Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On 1/22/06, Noel J. Bergman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It is also good to try to ensure that discussion has settled down, and that there is a consensus before calling for the vote. I generally believe that a good ASF vote isn't called to make a decision; it is called to ratify one. Exactly. A very important principle. So, regarding this proposal, does anyone else have any other concerns? Any other questions from or for the OFBiz team? Otherwise, I can prepare the vote later today. -- jaaron - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Noel J. Bergman wrote: Anyone on the PMC want to comment on this proposal? It seems as if there is significant interest from ASF Members, a willingness on the part of the donors to adopt The Apache Way, a number of ASF Members willing to act as Mentors, and no noticeably egregious problems. Anything else? ;-) I will certainly be involved with the project, and will also be using this as an opportunity to learn what being a mentor means in real terms (there seem to be enough mentors already). Ross - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Leo Simons wrote: On Sun, Jan 22, 2006 at 10:39:51PM -0500, Noel J. Bergman wrote: Anyone on the PMC want to comment on this proposal? It seems as if there is significant interest from ASF Members, a willingness on the part of the donors to adopt The Apache Way, a number of ASF Members willing to act as Mentors, and no noticeably egregious problems. +1. Leo PS: My non-pmc-hat comment would be boring, but nevermind me :-) The field ofbiz covers is actually quite interesting (it's similar to what I did with a former employer, so that's probably part of the reason why it is interesting. Although not on the PMC, a +1 from me :) Mvgr, Martin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
I was actually under the impression [that] the wiki was the place to leave this sort of thing During the collaborative phase of the PROPOSAL, the Wiki is used as a common edit space. When the VOTE comes up, the final propoal MUST be included in the VOTE e-mail, else that e-mail will be rejected. It is also good to try to ensure that discussion has settled down, and that there is a consensus before calling for the vote. I generally believe that a good ASF vote isn't called to make a decision; it is called to ratify one. --- Noel - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Noel J. Bergman wrote: I was actually under the impression [that] the wiki was the place to leave this sort of thing During the collaborative phase of the PROPOSAL, the Wiki is used as a common edit space. When the VOTE comes up, the final propoal MUST be included in the VOTE e-mail, else that e-mail will be rejected. Ok - we collaborated privately at first, via email, so the wiki wasn't necessary. It is also good to try to ensure that discussion has settled down, and that there is a consensus before calling for the vote. I generally believe that a good ASF vote isn't called to make a decision; it is called to ratify one. Alright - so, in terms of procedure, what happens next and who can make it happen? The Incubator PMC votes on accepting the project? I think we're ready for that, unless there are further questions. -- David N. Welton - http://www.dedasys.com/davidw/ Linux, Open Source Consulting - http://www.dedasys.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: Is this becoming the current de-facto process, posting to a wiki? (or @)#!)#@ wiki, as I tend to think of them...) Can we please have things go to the mail list, as that should be the 'primary institutional memory' of the incubator community. Feel free to also have on a wiki for collaboration to get it done, but after that, the final proposal should, IMO, go to the mail list. Please provide a patch to the Incubator documentation saying how things ought to work, then. In order to give the OFBiz guys something to start with, I created a document with OpenOffice, the final, reworked version of which you can read as an attachment to David E. Jones' email at the root of this thread. However, I was actually under the impression (seeing that everyone else had done so) that the wiki was the place to leave this sort of thing, so I wiki-ized it. David (Jones) - can you add J. Aaron Farr [EMAIL PROTECTED] as a mentor to the document, and change the sponsor to the Incubator PMC? -- David N. Welton - http://www.dedasys.com/davidw/ Linux, Open Source Consulting - http://www.dedasys.