[Goanet] Three new postings on Benualim blog
Hello! Three new postings are uploaded on Benaulim blog: 1. BANAULEKARS PROTEST http://bvacbenaulim.blogspot.com/2009/06/banaulekars-protest.html 2. OF LEGENDS, LAWYERS LADRAOS http://bvacbenaulim.blogspot.com/2009/06/of-legends-lawyers-ladraos.html 3. LIES OF THE SARPANCH NAILED http://bvacbenaulim.blogspot.com/2009/06/lies-of-sarpanch-nailed.html Warmly, Seby _ cricket and news. Logon to MSN Video for the latest clips http://www.exploremyway.com
[Goanet] Daily Grook #435
DAILY GROOK #435 ___ BATTER SHATTER ___ by Francis Rodrigues bowler stout wicket cold, batsman out he got bold! _ puns word-play of all kinds, hey...read between the lines! _ _ Internet explorer 8 lets you browse the web faster. http://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=9655582
[Goanet] Disseminating ignorance
To. The Editor Gomantak Times, St. Inez, Goa. Sir, Please publish the below given letter in 'Letters to the Editor' section. Thanks Tomazinho Cardozo Disseminating ignorance Mr. S. M. Borges's letter - Disseminating ignorance - published on your daily dated June 10, 2009 is the result of frustration. I say it is frustration only because he has unnecessarily mixed the payment I get as a columnist with the issue in question. My friend Mr. Borges gets excited immediately if any one states that DKA was formed to fight the injustice meted to Konkani in Roman script. It is because he is wearing glasses through which he can see only Konkani in Devnagori script and nothing else. I have always stated that Konkani in Roman script should be given equal status with Konkani in Devnagori script in the Official Language Act of Goa. My friend Mr. Borges opposes it with all his might because his ultimate aim is to see the end of Konkani in Roman script as soon as possible. Mr. Borges has a lot of time to write letters after letters and he feels that everyone else too lives in the same way. Every minute is precious to me and hence I would not like to waste my precious time in answering questions of Mr. Borges who is not any authority to decide on the issue. Nevertheless I am prepared to clear all the issues in the confused mind of Mr. Borges regarding Konkani in Roman script. Let us have a one to one, face to face live debate on this issue in the presence of the media - printed as well as electronic - and the people. If that happens then only we shall be in a position to state who is disseminating ignorance, false information and manipulated history. I give first preference to Mr. S. M. Borges to organize this debate and if he is not able to do so then I take the responsibility to organize the same. If agreeable then Mr. Borges may contact me on my cell phone 9822170102. Tomazinho Cardozo Candolim
Re: [Goanet] Is Indian Humility Virtuous or Despicable?
Most if not all attacks have been opportunistic. As I said before, the law-and-order situation has gone down hill in the last 10 years or so, ever since Labour came into power in the state, and the civil libertarians have had the upper hand against police actions. The last Police Commissioner appointee had a softly, softly approach to criminal damage (personal attacks, graffiti et al), which IMHO has is the root cause of these issues. The current Police Commissioner is no better, and calls from the public for a tougher approach seem to fall on deaf ears. Attacks against Indians are but a fraction of attacks other people have suffered. We already have had two good samaritans dead, who went to the aid of those being attacked. To quote Andrew Bolt, a columnist in Herald Sun: That so many Indian students are bashed and robbed can be largely explained by the kind of part-time jobs they tend to take, being hard workers - the late shifts in 7-Eleven stores, taxis and petrol stations, for instance. Imagine how safe these students are when they then go home alone late at night, often walking or taking near-deserted trains back to the tough suburbs where the cheap rents are. How safe would your own children be? But some attacks aren’t so easily explained away. Some, you might say, are “racist” in that Indians are famously peaceable - less likely to break the law and less likely to fight back when attacked by those who do. To thieves and thugs, they’re soft targets. That said, other attacks, as Victoria Police now belatedly admit, are indeed no-mucking-about racist. But to whose shame are these racists, really? True, video footage of the infamous pack-attack on Sourabh Sharma on the Werribee train shows thugs of various ethnicities, including, it seems, the Anglo kind. But what police and many journalists refuse to confirm or even discuss is what victims and their spokesmen repeatedly say - that many of their attackers are Africans, Islanders and, less often, Asians who are newcomers themselves, beneficiaries of our eagerness to seem kind and tolerant. Hear it from Macquarie University student Mukul Khanna, called back home by his worried parents: “A lot of my Pakistani friends have left the place after being brutally attacked and robbed . . . Interestingly, the attackers are mostly not locals and are themselves people of foreign origin.” Or read it in an edited statement that Tanveer X, bashed in January, gave to Beyond India Monthly: “When I turned on Anderson Rd I saw four black men . . . One of them came running behind us and hit me with the stick. Then they started hitting my wife . . . I want action against those African guys.” And have it confirmed in this Herald Sun report from last year, when Indian taxi drivers protested at having been the victims of most armed robberies on cabbies: “This year between May 8 and August 2 there were 12 reported robberies on