Re: freebsd-questions Digest, Vol 92, Issue 40

[Christopher Kelley]

Jay O'Brien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Alec,
Thanks, I searched the FreeBSD Handbook for "dependency" and didn't find any 
reference to "make search". I guess it is one of those things that once you 
know about it you don't have to look for it any more. Unfortunately a lot 
of the documentation I can review is written for those folks who already 
know the answers. 

Thanks for the heads up on 'make search', even if I can't find a complete 
description of the command. I find that it is referenced in the manual, 
however. 

I see that several of the packages that were installed aren't listed in the 
dependencies for portupgrade. Only the two ruby programs are listed. 

Jay
 

Jay,
I have found the FreeBSD basics articles over at onlamp.com to be 
invaluable.

Linky: http://www.onlamp.com/pub/ct/15
The two articles "portupgrade" and "Ports Tricks" (currently about 13 
articles down) are valuable enough to me that I printed them out!

I know it does sometimes seem that you need to know the answer before 
you know what to google for, but until someone invents a better way to 
search (e.g. somehow knowing the context of your search), it's worth 
trying a few different things in google.

Christopher
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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[Jay O'Brien]

Michael C. Shultz wrote:

 > It would be nice if the ports make options were better documented, but 
> you can read through /usr/ports/Mk/bsd.port.mk and find information
> on the various options. 
> 
> here is an example:
> 
> # all-depends-list
> # - Show all directories which are dependencies
> # for this port.
> 
> then
> 
> cd /usr/ports/lang/ezm3/
> make all-depends-list
> 
> result:
> 
> /usr/ports/converters/libiconv
> /usr/ports/devel/gettext
> /usr/ports/devel/gmake
> /usr/ports/devel/libtool15
> 
> -Mike
>

Mike, 

That's great info, thank you. It really helps put this into perspective.

I did portmanager -sl and it identifies 7 candidates for deletion. 
It identifies cvsup-without-gui and also identifies ezm3 upon which 
it depends. Am I missing something here or shouldn't ezm3 not been 
identified as a "leaf port"?

Jay





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Re: Userland "dig/host" for lookups against /etc/hosts?

[stheg olloydson]

it was said:

>It works if I ping 'hostname', but how can I find out the IP of
>'hostname' from the command line?

Hello,

Would not grep 'hostname' /etc/hosts do this?

HTH,

stheg



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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[stheg olloydson]

it was said:

>But how does it work (/usr/ports/Makefile doesn't have a 
>SEARCH statement) and is it documented somewhere, like in a MAN
>page? 
> 
>The handbook, ¶4.3, mentions 'make search' but doesn't explain
>how it works. 
> 

Hello,

It uses /usr/ports/Mk/bsd.port.mk. I doubt the options in there
are officially documented, unless they are in the Developer's
Handbook. There used to be a really good replacement for make
search that had a lot of nifty options. Because I rarely used it
(or make search), what it was called is lost to the mists of
foggy memory

Regards,

stheg

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Installation from Floppies

[Nick Wilson]

Hi
I am trying to install 5.3 from floppies/network and I boot from the the 
three discs (boot, kern1 and kern2).  At the end of this I get the 
FreeBSD 5 boot screen (about 8 options and the character drawing of a 
daemon).  Taking the default option 1 just starts the boot from floppies 
process again - how do I get past this screen to start the network setup 
and install?

Many thanks,
Nick
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Re: Userland "dig/host" for lookups against /etc/hosts?

[Christopher Nehren]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 2005-03-28, Emanuel Strobl scribbled these
curious markings:
> Is there one? Unfortunately I can't write one myself, at least not
> in a reasonable amount of time

- --cut--
#!/usr/bin/perl -w
use strict;

use Socket;
my $host = shift or die "usage: hostshost hostname\n";
my $addr = gethostbyname($host);
die "Cannot resolve host '$host'.\n" unless defined $addr;
my $ip = inet_ntoa($addr);
print "$host has address $ip\n";
- --cut--

Needs some 5.x version of Perl. Works with 5.005_03 as shipped in
FreeBSD 4.x. Also works with more recent perls.

Best Regards,
Christopher Nehren
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (FreeBSD)

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ehnDiO3MuDC3b3nryMUx+Ws=
=Z9c9
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-- 
I abhor a system designed for the "user", if that word is a coded
pejorative meaning "stupid and unsophisticated". -- Ken Thompson
If you ask the wrong questions, you get answers like "42" and "God".
Unix is user friendly. However, it isn't idiot friendly.

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Re: Userland "dig/host" for lookups against /etc/hosts?

[Emanuel Strobl]

Am Montag, 28. März 2005 08:23 schrieb Alexander Chamandy:
> On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 07:17:31 +0200, Emanuel Strobl
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Dear all,
> >
> > my testbed lacks of Ethernet Ports so one machine has no connection to my
> > DNS, no problem, there is something called /etc/hosts I thought.
> > It works if I ping 'hostname', but how can I find out the IP of
> > 'hostname' from the command line? dig and host want to contact the DNS
> > server, also nslookup does, so I think I need a utility which uses the
> > gethostbyname(3) function. Is there one? Unfortunately I can't write one
> > myself, at least not in a reasonable amount of time
>
> May I ask what you're trying to do with the machine?  If you just want
> local DNS resolution for experimentation you may try running BIND 9 or
> TinyDNS.

No DNS experiments, I'm very well equiped (authoritative DNS). It's just that 
my local subnet (productive) has not enough ethernet ports so one 
test-machine (in another subnet) cannot be connected to the local net and the 
two other subnets are for testing only, so none routes to my productive 
net
Everything is working fine, just curiosity..

-Harry

>
> > Thanks,
> >
> > -Harry


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Re: Userland "dig/host" for lookups against /etc/hosts?

[Alexander Chamandy]

On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 07:17:31 +0200, Emanuel Strobl
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dear all,
> 
> my testbed lacks of Ethernet Ports so one machine has no connection to my DNS,
> no problem, there is something called /etc/hosts I thought.
> It works if I ping 'hostname', but how can I find out the IP of 'hostname'
> from the command line? dig and host want to contact the DNS server, also
> nslookup does, so I think I need a utility which uses the gethostbyname(3)
> function. Is there one? Unfortunately I can't write one myself, at least not
> in a reasonable amount of time

May I ask what you're trying to do with the machine?  If you just want
local DNS resolution for experimentation you may try running BIND 9 or
TinyDNS.
 
> Thanks,
> 
> -Harry
> 
> 
> 


-- 
Best wishes,

Alexander G. Chamandy
Webmaster
www.bsdfreak.org
Your Source For BSD News!
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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[Abu Khaled]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 21:51:28 -0800, Michael C. Shultz
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Sunday 27 March 2005 09:41 pm, Jay O'Brien wrote:
> > stheg olloydson wrote:
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > They are recursive dependencies. Check each ports requirements.
> > > cvsup-without-gui depends on ezm3. ezm3 depends on gmake,
> > > gettext and libiconv. libiconv depends on libtool...and the foot
> > > bone's connected to the toe bone :).
> > >
> > > hth,
> > >
> > > stheg
> >
> > stheg,
> >
> > Thank you. Great learning experience. Especially 'make search'. That
> > is very useful. But how does it work (/usr/ports/Makefile doesn't
> > have a SEARCH statement) and is it documented somewhere, like in a
> > MAN page?
> >
> > The handbook, ¶4.3, mentions 'make search' but doesn't explain how it
> > works.
> >
> > Jay
> 
> It would be nice if the ports make options were better documented, but
> you can read through /usr/ports/Mk/bsd.port.mk and find information
> on the various options.
> 
> here is an example:
> 
> # all-depends-list
> # - Show all directories which are dependencies
> # for this port.
> 
> then
> 
> cd /usr/ports/lang/ezm3/
> make all-depends-list
> 
> result:
> 
> /usr/ports/converters/libiconv
> /usr/ports/devel/gettext
> /usr/ports/devel/gmake
> /usr/ports/devel/libtool15
> 
> -Mike
> ___
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> 

Thank you Michael for the very usefull information.
Ahh, can't say how much I've learned after joining the lists.

-- 
Kind regards
Abu Khaled
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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[Michael C. Shultz]

On Sunday 27 March 2005 09:41 pm, Jay O'Brien wrote:
> stheg olloydson wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > They are recursive dependencies. Check each ports requirements.
> > cvsup-without-gui depends on ezm3. ezm3 depends on gmake,
> > gettext and libiconv. libiconv depends on libtool...and the foot
> > bone's connected to the toe bone :).
> >
> > hth,
> >
> > stheg
>
> stheg,
>
> Thank you. Great learning experience. Especially 'make search'. That
> is very useful. But how does it work (/usr/ports/Makefile doesn't
> have a SEARCH statement) and is it documented somewhere, like in a
> MAN page?
>
> The handbook, ¶4.3, mentions 'make search' but doesn't explain how it
> works.
>
> Jay

It would be nice if the ports make options were better documented, but 
you can read through /usr/ports/Mk/bsd.port.mk and find information
on the various options. 

here is an example:

# all-depends-list
# - Show all directories which are dependencies
# for this port.

then

cd /usr/ports/lang/ezm3/
make all-depends-list

result:

/usr/ports/converters/libiconv
/usr/ports/devel/gettext
/usr/ports/devel/gmake
/usr/ports/devel/libtool15

-Mike
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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[Jay O'Brien]

stheg olloydson wrote:

> Hello,
> 
> They are recursive dependencies. Check each ports requirements.
> cvsup-without-gui depends on ezm3. ezm3 depends on gmake,
> gettext and libiconv. libiconv depends on libtool...and the foot
> bone's connected to the toe bone :). 
> 
> hth,
> 
> stheg
> 

stheg, 

Thank you. Great learning experience. Especially 'make search'. That is 
very useful. But how does it work (/usr/ports/Makefile doesn't have a 
SEARCH statement) and is it documented somewhere, like in a MAN page? 

The handbook, ¶4.3, mentions 'make search' but doesn't explain how it 
works. 

Jay





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Userland "dig/host" for lookups against /etc/hosts?

[Emanuel Strobl]

Dear all,

my testbed lacks of Ethernet Ports so one machine has no connection to my DNS, 
no problem, there is something called /etc/hosts I thought.
It works if I ping 'hostname', but how can I find out the IP of 'hostname' 
from the command line? dig and host want to contact the DNS server, also 
nslookup does, so I think I need a utility which uses the gethostbyname(3) 
function. Is there one? Unfortunately I can't write one myself, at least not 
in a reasonable amount of time

Thanks,

-Harry


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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[stheg olloydson]

it was said:

>>If you updated your soirces/ports "cvsup" then portupgrade did
>>what you asked it to do. It Updated all outdated
packages/ports 
>>and there dependencies.
>
>I'm convinced that you are right. However, why don't I show the

>other dependencies?

Hello,

They are recursive dependencies. Check each ports requirements.
cvsup-without-gui depends on ezm3. ezm3 depends on gmake,
gettext and libiconv. libiconv depends on libtool...and the foot
bone's connected to the toe bone :). 

hth,

stheg

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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[Abu Khaled]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 20:27:17 -0800, Jay O'Brien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Abu Khaled wrote:
> 
> > ezm3, gettext, gmake, libiconv, libtool are the build dependencies for
> > cvsup-without-gui.
> >
> > # cd /usr/ports
> > # make search name="cvsup-without-gui"
> >
> 
> Abu, I don't get that result. I only show ezm3-1.2.
> 
> # cd /usr/ports
> # make search name="cvsup-without-gui"
> Port:   cvsup-without-gui-16.1h_2
> Path:   /usr/ports/net/cvsup-without-gui
> Info:   General network file distribution system optimized for CVS (non-GUI 
> version)
> Maint:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> B-deps: ezm3-1.2
> R-deps:
> WWW:http://www.cvsup.org/
> #
> 
> > If you updated your soirces/ports "cvsup" then portupgrade did what
> > you asked it to do. It Updated all outdated packages/ports and there
> > dependencies.
> 
> I'm convinced that you are right. However, why don't I show the other
> dependencies?

# cd /usr/ports
# make search name=ezm3

That's the best thing about portupgrade/portmanager. We don't have to
worry (too much) about dependencies.

> 
> Jay
> 
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> 


-- 
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Abu Khaled
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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[Jay O'Brien]

Abu Khaled wrote:
 
> ezm3, gettext, gmake, libiconv, libtool are the build dependencies for
> cvsup-without-gui.
> 
> # cd /usr/ports
> # make search name="cvsup-without-gui"
> 

Abu, I don't get that result. I only show ezm3-1.2.

# cd /usr/ports 
# make search name="cvsup-without-gui" 
Port:   cvsup-without-gui-16.1h_2
Path:   /usr/ports/net/cvsup-without-gui
Info:   General network file distribution system optimized for CVS (non-GUI 
version)
Maint:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
B-deps: ezm3-1.2
R-deps: 
WWW:http://www.cvsup.org/
# 

> If you updated your soirces/ports "cvsup" then portupgrade did what
> you asked it to do. It Updated all outdated packages/ports and there
> dependencies.

I'm convinced that you are right. However, why don't I show the other 
dependencies?

Jay

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Re: Questions using PartitionMagic for dual-boot with WinXP-Pro

[Alec Berryman]

Maude User on 2005-03-27 19:47:30 -0800:

> I need help partitioning a laptop (using PartitionMagic) which
> already has WinXP-Pro on it, so it can dual-boot FreeBSD.

FreeBSD uses disk slices as opposed to partitions; decide how much
space you want FreeBSD to take up (including swap) and set that
aside.  When it comes time to install FreeBSD, you will be able to
allocate the slice as you see fit from the installer, but it will all
be on one partition.  You should leave the partition on which you
would like to install FreeBSD blank.

You will not be installing FreeBSD onto an ext2 or ext3 partition.
You probably ought to allocate more than 1MB of swap.

> Does this mean I should create a small partition BEFORE my WinXP
> partition, to put Boot Easy or LILO there? (Apparently
> PartitionMagic has a command to MOVE an existing partition - so it
> looks like I can just move the existing WinXP partition slightly to
> open up some space in front of it.)
> 
> If I do need to create a boot partition:
> 
> ...(a) How big should it be?
> 
> ...(b) What file system should it be - FAT, FAT32, ext2 or ext3?
> 
> ...(c) Should it be a primary partition, or logical (extended)?

You should not need a boot partition; the FreeBSD boot manager is
installed in the MBR.  I have no experience dual-booting FreeBSD and
Windows; you ought to check with someone who has.

> Anybody have a preference on using LILO versus Boot Easy?
> 
> Will there be a screen during the regular FreeBSD install that lets
> me install Boot Easy or LILO?

I don't know anything about Boot Easy, but I suspect that the FreeBSD
boot manager will be more than sufficient for your needs.  

> (2) Should the file system for my Linux partition be ext2 or ext3?
> 
> (3) Do I need a Linux swap partition? If so:
> 
> ...(a) How big should the Linux swap partition be? (I heard it
> should be twice the size of my RAM. I have 512MB, so should my Linux
> swap partition be 1024MB?)
> 
> ...(b) Should the Linux swap partition be FAT, FAT32, ext2 or ext3?
> 
> ...(c) Should the Linux swap partition be a primary partition - or
> logical (extended)?

At this point, you ought to make sure you understand that FreeBSD is
not a Linux distribution.

> If I make a second logical partition for WinXP, does it have to be
> NTFS? I heard that it could also be FAT or FAT32, and that way any
> OS could access it?

FAT32 is better supported than NTFS.

> (7) (Off-topic:) I heard that FreeBSD is not compatible with ACPI
> (7) power management. When and how do I disable this?

There is an option during the install to disable it; the statement
that FreeBSD is not compatible with ACPI is incorrect.


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Re: hyper threading.

[Anthony Atkielski]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

> Polling is simply unecessary in most cases. You could get
> better performance using an em driver and setting max
> ints to whatever is optimal for your system. Polling adds
> latency and over head for no good reason.

Polling often provides better performance, at the expense of higher
overhead.

-- 
Anthony


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8139 timeout

[rill]

helloï

I use 8139 net card. When I runing cvsup, It give me message "re0: 
watchdog timeout" and my network stop working. 

/etc/rc.conf
ifconfig_re0="inet 192.168.1.10 netmask 255.255.255.0 media 100baseTX"

FreeBSD info is:
/usr/ports/x11/gnomepanel# uname -a
FreeBSD Rill.net 5.4-PRERELEASE FreeBSD 5.4-PRERELEASE #0: Tue Mar  8 23:46:48 
CST 2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED]:/usr/obj/build/src/sys/Rill  i386

This is a older question?

Best Regards


-rill
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Re: How to get send-pr/porttools working when on a cable (dsl) provider link

[Randy Pratt]

On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 05:00:15 +0200
Danny Pansters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Hi all,
> 
> Just migrated all my stuff to a new machine and having troubles sending any 
> mail to the freebsd lists and inparticular with send-pr. I have a cable modem 
> connected to my gateway which connects to a gbit switch through which the 
> other pcs connect. The cable provider uses dhcp. I get my IP ok and my 
> hostname (sent through dhclient also, otherwise logging on doesn't work) is 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have set up pf to do nat and filtering. 
> It's not a firewall problem.
> 
> I'm having problems getting sendmail (from my desktp -- a client behind the 
> gateway) to be eligible to send mail to the freebsd servers, particularly 
> send-pr.
> 
> I already set my isp's smtp as smart relay in freensd.mc and did make, but 
> now 
> my FQDN hostname is not considered cosher (helo)... its desktop.homenet, a 
> local name.
> 
> How do I solve this?

I'll leave the sendmail answers to those who really understand it.

As an alternative, sendmail configurations could be avoided by using
ports/sysutils/gtk-send-pr especially if this is your only need
for sendmail.  Gtk-send-pr will deliver mail to any SMTP server.

Just a thought..

Randy



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Questions using PartitionMagic for dual-boot with WinXP-Pro

[Maude User]

Hi -

I need help partitioning a laptop (using PartitionMagic) which already has 
WinXP-Pro on it, so it can dual-boot FreeBSD. 

