Re: The fun I've been having
On 1/28/04 9:39 PM, Dave Bonhoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: FW is not an option to me. I don't have any FW devices nor FW equipped machines. And my biggest SCSI drive is too small for a complete clone. I was hoping to connect to the 'Family' iMac and create my back-up on a partition of its drive that I have been unable to mount lately... What about using FWB Partition Toolkit? If you have enough free space then you'll be able to create another partition on which to install your new system without losing anything. -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- The Think Different Store http://www.ThinkDifferentStore.com ---
Re: The fun I've been having
Don't have enough space, but a good thought though! Thanks! On 29-Jan-04, at 02:45, Robin Ashe wrote: On 1/28/04 9:39 PM, Dave Bonhoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: FW is not an option to me. I don't have any FW devices nor FW equipped machines. And my biggest SCSI drive is too small for a complete clone. I was hoping to connect to the 'Family' iMac and create my back-up on a partition of its drive that I have been unable to mount lately... What about using FWB Partition Toolkit? If you have enough free space then you'll be able to create another partition on which to install your new system without losing anything. -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- The Think Different Store http://www.ThinkDifferentStore.com --- -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- The Think Different Store http://www.ThinkDifferentStore.com ---
Re: The fun I've been having
How are you overclocking? Are you just increasing the CPU speed or are you increasing the bus speed? Both can have problems, but they're especially likely if you're increasing the bus speed. You'll put everything else out of whack. I would suggest at least while you're installing Panther that you return the system to normal settings. You should be able to overclock after you're finished installing as the installation process is usually more picky about stability issues than anything else. The other thing might be your hard drive, but I don't know enough specifics to be able to suggest anything regarding that. On 1/28/04 9:08 AM, Dave Bonhoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi folks! I'm posting this to 2 different lists in the hopes of hitting a bigger knowledge base. Please forgive me, I'm at the limit of my patience. The move to Panther has been an ugly one for me, and continues to frustrate me. Let me start with the machine and then the problems I've been having and what I've tried over the past weeks. 1999 Bronze keyboard PowerBook, aka Lombard. 333MHz overclocked to 433MHz, 512 MB of Kingston RAM (2x256MB), 40 GB Toshiba MK4019GAX hard drive. Runs hot, but the fan never comes on. A bit slow but very stable under Jaguar. I hear lots of praise for Panther on slower machines, so I decide to go for it. I attempt to archive and install, but about 80% through the first CD the screen goes weird and it has crashed... I had backed-up my user folder to another machine using Synk, so I'm not too upset. I reboot and try again with the same results. I try doing just the upgrade and again it crashes. I zap pram, reset NVRAM, everything that I can think of, even formatting the drive. I swap RAM with my wife's Wallstreet, no help. Finally, I pull the RAM chip out of the top slot and try just 256 MB. It worked! I begin applying software updates that I had previously downloaded. After upgrading to X.3.1, I can no longer mount dmg's. I wipe the drive and reinstall, but again, X.3.1 refuses to mount dmg's. I wipe the drive yet again and reinstall going straight to X.3.2. This is better! I try the open source wireless driver that I used in Jaguar, but it doesn't work in Panther. I try the IOXperts driver and it works much better, even supporting Appletalk! But less than 4 hours after registering the driver to my card, the card starts acting up and now only works sporadically. But that is a different issue... I try importing my user folder that I had backed up previously. I put everything where it is supposed to go and repair permissions. Most everything looks good. I reinstall most of the essential apps I need immediately. Mail is a PITA. I can check for mail, but nothing is arriving in my inbox. I know that this is wrong. I change permissions on every mailbox manually and things get better. Some mailboxes have to have their contents copied to a new mailbox and be deleted because they refuse to play nice. And web mail sucks as that is what I was using during this circus act. At this point, I've got 4 full days invested into this 'upgrade' and I still have lots of work ahead of me to get back to where I was. Little things like preferences, locations (I had over 20 different dial-up locations that I use, never mind different private networks with proxy servers, WAP's and such, my head hurts thinking about it...), and I'm still trying to install software, all the while using the machine to earn a pay cheque. After a few days, I reinstall my top 256MB RAM chip and everything appears well, at first. Then I get a weird display crash (like during the install). It is random and different each time. Sometimes it is a dark grey grid pattern, sometimes different coloured vertical bands, sometimes the display dissolves from the center out into psychedelic patterns, sometimes a horizontal line of black pixels slowly marches down the screen leaving an interesting pattern behind. Repairing permissions will generate this problem every time it is run. I thought that heat may be the problem, so I have left the keyboard open and a desk fan blowing onto the heat sink and it is cool to the touch rather than the normal 'very hot'. It still crashes. I try with Activity monitor open and watch as my installed RAM varies from 512 down to 510 and back again. I observe free RAM gradually disappear until there is 10 or so MB free, then it crashes. This is repeated a few times to verify. I pull the RAM from both slots and apply a contact enhancer (that has all kinds of approvals including NATO) to both chips and the processor card connector. Now when I repair permissions, my total RAM doesn't drop below 511 MB, and while my free RAM gets very low, 15 - 20 MB, the machine does not crash. I've repaired permissions twice now, without the fan and the keyboard is closed. I still don't know why the internal cooling fan isn't coming on.
