Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-12-17 Thread Howard Katz
Just an FYI--

I finally sat down with a borrowed multimeter and tested the ground
path from the three-prong plug on the long cord that comes with the
Apple power supply.

There's no ground path from the power plug (ring, tip, or outer
circle) to the grounding path.  So it's still problematic what happens
with any static charge when you touch the metal casing of a Ti or AL
unit.

Later...Howard

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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-12-07 Thread Howard Katz
Well, it got me.

Came into the office, forgot to touch the closest piece of metal
(shelf bracket), and touched the case.  ZAP!  Computer froze.

Restarted--and it did restart, but interestingly, it seems to have
forgotten a few settings--immediately noticed that preferred browser
defaulted to Safari instead of the firefox setting I had.

I don't know what else got munged, but I'm sure I'll find out.  All my
applications, music, etc. seem to be working correctly.

Later.Howard

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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-12-01 Thread darm0k

At 7:47 PM -0500 11/30/2005, Brian McEwen wrote:

On Nov 30, 2005, at 7:33 PM, Howard Katz wrote:


Silly question I'm sure--I can understand about touching the trackpad,
but what about if you just touch the body of the computer--AL or Ti?
It's happened to me and I get a slight shock.  Power supply is plugged
in.   I try to remember to discharge before I sit down, but it's easy
to forget.


If you repeatedly need to discharge like that then you might want to 
consider an anti-static floor mat under your chair...


If everything is plugged in, and you have a grounded outlet that is 
really grounded (only one in my house is), and Apple has done things 
right, then I'd think you'd ground thru the case, out the cord, to 
your house ground, and the static shoul follow that route from the 
case and all should be isolated from the sensitive bits.


While normal stray electrons will take that path, you still have to 
watch for the disgruntled ones -- that are influenced by Murphy. 
They'll skip the sweet grounds and go for your tasty interface 
chips...


- Dan.

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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread P. Turtle-Bear Guillermo

On Nov 27, 2005, at 9:52 AM, bobgir2004 wrote:

It's gotten quite cold these last weeks and I've noticed, in 
particular

when wearing anything made of Polartec, that when I reach for the light
switch when I enter the room to use my iBook,  when I hit the light 
switch I
often create a very loud snap/spark of static electricity from my 
finger to

one of the two screws holding in the light switch plate.

It's a much better idea to discharge that static electricity there 
than

into your iBook/PowerBook's track pad.


This is exactly why I hate polyester fleece clothing (in the house 
anyway!). Thanks for the reminder!


Turtle-Bear


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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread Howard Katz
Silly question I'm sure--I can understand about touching the trackpad,
but what about if you just touch the body of the computer--AL or Ti? 
It's happened to me and I get a slight shock.  Power supply is plugged
in.   I try to remember to discharge before I sit down, but it's easy
to forget.


Later...Howard

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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread P. Turtle-Bear Guillermo

On Nov 27, 2005, at 2:39 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

ug.  While visiting my mom years ago (Royal Palm Beach), one of her 
friends asked me to fix her computer.  It was ... mildewed.  White 
fur on the mb. *shudder*


Is there really white mildew? All New Mexican household mildews are 
black or darkish. Sounds like mold to me, probably left on some dead 
insect that took up residence in the computer case. Or the mold was 
growing on food or drink dropped in the case.


Turtle-Bear


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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread Brian McEwen


On Nov 30, 2005, at 7:33 PM, Howard Katz wrote:


Silly question I'm sure--I can understand about touching the trackpad,
but what about if you just touch the body of the computer--AL or Ti?
It's happened to me and I get a slight shock.  Power supply is plugged
in.   I try to remember to discharge before I sit down, but it's easy
to forget.


If everything is plugged in, and you have a grounded outlet that is  
really grounded (only one in my house is), and Apple has done things  
right, then I'd think you'd ground thru the case, out the cord, to  
your house ground, and the static shoul follow that route from the  
case and all should be isolated from the sensitive bits.


B


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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread Howard Katz
I'd have no qualms about that, but the adapters I've seen, both the
Apple-supplied one and the replacements on the market only have 2
prongs.  :)


On 11/30/05, Brian McEwen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 On Nov 30, 2005, at 7:33 PM, Howard Katz wrote:

  Silly question I'm sure--I can understand about touching the trackpad,
  but what about if you just touch the body of the computer--AL or Ti?
  It's happened to me and I get a slight shock.  Power supply is plugged
  in.   I try to remember to discharge before I sit down, but it's easy
  to forget.

 If everything is plugged in, and you have a grounded outlet that is
 really grounded (only one in my house is), and Apple has done things
 right, then I'd think you'd ground thru the case, out the cord, to
 your house ground, and the static shoul follow that route from the
 case and all should be isolated from the sensitive bits.