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Wiki votes, was Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On Wed, Jan 18, 2006 at 02:03:14AM +0100, Erik Abele wrote: [changed subject line though I don't intend to have a big discussion about this topic] Grr, I just did exactly the same thing and wrote just about the same thing. My thread view must be messed up... In any case, +1 to what he said. LSD - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Noel J. Bergman wrote: Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: Can we please have things go to the mail list, as that should be the 'primary institutional memory' of the incubator community. +1 But let's try to say such things to be educational, not chastising. Sorry. The wiki made me do it :) I hope David's been around enough to understand I didn't intend to chasten. I suspect he was following recent examples (and I should have said something sooner...) geir - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Jacopo Cappellato wrote: Hi Geir (and all), my name is Jacopo Cappellato, I'm one of the developers of the OFBiz project and, as you can imagine, I'm very interested in your feedback about our request to join the ASF Incubator. About the proposal posted to the Wiki instead of to this list... well if you go to the first post in this thread you'll find a mail from David Jones with the proposal attached (in PDF format). The document has essentially the same content of the Wiki page, only the proposed sponsor is different (based on feedback from this list, we are now asking that the Incubator PMC be our sponsor). Of course, we have no problems to repost to the list an updated PDF version as well, if PDF is good for you (and we'll probably do this if there are no more comments from this list that we should take into account). Hi Jacopo, First and most importantly, welcome! :) The following is my personal opinion, and shouldn't in any way be assumed to be Incubator Policy. Personally, I do like PDF but it still is one step away from LCD and makes it a *little* harder, for example for people who use non-GUI tools or on cellphones and such (I do get work mail to a phone, and I do have a PDF reader on it, but I think that I'm in a small minority...) It also makes searching mail content harder - you couldn't take an incubator archive mbox and grep for something. (Yes, modern tools will open and digest it, but use of those tools is more the exception than the norm...). Also, if you were keeping revisions of the docs in something like SVN, diffs would be easier. For example, you talk about how the PDF is essentially the same. If they were two emails, I could diff them. Now, w/ a PDF and a wiki page, one would have to examine the two manually to know the difference. Anyway, enough of a rant on this. Thanks for getting involved in this. The ASF is a fun place. really :) geir Thanks for your time and suggestions, Jacopo Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: Is this becoming the current de-facto process, posting to a wiki? (or @)#!)#@ wiki, as I tend to think of them...) Can we please have things go to the mail list, as that should be the 'primary institutional memory' of the incubator community. Feel free to also have on a wiki for collaboration to get it done, but after that, the final proposal should, IMO, go to the mail list. Does anyone else feel this way? Mail archives will live for years in distributed places. Wiki's seem to be single-sourced and a lot more ephemeral geir David N. Welton wrote: David N. Welton wrote: I guess it should be placed on the wiki? I'll do that later today if no one else beats me to it. Here we go: http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/OFBizProposal I changed the proposed sponsor to the Incubator PMC, as that's apparently the done thing. Ciao, - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Is this becoming the current de-facto process, posting to a wiki? (or @)#!)#@ wiki, as I tend to think of them...) Can we please have things go to the mail list, as that should be the 'primary institutional memory' of the incubator community. Feel free to also have on a wiki for collaboration to get it done, but after that, the final proposal should, IMO, go to the mail list. Does anyone else feel this way? Mail archives will live for years in distributed places. Wiki's seem to be single-sourced and a lot more ephemeral geir David N. Welton wrote: David N. Welton wrote: I guess it should be placed on the wiki? I'll do that later today if no one else beats me to it. Here we go: http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/OFBizProposal I changed the proposed sponsor to the Incubator PMC, as that's apparently the done thing. Ciao, - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On Wednesday 18 January 2006 07:16, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: Does anyone else feel this way? Mail archives will live for years in distributed places. Wiki's seem to be single-sourced and a lot more ephemeral Yes. As the primary tool of communication for myself and many others, mails are read. Links less so. Cheers Niclas - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: Is this becoming the current de-facto process, posting to a wiki? (or @)#!)#@ wiki, as I tend to think of them...) Can we please have things go to the mail list, as that should be the 'primary institutional memory' of the incubator community. Feel free to also have on a wiki for collaboration to get it done, but after that, the final proposal should, IMO, go to the mail list. Does anyone else feel this way? Mail archives will live for years in distributed places. Wiki's seem to be single-sourced and a lot more ephemeral I agree. -David - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Wiki votes, was Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
