Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading.
Jeez Louise! What a diatribe from Phaewryn! ! I certainly believe in SOME animal communicators and I myself have certainly seen several deceased people who gave me messages--one for a neighbor family to whom we were very close and two for me from very dear friends. And then there are so many friends and loved ones I cannot see and I yearn to hear from. My mother smells flowers when a loved one dies. She says it's like someone has dumped a bottle of perfume at her feet it's so strong. None of these things happen all the time but always come as a surprise. Where do those powers come from? It depends on who has the powers. Some are from God, some are from an evil place. They come from both places. We are all very feeling people in the first place because our love does not stop with humanity--it continues into a great love for animals. So there you go. Check out the incredible developments in quantum mechanics. Consciousness is Causal and Physicality is its Manifestation. On Jun 10, 2007, at 3:55 PM, Debbie wrote: I was disturbed by the below message. There is nothing wrong with people believing in certain things. If those things bring them comfort how could it ever be wrong? I read Phaewryn’s my space blog and it seems to me she is someone who is dealing with a lot of deep issues. She comes across as being a very angry and distrusting person. Take it for what it is worth – just someone blowing off steam. It must be a very sad and lonely life if a person doesn’t believe strongly in something. Faith is the healing force and there is nothing wrong with saying a prayer. If anything it humbles us enough to make us see what is truly important in our lives. Myself, I would say I wouldn’t go to any psychic readings of any type, but that’s me. I do believe there are things that are mystical or paranormal, etc…, but I have always wondered where those powers come from? Good or Evil? Since I don’t know then I choose not to use them., but if someone else finds comfort in it – then that is their choice. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:felvtalk- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf OfMarylyn Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 3:27 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. I'm not going to respond to such an awful personal attack. I truly believe in AC and know a number of people who practice it. It has worked for me and it has worked for them. I am sorry it has not worked for you. Perhaps one day. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 2:05 PM Subject: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. And the thought that perhaps we need to ask the cats in question what they would prefer when death is a serious option. The idea that any of you actually BELIEVE that anyone can psychically communicate with an animal is, to me, ABSURD. I think the animal communication business is a FRAUD taking advantage of people and their love of their pets (and often, their weakened mental status because of desperation and stress). There may actually BE good people out there who REALLY believe they communicate with animals... people who are not frauds, people with good hearts, but out of touch with reality. I'm not saying ALL AC's are just out to make a buck or gain fame, but really, you can't PROVE this stuff exists, and it's proven fact that other humans WILL take advantage when given a chance! Anyone remember snake oil? HELLO?! You know what? This list has of recent had SO MANY emails about animal communication, that it seems to be THE answer to EVERYTHING! I just can't fathom the emotional susceptibility of a person to actually believe in something so FAR OUT THERE and so obviously unable to be proven. And to put an animals LIFE, or the question of PHYSICAL MUTILATION, on the line based on what could just as well be as valid as flipping a coin, well, it's just unfathomable, I just can't come up with any other word for it! It's like a NEW RELIGION... You can't see, it, you can't prove it, you can't feel it, you can't do anything to prove it exists, yet you just blindly throw your faith into it, and put everything you own in your heart into this belief in the unprovable! I JUST DO NOT GET IT ! In my opinion, all the talk of animal communication on this list has made it's validity LAUGHABLE in the past
Oh My A/C??
I will certainly not insult anyone intentionally. I think A.C is sort of like reading tea leaves,numerology,,astrology and religion, and also homeopathy. If it works for you,,go for it, To each his own. Everyone has their own comfort level. Everyone here cares about their cats and other peoples cats as well and that makes them all special in my book. We will surely disagree often, but we all care! Kelly the proud atheist. and more important. the person owned by many cats.
Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned.
I do really understand. I've been there too many times. Alternative vets are not ACs and many consult by phone. My prayers are with you. Missy sounds like The Royal Princess Kitty Katt. Tell her or no I don't want to talk to you. But she understands that you are concerned about what she wants. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Kelley Saveika [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 10:12 PM Subject: Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned. I tried an AC with Missy. She said she got a lovely warm feeling. She wasn't going to tell me anything, she just went back to see if she could feel the warm feeling again. Missy stamped her little paw and said tell her. I love Missy so much. So scared to lose hr. On 6/10/07, Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you tried a holistic/alternative vet? Or AC's? You would be surprised what a cat will tell an AC it trusts. There are volunteer groups (they tell me) on the internet. Dixie has been able to tell me that she was spayed and certainly didn't need spaying again, even if the vets couldn't find the scar (hormone tests proved her right), when she has a flea (even one or two causes hot spots), if she needed to go to the vet after the pet food scar (long story) etc. I've been off computer and really don't know what all you have tried but I know of two avs that are great. For some reason I have to believe you need to try Just Born or some other colostrum containing supplement for your little friend. That may help and I can't believe that mother's milk would hurt. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Beth Noren To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 12:47 PM Subject: Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned. Hi Tad, I agree, rescuing a declawed shelter cat is the perfect solution for those that must have a declawed cat. Unfortunately, I haven't had much luck suggesting this to people yet, (even when I tell them how much money they can save) as they all seem to want itty-bitty kittens. In my case, I WANT the claws, I am just considering a possible declaw in the distant future if I can't figure out what is making his head itch so bad that he kicks it open... Beth On 6/10/07, Tad Burnett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: `I guess the point is that its a great way to keep the piece... Nobody can get upset if you tell people you rescued your declawed cat from a shelter already declawed... Tad Kelley Saveika wrote: On 6/10/07, Tad Burnett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There was an 18 year old siamese is a county shelter that I was looking at last night.. Looking through the list of about 30 cats that they had I noticed that they also had 2 other siamese as well as all the cats seemed like they would make great pets... Then I noticed that about one in four were declawed !!! If you want a declawed cat there are plenty of great kitties just dying waiting to be adopted and already declawed... Tad 1 in 4 is about the national average for declawed cats. So this statistic makes sense to me. -- Rescuties - Saving the world, one cat at a time. http://www.rescuties.org Vist the Rescuties store and save a kitty life! http://astore.amazon.com/rescuties-20 Please help Gandalf! http://www.firstgiving.com/gandalfkitty I GoodSearch for Rescuties. Raise money for your favorite charity or school just by searching the Internet with GoodSearch - www.goodsearch.com - powered by Yahoo!
Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned.
If you get into the raw diets: Primal runs about $16 for 4 pounds. It comes in little ounce cubes that you thaw and, given how concentrated it is, is as cheap or cheaper than some otc canned foods..FF is about 70 cants a can here (3 ounces). Don't panic yet. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Beth Noren To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 12:13 AM Subject: Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned. Hi Marylyn, Thank you so much for your suggestions, I really appreciate your kindness. I haven't tried an alternative vet yet, but do know of a good one not too far away. I've got a couple more food trials to do, and then I think we'll see what the holistic vet has to say. I know someone said before that Hill's Z/D did the trick for them. I want to try it, but am afraid of Hill's since the tainted food nightmare. Mine were all on Hill's D/D in February, and I had piles of throw-up everywhere. The D/D was never recalled, but now I don't totally trust Hill's. They did eat the recalled Natural Balance Venison Green Pea in January, with no noticeable ill effect (or improvement in his itching). The itching first started around Christmas, and it's all up on his head, so I don't think it's flea allergies, but maybe. I did just start them back on Revolution (thank you again for the help with that Kelley S. and MC!) so we'll see. These darn food trials just take s long. And I'm afraid the ultimate answer is going to be home-cooking mail-order rabbit or some such for five kitties. Yikes! I'll post if (when! positive thinking) I find something that works. Funny, other than two fevers early on, my FeLv kitty has been the healthiest one of the bunch. Way more worries and vet bills (allergies, broken bone, ear infection, tumorish-looking fat deposit) for the virus-free bunch. Ya never know... Thank you again for your help, Beth On 6/10/07, Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you tried a holistic/alternative vet? Or AC's? You would be surprised what a cat will tell an AC it trusts. There are volunteer groups (they tell me) on the internet. Dixie has been able to tell me that she was spayed and certainly didn't need spaying again, even if the vets couldn't find the scar (hormone tests proved her right), when she has a flea (even one or two causes hot spots), if she needed to go to the vet after the pet food scar (long story) etc. I've been off computer and really don't know what all you have tried but I know of two avs that are great. For some reason I have to believe you need to try Just Born or some other colostrum containing supplement for your little friend. That may help and I can't believe that mother's milk would hurt. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Beth Noren To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 12:47 PM Subject: Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned. Hi Tad, I agree, rescuing a declawed shelter cat is the perfect solution for those that must have a declawed cat. Unfortunately, I haven't had much luck suggesting this to people yet, (even when I tell them how much money they can save) as they all seem to want itty-bitty kittens. In my case, I WANT the claws, I am just considering a possible declaw in the distant future if I can't figure out what is making his head itch so bad that he kicks it open... Beth On 6/10/07, Tad Burnett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: `I guess the point is that its a great way to keep the piece... Nobody can get upset if you tell people you rescued your declawed cat from a shelter already declawed... Tad Kelley Saveika wrote: On 6/10/07, Tad Burnett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There was an 18 year old siamese is a county shelter that I was looking at last night.. Looking through the list of about 30 cats that they had I noticed that they also had 2 other siamese as well as all the cats seemed like
Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading.
