RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans
Sure as shit, but my house will still stand yet again. From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rick Archer Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 7:02 AM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of llundrub Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:39 AM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you would pool your money and buy a couple houses next door to each other in New Orleans and make meditation centers here. This city is at the start of a huge boom where for real it's all possibilities. If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another dunking.
[FairfieldLife] I'm the spirit of Giving
I am sponsoring a monthly Mahamritunjaya in which I will include Maharishi Mahesh Yogi from now on- every month - for his continued health and longevity. May Maharishi be around yet a long time. Thank you Maharishi for all you have done.
RE: [FairfieldLife] I'm the spirit of Giving
I meant "in the spirit of giving" From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of llundrub Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 8:47 AM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] I'm the spirit of Giving I am sponsoring a monthly Mahamritunjaya in which I will include Maharishi Mahesh Yogi from now on- every month - for his continued health and longevity. May Maharishi be around yet a long time. Thank you Maharishi for all you have done.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Orleans
I haven't seen much crime but I live Uptown. It's certainly no more dangerous than any other big city and crime is more spread out. The way this city always was and will be is that from block to block neighborhoods form, either safe or sorry. You should be reading the papers here as development plans for the city are coming out. It's just so much potential! Money will be pouring into everything since the city is still threadbare. And I'm starting to have jinseks for the whole city. I am setting the peg and calling it. If there is a rapture like situation on Earth for humans then it will start right here where I am. Because the meek, and all that, and we are certainly meek here. For this reason I have chosen to pour my money into sponsoring jinseks for the residents of this city. If people live here they simply deserve a better quality of life since we here live at God and nature's whim. Right now. But in the future people will figure out ways of working with nature, like building huge turbines which turn hurricanes into an energy reserve. If George Bush and his enemies don't kill us all first. -Original Message- From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robert Gimbel Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:55 AM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Orleans --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you would pool your money and > buy a couple houses next door to each other in New Orleans and make > meditation centers here. This city is at the start of a huge boom where for > real it's all possibilities. > That sounds great, but the way thing sound on the media, well they make it sound like it's like a war zone there- what's true anyway?? Is it safe to walk the streets there, or what? r.g. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links
[FairfieldLife] Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government
From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM To: Rick Archer Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government Dear Rick. Yeasterday I received the result from the Court Case between the TMO and the State in Norway regarding that the TMO did want the Monopoly of the words Transcendental Meditation and TM. I was a wittness on behalf of the State in Norway and I am happy to tell you that the TMO lost regarding the Monopoly of the words Transcendental meditation and won the Trademark of the words TM. The Court says that Transcendental Meditation is a description of a state of consciousness and knowbody can own a description. They also lost because the TMO has not been consistent in using the words Transcendental meditation. They have used TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. Maharishis Techniques in books and advertisements. The Court says also that it is a need to be free regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do - in the papers it is referred to my domene www.transcendentalmeditation.no and that I teach in free time - because I have an other full time job too. The TMO would not tell how many initiations they had done last year - I was open about how many I have teached. The TMO made a point of the Agreement forms that the TM-Teachers has signed - so did I. The Court did not consider that. The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - and after he die, who will be the owner of the TMO and all his techniques. The TMO tried to stop me from being a wittness - they wrote a letter to the Court in forhand of the Court Case and almost demanded the Court not to allow me to be a wittness. Not a smart thing to do - I think. In the Court Case - it was really a difference between Ole Markman (The lawyer of the TMO - Danish TM-Teacher - with no Carisma - pale and grey - talking the language of the TMO - telling that I (Ingegerd) do not keep the knowledge pure - not easy to understand for common people) and the Lawyer of the Norwegian Government, a very smart man. Some other Norwegian teachers of Transcendental meditation is happy too - they are very successfull in their teaching. You are free to use this as you like - send it to FFL if you want. Ingegerd Espås
[FairfieldLife] Re: today on MOU
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shukra69" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > quite an interesting speech from Maharishi today about komalangam of > Raam, the number system, nouns and gyan shakti vs kriya shakti , the > verb , the word system, the upangas, the six systems, forward and > backward, the zero as mandal , circle motion-self referral,check it out Interesting lecture, however without foundation, most people won't understand it. Having a little foundation I would surmise he was talking about the 'macrocosmic' self referral nature of Brahm...or Brahma the personal God, the purusha. When we as jivas experience this self referral state we become the 1-0 purusha. That is, you 'come back' and experience the Self and hence you are not considered 0 but 1-0, sort of a dichotomy of the manifest and unmanifest
[FairfieldLife] Because of TM
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > It's not that hard to track the market on most all of the news web > sites. It's been going through some problems lately so the assertion > that it is doing well is rather bunk, much like saying the sky is >blue > when in reality it is cloudy. > yes, in FF, someone here (a TM'er) was telling that one friend of theirs who goes to the domes was exclaiming how well investments are going `because of the pundits', while another friend who also is an active dome participant next was recounting how poorly investments were going since the arrival of the pundits. -Doug in FF > Personally I think the real intention of the ME is to take people who > would have otherwise become activists for change and accomplished some, > diverted and sitting on their butts meditating instead. >
[FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government
You mean, Transcendental Meditation is not unique, to TM? Oh no, there goes our true-believer TM paradigm. But, damn that scorpion Norwegian court. Besides, they are just a bunch of Norwegians, what do they really know about spiritual things? Natural law is our truth. -Governor for the A of E Hamilton in FF --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM > To: Rick Archer > Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government > > > > > > Dear Rick. > > Yeasterday I received the result from the Court Case between the TMO and the > State in Norway regarding that the TMO did want the Monopoly of the words > Transcendental Meditation and TM. > > > > I was a wittness on behalf of the State in Norway and I am happy to tell you > that the TMO lost regarding the Monopoly of the words Transcendental > meditation and won the Trademark of the words TM. > > > > The Court says that Transcendental Meditation is a description of a state of > consciousness and knowbody can own a description. They also lost because the > TMO has not been consistent in using the words Transcendental meditation. > They have used TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. Maharishis > Techniques in books and advertisements. The Court says also that it is a > need to be free regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do - in the > papers it is referred to my domene www.transcendentalmeditation.no and that > I teach in free time - because I have an other full time job too. The TMO > would not tell how many initiations they had done last year - I was open > about how many I have teached. The TMO made a point of the Agreement forms > that the TM-Teachers has signed - so did I. The Court did not consider that. > The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - and after he die, who > will be the owner of the TMO and all his techniques. > > > > The TMO tried to stop me from being a wittness - they wrote a letter to the > Court in forhand of the Court Case and almost demanded the Court not to > allow me to be a wittness. Not a smart thing to do - I think. > > > > In the Court Case - it was really a difference between Ole Markman (The > lawyer of the TMO - Danish TM-Teacher - with no Carisma - pale and grey - > talking the language of the TMO - telling that I (Ingegerd) do not keep the > knowledge pure - not easy to understand for common people) and the Lawyer of > the Norwegian Government, a very smart man. > > > > Some other Norwegian teachers of Transcendental meditation is happy too - > they are very successfull in their teaching. > > > > You are free to use this as you like - send it to FFL if you want. > > > > Ingegerd Espås >
Re: [FairfieldLife] Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government
In a message dated 3/30/2007 10:49:12 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:iespas@ Ingegerd Espå Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM To: Rick Archer Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government Dear Rick. Yeasterday I received the result from the Court Case between the TMO and the State in Norway regarding that the TMO did want the Monopoly of the words Transcendental Meditation and TM. I was a wittness on behalf of the State in Norway and I am happy to tell you that the TMO lost regarding the Monopoly of the words Transcendental meditation and won the Trademark of the words TM. The Court says that Transcendental Meditation is a description of a state of consciousness and knowbody can own a description. They also lost because the TMO has not been consistent in using the words Transcendental meditation. They have used TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. Maharishis Techniques in books and advertisements. The Court says also that it is a need to be free regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do - in the papers it is referred to my domene _www.transcendentalmwww.transcww_ (http://www.transcendentalmeditation.no/) and that I teach in free time - because I have an other full time job too. The TMO would not tell how many initiations they had done last year - I was open about how many I have teached. The TMO made a point of the Agreement forms that the TM-Teachers has signed - so did I. The Court did not consider that. The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - and after he die, who will be the owner of the TMO and all his techniques. The TMO tried to stop me from being a wittness - they wrote a letter to the Court in forhand of the Court Case and almost demanded the Court not to allow me to be a wittness. Not a smart thing to do - I think. In the Court Case - it was really a difference between Ole Markman (The lawyer of the TMO - Danish TM-Teacher - with no Carisma - pale and grey - talking the language of the TMO - telling that I (Ingegerd) do not keep the knowledge pure - not easy to understand for common people) and the Lawyer of the Norwegian Government, a very smart man. Some other Norwegian teachers of Transcendental meditation is happy too - they are very successfull in their teaching. You are free to use this as you like - send it to FFL if you want. Ingegerd Espås >Very interesting. Ingegerd Espas has spiritual courage. The judge has a very honest question to the TMO " The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - and after he die, who will be the owner of the TMO and all his techniques. Maybe the passing over of MMY will make legal issues between the TMO and other affiliates a very interesting time. The purity could slip right through their hands. God knows the purity of the teaching could use other places that it feels more comfortable growing in. Lsoma. ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
[FairfieldLife] Re: New Orleans
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Sure as shit, but my house will still stand yet again. > I wasn't aware that you actually own it. anyway I do remember the lovely colorful rooms and pictures of deities on the walls or was it the ceiling.. via the photos you posted here the other day. You must be missing that.. I hope New Orleans will recover to it's full potential. gl > > From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On Behalf Of Rick Archer > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 7:02 AM > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans > > > > From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On Behalf Of llundrub > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:39 AM > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans > > > > Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you would pool your money and > buy a couple houses next door to each other in New Orleans and make > meditation centers here. This city is at the start of a huge boom where for > real it's all possibilities. > > If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another dunking. >
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government
