Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Jun 30, 2009, at 11:09 AM, Nick Kew wrote: I'll be interested in this. Would it be useful for me to don an ASF hat and offer to help mentoring this? I'll also (naturally) be looking from httpd/proxy eyes. Don't we already have 3 Mentor? Any more would be counterproductive, I think. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Jim Jagielski wrote: On Jun 30, 2009, at 11:09 AM, Nick Kew wrote: I'll be interested in this. Would it be useful for me to don an ASF hat and offer to help mentoring this? I'll also (naturally) be looking from httpd/proxy eyes. Don't we already have 3 Mentor? Any more would be counterproductive, I think. Why do you think that, and where it is said 3 is a maximum? Regards -- ^(TM) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Jul 3, 2009, at 9:55 AM, Mladen Turk wrote: Jim Jagielski wrote: On Jun 30, 2009, at 11:09 AM, Nick Kew wrote: I'll be interested in this. Would it be useful for me to don an ASF hat and offer to help mentoring this? I'll also (naturally) be looking from httpd/proxy eyes. Don't we already have 3 Mentor? Any more would be counterproductive, I think. Why do you think that, and where it is said 3 is a maximum? Past experience. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
I'll be interested in this. Would it be useful for me to don an ASF hat and offer to help mentoring this? I'll also (naturally) be looking from httpd/proxy eyes. -- Nick Kew - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Jun 30, 2009, at 9:09 AM, Nick Kew wrote: I'll be interested in this. Would it be useful for me to don an ASF hat and offer to help mentoring this? I'll also (naturally) be looking from httpd/proxy eyes. Just say the word, and I'll add you to the proposed mentor list. :) -- Leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Leif Hedstrom wrote: On Jun 30, 2009, at 9:09 AM, Nick Kew wrote: I'll be interested in this. Would it be useful for me to don an ASF hat and offer to help mentoring this? I'll also (naturally) be looking from httpd/proxy eyes. Just say the word, and I'll add you to the proposed mentor list. :) the word :-) Guess that means I should sign up to p...@incubator, as well as the trafficserver lists if/when they get created. -- Nick Kew - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 8:25 AM, jean-frederic clerejfcl...@gmail.com wrote: Leif Hedstrom wrote: On Jun 25, 2009, at 7:59 AM, jean-frederic clere wrote: I don't think that is a problem: httpd (and other ASF project) also uses autconf/autoheader/automake to generate the configure that are included in the sources tarballs. Cool! One more (followup) question: We have a couple of files which currently have the BSD license attached to them, and these are flagged as potential IP violations. Is it possible to include these files and re-release them under the Apache license, or do we need to eliminate them (i.e. clean-room rewrite the functionality) ? assuming that the BSD files are flagged for licensing purposes (and not because they have dubious prevenance) then - with some care - there's no need to clean room rewrite the functionality. when preparing the source for donation, it's best to retain the original license and include some provenance information so that it's easier to track them. once the donation has happened, the disclaimers need to be included in the LICENSE documents included in the binary. the original licenses need to be retained in the source (typically as a quoted attribution with an apache header once significant changes have been made to the source). but it's probably easiest to ask about this on the legal-discuss list... - robert - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Leif Hedstrom wrote: On Jun 25, 2009, at 7:59 AM, jean-frederic clere wrote: I don't think that is a problem: httpd (and other ASF project) also uses autconf/autoheader/automake to generate the configure that are included in the sources tarballs. Cool! One more (followup) question: We have a couple of files which currently have the BSD license attached to them, and these are flagged as potential IP violations. Is it possible to include these files and re-release them under the Apache license, or do we need to eliminate them (i.e. clean-room rewrite the functionality) ? James was using the following see http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/james/jspf/trunk/tester/src/main/java/org/apache/james/jspf/tester/DNSTestingServer.java?revision=781370pathrev=781370 Cheers Jean-Frederic - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Leif Hedstrom wrote: Jim Jagielski wrote: Add me. Sweet, thanks! I have updated the draft proposal with the three mentors that we have so far. How many do we need before we could be considered for a vote? I'd like to join as well. We were looking for a mod_jk successor for a long time, and looking at the description this project looks very promising. Regards -- ^(TM) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Jun 26, 2009, at 4:46 AM, Mladen Turk wrote: Leif Hedstrom wrote: Jim Jagielski wrote: Add me. Sweet, thanks! I have updated the draft proposal with the three mentors that we have so far. How many do we need before we could be considered for a vote? I'd like to join as well. Great, so I can add you as a mentor as well? We were looking for a mod_jk successor for a long time, and looking at the description this project looks very promising. We use TS inside Y! for a lot of intelligent HTTP routing. -- Leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Leif Hedstrom wrote: Leo Simons wrote: Is there anything else missing? Nope, it looks like you have your ducks in a row! +1 from me. Great! Once our legal get their ducks lined up (very soon I hope),I'll submit the official request for approval / vote. I want to resolve the TM issues around Traffic Server before we do this, in case we end up having to rename the project (but I hope it won't come to that). Any progress on the