[changed subject line though I don't intend to have a big discussion about this topic] On 18.01.2006, at 00:16, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: Is this becoming the current de-facto process, posting to a wiki? (or @)#!)#@ wiki, as I tend to think of them...) Can we please have things go to the mail list, as that should be the 'primary institutional memory' of the incubator community. Feel free to also have on a wiki for collaboration to get it done, but after that, the final proposal should, IMO, go to the mail list. Does anyone else feel this way? Mail archives will live for years in distributed places. Wiki's seem to be single-sourced and a lot more ephemeral Thanks, Geir - there was a half written msg with exactly this topic in my outbox... I fully agree with you that at least anything which is subject to a vote should directly include all the relevant information - no links for substantial content, just for extras like fancy PDFs describing the architecture or tarballs of the initial codebase etc. This may sound a bit picky but everything else unfortunately comes with too many disadvantages (no real archives, dead links, no offline access, etc.). Cheers, Erik smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
RE: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: Can we please have things go to the mail list, as that should be the 'primary institutional memory' of the incubator community. +1 But let's try to say such things to be educational, not chastising. --- Noel - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Hi Geir (and all), my name is Jacopo Cappellato, I'm one of the developers of the OFBiz project and, as you can imagine, I'm very interested in your feedback about our request to join the ASF Incubator. About the proposal posted to the Wiki instead of to this list... well if you go to the first post in this thread you'll find a mail from David Jones with the proposal attached (in PDF format). The document has essentially the same content of the Wiki page, only the proposed sponsor is different (based on feedback from this list, we are now asking that the Incubator PMC be our sponsor). Of course, we have no problems to repost to the list an updated PDF version as well, if PDF is good for you (and we'll probably do this if there are no more comments from this list that we should take into account). Thanks for your time and suggestions, Jacopo Geir Magnusson Jr wrote: Is this becoming the current de-facto process, posting to a wiki? (or @)#!)#@ wiki, as I tend to think of them...) Can we please have things go to the mail list, as that should be the 'primary institutional memory' of the incubator community. Feel free to also have on a wiki for collaboration to get it done, but after that, the final proposal should, IMO, go to the mail list. Does anyone else feel this way? Mail archives will live for years in distributed places. Wiki's seem to be single-sourced and a lot more ephemeral geir David N. Welton wrote: David N. Welton wrote: I guess it should be placed on the wiki? I'll do that later today if no one else beats me to it. Here we go: http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/OFBizProposal I changed the proposed sponsor to the Incubator PMC, as that's apparently the done thing. Ciao, - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On Mon, Jan 16, 2006 at 10:45:49PM +0100, David N. Welton wrote: David N. Welton wrote: I guess it should be placed on the wiki? I'll do that later today if no one else beats me to it. Here we go: http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/OFBizProposal I changed the proposed sponsor to the Incubator PMC, as that's apparently the done thing. I believe J. Aaron said he'd be willing to mentor too[1]. -- justin 1. http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-general/200601.mbox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On 1/18/06, Justin Erenkrantz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Jan 16, 2006 at 10:45:49PM +0100, David N. Welton wrote: David N. Welton wrote: I guess it should be placed on the wiki? I'll do that later today if no one else beats me to it. Here we go: http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/OFBizProposal I changed the proposed sponsor to the Incubator PMC, as that's apparently the done thing. I believe J. Aaron said he'd be willing to mentor too[1]. -- justin Certainly willing if they'll have me! :-) -- jaaron - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
Any other questions or comments on this for now? I guess it should be placed on the wiki? I'll do that later today if no one else beats me to it. Ciao, -- David N. Welton - http://www.dedasys.com/davidw/ Linux, Open Source Consulting - http://www.dedasys.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
