Re: [Audyssey] replayability and Usa games was Re: Looking ForSomething New to Play
I agree with your original rampage, but I can see Tom's point, too. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Ibrahim Gucukoglu ibrahim_gucuko...@sent.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2013 12:06 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] replayability and Usa games was Re: Looking ForSomething New to Play Hi Thomas. I'm sorry, both to you and Shaun, it just gets me sometimes the attitude on here, the ingratitude. I never suggested James intended to cut and run, however he did and I personally paid for games which were never received such as Max Shrapnel. My problem lies in the fact that it looked like Shaun was ripping in to you, telling you to abandon MOTA and start again and I guess his email and the way it was phrased got my goat up. I am just as keen as everyone else to see new games developed for the AG community, however they aren't or at least not as rapidly, certainly not as intensely being produced, so anyone flaming or otherwise discouraging fellow developers has to be resisted if not squashed before it gets started right? Everyone has their bugbears and that was just mine, it certainly wasn't my intention to piss anyone off. All the best, Ibrahim. -Original Message- From: Thomas Ward Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2013 8:48 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] replayability and Usa games was Re: Looking For Something New to Play Hi all, I'm coming to this post a bit late, but please let's stop the flaming here. No matter how we all feel about the unfortunate situation with James North, what was it, six years ago its really passed time to put it behind us. I can understand your frustration with some list members such as Shaun but ripping him a new one on list isn't the way to handle it. :D Ibrahim, regarding the games James North had in production I said this before and I will say it again I am certain it wasn't his intent to take the money and run. After all, I have in my possession the source code for three different games he was working on, and know for a fact he was working on them. However, it is my belief the stress, the pressure, the demands of certain individuals in this community that resulted in him just throwing in the towel and walking away from it all. Leaving as he did was wrong, but its also understandable. End of story. On 3/25/13, Ibrahim Gucukoglu ibrahim_gucuko...@sent.com wrote: Hi Shaun. Jesus Christ, Shaun, your attitude absolutely sucks. James North was a brilliant innovator, his games are testaments to what can be achieved with diligence, commitment and passion. Sadly James lost that passion because of individuals like you, always pushing for more, always wining about inadequacies, always piling on the pressure for this and that to be released. James might have been a negligent developer in the end, he might have lost interest and heart in the blind community, but it was only because of the base ingratitude of so many people. In the end, I wouldn't have been surprised if he wasn't above ripping off people with promises of games he never intended to release, or perhaps he did, but put them on the back burner. Whatever, he had a life too, and so far in my soul opinion, games like Monkey Business, ESP Pinball Classic, Chain Reaction, Alien Outback and Dynaman just go to show the wide range of his talents as a developer. The blind gaming community lost a true innovator when he stopped developing and disappeared, I doubt he'd ever have anything to do with the blind strata of society ever again after what he experienced. Now you dare to take pot shots at Thomas Ward who out of his own pocket for the most part is developing MOTA, I wouldn't be surprised if shits like you don't end up pushing us back to an age when all we can play are text based RPG and MUD games, text adventure and the like because no one wants to develop for us. Rant over, if you want to participate in our community, do it constructively, otherwise it might be wise for you to unsubscribe. All the best, Ibrahim. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at
Re: [Audyssey] replayability and Usa games was Re: Looking ForSomething New to Play
Hi Dark, You know one thing about games that are all about exploration is that they are no fun for the author to play. Well unless there is lots of other random things in those areas. Just exploring is no fun if you wrote it and know it all already. My Dungeon Master game is the best example of that. Other than the random descriptions of the women in the rooms the game is always the same. So I think that is my worst game as far as replay value. BFN Jim I'm looking for some good Easter grass. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] replayability and Usa games was Re: Looking ForSomething New to Play
I aggree a lot of games need random events ofcause you need to do it in such a way as the player thinks things are random. In smuglers there is a limit of something like 9 story passages but you would never know there was. At 01:26 AM 3/28/2013, you wrote: Hi Dark, You know one thing about games that are all about exploration is that they are no fun for the author to play. Well unless there is lots of other random things in those areas. Just exploring is no fun if you wrote it and know it all already. My Dungeon Master game is the best example of that. Other than the random descriptions of the women in the rooms the game is always the same. So I think that is my worst game as far as replay value. BFN Jim I'm looking for some good Easter grass. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] replayability and Usa games was Re: Looking ForSomething New to Play
