Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: "Karen McCarthy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> From: Lori Albrough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Denise - I disagree with the clinician. A 3 y.o. who is doing fine in a full >cheek snaffle doesn't need a twisted wire bit! Use of a twisted-wire bit on a sensitive 3 year old mouth would be a travesty, IMHO. Right On, Lori! Good advice to heed, Denise. Sounds like this clinician is a dandy...wonder what he will prescibe for a horse that does't want to stop from the pain of the twisted wire bit? The "Whoa-Mutha" Special w/ 12" shanks??? Karen, in a much cooler Northern Nevada _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.
Re: I may be carzy... anyone else???
This message is from: "Karen McCarthy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Catherine, you know I would love to share the ride/drive...but work has thrown up a sizeable roadblock lately, 4 new comissions for landscape plans, argggh! I will be thinking of you, and I hope you find a driving buddy soon, you crazy woman! Good luck, Karen _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.
My first fjord
This message is from: Storme Lee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hello all~ I just signed up on this list, so grateful that I came across it. My question is...how do I trim my Fjords mane? It is the most beautiful sight on the planet when I go to the pasture and he comes running up to me. I want to do it properly. The person that I bought him from did it herself and she was by no means a master at it gauging from the pictures that I have seen. Of course I have never seen another Fjord in person. Any hints and suggestions would be wonderful. Any books or articles? thank you. Storme (one who is truly in love with her Fjord)
Re: Fjord Collectable
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Good luck Rondi. Very sorry about your friend, very difficult. Jean Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes & Noble Book Stores
Re: a BIT is a BIT of a BIT
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Lisa, I never put that twisted double wire bit in my horses mouth to "punish" or "mutilate" him. It happened when I could not find the right bit in my collection and the wire was the only one correct size. It worked. I have never had to use it to stop a runaway, never had a runaway. Oh well when I was eighteen the army mount took off with me but I rode it out. So it is not used for control more than any other bit is. Did have to stop letting a friend ride as she stopped my horse by pulling him back with the reins. That is a "no no". Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes & Noble Book Stores
Re: Fjord Collectable
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 09/03/2000 1:36:29 AM !!!First Boot!!!, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: << If not, I guess ya'll have to find a friend in Telemark,Norway, God's country!!! :) >> Well, actually I am leaving for Norway next Thursday. Although my trip over there isn't exactly a "pleasure" trip this time, our cottage is located not too far from Telemark. I have been to Telemark many, many times. I have a dear friend over there that I went to school with that has pancreatic cancer, so I am flying over to be with her for a while. I have a Norwegian Fjord Horse here in California as well as my 20 year old arab and a 16 year old QH. We also have four miniature horses. So I will be signing off for a while. I have enjoyed the list and the information on it. Thanks everybody for sharing so freely of your experiences with the Fjords. Sincerely, Rondi Tyler. Ramona, Ca.
Re: a BIT is a BIT of a BIT
This message is from: "Denise's" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> listers, on bits some more...i disagree with the statement below also. i was talking of the thicker twisted wire bit, maybe three or four wraps, much like jean gayle was speaking of, i think. just enough to get a little texture or bumps to the bit. no way would i use, or do i think anyone should use, the thin wire-like bits. they are much too thin and harsh for a horse's mouth. denise - Original Message - .>there is NO SUCH THING as a non-malicious variety of twisted wire bit. .