SUMMARY
===
I'm thinking of doing the following layout (things I'm unsure about are in 
brackets [...]):

- "boot" (Z:) - FAT [or FAT32?]- 2MB [less/more?] - primary - install Easy Boot 
[or LILO?] here
- "winxp" (C:) - NTFS - 20GB - primary (I will move/resize this existing 
partition, using PMagic)
- "winxp2" (X:) - FAT [or FAT32, NTFS?] - 15GB - logical [or primary?]
- "linux" - ext2 - 24GB - primary
- "swap" - ext2 [or FAT, FAT32?] - 1MB - logical [or primary?]

but I'm unsure about a lot of these parameters and I'm afraid of making the 
computer unbootable! The above layout sums up my questions - same questions in 
more detail below:

DETAILS
===
Specs: Compaq v3125us, Windows XP Professional (with Service Pack 2), 60GB hard 
disk, 512MB RAM, and NO floppy drive. (Also: Pioneer DVR-K14 Slimline 
(DVD+/-RW, CD-RW), Intel Extreme Graphics 2 video chipset, ACPI power 
management.) I have PartitionMagic 8.0. 

(Note: In the questions below, I use the word "partition" because that's what 
PartitionMagic uses. I understand that in FreeBSD this is called a "slice.")

(1) PartitionMagic says that if an OS partition starts after the "boot 
boundary," that OS won't be bootable. It says I have boot boundaries at 2GB, 
and at 1024 cylinders. 

Does this mean I should create a small partition BEFORE my WinXP partition, to 
put Boot Easy or LILO there? (Apparently PartitionMagic has a command to MOVE 
an existing partition - so it looks like I can just move the existing WinXP 
partition slightly to open up some space in front of it.)

If I do need to create a boot partition:

...(a) How big should it be?

...(b) What file system should it be - FAT, FAT32, ext2 or ext3?

...(c) Should it be a primary partition, or logical (extended)?

Anybody have a preference on using LILO versus Boot Easy?

Will there be a screen during the regular FreeBSD install that lets me install 
Boot Easy or LILO?

(2) Should the file system for my Linux partition be ext2 or ext3?

(3) Do I need a Linux swap partition? If so:

...(a) How big should the Linux swap partition be? (I heard it should be twice 
the size of my RAM. I have 512MB, so should my Linux swap partition be 1024MB?)

...(b) Should the Linux swap partition be FAT, FAT32, ext2 or ext3?

...(c) Should the Linux swap partition be a primary partition - or logical 
(extended)?

(4) It would be nice (but not required) to create a second logical partition at 
this time for WinXP (a second logical drive, say X:), so I could keep my WinXP 
user or data file separate there. If I have a boot partition, a main WinXP 
partition, a Linux partition, and a Linux swap partition, then that makes 4 
partitions. Is that the maximum (meaning I couldn't add a second WinXP 
partition)? 

If I make a second logical partition for WinXP, does it have to be NTFS? I 
heard that it could also be FAT or FAT32, and that way any OS could access it?

(5) I would like to be able to see DOS files from FreeBSD. Is there anything I 
have to do at partition time to make this possible?

(6) I'm confused about the whole "MaxCapacity = (sector size) x (sectors per 
track) x (cylinders) x (heads)" thing. Do I need to set sector size, sectors 
per track, cylinders and heads when I make a new partition? (I don't even seen 
much mention of cylinders, heads and sectors in PartitionMagic.)

(7) (Off-topic:) I heard that FreeBSD is not compatible with ACPI power 
management. When and how do I disable this?

Thanks for any help!

Stefan Scott


-
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Re: hyper threading.

[em1897]

I've never seen any "measurements". And most of your
"theories" are clearly incorrect for FreeBSD. So what good
is it?
You claim to have done measurements, so what do you have
to refute it? Being a fool is a choice. Its easily turned.
The problem is when you can't get more hardware. When you
are pushing the envelope, then you run out of choices. There
is also a price/performance consideration. You make a choice
to spend an extra 30% for certain hardware. But if you can
get the same performance using lesser hardware with different
settings or a different version of the OS, then you are wasting
your money. If you don't need much, or you are spending someone
else's money, then everything is moot. Just use whats cool.
-Original Message-
From: Anthony Atkielski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
Sent: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 20:01:57 +0200
Subject: Re: hyper threading.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
You know, you spout all of this wonderful theory without considering
the quality of the implementation.
Somethings can be derived directly from theory.  If you know the design
of the hardware, you can predict that two processors will provide x%
increment of throughput over a single processor, even if you don't
actually measure them.
In my case, I cite both theory and my own experience in measuring actual
systems.  The general principles of behavior of multiprocessor systems
are well understood, although specific implementations vary.  It is
clear, based even on design data alone, that hyperthreading will
generally improve throughput and should never diminish it (disregarding
OS overhead).  It is equally clear that the gain won't be as great as
having physically independent processors, but the idea of putting more
of the idle processor logic to work is a good one.
And a key point that you consistently overlook is that FreeBSD 5.x is
a particularly poor implementation of SMP. Linux and Dragonfly get 80%
improvement in performance with a 2nd processor, and FreeBSD doesn't.
I'd need to see measurements to substantiate this.
In general, when it comes to optimization, it's best not to fret too
much over how many percentage points of processor power or throughput
you gain or lose with specific configuration or implementation choices.
If your system is running so close to the wire that five percent makes
the difference between 100% busy and less than 100% busy, you need more
hardware in any case.
The concept that the kernel is poorly implemented by userland is well
done is just not an assumption that you can make.
Actually, it's not something that I spend a lot of time thinking about.
Right now, my production system is never more than 0.4% busy.  And if it
were 99% busy, I'd be looking at faster hardware, no matter what OS or
HT/MP options I might have implemented.
--
Anthony
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Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Chuck Robey]

Christopher Nehren wrote:
On 2005-03-27, Chuck Robey scribbled these
curious markings:
Just curious if you folks have tried the mozilla application, available 
only from mozilla (not firefox) called chatzilla?  I have tried nearly 
all of the other IRC clients, it's not a minimal one, but it's very very 
nice.

I personally try to keep things as console-based as possible. screen,
irssi, elinks, mutt, slrn and vim are my best friends. I'd be in serious
trouble if ncurses broke. :)
Can't say that I completely disagree, being that I'm a notable vim 
enthusiast, but I always say, if you're going to be honest, you need to 
at least try the one's you don't like, else you are not being honest in 
saying you don't like it.  I spent over a year learning C++, so I could 
be honest in saying I didn't like it.  If you don't give something a 
real try, then you're like the 3 year old who says "I don't like it, 
what is it?"

Best Regards,
Christopher Nehren

--

Chuck Robey | Interests include C & Java programming, FreeBSD,
[EMAIL PROTECTED]   | electronics, communications, and SF/Fantasy.
New Year's Resolution:  I will not sphroxify gullible people into looking up
fictitious words in the dictionary (on the wall at my old fraternity,
Signa Phi Nothing).

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Re: A Riddle

[em1897]

and who do you think cares what you do?
-Original Message-
From: Dev Tugnait <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 12:41:37 -0500
Subject: Re: A Riddle
I sticky this thread as retarded.
* [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
Apparently you can't read. I didn't say you were an
idiot for running your own server. Only that you
were an idiot to use your server to download
tons of crap from lists that you don't want to
read when for free you can have it stored elsewhere.
I have a server, and a domain (several) and lots of
other cool stuff. I got tired of wasting cpu cycles
and disk space, considering that maybe 1 out of 20
messages actually interests me. You guys always
complain about wasted bandwidth. Well if you use
yahoo or gmail or aol then you don't waste any bandwidth
of your own. You just read what you want to read.
-Original Message-
From: Chris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 10:31:58 -0600
Subject: Re: A Riddle
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
 
>-Original Message- 
>From: Fabian Keil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Sent: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 21:59:59 +0100 
>Subject: Re: A Riddle 
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
>>> --- Chris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 
>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
>>> > Hmm, I wonder if the lack of performance, or the 
>>> unwanted 
>>> > emails were more heavily weighted in the 
>>> decision? 
>>> > 
>>> > If there was any intelligent life on the list you 
>>> could 
>>> > counter what you call "Trolls" with solid technical 
>>> > arguments. This reminds me of the old bsdi 
>>> > list. A bunch of half-wits who are just happy 
>>> > to belong to something and have other half-wits 
>>> > to correspond with. 
>>> > 
>>> > FreeBSD used to have open discussions between 
>>> > users and developers and it used to be real 
>>> > good. Now it sucks and the developers are 
>>> > detached, off in their own little world. See 
>>> > a pattern? 
>>> > 
>>> > But with a user base from places like gnu-rox.org 
>>> > and makeworld.com, what do you expect I 
>>> > guess? 
>> > Please have a look at your own email address. 
>>> As an aside, all of the major web mail providers 
>>default to "top posting". Google (ever hear 
>>of them?) only shows the top N lines of a post. 
>>So if you bottom post, you don't see the message 
>>you want to see 
>>without having to make an effort. So when are 
>>you troglodytes going to climb out of your 
>>1994 hibernations and get with the times? 
>> > They don't default to top posting, they put 
>the cursor on top, so you can read the whole 
>message and cut irrelevant parts before replying. 
>> If Google doesn't display the whole message, 
>the interface is crap. That's not the fault of 
>anybody on this list. 
>>> You may prefer one over the other, but its 
>>hardly a capital offense to do otherwise. Most 
>>of us have evolved out of our unix newsreaders. 
>> > If you want to be read by as many people 
>as possible on this list, the easiest way is 
>to write well formed mails. 
>> Unfortunately, you are not only top posting, 
>your mailing software also inserts line breaks 
>where there shouldn't be any and makes it 
>hard to see who wrote what. 
>> Have a look at the beginning of this mail. 
>Your quotation is a mess. 
>>> Anyone with a brain is using web mail for 
>>mailing lists these days: no more whining 
>>about spam or "wasted bandwidth". 
>> > Having a brain is good, but using it is even better. 
>If the web interface produces garbage, changing 
>the interface could be a smart move. 
>> Just my two brainless cents. 
>> Fabian 
>-- > http://www.fabiankeil.de 
> 
*** Formatted correctly for ease of reading *** 
 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
>WRONG on all counts! 
> 
>Firstly, anyone who uses their own server for lists is 
>a complete idiot. 
 
So - according to YOU, most all of us that run our own servers are
idiots. Yanno what? You sound like the type that is forced to use his
parents PC, Forced to use AOL, and forced to use web mail. 
 
So - since YOU can't have what most of us can and do have, you feel 
the
need to lash out and verbally abuse. 
 
This is a classic case of the have-nots are beside them selfs over 
the
haves. 
 
It's one thing to say something like: 
 
It's my opinion that (insert rhetoric here) 
 
Then to make a sweeping generalization as you just did. Shows us what
kind a man (or boy) you are. 
 
Grow up - show some respect, don't insult - you will live longer when
you do join society. 
 
And, as I said before - even tho you may bash us, think you are
superior to us - we still love you anyways. 
 
Oh, and have a great day! 
 
-- Best regards, 
Chris 
 
If on an actuarial basis there is a 50 50 chance that 
something will go wrong, 
It will actually go wrong nine times out of ten. 
___ 
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Re: hyper threading.

[em1897]

Polling is simply unecessary in most cases. You could get
better performance using an em driver and setting max
ints to whatever is optimal for your system. Polling adds
latency and over head for no good reason.
As I've said before, the FreeBSD "team" is patently
clueless. They're grasping at straws.
-Original Message-
From: Anthony Atkielski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
Sent: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 20:04:16 +0200
Subject: Re: hyper threading.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Right. Thats what I said. You'll killl your networking.
Beyond a certain network load, you have to increase the number of timer
interrupts per second no matter how fast your processors are or how many
of them you have, if you are polling your I/O interfaces instead of
being driven from interrupts.
I don't like the idea of routinely running 1000 timer interrupts per
second, but I note that FreeBSD 6.x apparently is moving to this number
(?).  I'd prefer that it be readily configurable.
There are other options but I'm not sure how well x86 hardware supports
them.  Having a very accurate, very high resolution elapsed-time counter
on the processor(s) can help lower overhead by allowing the OS to get
accurate time information without waiting for an interrupt and with
execution of only a single instruction.  Having programmable, very high
resolution timers would help, too.
--
Anthony
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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[Abu Khaled]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 19:08:56 -0800, Jay O'Brien <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Alec Berryman wrote:
> 
> > Jay O'Brien on 2005-03-27 18:20:00 -0800:
> >
> >
> >>Now, pkg_info says I have 10 packages installed; added were ezm3,
> >>gettext, gmake, libiconv, libtool, portupgrade,ruby and ruby18. If
> >>these all required to make portupgrade or perl work, where is that
> >>reference?
> >
> >
> > They are required to build and run portupgrade.  If you do a 'make search
> > name=portupgrade' from /usr/ports, it will list all the dependencies.
> >
> >
> >>PS.. I tried to install portmanager again, and this time it got the
> >>files immediately and installed fine. It took about a minute, not two
> >>hours. It reports that all my ports are up to date. Whew.
> >
> >
> > That's because portupgrade did all the work :)  If you had run
> > portmanager before running portupgrade, you would have seen something
> > similar - portmanager taking two hours and portupgrade taking almost
> > no time at all.
> 
> Alec,
> 
> Thanks, I searched the FreeBSD Handbook for "dependency" and didn't find any
> reference to "make search". I guess it is one of those things that once you
> know about it you don't have to look for it any more. Unfortunately a lot
> of the documentation I can review is written for those folks who already
> know the answers.
> 
> Thanks for the heads up on 'make search', even if I can't find a complete
> description of the command. I find that it is referenced in the manual,
> however.
> 
> I see that several of the packages that were installed aren't listed in the
> dependencies for portupgrade. Only the two ruby programs are listed.

ezm3, gettext, gmake, libiconv, libtool are the build dependencies for
cvsup-without-gui.

# cd /usr/ports
# make search name="cvsup-without-gui"

If you updated your soirces/ports "cvsup" then portupgrade did what
you asked it to do. It Updated all outdated packages/ports and there
dependencies.

> 
> Jay
> 
> ___
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> 


-- 
Kind regards
Abu Khaled
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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[Jay O'Brien]

Alec Berryman wrote:

> Jay O'Brien on 2005-03-27 18:20:00 -0800:
> 
> 
>>Now, pkg_info says I have 10 packages installed; added were ezm3, 
>>gettext, gmake, libiconv, libtool, portupgrade,ruby and ruby18. If 
>>these all required to make portupgrade or perl work, where is that 
>>reference?
> 
> 
> They are required to build and run portupgrade.  If you do a 'make search
> name=portupgrade' from /usr/ports, it will list all the dependencies.
>  
> 
>>PS.. I tried to install portmanager again, and this time it got the 
>>files immediately and installed fine. It took about a minute, not two 
>>hours. It reports that all my ports are up to date. Whew.
> 
> 
> That's because portupgrade did all the work :)  If you had run
> portmanager before running portupgrade, you would have seen something
> similar - portmanager taking two hours and portupgrade taking almost
> no time at all.

Alec,

Thanks, I searched the FreeBSD Handbook for "dependency" and didn't find any 
reference to "make search". I guess it is one of those things that once you 
know about it you don't have to look for it any more. Unfortunately a lot 
of the documentation I can review is written for those folks who already 
know the answers. 

Thanks for the heads up on 'make search', even if I can't find a complete 
description of the command. I find that it is referenced in the manual, 
however. 

I see that several of the packages that were installed aren't listed in the 
dependencies for portupgrade. Only the two ruby programs are listed. 

Jay

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Re: NDIS installation problem with WMP54G v4 wireless card

[Texas Consultant]

Thank you for the excellent advice. I converted the .INF file to ASCII from 
UTF-8 (no error was given), re-ndiscvt'd and it works.

Very happy now!
From: Fabian Keil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Texas Consultant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
Subject: Re: NDIS installation problem with WMP54G v4 wireless card
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2005 17:18:48 +0100
"Texas Consultant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Just put together a new BSD 5.3 machine, and compiled NDIS for use with 
a
> Linksys WMP54g v4 card; it's a wireless card that uses the Ralink RT2500
> chipset.
>
> Everything works so far; major steps are:
>
> 1. make ndis
> 2. copy over NDIS driver files
> 3. make if_ndis
> 4. kldload ndis
>
> However, kldload if_ndis returns an error:
>
> /sbin/kldload -v /usr/src/sys/modules/if_ndis/if_ndis.ko
> kldload: can't load
> link_elf: symbol rt2500_sys_drv_data_start undefined
> /usr/src/sys/modules/if_ndis/if_ndis.ko: No such file or directory
> *** Error code 1
>
> Stop in /usr/src/sys/modules/if_ndis.

I had a similar problem after updating from 5.3 to 5.4-PRERELEASE.
I rebuilded if_ndis, but forgot to first recreate ndis_driver_data.h.
After rebuilding ndis_driver_data.h with the right sources it worked again.
Could your sources by out of sync with the system?
Fabian
--
http://www.fabiankeil.de

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Fwd: How to get send-pr/porttools working when on a cable (dsl) provider link

[Danny Pansters]

That's host cp464173-a.dbsch1.nb.home.nl minus "danny@" -- sorry, mis-paste :)


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From: Danny Pansters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
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Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 05:00:15 +0200
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Subject: How to get send-pr/porttools working when on a cable (dsl) provider
link
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Hi all,

Just migrated all my stuff to a new machine and having troubles sending any
mail to the freebsd lists and inparticular with send-pr. I have a cable modem
connected to my gateway which connects to a gbit switch through which the
other pcs connect. The cable provider uses dhcp. I get my IP ok and my
hostname (sent through dhclient also, otherwise logging on doesn't work) is
[EMAIL PROTECTED] I have set up pf to do nat and filtering.
It's not a firewall problem.