Just so there is no misunderstanding, animal communications is practiced by Christians as well as people of other beliefs and the Bible speaks of interspecies communications. Below is one of my favorite scriptures. JOB 12:7-10 You have only to ask the cattle, for them to instruct you, and the birds of the sky, for them to inform you. The creeping things of earth will give you lessons, and the fish of the sea provide you an explanation: there is not one such creature but will know that the hand of God has arranged things like this! In his hand is the soul of every living thing and the breath of every human being! There are a lot more but I'm not into preaching. Just clarifying that AC is recognized by numerous religions, agnostics and atheists. As some friends say, take what works for you and leave the rest. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: dede hicken [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 5:03 PM Subject: RE: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. Wow!! Now THAT was a vent!!! That said i agree with Debbie, but there is something more important at stake here. I personally have found this list to be one of the most caring ones around. You guys were supportive of me during our move, and even offered suggestions. Not one other list was as helpful. No, it didn't have much to do with FeLV (although Ki was the ONLY one who scared the crap out of me during that ordeal. He is doing well, anyway...) but I needed support. I have a CRF kitty, one with FIV and diabetes, one with FIV and stomatitis, one with just stomatitis (just, hah!) and an asthmatic. The others are healthy. But darnit, I was scared. No one likes to think about losing their furkid, and I have lost my share, and will again. Point is, we all need a kind word now and again. And suggestions, too. We may not alwys agree, but hey, they were given from the heart, and we need to be mature enough to take what we want and keep our mouth's shut if we don't like them. The internet brings peoples of all beliefs together...that is what is so facinating about it! One of my best friend is a Pagan. I don't believe in all of it, but I learned about it and was surprised! We are free to take it or leave it And, if you decide to leave it, do it with grace. In friendship, Dede and Ki (and all the rest) --- Debbie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was disturbed by the below message. There is nothing wrong with people believing in certain things. If those things bring them comfort how could it ever be wrong? I read Phaewryn's my space blog and it seems to me she is someone who is dealing with a lot of deep issues. She comes across as being a very angry and distrusting person. Take it for what it is worth - just someone blowing off steam. It must be a very sad and lonely life if a person doesn't believe strongly in something. Faith is the healing force and there is nothing wrong with saying a prayer. If anything it humbles us enough to make us see what is truly important in our lives. Myself, I would say I wouldn't go to any psychic readings of any type, but that's me. I do believe there are things that are mystical or paranormal, etc., but I have always wondered where those powers come from? Good or Evil? Since I don't know then I choose not to use them., but if someone else finds comfort in it - then that is their choice. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marylyn Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 3:27 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. I'm not going to respond to such an awful personal attack. I truly believe in AC and know a number of people who practice it. It has worked for me and it has worked for them. I am sorry it has not worked for you. Perhaps one day. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: HYPERLINK mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] To: HYPERLINK mailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgfelvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 2:05 PM Subject: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. And the thought that perhaps we need to ask the cats in question what they would prefer when death is a serious option. The idea that any of you
Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading.
That scripture is lovely. If you have more, I'd like to see them. Pam Marylyn wrote: Just so there is no misunderstanding, animal communications is practiced by Christians as well as people of other beliefs and the Bible speaks of interspecies communications. Below is one of my favorite scriptures. JOB 12:7-10 You have only to ask the cattle, for them to instruct you, and the birds of the sky, for them to inform you. The creeping things of earth will give you lessons, and the fish of the sea provide you an explanation: there is not one such creature but will know that the hand of God has arranged things like this! In his hand is the soul of every living thing and the breath of every human being! There are a lot more but I'm not into preaching. Just clarifying that AC is recognized by numerous religions, agnostics and atheists. As some friends say, take what works for you and leave the rest. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: dede hicken [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 5:03 PM Subject: RE: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. Wow!! Now THAT was a vent!!! That said i agree with Debbie, but there is something more important at stake here. I personally have found this list to be one of the most caring ones around. You guys were supportive of me during our move, and even offered suggestions. Not one other list was as helpful. No, it didn't have much to do with FeLV (although Ki was the ONLY one who scared the crap out of me during that ordeal. He is doing well, anyway...) but I needed support. I have a CRF kitty, one with FIV and diabetes, one with FIV and stomatitis, one with just stomatitis (just, hah!) and an asthmatic. The others are healthy. But darnit, I was scared. No one likes to think about losing their furkid, and I have lost my share, and will again. Point is, we all need a kind word now and again. And suggestions, too. We may not alwys agree, but hey, they were given from the heart, and we need to be mature enough to take what we want and keep our mouth's shut if we don't like them. The internet brings peoples of all beliefs together...that is what is so facinating about it! One of my best friend is a Pagan. I don't believe in all of it, but I learned about it and was surprised! We are free to take it or leave it And, if you decide to leave it, do it with grace. In friendship, Dede and Ki (and all the rest) --- Debbie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was disturbed by the below message. There is nothing wrong with people believing in certain things. If those things bring them comfort how could it ever be wrong? I read Phaewryn's my space blog and it seems to me she is someone who is dealing with a lot of deep issues. She comes across as being a very angry and distrusting person. Take it for what it is worth - just someone blowing off steam. It must be a very sad and lonely life if a person doesn't believe strongly in something. Faith is the healing force and there is nothing wrong with saying a prayer. If anything it humbles us enough to make us see what is truly important in our lives. Myself, I would say I wouldn't go to any psychic readings of any type, but that's me. I do believe there are things that are mystical or paranormal, etc., but I have always wondered where those powers come from? Good or Evil? Since I don't know then I choose not to use them., but if someone else finds comfort in it - then that is their choice. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marylyn Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 3:27 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. I'm not going to respond to such an awful personal attack. I truly believe in AC and know a number of people who practice it. It has worked for me and it has worked for them. I am sorry it has not worked for you. Perhaps one day. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: HYPERLINK mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] To: HYPERLINK mailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgfelvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 2:05 PM Subject: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. And the thought that perhaps we need to ask the cats in question
Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned.