topic? Cheers Jean-Frederic - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Jun 25, 2009, at 12:52 AM, jean-frederic clere wrote: Great! Once our legal get their ducks lined up (very soon I hope),I'll submit the official request for approval / vote. I want to resolve the TM issues around Traffic Server before we do this, in case we end up having to rename the project (but I hope it won't come to that). Any progress on the topic? Not yet, but apparently the legal person was away most of last week and this week. I'll do some more prodding to get some answers here. On a positive note, we got our report back from the 3rd party who did a code review for IP ownership. There are a few issues we'll need to resolve, but nothing major and we'll obviously have them resolved before we push the source. The only major piece that might need to get removed for now is SNMP support. One question though to the Incubator people: Several of the issues reported are around us using GNU configure, which is under GPL. How does other apache projects deal with this? Is it just a matter of not checking in the generated configure scripts, and expect people to use the .in, .am etc files to re-generate the scripts? This doesn't sound right though, because I'm pretty darn certain when I build Apache HTTP for example, I don't have to run autoconf or automake. Cheers! -- leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Leif Hedstrom wrote: On Jun 25, 2009, at 12:52 AM, jean-frederic clere wrote: Great! Once our legal get their ducks lined up (very soon I hope),I'll submit the official request for approval / vote. I want to resolve the TM issues around Traffic Server before we do this, in case we end up having to rename the project (but I hope it won't come to that). Any progress on the topic? Not yet, but apparently the legal person was away most of last week and this week. I'll do some more prodding to get some answers here. On a positive note, we got our report back from the 3rd party who did a code review for IP ownership. There are a few issues we'll need to resolve, but nothing major and we'll obviously have them resolved before we push the source. The only major piece that might need to get removed for now is SNMP support. One question though to the Incubator people: Several of the issues reported are around us using GNU configure, which is under GPL. How does other apache projects deal with this? Is it just a matter of not checking in the generated configure scripts, and expect people to use the .in, .am etc files to re-generate the scripts? This doesn't sound right though, because I'm pretty darn certain when I build Apache HTTP for example, I don't have to run autoconf or automake. I don't think that is a problem: httpd (and other ASF project) also uses autconf/autoheader/automake to generate the configure that are included in the sources tarballs. Cheers Jean-Frederic Cheers! -- leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Jun 25, 2009, at 7:59 AM, jean-frederic clere wrote: I don't think that is a problem: httpd (and other ASF project) also uses autconf/autoheader/automake to generate the configure that are included in the sources tarballs. Cool! One more (followup) question: We have a couple of files which currently have the BSD license attached to them, and these are flagged as potential IP violations. Is it possible to include these files and re-release them under the Apache license, or do we need to eliminate them (i.e. clean-room rewrite the functionality) ? Thanks! -- leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Hi, We already got two new mentors signed up (thanks to your posts to the httpd devel list I think). So, we're up to three now, how many do we need to be considered for a vote? 3 mentors is usually considered enough :) Is there anything else missing? Nope, it looks like you have your ducks in a row! +1 from me. Sounds like the an obvious/interesting challenge will be to try and attract some contributors from outside of yahoo -- with such a big (and probably sophisticated =) ) code base I imagine it might be hard for newbies to get up to speed...then again I can also imagine more than a few people would be interested in this stuff :) cheers, - Leo - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Leo Simons wrote: Is there anything else missing? Nope, it looks like you have your ducks in a row! +1 from me. Great! Once our legal get their ducks lined up (very soon I hope), I'll submit the official request for approval / vote. I want to resolve the TM issues around Traffic Server before we do this, in case we end up having to rename the project (but I hope it won't come to that). Sounds like the an obvious/interesting challenge will be to try and attract some contributors from outside of yahoo -- with such a big (and probably sophisticated =) ) code base I imagine it might be hard Yeah, it's pretty complicated under the hood (asynchronous state machine + threads), but there are tons of easy wins for someone to immediately come in and contribute. We also hope that some more former developers will sign up (we already got one, Eric Balsa, who is an ex-Yahoo). for newbies to get up to speed...then again I can also imagine more than a few people would be interested in this stuff :) Yeah, I think we have some interesting code/solutions here, which is what makes it scale to 4-8 CPUs fairly linearly. :) But we still think we can improve this, a lot, using new techniques and tools to optimize for todays multi-core processors with large L2/L3 caches etc. Cheers! -- Leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