In a message dated 3/30/2007 11:18:04 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: You mean, Transcendental Meditation is not unique, to TM? Oh no, there goes our true-believer TM paradigm. But, damn that scorpion Norwegian court. Besides, they are just a bunch of Norwegians, what do they really know about spiritual things? Natural law is our truth. -Governor for the A of E Hamilton in FF >Please Hamilton. Natural law does not live in the TMO. I was told I could not participate in the America Invincibility course because I am a practicing astrologer and a certified Yoga teacher. They questinoned my love for MMY in the name of the purity of the teaching. Maybe if some of the teachers of TM would speak up about the conservative gueidlines for their fellow Sidha's they would consider relaxing them. Most of the governors are sneaking around the guidelines and lying to get into the dome or stay there. The lack of spiritual courage among Governors is not acting in accordance with natural law. If you want to be a true Governor you would have to be at least honest with what is going on around you. Lou Valentino. Volunteer of the Intergalactic Confederation from the fourth level of the sixth dimension. How's that for a label. And yes, i will support my fellow Sidha's, meditators and Governors who have been judged unfairly by the Department for the Development of Consciousness. As the world continues to blow itself up, this Department continues to make choices that are not in alignment with Guru Dev. They may be in alignment with MMY but it just goes to show that MMY may need some improvement in his own awareness as to what is going on in his own back yard. --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) , "Rick Archer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:iespas@ From > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM > To: Rick Archer > Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government > > > > > > Dear Rick. > > Yeasterday I received the result from the Court Case between the TMO and the > State in Norway regarding that the TMO did want the Monopoly of the words > Transcendental Meditation and TM. > > > > I was a wittness on behalf of the State in Norway and I am happy to tell you > that the TMO lost regarding the Monopoly of the words Transcendental > meditation and won the Trademark of the words TM. > > > > The Court says that Transcendental Meditation is a description of a state of > consciousness and knowbody can own a description. They also lost because the > TMO has not been consistent in using the words Transcendental meditation. > They have used TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. Maharishis > Techniques in books and advertisements. The Court says also that it is a > need to be free regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do - in the > papers it is referred to my domene www.transcendentalm papers it pa and that > I teach in free time - because I have an other full time job too. The TMO > would not tell how many initiations they had done last year - I was open > about how many I have teached. The TMO made a point of the Agreement forms > that the TM-Teachers has signed - so did I. The Court did not consider that. > The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - and after he die, who > will be the owner of the TMO and all his techniques. > > > > The TMO tried to stop me from being a wittness - they wrote a letter to the > Court in forhand of the Court Case and almost demanded the Court not to > allow me to be a wittness. Not a smart thing to do - I think. > > > > In the Court Case - it was really a difference between Ole Markman (The > lawyer of the TMO - Danish TM-Teacher - with no Carisma - pale and grey - > talking the language of the TMO - telling that I (Ingegerd) do not keep the > knowledge pure - not easy to understand for common people) and the Lawyer of > the Norwegian Government, a very smart man. > > > > Some other Norwegian teachers of Transcendental meditation is happy too - > they are very successfull in their teaching. > > > > You are free to use this as you like - send it to FFL if you want. > > > > Ingegerd Espås > ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme
In a message dated 3/30/2007 5:56:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) , [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > In a message dated 3/29/2007 3:28:43 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) writes: > > > > > --- In _FairfieldLife@ --- In _Fair (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com) ) > , Lsoma@ wrote: > > > > > > In a message dated 3/29/2007 2:11:45 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]@yahoogroupno_re_ (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) ) writes: > > > > > > > > > > Questions & Answers > > > > Q. Is there any specific date for Maitreya's appearance? > > A. Most people imagine that world events (and the coming of a > World > > Teacher is certainly a world event) take place according to > precise > > dates. They imagine that all Hierarchical decisions are designed > for > > dates written in stone. This is assuredly not the case. The > Masters > > predict certain happenings to take place around a certain time but > > They know that humanity has freewill and therefore has an enormous > > influence on the precise timing of a given event. The Masters work > in > > 2,000 year cycles, so for Them really precise timing is not a > major > > consideration. No one knows the exact date on which Maitreya will > > take up His open work but everyone can understand that it is very, > > very soon. > > Since Maitreya will not at first reveal His name and status the > onus > > is on each one of us to recognize Him by what He says and does. In > > this way people will be recognizing the expression of their > > aspiration for the future of humanity, rather than simply > > following `The Teacher'. > > > > Q. Is it still expected there will be a worldwide stock-market > crash > > before Maitreya's public emergence? > > A. No, not necessarily, but the economic movement of the world is > > towards such a slump, which would probably increase once Maitreya > > starts His public work. > > > > Q. (1) Does the US administration truly believe that Iran is > trying > > to build a nuclear weapon or do they just want to remove the > Iranian > > president from power? > > (2) Does the hypocrisy of trying to pressure other nations into > not > > creating their own atomic weapons programme, while America has a > > large nuclear arsenal, not occur to those in power in the US > > government? > > A. (1) Yes, I believe they do. (2) Presumably not! > > > > Q. The US-backed Iraqi cabinet have approved a new oil law that is > > set to give foreign companies the long-term contracts and safe > legal > > framework they have been waiting for, but which has rattled labour > > unions and international campaigners, who say oil production > should > > remain in the hands of Iraqis. This means that Iraqi oil is up for > > grabs â€" and Iraq is now forced to consider all tenders. > > (1) Was Iraq pressured into agreeing to this bill? (2) If there > was > > such pressure was it exerted by the USA to benefit its own oil > > companies? (3) Were other countries also involved? > > (1) Yes. (2) Yes. (3) No. > > > > Q. If a new Messiah comes does this mean that the end of the world > is > > near? > > A. Maitreya is here, as the World Teacher. Is this the end? On the > > contrary â€" this is the beginning of a new time for humanity. But > a > > humanity chastened and relieved of its illusions and > destructiveness. > > For two thousand years, the Christian groups have taught this > account > > of the return of the Christ, coming on a cloud in the last days of > > the world, the `end days'. This, I submit, is a completely wrong > > interpretation of Christian scriptures which has distorted > > Christians' expectations of the Christ's return. The so-called > `end > > times' are to do not with the end of the world but with the end of > > the Age of Pisces, inaugurated by the Christ through Jesus 2,000 > > years ago. He promised to return, at "such a time as you think not" > â€" > > to inaugurate the new age, that of Aquarius. This time He has come > > Himself to expand the teaching given through Jesus and to prepare > the > > world for the Aquarian experience. > > What we have to look forward to is not the end of the world, which > > will not take place for millions of years ahead, but for the > creation > > of a new civilisation based on higher and truer spiritual values > than > > were possible for humanity at the time of Jesus. Jesus Himself, > now a > > Master, works with the Christ on a daily basis and will reform the > > Christian churches and teaching, as His part in the Great Plan. > > > > Q. We are asked, quite rightly, to tell as many people as we can > > about the emergence of Maitreya
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: today on MOU
Good surmise finally, whatever it meant. -Original Message- From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of BillyG. Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 9:53 AM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: today on MOU --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shukra69" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > quite an interesting speech from Maharishi today about komalangam of > Raam, the number system, nouns and gyan shakti vs kriya shakti , the > verb , the word system, the upangas, the six systems, forward and > backward, the zero as mandal , circle motion-self referral,check it out Interesting lecture, however without foundation, most people won't understand it. Having a little foundation I would surmise he was talking about the 'macrocosmic' self referral nature of Brahm...or Brahma the personal God, the purusha. When we as jivas experience this self referral state we become the 1-0 purusha. That is, you 'come back' and experience the Self and hence you are not considered 0 but 1-0, sort of a dichotomy of the manifest and unmanifest To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Orleans
Why would I be missing that. It didn't go anywhere. I painted over the Trishakti stupidly, thinking I would paint the entire Kalachakra mandala someday, throughout the entire house. I had meant for that from the start. At any rate I'm happy Trishakti, Guru Datta, and Ganesha were behind it all. -Original Message- From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of larry.potter Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 10:30 AM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: New Orleans --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "llundrub" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Sure as shit, but my house will still stand yet again. > I wasn't aware that you actually own it. anyway I do remember the lovely colorful rooms and pictures of deities on the walls or was it the ceiling.. via the photos you posted here the other day. You must be missing that.. I hope New Orleans will recover to it's full potential. gl > > From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On Behalf Of Rick Archer > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 7:02 AM > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans > > > > From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On Behalf Of llundrub > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:39 AM > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [FairfieldLife] New Orleans > > > > Honestly People, if any of you had any sense you would pool your money and > buy a couple houses next door to each other in New Orleans and make > meditation centers here. This city is at the start of a huge boom where for > real it's all possibilities. > > If they don't fix the levies, you're due for another dunking. > To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: Tiring contributions: (Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers ...
In a message dated 3/30/2007 1:21:50 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: These kind of elaborations remind me to the predicitions of reincarnation of Jesus in order to save the world. They are hardly of any practical use and do contain too many aspects, which cannot be proven and do only create a spirit of dependence and powerlessness regarding one's own way of unfoldment. So I basically agree to the commentator at the end of this endless monolog. It seems as if there are also people in this list in order to fill it with all kinds of misleading and tedious indoctrinations. This makes it difficult to distinguish upright essential and worth-while discussion points against prosy watering downs. Work of undercover agents in order to thin out the interest of readers ? - One of the charming ways to jam spiritual enhancement. We have to be alert ! Hagen I agree with you Hagelin. Thanks for the support. Lsoma. > Questions & Answers > > Q. Is there any specific date for Maitreya's appearance? > A. Most people imagine that world events (and the coming of a World > Teacher is certainly a world event) take place according to precise > dates. They imagine that all Hierarchical decisions are designed for > offensive to say that some > of the miracles are very amusing, like gems popping out from under > someone's big toe. > A. I quite agree. When people come to know the Masters more closely > they will recognize that They are filled with the joy of life and > have an extraordinary and quick sense of humour. The inventiveness of > their imagination is one of the outstanding qualities of their > activity. and so on and on > Lsoma; with all due respect; do you really want us to belive that you are communicating with archangels ? What if you are being manipulated by your own grandiose ego ? > For the record. Human beings don't need to wait for anyone form up above to save them or teach us how to love one another. You tell me I'm the one who is egotistical. Maybe if you stop sucking on the nipple of Benjamin Creame you could find out who you really are stop attacking those who disagree with your chosen masters of pure love. You love to use the FFL forum to promote your masters and then lead people to Benjamin Creams website to recruit them. FFL should be a forum for discussion on relevant topics of spirituality. Try to think outside of the Maitreya box that he is trying to build around you. If you continue to judge me you might want to ask Benjamin Creame about me. Tell him I am a volunteer from the fourth level of the sixth dimension. Maybe he can open your mind up a bit. If not, I don't care about other peoples judgments regarding my spiritual journey. To be frank, I'm so tired of so many people following so many teachers and claiming to have the Avatar of the century. My message is clear as a teacher: Stop looking for someone else to do it for you. You have and always will have the power to change any situation that is manifesting in the world or in your personal life. Anyone or any organization claiming to have the power to change you without having any faith that you can stand on your own feet is taking your self-empowerment away from you. There is too much attention these days on who's Guru is going to save them and the world. I think I've make my point. And this information is from me directly not an angel or guide or whatever. And, I never said that I communicate with seven dimensional masters or archangels as you call them. Some of the information I get is from other individuals who do soul transfrerence readings. They are recommended to me highly by close friends. Try to respond to some ot the information that I post instead of the need to point the finger at me so quickly that your mind remains closed to anyone elses story. Lsoma. . ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme
In a message dated 3/30/2007 12:02:28 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Tell him I am a volunteer from the fourth level of the sixth dimension. ---We all have our weird shit. I was Aliester Crowley in my last life. You sound like Aliester Crowley. Lsoma. __You sound like__ _Messages in this topic _ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/136377;_ylc=X3oDMTM4NnU3Zm5uBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMx NzA1MDc3MDc2BG1zZ0lkAzEzNjU3NARzZWMDZnRyBHNsawN2dHBjBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyMjczMzQEdH BjSWQDMTM2Mzc3) (0) _Reply (via web post) _ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJycjFvOXVnBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc 3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BG1zZ0lkAzEzNjU3NARzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzExNzUyMjc zMzQ-?act=reply&messageNum=136574) | _Start a new topic _ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJlcDVyM3ZpBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAz M5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA250cGMEc3RpbWUDMTE3NTIyNzMz NA--) _Messages_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/messages;_ylc=X3oDMTJlbXRhbGg1BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwNmdH IEc2xrA21zZ3MEc3RpbWUDMTE3NTIyNzMzNA--) | _Files_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/files;_ylc=X3oDMTJmZnBtNHMxBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAx OTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2ZpbGVzBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyMjczMzQ-) | _Photos_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/photos;_ylc=X3oDMTJlb28wc2t2BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwNmdH IEc2xrA3Bob3QEc3RpbWUDMTE3NTIyNzMzNA--) | _Links_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/links;_ylc=X3oDMTJmYzBsZDJxBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAx OTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2xpbmtzBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyMjczMzQ-) | _Database_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/database;_ylc=X3oDMTJjZTEzaHN0BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYw NmdHIEc2xrA2RiBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyMjczMzQ-) | _Polls_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/polls;_ylc=X3oDMTJmZGduZGwwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAx OTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3BvbGxzBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyMjczMzQ-) | _Calendar_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/calendar;_ylc=X3oDMTJkbjg4bjFsBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYw NmdHIEc2xrA2NhbARzdGltZQMxMTc1MjI3MzM0) To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: _http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/) and click 'Join This Group!' (http://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTJkOTg0ZTRzBF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxMTc1MjI3MzM1) _Change settings via the Web_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join;_ylc=X3oDMTJmOGJwdWU5BF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MD c3MDc2BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA3N0bmdzBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyMjczMzU-) (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: _Switch delivery to Daily Digest_ (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Delivery: Digest) | _Switch format to Traditional_ (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Delivery Format: Traditional) _Visit Your Group _ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife;_ylc=X3oDMTJkOWRtNGZpBF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwB GdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2hwZgRzdGltZQMxMTc1MjI3MzM1) | _Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use _ (http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/) | _Unsubscribe _ (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) Recent Activity *6 _New Members_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/members;_ylc=X3oDMTJmYXNhYWNxBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwN 2dGwEc2xrA3ZtYnJzBHN0aW1lAzExNzUyMjczMzQ-) *22 _New Photos_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/spnew;_ylc=X3oDMTJmNGJzZDlxBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwN2dG wEc2xrA3ZwaG90BHN0aW1lAzExNzUyMjczMzQ-) _Visit Your Group _ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife;_ylc=X3oDMTJlaTJxazQ4BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzM5MjAxOTYEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDc3MDc2BHNlYwN2d GwEc2xrA3ZnaHAEc3RpbWUDMTE3NTIyNzMzNA--) Y! GeoCities _Be Interactive_ (http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12inldkqh/M=493064.9803219.10510212.8674578/D=groups/S=1705077076:NC/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1175234535/A=3848541/R=0/SIG =12ban20bv/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=42416/*http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/y3 60/?v=f) Create a conver- sation with blogs. Need traffic? _Drive customers_ (http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=12i9khtde/M=493064.9803227.10510220.8674578/D=groups/S=1705077076:NC/Y=YAHOO/EXP=1175234535/A=3848644/R=0/SI G=131l83flq/*http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/srchv2.php?o=US2006&cmp=Yaho o&ctv=Groups5&s=Y&s2=&s3=&b=50) With search ads on Yahoo! Yahoo! Groups _Start a group_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/start;_ylc=X3oDMTJvcG11ZzgyBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BF9wAzMEZ3JwSWQDMzkyMDE5NgRncnBzcElkAzE3MDUwNzcwNzYEc2VjA25jbW9kBHNsawN ncm91cHMyBHN0aW1lAzExNzUy
[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "lurkernomore20002000" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 > wrote: > > snip > > > The reason I post the link to ShareInternational is to inspire anyone > > with interest to read and learn for themselves. I do not see that > > that could cause a problem for anyone. > > I rather enjoy hearing about Creme. I find many of his comments to be > pretty much on target. I will say Lsoma's comment about sucking on > Creme's nipple to be apropos. BTW, Nablus, are you just too DAMN GOOD > to snip your posts? > > lurk > > Agreed, Benjamin Creme is often very spot on even though some of what he says may lay ahead and is difficult to verify, as one poster pointed out earlier. (Maitreyas open work in the world. That is unless you have met Him ofcourse; thousands of people have, I have not.) This Lsoma fellow have made these claims before simply because he has not bothered to check the real story. I doubt that he ever read ShareInternational, because if he did he would see, among other things, that Benjamin Creme is very altruistic indeed and does never, ever denounce anyone. I am sure he would greet Lsoma with great respect, just as he does to everyone else, "high" or "low". He can be rather frank about some issues like capitalism and American foreign politics, but he seems balanced and very, very well informed. He is in constant telephatic contact with his Master from whom he receives the detailed information. Sometimes I wish I had more of that respectful quality myself :-) Benjamin Creme is not my Guru and I have met him only once. I have said this before, but for some it seems difficult to grasp that some information is just pure gold and highly interesting, and I appreciate that you appreciate it lurk. Particulary for TM'ers that should have developed a rather strong intuition, because I have never heard Mr. Creme state something that Maharishi has not in one way or the other already said. Creme's information is just more detailed. I'm not too familiar with some of the jargon here; what is "snipping a post" ?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "dhamiltony2k5" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > You mean, Transcendental Meditation is not unique, to TM? Oh no, > there goes our true-believer TM paradigm. But, damn that scorpion > Norwegian court. Besides, they are just a bunch of Norwegians, what > do they really know about spiritual things? Natural law is our truth. > > -Governor for the A of E Hamilton in FF The Government of Norway, how can they be involved in this case ? I don't get it. Anyway, if "they" do not see that it was Maharishi that invented and spent 30 years to let the world know about TM, and that it is unique I think they have a problem. Transcendental Meditation is not a state of consciousness, it is a mental technique. That the judges, the fools in court, was not able to understand this is not very surprising. Maharishi once commented that "Norway is a long and narrow country, inhabited by narrowminded people." They are a greedy bunch of consumers; not very spiritual at all. And the socalled "independent teachers", why are they ? I think it boils down to the same thing; greed - they want to collect the money for themselves. They got everything they know about meditation from Maharishi, now they want to cash in. I know it is not that simple, but I still feel that it's discusting.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > In a message dated 3/30/2007 10:49:12 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > > > > > > > From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:iespas@ Ingegerd Espå > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM > To: Rick Archer > Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government > > > > > > Dear Rick. > > Yeasterday I received the result from the Court Case between the TMO and the > State in Norway regarding that the TMO did want the Monopoly of the words > Transcendental Meditation and TM. > > > > I was a wittness on behalf of the State in Norway and I am happy to tell you > that the TMO lost regarding the Monopoly of the words Transcendental > meditation and won the Trademark of the words TM. > > > > The Court says that Transcendental Meditation is a description of a state of > consciousness and knowbody can own a description. They also lost because the > TMO has not been consistent in using the words Transcendental meditation. > They have used TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. Maharishis > Techniques in books and advertisements. The Court says also that it is a need to be > free regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do - in the papers it is > referred to my domene _www.transcendentalmwww.transcww_ > (http://www.transcendentalmeditation.no/) More accurately: http://www.transcendentalmeditasjon.no/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Rescue Proposal for Saving Fairfield-Life
What a joke. Why do you think that a complicated method is going make anything better? I bet you believe that the world should have one global government with lots of fucking rules too! Such an *unenlightened* idea. Hagen J. Holtz wrote: > Since many years I am a fan of this list, but I do not find time to read the > 50 - 100 daily messages. So I check the list on random basis with the > uncomfortable back-ground feeling to sometimes miss essential developments. > So I got a "bath-tube session" idea to restructure the list without depriving > it from it's self-reinforcing tendency. My proposal: > > 1. Someone, who is versified, prepares a link for all members of the list, in > order to put in their real names combined with their FairfieldLife-identity > and a short description of who they are. > > 2. Each of these self-revealing members gets the honestly task to moderate > the commentaries of the list for let's say one week in a year in sequential > rotation, passing the task to the next member, in order to compress them down > to the 10 most interesting contributions of the day. > > 3. In order to be technically affordable, the candidates, who want to be part > of this "race" send their commentaries as usual to the well-known list > address plus to this special link. By this act the variety and freedom of > commenting contributions does not get diminished and noone can argue against > it by suspecting a new censorship. On the other hand this artifice would help > all earnest members, who have little time and were predominantly interested > in grasping the essentials, to regularly be part of the list and keeping the > thread. > > For some stupid reason, being greeted with smiles by ma family, I kept the > last 100,000 Fairfield-mails like a nostalgic collector without even reading > them. This gives me at least the neurotic certainty to possess them in order > "to be" with you :-). > > If someone would assist me I could take initiative to prepare such a link, > which we may call in future "Fairfield.Essential" or so. > > And there is another advantage regarding this idea. By this act we can > elegantly get sorted out the wheat from the chaff without offending anybody's > freedom to say what he wants at any moment he wants. And it is also positive > that the main list even with all its scrap continues, because you save the > chance to see and judge eventually different from the contemporarily leading > moderator and do not feel restricted in whatever manner. > > I have understanding that for some of you it may sound more complicated but I > am inclined to see it more in terms of quality gain by increasing complexity > instead of deterrent aggregation of frustrating and demotivating opaques. > > Being with you and your special thoughts about it and agog of your > commentaries about this idea. > > Hagen >
[FairfieldLife] Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