Hi Shaun, Beyond random events I would like to see more complex programming techniques being used for things such as artificial intelligence. A good artificial intelligence doesn't use random choices, but actually bases intelligent decisions on statistical but uncertain data. How many times did the player throw a left hook verses a right jab etc. It can use those stats to try and block attacks based on how the game player behaves, and will learn from fighting you rather than just randomly attacking and blocking etc. That is why mainstream fighting games like Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat, and Marvel VS Capcom are so difficult to play because the artificial intelligence of the computer opponents is very good and can hold its own in a fight. On 3/27/13, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: I aggree a lot of games need random events ofcause you need to do it in such a way as the player thinks things are random. In smuglers there is a limit of something like 9 story passages but you would never know there was. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] replayability and Usa games was Re: Looking ForSomething New to Play
Hi Jim, Well, you have a good point there. The biggest problem with being the game developer is games, no matter how good the story, really hold no surprises for the developer himself or herself. If its about exploration you already know basically where every trap is, where every passage leads, and what should behind every door. About the only solution for that problem is a level generator or maze generator that basically randomly constructs a new level every game. I believe Entombs levels are done this way so no two games are exactly the same game. Plus if you randomly select and place items you will never find them in the same place from game to game. That helps restore some of the unexpected challenge to the game that a new gamer might feel towards your game. So in your adult dungeon game perhaps one solution would be to design a system where by the castle is randomly generated from game to game and the women are randomly placed accordingly. It would require a radical redesign of the game, but could be done to make it different from game to game. Cheers! On 3/27/13, Jim Kitchen j...@kitchensinc.net wrote: Hi Dark, You know one thing about games that are all about exploration is that they are no fun for the author to play. Well unless there is lots of other random things in those areas. Just exploring is no fun if you wrote it and know it all already. My Dungeon Master game is the best example of that. Other than the random descriptions of the women in the rooms the game is always the same. So I think that is my worst game as far as replay value. BFN Jim I'm looking for some good Easter grass. j...@kitchensinc.net http://www.kitchensinc.net (440) 286-6920 Chardon Ohio USA --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] replayability and Usa games was Re: Looking ForSomething New to Play
Thats true tom most ais up to a point have been simple though we are starting to get more complex ones. I wish there was more from greymatter as this company was working on something. I say was because the last blog post was last year which doesn't mean squat however. At 09:55 AM 3/28/2013, you wrote: Hi Shaun, Beyond random events I would like to see more complex programming techniques being used for things such as artificial intelligence. A good artificial intelligence doesn't use random choices, but actually bases intelligent decisions on statistical but uncertain data. How many times did the player throw a left hook verses a right jab etc. It can use those stats to try and block attacks based on how the game player behaves, and will learn from fighting you rather than just randomly attacking and blocking etc. That is why mainstream fighting games like Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat, and Marvel VS Capcom are so difficult to play because the artificial intelligence of the computer opponents is very good and can hold its own in a fight. On 3/27/13, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: I aggree a lot of games need random events ofcause you need to do it in such a way as the player thinks things are random. In smuglers there is a limit of something like 9 story passages but you would never know there was. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] replayability and Usa games was Re: Looking ForSomething New to Play
Hi Shaun, Well, you know as well as I do that's not unusual. A lot of people start writing some project with a bang, make some progress, and then it drops off for weeks or months. Sometimes life gets in the way, and sometimes the developer in question simply loses interest in the project. In either case I am sure we will here from Gray Matter if and when they have something to report. On 3/27/13, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: Thats true tom most ais up to a point have been simple though we are starting to get more complex ones. I wish there was more from greymatter as this company was working on something. I say was because the last blog post was last year which doesn't mean squat however. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