We have a pretty well documented API for writing plugins and we are trying to push new features into plugins if possible. Writing plugins is much easier then working on the core code. We know some people that have worked on the code base before and are hoping they will join the effort. -Bryan On 06/18/2009 11:13 AM, Leo Simons wrote: Hi, We already got two new mentors signed up (thanks to your posts to the httpd devel list I think). So, we're up to three now, how many do we need to be considered for a vote? 3 mentors is usually considered enough :) Is there anything else missing? Nope, it looks like you have your ducks in a row! +1 from me. Sounds like the an obvious/interesting challenge will be to try and attract some contributors from outside of yahoo -- with such a big (and probably sophisticated =) ) code base I imagine it might be hard for newbies to get up to speed...then again I can also imagine more than a few people would be interested in this stuff :) cheers, - Leo - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Roy T. Fielding wrote: On Jun 15, 2009, at 5:56 AM, Leif Hedstrom wrote: Roy T. Fielding wrote: I like the idea, though I would prefer that a larger group of committers (outside Yahoo!) were known up front because that sounds like a big code base. Any chance you could convince some of the former coders to join in the proposal? This is definitely a valid concern. We will try to get more people involved now that the process has begun, but I don't know if or how soon we can get some external developers to sign up. It's a bit of a catch 22, since we don't have the source out there yet. I know, and they may be prevented (by former employee contract) from talking about it until after Y! makes the code public. I would just place it on the wish list of things to do before graduating. BTW, Traffic Server is a registered trademark (2304928) owned by Yahoo! Is that trademark going to be assigned to the ASF as well or does the project plan on changing the name? I would like to see how various bits compare to implementations within httpd, particularly the protocol bits. We have run TS through Co-Advisor a number of times, and it fairs pretty well (as well as Squid, at least). Would it help putting up the results somewhere (I'd have to verify that this is possible and doable first though)? And as I mentioned in the proposal draft, we run TS + apache together for many Y! sites, and they work very well together. Sorry, I did not mean to imply that acceptance was conditional on the code quality. I am just interested in seeing if our projects can help each other once the code is available under the Apache License. If there is a scarcity of mentors, then I will mentor this project. I think I will have cycles to help. Cheers Jean-Frederic - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 12:17 AM, Leif Hedstroml...@yahoo-inc.com wrote: We would like to submit the Traffic Server proposal to the incubator. Our draft is available at I don't see a direct problem with few non-Yahoo developers for entering incubation, but it will become the most important aspect of the incubation period to grow the independence of Yahoo as employer of the people doing the work. I like that this is not another Java app proposal ;-) I need to see more Mentors than Doug before I would vote on this proposal. Cheers -- Niclas Hedhman, Software Developer http://www.qi4j.org - New Energy for Java I live here; http://tinyurl.com/2qq9er I work here; http://tinyurl.com/2ymelc I relax here; http://tinyurl.com/2cgsug - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Niclas Hedhman wrote: On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 12:17 AM, Leif Hedstroml...@yahoo-inc.com wrote: We would like to submit the Traffic Server proposal to the incubator. Our draft is available at I don't see a direct problem with few non-Yahoo developers for entering incubation, but it will become the most important aspect of the incubation period to grow the independence of Yahoo as employer of the people doing the work. Yes, that is definitely our goal (and I tried to document this in the draft, but maybe I need to clarify more here?). We are communicating with a few previous TS developers, to see if we can get a few non-yahoos as initial committers. Even if that happens, our hope is that we can attract developers pretty easily and readily as soon as we have the source out there in the incubator. I like that this is not another Java app proposal ;-) I need to see more Mentors than Doug before I would vote on this proposal. Yeah, we're still looking for more! :) It seems we have Doug Cutting Jean-Frederic Clere and possibly (but not likely) Roy T. Fielding. It seems we would need at least a couple more mentors, right? -- Leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Jun 17, 2009, at 10:09 AM, Leif Hedstrom wrote: Niclas Hedhman wrote: On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 12:17 AM, Leif Hedstroml...@yahoo-inc.com wrote: We would like to submit the Traffic Server proposal to the incubator. Our draft is available at I don't see a direct problem with few non-Yahoo developers for entering incubation, but it will become the most important aspect of the incubation period to grow the independence of Yahoo as employer of the people doing the work. Yes, that is definitely our goal (and I tried to document this in the draft, but maybe I need to clarify more here?). We are communicating with a few previous TS developers, to see if we can get a few non-yahoos as initial committers. Even if that happens, our hope is that we can attract developers pretty easily and readily as soon as we have the source out there in the incubator. I like that this is not another Java app proposal ;-) I need to see more Mentors than Doug before I would vote on this proposal. Yeah, we're still looking for more! :) It seems we have Doug Cutting Jean-Frederic Clere and possibly (but not likely) Roy T. Fielding. It seems we would need at least a couple more mentors, right? Add me. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Jim Jagielski wrote: Add me. Sweet, thanks! I have updated the draft proposal with the three mentors that we have so far. How many do we need before we could be considered for a vote? Also, besides the lack of non-yahoo committers, are there any other concerns with the draft? I'm still investigating the issue with the trademark of Traffic Server, if we can't transfer that to ASF (under the condition that we get accepted of course), we'll have to change the name (I hope it won't get to that). Cheers, -- Leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Roy T. Fielding wrote: I know, and they may be prevented (by former employee contract) from talking about it until after Y! makes the code public. I would just place it on the wish list of things to do before graduating. Sounds good. Do I need to put more explicit into the proposal draft? BTW, Traffic Server is a registered trademark (2304928) owned by Yahoo! Is that trademark going to be assigned to the ASF as well or does the project plan on changing the name? So, legal is working on this, but it'll be a few days (at least) until we have a final answer. Rest assure that we'll come up with a resolution that satisfies everyone (that's what my VP told me). Sorry, I did not mean to imply that acceptance was conditional on the code quality. I am just interested in seeing if our projects can help each other once the code is available under the Apache License. Ah yeah. There's a lot of interesting code in this project :). There is also a bunch of code that, ehm, needs much polishing, and there's definitely room to make lots of additions and improvements. I think it'll be a fun project to participate in, and I'm sure we can mutually learn from each others experiences. If there is a scarcity of mentors, then I will mentor this project. However, I'd prefer not to because my time is limited and I would not want to short-change the project. We already got two new mentors signed up (thanks to your posts to the httpd devel list I think). So, we're up to three now, how many do we need to be considered for a vote? Is there anything else missing? Thanks! -- leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Jun 15, 2009, at 5:56 AM, Leif Hedstrom wrote: Roy T. Fielding wrote: I like the idea, though I would prefer that a larger group of committers (outside Yahoo!) were known up front because that sounds like a big code base. Any chance you could convince some of the former coders to join in the proposal? This is definitely a valid concern. We will try to get more people involved now that the process has begun, but I don't know if or how soon we can get some external developers to sign up. It's a bit of a catch 22, since we don't have the source out there yet. I know, and they may be prevented (by former employee contract) from talking about it until after Y! makes the code public. I would just place it on the wish list of things to do before graduating. BTW, Traffic Server is a registered trademark (2304928) owned by Yahoo! Is that trademark going to be assigned to the ASF as well or does the project plan on changing the name? I would like to see how various bits compare to implementations within httpd, particularly the protocol bits. We have run TS through Co-Advisor a number of times, and it fairs pretty well (as well as Squid, at least). Would it help putting up the results somewhere (I'd have to verify that this is possible and doable first though)? And as I mentioned in the proposal draft, we run TS + apache together for many Y! sites, and they work very well together. Sorry, I did not mean to imply that acceptance was conditional on the code quality. I am just interested in seeing if our projects can help each other once the code is available under the Apache License. If there is a scarcity of mentors, then I will mentor this project. However, I'd prefer not to because my time is limited and I would not want to short-change the project. Roy - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
Roy T. Fielding wrote: I like the idea, though I would prefer that a larger group of committers (outside Yahoo!) were known up front because that sounds like a big code base. Any chance you could convince some of the former coders to join in the proposal? This is definitely a valid concern. We will try to get more people involved now that the process has begun, but I don't know if or how soon we can get some external developers to sign up. It's a bit of a catch 22, since we don't have the source out there yet. I would like to see how various bits compare to implementations within httpd, particularly the protocol bits. However, I don't We have run TS through Co-Advisor a number of times, and it fairs pretty well (as well as Squid, at least). Would it help putting up the results somewhere (I'd have to verify that this is possible and doable first though)? And as I mentioned in the proposal draft, we run TS + apache together for many Y! sites, and they work very well together. Thanks! -- Leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [Proposal] Traffic Server
On Jun 12, 2009, at 9:17 AM, Leif Hedstrom wrote: Good morning, We would like to submit the Traffic Server proposal to the incubator. Our draft is available at http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/TrafficServerProposal A quick overview of Traffic Server: Traffic Server is a Yahoo! / Inktomi caching proxy server. It has been actively developed and used inside Yahoo! for the last 3+ years, and we are now ready to begin the next step in it's evolution: make it Open Source. TS is a fairly large piece of software (300k+ lines of C/C++ code), and provides features and benefits lacking in many existing proxy/caches. I am obviously looking for feedback and comments on the proposal, as well as a few mentors. Doug Cutting has accepted to be our Champion. I like the idea, though I would prefer that a larger group of committers (outside Yahoo!) were known up front because that sounds like a big code base. Any chance you could convince some of the former coders to join in the proposal? I would like to see how various bits compare to implementations within httpd, particularly the protocol bits. However, I don't have the time to be a mentor. Cheers, Roy - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