David N. Welton wrote: I guess it should be placed on the wiki? I'll do that later today if no one else beats me to it. Here we go: http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/OFBizProposal I changed the proposed sponsor to the Incubator PMC, as that's apparently the done thing. Ciao, -- David N. Welton - http://www.dedasys.com/davidw/ Linux, Open Source Consulting - http://www.dedasys.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Incubator PMC vs Board as sponsor (Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF)
Niclas Hedhman wrote: On Friday 13 January 2006 04:27, David E. Jones wrote: As I understand it in order to become a top level project the Board must be the sponsor, which is why the proposal was written that way. That is a misconception. For projects targetting top-level, EITHER the Board or the Incubator PMC must sponsor. Board doesn't like to sponsor, and do so only in exceptional cases. So the Incubator PMC is the right folks to address. (And probably why you get the What is this doing here? response from the Board.) IMO this is a buglet with http://incubator.apache.org/incubation/Incubation_Policy.html which I filed here: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INCUBATOR-10 If you're reading that for the first time, or even if you're an ASF member like me who hasn't dealt with incubation before, it doesn't give you a sense for which one is the best to use. If someone grants me the relevant SVN karma and points me to the right checkout url, I will fix this and the other two bugs I filed as well. -- David N. Welton - http://www.dedasys.com/davidw/ Linux, Open Source Consulting - http://www.dedasys.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On 1/10/06, David E. Jones [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We are all looking forward to your comments and desire to express in advance appreciation for all that you have done and are doing for the open source world and the software world in general through your efforts in the Apache Software Foundation. This proposal has caught my interest. I'd be willing to help mentor. A couple of points: The proposal says that this project is to be sponsored by the ASF Board. Is that correct? Did the Board already +1 on or are we still searching for a sponsoring entity? Apache has generally stayed away from end user applications and instead focuses on infrastructure and middleware. That's not completey true, but is a good rule of thumb. For example, a lot of contributors and supporters of the ASF use our code to create ecommerce products. I'm a little worried that some may view this proposal as the ASF attempting to compete with these contributors. -- jaaron - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
J Aaron Farr wrote: On 1/10/06, David E. Jones [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We are all looking forward to your comments and desire to express in advance appreciation for all that you have done and are doing for the open source world and the software world in general through your efforts in the Apache Software Foundation. This proposal has caught my interest. I'd be willing to help mentor. Great:-) A couple of points: The proposal says that this project is to be sponsored by the ASF Board. Is that correct? Did the Board already +1 on or are we still searching for a sponsoring entity? The board response was along the lines of why is this here?, so I guess the Incubator PMC should be the sponsoring entity if there is to be one. Apache has generally stayed away from end user applications and instead focuses on infrastructure and middleware. That's not completey true, but is a good rule of thumb. For example, a lot of contributors and supporters of the ASF use our code to create ecommerce products. I'm a little worried that some may view this proposal as the ASF attempting to compete with these contributors. I think we should look at whether this project is a good fit for the ASF (I think so, or I wouldn't have mentioned the idea to them) rather than if we are stepping on someone's toes. Geronimo steps on toes. Harmony does to some degree, as well. Once upon a time, people sold web servers, and httpd stepped on their toes. And for what it's worth, the problems that OFBiz attempts to solve are hard, and there is a lot of room for competitors - both those that build other systems as well as those that build on top of OFBiz. JIRA, for instance, is built on top of code from the OFBiz guys. -- David N. Welton - http://www.dedasys.com/davidw/ Linux, Open Source Consulting - http://www.dedasys.