I'm having problems getting sendmail (from my desktp -- a client behind the
gateway) to be eligible to send mail to the freebsd servers, particularly
send-pr.

I already set my isp's smtp as smart relay in freensd.mc and did make, but
 now my FQDN hostname is not considered cosher (helo)... its desktop.homenet,
 a local name.

How do I solve this?

(also...contrast this inconvenience with every non-subscribed spammer being
able to spam us if she has a colo set up properly...)


Thanks very much,

Dan
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How to get send-pr/porttools working when on a cable (dsl) provider link

[Danny Pansters]

Hi all,

Just migrated all my stuff to a new machine and having troubles sending any 
mail to the freebsd lists and inparticular with send-pr. I have a cable modem 
connected to my gateway which connects to a gbit switch through which the 
other pcs connect. The cable provider uses dhcp. I get my IP ok and my 
hostname (sent through dhclient also, otherwise logging on doesn't work) is 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] I have set up pf to do nat and filtering. 
It's not a firewall problem.

I'm having problems getting sendmail (from my desktp -- a client behind the 
gateway) to be eligible to send mail to the freebsd servers, particularly 
send-pr.

I already set my isp's smtp as smart relay in freensd.mc and did make, but now 
my FQDN hostname is not considered cosher (helo)... its desktop.homenet, a 
local name.

How do I solve this?

(also...contrast this inconvenience with every non-subscribed spammer being 
able to spam us if she has a colo set up properly...)


Thanks very much,

Dan
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Re: Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[Alec Berryman]

Jay O'Brien on 2005-03-27 18:20:00 -0800:

> Now, pkg_info says I have 10 packages installed; added were ezm3, 
> gettext, gmake, libiconv, libtool, portupgrade,ruby and ruby18. If 
> these all required to make portupgrade or perl work, where is that 
> reference?

They are required to build and run portupgrade.  If you do a 'make search
name=portupgrade' from /usr/ports, it will list all the dependencies.
 
> PS.. I tried to install portmanager again, and this time it got the 
> files immediately and installed fine. It took about a minute, not two 
> hours. It reports that all my ports are up to date. Whew.

That's because portupgrade did all the work :)  If you had run
portmanager before running portupgrade, you would have seen something
similar - portmanager taking two hours and portupgrade taking almost
no time at all.


pgpfp6T6Aj4YX.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Portupgrade (vs. Portmanager) question

[Jay O'Brien]

Updating a computer, pkg_info reported I only had two packages, 
cvsup-without-gui-16.1h and perl-5.8.5, both of which were out 
of date as reported by pkg_version. 

I tried to install portmanager, but it was not able to get the 
needed files from http://portmanager.sunsite.dk.

So, I installed portupgrade. Those files came in fine.

I then did "portupgrade -a -N -vu -rR", which was successful for me 
several months ago on another computer. 

The computer ran for over nearly two hours, with messages scrolling 
by so fast it was nearly impossible to read, filling up the screen with 
text.  I used script so as to capture the screen messages; the capture 
file of the screen is 1.2MB in size!  

Now, pkg_info says I have 10 packages installed; added were ezm3, 
gettext, gmake, libiconv, libtool, portupgrade,ruby and ruby18. If 
these all required to make portupgrade or perl work, where is that 
reference?

Help!  What did I do?  

Jay O'Brien
Rio Linda, California, USA


PS.. I tried to install portmanager again, and this time it got the 
files immediately and installed fine. It took about a minute, not two 
hours. It reports that all my ports are up to date. Whew.

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Re: Anthony's drive issues.Re: ssh password delay

[Martin McCann]

> 
> No, I'll be told that as long as I'm dealing with children instead of
> adults.

this is around the fith time recently you have either insinuated or
outright claimed that the participants of this mailing list are all
immature children. And yet you return time and time again asking for
help. What does this say about you? 

You have now also started taking your attitute into many other threads,
making it very difficult to sift through the techunicaly relevent and
helpful threads thanks to your inability to control your tantrums. 

You are spoiling this list for the people who would like to work
together to solve their problems. Yes, you can be kill mailed, but that
will not remove your replies. It looks like the only solution is to
filter out any mail containing your name anywhere in the text (even this
is not fool proof due to unquoted citations), and this will mean that
many useful or genuine mails will be filtered also due to having your
name in it. 

Yes everyone on this list are immature children, and yes no-one will
listen to any objective critisism of their mightly religious icon
FreeBSD. Any problem anyone gives is obviously the fault of other people
because FreeBSD is perfect. Now that you have agreement, please be on
your way to find the adult company you seek. 

Martin 
 

  

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re: Had to revert from 5.3 to 4.11

[Bruce Campbell]

Ted Mittelstaedt said...
>Bruce,
>
>  Please do us a favor, these kinds of reports basically go into the
>bit bucket when posted to the freebsd-questions mailing list.
>
>  If you would be so kind, please run send-pr on your 4.11 systems
>and send what your seeing in as a bug.  Granted, since it's not
>specific nobody is going to be able to send you a patch or some
>such - but there is still value in these reports being in there as
>if others report the same trouble a coorelation can be drawn.
>
>  Also please list the model number of your SuperMicro motherboards.
>
>Thanks!
>Ted

Supermicro motherboard X5DPR-8G2+

It has been running 4.11 solidly for almost 2 months now.

Some more info on the system is here (about a problem experienced
on the same system):

  http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=bin/75855

Kris Kennaway said...
>Probably this:
>
>ftp://ftp.FreeBSD.org/pub/FreeBSD/ERRATA/notices/FreeBSD-EN-05:03.ipi.asc
>
>Kris

I applied that towards the end of January.  Pretty sure anyway,
memory is fading.

We were running:

  FreeBSD 5.3-RELEASE-p5 #3

when we abandoned ship.  If memory serves, I rebuilt the kernel
only (not the world), when I applied those patches.

I have left the department that owns the server now,  but
I've asked them to followup to this mailling list when they
continue with the diagnosis.

> -Original Message-
> From: owner-freebsd-questions at freebsd.org
> [mailto:owner-freebsd-questions at freebsd.org]On Behalf Of Bruce Campbell
> Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 6:01 PM
> To: freebsd-questions at freebsd.org
> Subject: Had to revert from 5.3 to 4.11
>
>
>
> Upgraded a large e-mail server from 4.7 to 5.3 late December/2004
>
> The 5.3 system never stayed up for more than 3 days (kernel panics
> - often while running "vacation").
>
> A fair bit of fiddling trying to keep it running for about a month,
> then gave up.  Kept the kernel tree updated, no difference.
>
> Reverted to 4.11 about 3 weeks ago, no problems since.
>
> Also upgraded a web server to 5.3 during that time, and
> had to retreat also, same reasons.
>
> We do have a heavily loaded 5.2.1 system running well.
>
> Main difference between the crashy and reliable system
> is nfs home dirs on the mail and web servers.  nfs server
> is 4.7
>
> Same hardware in all cases, dual xeon supermicro.
>
> At a later time we will invest further diagnostic effort.
> Sorry for the lack of specifics.
>



-- 
Bruce Campbell
Manager, Science Computing
C2-260
University of Waterloo
(519)888-4567 ext 6991


This mail sent through www.mywaterloo.ca
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Xorg mouse problems

[Alexander Chamandy]

Hi all,

I've got a PS/2 Labtech optical mouse with and Xorg 6.8.2 running on
FreeBSD 5.4PR with an AMD Athlon and a GeForce 2 MX and I'm having
some strange problems with Xorg and moused.  This all worked fine
under NetBSD (1.6.x and 2.0) with the wsmouse driver, but strangely,
now when I use Xorg and/or moused on FreeBSD the mouse skips on
verticle or horizontal movement all the way across the screen.  I've
tried changing the resolution, disabling ACPI, using different
protocols and nothing has resolved the problem.  Has anyone
experienced this before and if so, how have they resolved it?


dmesg included: 

Copyright (c) 1992-2005 The FreeBSD Project.
Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994
The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved.
FreeBSD 5.4-PRERELEASE #0: Sun Mar 27 08:12:11 EST 2005
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/usr/src/sys/i386/compile/ambrosia
Timecounter "i8254" frequency 1193182 Hz quality 0
CPU: AMD Athlon(tm) Processor (1343.06-MHz 686-class CPU)
  Origin = "AuthenticAMD"  Id = 0x644  Stepping = 4
  
Features=0x183f9ff
  AMD Features=0xc044
real memory  = 805224448 (767 MB)
avail memory = 782417920 (746 MB)
npx0:  on motherboard
npx0: INT 16 interface
cpu0 on motherboard
pcib0:  pcibus 0 on motherboard
pir0:  on motherboard
$PIR: BIOS IRQ 15 for 0.4.INTC is not valid for link 0x3
pci0:  on pcib0
$PIR: ROUTE_INTERRUPT failed.
agp0:  mem
0xe400-0xe7ff at device 0.0 on pci0
pcib1:  at device 1.0 on pci0
pci1:  on pcib1
pci1:  at device 0.0 (no driver attached)
isab0:  at device 4.0 on pci0
isa0:  on isab0
atapci0:  port
0xd800-0xd80f,0x376,0x170-0x177,0x3f6,0x1f0-0x1f7 at device 4.1 on
pci0
ata0: channel #0 on atapci0
ata1: channel #1 on atapci0
uhci0:  port 0xd400-0xd41f irq 7 at device
4.2 on pci0
usb0:  on uhci0
usb0: USB revision 1.0
uhub0: VIA UHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1
uhub0: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered
uhci1:  port 0xd000-0xd01f irq 7 at device
4.3 on pci0
usb1:  on uhci1
usb1: USB revision 1.0
uhub1: VIA UHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1
uhub1: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered
pci0:  at device 4.4 (no driver attached)
pci0:  at device 4.5 (no driver attached)
xl0: <3Com 3c905C-TX Fast Etherlink XL> port 0xa400-0xa47f mem
0xd580-0xd580007f irq 7 at device 13.0 on pci0
miibus0:  on xl0
xlphy0: <3c905C 10/100 internal PHY> on miibus0
xlphy0:  10baseT, 10baseT-FDX, 100baseTX, 100baseTX-FDX, auto
xl0: Ethernet address: 00:04:76:e3:6d:42
atapci1:  port
0x8800-0x883f,0x9000-0x9003,0x9400-0x9407,0x9800-0x9803,0xa000-0xa007
mem 0xd500-0xd501 irq 10 at device 17.0 on pci0
ata2: channel #0 on atapci1
ata3: channel #1 on atapci1
orm0:  at iomem
0xd-0xd07ff,0xcc000-0xce7ff,0xc-0xcb7ff on isa0
pmtimer0 on isa0
atkbdc0:  at port 0x64,0x60 on isa0
atkbd0:  irq 1 on atkbdc0
kbd0 at atkbd0
psm0:  irq 12 on atkbdc0
psm0: model IntelliMouse, device ID 3
sc0:  at flags 0x100 on isa0
sc0: VGA <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x300>
sio0 at port 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 flags 0x10 on isa0
sio0: type 16550A
sio1 at port 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3 on isa0
sio1: type 16550A
vga0:  at port 0x3c0-0x3df iomem 0xa-0xb on isa0
unknown:  can't assign resources (port)
unknown:  can't assign resources (port)
unknown:  can't assign resources (irq)
unknown:  can't assign resources (irq)
unknown:  can't assign resources (port)
Timecounter "TSC" frequency 1343055484 Hz quality 800
Timecounters tick every 10.000 msec
acd0: CDROM  at ata0-master PIO4
ad4: 76319MB  [155061/16/63] at ata2-master UDMA100
Mounting root from ufs:/dev/ad4s1a



-- 
Best wishes,

Alexander G. Chamandy
Webmaster
www.bsdfreak.org
Your Source For BSD News!
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Re: FreeBSD Installation

[stheg olloydson]

it was said:



>While loading the sysinstall it freezes up when it reaches
sio0:
>type 8250.

Yow!
 
>The book shows type 16550A
>
>The computer I am trying to install FreeBSD on is an AMD 700
Mhz
> maching with 512 K of memory.



The 8250 UART has been obsolete for _years_ (pre-386 days). Try
disabling the serial ports in BIOS. You may want to do the same
to the parallel port, too. After you get set up, try enabling
them to see what happens.
Don't fool with 4.6; it's pretty old. (Not as old as an 8250
chip, but still) After getting the 4.8 system running, you
should update to 4.11. Hang on to the book, though, because a
lot of the information will still apply. The up-to-date handbook
is available online at www.freebsd.org. Some ftp servers have it
in pdf format if you dislike reading online.
Out of curiosity, what motherboard make and model do you have?

HTH,

stheg

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Re: hyper threading.

[Anthony Atkielski]

RW writes:

> But what would be the point, that's slower than running with HT turned-off.

Not necessarily.  It depends on a lot of things.

It any case, nobody is forced to run with HT and SMP enabled.

-- 
Anthony


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RE: FreeBSD Installation

[bob]

4.11 is the current production stable release which contains massive
changes from 4.8 one of which is the "kernel configuration in
full-screen visual mode" is not required any longer. The book you
are referencing is outdated. Release 4.6 and 4.8 are no longer
supported versions. The 5.3 version is brand new and still
experiencing problems and is not as stable and reliable as 4.11. No
need to get to close to the bleeding edge by using the 5.3 version.

Follow the step by step instructions in the Install guide at this
URL

http://www.unixguide.net/freebsd/fbsd_installguide/index.php


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Joe Parker
Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 7:34 PM
To: freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.org
Subject: FreeBSD Installation



I have version 4.6 and 4.8 of FreeBSD and I am having trouble
getting pass a certain point. This is the procedure I have followed
form The FreeBSD Handbook, 3rd Edition, Volume I: User Guide Edited
by Murray Stokely and Chern Lee.

I boot for the CD and start form Start kernel configuration in
full-screen visual mode.

Then Press X

Then delete:

Advansys SCSI narrow controller

Adaptec 154 X SCSI controller

Adaptec 152 X SCSI and computable sound card

Buslogic SCSI controller

Then press Q

Save these parameters before exiting YES

While loading the sysinstall it freezes up when it reaches sio0:
type 8250.

The book shows type 16550A

The computer I am trying to install FreeBSD on is an AMD 700 Mhz
maching with 512 K of memory. Nothing else on the hard drive. It
will be a stand a lone computer once I get FreeBSD installed.

Any help you can give me will be greatly appreciated.

Best Regards,  Joe



Joe Parker
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Why Wait? Move to EarthLink.
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Re: FreeBSD Installation

[Abu Khaled]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 16:33:35 -0800, Joe Parker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> 
> I have version 4.6 and 4.8 of FreeBSD and I am having trouble getting pass a 
> certain point. This is the procedure I have followed form The FreeBSD 
> Handbook, 3rd Edition, Volume I: User Guide Edited by Murray Stokely and 
> Chern Lee.
> 
> I boot for the CD and start form Start kernel configuration in full-screen 
> visual mode.
> 
> Then Press X
> 
> Then delete:
> 
> Advansys SCSI narrow controller
> 
> Adaptec 154 X SCSI controller
> 
> Adaptec 152 X SCSI and computable sound card
> 
> Buslogic SCSI controller
> 
> Then press Q
> 
> Save these parameters before exiting YES
> 
> While loading the sysinstall it freezes up when it reaches sio0: type 8250.
> 
> The book shows type 16550A

sio0 is the serial interface. If you don't need it try to disable it
"bios" to see if it's the reason for this problem.

> 
> The computer I am trying to install FreeBSD on is an AMD 700 Mhz maching with 
> 512 K of memory. Nothing else on the hard drive. It will be a stand a lone 
> computer once I get FreeBSD installed.
> 
> Any help you can give me will be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Best Regards,  Joe
> 
> 
> Joe Parker
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Why Wait? Move to EarthLink.
> ___
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> 


-- 
Kind regards
Abu Khaled
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Dependency problem: atk-1.0.901

[Bnonn]

Hi everyone, when attempting to install GTK2 or XFCE, I get a stop error
stating that the package atk-1.0.901 does not exist. I've
checked /usr/ports/accessibility/atk and have found that atk1.6.1
exists, and can be installed without problems, however apparently this
is not the right version.

I'm running FreeBSD 5.4 and have tried updating via cvs etc, without any
luck. It seems strange to me that this dependency problem would exist,
as surely a lot of people install GTK2, if not XFCE. Does anyone know of
a way to get around this? I'd sort of like to have a gui for my
machine :)

Bnonn
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FreeBSD Installation

[Joe Parker]

  
I have version 4.6 and 4.8 of FreeBSD and I am having trouble getting pass a 
certain point. This is the procedure I have followed form The FreeBSD Handbook, 
3rd Edition, Volume I: User Guide Edited by Murray Stokely and Chern Lee.
 
I boot for the CD and start form Start kernel configuration in full-screen 
visual mode.
 
Then Press X
 
Then delete:
 
Advansys SCSI narrow controller
 
Adaptec 154 X SCSI controller
 
Adaptec 152 X SCSI and computable sound card
 
Buslogic SCSI controller
 
Then press Q 
 
Save these parameters before exiting YES
 
While loading the sysinstall it freezes up when it reaches sio0: type 8250.
 
The book shows type 16550A
 
The computer I am trying to install FreeBSD on is an AMD 700 Mhz maching with 
512 K of memory. Nothing else on the hard drive. It will be a stand a lone 
computer once I get FreeBSD installed.
 
Any help you can give me will be greatly appreciated.
 
Best Regards,  Joe 
 
 

Joe Parker
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Why Wait? Move to EarthLink.
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FreeBSD 4.6 & 4.8

[Joe Parker]

  
I have version 4.6 and 4.8 of FreeBSD and I am having trouble getting pass a 
certain point. This is the procedure I have followed form The FreeBSD Handbook, 
3rd Edition, Volume I: User Guide Edited by Murray Stokely and Chern Lee.
 
I boot for the CD and start form Start kernel configuration in full-screen 
visual mode.
 
