Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
As there clearly was an interest (at least 2:1 yay's to nay's, counting in feedback I got on irc) I have created the bug: https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=151118 where we can finalize some details. I described the way we can proceed in the opening message. Please add yourself to the bug if you want to be involved. Present TLP's that do not want to move can be dealt with on the opt-out basis. After the TLP is created I'll create a bugs blocking that tracker, one per existing project and let project members decide whether they want to move or not. If somebody opts out by then I will of course skip on creating the corresponding bug. The details are in the tracker. The suggested projects are: Projects to be moved (tentative, may opt out): Common Lisp java perl php python New projects: Ada Haskell George -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
Hi George, On 10/13/06, George Shapovalov [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The suggested projects are: Projects to be moved (tentative, may opt out): Common Lisp java perl php python The PHP team will be opting out. Best regards, Stu -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
Stuart Herbert wrote: The PHP team will be opting out. Confirmed, PHP will remain its own TLP. -- Best regards, Luca Longinotti aka CHTEKK LongiTEKK Networks Admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Gentoo Dev: [EMAIL PROTECTED] SysCP Dev: [EMAIL PROTECTED] TILUG Supporter: [EMAIL PROTECTED] signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
середа, 11. жовтень 2006 23:12, Stuart Herbert Ви написали: We don't need a management hierarchy just to bring some structure to the docs on the website.I don't see any benefit in creating a TLP for programming languages. If we were to move programming languages around, for example, I'd want to bring PHP and Ruby under webapps, as that's a more natural fit than a 'programming languages' category. Well, incidentally I already got replies for two languages where they wanted now to create a project, given there is a TLP for languaged in general. So some people so want that :). Anyway, any project is definitely free to opt out of this move. If you want your project to stay TLP please just say so. George -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
середа, 11. жовтень 2006 22:30, Matthew Kennedy Ви написали: I think this proposal is OK even it is just to organize the top level listing a bit better. It seems like a real mix right now -- Council next to Common Lisp, PR next to Python and so on etc. Yea, this is exactly why I want to organize stuff a bit better. The principal list of individual TLPs (as they stand now) is below: Common Lisp eselect [..] I'm surprised to see you've listed eselect in there. Isn't that more of a system tool? Well, it seemed like a small tool, having a TLP for which is a gross overkill, and it is used to switch compiler variants. But then you are right - it is used for many more nonrelated packages (the related modules I have here are: binutils, compiler, gnat, java-nsplugin, java-vm, but this is less than 50%), so we can cross it out (from this one). PPS We could add principal divisions there, like Languages Tools whatever_else I think this would be too deep a hierarchy. Funnily I already got questions like is this thing only to move stuff around? I would be all for it if it had a bit more meat. I added that PPS expecting questions like that would be asked. Of course, realistically I do not think anything other than repositioning a few projects comes out of it - yet. If anybody steps forward saying I want to do so and so and it seems to fit under this umbrella then I think would be the right time to consider the structure or what exactly is going to be done. As it stands now, I don't think it is worth overly worrying about this. George -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
On 10/12/06, George Shapovalov [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Funnily I already got questions like is this thing only to move stuff around? I would be all for it if it had a bit more meat. I added that PPS expecting questions like that would be asked. Of course, realistically I do not think anything other than repositioning a few projects comes out of it - yet. If anybody steps forward saying I want to do so and so and it seems to fit under this umbrella then I think would be the right time to consider the structure or what exactly is going to be done. As it stands now, I don't think it is worth overly worrying about this. This isn't going to bring any benefits to anyone. If you want to help users find docs on programming languages on Gentoo (assuming there _are_ any users who don't know how to Google for such things), just get the docs team to organise 'Programming Languages on Gentoo' docs category on [1]. _That_ would be much more useful to users. Creating a TLP just to order some docs ... sorry, but it seems a very bizarre thing to do. [1] http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/index.xml Best regards, Stu -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
George Shapovalov wrote: Well, it seemed like a small tool, having a TLP for which is a gross overkill, eselect is anything but a small tool... I'd just reorder docs in a more rational way but let our flat tlp as is. lu -- Luca Barbato Gentoo/linux Gentoo/PPC http://dev.gentoo.org/~lu_zero -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
On Wed, Oct 11, 2006 at 19:33:16 +0200, George Shapovalov wrote: Hi gang. [snip] The principal list of individual TLPs (as they stand now) is below: Common Lisp eselect java perl php python Ada -- to be added Hi, if you go ahead with it, we'll probably want to add a ml subproject. It didn't seem worth creating a whole TLP before, but would definitely have a place in such an organization. /Alexandre -- Hi, I'm a .signature virus! Please copy me in your ~/.signature. pgpfwQD7eWrQS.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