bits and bits
This message is from: "Denise's" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> listers, about bits.. i agree that the brain stops the horse and that any bit in the wrong hands can cause a problem. i am happy with the way my three year old handles with his bit. he stops when i ask, has NEVER RUNAWAY and has given me no reason to up the bit, my trainer is too. if he does get excited about something he will easily flex his neck and circle till he calms down. he is no problem. i was just mentioning the clinician and his response because i wondered about the reason to change, if all is well, other than to sell a bit. i wanted the opinion of experienced horse people who work their horses daily and have trained young ones to adults. i train all my horses using john lyons techniques and they have worked very well for me. thanks for all the info. denise
Re: a BIT is a BIT of a BIT
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Good for you, Lisa. You said it all, and expressed my opinion as well as many others', I'm sure. Brigid in CA
Re: smart critters
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Tor was a whole other story. He seemed bored by the whole thing. Again, I feel that he knows what is wanted, he's just not interested. If he has to work for that treat, he'll just leave. Has anyone else run into responses like these? Any comments?" Hi Laurie- My boys are excellent with the clicker. Yep, they definitely tune out if what I'm asking doesn't make sense or is boring. In that case I try something else. Lately I've used the clicker to practice backing up, something they seemed oblivious to with conventional methods. The best I got was a sluggish step, two if I was lucky. With use of the clicker, they are backing like pros (well, almost!), and they also think nothing of a big loud plastic bag hanging off the saddle horn (contains chopped carrots and apples). Sacking out, clicker-style... Brigid in CA
a BIT is a BIT of a BIT
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 00-09-02 11:51:27 EDT, you write: << a second subject i would like to hear more about is BITS. anyone out there with expertese (sp?) on different bits for horses in general and fjords in particular, i would love to hear whys, howcomes and facts on bits. why switch from a snaffle if it is doing the job? why use a kimberwick instead of a snaffle? when should you change? what about twisted wire bits? (not the malicious variety) what about the notion of low palates in fjords? sure would like to know more. >> ** I will defer to Jeans expertise in bits, however, in my humble opinion, ( YEA RIGHT ) there is NO SUCH THING as a non-malicious variety of twisted wire bit. If you need this type of bit to stop your horse, or make it " more responsive " you need to go back to basics, and lighten this horse up. The BRAIN stops the horse, as much recorded by runaways WITH twisted wire, and even barb wire bits, show. Teach verbal and soft hand commands instead of using brutal aids, and you will have a horse that stops for you when *&&^% hits the fan, and you need more than easy cues. Please dont all write and tell me that severe bits are only severe in the hands of someone harsh.that you can ride " soft " with these bits and everyones happy. If thats sowhy need the twisted wire ? My driving horses like alot of contact, and we do not drive with Western loose lines, like in the movies.however, my Liverpool Mullenmouths are used with straight bars, and hooked onto the cheek piece, or top hole, never the " dead mans hole " ( last slot from the bottom. ) All mine stop, so far, < G > and yes, *^%$*& has hit the fan, many times. Been charged by 8 emus while stuck in a bridle path that bordered their yard with a green pair, just hitched together., had equipment break, sending my mare to her knees while facing home on a cool, fresh dayhad a trash truck drop its dumster from around 20 ft up, right in front of my single horse, hitched, been passed by emergency vehicles going code # 3, been chased by dogs, had loose horses charge up and take off bucking, been in parades. sort of like training for HELL while being chased by marching bands, wanna-be cowboys for a day shooting off real enough guns, kids rushing out under your horses hoofs for candy thrown backwards by the entry in front of you, and had to pass, camels, llamas, pot-belly pigs and even an elephant. ( THAT got their attention. No twisted wire, no wrecks. End of lecture. * Except, that maybe a 3 yr old that has been ridden already for a year, and is expected to lope off and canter around with reining dudes for advice, is.too burnt out already to look responsive ? At 3, again in my humble opinion, they should just be starting to learn the basics of riding, not finish work. Sorry, dont get the last part.notion ?? of low pallets ? A few of mine dont have it, most of my Fjords do have very low pallets, compared to my QH's, Paints and other pony breeds. Lisa Pedersen, Cedar City, UTAH * clear, cool, but big thunderheads over Zion.
Rain in Montana
This message is from: "Janne Myrdal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> First of all I AM THRILLED for you guys out west that you had rain in Montana to help out with the horrible fires, take it all would you!! so when it comes our way, THEY ARE EMPTY!!! PLEASE!!! Make sure those clouds dump it all on you, we DO NOT want any more!!! Janne in ND, still wet!!
RE: Fjord Collectable
This message is from: "Janne Myrdal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Yiipee, good for Porsgrund, my home town porcelain factory. Also, there is an artist in Skien, Twin city of Porsgrunn ( modern sp), that has several good prints of fjords, his name is Jan Petter Bratsberg. So far I have found 3 differerent ones. Also beautiful Norwegian wild life. I am looking to find a web site for these. If not, I guess ya'll have to find a friend in Telemark,Norway, God's country!!! :) Janne in soggy, hailed out, miserably wet ND.- supposed to be harvest time. But the fjords love it, keeps the flies away.