Then Press X
 
Then delete:
 
Advansys SCSI narrow controller
 
Adaptec 154 X SCSI controller
 
Adaptec 152 X SCSI and computable sound card
 
Buslogic SCSI controller
 
Then press Q 
 
Save these parameters before exiting YES
 
While loading the sysinstall it freezes up when it reaches sio0: type 8250.
 
The book shows type 16550A
 
The computer I am trying to install FreeBSD on is an AMD 700 MHz marchine with 
512 MB of memory. Nothing else on the hard drive. It will be a stand a lone 
computer once I get FreeBSD installed.
 
Any help you can give me will be greatly appreciated.
 
Best Regards,  Joe 
 
 


Joe Parker
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Why Wait? Move to EarthLink.
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Re: hyper threading.

[RW]

On Sunday 27 March 2005 22:33, Anthony Atkielski wrote:
> RW writes:
> > Multiple processors can run multiple processes at the same time. A HT
> > processor can only run two threads from the same process.
>
> This is incorrect.  HT processors don't care where the threads come
> from; it is possible to run threads from two completely different
> processes on the same HT processor.

But what would be the point, that's slower than running with HT turned-off.
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Re: cdrom trouble with wine

[jason henson]

jason henson wrote:
I have got to a point where I need some help.  I have got starcraft 
tot install, broodwar to install, and update it.  I can run programs 
from cd in with, like setup.exe, but starcraft still can't read a file 
on the cd.  I have mounted the cd in my home dir, created the right 
wine config file, and even used dd to make an iso that I mounted and 
it still didn't work.  I don't think this game even uses any secure 
rom because a simple disc copy on to a cdr works fine in windows.  
Anyone had a problem like this?

$ wine starcraft.exe
fixme:file:get_default_drive_device auto detection of DOS devices not 
supported on this platform
fixme:ntdll:NtQueryVolumeInformationFile device info not properly 
supported on this platform
err:heap:HEAP_CreateSystemHeap system heap base address 0x8000 not 
available
$

thanks,
Jason

BTW staredit works, but is slugish with out nice.
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Re: Anthony's drive issues.Re: ssh password delay

[Anthony Atkielski]

Ted Mittelstaedt writes:

> But the ahc() driver -is- bug free.  It's not bug free when it's running
> on modified hardware, but it's fine when it's running with unmodded
> hardware.

It's also free of bugs if it's never called.

> Your complaint sounds somewhat like the guy who bought a 68 Mustang then
> complained when he had to cut away the shock towers to fit in a 460
> and headers, then complained more when the torque from his engine twisted
> the frame of the car.

I don't know anything about cars.

> Your going to be told to stick your head up your ass as long as you keep
> believing that your hardware and it's firmware has nothing to do with
> the problem.

No, I'll be told that as long as I'm dealing with children instead of
adults.

> Tens of thousands (probably more) of other people run
> FreeBSD servers for years using aic7880 chipsets without seeing
> what your seeing.

Even more run Windows without seeing what I'm seeing.

Someone must be running my machine, since it is mentioned on the 5.3
compatibility list.

> Clearly, there is something in your hardware that is different from all
> these other people and that FreeBSD doesn't work with.

Probably.  Sounds like an OS bug to me.

-- 
Anthony


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Re: Anthony's drive issues.Re: ssh password delay

[Anthony Atkielski]

Chris writes:

> Tell that to the MS developers then - perhaps they will listen to you.

Done.

> Tell them to stop producing bloated code.

I've tried, but that is both a tendency of many developers (especially
PC developers) and a marketing imperative.

> Code that allows every 12 year-old on the planet to code a new back
> door, Trojan, or virus.

Bloat alone doesn't allow that, and Microsoft code isn't any more
vulnerable to this than any other code of comparable complexity for PC
systems.

> Tell them - and once they start doing that - maybe the real technical
> users around the world won't snicker when they here the word,
> Microsoft.

What does any of this have to do with FreeBSD?

-- 
Anthony


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Re: Anthony's drive issues.Re: ssh password delay

[Anthony Atkielski]

Ted Mittelstaedt writes:

> And to test with just one disk on the controller, specifically the
> Seagate, but also with just the Quantum, to eliminate a possible bad
> interaction between the disks and to eliminate possible incompatible
> firmware in either of the disks to that of the Adaptec controller.
> Since you haven't done that we still don't know if possibly it would
> work fine with only one of the disks on the chain.

A waste of time without first determining what the messages coming from
FreeBSD actually meant.

Do you always start swapping hardware in and out whenever you see an
unfamiliar message on the console?

> It would have been an invalid conjecture because while your utility power
> might be bad, the power your getting from your UPS certainly isn't. I do
> assume you have this on a UPS, right?

Yes ... but what makes you so sure it's not suddenly defective?

-- 
Anthony


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RE: Help!

[bob]

Use your 3.4 FreeBSD system or a win system to download the mini.iso
file for 4.11 and then burn it to cd. Boot your box from the 4.11
mini newly created cd and accept the default slice sizes, select not
to install the ports collection.  The ports collection is over 3000
strong now and some are variations of same base port. You are being
foolish to select all ports as that is unnecessary and a gross waist
of disk space. After base install is complete then select the ports
you want and install separately.

You are way back level and there has been great changes in the
system and the sysinstall process. Read and follow this Install
guide for step by step instructions for 4.11 release as it's the
same as 4.10.


http://freebsd.packards-home.net/index.php


Yes FreeBSD CAN be installed on the fourth of four SCSI disk drives
on the second of two SCSI cards, but if you have other operating
systems on those other disks you will have to manual update the MBR
(master boot record)  multi boot program on the HD the PC bios point
to for selecting which operating system you want to boot from.




-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Charlie
Sorsby
Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 5:51 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Help!

Every time I turn round, someone is telling me that I should update
to a more recent version of freeBSD.  Each time I try, I encounter
nothing but trouble.

Before I even begin:  *CAN* freeBSD be installed on the fourth of
four SCSI disk drives on the second of two SCSI cards?

I know of no way to record the error messages other than with
pencil and paper -- not a very efficient method in this computer
age, especially when one is in the throes of frustration.

I tried some time ago, updating to 4.5, the latest version for
which I have a CDROM.  When I encountered problems and queried this
list, I received a message to the effect that the installer should
quit working after X years.  Perhaps that was tongue in cheek but
it was singularly unhelpful.

So, I continued to use 3.4 which, aside from the fact that I can't
add anything new or update any ports or ... has stood me in good
stead for years.

Finally getting tired of using netscape 4.76 -- I've been
unsuccessful
at finding any "modern" browser that I can install under 3.4 --
and having it crashed by "modern" web sites, I decided to try again.
I fetched the floppy images for 4.11 -- I have no interest in 5.x,
4.x is far enough removed from real BSD that I wouldn't go that
route it I had a choice.

Busy with other things, I finally got round to trying an ftp
install today.

Before I proceed, I suppose that I'd best tell you what my system
comprises:

M'board:Intel D845WN

CPU:P4, 2.4GHz, 478, 512K, 400MHz FSB

Memory: Crucial 512MB, 168-pin, DIMM 64Mx64, PC133 SDRAM

Case:   Antec Sonata with Antec "TruePower" supply.

SCSI cards (presently, the Adaptec is in the PCI slot closer to the
CPU):
Adaptec 2940
Tekram DC-390U2W

Ethernet;   Intel PRO100S

Disk drives (The first three are on the 2940, the fourth on the
Tekram):
IBM DORS-32160 WA0A, 2GB (from original system,
with leftover freeBSD 2.1.5 stuff,
no longer bootable.)
Seagate ST34501N 0015, 4GB (with freeBSD 3.4)
Seagate ST39216N 0010, 9GB (/home -- no OS)
Seagate ST318517W 0105, 18GB (on which I tried
to install 4.5 before and 4.11 today.

CDROM drive:Plextor (don't recall specs.)

Video card: Matrox Millennium G400, AGP4X, 32MB SGRAM

Oh -- FWIW, I'm also running XFree86 4.1.0 although that should not
be relevant to the installation problem but, like the feller says,
for the sake of completeness...

(I'll append -- at the end of this message -- dmesg from latest
boot after unsuccessful installation to cover anything that I've
forgotten.  This system has simply evolved over the years.)

I hope I won't forget any parts of this; I had to get back to 3.4
in order to be able to do this e-mail.  I got through the fdisk
and disklabel (re)configuration of the fourth disk onto which I
planned to install freeBSD 4.11 (having selected "Standard Install")

Here's what I tried to set up as (Unix) partitions (remember this
is on the 18GB drive):

/128MB  # Thought this should be more than
enough
swap 512MB
/usr4196MB
/var 512MB
/usr/local  4196MB
/tmp 512MB
/spare  # Everything else -- to be disposed of later.

I then proceeded to choose the installation "package" or whatever
it's called -- I chose "ALL" and then replied yes to the query
about installing the ports collection.

I believe that the next query was the choice of installation medium;
I chose (the first) ftp and the first (ftp.freebsd.org?) server in
the list and fetching the bits and pieces began.

Within

cdrom trouble with wine

[jason henson]

I have got to a point where I need some help.  I have got starcraft tot 
install, broodwar to install, and update it.  I can run programs from cd 
in with, like setup.exe, but starcraft still can't read a file on the 
cd.  I have mounted the cd in my home dir, created the right wine config 
file, and even used dd to make an iso that I mounted and it still didn't 
work.  I don't think this game even uses any secure rom because a simple 
disc copy on to a cdr works fine in windows.  Anyone had a problem like 
this?

$ wine starcraft.exe
fixme:file:get_default_drive_device auto detection of DOS devices not 
supported on this platform
fixme:ntdll:NtQueryVolumeInformationFile device info not properly 
supported on this platform
err:heap:HEAP_CreateSystemHeap system heap base address 0x8000 not 
available
$

thanks,
Jason
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RE: Anthony's drive issues.Re: ssh password delay

[Ted Mittelstaedt]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>> In any case if you meet the driver author halfway and don't approach
>> it like it's his driver that's broken, but rather that your hardware
>> isn't exactly compliant, (regardless of what you really believe) you
>> won't be put into the anal insertion category.
>
> If I have to worry about hurting the developer's delicate feelings,
> maybe a new developer might be a good idea.  I hoped to stop having to
> deal with schoolkids when I got out of school.  Good developers feel
> morally obligated to deliver bug-free code and don't have to be nagged
> about it.

But the ahc() driver -is- bug free.  It's not bug free when it's running
on modified hardware, but it's fine when it's running with unmodded
hardware.

Your complaint sounds somewhat like the guy who bought a 68 Mustang then
complained when he had to cut away the shock towers to fit in a 460
and headers, then complained more when the torque from his engine twisted
the frame of the car.

Your going to be told to stick your head up your ass as long as you keep
believing that your hardware and it's firmware has nothing to do with
the problem.  Tens of thousands (probably more) of other people run
FreeBSD
servers for years using aic7880 chipsets without seeing what your seeing.
Clearly, there is something in your hardware that is different from all
these other people and that FreeBSD doesn't work with.

Your controller is probably the most common narrow scsi controller in
use among people running FreeBSD production servers.  Only the Symbiosis
narrow scsi chipset probably has a larger following, and a lot of these
are only running tapedrives and CD's.  (since they were sold with no boot
rom)

Ted

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Re: Anthony's drive issues.Re: ssh password delay

[Chris]

Anthony Atkielski wrote:
 > If I have to worry about hurting the developer's delicate feelings,
maybe a new developer might be a good idea.  I hoped to stop having to
deal with schoolkids when I got out of school.  Good developers feel
morally obligated to deliver bug-free code and don't have to be nagged
about it.
Tell that to the MS developers then - perhaps they will listen to you.
Tell them to stop producing bloated code. Code that allows every 12 
year-old on the planet to code a new back door, Trojan, or virus.

Tell them - and once they start doing that - maybe the real technical 
users around the world won't snicker when they here the word, Microsoft.

--
Best regards,
Chris
People will believe anything if you whisper it.
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Re: Anthony's drive issues.Re: ssh password delay

[Anthony Atkielski]

Ted Mittelstaedt writes:

> You also pay Microsoft for their stuff - makes a big difference ...

The rest of FreeBSD seems to have been written without any checks from
me.

> ... my guess if you contacted the ahc() developer and offered to pay
> him the cost of an NT server license he would be more than happy to
> mod the driver no matter how much of an asshole you chose to be to
> him. (or her)

I probably still have a pristine copy of NT Server in a sealed box
somewhere. I think I bought several copies.  I know I have a sealed box
of Office 97, since it's sitting right next to me, but apparently it has
some issues when installed on XP (these days I hesitate to install
anything from Microsoft because installing one MS product seems to
install about 95% of its other products automagically).

> In any case if you meet the driver author halfway and don't approach
> it like it's his driver that's broken, but rather that your hardware
> isn't exactly compliant, (regardless of what you really believe) you
> won't be put into the anal insertion category.

If I have to worry about hurting the developer's delicate feelings,
maybe a new developer might be a good idea.  I hoped to stop having to
deal with schoolkids when I got out of school.  Good developers feel
morally obligated to deliver bug-free code and don't have to be nagged
about it.

-- 
Anthony


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RE: Anthony's drive issues.Re: ssh password delay

[Ted Mittelstaedt]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Ted Mittelstaedt writes:
>
>> Actually it was a waste to you because you don't want to try
>> anything, but it wasn't a waste to others on the list.
>
> It was a waste to me because nobody knows what the problem is or how
> to fix it, and the only suggestions I got were that the hardware was
> failing, which I know isn't true.
>

And to test with just one disk on the controller, specifically the
Seagate,
but also with just the Quantum, to eliminate a possible bad interaction
between the disks and to eliminate possible incompatible firmware in
either of the disks to that of the Adaptec controller.  Since you haven't
done that we still don't know if possibly it would work fine with only
one of the disks on the chain.

>> When trying to troubleshoot a problem you make a conjecture as to
>> what the problem might be then you test for it.
>
> I guess it's a good thing that nobody conjectured that it might be bad
> utility power, or I'd have to switch to a new nuclear plant in order
> to troubleshooot the problem.

It would have been an invalid conjecture because while your utility power
might be bad, the power your getting from your UPS certainly isn't.  I do
assume you have this on a UPS, right?

Ted

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Re: Help!

[Anthony Atkielski]

Charlie Sorsby writes:

> Every time I turn round, someone is telling me that I should update
> to a more recent version of freeBSD.  Each time I try, I encounter
> nothing but trouble.

If the version you are currently running does what you require, there is
no reason for you to update, no matter what anyone says.

> I tried some time ago, updating to 4.5, the latest version for
> which I have a CDROM.  When I encountered problems and queried this
> list, I received a message to the effect that the installer should
> quit working after X years.  Perhaps that was tongue in cheek but
> it was singularly unhelpful.

Nobody suggested that you replace all your hardware?  Well, you were
lucky, then.  Newer versions of FreeBSD never have bugs; if they don't
work on a system that worked with an older version of FreeBSD, the only
possibility is that the hardware somehow failed while you were
installing the newer version.  I've been told this again and again when
I've had problems, but I obstinately refuse to believe it just because
someone says it is so.

> So, I continued to use 3.4 which, aside from the fact that I can't
> add anything new or update any ports or ... has stood me in good
> stead for years.

If it works, don't change it.  Don't listen to the upgrade fanatics who
constantly install the latest bleeding-edge releases of the OS simply
because they don't have anything better to do.  Never fix what isn't
broken.

> Finally getting tired of using netscape 4.76 -- I've been unsuccessful
> at finding any "modern" browser that I can install under 3.4 -- and
> having it crashed by "modern" web sites, I decided to try again.

Ah, that's different ... at least in that case you have a reason to
upgrade.

I daresay that lynx will probably run under 3.4, but it's not a very
exciting browser.

> I fetched the floppy images for 4.11 -- I have no interest in 5.x,
> 4.x is far enough removed from real BSD that I wouldn't go that
> route it I had a choice.

Where and what is "real BSD"?

> Within a very few minutes, the installer complained that it had run
> out of space on / -- why it would have tried to fetch everything to
> the root partition is beyond me but that's what it said.

For what it's worth, I have about 128 MB in use on / after a standard
install of 5.3, which is no doubt bigger than 4.x, but you may still be
getting close.  I put 2 GB on /, and 7% is in use.

-- 
Anthony


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RE: Anthony's drive issues.Re: ssh password delay

[Ted Mittelstaedt]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Ted Mittelstaedt writes:
>
>> In a case like this it is very likely a BSD driver issue - why,
>> because the FreeBSD driver author could not test with every
>> custom-modified microcode when he wrote the driver. There is no list
>> out there of every computer company who has had a source license to
>> the Adaptec microcode and made modifications to it. And naturally you
>> would assume that anyone making mods to the SCSI microcode would have
>> the brains not to break it. In this case that didn't happen. Most
>> likely HP modified the Adaptec microcode because of bugs in the disks
>> that they were supplying with the original Vectras.
>
> I wouldn't automatically assume that there were _bugs_ in the disks.
>

Not for the Seagate that you have but as I've said before I've had
problems with Quantum SCSI disk drives on other controllers, in
different systems, and even on NT.

And, HP used to manufacture their own SCSI disks, as
I recall they stopped doing it sometime around that era.  They put
special firmware that supported some extra features in the HP 6000
and S800/900 (like sector atomicity, patent EP565855, anyone remember
that) in them, and did that up until 1996.  I also recall issues with
the HP disks on certain controllers.  I suspect that some of those
Vectra servers were sold with HP disks in them.

>> ... and b) Anthony is convinced that his Vectra has an Adaptec
>> chipset and microcode that runs that chipset that is pefectly good
>> and identically compliant to every other Adaptec chipset ...
>
> I don't recall ever saying anything about the microcode, only the
> hardware.
>

OK, but let's just say that the way you were using the terminology
you wern't differentiating the microcode from the aic7880 chipset.
Granted, we on the list overlooked this as well - nobody asked
you early on to post the firmware versions of the Adaptec controller.
We all I think assumed that HP just used the Adaptec aic7880 with
the regular Adaptec firmware/microcode.