Re: The fun I've been having
On Jan 28, 2004, at 1:08 PM, Robin Ashe wrote: How are you overclocking? Are you just increasing the CPU speed or are you increasing the bus speed? Both can have problems, but they're especially likely if you're increasing the bus speed. You'll put everything else out of whack. I would suggest at least while you're installing Panther that you return the system to normal settings. You should be able to overclock after you're finished installing as the installation process is usually more picky about stability issues than anything else. 1999 Bronze keyboard PowerBook, aka Lombard. 333MHz overclocked to 433MHz, 512 MB of Kingston RAM (2x256MB), 40 GB Toshiba MK4019GAX hard drive. Runs hot, but the fan never comes on. A bit slow but very stable under Jaguar. Nice catch. I completely skimmed that... Phil Burk ___ Systems Support Technician Wiley Publishing, Inc. Indianapolis, IN 46256 317-572-3049 -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- The Think Different Store http://www.ThinkDifferentStore.com ---
The fun I've been having
On Jan 28, 2004, at 12:08 PM, Dave Bonhoff wrote: Hi folks! I'm posting this to 2 different lists in the hopes of hitting a bigger knowledge base. Please forgive me, I'm at the limit of my patience. The move to Panther has been an ugly one for me, and continues to frustrate me. Let me start with the machine and then the problems I've been having and what I've tried over the past weeks. SNIP But now, my problem is that I can't mount any network drives. I can see them, and I can attempt to connect to them, but they don't mount on the desktop or in the finder side bar. This means I can't backup. And the way this adventure through computing hell has been going, I NEED to backup! I understand, through lots of searching, that there may be an issue with video drivers, and with more than 384 MB of RAM installed. The networking has me stumped though. Where do I go from here? One part of me wants to ditch Panther and go back to Jaguar because it worked well. But the other part of me prefers the speed and features of Panther, when it is working nicely... Dave, First of all, just because you ran the repair permissions utility doesn't mean that all the permissions settings on your drive are properly set. This util will only reset permissions for items it sees in /Library/Receipts. If you copied old preferences and ~/Library items it may very well be that they are incorrect. The volumes-not-mounting issue smacks of permission settings being incorrect for /Volumes. Here's what my Panther boot disk looks like: total 8801 drwxrwxr-t 34 root admin 1156 27 Jan 15:31 . drwxrwxr-t 34 root admin 1156 27 Jan 15:31 .. -rw-rw-r-- 1 philburk staff 12292 27 Jan 17:14 .DS_Store d-wx-wx-wt 5 root admin170 22 Apr 2003 .Trashes -r--r--r-- 1 root wheel156 12 Sep 15:41 .hidden -rw--- 1 root admin 65536 24 Oct 16:05 .hotfiles.btree dr--r--r-- 2 root wheel256 27 Jan 15:30 .vol drwxrwxr-x 38 root admin 1292 29 May 2002 Applications -rw-r--r-- 1 root admin 1024 27 Jan 17:14 Desktop DB -rw-r--r-- 1 root admin 2 20 Jan 12:45 Desktop DF drwxr-xr-x 2 philburk unknown 68 11 Nov 2002 Desktop Folder drwxrwxr-x 13 root admin442 23 Dec 15:30 Developer drwxr-xr-x 2 philburk admin 68 4 Dec 10:57 Documents drwxrwxr-x 37 root admin 1258 12 Sep 15:41 Library drwxr-xr-x 1 root wheel512 28 Jan 13:04 Network drwxr-xr-x 4 root wheel136 12 Sep 15:41 System drwxrwxr-t 7 root admin238 7 Jan 12:00 Users drwxrwxrwt 10 root admin340 27 Jan 17:13 Volumes dr-xr-xr-x 4 philburk unknown 136 24 Oct 16:07 automount drwxr-xr-x 35 root wheel 1190 15 Nov 01:21 bin drwxrwxr-t 2 root admin 68 12 Sep 15:41 cores dr-xr-xr-x 2 root wheel512 27 Jan 15:30 dev lrwxr-xr-x 1 root admin 11 24 Oct 15:52 etc - private/etc lrwxr-xr-x 1 root admin 9 27 Jan 15:31 mach - /mach.sym -r--r--r-- 1 root admin 567760 27 Jan 15:31 mach.sym -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel3824080 11 Dec 19:20 mach_kernel drwxr-xr-x 5 root wheel170 27 Jan 15:31 private drwxr-xr-x 61 root wheel 2074 27 Jan 15:13 sbin lrwxr-xr-x 1 root admin 11 24 Oct 15:52 tmp - private/tmp drwxr-xr-x 10 root wheel340 12 Sep 15:42 usr lrwxr-xr-x 1 root admin 11 24 Oct 15:52 var - private/var You're going to need to be very careful with the settings at the root level. I would do the following: make sure the root level is fine. Go to the terminal, change to your home directory, check that your home directory permissions are set like this: drwxr-xr-x 25 philburk staff850 28 Jan 13:07 . drwxrwxr-t 7 root admin238 7 Jan 12:00 .. drwx-- 24 philburk staff816 