Fingerlakes Mystery Colt is ours
This message is from: "whfjords" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > I don't know about any other progeny accomplishments at that show, but at > Fingerlakes, Kevlar was Reserve Grand Champion Stallion [under Flotren]. In > a youngstock halter class of about 9, Erlend kids took 1st [OH Tira, owned > by Phillip and Deborah Juran], 2nd [OH Inga Mai, owned by Susan Moore], and > 4th [Eltan, owned by ?], a grey Hi Peg that's our boy His name is Eitan, little typo on the entry. He's grey and got lots a stripes on his legs. of course He's perfect!!! We also have a sister from Erlend brown dun, Rozlyn. Mom is Rosie by Hostar. She was just to young to go that far away. I think she's smarter and cuter, if that's possible?? Debi in Erie, Pa >
Re: Hostar Filly and Parelli
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have an aversion to Parelli, already discussed. Kind of sorry I brought it up. However, I will not sell any of my horses to anyone using Parelli methods.
Re: Horse age for competition
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Eike Schoen-Petersen) Gail, you made an important point. When I was little, there was no age requirement for competitions and many horses were finished by the time they were 6 or 7 (thats warmbloods in Germany) Now they have put in restrictions and you can't do anything much before the horse is five. For long distance rides they never allowed any horse younger than five. In the slow maturing Fjords it is especially important to give them time to grow and mature so we only start riding them when they are about four years old and also turn them back out for maybe another half year after some basic training. Of course that makes the trained horse more expensive! I guess the message should be: if you or your customers can't afford to wait, stay out of it. My personal conviction: leave the babies alone! Eike Schoen-Petersen Haffwiesenhof Germany
Hostar Filly and Parelli
This message is from: "Cheryl Beillard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Can't decode the message re the filly you have for sale (TTouch trained) vs Parelli .. are these training modes so incompatible or do you have a particular aversion for Parelli, and if so, why?
Re: smart critters
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Do you feed them "free" treats at other time? I think this is the key. Pretty hard to stick to, tho. If they can get "free" treats than they aren't going to want to work for them. Smart horses! Alexandra Kurland has a new video out "The Click that Teaches" "Lesson #1, Getting started with the clicker" which really emphasizes the initial training of teaching them not to mug you for treats. This is where I go wrong..I just seem to have to give them "free" treats! I will have to get down to business one of these days and do it right! Jean in soggy Fairbanks, Alaska, where the sun is trying to peek through after another 1/2 inch rain yesterday! The fjords are getting great training to go through water and swamps! >Questions about clicker training. A while back I tried clicker training with >my two. Got the book, read it, thought it made sense. Got two very different >responses from Copper (QH) and Tor (Fjord). It seemed to make Copper just >plain mad. I think he felt like he was being teased. He knew that he had to >touch the target (a small cone) to get the treat, but he didn't want to. One >time he knocked it out of my hand and then stompted on it, then he came back >with his ears pinned back like "There, I touched the stupid thing, now >gimmee my treat!" I quit trying to do any clicker training with him. We >already work well together and he has very good manners, so this just didn't >seem worth it. >Tor was a whole other story. He seemed bored by the whole thing. Again, >I feel that he knows what is wanted, he's just not interested. If he has to >work for that treat, he'll just leave. Has anyone else run into responses >like these? Any comments? > >Laurie > > > Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska [EMAIL PROTECTED]
smart critters
This message is from: "Laurie Pittman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I do the same thing when my guys get pushy at feeding time. They both know not to crowd me when I'm feeding, but once in a while I have to remind them. Questions about clicker training. A while back I tried clicker training with my two. Got the book, read it, thought it made sense. Got two very different responses from Copper (QH) and Tor (Fjord). It seemed to make Copper just plain mad. I think he felt like he was being teased. He knew that he had to touch the target (a small cone) to get the treat, but he didn't want to. One time he knocked it out of my hand and then stompted on it, then he came back with his ears pinned back like "There, I touched the stupid thing, now gimmee my treat!" I quit trying to do any clicker training with him. We already work well together and he has very good manners, so this just didn't seem worth it. Tor was a whole other story. He seemed bored by the whole thing. Again, I feel that he knows what is wanted, he's just not interested. If he has to work for that treat, he'll just leave. Has anyone else run into responses like these? Any comments? Laurie
Re: impatient stamping
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Once before I mentioned that Gunnar pawed and my mare would swing her head in great agitation if I did not bring the food fast enough. In each case I did the same, stop in my tracks with the food. Gunnar registered the most surprise and seemed to wonder how he made me do that. Their behavior occasionally comes back and I simply stop again and it goes away. Smart critters Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes & Noble Book Stores
Re: impatient stamping