>> With that sort of attitude if he were to approach the author of the
>> ahc() driver he would be told to stick his head up his ass.
>
> Whereas Microsoft just modified the OS to accommodate the special
> microcode.  That's why Microsoft is number one.

You also pay Microsoft for their stuff - makes a big difference - my
guess
if you contacted the ahc() developer and offered to pay him the cost of
an NT server license he would be more than happy to mod the driver no
matter how much of an asshole you chose to be to him.  (or her)

In any case if you meet the driver author halfway and don't approach it
like it's his driver that's broken, but rather that your hardware isn't
exactly compliant, (regardless of what you really believe) you won't be
put into the anal insertion category.

Ted

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Re: cvsup, portupgrade, installing ports, and firewalls

[Erik Trulsson]

On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 04:01:08PM -0700, Pat Maddox wrote:
> I've got the pf firewall installed, and every time I run cvsup,
> portupgrade or try to install ports, I have to disable it.  What
> outgoing and incoming ports do I need to allow in order to run these
> without disabling the firewall?

The cvsup(1) manpage describes exactly what ports need to be opened for
cvsup to work. (Normally just outgoing TCP connections to port 5999 on
the server.)

Fetching distfiles for ports is usually done via either HTTP or FTP, so
if you allow those out everyting should work.



-- 

Erik Trulsson
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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cvsup, portupgrade, installing ports, and firewalls

[Pat Maddox]

I've got the pf firewall installed, and every time I run cvsup,
portupgrade or try to install ports, I have to disable it.  What
outgoing and incoming ports do I need to allow in order to run these
without disabling the firewall?
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Help!

[Charlie Sorsby]

Every time I turn round, someone is telling me that I should update
to a more recent version of freeBSD.  Each time I try, I encounter
nothing but trouble.

Before I even begin:  *CAN* freeBSD be installed on the fourth of
four SCSI disk drives on the second of two SCSI cards?

I know of no way to record the error messages other than with
pencil and paper -- not a very efficient method in this computer
age, especially when one is in the throes of frustration.

I tried some time ago, updating to 4.5, the latest version for
which I have a CDROM.  When I encountered problems and queried this
list, I received a message to the effect that the installer should
quit working after X years.  Perhaps that was tongue in cheek but
it was singularly unhelpful.

So, I continued to use 3.4 which, aside from the fact that I can't
add anything new or update any ports or ... has stood me in good
stead for years.

Finally getting tired of using netscape 4.76 -- I've been unsuccessful
at finding any "modern" browser that I can install under 3.4 --
and having it crashed by "modern" web sites, I decided to try again.
I fetched the floppy images for 4.11 -- I have no interest in 5.x,
4.x is far enough removed from real BSD that I wouldn't go that
route it I had a choice.

Busy with other things, I finally got round to trying an ftp
install today.

Before I proceed, I suppose that I'd best tell you what my system
comprises:

M'board:Intel D845WN

CPU:P4, 2.4GHz, 478, 512K, 400MHz FSB

Memory: Crucial 512MB, 168-pin, DIMM 64Mx64, PC133 SDRAM

Case:   Antec Sonata with Antec "TruePower" supply.

SCSI cards (presently, the Adaptec is in the PCI slot closer to the
CPU):
Adaptec 2940
Tekram DC-390U2W

Ethernet;   Intel PRO100S

Disk drives (The first three are on the 2940, the fourth on the
Tekram):
IBM DORS-32160 WA0A, 2GB (from original system,
with leftover freeBSD 2.1.5 stuff,
no longer bootable.)
Seagate ST34501N 0015, 4GB (with freeBSD 3.4)
Seagate ST39216N 0010, 9GB (/home -- no OS)
Seagate ST318517W 0105, 18GB (on which I tried
to install 4.5 before and 4.11 today.

CDROM drive:Plextor (don't recall specs.)

Video card: Matrox Millennium G400, AGP4X, 32MB SGRAM

Oh -- FWIW, I'm also running XFree86 4.1.0 although that should not
be relevant to the installation problem but, like the feller says,
for the sake of completeness...

(I'll append -- at the end of this message -- dmesg from latest
boot after unsuccessful installation to cover anything that I've
forgotten.  This system has simply evolved over the years.)

I hope I won't forget any parts of this; I had to get back to 3.4
in order to be able to do this e-mail.  I got through the fdisk
and disklabel (re)configuration of the fourth disk onto which I
planned to install freeBSD 4.11 (having selected "Standard Install")

Here's what I tried to set up as (Unix) partitions (remember this
is on the 18GB drive):

/128MB  # Thought this should be more than enough
swap 512MB
/usr4196MB
/var 512MB
/usr/local  4196MB
/tmp 512MB
/spare  # Everything else -- to be disposed of later.

I then proceeded to choose the installation "package" or whatever
it's called -- I chose "ALL" and then replied yes to the query
about installing the ports collection.

I believe that the next query was the choice of installation medium;
I chose (the first) ftp and the first (ftp.freebsd.org?) server in
the list and fetching the bits and pieces began.

Within a very few minutes, the installer complained that it had run
out of space on / -- why it would have tried to fetch everything to
the root partition is beyond me but that's what it said.  Oh --
there was one previous complaint about not being able to create a
swap partition that I'd requested as partition b.  I don't
understand that, either.

Aside (just in case it may be relevant):  Recently, I've not been
able to boot the CDROM.  I had no reason to try when I rebuilt the
system some time ago with the Intel m'board and Antec case.  I
first noticed it some time ago when I tried to install 4.5.  I had
never had a problem with the old Gigabyte m'board system.  As I
said, I don't know if this is relevant but thought I'd better
mention it just in case.

Here's the dmesg output:

Copyright (c) 1992-1999 FreeBSD Inc.
Copyright (c) 1982, 1986, 1989, 1991, 1993
The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved.
FreeBSD 3.4-RELEASE #6: Tue Jun 29 08:43:56 MDT 2004
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/usr/src/sys/compile/KERNEL.CRS
Timecounter "i8254"  frequency 1193182 Hz
Timecounter "TSC"  frequency 2392250892 Hz
CPU: unknown (2392.25-MHz 686-class CPU)
  Origin = "GenuineIntel"  Id = 0xf27  Stepping = 7
  
Features=0xbfebfbff,,,MMX,FXSR,,>
real memory 

Re: AWK in 4.X different from 5.X?

[Jonathan Chen]

On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 12:09:03PM -0500, Francisco Reyes wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Mar 2005, Mario Hoerich wrote:
> 
> >>Now I just wonder how to get date in my output. :-(
> >
> >Well, if nothing else helps there's always system("date").
> >However, you could also install lang/gawk.
> 
> Since this was from a shell script I did
> date | awk '{print "#"$1 " " $2 "-" $3 "-" $6}'

How about:
date +"#%a %b - %d - %Y"
-- 
Jonathan Chen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--
char *p="char *p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
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RE: Does QEMU support Windows VPN ? (5th try)

[Ted Mittelstaedt]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>>> I have been trying to connect from my FreeBSD box to a Microsoft
>>> 
>>> 
>>> VPN.  I am running Windows 2000 Pro and also Windows Millennium
>>> inside  QEMU.  I have also tried using both "-user-net" and
>>> "/dev/tun0" connections.  The connections fail while trying to
>>> authenticate my name and password.
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> What does the port maintainer say?
>> 
>> 
> The port maintainer has not replied to my email I sent them.
> 
> Am I the only one trying to use Microsoft's VPN and RemoteAccess
> software from within QEMU ? 
> 

We use poptop from the ports and it works fine for Microsoft's PPP
VPN client.  If you want my notes on how to set it up and configure
it just ask.

Ted

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Re: upgrading net-snmp-5.2.1 gives error

[gustaaf wijnands]

Thomas Foster wrote:
Does it compile WITH_PERL="NO" ?
It doesn't compile WITHOUT_PERL=yes

what version of autoconf and libtool are you using?
pkg_info |grep autoconf
autoconf-2.13.000227_5 Automatically configure source code on many Un*x 
platforms
autoconf-2.59_2 Automatically configure source code on many Un*x 
platforms

pkg_info |grep libtool
libtool-1.3.5_2 Generic shared library support script (version 1.3)
libtool-1.5.10_1Generic shared library support script (version 1.5)

and perl -v returns what version?
perl -v
This is perl, v5.8.6 built for i386-freebsd-64int
perl -V
Summary of my perl5 (revision 5 version 8 subversion 6) configuration:
  Platform:
osname=freebsd, osvers=5.3-release-p5, archname=i386-freebsd-64int
uname='freebsd laptop.intern 5.3-release-p5 freebsd 5.3-release-p5 
#7: wed ja 
   n 26 21:10:23 cet 2005 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:usrobjusrsrcsysmykernel i386 '
config_args='-sde -Dprefix=/usr/local 
-Darchlib=/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.8.6/mach 
-Dprivlib=/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.8.6 
-Dman3dir=/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.8.6/perl 
  /man/man3 
-Dman1dir=/usr/local/man/man1 -Dsitearch=/usr/local/lib/perl5/site_perl 

 /5.8.6/mach -Dsitelib=/usr/local/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.6 
-Dscriptdir=/usr/local 
   /bin 
-Dsiteman3dir=/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.8.6/man/man3 
-Dsiteman1dir=/usr/local/m 
   an/man1 -Ui_malloc -Ui_iconv 
-Uinstallusrbinperl -Dcc=cc -Doptimize=-O -pipe  -Du 

seshrplib -Dccflags=-DAPPLLIB_EXP="/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.8.6/BSDPAN" 
-Ud_dosuid 
-Ui_gdbm -Dusethreads=n -Dusemymalloc=y 
-Duse64bitint'
hint=recommended, useposix=true, d_sigaction=define
usethreads=undef use5005threads=undef useithreads=undef 
usemultiplicity=undef
useperlio=define d_sfio=undef uselargefiles=define usesocks=undef
use64bitint=define use64bitall=undef uselongdouble=undef
usemymalloc=y, bincompat5005=undef
  Compiler:
cc='cc', ccflags 
='-DAPPLLIB_EXP="/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.8.6/BSDPAN" -DHAS_FP 

  SETMASK -DHAS_FLOATINGPOINT_H -fno-strict-aliasing -pipe 
-I/usr/local/include',
optimize='-O -pipe ',
cppflags='-DAPPLLIB_EXP="/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.8.6/BSDPAN" 
-DHAS_FPSETMASK - 
  DHAS_FLOATINGPOINT_H -fno-strict-aliasing 
-pipe -I/usr/local/include'
ccversion='', gccversion='3.4.2 [FreeBSD] 20040728', gccosandvers=''
intsize=4, longsize=4, ptrsize=4, doublesize=8, byteorder=12345678
d_longlong=define, longlongsize=8, d_longdbl=define, longdblsize=12
ivtype='long long', ivsize=8, nvtype='double', nvsize=8, 
Off_t='off_t', lseek 
 size=8
alignbytes=4, prototype=define
  Linker and Libraries:
ld='cc', ldflags =' -Wl,-E -L/usr/local/lib'
libpth=/usr/lib /usr/local/lib
libs=-lm -lcrypt -lutil
perllibs=-lm -lcrypt -lutil
libc=, so=so, useshrplib=true, libperl=libperl.so
gnulibc_version=''
  Dynamic Linking:
dlsrc=dl_dlopen.xs, dlext=so, d_dlsymun=undef, ccdlflags=' 
-Wl,-R/usr/local/ 
  lib/perl5/5.8.6/mach/CORE'
cccdlflags='-DPIC -fPIC', lddlflags='-shared  -L/usr/local/lib'

Characteristics of this binary (from libperl):
  Compile-time options: USE_64_BIT_INT USE_LARGE_FILES
  Locally applied patches:
SUIDPERLIO0 - fix PERLIO_DEBUG local root exploit (CAN-2005-0155)
SUIDPERLIO1 - fix PERLIO_DEBUG buffer overflow (CAN-2005-0156)
  Built under freebsd
  Compiled at Feb  6 2005 20:47:58
  @INC:
/usr/local/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.6/mach
/usr/local/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.6
/usr/local/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.5
/usr/local/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.6.1
/usr/local/lib/perl5/site_perl
/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.8.6/BSDPAN
/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.8.6/mach
/usr/local/lib/perl5/5.8.6
.

what happens after running ldconfig -R
still the same error. Any idea? Thank for helping me
--
Gustaaf Wijnands
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Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Christopher Nehren]

On 2005-03-27, Chuck Robey scribbled these
curious markings:
> Just curious if you folks have tried the mozilla application, available 
> only from mozilla (not firefox) called chatzilla?  I have tried nearly 
> all of the other IRC clients, it's not a minimal one, but it's very very 
> nice.

I personally try to keep things as console-based as possible. screen,
irssi, elinks, mutt, slrn and vim are my best friends. I'd be in serious
trouble if ncurses broke. :)

Best Regards,
Christopher Nehren
-- 
I abhor a system designed for the "user", if that word is a coded
pejorative meaning "stupid and unsophisticated". -- Ken Thompson
If you ask the wrong questions, you get answers like "42" and "God".
Unix is user friendly. However, it isn't idiot friendly.

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Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Chuck Robey]

Christopher Nehren wrote:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
On 2005-03-27, Gert Cuykens scribbled these
curious markings:
Thx ps how do you do /set | more in irc language ?

Have you tried using the backscroll, accessible (in irssi at least) with
Page Up / Page Down?
Just curious if you folks have tried the mozilla application, available 
only from mozilla (not firefox) called chatzilla?  I have tried nearly 
all of the other IRC clients, it's not a minimal one, but it's very very 
nice.

Best Regards,
Christopher Nehren
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (FreeBSD)
iD8DBQFCRxu9k/lo7zvzJioRAkSDAJ9haweGhIh26RzklyJhilgupulATQCeJVi4
zI7WihLvMPa9ieub338Ss6Q=
=Rn6H
-END PGP SIGNATURE-
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Re: upgrading net-snmp-5.2.1 gives error

[Thomas Foster]

Does it compile WITH_PERL="NO" ?
what version of autoconf and libtool are you using?
and perl -v returns what version?
what happens after running ldconfig -R
T
- Original Message - 
From: "gustaaf wijnands" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 1:35 PM
Subject: upgrading net-snmp-5.2.1 gives error


Hello all,
portupgrading net-snmp-5.2.1 doesn't seem to work on my machine:
/libexec/ld-elf.so.1: 
/usr/local/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.6/mach/auto/SNMP/SNMP.so: Undefined 
symbol "perl_get_sv"
*** Error code 1

Stop in /usr/ports/net-mgmt/net-snmp/work/net-snmp-5.2.1.
*** Error code 1
Stop in /usr/ports/net-mgmt/net-snmp.
** Command failed [exit code 1]: /usr/bin/script -qa 
/tmp/portupgrade3553.1 make
** Fix the problem and try again.

I am running FreeBSD 5.3-RELEASE-p5 #7. Anybody any idea what can be wrong 
and what can be done about it?

Thanks,
--
Gustaaf Wijnands
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Re: more problems with 5.3 and "TIMEOUT - WRITE_DMA"

[Mike Daemon]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 13:32:43 -0800, Thomas Foster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I had this same issue

I´ll have seen some more posts on the list with about the same problem
therefore, I hope some bright one will take alook at the code.. and
post something smart.. I´m very much stuck, hopeing any new snapshot
will work..

 on an older AMD Nforce board.  5.2.1 seemed to install
> and run.. but moving to 5.3 gave me issues.  I tinkered with the DMA
> settings in the BIOS.. to no avail.  The Geometry seemed to be off on the
> drive I noticed (IBM deskstar) when I newfs'd it.. so I changed out drives..
> but never got it working..  I eventually just dropped Gentoo on it.
> 
> What chipset, drive controller hard drive are you using on this system?

http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=ata&sektion=4&manpath=FreeBSD+5.3-RELEASE

I´ll notised that my idecontroller IS supported by the ata-driver,
witch makes it even stranger.. (I think I will check on my cabling
once more, even if it´s a newly installed _rounded_ 32 pin cable..)

My atacontroller: SiS 5513
My HDD: Seagate 200 GB


> 
> T
> 
> - Original Message -
> From: "Mike Daemon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "FreeBSD Questions" 
> Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 1:15 PM
> Subject: more problems with 5.3 and "TIMEOUT - WRITE_DMA"
> 
> I got this annoying problem when upgradeing to 5.3, the miniinst iso
> blurps out "TIMEOUT - WRITE_DMA" when it starts writing base to my
> disk. And when I tried to first install 5.2.1 and upgrade (cvsup, make
> buildworld etc.. ) to 5.3 that way everything seems fine until I
> reboot to single-user-mode, as soon as Im starting to write anything
> to the disk it´s blurping out those errors.. I have diagnosticed my
> disk, checked my cabling and fixed my PSU (installed a brand new one).
> No difference. I noticed that my ide-controller was supported in 4.11,
> but not? in 5.3, is that realy true? seems very strange...
> 
> Sence I duel boot with Wintendo/Lunix and don´t see this problem with
> those oses I´m very confused of what to do next..
> 
> I´ll tried some snapshots to but no luck...
> 
> / Mike
> 
> ps My dmesg goes in the attachment, in hope for a patch/solution to
> this problem. ds
> 
> 
> 
> > ___
> > freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list
> > http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions
> > To unsubscribe, send any mail to
> > "[EMAIL PROTECTED]"
> >
> 
>
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upgrading net-snmp-5.2.1 gives error

[gustaaf wijnands]

Hello all,
portupgrading net-snmp-5.2.1 doesn't seem to work on my machine:
/libexec/ld-elf.so.1: 
/usr/local/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.6/mach/auto/SNMP/SNMP.so: Undefined 
symbol "perl_get_sv"
*** Error code 1

Stop in /usr/ports/net-mgmt/net-snmp/work/net-snmp-5.2.1.
*** Error code 1
Stop in /usr/ports/net-mgmt/net-snmp.
** Command failed [exit code 1]: /usr/bin/script -qa 
/tmp/portupgrade3553.1 make
** Fix the problem and try again.