Just in case you are not already sick of this topic... I think I understand your point of view. Sounds reasonable. I also understand that you don't find my take on it reasonable. Fair enough. It was my reaction to the wording of MMY's announcement about Guru Dev that changed my view of him from "stodgy old time religion guy" to more of a self promoter using miracles as a hook. But our discussion has definitely bought out a need to find out what specific miracles MMY claimed for GD. In any case I have addressed some points you felt I had missed. FWIW. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > As an aside, the tradition of the day was to > deliver a kid to an adult teacher to take care of > him. Letting him walk off was just as much an > aberration of parental responsibility as it is today. Judy If there was anything they could have done about it, that is. If they'd handed him over to a teacher, and the kid didn't find him congenial, he'd most likely have walked away from the teacher. ME Buz ! Sorry, the correct parenting answer was to take care of your underage child. No one gets off the hook by claiming that kids can walk away. Good parents don't let them, no exceptions. Rich ones get even less slack. They could have hired a shadow person to follow GD around everywhere for about 2 cents a day. [I wrote:] > MMY, as I said, didn't imply any particular miracle > in that particular piece. In the other piece you > just quoted, he made a general pro forma reference, > pretty much de rigeur for a realized Indian master. > > When you hear someone introduce a candidate for > office as "The next president of the United States," > and the candidate then loses the election, do you > then say to yourself, "That scoundrel who introduced > the candidate before the election was lying"? > > I'm not sure where you got the idea about how > realized people get introduced, ever been to India? Judy; No, but I've read plenty of testimonials about purportedly realized teachers. ME; I am not challenging your familiarity with spiritual people, just how they get introduced. You are claiming that it was common to mention a teacher's siddhis in his intro. I maintain that only crass teachers would use it. It is hokey spirituality. Ever seen another supposedly realized > guy get introduced? This is a made up perspective. > It is just as likely that mentioning Sidhis is just > as tacky for religious people in India as here. > Remember he was representing a high formal office. Judy: I should think that would make claims for siddhis-- especially such siddhis as omniscience--even more appropriate. > My Indian friends here view sidhis claims as > ludicrously as we view the healing claims of > televangelists. ME: I wouldn't doubt it, but isn't that a bit of a self-selected sample? How likely is it that Indians who took such claims for granted would be those you would make friends with in the first place? Judy: They are self-selected because the most pious Indians won't leave the country. My point was that their culture makes the same distinctions we do concerning televangelists and serious spiritual people. Claiming miracles is an indication of slippery intent in both cultures. I have plenty of religious and spiritually minded friends who still view making claims of miracles as a televangelist trick to bamboozle naive people. I don't sort friends by beliefs but by behavior. Also, this promotion of Guru Dev took place decades earlier than your sojourns in India, not that long after India won its independence from the British. It's not impossible that modern skepticism about such things was a lot less common back then. ME: Very possible. > The closer example would be Benny Hin's claims of > curing cancer being met with the appropriate skepticism. > Claiming unproven miracles to market spirituality is > crass and deserves to be ridiculed. That may be, but the issue here is whether MMY actually made such claims, as opposed to a pro forma statement, as I said, about unspecified abilities. > Your example about the candidate has nothing to do with > this. MMY is not claiming what he will become in the > future, he is claiming it is true now. Judy: It isn't a perfect analogy, but it makes the point. It's the same type of pro forma claim. It's expected, a formula. If the candidate weren't introduced that way, you'd wonder why not. ME: I don't think you know if this is a pro forma claim in Indian culture at any time. It puts him in the Sai Baba camp of people using miracle claims to enhance their image. We are left with our differing opinions without all the facts. You see his making miracle claims as not big deal. I view it as a character issue. Claiming that a > person is God's gift to India is exaggeration for effect. > Claiming miracles to influence superstitions people > is MMY being P.T. Barnum. Judy: But *he didn't claim any miracles*, Curtis. He made
[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme
Hey, wait a minute Lsoma; why so uptight ? Why do you want me to recognize Lord Ashtar, someone I have heard nothing about 0, ? He is probably a great soul ! I see that I hurt your feelings when I pointed out that hardly any of your predictions for 2006 went through. I am sorry about that, should never have made that comment though I was correct and you were wrong. I think your predictions for 2007 looks much better. We all have our ups and downs. Regarding your "hate" towards Maitreya I have no comments. Events will unfold itself in perfect harmony. Some will think of Him as the great Satan, particularily amongst the fundamentalistic population in every religion. Now just one last comment before I refuse to answer any of your outbursts until you actually read what Benjamin Creme writes, what you obviously have not done; Jesus of Nasareth is not the Christ. The Christ, Iman Madhi, Krisha, Maitreya Buddha, The Messiah and many of the Awaited is now in incarnation having created a Mahavirupta body in the Himalayas and transported Himself to London in 1977. His name is Maitreya. 13 of the 33 Masters have also taken birth at this time. Brahmananda Saraswathi is currently not in incarnation. Jesus of Nasareth is one of Them and is currently and for the last 600 years residing in Italy. His particular interest, among many other things, has been the Church i Latin America. For TM'ers this is hardly a surprise. "Heaven will walk on earth - in this generation." -Maharishi Don't be critical. Why not practise that which you have said in former posts; we should all rather be working together ! With the deepest respect for you and your work Lsoma ! Nablusoss http://www.shareintl.org Q. Why, if Maitreya appears before 600 or even more people at a meeting of a religious group in Britain ¯ as in Edinburgh and York ¯ do we see nothing about it in the media? BC: The people before whom he appears are in every case fundamentalist Christians of one persuasion or another; denominationally they vary tremendously, but the consistent factor is that they are all extremely dogmatic in their beliefs. Maitreya appears to them to `soften them up.' These are the groups from whom, throughout the world, he expects the major opposition and rejection. If he appears as the World Teacher and they are expecting the Teacher in their own terms ¯ as the Christ, Maitreya Buddha, Krishna, the Imam Mahdi, the Messiah ¯ with their very fixed views they would be inclined to reject him. The most important thing is the creation of the healing waters, which is done first. When Maitreya has magnetized the waters, in due course ¯ it might take a few weeks ¯ he finds a group of fundamentalists in a town nearby and appears before them. He speaks to them in their own language and many healings take place during the process. He does not say: "I am Maitreya"; "I am the Christ"; or "I am the Imam Mahdi," he just appears, out of the blue but in a form which they will recognize ¯ as he did in Nairobi in Kenya, on 11 June 1988, an appearance of which we have photographs. Maitreya leaves it to the groups, in the thoughtform in which he has appeared to them, to recognize him or not. Some of them will say: "Beware, it could be the anti-christ: before the Christ comes, the anti-christ is coming." That is why they do not speak out, and if they do not speak the media does not speak. Occasionally at these meetings there have been representatives of religious newspapers who do not write about it. Why not? I think they do not know what to do with this information: it is too `hot.' Either they believe it is the Christ or they believe it is the anti- christ; or they are mystified because he has not said who he is. Perhaps 80 per cent of the people believe they had an experience of the Christ, or the Mahdi, or the Messiah ¯ whomever it happened to be ¯ and they are perfectly content to accept that and just wait for something more to happen in connection with it. That must do something to their awareness, even if they do not talk about it except among themselves. When eventually they see Maitreya on television they will say: "That's the one who appeared to us ¯ perhaps he is all right after all; perhaps he is not the anti-christ." The appearance in Nairobi was reported and photographed because the editor of the Swahili edition of the Kenya Times was present and wrote it up. It was picked up by various media and was a two-day wonder around the world. The media in general, as ordinary men and women, are deeply, profoundly sceptical, and professionally, not only sceptical, but cynical in the extreme. Q. How are we to know for certain that Lord Maitreya is not the false Christ? BC: There is not only one 'false Christ.' There are several well- known teachers who believe themselves, or are believed by their followers, to be the Christ, and from my personal experience alone I know of score
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government
The scorpion is the root of union. -Original Message- From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of dhamiltony2k5 Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 10:12 AM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government You mean, Transcendental Meditation is not unique, to TM? Oh no, there goes our true-believer TM paradigm. But, damn that scorpion Norwegian court. Besides, they are just a bunch of Norwegians, what do they really know about spiritual things? Natural law is our truth. -Governor for the A of E Hamilton in FF --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Rick Archer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > From: Ingegerd Espås [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 2:46 AM > To: Rick Archer > Subject: Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government > > > > > > Dear Rick. > > Yeasterday I received the result from the Court Case between the TMO and the > State in Norway regarding that the TMO did want the Monopoly of the words > Transcendental Meditation and TM. > > > > I was a wittness on behalf of the State in Norway and I am happy to tell you > that the TMO lost regarding the Monopoly of the words Transcendental > meditation and won the Trademark of the words TM. > > > > The Court says that Transcendental Meditation is a description of a state of > consciousness and knowbody can own a description. They also lost because the > TMO has not been consistent in using the words Transcendental meditation. > They have used TM-Technique - TM-program - Deep meditation. Maharishis > Techniques in books and advertisements. The Court says also that it is a > need to be free regarding to compete activities as i (Ingegerd) do - in the > papers it is referred to my domene www.transcendentalmeditation.no and that > I teach in free time - because I have an other full time job too. The TMO > would not tell how many initiations they had done last year - I was open > about how many I have teached. The TMO made a point of the Agreement forms > that the TM-Teachers has signed - so did I. The Court did not consider that. > The Court made a point that MMY is a very old man - and after he die, who > will be the owner of the TMO and all his techniques. > > > > The TMO tried to stop me from being a wittness - they wrote a letter to the > Court in forhand of the Court Case and almost demanded the Court not to > allow me to be a wittness. Not a smart thing to do - I think. > > > > In the Court Case - it was really a difference between Ole Markman (The > lawyer of the TMO - Danish TM-Teacher - with no Carisma - pale and grey - > talking the language of the TMO - telling that I (Ingegerd) do not keep the > knowledge pure - not easy to understand for common people) and the Lawyer of > the Norwegian Government, a very smart man. > > > > Some other Norwegian teachers of Transcendental meditation is happy too - > they are very successfull in their teaching. > > > > You are free to use this as you like - send it to FFL if you want. > > > > Ingegerd Espås > To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