taxi drivers in Flemington, Moonee Ponds and Ascot Vale. “Police will not officially acknowledge any particular ethnic group is a target, or that any other group is carrying out the crimes. But in every case the victims told police their attackers were African . . .” And in all but two their victims were Indians. Note yet again the reluctance of police to admit they have trouble with African gangs—or gangs of any particular ethnicity. So there you are. Part of the problem is that some Indian students (and my wife sees them every day on her journey to work by tram - we live near LaTrobe University) are arrogant, put their feet up on the seat opposite, talk loudly among themselves in Hindi (just as one would in the din of Mumbai and Delhi), ogle women, and generally act obnoxious - not all, but a few. Besides that, the body odour and the stale smell of cooking on clothes. And it is these few that give all other Indians a bad name. Gabriel. - Original Message From: Mario Goveia mgov...@sbcglobal.net To: goanet@lists.goanet.org Sent: Friday, 12 June, 2009 12:30:06 AM Subject: [Goanet] Is Indian Humility Virtuous or Despicable? Shame on Australia for being racist and allowing this to happen. Shame, shame, shame all around. Mario responds: Hey, Roland, Calm down, man! With all this shame-shame-poppy-shame business, and perhaps a couple of straw men and a few gross generalities thrown in for good measure, are you, perhaps, also displaying the same lack of confidence you are decrying? I'm not even sure what version of Indian humility you are talking about when you cite some Indian 16-year-old. I wonder what our intrepid Aussie Goanetters, Ruby Goes and Gabriel de Figueredo, think about all these accusations by Roland that Australia - the entire country, no less - is racist and allowing Indian students to be attacked??? Need a Holiday? Win a $10,000 Holiday of your choice. Enter
[Goanet] Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin
Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin (Goa) Inquisition Believe me or not, I was born and brought up in Goa. In other words I spend 50 years in Goa plus 12 more years in and out Goa and UK. Like the word ‘Tsunami’ for me the word ‘Inquisition’ was also entirely new. And I only found out about it when I was in the UK. And where did I find out? On our very own ‘Goanet’ internet forum some years ago. In school as part of history we learnt about French revolution, America civil war, Boston tea party, Maria antonette or Luis the XIV. We learnt about Shivaji Maharaj, Timpu Sultan, the world war I and II, Partition of Bengal, Lord Curzon etc etc but I never ever remember reading or leaning about Goa’s Inquisition. When I saw some old framed wall pictures at Rachol Church (near Rai-Shiroda ferry), I asked my Dad about it and I was told it was all about ‘Cumcolim Martyrs’or ‘Kristavank piddapidda’. The pictures showing images of brutal killings. Perhaps, in Goa, we did not hear or learn about Inquisition because most Goan shools run by the Church. I am sure the things would have been different if the case was other way round. Non- Christian being the majority in Goa, they did try to bring it up, as a part of history, in the form of a VCD but it did not go well with the Christians and the same was withdrawn. It’s true, we being Goans, don’t know much about our tiny Goa’s history but we often learn it from others or outsiders. Talking about Bom Jesus Basilica, I was even told more than once that St. Francis Xavier himself ordered inquisition. I don’t know if that is true. Some could send me a pointer (privately) to any such articles on the net etc Saiba SFX, bhogos maka hanv chuklam zalear joego...@yahoo.co.uk for Goa NRI related info... http://in.groups.yahoo.com/group/GOAN-NRI/ For Goan Video Clips http://youtube.com/joeukgoa In Goa, Dial 1 0 8 For Hospital, Police, Fire etc
Re: [Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin
Dear Sapna, I think the Rough Guide took the rough information. People were burnt at the stake in England and Europe, but apparently this has been overlooked by all and sundry, especially by the Rough Guides. It is not known when burning was first used in Britain, but there is a recorded burning for heresy in 1222, when a deacon of the church was burnt at Oxford for embracing the Jewish faith so he could marry a Jew. In 1401, the king authorised a Statute of Heresy which gave the clergy power to arrest and try those suspected of heresy. The first to suffer under the new act was one William Sautre, a priest, who was executed at (Kings) Lynn in 1402. This statute was repealed in 1553, but burning was re-introduced by Henry VIII. His daughter, Mary Tudor (Bloody Mary), was also very keen on this method and 274 burnings of both sexes for heresy were recorded during her 5 year reign (reign of terror) in the mid 16th century. In most cases their only crime was following the Protestant faith. The normal place of execution in Londonbeing at West Smith Field (now called just Smithfield). An engraving of the period shows that these unfortunates were stood in empty tar barrels at the stake and then had faggots heaped round them. It was not the practice to strangle heretics before they were burnt so they died slow and horrible deaths - being literally burned alive. Burning was in use throughout Europe at this time and was particularly favoured by the Spanish Inquisition as it did not involve shedding of the victim's blood, which was disallowed under the prevailing Roman Catholic doctrine, and because it ensured that the condemned had no body to take into the next life (which was believed to be a very severe punishment in itself). It was also thought at that time that