 B

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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread Brian McEwen


On Nov 30, 2005, at 7:49 PM, Howard Katz wrote:


I'd have no qualms about that, but the adapters I've seen, both the
Apple-supplied one and the replacements on the market only have 2
prongs.  :)


hm.  True! :)

You're killing it! you're killing it!!

:)

B


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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread Bill Briggs
At 6:49 PM -0600 11/30/05, Howard Katz wrote:
I'd have no qualms about that, but the adapters I've seen, both the
Apple-supplied one and the replacements on the market only have 2
prongs.  :)

 True of older models, but my new PowerBook (purchased in July of this year) 
has a genuine case ground. If you just plug in the white power brick, you only 
have two prongs, but if you use the longer cord you get the case ground as 
well. So touching your PowerBook's case and discharging won't cause damage if 
you're plugged in with the cord.

 That said, static is deadly to modern silicon chips with their very small 
device dimensions. A person can easily build up a static charge of several 
kilovolts, and while the amount of energy is small, when it's focused in a 
small area, it can easily destroy the nanometer scale components on ICs. 
Somewhere here I have an old HP magazine that has scanning electron micrographs 
of transistor junctions destroyed by static - before and after images. Once 
they are damaged the chip is useless. We were running a new Van de Graff 
generator in the technician's shop about a year ago and ended up destroying the 
MoBo on a nearby computer. The Van de Graff generator we had builds up about 
200,000 volts, and the compyter was only 4 or 5 feet away, and something in it 
got damaged. We are more careful with them now.

 - web

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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread Howard Katz
I looked at the cord when I got my AL--and noticed that while there
was 3 prongs on the wall side, there was only 2 connectors on the PS
side.  I didn't see where the cord would make a grounding connection.

Later...Howard


On 11/30/05, Bill Briggs [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  True of older models, but my new PowerBook (purchased in July of this year) 
 has a genuine case ground. If you just plug in the white power brick, you 
 only have two prongs, but if you use the longer cord you get the case ground 
 as well. So touching your PowerBook's case and discharging won't cause damage 
 if you're plugged in with the cord.

  That said, static is deadly to modern silicon chips with their very small 
 device dimensions. A person can easily build up a static charge of several 
 kilovolts, and while the amount of energy is small, when it's focused in a 
 small area, it can easily destroy the nanometer scale components on ICs. 
 Somewhere here I have an old HP magazine that has scanning electron 
 micrographs of transistor junctions destroyed by static - before and after 
 images. Once they are damaged the chip is useless. We were running a new Van 
 de Graff generator in the technician's shop about a year ago and ended up 
 destroying the MoBo on a nearby computer. The Van de Graff generator we had 
 builds up about 200,000 volts, and the compyter was only 4 or 5 feet away, 
 and something in it got damaged. We are more careful with them now.

  - web

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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread Clark Martin

At 7:47 PM -0500 11/30/05, Brian McEwen wrote:

On Nov 30, 2005, at 7:33 PM, Howard Katz wrote:


Silly question I'm sure--I can understand about touching the trackpad,
but what about if you just touch the body of the computer--AL or Ti?
It's happened to me and I get a slight shock.  Power supply is plugged
in.   I try to remember to discharge before I sit down, but it's easy
to forget.


If everything is plugged in, and you have a grounded outlet that is 
really grounded (only one in my house is), and Apple has done things 
right, then I'd think you'd ground thru the case, out the cord, to 
your house ground, and the static shoul follow that route from the 
case and all should be isolated from the sensitive bits.


Too much of the case is plastic (even some of the metal).  Even if 
it is metal it may not have a good connection to the power jack.  And 
if the power supply has the two prong connector on it there is NO 
ground connection.


Even in a desktop computer with a good ground and all you can have 
trouble.  I knew a guy who had a Mac II that would restart sometimes 
when he touched the keyboard.  The static caused a surge somewhere in 
the keyboard and triggered the restart.


It is far better to discharge the static before you touch the 
computer.  Touch some bare metal on the surge strip for example.

--
Clark Martin
Redwood City, CA, USA
Macintosh / Internet Consulting

I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway

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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread Clark Martin

At 8:04 PM -0600 11/30/05, Howard Katz wrote:

I looked at the cord when I got my AL--and noticed that while there
was 3 prongs on the wall side, there was only 2 connectors on the PS
side.  I didn't see where the cord would make a grounding connection.

Later...Howard



Unplug the cord connector from the PS.  There are metal tabs inside 
the slot that engage the metal nub (for utter lack of a better term) 
on the power supply that holds the connector in place.

--
Clark Martin
Redwood City, CA, USA
Macintosh / Internet Consulting

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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-30 Thread Richard Clark
I think the ground is the metal lug on the power supply that guides  
the plug insert.


Richard
On Dec 1, 2005, at 3:04 AM, Howard Katz wrote:


I looked at the cord when I got my AL--and noticed that while there
was 3 prongs on the wall side, there was only 2 connectors on the PS
side.  I didn't see where the cord would make a grounding connection.