Do you know if the raw diets can be cooked, or does that destroy the vitamins and taurine and stuff? Or does it make the ground up bone chips too brittle and dangerous? I have a link from someone for mail-order supplements that can be added to home-cooked meals, may go that route... Thank you, Beth On 6/11/07, Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you get into the raw diets: Primal runs about $16 for 4 pounds. It comes in little ounce cubes that you thaw and, given how concentrated it is, is as cheap or cheaper than some otc canned foods..FF is about 70 cants a can here (3 ounces). Don't panic yet. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - *From:* Beth Noren [EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org *Sent:* Monday, June 11, 2007 12:13 AM *Subject:* Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned. Hi Marylyn, Thank you so much for your suggestions, I really appreciate your kindness. I haven't tried an alternative vet yet, but do know of a good one not too far away. I've got a couple more food trials to do, and then I think we'll see what the holistic vet has to say. I know someone said before that Hill's Z/D did the trick for them. I want to try it, but am afraid of Hill's since the tainted food nightmare. Mine were all on Hill's D/D in February, and I had piles of throw-up everywhere. The D/D was never recalled, but now I don't totally trust Hill's. They did eat the recalled Natural Balance Venison Green Pea in January, with no noticeable ill effect (or improvement in his itching). The itching first started around Christmas, and it's all up on his head, so I don't think it's flea allergies, but maybe. I did just start them back on Revolution (thank you again for the help with that Kelley S. and MC!) so we'll see. These darn food trials just take s long. And I'm afraid the ultimate answer is going to be home-cooking mail-order rabbit or some such for five kitties. Yikes! I'll post if (when! positive thinking) I find something that works. Funny, other than two fevers early on, my FeLv kitty has been the healthiest one of the bunch. Way more worries and vet bills (allergies, broken bone, ear infection, tumorish-looking fat deposit) for the virus-free bunch. Ya never know... Thank you again for your help, Beth On 6/10/07, Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you tried a holistic/alternative vet? Or AC's? You would be surprised what a cat will tell an AC it trusts. There are volunteer groups (they tell me) on the internet. Dixie has been able to tell me that she was spayed and certainly didn't need spaying again, even if the vets couldn't find the scar (hormone tests proved her right), when she has a flea (even one or two causes hot spots), if she needed to go to the vet after the pet food scar (long story) etc. I've been off computer and really don't know what all you have tried but I know of two avs that are great. For some reason I have to believe you need to try Just Born or some other colostrum containing supplement for your little friend. That may help and I can't believe that mother's milk would hurt. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - *From:* Beth Noren [EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org *Sent:* Sunday, June 10, 2007 12:47 PM *Subject:* Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned. Hi Tad, I agree, rescuing a declawed shelter cat is the perfect solution for those that must have a declawed cat. Unfortunately, I haven't had much luck suggesting this to people yet, (even when I tell them how much money they can save) as they all seem to want itty-bitty kittens. In my case, I WANT the claws, I am just considering a possible declaw in the distant future if I can't figure out what is making his head itch so bad that he kicks it open... Beth On 6/10/07, Tad Burnett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: `I guess the point is that its a great way to keep the piece... Nobody can get upset if you tell people you rescued your declawed cat from a shelter already declawed... Tad Kelley Saveika wrote: On 6/10/07, Tad Burnett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There was an 18 year old siamese is a county shelter that I was looking at last
Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned.
Hi Beth, I cook for Fred and I debone all my meat. I've always been told cooked bones, especially chicken is dangerous for cats to eat. I make all my food from scratch so don't know anything about what happens when you cook pre-packaged raw. -- Belinda happiness is being owned by cats ... Be-Mi-Kitties http://bemikitties.com Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens http://adopt.bemikitties.com FeLV Candlelight Service http://bemikitties.com/cls HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting web design] http://HostDesign4U.com BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites] http://bmk.bemikitties.com
OT: For Missy, the dog Skinned Alive
Public Seeks Felony Charges for Heinous Act of Skinning Dog Alive _http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/848530163_ (http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/848530163) Please sign and pass it on!! Post your comment on the Topix Blog: _http://www.topix.net/city/benton-ar/2007/06/benton-woman-finds-dog-skinned-al ive_ (http://www.topix.net/city/benton-ar/2007/06/benton-woman-finds-dog-skinned-alive) Terrie Mohr-Forker TAZZY'S ANIMAL TRANSPORTS SIAMESE COLLIE RESCUE Donations accepted at: _https://www.paypal.com/_ (https://www.paypal.com/) _http://www.tazzys-siameses-collies.petfinder.org/_ (http://www.tazzys-siameses-collies.petfinder.org/) _http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wasiameserescue_ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/wasiameserescue) _http://hometown.aol.com/tatorbunz/myhomepage/petmemorial.html_ (http://hometown.aol.com/tatorbunz/myhomepage/petmemorial.html) _http://www.felineleukemia.org/_ (http://www.felineleukemia.org/) _http://www.hometown.aol.com/tatorbunz/index.html_ (http://www.hometown.aol.com/tatorbunz/index.html) _http://www.petloss.com/_ (http://www.petloss.com/) ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading.
Phaewryn, This is the 3rd time in a year that you have gone off on other members inappropriately and then claimed to be leaving. I think you need to stop. It is not right or fair to insult other people and then stick your neck in the sand. No one here agrees 100% with any other member on this site. When this happens, either we respectfully disagree, or we just don't say anything. There is no reason to go on a mission to destroy. It is so clear that when you do this, there's much more underlying your verbal spews that has nothing to do with this group and everything to do with your own life. If you are stressed out, stop taking it out here. It's not right. I completely disagree with your statement that for the past year that the validity of the site has been laughable. If you remember, I joined this list a year a half ago. I have learned SO MUCH from this list in the past year a half, and that knowledge has spurred me to do a lot of further research. I am actually able to help others here. I came here so needy and ignorant only to come out more knowledgeable on many aspects of feline care, all because of the loving members of this group. That includes you. No, I didn't prescribe to all the advice given, but took it all in, did my own research, and am still paying it back to new members who came her just like I did. The validity of this group is just as strong as it was six years ago. What you say about a/c's could be true, but you don't know. I don't know. Neither of us have tried one. You can't prove anything intangible exists anyway. What would you say to someone who says you don't love your son because it can't be proven? Indeed, it cannot be proven in a quantitative or tangible way, as no intangibles can. You can't see them, you can't touch them. But nevertheless, your love for your son IS there and it IS true. Same way for faith in God for some of us. So I hope that you will begin to question your own belief that unless you can prove something, it might as well not exist. There is suffering in the world so we can grow. If there were no suffering, there would be no happiness. You cannot know real happiness if you never have struggles and make personal growth. And FYI, prayer is not crap. You have asked for it yourself here. Please, make an effort to hold your tongue. The 24-hour rule always works for me. Write your letter in a word document, save it, and go back and read it in 24 hours. Revise as needed. You might need 48 hours. I did it when writing this post to you. I waited until I slept on it before responding. And my post shows much less anger, and more sense than it would have had I immediately responded. Save your sarcasm for yourself. No one else appreciates it. Dealing with sick animals is hard enough without you making everyone feel badly. I felt like you once, over ten years ago, making everyone around me feel bad because I felt bad inside. I got help with a great counselor for a year. Worked through a lot of childhood issues. Some adult issues. I've been a new woman ever since. Stronger, more secure, and most importantly, happier with who I am. I'll never regret my decision to get help. I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy to feel like I did before I got help. And I certainly don't wish it on you or anyone else on this list. I truly hope, and will pray, that you find some way to deal with these issues in your personal life that keep plaguing you. Life has so much to offer us. Sincerely, Wendy Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~ Get your own web address. Have a HUGE year through Yahoo! Small Business. http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL
Re: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading.