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On 1/12/06, David N. Welton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think we should look at whether this project is a good fit for the ASF (I think so, or I wouldn't have mentioned the idea to them) rather than if we are stepping on someone's toes. Geronimo steps on toes. Harmony does to some degree, as well. Once upon a time, people sold web servers, and httpd stepped on their toes. On 1/12/06, Ross Gardler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Many ASF projects compete with many other products. As far as I understand things the ASF prides itself on not allowing any commercial entities or individuals to dictate what the ASF does and how it does it. Certainly. My point was that we should be prepared for such concerns. For example, I imagine an announcement that Apache is producing a full ecommerce stack would create some buzz and questions. As for being a good fit, on the surface it seems like it would be. I don't know anything other than what was in the proposal about how OFBiz has worked internally as a community. But then, figuring out those sorts of things is exactly what the incubation process is about. -- jaaron - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On Jan 12, 2006, at 11:57 AM, J Aaron Farr wrote: This proposal has caught my interest. I'd be willing to help mentor. That would be great. I've been skimming through the policy emails that have been on this list for the last few days and it's sounding like 3 mentors is something that would be a good thing. For the reason you mentioned (below) and others having a good group of mentors will likely be pretty important for a project like OFBiz. A couple of points: The proposal says that this project is to be sponsored by the ASF Board. Is that correct? Did the Board already +1 on or are we still searching for a sponsoring entity? As I understand it in order to become a top level project the Board must be the sponsor, which is why the proposal was written that way. We did send a this proposal to the board mailing list and as far as I know there hasn't been a +1 from the Board yet, but they said the proposal should initially be sent here to the general incubator list. I guess after it has been discussed here in order to go forward as proposed approval and acceptance from the board will be required (or maybe not?). Apache has generally stayed away from end user applications and instead focuses on infrastructure and middleware. That's not completey true, but is a good rule of thumb. For example, a lot of contributors and supporters of the ASF use our code to create ecommerce products. I'm a little worried that some may view this proposal as the ASF attempting to compete with these contributors. Yes, this was one of my initial concerns and probably why I never really thought of the option before (even though I like the Apache way of doing things and about a year ago we started looking into changing the OFBiz license from MIT to Apache 2.0). This does seem to be a bit of a new direction for Apache, though in a way it is just going another level or two up a stack that various Apache projects have been progressing up over time. In general where I see OFBiz fitting in the world is not so much an out of the box use piece of software anyway. Some companies certainly can and choose to use it this way, but for the most part it is a starting point for customized software for internal use within a company or even commercial or open source derivative works. These typically have a more specifically defined scope, like a particular industry or type of company. Doing things in this way makes software projects and products possible that wouldn't be otherwise, just as lower level (infrastructure, middleware, etc) open source components do though at a different level. OFBiz has a framework oriented for data and service driven enterprise apps and a data model, set of services, and set of generic user interfaces that can be used in some cases as it though in most cases just as artifacts that can be reused in other projects. Not that this wouldn't compete with other commercial and even open source efforts, but hopefully this short description makes it more clear how I see OFBiz fitting in the world. For those who have home grown ecommerce and other enterprise systems (CRM, ERP, and so on) for either internal or commercial use, perhaps we can help them out by allowing them to share lower level data model and service and possibly even UI artifacts and therefore focus on higher level more differentiating things. In the end it is the end-users who benefit most from this, as is the case with most open source software, and so it is from the edge (end users) that most of this is driven and service and product providers have a new option to either cooperate or compete, but either way they will have to explain their choice and direction to their clients, and there is no universal principal that says that in all cases one is really better or worse than the other... One way or another I guess bringing in a project like OFBiz does perhaps expand the scope, especially the publicly perceived scope, of the ASF. In a way this is a validation of the ASF model and this type of licensing and community interaction in general. It shows that these things apply to lots of different types of software and not just the more common and established perception of open source software in operating systems, server infrastructure (web, mail, other servers), middleware, databases, etc. -David - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On Jan 12, 2006, at 1:25 PM, Yoav Shapira wrote: There IS a conceptual and code-level separation between the OFBiz framework and components built on top of it, but I think it makes a nice