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Living with Nature (was Reminder about Static Electricity)

2005-11-28 Thread Tim Collier
Ah, but there's no place like home.  What did she do, leave it  
outside?  Or live in a house without AC?  I can see that happening in  
a case like that.  Mold is a MAJOR problem down here.  It does seem  
to love to live inside electronics that 'live' outside.  I saw a TV  
that a neighbor 'used' to use out on her patio die after about a  
year.  We opened it up and it was full of all these pretty colors of  
mold.  Sort of changed her mind about bringing it back for warrantee  
coverage.
But most electronics down here, if kept in an air conditioned house  
(AC also de-humidifies) can live long happy lives.  I keep my house  
at about 74 degrees.  Now lightening:  yes, we are known as the  
lightening capital of the US.  A wise user NEVER plugs anthing!  
directly into the wall.well nothing sensitive.  TV's, sound  
equipment, computers, monitors, routers, printers etc are all on back- 
up power supplies or at a minimum a power strip with a surge  
protector.  Even still, a lightening storm fried 2 dsl modems within  
a span of 6 months.  Anyway, hopefully all of this goes to illustrate  
to some new user on the list that you have to take care no matter  
where you live.  Weather conditions can render your precious,  
expensive electronic toys useless.  Take all precautions when it  
comes to protecting them.  Find out what others in your area do to  
extend the life of their computers.  Most of all, live defensively.


Best wishes for the holiday season,

Tim
On Nov 27, 2005, at 4:39 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


At 2:10 PM -0500 11/27/05, Tim Collier wrote:

Thankfully, we don't have to worry about that down here in Miami.


True.
You just get hallacious thunderstorms, hurricanes, and 24/7 mildew. :P

ug.  While visiting my mom years ago (Royal Palm Beach), one of her  
friends asked me to fix her computer.  It was ... mildewed.   
White fur on the mb. *shudder*


- Dan.

--


Exterminate all rational though.


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Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-27 Thread bobgir2004
Just a friendly reminder to all.

It's gotten quite cold these last weeks and I've noticed, in particular
when wearing anything made of Polartec, that when I reach for the light
switch when I enter the room to use my iBook,  when I hit the light switch I
often create a very loud snap/spark of static electricity from my finger to
one of the two screws holding in the light switch plate.

It's a much better idea to discharge that static electricity there than
into your iBook/PowerBook's track pad.

'Nuff said,
bob



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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-27 Thread darm0k

At 11:52 AM -0500 11/27/05, bobgir2004 wrote:

Just a friendly reminder to all.

It's gotten quite cold these last weeks and I've noticed, in particular
when wearing anything made of Polartec, that when I reach for the light
switch when I enter the room to use my iBook,  when I hit the light switch I
often create a very loud snap/spark of static electricity from my finger to
one of the two screws holding in the light switch plate.

It's a much better idea to discharge that static electricity there than
into your iBook/PowerBook's track pad.

'Nuff said,
bob


Never enough said about this important subject!

Too many people ignore this issue.
Then they wonder why their DIMMs are flakey, etc.

Static electricity and computers DO NOT get along.

Today's faster components are *extra* sensative!

Ground thyself!  before touching your sweetie Mac!

And if you're actually working inside your Mac, *keep* yourself grounded!

Extra points if you make the cat jump! :)

ObAlternativePOV:  Don't ever ground yourself.  I need the income 
repairing your machines!  Carpe DIMM!  Thankyouveddymuch!


- Dan.

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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-27 Thread Tim Collier

Thankfully, we don't have to worry about that down here in Miami.

Tim
On Nov 27, 2005, at 11:52 AM, bobgir2004 wrote:


Just a friendly reminder to all.

It's gotten quite cold these last weeks and I've noticed, in  
particular
when wearing anything made of Polartec, that when I reach for the  
light
switch when I enter the room to use my iBook,  when I hit the light  
switch I
often create a very loud snap/spark of static electricity from my  
finger to

one of the two screws holding in the light switch plate.

It's a much better idea to discharge that static electricity  
there than

into your iBook/PowerBook's track pad.

'Nuff said,
bob



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 Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com  | Refurbished  
Drives |
 -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks  |   CDRWs on  
Sale!  |


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Exterminate all rational though.


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Re: Reminder about static electricity

2005-11-27 Thread darm0k

At 2:10 PM -0500 11/27/05, Tim Collier wrote:

Thankfully, we don't have to worry about that down here in Miami.


True.
You just get hallacious thunderstorms, hurricanes, and 24/7 mildew. :P

ug.  While visiting my mom years ago (Royal Palm Beach), one of her 
friends asked me to fix her computer.  It was ... mildewed.  White 
fur on the mb. *shudder*


- Dan.

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