At 12:25 PM 6/11/2007, you wrote: Wendy..spoken so very well. as I mentioned before, I may not believe but I respect everyone here. this is one the most supportive and informative groups I belong to, For those who remember last year and the recovery/return of the 2 FELV cats from the carjackingWe are here to support each other, perhaps Phaewrn was upset at me regarding my attitude on declawing stating euthanasia is never i viable alternative, We all suffer for and with our animals and this is a great bunch of people. If anyone has anything personal to say. Use a private email rather than post to the group. Kelly www.kellyscats.zoomshare.com Phaewryn, This is the 3rd time in a year that you have gone off on other members inappropriately and then claimed to be leaving. I think you need to stop. It is not right or fair to insult other people and then stick your neck in the sand. No one here agrees 100% with any other member on this site. When this happens, either we respectfully disagree, or we just don't say anything. There is no reason to go on a mission to destroy. It is so clear that when you do this, there's much more underlying your verbal spews that has nothing to do with this group and everything to do with your own life. If you are stressed out, stop taking it out here. It's not right. I completely disagree with your statement that for the past year that the validity of the site has been laughable. If you remember, I joined this list a year a half ago. I have learned SO MUCH from this list in the past year a half, and that knowledge has spurred me to do a lot of further research. I am actually able to help others here. I came here so needy and ignorant only to come out more knowledgeable on many aspects of feline care, all because of the loving members of this group. That includes you. No, I didn't prescribe to all the advice given, but took it all in, did my own research, and am still paying it back to new members who came her just like I did. The validity of this group is just as strong as it was six years ago. What you say about a/c's could be true, but you don't know. I don't know. Neither of us have tried one. You can't prove anything intangible exists anyway. What would you say to someone who says you don't love your son because it can't be proven? Indeed, it cannot be proven in a quantitative or tangible way, as no intangibles can. You can't see them, you can't touch them. But nevertheless, your love for your son IS there and it IS true. Same way for faith in God for some of us. So I hope that you will begin to question your own belief that unless you can prove something, it might as well not exist. There is suffering in the world so we can grow. If there were no suffering, there would be no happiness. You cannot know real happiness if you never have struggles and make personal growth. And FYI, prayer is not crap. You have asked for it yourself here. Please, make an effort to hold your tongue. The 24-hour rule always works for me. Write your letter in a word document, save it, and go back and read it in 24 hours. Revise as needed. You might need 48 hours. I did it when writing this post to you. I waited until I slept on it before responding. And my post shows much less anger, and more sense than it would have had I immediately responded. Save your sarcasm for yourself. No one else appreciates it. Dealing with sick animals is hard enough without you making everyone feel badly. I felt like you once, over ten years ago, making everyone around me feel bad because I felt bad inside. I got help with a great counselor for a year. Worked through a lot of childhood issues. Some adult issues. I've been a new woman ever since. Stronger, more secure, and most importantly, happier with who I am. I'll never regret my decision to get help. I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy to feel like I did before I got help. And I certainly don't wish it on you or anyone else on this list. I truly hope, and will pray, that you find some way to deal with these issues in your personal life that keep plaguing you. Life has so much to offer us. Sincerely, Wendy Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~ Get your own web address. Have a HUGE year through Yahoo! Small Business. http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.8.13/843 - Release Date: 6/10/2007 1:39 PM -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.8.13/843 - Release Date: 6/10/2007 1:39 PM
Re: OT - trimming nails/polydactyls
I have a polydactyl cat (Siamese mix) who has one extra toe on each foot. The two nails on those two extra toes on the front paws grow towards the underside of her paw, not outwardly like a normal cat's claws. They eventually grow INTO the padding of LuLu's paws if I do not clip them about 2-4 times per year. So yes, claws can be ingrown in a feline. And yes, it is a must that I trim them. It's impossible for her to use a scratching post for these two nails. Trimming nails is just fine to me, as long as it's done right. If you're into the all-natural, no interferance type of living, then you can't be for pts. :) Wendy Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~ Get the free Yahoo! toolbar and rest assured with the added security of spyware protection. http://new.toolbar.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/norton/index.php
Re: Charity (Crossed The Bridge)
Patti,
I'm so sorry you lost your sweet Charity. It sounds
like she is loved deeply. I hope that you've found a
little peace now that it's Monday and you've probably
found a solution to her burial needs. I am so sorry
things didn't go smoothly for either of you. Take
care of yourself and treat yourself to that slice of
cheesecake or a hot bath or whatever brings a smile to
your face. Charity would like that.
:)
Wendy
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I don't know just how I can even write this, but
my Charity DID
cross.. I can only pray it was peaceful..
But, w/ her pitiful crying, I know
she was in pain.
And, someone [sorry, memory is shot] mentioned
getting a cab But,
since I moved, my [wonderful] vet is in Md., I'm
in a small town in Pa. With
NO cab service...
It all happened so [too] fast, I am in shock,
besides myself.. Don't
know what to do...
And, trust me, I DID try contacting many
people...As far as house
calls, well, no one was available. They all said
Wait 'til Monday..Yeah,
sure. I deep down inside, knew Monday would be
too late BUT, I DID
pray for a miracle.. Didn't want to give
up...
I can only be glad that she finally had a home
knew she was very much
loved..{Lot of solace that brings me now]
And, it's Saturday, HOT I want to have her
cremated vet's not in til
Moday.And, I also don't have a trunk freezer for
her remains.. Can't get
any worse...
And, being up w/ her the whole time, I'm just too
devastated to even try
to get some rest..
Thank you ALL for your prayers suggestions.[This
list has the BEST people.
so caring. understanding.The MAIN reason I never
left after losing my
Ethan]
I did write Belinda for the CLS separately
Have to go. With my vision problems with all
these tears, I can't see
at all now..
Much love, with tears,
Patti her [remaining] gang
** See what's
free at http://www.aol.com.
Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the
world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~
Need a vacation? Get great deals
to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.
http://travel.yahoo.com/
RE: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please just deletewithout reading.
Wendy, thank you so much for your reasoned and graceful response. Do I believe in animal communicators? I'm not sure. Do I think that there are people who can communicate with animals on a deeper level? Yes. Do I believe it's something that might be worth a try under some circumstances? Absolutely. It's not like the AC has to put electrodes in the animal's brain, or in some cases even lay hands on them or be anywhere near them. What's the harm? I realize there's a huge potential for scam here, but I also know that many ACs don't charge for their services. When I was volunteering at a Katrina pets shelter, an AC was called in and her impressions posted on the animals' cages. Some of them were general enough to be generic -- doesn't understand why she's locked up, wants to go home -- but some were heartbreakingly specific -- remembers being hurt, can't remember ever playing -- and these were enough to make me believe that there *can* be something to it. Also, the wonderful listmommy of the ferals list believes absolutely that we can communicate, and always says things like tell her her story, she loves to hear it because even if there's a language barrier, our tone and body language are as plain for our animals to read as theirs is for us to read. One of my best friends is in England now, and her 11-year-old stripey boy, Spike, will be joining her sometime next month. I'm helping his aunt he's been staying with get him into the carrier for his last vet visit just before he goes, and you can bet I will be talking to him about how he might have a scary day on the plane (it's an animal transport flight, he will be in the main cabin with other pets) but when it's over he'll be with his mom again. And on the day he flies, will I be vibing with all my might that he gets there okay and isn't too scared? God, yes. Since joining various cat groups, I've sort of come to believe in vibes -- whether they're called vibes, or Kitty Cones of Power, or prayer, or meditation. Again, I'm not remotely sure they work, but there's more to us than science knows about yet, our brains have powers we can't even begin to tap, and if shooting a few seconds of positive energy, or visualizing a light around a sick kitty, or whatever, might possibly make a difference, why wouldn't I just do it. Hell, I even vibe at roadkill, just telling them I'm sorry they died because of one of us. Do I believe that there's REALLY a place called the Rainbow Bridge where pets go to wait for us? I really want to. It's a sweet, tangible and comforting image, and if there's a Heaven, how could it be as great as everybody says if there aren't joyous reunions with everybody we've loved? Rainbow Bridge is as plausible as a lot of other stuff we are told but have no proof of. And again, what's the harm? Phaewryn, I'm sorry you're in such a bad place right now that you feel the need to be hurtful. You are free not to believe in any of this, and even to think that those of us who do or who are at least open to it are fools, but nobody here is using vibes, AC, meditations or the like instead of sound veterinary care. Sometimes somekitty just needs that little extra thing to turn a corner, or to be found when lost, or to be less stressed, and I figure there is no harm in seeking help from an undefinable power, be it God or Gaia or the universe or the human mind's will. Diane R. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of wendy Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 2:25 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please just deletewithout reading. Phaewryn, This is the 3rd time in a year that you have gone off on other members inappropriately and then claimed to be leaving. I think you need to stop. It is not right or fair to insult other people and then stick your neck in the sand. No one here agrees 100% with any other member on this site. When this happens, either we respectfully disagree, or we just don't say anything. There is no reason to go on a mission to destroy. It is so clear that when you do this, there's much more underlying your verbal spews that has nothing to do with this group and everything to do with your own life. If you are stressed out, stop taking it out here. It's not right. I completely disagree with your statement that for the past year that the validity of the site has been laughable. If you remember, I joined this list a year a half ago. I have learned SO MUCH from this list in the past year a half, and that knowledge has spurred me to do a lot of further research. I am actually able to help others here. I came here so needy and ignorant only to come out more knowledgeable on many aspects of feline care, all because of the loving members of this group. That includes you. No, I didn't prescribe to all the advice given, but took it all in, did my own research, and am still paying it back to new members who came
Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned.