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 9/2/00 9:49:26 AM Mountain Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: << Cody decided that Korinas impatient habbit needed to stop, and he has been making her wait till she stops banging, before he'll walk another step. Amazing..this kid of mine has patience that I NEVER did. >> Lisa, thank Cody for me. I have that stamping problem with Ida, too, and I should have thought of that, but sure didn't. It's kind of like clicker training, actually.Gail in NM
New webpage - Norges Fjordhestlag
This message is from: "Ingvild Nygaard Sveen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Just a little note to inform you that Norges Fjordhestlag is now on the Internet. The text is in norwegian, but everything that would be interesting to "foreign" readers will soon be posted at Fjord Horse International's webpage. I addition, we have access to a HUGE archive of photos (old and new), that will decorate the two webpages in the future. You'll find the new webpage at: http://www.fjordhest.no/ Ingvild N. Sveen in Oslo, Norway. http://www.multinett.no/ingvild webmaster of: Norges Fjordhestlag's fjordhest.no http://www.fjordhest.no Fjordhorse International http://www.fjordhorseint.no The Fjordhorse page http://www.multinett.no/ingvild/fjord.html
Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: Mary Thurman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> --- Denise's <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This message is from: "Denise's" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > i would love to hear whys, howcomes and > facts on bits. > what about the notion of low > palates in fjords? Denise, We, too, had heard that Fjords have low palates. So, when we were training ours for western reining, I was concerned about Sindar being able to 'carry' a regular medium port western bit(since he had a rather'fine' head to begin with). When we sold him this summer he was happily 'carrying' a regular medium port, seven shank, western bit. Putting him 'into' this bit was the easiest transition I ever made. He took to it in just a couple of rides - the hardest part was teaching him how to 'spit it out'. He would hold the bit in his mouth with his tongue - could have used the bit without a headstall - so when unbridling time came, he had to learn how to release it without hitting it on his canine teeth. He actually HATED the Tom Thumb style swivel shanked snaffle bit I had him in last year - chewed and fussed at it all the time. Not so with the regular curb bit. I used the 'seven shank' bit(shanks are shaped like a number 7) to discourage him from trying to grab the shank in his lips. This is sometimes a problem with 'shanked' bits on Fjords, I guess because they are so 'mouthy'. This horse is currently being used as a hunter/jumper, so I assume he is back into some kind of snaffle bit, which he also did well in. Mary = Mary Thurman Raintree Farms [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/
Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: "Denise's" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> dear lori, thank you for the response to my humble questions on bits. that is exactly what i wanted; an answer and opinion from an experienced horse person, especially someone familiar with fjords. i think the clinician was'nt used to the "slowness" of my 3 yr. old fjord, as compared to a trained 1/4 horse. when i do his turns and loops in an arena at a trot and lope, he does just find for me. i am a beginner, so i don't really want his front end turning before his back end can catch up. i think i might be eating more sand than my stomach could handle! denise > > > because i went to a clinic recently. the clinician recommended a twisted > > wire bit. it is for my three year old, quinn. he is in a full cheek > > snaffle and does just fine. > Denise - > I disagree with the clinician. A 3 y.o. who is doing fine in a full cheek > snaffle doesn't need a twisted wire bit! > > twisted-wire bit on a sensitive 3 year old mouth would be a travesty, > > Lori Albrough
Hey it's been raining in Montana!!
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Everyone! I was just so excited to tell you it rained for atleast 8 hours here last night, and I mean rained cats and dogs. I doubt the lightening that went with it will start any new fires since it was doused with buckets from the sky. My husband went back to work at the Fire Camp after his 48 hours off (14 days on) those 18 hour shifts are hard on a disabled guy, but all he has to do is drive media, and firemen up to the fire lines and answer phones. His official title is information officer/Driver/Gopher. Speaking of which my husband can't attend Libby with me : ( and he's worried! Every time I go to Sandpoint, Idaho without him or anywhere else their is Fjords, I come home with one HEE HEE We have decided to sell our yearling stud colt, Harrison (I'll geld him probably end of Sept). I keep reminding myself the whole idea of breeding mares is to sell the offspring. But Harrison is the first, so It's been a hard decision. He will be at Libby showing off his wonderful personality and quick learning ability, even with beginner handlers! Okay enough with the plug Catherine, I'm so glad you are coming to Libby, why can't you just kidnap Gayle Ware and bring her too!! Enjoying the rain in the Bitteroot Valley Michele Noonan
Re: Libby Video
This message is from: "Bushnell's" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sherrie! that's wonderful that videos will be made of the Libby Show! I hope the parade's on it too.. Gene plans on entering the stagecoach and we'd dearly love to have one of the entire parade (ever notice how you miss the whole thing if you're involved?) I misplaced your original post in which you said a lady plans on video taping the Libby Show, but I did want to tell you how pleased I am.=)) Ruthie, in NW MT where it's RAINING Yah!