I am running FreeBSD 5.3-RELEASE-p5 #7. Anybody any idea what can be 
wrong and what can be done about it?

Thanks,
--
Gustaaf Wijnands
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Re: hyper threading.

[Anthony Atkielski]

RW writes:

> Multiple processors can run multiple processes at the same time. A HT
> processor can only run two threads from the same process.

This is incorrect.  HT processors don't care where the threads come
from; it is possible to run threads from two completely different
processes on the same HT processor.  The threads have completely
independent architectural states and can come from anywhere in the
system.

However, the design of hyperthreading favors a certain amount of
commonality between the contexts of each thread.  While it's best to
have different instruction mixes, it helps if both threads are executing
in the same memory spaces, since resources such as on-device cache are
shared between the threads in the HT processor.  Completely different
threads in different processes executing out of different areas of
memory might cause more contention for cache and similar resources (TLB,
etc.), diminishing the advantage of hyperthreading.

Also, spin waits need special consideration on HT processors.  If one
thread spins on a gate or semaphore held by the other thread, it
effectively slows the other thread down, keeping both threads moving
more slowly than they might if they were in completely separate
processors.  A solution for this suggested by Intel is the PAUSE
instruction, which forces complete execution of a spin-wait instruction
before the next execution can begin, thus freeing resources for the
other thread in the processor.  Intel recommends the use of PAUSE even
when HT processors are not being used.

Still another recommendation is to schedule first physically independent
processors, then HT logical processors.  This requires that the OS be
aware of the difference between the two.  This usually makes more
efficient use of processor resources, except for some very specific
cases where running two threads on the same HT processor might run as
fast or faster than running them separately (if they are referencing a
lot of the same shared resources, such as cache).

Intel claims up to a 30% improvement in throughput for an HT processor
as compared to a normal processor.  For truly separate physical
processors, the improvement is more like 60%, and possibly much more.

Hyperthreading should not be seen as a substitute for multiple
processors.  It's more like a way to make better use of each processor.

Hyperthreading is especially useful when multiple execution threads
exist in a common context, such as multithreaded daemons or
multithreaded desktop applications.  In these situations, the HT
architecture is used to the fullest, with corresponding improvements in
performance.

Recent changes in FreeBSD architecture to allow a multithreaded kernel
are among the situations in which hyperthreading can be put to good use.
The new multithreaded architecture of Apache 2.x should also be able to
put HT to good use.

-- 
Anthony


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Re: more problems with 5.3 and "TIMEOUT - WRITE_DMA"

[Thomas Foster]

I had this same issue on an older AMD Nforce board.  5.2.1 seemed to install 
and run.. but moving to 5.3 gave me issues.  I tinkered with the DMA 
settings in the BIOS.. to no avail.  The Geometry seemed to be off on the 
drive I noticed (IBM deskstar) when I newfs'd it.. so I changed out drives.. 
but never got it working..  I eventually just dropped Gentoo on it.

What chipset, drive controller hard drive are you using on this system?
T
- Original Message - 
From: "Mike Daemon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "FreeBSD Questions" 
Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 1:15 PM
Subject: more problems with 5.3 and "TIMEOUT - WRITE_DMA"

I got this annoying problem when upgradeing to 5.3, the miniinst iso
blurps out "TIMEOUT - WRITE_DMA" when it starts writing base to my
disk. And when I tried to first install 5.2.1 and upgrade (cvsup, make
buildworld etc.. ) to 5.3 that way everything seems fine until I
reboot to single-user-mode, as soon as Im starting to write anything
to the disk it´s blurping out those errors.. I have diagnosticed my
disk, checked my cabling and fixed my PSU (installed a brand new one).
No difference. I noticed that my ide-controller was supported in 4.11,
but not? in 5.3, is that realy true? seems very strange...
Sence I duel boot with Wintendo/Lunix and don´t see this problem with
those oses I´m very confused of what to do next..
I´ll tried some snapshots to but no luck...
/ Mike
ps My dmesg goes in the attachment, in hope for a patch/solution to
this problem. ds



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more problems with 5.3 and "TIMEOUT - WRITE_DMA"

[Mike Daemon]

I got this annoying problem when upgradeing to 5.3, the miniinst iso
blurps out "TIMEOUT - WRITE_DMA" when it starts writing base to my
disk. And when I tried to first install 5.2.1 and upgrade (cvsup, make
buildworld etc.. ) to 5.3 that way everything seems fine until I
reboot to single-user-mode, as soon as Im starting to write anything
to the disk it´s blurping out those errors.. I have diagnosticed my
disk, checked my cabling and fixed my PSU (installed a brand new one).
No difference. I noticed that my ide-controller was supported in 4.11,
but not? in 5.3, is that realy true? seems very strange...

Sence I duel boot with Wintendo/Lunix and don´t see this problem with
those oses I´m very confused of what to do next..

I´ll tried some snapshots to but no luck... 

/ Mike

ps My dmesg goes in the attachment, in hope for a patch/solution to
this problem. ds
Copyright (c) 1992-2004 The FreeBSD Project.
Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994
The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved.
FreeBSD 5.2.1-RELEASE #0: Mon Feb 23 20:45:55 GMT 2004
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/usr/obj/usr/src/sys/GENERIC
Preloaded elf kernel "/boot/kernel/kernel" at 0xc0e6d000.
Preloaded mfs_root "/boot/mfsroot" at 0xc0e6d244.
Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/acpi.ko" at 0xc0e6d288.
ACPI APIC Table: 
Timecounter "i8254" frequency 1193182 Hz quality 0
CPU: Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 2.40GHz (2400.10-MHz 686-class CPU)
  Origin = "GenuineIntel"  Id = 0xf24  Stepping = 4
  
Features=0x3febfbff
real memory  = 268419072 (255 MB)
avail memory = 246906880 (235 MB)
ioapic0  irqs 0-23 on motherboard
Pentium Pro MTRR support enabled
npx0: [FAST]
npx0:  on motherboard
npx0: INT 16 interface
acpi0:  on motherboard
acpi0: Overriding SCI Interrupt from IRQ 9 to IRQ 20
pcibios: BIOS version 2.10
Using $PIR table, 10 entries at 0xc00f1b10
acpi0: Power Button (fixed)
Timecounter "ACPI-fast" frequency 3579545 Hz quality 1000
acpi_timer0: <24-bit timer at 3.579545MHz> port 0xe408-0xe40b on acpi0
acpi_cpu0:  on acpi0
acpi_button0:  on acpi0
pcib0:  port 0xcf8-0xcff on acpi0
pci0:  on pcib0
agp0:  mem 0xe800-0xebff at
device 0.0 on pci0
pcib1:  at device 1.0 on pci0
pci1:  on pcib1
pci1:  at device 0.0 (no driver attached)
isab0:  at device 2.0 on pci0
isa0:  on isab0
ohci0:  mem 0xe680-0xe6800fff irq 20 at
device 2.2 on pci0
usb0: OHCI version 1.0, legacy support
usb0: SMM does not respond, resetting
usb0:  on ohci0
usb0: USB revision 1.0
uhub0: SiS OHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1
uhub0: 3 ports with 3 removable, self powered
ohci1:  mem 0xe600-0xe6000fff irq 23 at
device 2.3 on pci0
usb1: OHCI version 1.0, legacy support
usb1: SMM does not respond, resetting
usb1:  on ohci1
usb1: USB revision 1.0
uhub1: SiS OHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1
uhub1: 3 ports with 3 removable, self powered
ums0: Microsoft Microsoft 5-Button Mouse with IntelliEye(TM), rev
1.10/3.00, addr 2, iclass 3/1
ums0: 5 buttons and Z dir.
atapci0:  port 0xd800-0xd80f at device 2.5 on pci0
ata0: at 0x1f0 irq 14 on atapci0
ata0: [MPSAFE]
ata1: at 0x170 irq 15 on atapci0
ata1: [MPSAFE]
pci0:  at device 5.0 (no driver attached)
rl0:  port 0xa400-0xa4ff mem
0xe500-0xe5ff irq 17 at device 9.0 on pci0
rl0: Ethernet address: 00:c1:26:0e:fe:f5
miibus0:  on rl0
rlphy0:  on miibus0
rlphy0:  10baseT, 10baseT-FDX, 100baseTX, 100baseTX-FDX, auto
fdc0:  port
0x3f7,0x3f2-0x3f5 irq 6 drq 2 on acpi0
fdc0: FIFO enabled, 8 bytes threshold
fd0: <1440-KB 3.5" drive> on fdc0 drive 0
ppc0 port 0x778-0x77b,0x378-0x37f irq 7 drq 3 on acpi0
ppc0: SMC-like chipset (ECP/EPP/PS2/NIBBLE) in COMPATIBLE mode
ppc0: FIFO with 16/16/16 bytes threshold
ppbus0:  on ppc0
plip0:  on ppbus0
lpt0:  on ppbus0
lpt0: Interrupt-driven port
ppi0:  on ppbus0
sio0 port 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 on acpi0
sio0: type 16550A
sio1 port 0x2f8-0x2ff irq 3 on acpi0
sio1: type 16550A
atkbdc0:  port 0x64,0x60 irq 1 on acpi0
atkbd0:  flags 0x1 irq 1 on atkbdc0
kbd0 at atkbd0
orm0:  at iomem 0xd-0xd3fff on isa0
pmtimer0 on isa0
sc0:  at flags 0x100 on isa0
sc0: VGA <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x300>
vga0:  at port 0x3c0-0x3df iomem 0xa-0xb on isa0
Timecounter "TSC" frequency 2400095416 Hz quality 800
Timecounters tick every 10.000 msec
md0: Preloaded image  4423680 bytes at 0xc09e16d8
GEOM: create disk ad0 dp=0xc31ecd60
ad0: 19541MB  [39703/16/63] at ata0-master UDMA33
acd0: DVDR <_NEC DVD_RW ND-3500AG> at ata0-slave PIO4
GEOM: create disk ad2 dp=0xc3184960
ad2: 190782MB  [387621/16/63] at ata1-master UDMA33
GEOM: create disk ad3 dp=0xc3184560
ad3: 58644MB  [119150/16/63] at ata1-slave UDMA33
Mounting root from ufs:/dev/md0
module_register: module pci/txp already exists!
Module pci/txp failed to register: 17
interface cd9660.1 already present in the KLD 'kernel'!
interface sysvmsg.1 already present in the KLD 'kernel'!
module_register: module pccard/xe already exists!
Module pccard/xe failed to register: 17
module_register: modul

Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Gert Cuykens]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 20:45:04 + (UTC), Christopher Nehren
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> On 2005-03-27, Gert Cuykens scribbled these
> curious markings:
> > Thx ps how do you do /set | more in irc language ?
> 
> Have you tried using the backscroll, accessible (in irssi at least) with
> Page Up / Page Down?
> 

no :P
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Re: hyper threading.

[RW]

On Saturday 26 March 2005 22:45, Anthony Atkielski wrote:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> > Yes, the theory is very nice; you've done a nice
> > job reading Intel's marketing garb.
>
> I haven't read their marketing materials.  I'm simply going by the
> technical descriptions I've read of the architecture.
>
> > However if you don't have a specific hyperthreading-aware scheduler
> > and particularly well-written, threaded applications, you'll lose more
> > than you'll gain.
>
> If that were true, then it would be equally true of systems with actual
> multiple physical processors.  In practice, multiple processors provide
> an obvious performance gain, and hyperthreading does, too, although it's
> much more modest than the gain obtained from physically independent
> processors.

The situation is very different.

Multiple processors can run multiple processes at the same time. A HT 
processor can only run two threads from the same process. And most software 
isn't multithreaded.
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Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Christopher Nehren]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 2005-03-27, Gert Cuykens scribbled these
curious markings:
> Thx ps how do you do /set | more in irc language ?

Have you tried using the backscroll, accessible (in irssi at least) with
Page Up / Page Down?

Best Regards,
Christopher Nehren
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (FreeBSD)

iD8DBQFCRxu9k/lo7zvzJioRAkSDAJ9haweGhIh26RzklyJhilgupulATQCeJVi4
zI7WihLvMPa9ieub338Ss6Q=
=Rn6H
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

-- 
I abhor a system designed for the "user", if that word is a coded
pejorative meaning "stupid and unsophisticated". -- Ken Thompson
If you ask the wrong questions, you get answers like "42" and "God".
Unix is user friendly. However, it isn't idiot friendly.

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Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Gert Cuykens]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 18:13:18 + (UTC), Christopher Nehren
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 2005-03-27, Gert Cuykens scribbled these
> curious markings:
> > And how do you turn on beeps in irssi ?
> 
> /set beep_msg_level hilight
> 
> I recommend perusing through irssi's online help. You'd be surprised at
> what's available (even *I'm* surprised, and I've been using it for a
> while; even tinkered with the Perl API).

Thx ps how do you do /set | more in irc language ?
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Re: inetd vs standalone daemon

[Thomas Foster]

Im still confused as to your questions.. again.. most of these are answered 
by a simple glance at the FreeBSD handbook:

http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/network-inetd.html
If you want to remove the inetd binary from your system .. go for it...
There are those who still use it as a wrapper for other services... such at 
identd (auth) or even finger

As far as removing it from sources.. you could try to "pull a freebsd source 
developers leg" but I assume you wont get very far..

The Fed-Ex metaphor is interesting but not really relevent to all services 
wrapped in inetd..

T
- Original Message - 
From: "Gert Cuykens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: 
Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 12:01 PM
Subject: Re: inetd vs standalone daemon


On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 14:13:00 -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Is inetd a daemon that start other daemons ?
YES
> Is sql and apache a standalone daemon ?
YES
> Can i delete inetd ?
Just don't start it at boot time
and that would be (rc.conf) inetd_enable="NO" ?
> I vote we get rid of inetd :)
It's your box, do what ever you want
So how do we remove it from freebsd ? Please let it be a pkg_delete :)
If not witch freebsd source developer do i need to pull his leg to
remove it from source into a pkg ?
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Re: inetd vs standalone daemon

[Christopher Nehren]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 2005-03-27, Gert Cuykens scribbled these
curious markings:
> So how do we remove it from freebsd ? Please let it be a pkg_delete :)
> If not witch freebsd source developer do i need to pull his leg to
> remove it from source into a pkg ?

Here's a bit of basic information about FreeBSD. Despite what you may
have learned about Linux, having every single file in the system
managed by a package is *NOT* a good idea[1]. You end up with systems
lacking compilers[2] that way, which confuse new users who try to build
software. inetd is not part of any package, and I hope that it never
will be. inetd is part of FreeBSD's base system -- the collection of
software, documentation, &c. that the FreeBSD group maintains on their
own, separate from the Ports Collection which is (for the most part)
composed entirely of third-party software.

I will admit that this doesn't permit for the granularity available in
Linux distributions. But personally, I don't want that sort of
granularity. I don't want to have to *worry* about installing a
compiler, OpenSSL, and the like. I just want to tell it to install
everything and have it *actually* install everything.

If you want to make a fully package-based version of FreeBSD, where
everything from /bin/ls to /usr/sbin/inetd is a package, then by all
means do so. You won't even be alone in your desire. I seem to remember
a group of people vocalising a request for this a while ago. You'll
never be able to count me as a user, though. :)

[1]: I'm not exactly pleased with the "distributions" concept when you
install, but since I always select "All" anyway, it's a moot point I
suppose.

[2]: And other crucial things like OpenSSL, which even crops up on
FreeBSD from time to time.

Best Regards,
Christopher Nehren
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-- 
I abhor a system designed for the "user", if that word is a coded
pejorative meaning "stupid and unsophisticated". -- Ken Thompson
If you ask the wrong questions, you get answers like "42" and "God".
Unix is user friendly. However, it isn't idiot friendly.

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Re: inetd vs standalone daemon

[Christopher Nehren]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 2005-03-27, Gert Cuykens scribbled these
curious markings:
> Is inetd a daemon that start other daemons ?

Kind of. Its manual page is very descriptive.

> Is sql and apache a standalone daemon ?

SQL is (or is not, depending upon whom you believe) the Structured Query
Language. It's a standard, a concept, an idea. It has no representation
as software. Certain implementations of SQL, however, in server-based
environments manifest themselves as daemons, yes. Certain other
implementations in server-like environments don't manifest themselves as
daemons (e.g.  SQLite).

Apache can be run either way, but I've never found a need to run it
under inetd. It's always served me well in standalone mode.

> Can i delete inetd ?

I wouldn't. Why do you want to do so? Besides, unless you add the
appropriate flag somewhere in your buildworld infrastructure, it'll be
built and reinstalled when you update your base system anyway.

> I vote we get rid of inetd :)

And I vote that you research your votes before making them.

Best Regards,
Christopher Nehren
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-- 
I abhor a system designed for the "user", if that word is a coded
pejorative meaning "stupid and unsophisticated". -- Ken Thompson
If you ask the wrong questions, you get answers like "42" and "God".
Unix is user friendly. However, it isn't idiot friendly.

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Re: inetd vs standalone daemon

[Gert Cuykens]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 14:13:00 -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Is inetd a daemon that start other daemons ?
> YES
> 
> > Is sql and apache a standalone daemon ?
> YES
> 
> > Can i delete inetd ?
> Just don't start it at boot time

and that would be (rc.conf) inetd_enable="NO" ?
 