This section was reversed by speaker name, sorry! It should read: Judy:I wouldn't doubt it, but isn't that a bit of a self-selected sample? How likely is it that Indians who took such claims for granted would be those you would make friends with in the first place? Me: They are self-selected because the most pious Indians won't leave the country. My point was that their culture makes the same distinctions we do concerning televangelists and serious spiritual people. Claiming miracles is an indication of slippery intent in both cultures. I have plenty of religious and spiritually minded friends who still view making claims of miracles as a televangelist trick to bamboozle naive people. I don't sort friends by beliefs but by behavior. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Just in case you are not already sick of this topic... > > I think I understand your point of view. Sounds reasonable. I also > understand that you don't find my take on it reasonable. Fair enough. > It was my reaction to the wording of MMY's announcement about Guru > Dev that changed my view of him from "stodgy old time religion guy" to > more of a self promoter using miracles as a hook. But our discussion > has definitely bought out a need to find out what specific miracles > MMY claimed for GD. In any case I have addressed some points you felt > I had missed. FWIW. > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" > wrote: > > > As an aside, the tradition of the day was to > > deliver a kid to an adult teacher to take care of > > him. Letting him walk off was just as much an > > aberration of parental responsibility as it is today. > > Judy If there was anything they could have done > about it, that is. If they'd handed him over > to a teacher, and the kid didn't find him > congenial, he'd most likely have walked away > from the teacher. > > ME Buz ! Sorry, the correct parenting answer was to take care of > your underage child. No one gets off the hook by claiming that kids > can walk away. Good parents don't let them, no exceptions. Rich ones > get even less slack. They could have hired a shadow person to follow > GD around everywhere for about 2 cents a day. > > > [I wrote:] > > MMY, as I said, didn't imply any particular miracle > > in that particular piece. In the other piece you > > just quoted, he made a general pro forma reference, > > pretty much de rigeur for a realized Indian master. > > > > When you hear someone introduce a candidate for > > office as "The next president of the United States," > > and the candidate then loses the election, do you > > then say to yourself, "That scoundrel who introduced > > the candidate before the election was lying"? > > > > I'm not sure where you got the idea about how > > realized people get introduced, ever been to India? > > Judy; No, but I've read plenty of testimonials > about purportedly realized teachers. > > ME; I am not challenging your familiarity with spiritual people, just > how they get introduced. You are claiming that it was common to > mention a teacher's siddhis in his intro. I maintain that only crass > teachers would use it. It is hokey spirituality. > > Ever seen another supposedly realized > > guy get introduced? This is a made up perspective. > > It is just as likely that mentioning Sidhis is just > > as tacky for religious people in India as here. > > Remember he was representing a high formal office. > > Judy: I should think that would make claims for siddhis-- > especially such siddhis as omniscience--even more > appropriate. > > > My Indian friends here view sidhis claims as > > ludicrously as we view the healing claims of > > televangelists. > > ME: I wouldn't doubt it, but isn't that a bit of a > self-selected sample? How likely is it that > Indians who took such claims for granted would > be those you would make friends with in the > first place? > > Judy: They are self-selected because the most pious Indians won't > leave the country. My point was that their culture makes the same > distinctions we do concerning televangelists and serious spiritual > people. Claiming miracles is an indication of slippery intent in both > cultures. I have plenty of religious and spiritually minded friends > who still view making claims of miracles as a televangelist trick to > bamboozle naive people. I don't sort friends by beliefs but by behavior. > > Also, this promotion of Guru Dev took place > decades earlier than your sojourns in India, > not that long after India won its independence > from the British. It's not impossible that > modern skepticism about such things was a lot > less common back then. > > ME: Very possible. > > > The closer example would be Benny Hin's claims of > > curing cancer being met with the appropriate skepticism. > > Claiming unproven miracles to market spirituality is > > crass and deserves to be ridiculed. > > That may be, but the issue h
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
Curtis, without snipping any of your post (below) or spending a whole lot more time or words on the subject, it seems pretty clear that Guru Dev, himself, believed in siddhis and miracles, as is obvious from Paul Mason's site with quotes from him exactly on that subject, as well as the bios of him which are allegedly based on stories he told himself. In "The Whole Thing, The Real Thing" he claims his guru, Swamiji Krishnanad, raised a boy from the dead and there's also the story of the Aghori Mahatma who put on the spectacular diorama of the divinities (as well as a deluge of blood and bones) for Guru Dev's benefit while Guru Dev was doing sadhana in some jungle somewhere. And the Indian teachers and gurus I've read (Yogananda immediately comes to mind), all presume the miraculous as being part and parcel of enlightened life. So it doesn't seem odd or particularly perfidious on Brahmachari Mahesh's part to make such claims about Guru Dev, whether or not Guru Dev himself claimed to possess them. Basically, the belief in siddhis are part of the Indian culture and as such, even a person of integrity and prudence, steeped in that culture, would accept as true the reality of miracles that have no empirical proof to substantiate them. It's just a way of looking at the world. ** --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Just in case you are not already sick of this topic... > > I think I understand your point of view. Sounds reasonable. I also > understand that you don't find my take on it reasonable. Fair enough. > It was my reaction to the wording of MMY's announcement about Guru > Dev that changed my view of him from "stodgy old time religion guy" to > more of a self promoter using miracles as a hook. But our discussion > has definitely bought out a need to find out what specific miracles > MMY claimed for GD. In any case I have addressed some points you felt > I had missed. FWIW. > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" > wrote: > > > As an aside, the tradition of the day was to > > deliver a kid to an adult teacher to take care of > > him. Letting him walk off was just as much an > > aberration of parental responsibility as it is today. > > Judy If there was anything they could have done > about it, that is. If they'd handed him over > to a teacher, and the kid didn't find him > congenial, he'd most likely have walked away > from the teacher. > > ME Buz ! Sorry, the correct parenting answer was to take care of > your underage child. No one gets off the hook by claiming that kids > can walk away. Good parents don't let them, no exceptions. Rich ones > get even less slack. They could have hired a shadow person to follow > GD around everywhere for about 2 cents a day. > > > [I wrote:] > > MMY, as I said, didn't imply any particular miracle > > in that particular piece. In the other piece you > > just quoted, he made a general pro forma reference, > > pretty much de rigeur for a realized Indian master. > > > > When you hear someone introduce a candidate for > > office as "The next president of the United States," > > and the candidate then loses the election, do you > > then say to yourself, "That scoundrel who introduced > > the candidate before the election was lying"? > > > > I'm not sure where you got the idea about how > > realized people get introduced, ever been to India? > > Judy; No, but I've read plenty of testimonials > about purportedly realized teachers. > > ME; I am not challenging your familiarity with spiritual people, just > how they get introduced. You are claiming that it was common to > mention a teacher's siddhis in his intro. I maintain that only crass > teachers would use it. It is hokey spirituality. > > Ever seen another supposedly realized > > guy get introduced? This is a made up perspective. > > It is just as likely that mentioning Sidhis is just > > as tacky for religious people in India as here. > > Remember he was representing a high formal office. > > Judy: I should think that would make claims for siddhis-- > especially such siddhis as omniscience--even more > appropriate. > > > My Indian friends here view sidhis claims as > > ludicrously as we view the healing claims of > > televangelists. > > ME: I wouldn't doubt it, but isn't that a bit of a > self-selected sample? How likely is it that > Indians who took such claims for granted would > be those you would make friends with in the > first place? > > Judy: They are self-selected because the most pious Indians won't > leave the country. My point was that their culture makes the same > distinctions we do concerning televangelists and serious spiritual > people. Claiming miracles is an indication of slippery intent in both > cultures. I have plenty of religious and spiritually minded friends > who still view making claims of miracles as a televangelist trick to > bamboozle naive people. I don
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme
In a message dated 3/30/2007 1:41:59 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hey, wait a minute Lsoma; why so uptight ? Why do you want me to recognize Lord Ashtar, someone I have heard nothing about 0, ? He is probably a great soul ! I see that I hurt your feelings when I pointed out that hardly any of your predictions for 2006 went through. I am sorry about that, should never have made that comment though I was correct and you were wrong. I think your predictions for 2007 looks much better. We all have our ups and downs. Regarding your "hate" towards Maitreya I have no comments. Events will unfold itself in perfect harmony. Some will think of Him as the great Satan, particularily amongst the fundamentalistic population in every religion. Now just one last comment before I refuse to answer any of your outbursts until you actually read what Benjamin Creme writes, what you obviously have not done; Jesus of Nasareth is not the Christ. The Christ, Iman Madhi, Krisha, Maitreya Buddha, The Messiah and many of the Awaited is now in incarnation having created a Mahavirupta body in the Himalayas and transported Himself to London in 1977. His name is Maitreya. 13 of the 33 Masters have also taken birth at this time. Brahmananda Saraswathi is currently not in incarnation. Jesus of Nasareth is one of Them and is currently and for the last 600 years residing in Italy. His particular interest, among many other things, has been the Church i Latin America. For TM'ers this is hardly a surprise. "Heaven will walk on earth - in this generation." -Maharishi Don't be critical. Why not practise that which you have said in former posts; we should all rather be working together ! With the deepest respect for you and your work Lsoma ! Nablusoss > Yes. I did mention how different groups should meditate together or at least at the same time of day in the past. However, you said it was dangerous for people to meditate together according to Lord Meitreya. I appriciate your recognition that my 2007 predictions are on target. I know you think i'm egotistical but I am a volunteer from the sixth dimension. Therefore, my commitment to the inner core group of vounteers is very strong since the time is near for a visit from other races. There are 50,000 different races. Spaceships will be landing not to save people but to educate the masses of how the Pleidians live. It is the Pleideans that are most protective of planet earth. Lord Ashstar is the leader of this massive evacuation if nessassary or to implement a new way of living or us. MMY will pass over in July or August which sets into motion a new energy matrix for the TMO. I look forward to the new and more enlightening society that will dawn from 2008 to 2012. Good luck with your journey and I'm sure that everyone will find their own way. Sincerely, Lou Valentino Q. Why, if Maitreya appears before 600 or even more people at a meeting of a religious group in Britain ¯ as in Edinburgh and York ¯ do we see nothing about it in the media? BC: The people before whom he appears are in every case fundamentalist Christians of one persuasion or another; denominationally they vary tremendously, but the consistent factor is that they are all extremely dogmatic in their beliefs. Maitreya appears to them to `soften them up.' These are the groups from whom, throughout the world, he expects the major opposition and rejection. If he appears as the World Teacher and they are expecting the Teacher in their own terms ¯ as the Christ, Maitreya Buddha, Krishna, the Imam Mahdi, the Messiah ¯ with their very fixed views they would be inclined to reject him. The most important thing is the creation of the healing waters, which is done first. When Maitreya has magnetized the waters, in due course ¯ it might take a few weeks ¯ he finds a group of fundamentalists in a town nearby and appears before them. He speaks to them in their own language and many healings take place during the process. He does not say: "I am Maitreya"; "I am the Christ"; or "I am the Imam Mahdi," he just appears, out of the blue but in a form which they will recognize ¯ as he did in Nairobi in Kenya, on 11 June 1988, an appearance of which we have photographs. Maitreya leaves it to the groups, in the thoughtform in which he has appeared to them, to recognize him or not. Some of them will say: "Beware, it could be the anti-christ: before the Christ comes, the anti-christ is coming." That is why they do not speak out, and if they do not speak the media does not speak. Occasionally at these meetings there have been representatives of religious newspapers who do not write about it. Why not? I think they do not know what to do with this information: it is too `hot.' Either they believe it is the Christ or they believe it is the anti- christ; or they are mystified because he
[FairfieldLife] Re: Court Case between TMO and the Norwegian Government
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The Government of Norway, how can they be involved in this case ? I > don't get it. Anyway, if "they" do not see that it was Maharishi that > invented and spent 30 years to let the world know about TM, and that it > is unique I think they have a problem. Transcendental Meditation is not > a state of consciousness, it is a mental technique. That the judges, > the fools in court, was not able to understand this is not very > surprising. Maharishi once commented that "Norway is a long and narrow > country, inhabited by narrowminded people." They are a greedy bunch of > consumers; not very spiritual at all. And the socalled "independent > teachers", why are they ? I think it boils down to the same thing; > greed - they want to collect the money for themselves. They got > everything they know about meditation from Maharishi, now they want to > cash in. I know it is not that simple, but I still feel that it's > discusting. Re: Maharishi once commented that "Norway is a long and narrow country, inhabited by narrowminded people." Does MMY ever have anything NICE to say about anybody (besides the TBs who he criticizes as well) or any country? He sure does a lot of criticizing and what does that accomplish? It makes him look very small. As to why teachers are independent -- are you really that clueless? Or do you have no memory of the recent past? TM teachers were told that if they did not get "re-certified" that they were no longer TM teachers in the eyes of the TMO. This is what (IMO) has alienated hundreds (thousands?) of loyal, dedicated TM teachers and is the primary reason that when the big call went out last summer for TMers to congregate in FF, most of the govs (and fed up sidhas) stayed home. MMY bit the hand that fed him on the re-certification decision, IMO.