Reining/dressage
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 9/1/00 8:47:36 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: << I want to see the reining competition, too (It's just Western dressage, more or less). New Mexico State U has an olympic reining team. >> Gail, I've often referred to Reining as Dressage done at 90 miles an hour! Reining is definitely 'taking it's place' in the horse world with it now being sanctioned by the International Equestrian Federation. Reining will now be included in such international venues as the Nation's Cup, Pan Am Games, and World Equestrian Games and hopefully on to the Olympis someday soon. For decades those events have only included English disciplines based largely on European traditions and customs. At long last, America's indigenous riding style, Western, will take it's place on the front lines of World Horsedom. Reining is the ultimate expression of Western Horsemanship just as Dressage is to English. Hooray and it's about time! What took them so long?? Gayle Ware Field of Dreams Eugene, OR www.fjordhorse.com
Re: Green Horses and bits
This message is from: Lori Albrough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > This message is from: "Denise's" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > because i went to a clinic recently. the clinician recommended a twisted > wire bit. it is for my three year old, quinn. he is in a full cheek > snaffle and does just fine. Denise - I disagree with the clinician. A 3 y.o. who is doing fine in a full cheek snaffle doesn't need a twisted wire bit! That bit is only going to cause problems. My preferred bit is a loose-ring jointed snaffle, or a loose-ring french link snaffle. Every horse should be able to be ridden in a plain old loose-ring snaffle. If the horse is not responsive enough, work on putting him in front of your leg, not on jangling the nerves in his mouth. Use of a twisted-wire bit on a sensitive 3 year old mouth would be a travesty, IMHO. Here's a quote on snaffle bits from Cherry Hill's book "Making not Breaking - The First Year under Saddle" (good book - recommended) "The texture of the mouthpiece can be smooth, wavy, ribbed, ridged, or rough. For early training, a smooth mouthpiece is most appropriate. It slides through a horse's mouth uneventfully, so there are no surprises and he can react fluidly and without tension. In contract, an uneven surface bumps the horse's mouth as the bit moves from side to side. This can serve to get a horse's attention or make him afraid. If a horse is injured by a bit, he may avoid contact with it by getting behind the bit or tossing his head in an effort to escape contact. Textured mouthpieces, such as a slow twist (a thick mouthpiece with three or four twists), a scrub board (with built-up strips in the mouthpiece), a wire-wrap, or a twisted-wire snaffle are designed to lighten up a tough-mouthed horse and don't have a place in standard training of young horses." Lori Albrough
Re: I may be carzy... anyone else???
This message is from: carol j makosky <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Catherine Lassesen wrote: > This message is from: "Catherine Lassesen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Hey, with my husband gone to Spain due to his mother having a stroke, I was > going to cancel the Libby trip. But Peg K. said I should throw out to this > crowd That away Catherina. I bought my horse when my husband was on a hunting trip and told him about it shortly b4 she was to be delivered. Then when he was gone away again, I bought a house for my kids in the Twin Cities. So, I always keep him guessing as to what he will find when he gets home from a trip. -- "Built FJORD tough" Carol M. On Golden Pond
Fjords for Sale in MA
This message is from: Jean Ruhan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 10yr Red Dun Mare, 14.1H getting ready for her first CDE. Entered her in the Myopia Driving Event. She is very easy to get along with and is in training now with Andy Marcoux who will drive her at Myopia. She was formerly owned by the Wich's who did distance driving with her. She has a nice long stride and is a forward mover. Proven broodmare (3 foals). She wouldn't suit a "brand new" driver but someone with a little experience will get along with her just fine. Andy has even given lessons with her. Also have a tall yearling Brown Dun colt out of this mare X Hostar. He looks like he would be good at dressage/driving. Very reasonably priced. Both of these have been kept up to date on all veterinary and blacksmith care. If you want more info I'd be glad get back to you.