> > I vote we get rid of inetd :)
> It's your box, do what ever you want

So how do we remove it from freebsd ? Please let it be a pkg_delete :)
If not witch freebsd source developer do i need to pull his leg to
remove it from source into a pkg ?
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Re: inetd vs standalone daemon

[Gert Cuykens]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 21:05:11 +0200, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 07:46:09PM +0200, Gert Cuykens wrote:
> > Can i delete inetd ?
> 
> Why would you want to? Just don't enable it from /etc/rc.conf
> and you'll be fine. If you need it, you can always enable it
> later. Many machines run just fine without inetd. It all depends
> what you wanna do.
> 
> > I vote we get rid of inetd :)
> 
> No. With inetd, you can also turn regular filters into network
> aware programs (sort of). And not every network service is always
> needed all the time. Having a deamon for each of those seldom used
> services hanging around is just wastful.

i think its less wasteful cpu time to run separate daemons then to run
1 big daemon. Because the big daemon needs to find out which service
it needs to start every time a fedex guy is knocking at the door while
a separate daemon already knows what it needs to do before the fedex
guy is standing at the door.
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Re: inetd vs standalone daemon

[Marty Landman]

At 02:05 PM 3/27/2005, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 07:46:09PM +0200, Gert Cuykens wrote:
> I vote we get rid of inetd :)
No. With inetd, you can also turn regular filters into network
aware programs (sort of). And not every network service is always
needed all the time. Having a deamon for each of those seldom used
services hanging around is just wastful.
How much wasting is going on though? Can I get a good feel for resources 
consumed by looking at 'top'?

I'm happy with my set up the way it is and am just asking in the hopes of 
learning more than I know (not very hard at this point).

Marty
Marty Landman, Face 2 Interface Inc. 845-679-9387
Search & Sort Easily: http://face2interface.com/Products/FormATable.shtml
Web Installed Formmail: http://face2interface.com/formINSTal
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RE: inetd vs standalone daemon

[bob]

> Is inetd a daemon that start other daemons ?
YES

> Is sql and apache a standalone daemon ?
YES

> Can i delete inetd ?
Just don't start it at boot time

> I vote we get rid of inetd :)
It's your box, do what ever you want

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Re: inetd vs standalone daemon

[cpghost]

On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 07:46:09PM +0200, Gert Cuykens wrote:
> Can i delete inetd ?

Why would you want to? Just don't enable it from /etc/rc.conf
and you'll be fine. If you need it, you can always enable it
later. Many machines run just fine without inetd. It all depends
what you wanna do.

> I vote we get rid of inetd :)

No. With inetd, you can also turn regular filters into network
aware programs (sort of). And not every network service is always
needed all the time. Having a deamon for each of those seldom used
services hanging around is just wastful.

-cpghost.

-- 
Cordula's Web. http://www.cordula.ws/
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Re: Samba problems

[Alejandro Pulver]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 11:02:44 +0200
Fabian Keil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Alejandro Pulver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> > On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 20:37:51 +0100
> > Fabian Keil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > 
> > > Alejandro Pulver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > 
> > > > I am using FreeBSD 5.3 with Samba 3.0.7,1.
> > > > 
> > > > I can read all files from a Windows 2000 Pro. But when
> > > > I try to access a mount point that is an NTFS filesystem, I have
> > > > no read permission (files and directories appear as zero length
> > > > files) until I access them from the server machine (like doing
> > > > an 'ls').
> > > > 
> > > > My configuration file is as follows:
> > > > 
> > > > = BEGIN =
> > > > # Samba config file created using SWAT
> > > > # from 127.0.0.1 (127.0.0.1)
> > > > # Date: 2004/12/11 19:24:02
> > > > 
> > > > # Global parameters
> > > > [global]
> > > > workgroup = VARNET
> > > > server string = FreeBSD 5.3
> > > > security = SHARE
> > > > log file = /var/log/samba/log.%m
> > > > max log size = 50
> > > > dns proxy = No
> > > > 
> > > > [mnt]
> > > > comment = Mounted Filesystems
> > > > path = /mnt
> > > > guest ok = Yes
> > > > 
> > > > [printers]
> > > > comment = All Printers
> > > > path = /var/spool/samba
> > > > printable = Yes
> > > > browseable = No
> > > > 
> > > > [ale]
> > > > comment = Ale's Home DIrectory
> > > > path = /home/ale
> > > > guest ok = Yes
> > > > = END ===
> > > > 
> > > > Note: I have subdirectories under '/mnt' like 'w2k', 'wxp',
> > > > 'cam', and'tmp'.
> > > > 
> > > > What am I doing wrong?
> > > 
> > > Who owns the subdirectories and who is your guest user?
> 
> > My guest user is 'nobody', but I also tried with 'ale' and 'root'
> > (wich owns the mount point).
> 
> Did you see in samba's log that the guest user was changed?
> How did you change it, with "guest user" or with "force user"?
> 
> As your problem can be reproduced, increasing samba's debug
> level might help. Samba should log why read access was denied.
> 
> If you access the samba share with mount_smbfs, do you see
> the same behavior?
>  
> > The directory '/mnt/w2k' is owned by 'root' and the group 'wheel',
> > the permissions are rwxr-xr-x.
> 
> If you only want read access, this looks fine.
> 
> Fabian
> -- 
> http://www.fabiankeil.de
>

Hello,

Thank you for your reply.

I saw in SWAT that the connection from the other machine was mapped to
the desired local user in all cases (I tried "nobody", "ale" and
"root"). I used "guest account = ".

Something strange is happening: I can access the sahre '/mnt' (and
'w2k') with 'smbclient' (using the 'guest' user), but if I do it with
'mount_smbfs //[EMAIL PROTECTED]/mnt /home/ale/tmp' then the problem appears,
even with 'root' (I can not see/access entries until I list them with
any user from '/mnt/w2k').

I think the problem is with Samba, not 'mount_smbfs'.

This message appears (many times) in debug level 0:

[2005/03/27 15:04:38, 1] smbd/service.c:make_connection_snum(648)
  mariana (192.168.1.1) connect to service mnt initially as user nobody
(uid=65534, gid=65534) (pid 1217)[2005/03/27 15:04:44, 0]
locking/posix.c:posix_fcntl_lock(657)  posix_fcntl_lock: WARNING: lock
request at offset 0, length 4096 returned[2005/03/27 15:04:44, 0]
locking/posix.c:posix_fcntl_lock(658)  an Invalid argument error. This
can happen when using 64 bit lock offsets[2005/03/27 15:04:44, 0]
locking/posix.c:posix_fcntl_lock(659)  on 32 bit NFS mounted file
systems.

The other message I noticed (but I think it is not an error) in level 3
is:

[2005/03/27 14:16:19, 2] auth/auth.c:check_ntlm_password(312)
  check_ntlm_password:  Authentication for user [nobody] -> [nobody]
FAILED with error NT_STATUS_WRONG_PASSWORD[2005/03/27 14:16:19, 3]
auth/auth.c:check_ntlm_password(219)  check_ntlm_password:  Checking
password for unmapped user [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the new
password interface[2005/03/27 14:16:19, 3]
auth/auth.c:check_ntlm_password(222)  check_ntlm_password:  mapped user
is: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

The one that also called my attention was:

[2005/03/27 14:16:30, 3] smbd/error.c:error_packet(105)
  error string = Is a directory
[2005/03/27 14:16:30, 3] smbd/error.c:error_packet(129)
  error packet at smbd/nttrans.c(862) cmd=162 (SMBntcreateX)
NT_STATUS_FILE_IS_A_DIRECTORY

However I do not know about the internal working of Samba so perhaps I
missed some important messages.

I made different logs with different debug levels. They are in
ftp://ftp.varnet.to (public FTP) in a directory called "samba_logs". The
local machine is called "ale" and the other "mariana". The best log in
level 3 is in the directory "log.3_2".

Thanks and Best Regards,
Ale
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Re: Vinum Problem

[Robert Slade]

On Sun, 2005-03-27 at 16:59, Ean Kingston wrote:
> On March 27, 2005 10:35 am, Robert Slade wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have managed to setup a vinum volume using 2 striped disks, the volume
> > is created and I can do newfs on it and mount it.
> >
> > However, when I set start_vinum="YES" in rc.conf, vinum loads then I get
> > panic, followed by hanging vnode.
> >
> > I'm using 5.3.
> >
> > Any pointers please.
> 
> In 5.3, you need to use gvinum instead of vinum. To do this set 
> start_vinum="NO" in /etc/rc.conf and set geom_vinum_load="YES" 
> in /boot/loader.conf.
> 
> gvinum will read your vinum configuration just fine so you only need to make 
> the changes I suggested to get it to work.
> 
> Althought this is documented, it is not what I would call 'well documented' 
> yet.

Ean,

Thank you, that got me further, I appears to have created a new
/dev/gvinum/test, which seems to the right size, but when I mount it as
/test, I get not a directory when I try and ls it.

I have tried to find documentation on geom, but that seems to be related
to mirroring.

Rob

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Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Christopher Nehren]

On 2005-03-27, Gert Cuykens scribbled these
curious markings:
> And how do you turn on beeps in irssi ?

/set beep_msg_level hilight

I recommend perusing through irssi's online help. You'd be surprised at
what's available (even *I'm* surprised, and I've been using it for a
while; even tinkered with the Perl API).

Best Regards,
Christopher Nehren
-- 
I abhor a system designed for the "user", if that word is a coded
pejorative meaning "stupid and unsophisticated". -- Ken Thompson
If you ask the wrong questions, you get answers like "42" and "God".
Unix is user friendly. However, it isn't idiot friendly.

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Re: hyper threading.

[Anthony Atkielski]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

> Right. Thats what I said. You'll killl your networking.

Beyond a certain network load, you have to increase the number of timer
interrupts per second no matter how fast your processors are or how many
of them you have, if you are polling your I/O interfaces instead of
being driven from interrupts.

I don't like the idea of routinely running 1000 timer interrupts per
second, but I note that FreeBSD 6.x apparently is moving to this number
(?).  I'd prefer that it be readily configurable.

There are other options but I'm not sure how well x86 hardware supports
them.  Having a very accurate, very high resolution elapsed-time counter
on the processor(s) can help lower overhead by allowing the OS to get
accurate time information without waiting for an interrupt and with
execution of only a single instruction.  Having programmable, very high
resolution timers would help, too.

-- 
Anthony


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Re: hyper threading.

[Anthony Atkielski]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

> You know, you spout all of this wonderful theory without considering
> the quality of the implementation.

Somethings can be derived directly from theory.  If you know the design
of the hardware, you can predict that two processors will provide x%
increment of throughput over a single processor, even if you don't
actually measure them.

In my case, I cite both theory and my own experience in measuring actual
systems.  The general principles of behavior of multiprocessor systems
are well understood, although specific implementations vary.  It is
clear, based even on design data alone, that hyperthreading will
generally improve throughput and should never diminish it (disregarding
OS overhead).  It is equally clear that the gain won't be as great as
having physically independent processors, but the idea of putting more
of the idle processor logic to work is a good one.

> And a key point that you consistently overlook is that FreeBSD 5.x is
> a particularly poor implementation of SMP. Linux and Dragonfly get 80%
> improvement in performance with a 2nd processor, and FreeBSD doesn't.

I'd need to see measurements to substantiate this.

In general, when it comes to optimization, it's best not to fret too
much over how many percentage points of processor power or throughput
you gain or lose with specific configuration or implementation choices.
If your system is running so close to the wire that five percent makes
the difference between 100% busy and less than 100% busy, you need more
hardware in any case.

> The concept that the kernel is poorly implemented by userland is well
> done is just not an assumption that you can make.

Actually, it's not something that I spend a lot of time thinking about.
Right now, my production system is never more than 0.4% busy.  And if it
were 99% busy, I'd be looking at faster hardware, no matter what OS or
HT/MP options I might have implemented.

-- 
Anthony


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Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Gert Cuykens]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 17:41:25 + (UTC), Christopher Nehren
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> On 2005-03-27, Gert Cuykens scribbled these
> curious markings:
> >> Surely you have screen(1) set up to show terminal beeps to you
> >> *somehow*, right? I personally prefer having it use esdplay because I
> >> usually have rhythmbox going, but you should be able to use a good ol'
> >> terminal bell.
> >
> > so how do you do the beep thingie ? Becuase i did not find it ?
> 
> By default, screen translates terminal bells into messages which are
> displayed at the bottom of the screen. The bad thing about this is that
> it dismisses such messages as soon as you hit a key. What this means is
> that if you're typing away at a document of some sort and someone
> mentions your nick on IRC, you may not notice. Using ^A-G (default
> keybindings) will make the bell audible, so that you'll be able to hear
> it. Whether your terminal emulation program that you use to log into the
> system translates it into something visual is another matter. If you
> want to always use this setting but you don't want to have to hit ^A-G
> every time you start screen, put this in a file named ~/.screenrc:
> 
> vbell off
> 
> And you'll never see that annoying visual bell ever again.

And how do you turn on beeps in irssi ?
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inetd vs standalone daemon

[Gert Cuykens]

Is inetd a daemon that start other daemons ?
Is sql and apache a standalone daemon ?
Can i delete inetd ?
I vote we get rid of inetd :)
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Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Christopher Nehren]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 2005-03-27, Gert Cuykens scribbled these
curious markings:
>> Surely you have screen(1) set up to show terminal beeps to you
>> *somehow*, right? I personally prefer having it use esdplay because I
>> usually have rhythmbox going, but you should be able to use a good ol'
>> terminal bell.
>
> so how do you do the beep thingie ? Becuase i did not find it ?

By default, screen translates terminal bells into messages which are
displayed at the bottom of the screen. The bad thing about this is that
it dismisses such messages as soon as you hit a key. What this means is
that if you're typing away at a document of some sort and someone
mentions your nick on IRC, you may not notice. Using ^A-G (default
keybindings) will make the bell audible, so that you'll be able to hear
it. Whether your terminal emulation program that you use to log into the
system translates it into something visual is another matter. If you
want to always use this setting but you don't want to have to hit ^A-G
every time you start screen, put this in a file named ~/.screenrc:

vbell off

And you'll never see that annoying visual bell ever again.

Best Regards,
Christopher Nehren
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ZzWiNWqBEjNfFnvNcBLzaCA=
=R0Kg
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-- 
I abhor a system designed for the "user", if that word is a coded
pejorative meaning "stupid and unsophisticated". -- Ken Thompson
If you ask the wrong questions, you get answers like "42" and "God".
Unix is user friendly. However, it isn't idiot friendly.

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Re: A Riddle

[Dev Tugnait]

I sticky this thread as retarded.

* [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> Apparently you can't read. I didn't say you were an
> idiot for running your own server. Only that you
> were an idiot to use your server to download
> tons of crap from lists that you don't want to
> read when for free you can have it stored elsewhere.
> 
> I have a server, and a domain (several) and lots of
> other cool stuff. I got tired of wasting cpu cycles
> and disk space, considering that maybe 1 out of 20
> messages actually interests me. You guys always
> complain about wasted bandwidth. Well if you use
> yahoo or gmail or aol then you don't waste any bandwidth
> of your own. You just read what you want to read.
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Chris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 10:31:58 -0600
> Subject: Re: A Riddle
> 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
>  
> >-Original Message- 
> >From: Fabian Keil <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Sent: Sat, 26 Mar 2005 21:59:59 +0100 
> >Subject: Re: A Riddle 
> >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
> >>> --- Chris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 
> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
> >>> > Hmm, I wonder if the lack of performance, or the 
> >>> unwanted 
> >>> > emails were more heavily weighted in the 
> >>> decision? 
> >>> > 
> >>> > If there was any intelligent life on the list you 
> >>> could 
> >>> > counter what you call "Trolls" with solid technical 
> >>> > arguments. This reminds me of the old bsdi 
> >>> > list. A bunch of half-wits who are just happy 
> >>> > to belong to something and have other half-wits 
> >>> > to correspond with. 
> >>> > 
> >>> > FreeBSD used to have open discussions between 
> >>> > users and developers and it used to be real 
> >>> > good. Now it sucks and the developers are 
> >>> > detached, off in their own little world. See 
> >>> > a pattern? 
> >>> > 
> >>> > But with a user base from places like gnu-rox.org 
> >>> > and makeworld.com, what do you expect I 
> >>> > guess? 
> >> > Please have a look at your own email address. 
> >>> As an aside, all of the major web mail providers 
> >>default to "top posting". Google (ever hear 
> >>of them?) only shows the top N lines of a post. 
> >>So if you bottom post, you don't see the message 
> >>you want to see 
> >>without having to make an effort. So when are 
> >>you troglodytes going to climb out of your 
> >>1994 hibernations and get with the times? 
> >> > They don't default to top posting, they put 
> >the cursor on top, so you can read the whole 
> >message and cut irrelevant parts before replying. 
> >> If Google doesn't display the whole message, 
> >the interface is crap. That's not the fault of 
> >anybody on this list. 
> >>> You may prefer one over the other, but its 
> >>hardly a capital offense to do otherwise. Most 
> >>of us have evolved out of our unix newsreaders. 
> >> > If you want to be read by as many people 
> >as possible on this list, the easiest way is 
> >to write well formed mails. 
> >> Unfortunately, you are not only top posting, 
> >your mailing software also inserts line breaks 
> >where there shouldn't be any and makes it 
> >hard to see who wrote what. 
> >> Have a look at the beginning of this mail. 
> >Your quotation is a mess. 
> >>> Anyone with a brain is using web mail for 
> >>mailing lists these days: no more whining 
> >>about spam or "wasted bandwidth". 
> >> > Having a brain is good, but using it is even better. 
> >If the web interface produces garbage, changing 
> >the interface could be a smart move. 
> >> Just my two brainless cents. 
> >> Fabian 
> >-- > http://www.fabiankeil.de 
> > 
> *** Formatted correctly for ease of reading *** 
>  
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
> >WRONG on all counts! 
> > 
> >Firstly, anyone who uses their own server for lists is 
> >a complete idiot. 
>  
> So - according to YOU, most all of us that run our own servers are 
> idiots. Yanno what? You sound like the type that is forced to use his 
> parents PC, Forced to use AOL, and forced to use web mail. 
>  
> So - since YOU can't have what most of us can and do have, you feel the 
> need to lash out and verbally abuse. 
>  
> This is a classic case of the have-nots are beside them selfs over the 
> haves. 
>  
> It's one thing to say something like: 
>  
> It's my opinion that (insert rhetoric here) 
>  
> Then to make a sweeping generalization as you just did. Shows us what 
> kind a man (or boy) you are. 
>  
> Grow up - show some respect, don't insult - you will live longer when 
> you do join society. 
>  
> And, as I said before - even tho you may bash us, think you are 
> superior to us - we still love you anyways. 
>  
> Oh, and have a great day! 
>  
> -- Best regards, 
> Chris 
>  
> If on an actuarial basis there is a 50 50 chance that 
> something will go wrong, 
> It will actually go wrong nine times out of ten. 
> __

Re: FreeBSD 4.x Opteron Question

[Matthew Seaman]

On Wed, Mar 23, 2005 at 01:10:37PM -0800, NMH wrote:
> 
> --- Matthew Seaman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > On Tue, Mar 15, 2005 at 08:50:22AM -0800, Boris
> > Spirialitious wrote:
> > > When opteron support start for Freebsd? I have
> > 4.9. 
> > > is supported? Or 4.11 better? I can't use 5.x.
> > 
> > Well, AMD64 support as a tier-1 platform only came
> > in with 5.x, so
> > you're S.O.L. if you have to use a 4.x release
> > version.  
> >  
> > > Will a i386 disk boot on opteron system? Can I
> > > use same disk image for intel and amd MBs? Any
> > > big problems?
> > 
> > You can generally run AMD64 machines in IA32 mode --
> > but what would be
> > the point? All you get then is a machine that costs
> > more than an
> > equivalent IA32 box and that probably performs
> > worse.