This isn't going to bring any benefits to anyone. If you want to help users find docs on programming languages on Gentoo (assuming there _are_ any users who don't know how to Google for such things), just get the docs team to organise 'Programming Languages on Gentoo' docs category on [1]. _That_ would be much more useful to users. Creating a TLP just to order some docs ... sorry, but it seems a very bizarre thing to do. [1] http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/index.xml I would like to say that the docs are second to... probably only IBM developerworks which seems like where 1/4 of our docs come from. perhaps the wrong time to bring this up but the list for documentation is a MESS I've been using gentoo docs for 3 years back when they were 1/10-ish this size and back then the organization worked. but I can never remember whether the reference I'm looking for is Gentoo Desktop Documentation Resources Upgrade Guides System Administration Documentation etc. so the index page rare does me any good I suggested this on bugzilla a long time ago... and can't remember what happened with it. but docs could use a search function. better yet if it could somehow be integrated also into the forum search might save some time with some questions. example search grub on the forums get the grub error listing doc, and the handbook chapter on it, then forum threads. even if the forum thing wasn't possible say I was looking for a doc on iptables. http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/security/security-handbook.xml?part=1chap=12 http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/articles/dynamic-iptables-firewalls.xml http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/articles/linux-24-stateful-fw-design.xml those are 3 references that I'm aware of and in 2 different places and only one even mentions iptables in the title, and if I don't know the linux firewall is called iptables and I search firewall only one is labeled firewall in the link and the other I would have to know it was mentioned in the security handbook. I also think that via common sense these would all be under System Administration Documentation, but none of them are. If I were new to the docs I would be completely confused at the organization. -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
четвер, 12. жовтень 2006 10:47, Stuart Herbert написав: This isn't going to bring any benefits to anyone. If you want to help users find docs on programming languages on Gentoo (assuming there _are_ any users who don't know how to Google for such things), just get the docs team to organise 'Programming Languages on Gentoo' docs category on [1]. _That_ would be much more useful to users. Sorry, I am not sure how it went this direction. I am not talking about some language docs, these do not even belong to our space. I am talking about Gentoo and project specific issues. One thing is an organization - there are real projects related to languages and IMHO it only makes sense for them to belong to a common TLP since they are related. (And looks like a few more would be created to represent existing teams when the TLP is created). Then there are some use resources specific to every project. These would be represented as that - resource links in index.xml pages, as for example done with multi-blas/lapack in sci. This is all I am talking about. Sorry about confusion. George -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
On Wed, 2006-10-11 at 17:24 +0200, George Shapovalov wrote: Hi gang. As I looked for a place where to put some documentation naturally falling in a project domain for Ada, I realized that we have TLPs for many individual (programming) languages. First I though to ping some people on irc, but, as I went down the page the noticed number became nontrivial, so I decided to throw an email here instead. Basically the idea is that a TLP for an individual language is way too much - most of them do not have subprojects anyway. Therefore lets try to organize it a bit better? At least documentation-wise. We will have to see whether there will be any additional correllation further on (and indeed there might be, for example for the different gcc-backends), but even if not I think it is better to keep the main projects page more structured. What I propose is to create a TLP page for Gentoo Programming Resources (or pick your name) and move all the individual languages into the subdirs of it. Any opinions? If I get any yay's or no nays I'll create a bug about it and then we can finalize the layout there.. (I just like to keep the trace of what is being done and the related discussions). I'd certainly say 'yay' for the Haskell team. We'd be quite happy to be a sub-project of some prog lang TLP. -- Duncan Coutts : Gentoo Developer (Haskell team lead) email : dcoutts at gentoo dot org -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
Hi George, On 10/11/06, George Shapovalov [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi gang. As I looked for a place where to put some documentation naturally falling in a project domain for Ada, I realized that we have TLPs for many individual (programming) languages. First I though to ping some people on irc, but, as I went down the page the noticed number became nontrivial, so I decided to throw an email here instead. We don't need a management hierarchy just to bring some structure to the docs on the website.I don't see any benefit in creating a TLP for programming languages. If we were to move programming languages around, for example, I'd want to bring PHP and Ruby under webapps, as that's a more natural fit than a 'programming languages' category. (And no, I'm not pushing for PHP and Ruby to move at all). Best regards, Stu -- -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-dev] a new TLP to unify programming langiages?
George Shapovalov [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [...] What I propose is to create a TLP page for Gentoo Programming Resources (or pick your name) and move all the individual languages into the subdirs of it. Any opinions? If I get any yay's or no nays I'll create a bug about it and then we can finalize the layout there.. I think this proposal is OK even it is just to organize the top level listing a bit better. It seems like a real mix right now -- Council next to Common Lisp, PR next to Python and so on etc. (I just like to keep the trace of what is being done and the related discussions). The principal list of individual TLPs (as they stand now) is below: Common Lisp eselect java perl php python Ada -- to be added I'm surprised to see you've listed eselect in there. Isn't that more of a system tool? PPS We could add principal divisions there, like Languages Tools whatever_else I think this would be too deep a hierarchy. -- Matthew Kennedy Gentoo Linux Developer (Public Key 0x401903E0) -- gentoo-dev@gentoo.org mailing list