cohesive project together. It's sort of like if Tomcat and Struts were under the same umbrella: not necessary, but not hurtful as long as people can independently download, use, develop, and contribute to either layer. My understanding is the OFBiz has always been like that, which is good. Just a quick comment on this to save people reading in having to dig stuff up... We have been working more and more toward a separation of the framework and the applications. It has always been possible, though for some situations not real easy, to use specific tools in the framework and such, so the direction we are working toward is to have perhaps even separate releases for the framework and the applications. If you look in the OFBiz SVN repository the applications part is the applications directory and the framework is everything else. Oh, well, except the specialized directory which is sort of growing into a commons type of area for people working on specific open source extensions to OFBiz. So, anyway, the framework release would include all of the tools, the example component (with entity defs, service defs and implementations, and UI level artifacts for an example UI following certain best practices patterns), and the only other webapp would be the webtools component which has a UI for various framework related or more technical tools that can be used while the server is running (like cache viewing/stats/maintenance, and UIs related to framework components like the Service Engine, Entity Engine, Workflow Engine, Data File Tool, etc). In another email the applications were described as kind of the ultimate example of how to use the framework for real world business problems, and that is a good way of looking at it and one way of using these parts of OFBiz. It may not happen right away as we work on getting OFBiz into Apache, but eventually these are some of various distinct sub-projects mentioned in the proposal that could go under a top level OFBiz project. -David smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On Friday 13 January 2006 04:27, David E. Jones wrote: As I understand it in order to become a top level project the Board must be the sponsor, which is why the proposal was written that way. That is a misconception. For projects targetting top-level, EITHER the Board or the Incubator PMC must sponsor. Board doesn't like to sponsor, and do so only in exceptional cases. So the Incubator PMC is the right folks to address. (And probably why you get the What is this doing here? response from the Board.) Anyway. I am also quite intrigued by this proposal. OFBiz has been on my radar for quite a few years, but never got into any active work I am doing. However, I am currently working on a competing product which I think would benefit from being based on something like OFBiz instead of all in-house development. I think the company in question would also benefit is some of the generic stuff is pushed out into OFBiz, to lower the man power requirement. After all, this company doesn't sell the underlying technology, they sell the end-user system, totally customized for a particular company. I am in favour of bringing this to ASF, and would also like to assist in the incubation process. Cheers Niclas - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Proposal for OFBiz to Join the ASF
On Jan 12, 2006, at 6:00 PM, Niclas Hedhman wrote: On Friday 13 January 2006 04:27, David E. Jones wrote: As I understand it in order to become a top level project the Board must be the sponsor, which is why the proposal was written that way. That is a misconception. For projects targetting top-level, EITHER the Board or the Incubator PMC must sponsor. Board doesn't like to sponsor, and do so only in exceptional cases. So the Incubator PMC is the right folks to address. (And probably why you get the What is this doing here? response from the Board.) Yes, that would explain it... I'll adjust our proposal to mention both as options. So, I guess the most likely and preferred option is the Incubator PMC, so we'll hope for more comments from PMC members. I just read through the Incubator PMC list and it looks like Yoav Shapira is on it, which is great since he was interested in this early on and has volunteered to champion this proposal. Anyway. I am also quite intrigued by this proposal. OFBiz has been on my radar for quite a few years, but never got into any active work I am doing. However, I am currently working on a competing product which I think would benefit from being based on something like OFBiz instead of all in- house development. I think the company in question would also benefit is some of the generic stuff is pushed out into OFBiz, to lower the man power requirement. After all, this company doesn't sell the underlying technology, they sell the end-user system, totally customized for a particular company. I am in favour of bringing this to ASF, and would also like to assist in the incubation process. Thank you for your comments. It's great to see interest and support for moving in this direction. -David smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