[FairfieldLife] 18 video lectures/instructions by Goenka re his 10-day Vipassana course
Haven't checked out the whole series but this first video I found very interesting.. the first "breathing meditation" technique plus interesting observations abaout "subtler" awareness, general course instructions: http://uk.video.yahoo.com/video/play?vid=202317&fr=yfp-t-501 In fact this is the "first" but maybe less interesting video: http://uk.video.yahoo.com/video/play?ei=UTF-8&b=2&vid=202315&gid=164791 Whole series of lectures: http://uk.video.yahoo.com/video/group?gid=164791 Goenka is the guru who introduced Vipassana in Indian prisons: Doing Time, Doing Vipassana": http://homepage.mac.com/vajranatha/FileSharing2.html http://www.prison.dhamma.org/ UK centre: http://www.dipa.dhamma.org/ If I were not doing TM I would be intrigued enough to try the 10-day course myself!!
[FairfieldLife] Romance on the Spiritual Path
It happens, right? And it's often more complicated for those pursuing a strong spiritual path than it is for those who are not, right? I mean, added to all the other normal, everyday impediments to finding a cool person to hook up with, there's all this God stuff. Or eternity stuff, or Absolute stuff, or whatever you want to call it. There are a number of additional hurdles to overcome. There's the "Will this guy/gal one day get a wild spiritual hair up his ass and decide to dump me and go live in a cave in the Himalayas" thang. There's the "This is a pretty small, incestuous community, and if it doesn't work out between him/her and me, how am I going to handle running into him at courses for decades to come" thang. There's the "Will Maharishi throw me out of the movement if I ball this guy/gal" thang. There's the *karma* thang. There are just SO many "thangs." So I thought it might be fun to ask for people's romance stories here. I know I have a few, and I'd be willing to bet that you guys have more than a few yourselves.
[FairfieldLife] "Stop the Dolphin and Whale killings in Taiji" -online petition
Dear Friends, I have just read and signed the online petition: "Stop the Dolphin and Whale killings in Taiji" hosted on the web by PetitionOnline.com, the free online petition service, at: http://www.PetitionOnline.com/golfinho/ I personally agree with what this petition says, and I think you might agree, too. If you can spare a moment, please take a look, and consider signing yourself. Best wishes, - We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love (and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Romance on the Spiritual Path
On Mar 30, 2007, at 2:10 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: It happens, right? And it's often more complicated for those pursuing a strong spiritual path than it is for those who are not, right? I'm not at all sure of that, Barry. I think to some extent it's just an excuse many of us use. :) I don't think the social situation in our W culture is very healthy, and leaves a lot of people on the outside looking in, as it were. Whether being on a 'spiritual path' makes it more difficult is impossible to say, IMO. But since I believe that most are on some sort of path or other I would disagree there's anything inherently more difficult about a spiritual one. Especially since it's often impossible to define exactly what a 'spiritual path' actually is. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
As always I am glad you weighed in Marek! I agree with what you said up to a point. Certainly Guru Dev had such beliefs and may have viewed his own experiences as proof of miracles. Since I am not inclined to believe in River Goddesses giving monetary boons to people, I still think there was some monkey business surrounding this claim. It is either objectively true or not and he knew which it was. Yogananda with his movie star disciples is in the same Hindu televangelist camp as MMY in my book. He was huckstering spirituality in the West for cash. I have some pious Indian friends from Gujarat. Their view of guys like MMY matches my own. I think there is a legitimate distinction in most cultures between the guys marketing spirituality with stories of magical powers, and the more traditional conservative view. It believe that this distinction is important to religious people the world over. I used to put Guru Dev in a different category from MMY in this regard. Now I am not so sure. I get that my point means nothing to people who are inclined to take Yoganandas claims of miracles as factually true and the same for Guru Dev's miracles. My view may only have importance in how I am constructing distinctions between different types of religious people. It is a work in progress. So far I think that people making claims of miracles to gain spiritual credibility are more suspect than those who do not. It reflects the boundaries of my own thinking based on seeing too many people claim stuff that just isn't true. I am opened to any demonstration of miracles that includes professional magicians. I would love to have seen some of the stuff Turq reports. But since I have not, I am still skeptical till I see something substantial. So with that starting point when I see a claim of miracles my antenna go up. I am not inclined to believe that living alone for a long time gave Guru Dev super powers. If he is claiming to have seen Krishna like Yogananda did, I figure, so have I under long meditation influence. But if he claims to have a box that gives cash, I view this claim differently. It is another class of delusion or con. Once the claim reaches an objective level, it gets the same treatment for me that any physical claim gets. All subjective experiences are given a total pass from me because I know how compelling they can be. As I said, work in progress! This topic can be used in so many ways. It is a way to explore where we are drawing our different lines. I need to dig up my "Whole Thing Real Thing" book. I bought one from Dr. Varma years ago. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Marek Reavis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Curtis, without snipping any of your post (below) or spending a whole > lot more time or words on the subject, it seems pretty clear that > Guru Dev, himself, believed in siddhis and miracles, as is obvious > from Paul Mason's site with quotes from him exactly on that subject, > as well as the bios of him which are allegedly based on stories he > told himself. In "The Whole Thing, The Real Thing" he claims his > guru, Swamiji Krishnanad, raised a boy from the dead and there's also > the story of the Aghori Mahatma who put on the spectacular diorama of > the divinities (as well as a deluge of blood and bones) for Guru > Dev's benefit while Guru Dev was doing sadhana in some jungle > somewhere. > > And the Indian teachers and gurus I've read (Yogananda immediately > comes to mind), all presume the miraculous as being part and parcel > of enlightened life. > > So it doesn't seem odd or particularly perfidious on Brahmachari > Mahesh's part to make such claims about Guru Dev, whether or not Guru > Dev himself claimed to possess them. Basically, the belief in > siddhis are part of the Indian culture and as such, even a person of > integrity and prudence, steeped in that culture, would accept as true > the reality of miracles that have no empirical proof to substantiate > them. It's just a way of looking at the world. > > ** > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" > wrote: > > > > Just in case you are not already sick of this topic... > > > > I think I understand your point of view. Sounds reasonable. I also > > understand that you don't find my take on it reasonable. Fair > enough. > > It was my reaction to the wording of MMY's announcement about Guru > > Dev that changed my view of him from "stodgy old time religion guy" > to > > more of a self promoter using miracles as a hook. But our > discussion > > has definitely bought out a need to find out what specific miracles > > MMY claimed for GD. In any case I have addressed some points you > felt > > I had missed. FWIW. > > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" > > wrote: > > > > > As an aside, the tradition of the day was to > > > deliver a kid to an adult teacher to take care of > > > him. Letting him walk off was just as much
Re: [FairfieldLife] Romance on the Spiritual Path
TurquoiseB wrote: > It happens, right? > > And it's often more complicated for those pursuing > a strong spiritual path than it is for those who are > not, right? > > I mean, added to all the other normal, everyday > impediments to finding a cool person to hook up with, > there's all this God stuff. Or eternity stuff, or > Absolute stuff, or whatever you want to call it. > There are a number of additional hurdles to overcome. > > There's the "Will this guy/gal one day get a wild > spiritual hair up his ass and decide to dump me and > go live in a cave in the Himalayas" thang. There's > the "This is a pretty small, incestuous community, > and if it doesn't work out between him/her and me, > how am I going to handle running into him at courses > for decades to come" thang. There's the "Will Maharishi > throw me out of the movement if I ball this guy/gal" > thang. There's the *karma* thang. There are just SO > many "thangs." > > So I thought it might be fun to ask for people's > romance stories here. I know I have a few, and I'd > be willing to bet that you guys have more than a few > yourselves. I found that many women on the "spiritual path" were into rescuing "hurt puppies" or guys that had little interest in spiritual things but perceived as needing some help. The guy became their project. I recognized this easily because my niece was that way and the family was often critical of her "projects" that usually wound up in disaster. I bet you're seen this phenomena too.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Romance on the Spiritual Path
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Mar 30, 2007, at 2:10 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: > > > It happens, right? > > > > And it's often more complicated for those pursuing > > a strong spiritual path than it is for those who are > > not, right? > > I'm not at all sure of that, Barry. I think to some extent > it's just an excuse many of us use. :) I don't think the social > situation in our W culture is very healthy, and leaves a lot of > people on the outside looking in, as it were. Whether being on > a 'spiritual path' makes it more difficult is impossible to say, > IMO. But since I believe that most are on some sort of path or > other I would disagree there's anything inherently more difficult > about a spiritual one. Especially since it's often impossible to > define exactly what a 'spiritual path' actually is. Well said. I've had long-term relationships both on and off the spiritual path, such as it may be, and never found the former to be more complicated than the latter. If anything, the shared commitment has served as a kind of glue that has made it easier to get past other kinds of obstacles and conflicts with the relationship intact.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Romance on the Spiritual Path
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Mar 30, 2007, at 2:10 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: > > > It happens, right? > > > > And it's often more complicated for those pursuing > > a strong spiritual path than it is for those who are > > not, right? > > I'm not at all sure of that, Barry. I think to some extent > it's just an excuse many of us use. :) I don't think the > social situation in our W culture is very healthy, and > leaves a lot of people on the outside looking in, as it > were. Whether being on a 'spiritual path' makes it more > difficult is impossible to say, IMO. But since I believe > that most are on some sort of path or other I would disagree > there's anything inherently more difficult about a spiritual > one. Especially since it's often impossible to define > exactly what a 'spiritual path' actually is. If you've never noticed much of a difference from the mainstream of life, cool. I guess I have. Like when your girlfriend is as psychic as you are, and when you hook up, you really "hook up." :-) Like the connection is 24/7, wherever in the world you find yourselves, together or apart. You'd prob- ably have to have the music to go with this to get it completely, but the best statement I know of about his state of affairs (so to speak) is from Bruce Cockburn, in his song, "Live On My Mind." He wrote it while continents away from the woman he was writing it to. Or maybe he wasn't. See you standing in the door against the dark Fireflies around you like a crown of sparks You blow me a kiss that blurs my vision Blurs the human condition You're the ocean ringing in my brain You are my island ripe with cane Catch the scent of strange flowers when you pass Fluid motion like the wind in grass It's your eyes I want to see Looking into mine Got you live on my mind All the time Light me like incense in the night Light me like a candle burning bright Light me like a searchlight in the sky Time means nothing when I look in your eyes It's your eyes I want to see Looking into mine Got you live on my mind All the time It's your eyes I want to see Looking into mine Got you live on my mind All the time