The home cooked meals may be your answer. The Primal is so ground up I haven't found a bone...just very dense cubes. Google Primal and other raw (BARF) sites. Dixie just happens to like this one big time. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Beth Noren To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 10:54 AM Subject: Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned. Do you know if the raw diets can be cooked, or does that destroy the vitamins and taurine and stuff? Or does it make the ground up bone chips too brittle and dangerous? I have a link from someone for mail-order supplements that can be added to home-cooked meals, may go that route... Thank you, Beth On 6/11/07, Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you get into the raw diets: Primal runs about $16 for 4 pounds. It comes in little ounce cubes that you thaw and, given how concentrated it is, is as cheap or cheaper than some otc canned foods..FF is about 70 cants a can here (3 ounces). Don't panic yet. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Beth Noren To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 12:13 AM Subject: Re: OT - Phelix...and lessons learned. Hi Marylyn, Thank you so much for your suggestions, I really appreciate your kindness. I haven't tried an alternative vet yet, but do know of a good one not too far away. I've got a couple more food trials to do, and then I think we'll see what the holistic vet has to say. I know someone said before that Hill's Z/D did the trick for them. I want to try it, but am afraid of Hill's since the tainted food nightmare. Mine were all on Hill's D/D in February, and I had piles of throw-up everywhere. The D/D was never recalled, but now I don't totally trust Hill's. They did eat the recalled Natural Balance Venison Green Pea in January, with no noticeable ill effect (or improvement in his itching). The itching first started around Christmas, and it's all up on his head, so I don't think it's flea allergies, but maybe. I did just start them back on Revolution (thank you again for the help with that Kelley S. and MC!) so we'll see. These darn food trials just take s long. And I'm afraid the ultimate answer is going to be home-cooking mail-order rabbit or some such for five kitties. Yikes! I'll post if (when! positive thinking) I find something that works. Funny, other than two fevers early on, my FeLv kitty has been the healthiest one of the bunch. Way more worries and vet bills (allergies, broken bone, ear infection, tumorish-looking fat deposit) for the virus-free bunch. Ya never know... Thank you again for your help, Beth On 6/10/07, Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you tried a holistic/alternative vet? Or AC's? You would be surprised what a cat will tell an AC it trusts. There are volunteer groups (they tell me) on the internet. Dixie has been able to tell me that she was spayed and certainly didn't need spaying again, even if the vets couldn't find the scar (hormone tests proved her right), when she has a flea (even one or two causes hot spots), if she needed to go to the vet after the pet food scar (long story) etc. I've been off computer and really don't know what all you have tried but I know of two avs that are great. For some reason I have to believe you need to try Just Born or some other colostrum containing supplement for your little friend. That may help and I can't believe that mother's milk would hurt. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Beth Noren To:
Re: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please justdeletewithout reading.
Regarding Spike: Please spray his blankets/carrier (whatever) with Feliway and put Rescue Remedy in his mouth. It really should help. RR is used in the dog show circuit a lot. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Rosenfeldt, Diane [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 3:48 PM Subject: RE: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please justdeletewithout reading. Wendy, thank you so much for your reasoned and graceful response. Do I believe in animal communicators? I'm not sure. Do I think that there are people who can communicate with animals on a deeper level? Yes. Do I believe it's something that might be worth a try under some circumstances? Absolutely. It's not like the AC has to put electrodes in the animal's brain, or in some cases even lay hands on them or be anywhere near them. What's the harm? I realize there's a huge potential for scam here, but I also know that many ACs don't charge for their services. When I was volunteering at a Katrina pets shelter, an AC was called in and her impressions posted on the animals' cages. Some of them were general enough to be generic -- doesn't understand why she's locked up, wants to go home -- but some were heartbreakingly specific -- remembers being hurt, can't remember ever playing -- and these were enough to make me believe that there *can* be something to it. Also, the wonderful listmommy of the ferals list believes absolutely that we can communicate, and always says things like tell her her story, she loves to hear it because even if there's a language barrier, our tone and body language are as plain for our animals to read as theirs is for us to read. One of my best friends is in England now, and her 11-year-old stripey boy, Spike, will be joining her sometime next month. I'm helping his aunt he's been staying with get him into the carrier for his last vet visit just before he goes, and you can bet I will be talking to him about how he might have a scary day on the plane (it's an animal transport flight, he will be in the main cabin with other pets) but when it's over he'll be with his mom again. And on the day he flies, will I be vibing with all my might that he gets there okay and isn't too scared? God, yes. Since joining various cat groups, I've sort of come to believe in vibes -- whether they're called vibes, or Kitty Cones of Power, or prayer, or meditation. Again, I'm not remotely sure they work, but there's more to us than science knows about yet, our brains have powers we can't even begin to tap, and if shooting a few seconds of positive energy, or visualizing a light around a sick kitty, or whatever, might possibly make a difference, why wouldn't I just do it. Hell, I even vibe at roadkill, just telling them I'm sorry they died because of one of us. Do I believe that there's REALLY a place called the Rainbow Bridge where pets go to wait for us? I really want to. It's a sweet, tangible and comforting image, and if there's a Heaven, how could it be as great as everybody says if there aren't joyous reunions with everybody we've loved? Rainbow Bridge is as plausible as a lot of other stuff we are told but have no proof of. And again, what's the harm? Phaewryn, I'm sorry you're in such a bad place right now that you feel the need to be hurtful. You are free not to believe in any of this, and even to think that those of us who do or who are at least open to it are fools, but nobody here is using vibes, AC, meditations or the like instead of sound veterinary care. Sometimes somekitty just needs that little extra thing to turn a corner, or to be found when lost, or to be less stressed, and I figure there is no harm in seeking help from an undefinable power, be it God or Gaia or the universe or the human mind's will. Diane R. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of wendy Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 2:25 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please just deletewithout reading. Phaewryn, This is the 3rd time in a year that you have gone off on other members inappropriately and then claimed to be leaving. I think you need to stop. It is not right or fair to insult other people and then stick your neck in the sand. No one here agrees 100% with any other member on this site. When this happens, either we respectfully disagree, or we just don't say anything. There is no reason to go on a mission to destroy. It is so clear that when you do this, there's much more underlying your verbal
RE: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - pleasejustdeletewithout reading.