28 Jan 11:10 Desktop drwx-- 19 philburk staff646 7 Jan 11:07 Documents drwx-- 35 philburk staff 1190 27 Oct 08:36 Library drwx-- 5 philburk staff170 19 Mar 2003 Movies drwx-- 7 philburk staff238 21 Oct 14:44 Music drwx-- 24 philburk staff816 21 Oct 14:45 Pictures drwxr-xr-x 5 philburk staff170 27 May 2003 Public drwxr-xr-x 5 philburk staff170 19 Mar 2003 Sites Just to make sure I would issue the following command: sudo chown -R [yourusername]:staff * in your home directory. This will make sure that you own all the items in there. I would also pull that second 256 MB chip and run it for a good couple of days and notice if there is a significant difference. Finally, stop overclocking until you have Panther stable. Phil Burk ___ Systems Support Technician Wiley Publishing, Inc. Indianapolis, IN 46256 317-572-3049 -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog
Re: The fun I've been having
Hi Robin, I O/C'd by changing the multiplier. I did not change the bus speed. I appreciate that this may be a factor, but since it was stable under Jaguar, I don't know why Panther would have issues. Panther appears to be less CPU intensive than Jaguar. It is certainly much snappier and according to the Activity monitor, the CPU usage appears to be lower on average. The hard drive is less than a year old, so I can only hope that it is still in good order. Disk Utility has not reported any issues with regards to S.M.A.R.T. status. At this time I'm leaning to possible RAM issues, video driver issues, and problems with permissions. Correct me if this is wrong, but if I am able to do a full backup using either CCC or Disk Utility, I would be safe in attempting to do an archive and restore installation - assuming I remove one of the 256 MB RAM chips. If I did this, would I have to re-install all my applications again? Obviously I'd have to do all the software updates. But I'm thinking that I might be able to eliminate problems with permissions this way and possibly any corrupt components from the current install. Just thinking. Thanks Dave On 28-Jan-04, at 13:08, Robin Ashe wrote: How are you overclocking? Are you just increasing the CPU speed or are you increasing the bus speed? Both can have problems, but they're especially likely if you're increasing the bus speed. You'll put everything else out of whack. I would suggest at least while you're installing Panther that you return the system to normal settings. You should be able to overclock after you're finished installing as the installation process is usually more picky about stability issues than anything else. The other thing might be your hard drive, but I don't know enough specifics to be able to suggest anything regarding that. On 1/28/04 9:08 AM, Dave Bonhoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi folks! I'm posting this to 2 different lists in the hopes of hitting a bigger knowledge base. Please forgive me, I'm at the limit of my patience. The move to Panther has been an ugly one for me, and continues to frustrate me. Let me start with the machine and then the problems I've been having and what I've tried over the past weeks. 1999 Bronze keyboard PowerBook, aka Lombard. 333MHz overclocked to 433MHz, 512 MB of Kingston RAM (2x256MB), 40 GB Toshiba MK4019GAX hard drive. Runs hot, but the fan never comes on. A bit slow but very stable under Jaguar. I hear lots of praise for Panther on slower machines, so I decide to go for it. I attempt to archive and install, but about 80% through the first CD the screen goes weird and it has crashed... I had backed-up my user folder to another machine using Synk, so I'm not too upset. I reboot and try again with the same results. I try doing just the upgrade and again it crashes. I zap pram, reset NVRAM, everything that I can think of, even formatting the drive. I swap RAM with my wife's Wallstreet, no help. Finally, I pull the RAM chip out of the top slot and try just 256 MB. It worked! I begin applying software updates that I had previously downloaded. After upgrading to X.3.1, I can no longer mount dmg's. I wipe the drive and reinstall, but again, X.3.1 refuses to mount dmg's. I wipe the drive yet again and reinstall going straight to X.3.2. This is better! I try the open source wireless driver that I used in Jaguar, but it doesn't work in Panther. I try the IOXperts driver and it works much better, even supporting Appletalk! But less than 4 hours after registering the driver to my card, the card starts acting up and now only works sporadically. But that is a different issue... I try importing my user folder that