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
Curtis, Marek has made my points more authoritatively and far more succinctly than I've been able to do, so I'll bow out, except for this: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Your thinking is so very rigid when it suits > > > your purposes, and so very flexible when that > > > works better for you. > > > > > > Agreed. It has taken me years of self development > > > to achieve this. > > > > Judy: And you're *proud* of insisting on the evidence > > when it confirms your beliefs and ignoring it > > when it doesn't?? > > > > Me: I don't see how trying to characterize my thinking > > process in a negative way advances our discussion Judy. > > I am not soliciting your help in my general thinking > > style. You weren't soliciting my help in understanding Guru Dev and MMY either. Why would you be soliciting help anyway if you aren't aware you need it? Just think of it as a random act of kindness.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
Condescension is not kindness. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Curtis, Marek has made my points more > authoritatively and far more succinctly than > I've been able to do, so I'll bow out, except > for this: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" > wrote: > > > > > Your thinking is so very rigid when it suits > > > > your purposes, and so very flexible when that > > > > works better for you. > > > > > > > > Agreed. It has taken me years of self development > > > > to achieve this. > > > > > > Judy: And you're *proud* of insisting on the evidence > > > when it confirms your beliefs and ignoring it > > > when it doesn't?? > > > > > > Me: I don't see how trying to characterize my thinking > > > process in a negative way advances our discussion Judy. > > > I am not soliciting your help in my general thinking > > > style. > > You weren't soliciting my help in understanding > Guru Dev and MMY either. > > Why would you be soliciting help anyway if you > aren't aware you need it? > > Just think of it as a random act of kindness. >
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
Comment below: ** --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > As always I am glad you weighed in Marek! I agree with what you said > up to a point. Certainly Guru Dev had such beliefs and may have > viewed his own experiences as proof of miracles. Since I am not > inclined to believe in River Goddesses giving monetary boons to > people, I still think there was some monkey business surrounding this > claim. It is either objectively true or not and he knew which it was. > > Yogananda with his movie star disciples is in the same Hindu > televangelist camp as MMY in my book. He was huckstering spirituality > in the West for cash. I have some pious Indian friends from Gujarat. > Their view of guys like MMY matches my own. I think there is a > legitimate distinction in most cultures between the guys marketing > spirituality with stories of magical powers, and the more traditional > conservative view. It believe that this distinction is important to > religious people the world over. I used to put Guru Dev in a > different category from MMY in this regard. Now I am not so sure. > > I get that my point means nothing to people who are inclined to take > Yoganandas claims of miracles as factually true and the same for Guru > Dev's miracles. My view may only have importance in how I am > constructing distinctions between different types of religious people. > It is a work in progress. So far I think that people making claims > of miracles to gain spiritual credibility are more suspect than those > who do not. It reflects the boundaries of my own thinking based on > seeing too many people claim stuff that just isn't true. I am opened > to any demonstration of miracles that includes professional magicians. > I would love to have seen some of the stuff Turq reports. But since > I have not, I am still skeptical till I see something substantial. So > with that starting point when I see a claim of miracles my antenna go > up. I am not inclined to believe that living alone for a long time > gave Guru Dev super powers. If he is claiming to have seen Krishna > like Yogananda did, I figure, so have I under long meditation > influence. But if he claims to have a box that gives cash, I view > this claim differently. It is another class of delusion or con. Once > the claim reaches an objective level, it gets the same treatment for > me that any physical claim gets. All subjective experiences are given > a total pass from me because I know how compelling they can be. As I > said, work in progress! > > This topic can be used in so many ways. It is a way to explore where > we are drawing our different lines. I need to dig up my "Whole Thing > Real Thing" book. I bought one from Dr. Varma years ago. > **snip to end** Curtis, I totally agree that the real discussion between us on this subject is just where we draw the lines in our understanding and belief of who these guys are and what they stand for. And like you, and for some time, I have distinguished in my mind Maharishi from Guru Dev precisely because I felt that Guru Dev lived a life consciously chosen to be (and apparently successfully lived) separate from the distractions and temptations that may have affected Maharishi's life decisions. Bottom line for me, however, is that there is something in the life of Guru Dev, as and to the degree I know it, that inspires me. In the video of the French Tibetan monk, when he comments near the beginning of his talk about when he first went to the Himalayas and met the Buddhist monks, he found that he didn't just want to learn what they knew, he wanted to *be* the way they were. He recognized some quality of consciousness in them that he wanted as well. When I first met Maharishi that's exactly what I felt. Whatever it was that he had, I wanted That, too. I wanted to *be* That. And besides that, I wanted to be a good man, a good person, a person of compassion and virtue. Nothing of what I have subsequently heard or read of Maharishi's possible failings as a man or a teacher have convinced me that he is not awake in pure consciousness, Awake in Brahman. However, he just isn't a role model for the other relative personal virtues that I esteem. But, based on everything I have heard or read about Guru Dev, I feel that his character and personality are totally worthy of emulation, reverence and respect. To me he is a Buddha and I revere him as such. Would it come to light, however, that he had personal failures as a human being that I have no inkling of now, of course I would be disappointed (just as I have been disappointed with some of Maharishi's personal characteristics), but the ideal, which to me he represents, would still be alive in me as an ideal to pursue and strive for. Guru Dev is a representation, in my consciousness, of exactly what I feel he should be, and as such, is perfect. Perfect B
[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > snip > Benjamin Creme is not my Guru and I have met him only once. I have > said this before, but for some it seems difficult to grasp that some information is just pure gold and highly interesting, and I > appreciate that you appreciate it lurk. Yea, he seems pretty right on, on many things. > > I'm not too familiar with some of the jargon here; what is "snipping > a post" ? Ok, I am playing moderator here, (so I am not counting this as one of my five) Snipping: When you reply to a post, you can edit and "snip" out parts that you don't need, or want. Just use your cursor and backspace parts to delete, or left click and hold and move up to "block out" a section, then backspack. Isn't this familiar to you? lurk >
[FairfieldLife] Auspicious Days for the Month of April 2007
Note: forwarded message attached. TV dinner still cooling? Check out "Tonight's Picks" on Yahoo! TV. http://tv.yahoo.com/--- Begin Message --- You appear to be using an email application that won't properly display the graphical (or HTML) version of our Yagya newsletter. Please visit the following web page where it has been posted for your enjoyment: http://yagya.org/2007_04_days.html http://yagya.org/2007_04_days.html";>AOL User Link--- End Message ---
[FairfieldLife] A House Divided will not Long Stand
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ffia1120 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > As to why teachers are independent -- are you really that clueless? > Or do you have no memory of the recent past? TM teachers were told > that if they did not get "re-certified" that they were no longer TM > teachers in the eyes of the TMO. This is what (IMO) has alienated > hundreds (thousands?) of loyal, dedicated TM teachers and is the > primary reason that when the big call went out last summer for TMers > to congregate in FF, most of the govs (and fed up sidhas) stayed > home. MMY bit the hand that fed him on the re-certification decision, > IMO. > Good practical observation about the situation here now with the TM community. Yes, it is that now classical theme: `A house divided will not long stand'. http://showcase.netins.net/web/creative/lincoln/speeches/house.htm a fascinating thing about the situation is that there is not language of reconcilliation extended by any of them up there. 'Their truth goes marching on'. It is getting to be a pretty small group. -Old Governor Doug in FF
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Condescension is not kindness. That wasn't condescension, it was snark. In response to pomposity. > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" wrote: > > > > Curtis, Marek has made my points more > > authoritatively and far more succinctly than > > I've been able to do, so I'll bow out, except > > for this: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" > > wrote: > > > > > > > Your thinking is so very rigid when it suits > > > > > your purposes, and so very flexible when that > > > > > works better for you. > > > > > > > > > > Agreed. It has taken me years of self development > > > > > to achieve this. > > > > > > > > Judy: And you're *proud* of insisting on the evidence > > > > when it confirms your beliefs and ignoring it > > > > when it doesn't?? > > > > > > > > Me: I don't see how trying to characterize my thinking > > > > process in a negative way advances our discussion Judy. > > > > I am not soliciting your help in my general thinking > > > > style. > > > > You weren't soliciting my help in understanding > > Guru Dev and MMY either. > > > > Why would you be soliciting help anyway if you > > aren't aware you need it? > > > > Just think of it as a random act of kindness.
[FairfieldLife] Braincell and the Universe
http://sprott.physics.wisc.edu/pickover/pc/brain-universe.html
[FairfieldLife] Re: Questions to, and answers from Benjaim Creme
Also, try top posting and stop changing the subject line. The search engine on Yahoo! already sucks - don't make it worse. If you have anything worthwhile to say, don's say it in the subject line - start a new topic. Yahoo! Groups sucks as a newsreader - can't even hardly follow along a thread the way the lines are all jumbled up. Judy and TurquoisB seem to be the only respondents here who know how to format a line with the ENTER key. Go figure. lurk wrote: > Snipping: When you reply to a post, you > can edit and "snip" out parts that you > don't need, or want.