Thanks! There are already plans to lay the Feliway on, but I don't think anyone is allowed to give him anything by mouth before the trip -- certainly not mood meds and possibly not even RR. I'll have his mommy double-check on that, though. Diane R. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marylyn Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 3:58 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - pleasejustdeletewithout reading. Regarding Spike: Please spray his blankets/carrier (whatever) with Feliway and put Rescue Remedy in his mouth. It really should help. RR is used in the dog show circuit a lot. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Rosenfeldt, Diane [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 3:48 PM Subject: RE: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please justdeletewithout reading. Wendy, thank you so much for your reasoned and graceful response. Do I believe in animal communicators? I'm not sure. Do I think that there are people who can communicate with animals on a deeper level? Yes. Do I believe it's something that might be worth a try under some circumstances? Absolutely. It's not like the AC has to put electrodes in the animal's brain, or in some cases even lay hands on them or be anywhere near them. What's the harm? I realize there's a huge potential for scam here, but I also know that many ACs don't charge for their services. When I was volunteering at a Katrina pets shelter, an AC was called in and her impressions posted on the animals' cages. Some of them were general enough to be generic -- doesn't understand why she's locked up, wants to go home -- but some were heartbreakingly specific -- remembers being hurt, can't remember ever playing -- and these were enough to make me believe that there *can* be something to it. Also, the wonderful listmommy of the ferals list believes absolutely that we can communicate, and always says things like tell her her story, she loves to hear it because even if there's a language barrier, our tone and body language are as plain for our animals to read as theirs is for us to read. One of my best friends is in England now, and her 11-year-old stripey boy, Spike, will be joining her sometime next month. I'm helping his aunt he's been staying with get him into the carrier for his last vet visit just before he goes, and you can bet I will be talking to him about how he might have a scary day on the plane (it's an animal transport flight, he will be in the main cabin with other pets) but when it's over he'll be with his mom again. And on the day he flies, will I be vibing with all my might that he gets there okay and isn't too scared? God, yes. Since joining various cat groups, I've sort of come to believe in vibes -- whether they're called vibes, or Kitty Cones of Power, or prayer, or meditation. Again, I'm not remotely sure they work, but there's more to us than science knows about yet, our brains have powers we can't even begin to tap, and if shooting a few seconds of positive energy, or visualizing a light around a sick kitty, or whatever, might possibly make a difference, why wouldn't I just do it. Hell, I even vibe at roadkill, just telling them I'm sorry they died because of one of us. Do I believe that there's REALLY a place called the Rainbow Bridge where pets go to wait for us? I really want to. It's a sweet, tangible and comforting image, and if there's a Heaven, how could it be as great as everybody says if there aren't joyous reunions with everybody we've loved? Rainbow Bridge is as plausible as a lot of other stuff we are told but have no proof of. And again, what's the harm? Phaewryn, I'm sorry you're in such a bad place right now that you feel the need to be hurtful. You are free not to believe in any of this, and even to think that those of us who do or who are at least open to it are fools, but nobody here is using vibes, AC, meditations or the like instead of sound veterinary care. Sometimes somekitty just needs that little extra thing to turn a corner, or to be found when lost, or to be less stressed, and I figure there is no harm in seeking help from an undefinable power, be it God or Gaia or the universe or the human mind's will. Diane R. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of wendy Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 2:25 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please just deletewithout reading. Phaewryn,
Re: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication -pleasejustdeletewithout reading.
Then she may want to check on the spray RR. I understand them not wanting anything in his stomach but RR drops??? However, rules are rules. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Rosenfeldt, Diane [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 4:04 PM Subject: RE: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication -pleasejustdeletewithout reading. Thanks! There are already plans to lay the Feliway on, but I don't think anyone is allowed to give him anything by mouth before the trip -- certainly not mood meds and possibly not even RR. I'll have his mommy double-check on that, though. Diane R. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marylyn Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 3:58 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - pleasejustdeletewithout reading. Regarding Spike: Please spray his blankets/carrier (whatever) with Feliway and put Rescue Remedy in his mouth. It really should help. RR is used in the dog show circuit a lot. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Rosenfeldt, Diane [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 3:48 PM Subject: RE: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please justdeletewithout reading. Wendy, thank you so much for your reasoned and graceful response. Do I believe in animal communicators? I'm not sure. Do I think that there are people who can communicate with animals on a deeper level? Yes. Do I believe it's something that might be worth a try under some circumstances? Absolutely. It's not like the AC has to put electrodes in the animal's brain, or in some cases even lay hands on them or be anywhere near them. What's the harm? I realize there's a huge potential for scam here, but I also know that many ACs don't charge for their services. When I was volunteering at a Katrina pets shelter, an AC was called in and her impressions posted on the animals' cages. Some of them were general enough to be generic -- doesn't understand why she's locked up, wants to go home -- but some were heartbreakingly specific -- remembers being hurt, can't remember ever playing -- and these were enough to make me believe that there *can* be something to it. Also, the wonderful listmommy of the ferals list believes absolutely that we can communicate, and always says things like tell her her story, she loves to hear it because even if there's a language barrier, our tone and body language are as plain for our animals to read as theirs is for us to read. One of my best friends is in England now, and her 11-year-old stripey boy, Spike, will be joining her sometime next month. I'm helping his aunt he's been staying with get him into the carrier for his last vet visit just before he goes, and you can bet I will be talking to him about how he might have a scary day on the plane (it's an animal transport flight, he will be in the main cabin with other pets) but when it's over he'll be with his mom again. And on the day he flies, will I be vibing with all my might that he gets there okay and isn't too scared? God, yes. Since joining various cat groups, I've sort of come to believe in vibes -- whether they're called vibes, or Kitty Cones of Power, or prayer, or meditation. Again, I'm not remotely sure they work, but there's more to us than science knows about yet, our brains have powers we can't even begin to tap, and if shooting a few seconds of positive energy, or visualizing a light around a sick kitty, or whatever, might possibly make a difference, why wouldn't I just do it. Hell, I even vibe at roadkill, just telling them I'm sorry they died because of one of us. Do I believe that there's REALLY a place called the Rainbow Bridge where pets go to wait for us? I really want to. It's a sweet, tangible and comforting image, and if there's a Heaven, how could it be as great as everybody says if there aren't joyous reunions with everybody we've loved? Rainbow Bridge is as plausible as a lot of other stuff we are told but have no proof of. And again, what's the harm? Phaewryn, I'm sorry you're in such a bad place right now that you feel the need to be
RE: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication-pleasejustdeletewithout reading.
Yes, and the rules are so very picky, we wouldn't want to do anything to jeopardize his going on schedule. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marylyn Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 4:20 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication-pleasejustdeletewithout reading. Then she may want to check on the spray RR. I understand them not wanting anything in his stomach but RR drops??? However, rules are rules. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Rosenfeldt, Diane [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 4:04 PM Subject: RE: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication -pleasejustdeletewithout reading. Thanks! There are already plans to lay the Feliway on, but I don't think anyone is allowed to give him anything by mouth before the trip -- certainly not mood meds and possibly not even RR. I'll have his mommy double-check on that, though. Diane R. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marylyn Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 3:58 PM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: Re: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - pleasejustdeletewithout reading. Regarding Spike: Please spray his blankets/carrier (whatever) with Feliway and put Rescue Remedy in his mouth. It really should help. RR is used in the dog show circuit a lot. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Rosenfeldt, Diane [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 3:48 PM Subject: RE: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please justdeletewithout reading. Wendy, thank you so much for your reasoned and graceful response. Do I believe in animal communicators? I'm not sure. Do I think that there are people who can communicate with animals on a deeper level? Yes. Do I believe it's something that might be worth a try under some circumstances? Absolutely. It's not like the AC has to put electrodes in the animal's brain, or in some cases even lay hands on them or be anywhere near them. What's the harm? I realize there's a huge potential for scam here, but I also know that many ACs don't charge for their services. When I was volunteering at a Katrina pets shelter, an AC was called in and her impressions posted on the animals' cages. Some of them were general enough to be generic -- doesn't understand why she's locked up, wants to go home -- but some were heartbreakingly specific -- remembers being hurt, can't remember ever playing -- and these were enough to make me believe that there *can* be something to it. Also, the wonderful listmommy of the ferals list believes absolutely that we can communicate, and always says things like tell her her story, she loves to hear it because even if there's a language barrier, our tone and body language are as plain for our animals to read as theirs is for us to read. One of my best friends is in England now, and her 11-year-old stripey boy, Spike, will be joining her sometime next month. I'm helping his aunt he's been staying with get him into the carrier for his last vet visit just before he goes, and you can bet I will be talking to him about how he might have a scary day on the plane (it's an animal transport flight, he will be in the main cabin with other pets) but when it's over he'll be with his mom again. And on the day he flies, will I be vibing with all my might that he gets there okay and isn't too scared? God, yes. Since joining various cat groups, I've sort of come to believe in vibes -- whether they're called vibes, or Kitty Cones of Power, or prayer, or meditation. Again, I'm not remotely sure they work, but there's more to us than science knows about yet, our brains have powers we can't even begin to tap, and if shooting a few seconds of positive energy, or visualizing a light around a sick kitty, or whatever, might possibly make a difference, why wouldn't I just do it. Hell, I even vibe at roadkill, just telling them I'm sorry they died because of one of us. Do I believe that there's REALLY a place called the Rainbow Bridge where pets go to wait for us? I really want to. It's a
Re: OT - animal communication - Religious Stuff
There are those on the board that have no interest in this so I will send this email and ask that you contact me off the board if I can provide additional informtion. Please remember that, under the Christian and Jewish traditions, man was kicked out of paradise, not the animals. Try these links: http://www.dogshavesouls.com/scripture.html www.saintfrancisfoundation.com And search www.Amazon.com for information on animals and heaven and communications A particular favorite: Numbers 22:27 And when the ass (donkey) saw the angel of the Lord, she fell down under Balaam: and Balaam's anger was kindled, and he smote the ass with a staff. 28 And the Lord opened the mouth of the ass, and she said unto Balaam, What have I done unto thee, that thou hast smitten me these three times? ROMANS 8:19-21 the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God, because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. (KJV). LUKE 3:6 And all flesh shall see the salvation of God.' (NKJ) ACTS 3:21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began. (KJV) REV. 21:5 And He that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And He said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful. (KJV) ECCLESIASTES 3:18 I said in my heart, Concerning the condition of the sons of men, God tests them, that they may see that they themselves are like animals. (NKJ) ECCLESIASTES 3:19-20 Man's fate is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath, man has no advantage over the animal. Everything is meaningless. All go to the same place; all come from dust and to dust all return. (NIV) LUKE 3:6 all flesh shall see the salvation of God. (KJV) PSALM 36:6 Your righteousness is like the mighty mountains, your judgments are like the great deep; you save humans and animals alike, O LORD. (NRS) GENESIS 1:30 and to every animal of the earth, and to every fowl of the heavens, and to everything that creepeth on the earth, in which is a living soul, every green herb for food. And it was so. (DBY If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Pam Norman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 8:59 AM Subject: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. That scripture is lovely. If you have more, I'd like to see them. Pam Marylyn wrote: Just so there is no misunderstanding, animal communications is practiced by Christians as well as people of other beliefs and the Bible speaks of interspecies communications. Below is one of my favorite scriptures. JOB 12:7-10 You have only to ask the cattle, for them to instruct you, and the birds of the sky, for them to inform you. The creeping things of earth will give you lessons, and the fish of the sea provide you an explanation: there is not one such creature but will know that the hand of God has arranged things like this! In his hand is the soul of every living thing and the breath of every human being! There are a lot more but I'm not into preaching. Just clarifying that AC is recognized by numerous religions, agnostics and atheists. As some friends say, take what works for you and leave the rest. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: dede hicken [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 5:03 PM Subject: RE: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. Wow!! Now THAT was a vent!!! That said i agree with Debbie, but there is something more important at stake here. I personally have found this list to be one of the most caring ones around. You guys were supportive of me during our move, and even offered suggestions. Not one other list was as helpful. No, it didn't have much to do with FeLV (although Ki was the ONLY one who scared the crap out of me during that ordeal. He is doing well, anyway...) but I needed support. I have a CRF kitty, one with FIV and
To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please just
Hi guys, Too bad that when I pop my head back in the door, I see strife! For those of you who don't know me, I'm the one that had the two cat carjacked last fall. I'm also pretty straightlaced when it comes to the spiritual world - or at least across the board dubious - but dear Hideyo piped in about a visualization and Nina wrote about feeling connections and everyone that wrote about support and love and thoughts...well it helped 100%. More. And for those of you who don't know, my sweet Satchmo and Beatrix were found within 48 hours. Yes, it's impossible to run the experiment again and not to use visualization and positive thought to see if they could have been found anyway, but even if just in my frenzied head and heart, it helped immensely. Anyway, can someone please forward Wendy's message to Phaewryn's personal email? As she ducks out after releasing her thoughts, I don't know if she really understands the hurtful aftermath. I don't have any of her contact information, but I think that it would be a good idea. Thanks, here's hoping the sun is shining again the next time I unearth myself. ;) Leslie ps Bea and Satch are doing GREAT and keeping their paws full with the new canine addition to the family, Charlotte. From: wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. Phaewryn, This is the 3rd time in a year that you have gone off on other members inappropriately and then claimed to be leaving. I think you need to stop. It is not right or fair to insult other people and then stick your neck in the sand. No one here agrees 100% with any other member on this site. When this happens, either we respectfully disagree, or we just don't say anything. There is no reason to go on a mission to destroy. It is so clear that when you do this, there's much more underlying your verbal spews that has nothing to do with this group and everything to do with your own life. If you are stressed out, stop taking it out here. It's not right. I completely disagree with your statement that for the past year that the validity of the site has been laughable. If you remember, I joined this list a year a half ago. I have learned SO MUCH from this list in the past year a half, and that knowledge has spurred me to do a lot of further research. I am actually able to help others here. I came here so needy and ignorant only to come out more knowledgeable on many aspects of feline care, all because of the loving members of this group. That includes you. No, I didn't prescribe to all the advice given, but took it all in, did my own research, and am still paying it back to new members who came her just like I did. The validity of this group is just as strong as it was six years ago. What you say about a/c's could be true, but you don't know. I don't know. Neither of us have tried one. You can't prove anything intangible exists anyway. What would you say to someone who says you don't love your son because it can't be proven? Indeed, it cannot be proven in a quantitative or tangible way, as no intangibles can. You can't see them, you can't touch them. But nevertheless, your love for your son IS there and it IS true. Same way for faith in God for some of us. So I hope that you will begin to question your own belief that unless you can prove something, it might as well not exist. There is suffering in the world so we can grow. If there were no suffering, there would be no happiness. You cannot know real happiness if you never have struggles and make personal growth. And FYI, prayer is not crap. You have asked for it yourself here. Please, make an effort to hold your tongue. The 24-hour rule always works for me. Write your letter in a word document, save it, and go back and read it in 24 hours. Revise as needed. You might need 48 hours. I did it when writing this post to you. I waited until I slept on it before responding. And my post shows much less anger, and more sense than it would have had I immediately responded. Save your sarcasm for yourself. No one else appreciates it. Dealing with sick animals is hard enough without you making everyone feel badly. I felt like you once, over ten years ago, making everyone around me feel bad because I felt bad inside. I got help with a great counselor for a year. Worked through a lot of childhood issues. Some adult issues. I've been a new woman ever since. Stronger, more secure, and most importantly, happier with who I am. I'll never regret my decision to get help. I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy to feel like I did before I got help. And I certainly don't wish it on you or anyone else on this list. I truly hope, and will pray, that you find some way to deal with these issues in your personal life that keep plaguing you. Life has so much to offer us. Sincerely, Wendy Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the world - indeed it
Re: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please just