I had backed up previously. I put everything where it is supposed to go and repair permissions. Most everything looks good. I reinstall most of the essential apps I need immediately. Mail is a PITA. I can check for mail, but nothing is arriving in my inbox. I know that this is wrong. I change permissions on every mailbox manually and things get better. Some mailboxes have to have their contents copied to a new mailbox and be deleted because they refuse to play nice. And web mail sucks as that is what I was using during this circus act. At this point, I've got 4 full days invested into this 'upgrade' and I still have lots of work ahead of me to get back to where I was. Little things like preferences, locations (I had over 20 different dial-up locations that I use, never mind different private networks with proxy servers, WAP's and such, my head hurts thinking about it...), and I'm still trying to install software, all the while using the machine to earn a pay cheque. After a few days, I reinstall my top 256MB RAM chip and everything appears well, at first. Then I get a weird display crash (like during the install). It is random and different each time. Sometimes it is a dark grey grid pattern, sometimes different coloured vertical
Re: The fun I've been having
On Jan 28, 2004, at 2:47 PM, Dave Bonhoff wrote: I O/C'd by changing the multiplier. I did not change the bus speed. I appreciate that this may be a factor, but since it was stable under Jaguar, I don't know why Panther would have issues. Panther appears to be less CPU intensive than Jaguar. It is certainly much snappier and according to the Activity monitor, the CPU usage appears to be lower on average. It doesn't matter, fundamental parts of the OS changed dramatically between 10.2 and 10.3. Prudent troubleshooting mandates that you turn off the overclocking. The hard drive is less than a year old, so I can only hope that it is still in good order. Disk Utility has not reported any issues with regards to S.M.A.R.T. status. At this time I'm leaning to possible RAM issues, video driver issues, and problems with permissions. A complete initialization of the drive with zeroes will turn up any sector-related issues. If your drive is having difficulty spinning up it would be manifested in other ways (notable pauses, system hangs, obvious noise). Correct me if this is wrong, but if I am able to do a full backup using either CCC or Disk Utility, I would be safe in attempting to do an archive and restore installation - assuming I remove one of the 256 MB RAM chips. If I did this, would I have to re-install all my applications again? Obviously I'd have to do all the software updates. But I'm thinking that I might be able to eliminate problems with permissions this way and possibly any corrupt components from the current install. Use CCC. I assume you're thinking of backing up to a FW device. Definitely the best way to go. If you do this and subsequently do an archive and install you should be OK. The Panther installer won't clobber stuff you've added to any of the folder hierarchies such as /Application and /Library. (Actually, this changed in Jag too but I'm not sure exactly when...) Keep in mind that if you do an archive and install that you probably don't want to be preserving current users and network settings. This shouldn't matter if you have a complete backup as you'll be able to restore bits and pieces of your home directory as needed. As long as you don't completely replace your new home directory with your old you should be good to go. Phil Burk ___ Systems Support Technician Wiley Publishing, Inc. Indianapolis, IN 46256 317-572-3049 -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- The Think Different Store http://www.ThinkDifferentStore.com ---
Long Quotations (Was Re: The fun I've been having)
Can everyone *please* not quote the entire message in replies and only post the pertinent sections instead?? Perhaps at least out of mercy for those of us getting digest mode... Thanks, Jim Rohde Kindness is the language which the deaf can hear and the blind can see. - Mark Twain -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- The Think Different Store http://www.ThinkDifferentStore.com ---
Re: The fun I've been having