[FairfieldLife] Milarepa, the movie
http://milarepamovie.com/ By the same team as "The Cup"
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
Marek Reavis wrote: > But, based on everything I have heard or > read about Guru Dev, I feel that his > character and personality are totally > worthy of emulation, reverence and respect. > >From what I've read, Rajaram Mishra fully supported the Indian varnashramadharma system. That's why he didn't include Mr. Varma on the list of worthy successors in his will. Mahesh was of the Sudra caste from a family of scribes, and thus not eligible for the title of sannyasin. It may be that Rajaram was am arch conservative as well - not a single woman was included in his will either. Which is odd, since he supposedly worshipped the Goddess Saraswati. I wouldn't be surprised if Guru Dev fully supported the conservative party in Indian politics as well. Apparently Mr. Mishra was addicted to betel leaves and enjoyed a good chew after every meal. So, how are you going to emulate these qualities, not to mention the idea of total celibacy and skipping the whole stage of a householder? I mean, it's great to respect holy men, but emulation of them is not for this age. I once read a story about Ramakrishna that related how he refused to sleep with his own wife. Go figure. Yes, I like Brahmananda, Maharishi and Yogananda, and lots of other teachers too, but it's probably counterproductive for anyone on the spiritual path to indulge in a cult of personality and insinuate that their teacher is divinity itself and thus try to emulate their behavior. MMY is a case in point - so is Trungpa or Fredrick Lentz. One drank hisself to death and the other killed hisself with a dog collar around his neck. Be your own Guru.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
Ccurtis wrote: > So far I think that people making claims > of miracles to gain spiritual credibility > are more suspect than those who do not. > Well, it would be pretty difficult to find a "spiritual" person who didn't believe in spirits, ergo, a miracle, since every materialist knows that there are no spirits - only claims. But, are you saying that there are spiritual materialists who make no claims of miracles or spirits? That would be a contradiction in terms, would it not?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
Richard, I was thinking that mainstream religious types don't talk about miracles much. They talk about love. They feel uncomfortable with people who claim miracles. So they might be spiritual and believe in God, but not buy that some preacher can heal cancer by shouting at you. I think this is the majority of religious Americans. By the time you figure out how watered down their version of spirituality is, you find it is more similar than different from an Atheist's view of our lot in life. A place where shit happens and no one seems to have a hotline to the big guy or we wouldn't have Guinea worms. (Google ride this at your own peril) I think some people believe in a vague "great spirit" and, like the deists, don't feel that God has much to do with our lives after creation. So that was what I was thinking, religious people who believe in God but are pretty skeptical about miracle claims outside their scriptures, East or West. Thanks for asking. Any insight is appreciated. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Richard J. Williams" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Ccurtis wrote: > > So far I think that people making claims > > of miracles to gain spiritual credibility > > are more suspect than those who do not. > > > Well, it would be pretty difficult to find > a "spiritual" person who didn't believe in > spirits, ergo, a miracle, since every > materialist knows that there are no spirits > - only claims. But, are you saying that > there are spiritual materialists who make > no claims of miracles or spirits? That would > be a contradiction in terms, would it not? >
[FairfieldLife] Re: Discussion with Judy about Guru Dev and MMY's intro letter continues
Reply below: ** --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Richard J. Williams" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Marek Reavis wrote: > > But, based on everything I have heard or > > read about Guru Dev, I feel that his > > character and personality are totally > > worthy of emulation, reverence and respect. > > > From what I've read, Rajaram Mishra fully supported > the Indian varnashramadharma system. That's why > he didn't include Mr. Varma on the list of worthy > successors in his will. Mahesh was of the Sudra > caste from a family of scribes, and thus not > eligible for the title of sannyasin. > > It may be that Rajaram was am arch conservative > as well - not a single woman was included in his > will either. Which is odd, since he supposedly > worshipped the Goddess Saraswati. I wouldn't be > surprised if Guru Dev fully supported the > conservative party in Indian politics as well. > Apparently Mr. Mishra was addicted to betel > leaves and enjoyed a good chew after every meal. > > So, how are you going to emulate these qualities, > not to mention the idea of total celibacy and > skipping the whole stage of a householder? I > mean, it's great to respect holy men, but emulation > of them is not for this age. I once read a story > about Ramakrishna that related how he refused to > sleep with his own wife. Go figure. > > Yes, I like Brahmananda, Maharishi and Yogananda, > and lots of other teachers too, but it's probably > counterproductive for anyone on the spiritual > path to indulge in a cult of personality and > insinuate that their teacher is divinity itself > and thus try to emulate their behavior. MMY is a > case in point - so is Trungpa or Fredrick Lentz. > One drank hisself to death and the other killed > hisself with a dog collar around his neck. > > Be your own Guru. > **end** Excellent comments, thank you. Absolutely, we are our own guru; the utilization of Divine Teachers, living or dead, and images of God, is only a projection of our own highest sense of Self onto an 'other' so we have something to put Attention on; basically a movement, either as an intermediary step towards a clearer sense of Self, or as end in itself if you find just the perfect configuration in a projection (the Shri Yantra comes to mind as non-representational but perfect projection). Guru Dev is a hero to me. The fact that he was a monk, and that Maharishi's whole program came wrapped in a type of spiritual glamour regarding monkish virtues (even though Maharishi famously taught "meditation for householders"), certainly informs some of my emulation of Guru Dev; but I meant 'emulation' more as to integrity and focus rather than specific lifestyle or ashrama. The speculation that he was likely a very traditional and conservative Brahmin Hindu who probably espoused political and social views that I wouldn't share, also doesn't affect my sense of reverence and affection. So too, whatever tastes he may have cultivated or addictions he may have cherished; betel, coffee, bhang, tea or chillum -- who cares. These things are all expressions of the cultural and political milieu into which a personality is born and steeped in. But the cult of personality seems to be a fundamental human characteristic. The key, I guess, is to find (or project) a personality that is worthy of the cult, regardless of where in time or where in the world it was formed. Generally speaking, Buddhism seems to have gotten that pretty right. Christianity, less so, in my opinion; same with Islam. Hinduism seems robust but very spotty. Anyway, thanks again for the post. Marek
[FairfieldLife] Spiritual Life, Saints, M Effect,
Hello, I have not posted in a while, and lapsed in reading for a good part of that. The five post limit looks good. But discussion seems a bit stilted sometimes. Its a pity to cap great diologues like Curtis and Marek's -- if they have more to say in a day in their saints discussion. But overall the new FFL seems like the older FFL of 2-3 years ago which many of us were quite fond of. Some some themes (or broad extrapolations of them in my head) have caught my attention in an interconnected sort of way. and shou 1) What is spiritual life? 2) What characterizes a saint and his/her life? 3) "Tale tales" told by and of Saints 4) Does the ME diminish by distance for example like like gravity and light -- 1/distance^2? 5) What is relationship between spiritual people Some thoughts, which are hardly new and sound quite trite in words, but for me, several creates a strong "flip" of life -- sort of like the foreground/background optical illusions, when its "groked" and actually siumply lived. 1) Primarily satisfaction from THAT, that constant inner dipping, drinking at the well, amidst both the enticing and enthralling films (life / karmic roll-outs, life circumstances, roles and responsibilities we assume) and painfilly bad ones. We can still be really into the film, enthusiastically, but not living for it -- or craving release from it. Just keep drinking the nectar from the well and um, "take it as it comes" (or as it flies off the fan). Trite words, but a refreshing lovely thing when lived. 2) Deeply living above. Every saint, living deep values of THAT inside and outside, all have very diverse karma's they are living out -- and some taken on from students. Judging a saints life from outer circumstances, personality, habits etc is totally missing what they are. Its as "off" as judging ones life as "good" if good times are rolling and bad when they are not. 3) Some saints feel no shame in telling tale tales -- and some stranger than life true ones -- if it sucks some into living the above. Effective communicators paint effective picturs that motivate action towards something. If its a good thing the listener gets to from the process, all can laugh later at the tall tales. Was Yogananda's vision of Krishna an embellished tale or a reality? Dunno, but it got my attention. It may have not been Krishna, but it was, i am sure, something in that direction. On the other hand, if the tall tales are used to manipulate, control distort, impress and extort, its a bad thing. How to distiguish? Not sure. Be skeptical I guess. And be open to being entertained and insprired within that skepticism. Charlie Lutes told lots of "tall tales", in my book, and in doing so inspired many on a path that helped them. TMO has told some tall tales that for some have run them down hill. 4) Why should FF crime, hog farm etc be more diminished by proximity to MD, Domes etc more than in San Francisco or Moscow? We seem to automatically assume a distance effect from groupd YF, Saints, Darshan etc. Yet if those things operate at finest level, or beyond, then effect should / could be evenly distributed across great distance. Darshan of saints is very special. Proximity. But you can have darshan of any saint at any time by closing eyes and just be with that saint. Effects can be powerful. Relates to point 2. What is the Saint? Their outer lives, and proximity/locality, or a universal, fairly unlocalized expression of THAT? 5) Satisfaction primarily from THAT and not from the other. Odd sounding structure to some I am sure. But eliminates co-dependence and all. Using the pain of separation and longing to be with lover as intense back drop to find satisfaction in THAT as anchor. My relations of the past have most always been the reverse -- due to my shortcomings and not being above to hold onto THAT when those huge WAVEs come. Comments and other angles or views most welcome.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Spiritual Life, Saints, M Effect,
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Was it just me, or could anyone else not slog through these points? Kinda like someone dumping a truckload of manure on a little flower. Or someone calling a call in radio show and asking about 10 questions. Be selective, or bring up one point every few days. lurk > > Hello, > > I have not posted in a while, and lapsed in reading for a good part of > that. The five post limit looks good. But discussion seems a bit > stilted sometimes. Its a pity to cap great diologues like Curtis and > Marek's -- if they have more to say in a day in their saints > discussion. But overall the new FFL seems like the older FFL of 2-3 > years ago which many of us were quite fond of. > > Some some themes (or broad extrapolations of them in my head) have > caught my attention in an interconnected sort of way. and shou > > 1) What is spiritual life? > > 2) What characterizes a saint and his/her life? > > 3) "Tale tales" told by and of Saints > > 4) Does the ME diminish by distance for example like like gravity and > light -- 1/distance^2? > > 5) What is relationship between spiritual people > > Some thoughts, which are hardly new and sound quite trite in words, > but for me, several creates a strong "flip" of life -- sort of like > the foreground/background optical illusions, when its "groked" and > actually siumply lived. > > 1) Primarily satisfaction from THAT, that constant inner dipping, > drinking at the well, amidst both the enticing and enthralling films > (life / karmic roll-outs, life circumstances, roles and > responsibilities we assume) and painfilly bad ones. We can > still be really into the film, enthusiastically, but not living for it > -- or craving release from it. Just keep drinking the nectar from the > well and um, "take it as it comes" (or as it flies off the fan). Trite > words, but a refreshing lovely thing when lived. > > 2) Deeply living above. Every saint, living deep values of THAT inside > and outside, all have very diverse karma's they are living out -- and > some taken on from students. Judging a saints life from outer > circumstances, personality, habits etc is totally missing what they > are. Its as "off" as judging ones life as "good" if good times are > rolling and bad when they are not. > > 3) Some saints feel no shame in telling tale tales -- and some > stranger than life true ones -- if it sucks some into living the > above. Effective communicators paint effective picturs that motivate > action towards something. If its a good thing the listener gets to > from the process, all can laugh later at the tall tales. Was > Yogananda's vision of Krishna an embellished tale or a reality? Dunno, > but it got my attention. It may have not been Krishna, but it was, i am > sure, something in that direction. > > On the other hand, if the tall tales are used to manipulate, control > distort, impress and extort, its a bad thing. How to distiguish? Not > sure. Be skeptical I guess. And be open to being entertained and > insprired within that skepticism. Charlie Lutes told lots of "tall > tales", in my book, and in doing so inspired many on a path that > helped them. TMO has told some tall tales that for some > have run them down hill. > > 4) Why should FF crime, hog farm etc be more diminished by proximity > to MD, Domes etc more than in San Francisco or Moscow? We seem to > automatically assume a distance effect from groupd YF, Saints, Darshan > etc. Yet if those things operate at finest level, or beyond, then > effect should / could be evenly distributed across great distance. > Darshan of saints is very special. Proximity. But you can have darshan > of any saint at any time by closing eyes and just be with that saint. > Effects can be powerful. Relates to point 2. What is the Saint? Their > outer lives, and proximity/locality, or a universal, fairly > unlocalized expression of THAT? > > 5) Satisfaction primarily from THAT and not from the other. Odd > sounding structure to some I am sure. But eliminates co-dependence and > all. Using the pain of separation and longing to be with lover as > intense back drop to find satisfaction in THAT as anchor. My relations > of the past have most always been the reverse -- due to my > shortcomings and not being above to hold onto THAT when > those huge WAVEs come. > > Comments and other angles or views most welcome. >
[FairfieldLife] Posting quotas
I've been pretty caught up in my work. Everybody is pretty much within the 5-post limit, except for bad boy Kirk, but I guess we're cutting him some slack because he won't be able to post on days when he's working. Besides, I never have been able to control the guy, and who would want to? Anyway, thanks to all for keeping things pretty civil. If there's something you need to bring to my attention, put my name in the subject line, or I might miss it.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Milarepa, the movie
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > http://milarepamovie.com/ > > By the same team as "The Cup" It looks wonderful, although the "from the same team" thing is a little misleading. It's like the tagline for "The 300" that says, "from the creator of Sin City," implying the same director when it isn't. But that's just an industry pet peeve of mine -- I look forward to seeing this film. Thanks for mentioning it.
[FairfieldLife] Guru Dev in a closet?
According to my TM teacher's story over 25 years ago, as I recall the end of it, Guru Dev once pointed to a closet in a corner, and told his disciples to say "Jai Guru Dev", and take him out of that closet, if they needed him, when he was on a trip. I wonder if anybody else has heard anything even remotely similar. My teacher is Piscean, ruled by Neptune. I wonder if he made that story up. OTOH, I might of course have misunderstood what he told us...