>  Actually, I use a ton of Opterons in IA32 mode that
> blow past the fastest pent 4's we tried. I have found
> them very stable, reliable and faster than the
> Pentium.
>  (have not tried the Xeons) Of course they are even
> faster in 64 bit mode. But sadly most programs that I
> need don't work well or at all in 64 bit mode yet.

Indeed yes.  I stand corrected, and having had the opportunity to play
with some Opteron kit since I wrote the reply above, I must agree that
they do provide excellent performance in both IA32 and AMD64 modes.

Prices aren't even too outrageous, considering the extra performance.
Lead time for getting the kit is a little longer than for the Xeons,
and our supplier can't do a 1U Opteron rack mount with dual power
supplies yet, but those are minor considerations.  Guess we're going
to be getting a few more AMD64 boxes coming in, in future.

   Cheers,

   Matthew

-- 
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   8 Dane Court Manor
  School Rd
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Tilmanstone
Tel: +44 1304 617253  Kent, CT14 0JL UK


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Description: PGP signature

Re: What's an easy way to replace a drive?

[Matthew Seaman]

On Thu, Mar 24, 2005 at 07:55:13PM +0100, Anthony Atkielski wrote:

> Can I boot from the FreeBSD boot CD and avoid mounting anything on any
> of the hard drives at all? (That's not a problem in this case, since the
> root is on a different drive, but if I ever had to replace the drive
> containing the root I'm just wondering how to go about it.)

Use Disk2 - the live filesystem disk - for that purpose.  If you boot
from it, it puts you into sysinstall just like disk1, but you can
select 'Fixit mode' from the main menu and get a shell prompt while
running entirely of the CD.

Cheers,

Matthew

-- 
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil.   8 Dane Court Manor
  School Rd
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Tilmanstone
Tel: +44 1304 617253  Kent, CT14 0JL UK


pgp1u7Q5nwbr5.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Gert Cuykens]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 16:28:29 + (UTC), Christopher Nehren
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> On 2005-03-27, Paul Waring scribbled these
> curious markings:
> > I run it from a screen session all the time and it works well once you
> > get the hang of it. I think you can make it beep when new messages
> > come in but because I run it on a remote server I've never bothered to
> > look into/activate this feature.
> 
> Surely you have screen(1) set up to show terminal beeps to you
> *somehow*, right? I personally prefer having it use esdplay because I
> usually have rhythmbox going, but you should be able to use a good ol'
> terminal bell.

so how do you do the beep thingie ? Becuase i did not find it ?
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Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Paul Waring]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 16:28:29 + (UTC), Christopher Nehren
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Surely you have screen(1) set up to show terminal beeps to you
> *somehow*, right? I personally prefer having it use esdplay because I
> usually have rhythmbox going, but you should be able to use a good ol'
> terminal bell.

No I don't, because it's not a feature that I see any need for. I'm
sure there is a way to do it but if I don't want that particular
feature I'm not going to spend time looking for how to enable it.

Paul

-- 
Rogue Tory
www.roguetory.org.uk
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Enabling sound on Dell Dimension 8300 (FreeBSD 5.1-RELEASE)

[Amit Kumar Saha]

Hi,
I am trying to enable the builtin sound card present in Dell
Dimension 8300 but cant seem to get it done. As far as I remember, in
FreeBSD 5.3 it can be done simply by having the following two options in
the kernel config file:

device sound
device snd_ich

However, FreeBSD 5.1 does not recognize any of these even (Even man sound
or man snd_ich does not work even though it should work on any FreeBSD 5.*
So I guess I have to give some hardware hints in order to

config MYCONFIG gives the following error report:
=

config: Error: device "sound" is unknown
config: Error: device "snd_ich" is unknown

(/boot/kernel/ however has the files snd_ich.ko as well as snd_pcm.ko)

The output of cat /dev/sndstat is as follows:
=

FreeBSD Audio Driver (newpcm)
Installed devices:


The dmesg output is as follows:


<== START OF dmesg output

Copyright (c) 1992-2003 The FreeBSD Project.
Copyright (c) 1979, 1980, 1983, 1986, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994
The Regents of the University of California. All rights reserved.
FreeBSD 5.1-RELEASE #3: Tue Oct 14 18:17:28 CDT 2003
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/usr/src/sys/i386/compile/NEW
Preloaded elf kernel "/boot/kernel/kernel" at 0xc070.
Preloaded elf module "/boot/kernel/acpi.ko" at 0xc0700294.
Timecounter "i8254"  frequency 1193182 Hz
Timecounter "TSC"  frequency 3192009524 Hz
CPU: Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 3.20GHz (3192.01-MHz 686-class CPU)
  Origin = "GenuineIntel"  Id = 0xf29  Stepping = 9
  
Features=0xbfebfbff
  Hyperthreading: 2 logical CPUs
real memory  = 1073168384 (1023 MB)
avail memory = 1035091968 (987 MB)
Pentium Pro MTRR support enabled
npx0:  on motherboard
npx0: INT 16 interface
acpi0:  on motherboard
pcibios: BIOS version 2.10
Using $PIR table, 8 entries at 0xc00feae0
acpi0: power button is handled as a fixed feature programming model.
Timecounter "ACPI-fast"  frequency 3579545 Hz
acpi_timer0: <24-bit timer at 3.579545MHz> port 0x808-0x80b on acpi0
acpi_cpu0:  port 0x530-0x537 on acpi0
acpi_cpu1:  port 0x530-0x537 on acpi0
acpi_button0:  on acpi0
pcib0:  port 0xcf8-0xcff on acpi0
pci0:  on pcib0
agp0:  mem 0xe800-0xefff at device 
0.0 on pci0
pcib1:  at device 1.0 on pci0
pci1:  on pcib1
pci1:  at device 0.0 (no driver attached)
uhci0:  port 0xff80-0xff9f irq 11 at 
device 29.0 on pci0
usb0:  on uhci0
usb0: USB revision 1.0
uhub0: Intel UHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1
uhub0: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered
uhci1:  port 0xff60-0xff7f irq 10 at 
device 29.1 on pci0
usb1:  on uhci1
usb1: USB revision 1.0
uhub1: Intel UHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1
uhub1: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered
uhci2:  port 0xff40-0xff5f irq 9 at 
device 29.2 on pci0
usb2:  on uhci2
usb2: USB revision 1.0
uhub2: Intel UHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1
uhub2: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered
uhci3:  port 0xff20-0xff3f irq 11 at 
device 29.3 on pci0
usb3:  on uhci3
usb3: USB revision 1.0
uhub3: Intel UHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1
uhub3: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered
pci0:  at device 29.7 (no driver attached)
pcib2:  at device 30.0 on pci0
pci2:  on pcib2
fxp0:  port 0xdf40-0xdf7f mem 
0xfcfff000-0xfcff irq 10 at device 8.0 on pci2
fxp0: Ethernet address 00:07:e9:5f:67:fd
miibus0:  on fxp0
inphy0:  on miibus0
inphy0:  10baseT, 10baseT-FDX, 100baseTX, 100baseTX-FDX, auto
isab0:  at device 31.0 on pci0
isa0:  on isab0
atapci0:  port 
0xffa0-0xffaf,0x374-0x377,0x170-0x177,0x3f4-0x3f7,0x1f0-0x1f7 mem 
0xfebffc00-0xfebf irq 9 at device 31.1 on pci0
ata0: at 0x1f0 irq 14 on atapci0
ata1: at 0x170 irq 15 on atapci0
atapci1:  port 
0xfea0-0xfeaf,0xfe30-0xfe33,0xfe20-0xfe27,0xfe10-0xfe13,0xfe00-0xfe07 irq 9 at 
device 31.2 on pci0
ata2: at 0xfe00 on atapci1
ata3: at 0xfe20 on atapci1
pci0:  at device 31.3 (no driver attached)
pci0:  at device 31.5 (no driver attached)
fdc0:  port 
0x3f7,0x3f0-0x3f5 irq 6 drq 2 on acpi0
fdc0: FIFO enabled, 8 bytes threshold
fd0: <1440-KB 3.5" drive> on fdc0 drive 0
atkbdc0:  port 0x64,0x60 irq 1 on acpi0
atkbd0:  flags 0x1 irq 1 on atkbdc0
kbd0 at atkbd0
psm0:  irq 12 on atkbdc0
psm0: model IntelliMouse, device ID 3
sio0 port 0x3f8-0x3ff irq 4 on acpi0
sio0: type 16550A
ppc0 port 0x778-0x77f,0x378-0x37f irq 7 on acpi0
ppc0: SMC-like chipset (ECP/EPP/PS2/NIBBLE) in COMPATIBLE mode
ppc0: FIFO with 16/16/8 bytes threshold
ppbus0:  on ppc0
plip0:  on ppbus0
lpt0:  on ppbus0
lpt0: Interrupt-driven port
ppi0:  on ppbus0
orm0:  at iomem 0xd1000-0xd3fff,0xc-0xcf7ff on isa0
pmtimer0 on isa0
sc0:  at flags 0x100 on isa0
sc0: VGA <16 virtual consoles, flags=0x300>
sio1: configured irq 3 not in bitmap of probed irqs 0
sio1: port may not be enabled
vga0:  at port 0x3c0-0x3df iomem 0xa-0xb on isa0
RTC BIOS diagnostic error 18
Timecounters tick every 10.000 msec
ad4: 238418MB  [484406/16/63] at ata2-master UDMA100
acd0: 

Re: AWK in 4.X different from 5.X?

[Francisco Reyes]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005, Mario Hoerich wrote:
Now I just wonder how to get date in my output. :-(
Well, if nothing else helps there's always system("date").
However, you could also install lang/gawk.
Since this was from a shell script I did
date | awk '{print "#"$1 " " $2 "-" $3 "-" $6}'
It works for my needs.
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Re: Emacs and backspace - again

[Lowell Gilbert]

Rodger Castle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> I'm using emacs20 from the ports collection (as emacs from ports would not 
> compile due to the Xau3d compile error) on 5.4-PRERELEASE.
> $TERM is xterm

There haven't been any reported failures in building
x11-toolkits/Xaw3d in at least several months.

I'd suggest you put your efforts into solving the problem
with that rather than workarounds for obsolete versions 
of emacs.
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Re: which shell irc client do you like ?

[Gert Cuykens]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 13:45:01 +0100, Paul Waring <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 01:56:50 +0100, Gert Cuykens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > i am looking for a very simple colored one, in the style of
> >
> > me 19:10# bla bla
> > you 19:10# bla bla
> >
> > no menus or borders
> 
> I don't know what you mean by no menus or borders, but irssi is pretty
> stripped down and can be run from the console:
> 
> http://www.irssi.org/
> 
> I run it from a screen session all the time and it works well once you
> get the hang of it. I think you can make it beep when new messages
> come in but because I run it on a remote server I've never bothered to
> look into/activate this feature.

thx irssi and bitlbee is just what i needed to cover everything :)
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Re: Missing tiff-3.6.1_1

[Al]

I tried this a couple of days ago, and I similarly got the missing
tiff-3.6.1_1 error as it was no where to be found in the ftp site.
I had installed FreeBSD 5.3 and the ports collection from a CD onto 
a new machine.  I got that error afterwards when I tried to build 
from ports samba3, IIRC.

cvsup-ing the ports collection eliminated those errors.  


On Sat, Mar 26, 2005 at 02:57:54PM -0800, Kris Kennaway wrote:
> On Fri, Mar 18, 2005 at 10:59:24AM -0500, Christopher Kearns wrote:
> > After installing freeBSD 5.3 on my system, many packages will not 
> > install. I get an error message that says Warning: tiff-3.6.1_1 is a 
> > required package but was not found. What do I need to do?
> 
> First tell us exactly what commands you are trying to run and the
> exact errors you receive.
> 
> Kris


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Re: Jails ....

[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 11:23:05 -0500
"Grant Peel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> It seems to me, that for all the work of scponly shell to be setup,
> why not  just create a simple jail and allow ssh teminal access for
> users?
> 
> That having been said, is it possible to set up jails for existing
> users  that include only simple commands, like:
> 
> ls
> mkdir
> rmdir
> pico
> rm
> chown
> chmod
> 
> if so, are there any guru's who would like to type and explanation and
> step  by step how to here?

i can think of one possible solution for this :

1) you create the jail (see : man jail [with one exception, i prefer a
make world for the host and then use a make installworld for the jails
instead of make world again for the jail])

2) make /bin /sbin /usr/bin /usr/sbin /usr/local/bin /usr/local/sbin
only accessible for root (and users for possible other services) and 
set the PATH to include a new dir e.g. /newbin/ which is accessible for
users, and copy the shell (and possible other basic commands) they need
in that dir too

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Re: hyper threading.

[em1897]

You know, you spout all of this wonderful theory without considering
the quality of the implementation. Everything is implementation.
And a key point that you consistently overlook is that
FreeBSD 5.x is a particularly poor implementation of SMP.
Linux and Dragonfly get 80% improvement in performance
with a 2nd processor, and FreeBSD doesn't. Theory is
meaningless if the implementation sucks, which is more
than just part of the point. The concept that the kernel
is poorly implemented by userland is well done is just not
an assumption that you can make.
-Original Message-
From: Anthony Atkielski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org
Sent: Sun, 27 Mar 2005 12:33:36 +0200
Subject: Re: hyper threading.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
You can argue the technical theory all you want, but the
measurements say otherwise.
You have to ensure that you're doing the right measurements.
FreeBSD 4.9 ->> Load: 38% (I put this in for fun :-)
Freebsd 5.4-Pre UP (no HT) -> Load: high 55-60% range
FreeBSD 5.4-Pre SMP/HT -> Load:  70-80% (much more jumping around)
You'll find that the total CPU time required from start to finish for a
single thread is ALWAYS higher for SMP than for a UP environment, even
if you have separate physical processors.
Several things happen when you move from a uniprocessor environment to
an environment with two or more processors:
- The total CPU time for each thread increases.
- The total system load on a per process basis increases.
- The total throughput of the system improves if there is more than one
independent process running in the system.
- Each of the processors runs more slowly than it would if it were the
only processor running in a UP environment.
If you run a single-thread benchmark on a MP system, you'll find that it
runs more slowly than it does on a UP system. If you run multiple
single-thread independent benchmarks on a MP system, you'll find that
total CPU time for each benchmark increases over that required in a UP
system--but the elapsed time required to complete all benchmarks
substantially diminishes.
To properly gauge the performance of a multiprocessor system, you must
run a realistic mix of tasks on the system and measure overall
throughput.  If you do this, you'll find that you always come out ahead
with multiple processors, even HT processors.
Hyperthreading is just a special case of multiprocessing that imposes
some additional restrictions.  HT is much more sensitive to similarities
in instruction mix across processes, because the actual processor
hardware is being shared.  With a sufficiently heterogenous instruction
mix across multiple execution threads, this isn't a problem; but if you
are running a single-threaded benchmark, or a series of identical
single-threaded benchmarks, it can seriously distort your measurements.
Although adding physical processors diminishes the performance of each
processor, it still adds overall processing power, up to a certain
point. The increment is never equal to the actual number of processors
added, though; that is, if you go from one to two processors, you never
get a doubling of effective processor power--it's more like 70-80%. The
percentage increment gets worse with each additional processor, until
you reach a point at which performance actually starts to decline (the
point at which this happens is extremely hardware dependent, but it's
always well beyond two processors).
Hyperthreaded processors should not diminish in performance just because
HT is turned on, because the hardware contention that diminishes
performance in conventional MP systems is largely absent in a HT
microprocessor.  However, since you are really still only sharing a
single processor with HT, the overall increment is much lower than it
would be with two physical processors, and it is very sensitive to the
instruction mix.
this shows that you really are a bit foggy. Did you miss the part
where with 2 processors you actually do have 2 processors?
I actually read what Intel had to say on how the architecture works, and
I spent years measuring systems the hard way (with hardware monitors and
probes), so I know somewhat whereof I speak.  Multiprocessing was always
a significant hot-button issue with customers, as they always wanted to
know how much they really gained with multiple processors (as opposed to
what they had been promised).
I can make an argument that networking with 1 processor on 5.4 is
better than with 2. For example, with a test similar to the above, 
with
2 phyiscal processors FreeBSD 5.4 will start dropping packets way 
before
it hits 500Kpps unless you increase the interrrupts/second, which of
course increases the system load. And even with the dropped packets
(which should reduce the load because it doesnt have to receive
and transmit the packet), the load is still higher than for 4.x with
a single processor.
Load is not a problem, as long as it's below 100%.  Since individual
processors slow down in MP configurations, anything