Phil, while I understand the concept of what you are suggesting and agree whole heartedly, I am not familiar enough with using Terminal and such to know how to accomplish what you are suggesting. I can follow directions pretty well though! [;^) What command did you use to see the permissions you had listed? When I've tried to run the sudo chown command you suggested, bash returns an invalid argument statement. Not sure what I'm doing wrong... When I was running with only 256 MB I found that there was a lot of disk activity and free memory was usually 3 - 4 MB after the machine had been running for a few hours. Also, due to the delicate nature of moving surface mount resistors I would prefer to leave un-clocking as a last resort. It was nerve wracking enough moving them the first time! Thanks Dave On 28-Jan-04, at 13:41, Phil Burk wrote: Dave, First of all, just because you ran the repair permissions utility doesn't mean that all the permissions settings on your drive are properly set. This util will only reset permissions for items it sees in /Library/Receipts. If you copied old preferences and ~/Library items it may very well be that they are incorrect. The volumes-not-mounting issue smacks of permission settings being incorrect for /Volumes. Here's what my Panther boot disk looks like: snip You're going to need to be very careful with the settings at the root level. I would do the following: make sure the root level is fine. Go to the terminal, change to your home directory, check that your home directory permissions are set like this: drwxr-xr-x 25 philburk staff850 28 Jan 13:07 . drwxrwxr-t 7 root admin238 7 Jan 12:00 .. drwx-- 24 philburk staff816 28 Jan 11:10 Desktop drwx-- 19 philburk staff646 7 Jan 11:07 Documents drwx-- 35 philburk staff 1190 27 Oct 08:36 Library drwx-- 5 philburk staff170 19 Mar 2003 Movies drwx-- 7 philburk staff238 21 Oct 14:44 Music drwx-- 24 philburk staff816 21 Oct 14:45 Pictures drwxr-xr-x 5 philburk staff170 27 May 2003 Public drwxr-xr-x 5 philburk staff170 19 Mar 2003 Sites Just to make sure I would issue the following command: sudo chown -R [yourusername]:staff * in your home directory. This will make sure that you own all the items in there. I would also pull that second 256 MB chip and run it for a good couple of days and notice if there is a significant difference. Finally, stop overclocking until you have Panther stable. Phil Burk -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- The Think Different Store http://www.ThinkDifferentStore.com ---
Re: The fun I've been having
On 28-Jan-04, at 15:00, Phil Burk wrote: Correct me if this is wrong, but if I am able to do a full backup using either CCC or Disk Utility, I would be safe in attempting to do an archive and restore installation - assuming I remove one of the 256 MB RAM chips. If I did this, would I have to re-install all my applications again? Obviously I'd have to do all the software updates. But I'm thinking that I might be able to eliminate problems with permissions this way and possibly any corrupt components from the current install. Use CCC. I assume you're thinking of backing up to a FW device. Definitely the best way to go. If you do this and subsequently do an archive and install you should be OK. The Panther installer won't clobber stuff you've added to any of the folder hierarchies such as /Application and /Library. (Actually, this changed in Jag too but I'm not sure exactly when...) FW is not an option to me. I don't have any FW devices nor FW equipped machines. And my biggest SCSI drive is too small for a complete clone. I was hoping to connect to the 'Family' iMac and create my back-up on a partition of its drive that I have been unable to mount lately... Keep in mind that if you do an archive and install that you probably don't want to be preserving current users and network settings. This shouldn't matter if you have a complete backup as you'll be able to restore bits and pieces of your home directory as needed. As long as you don't completely replace your new home directory with your old you should be good to go. Hrmm. Isn't that kind of how I got to where I am now? No... You are suggesting using some finesse this time! Thanks! Dave -- G-Books is sponsored by http://lowendmac.com/ and... Small Dog Electronicshttp://www.smalldog.com | Refurbished Drives | -- Check our web site for refurbished PowerBooks | CDRWs on Sale! | Support Low End Mac http://lowendmac.com/lists/support.html G-Books list info: http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-books.html -- AOL users, remove mailto:; Send list messages to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] For digest mode, email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscription questions: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/g-books%40mail.maclaunch.com/ --- The Think Different Store http://www.ThinkDifferentStore.com ---