At 02:46 PM 6/11/2007, you wrote: If you noticed I just mentioned you and have been wonderingIt was my miracle story of last year, and regardless..for me it was the group getting together and doing something. Hugs to the babies and glad you are still here. Kelly ( we spoke on the phone) www.kellyscats.zoomshare.com Hi guys, Too bad that when I pop my head back in the door, I see strife! For those of you who don't know me, I'm the one that had the two cat carjacked last fall. I'm also pretty straightlaced when it comes to the spiritual world - or at least across the board dubious - but dear Hideyo piped in about a visualization and Nina wrote about feeling connections and everyone that wrote about support and love and thoughts...well it helped 100%. More. And for those of you who don't know, my sweet Satchmo and Beatrix were found within 48 hours. Yes, it's impossible to run the experiment again and not to use visualization and positive thought to see if they could have been found anyway, but even if just in my frenzied head and heart, it helped immensely. Anyway, can someone please forward Wendy's message to Phaewryn's personal email? As she ducks out after releasing her thoughts, I don't know if she really understands the hurtful aftermath. I don't have any of her contact information, but I think that it would be a good idea. Thanks, here's hoping the sun is shining again the next time I unearth myself. ;) Leslie ps Bea and Satch are doing GREAT and keeping their paws full with the new canine addition to the family, Charlotte. From: wendy mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: To Phaewryn: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. Phaewryn, This is the 3rd time in a year that you have gone off on other members inappropriately and then claimed to be leaving. I think you need to stop. It is not right or fair to insult other people and then stick your neck in the sand. No one here agrees 100% with any other member on this site. When this happens, either we respectfully disagree, or we just don't say anything. There is no reason to go on a mission to destroy. It is so clear that when you do this, there's much more underlying your verbal spews that has nothing to do with this group and everything to do with your own life. If you are stressed out, stop taking it out here. It's not right. I completely disagree with your statement that for the past year that the validity of the site has been laughable. If you remember, I joined this list a year a half ago. I have learned SO MUCH from this list in the past year a half, and that knowledge has spurred me to do a lot of further research. I am actually able to help others here. I came here so needy and ignorant only to come out more knowledgeable on many aspects of feline care, all because of the loving members of this group. That includes you. No, I didn't prescribe to all the advice given, but took it all in, did my own research, and am still paying it back to new members who came her just like I did. The validity of this group is just as strong as it was six years ago. What you say about a/c's could be true, but you don't know. I don't know. Neither of us have tried one. You can't prove anything intangible exists anyway. What would you say to someone who says you don't love your son because it can't be proven? Indeed, it cannot be proven in a quantitative or tangible way, as no intangibles can. You can't see them, you can't touch them. But nevertheless, your love for your son IS there and it IS true. Same way for faith in God for some of us. So I hope that you will begin to question your own belief that unless you can prove something, it might as well not exist. There is suffering in the world so we can grow. If there were no suffering, there would be no happiness. You cannot know real happiness if you never have struggles and make personal growth. And FYI, prayer is not crap. You have asked for it yourself here. Please, make an effort to hold your tongue. The 24-hour rule always works for me. Write your letter in a word document, save it, and go back and read it in 24 hours. Revise as needed. You might need 48 hours. I did it when writing this post to you. I waited until I slept on it before responding. And my post shows much less anger, and more sense than it would have had I immediately responded. Save your sarcasm for yourself. No one else appreciates it. Dealing with sick animals is hard enough without you making everyone feel badly. I felt like you once, over ten years ago, making everyone around me feel bad because I felt bad inside. I got help with a great counselor for a year. Worked through a lot of childhood issues. Some adult issues. I've been a new woman ever since. Stronger, more secure, and most importantly, happier with who I am. I'll never regret my decision to get help. I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy to
raw diet
I feed my dogs, and have fed my former cats a raw diet. I follow both Dr Richard Pitcairn and Dr Ian Billinghurst's species appropriate concepts and recipes. Both my dogs and cats have thrived on it. Both the vets I use (allopathic and homeopathic) think that if I can wean MeMe from crack to a raw diet, it would help her immune system. I have not been able to, although I keep trying. Anyone who is interested in raw feeding might read: Dr. Ian Billinghurst ; The BARF Diet Dr. Richard Pitcairn ; Natural Health for Dogs and Cats Also, there is a Yahoo group called Raw Paws which is primarily for cats. There are a great many people knowledgeable in feline nutrition, although no one there has real experience with FeLV positive cats. Jane
Re: OT - animal communication - Religious Stuff
Thank you, Pam Marylyn wrote: There are those on the board that have no interest in this so I will send this email and ask that you contact me off the board if I can provide additional informtion. Please remember that, under the Christian and Jewish traditions, man was kicked out of paradise, not the animals. Try these links: http://www.dogshavesouls.com/scripture.html www.saintfrancisfoundation.com And search www.Amazon.com for information on animals and heaven and communications A particular favorite: Numbers 22:27 And when the ass (donkey) saw the angel of the Lord, she fell down under Balaam: and Balaam's anger was kindled, and he smote the ass with a staff. 28 And the Lord opened the mouth of the ass, and she said unto Balaam, What have I done unto thee, that thou hast smitten me these three times? ROMANS 8:19-21 the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God, because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. (KJV). LUKE 3:6 And all flesh shall see the salvation of God.' (NKJ) ACTS 3:21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began. (KJV) REV. 21:5 And He that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And He said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful. (KJV) ECCLESIASTES 3:18 I said in my heart, Concerning the condition of the sons of men, God tests them, that they may see that they themselves are like animals. (NKJ) ECCLESIASTES 3:19-20 Man's fate is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath, man has no advantage over the animal. Everything is meaningless. All go to the same place; all come from dust and to dust all return. (NIV) LUKE 3:6 all flesh shall see the salvation of God. (KJV) PSALM 36:6 Your righteousness is like the mighty mountains, your judgments are like the great deep; you save humans and animals alike, O LORD. (NRS) GENESIS 1:30 and to every animal of the earth, and to every fowl of the heavens, and to everything that creepeth on the earth, in which is a living soul, every green herb for food. And it was so. (DBY If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Pam Norman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 8:59 AM Subject: Re: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. That scripture is lovely. If you have more, I'd like to see them. Pam Marylyn wrote: Just so there is no misunderstanding, animal communications is practiced by Christians as well as people of other beliefs and the Bible speaks of interspecies communications. Below is one of my favorite scriptures. JOB 12:7-10 You have only to ask the cattle, for them to instruct you, and the birds of the sky, for them to inform you. The creeping things of earth will give you lessons, and the fish of the sea provide you an explanation: there is not one such creature but will know that the hand of God has arranged things like this! In his hand is the soul of every living thing and the breath of every human being! There are a lot more but I'm not into preaching. Just clarifying that AC is recognized by numerous religions, agnostics and atheists. As some friends say, take what works for you and leave the rest. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: dede hicken [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 5:03 PM Subject: RE: OT - animal communication - please just delete without reading. Wow!! Now THAT was a vent!!! That said i agree with Debbie, but there is something more important at stake here. I personally have found this list to be one of the most caring ones around. You guys were supportive of me during our move, and even offered suggestions. Not one other list was as helpful. No, it didn't have much to do with FeLV (although Ki was the ONLY one who scared the crap out of me during that ordeal. He is doing well, anyway...) but I needed support. I
Re: raw diet
Will MeMe eat raw if there is nothing else to eat? Or if you mix a small amount of food with or put it on top of the raw? The addition of high vitamin veggies to Dixie's diet has helped a lot. I know I am repeating myself but she is eating Primal raw + spinach, carrots, broccoli (and now--maybe--green beans) + Just Born/Fast Track/Transfer Factor Feline Complete (not all in the same day but depending on the circumstances and instincts). She gets some Wellness or Markwell canned (when we are traveling/she needs a snack and I have nothing thawed/as a special reward because she wants it). I know most BARF experts don't recommend the veggies but Dixie loves them and my alternative vet's cat loves greens (she hasn't tried the carrots yet). Both cats like Barley Cat too. She had some pretty serious gum issues when she first came to live with me. They no longer exist and both the regular vet and the alternative vet are amazed. My two cents.a lot of which is repeat. If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis - Original Message - From: Jane Lyons To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Monday, June 11, 2007 4:59 PM Subject: raw diet I feed my dogs, and have fed my former cats a raw diet. I follow both Dr Richard Pitcairn and Dr Ian Billinghurst's species appropriate concepts and recipes. Both my dogs and cats have thrived on it. Both the vets I use (allopathic and homeopathic) think that if I can wean MeMe from crack to a raw diet, it would help her immune system. I have not been able to, although I keep trying. Anyone who is interested in raw feeding might read: Dr. Ian Billinghurst ; The BARF Diet Dr. Richard Pitcairn ; Natural Health for Dogs and Cats Also, there is a Yahoo group called Raw Paws which is primarily for cats. There are a great many people knowledgeable in feline nutrition, although no one there has real experience with FeLV positive cats. Jane