burning cleansed the soul which was considered important for those convicted of witchcraft and heresy. ... The last person to be burned as a witch in Scotlandwas Janet Horne at Dornoch in Ross shire in 1727. Janet had been accused of witching her daughter to make her hands and feet grow into horses hooves, so that she could ride her. The daughter had a deformed hand, due to being “shod by the Devil”! She was also tried but acquitted. She later had a child who exhibited the same kind of congenital hand deformity. A stone at the place of execution commemorates her death. The witchcraft Acts were repealed there in 1736. Go to http://www.witchesway.net/links/burningtimes/executed.htmlfor a listing of witch executions. It is claimed that some 200,000 people were burned for witchcraft in Europein 16th and 17th centuries. See http://www.capitalpunishmentuk.org/burning.html for the above quoted paragraphs. So I cannot see that the Inquisition in Goa was in any way any worse than in the rest of the world of the times. The above, BTW, does not talk of Inquisition in the Americas. You can do more reasearch about this topic if you wish, as it is rather abhorrent to me. Besides, another practice common in England of the times was to be hung, drawn and quartered - you may have seen the sanitized version in the movie Braveheart. To be fair, the Portuguese were the first in India to: 1. ban the then current practice of Sati (a practice worse than the Inquisition IMHO) 2. empower women allowing them equal rights of succession. 3. ban capital punishment (1867). India still carries on with capital punishment Gabriel. - Original Message From: Sapna Shahani sapnashah...@gmail.com To: Jason Keith Fernandes jason.k.fernan...@gmail.com Cc: goanet@lists.goanet.org Sent: Saturday, 13 June, 2009 2:50:34 PM Subject: Re: [Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin I was just struck when I learned that the Inquisition in Goa was possibly one of the worst in the world (according to the Rough Guide). Need a Holiday? Win a $10,000 Holiday of your choice. Enter now.http://us.lrd.yahoo.com/_ylc=X3oDMTJxN2x2ZmNpBF9zAzIwMjM2MTY2MTMEdG1fZG1lY2gDVGV4dCBMaW5rBHRtX2xuawNVMTEwMzk3NwR0bV9uZXQDWWFob28hBHRtX3BvcwN0YWdsaW5lBHRtX3BwdHkDYXVueg--/SIG=14600t3ni/**http%3A//au.rd.yahoo.com/mail/tagline/creativeholidays/*http%3A//au.docs.yahoo.com/homepageset/%3Fp1=other%26p2=au%26p3=mailtagline
[Goanet] Remembrance : 25 years before on June 13, 1984 Boat overturned
Remembrance : 25 years before on June 13, 1984 Boat overturned in which 25 villegers from Madkai drowned. Major help received by villagers at that time was from Dainik Gomantak who raised Rs.2.5 lacs from people contribution. http://www.dainikgomantak.com/dainikgomantak/gomantak/rightframe.html Shrikant Vinayak Barve Convener: We Love Ayurved 9403175973 Explore and discover exciting holidays and getaways with Yahoo! India Travel http://in.travel.yahoo.com/
Re: [Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin
Sapna, As a goan who has spent more time outside Goa, I personally feel that this historical quest of yours is an attempt to stir up events that happened a good 400 years ago or so. which will engender communal discord between the Hindu and Christian communities. Sapna Shahani wrote: As a non-Goan who's lived here on and off for 20 years, I'm very curious about Goa's history with the Inquisition. How is it that the gory history of Goa's past remains virtually unknown by outsiders or tourists? The Basilica of Bom Jesus is a beautiful building but I find it odd that visitors don't know what cruelties once took place in the vicinity of the Basilica. Would love to hear the thoughts of people on this list... Best, Sapna.
Re: [Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin
Sapna Shahani (SS) wrote. My responses interspersed SS [1]: I was just struck when I learned that the Inquisition in Goa was possibly one of the worst in the world (according to the Rough Guide). jc 1: You are coming to debate with us armed with 'information' from the Rough Guide? That is brilliant! -- SS [2]: I thought this list had intellectuals who could respectfully debate with one another. jc 2: Just that you may know, there ARE many intellectuals on this list. You are unlikely to know them as you 'do not know them well enough to know' any blind or bright spots, these intellectuals may or may not have. -- SS [3] I didnt think we knew each other well enough for you to know any other blind spots that I may have. jc 3: please see the answer above. ps: I thought that you would take on some more women-related intellectual issues e.g. Sati, Devadasi, Female Foetlcide and Infanticide, Dowry burning but I was wrong. Your encyclopedia appears to be the Rough Guide. You are (as they say) in a class by yourself - even though, you should not be surprised at the support you will get from the saffron haters of Catholics in Goa and elsewhere. jc
Re: [Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin
Dear Sapna, Let me reiterate my apology. Yes, the last line was out of line. No debate there. to further this discussion though, perhaps we should not be making statement based on something like the Rough Guide. Its exactly that! the Rough Guide for Christ's sake! :-D How does one say that the Goa Inquisition was one of the worst in the world? What is the scale on which this is determined? (Once more I am not saying that the Inquisition was a tea-party, i am nevertheless challenging the discourse). I have yet to see serious scholarship on the Goa Inquisition, and the work by A. K. Priolkar does not count. Similarly the two accounts that we have, shold also be taken in their context, written in the context of Northern v. Souther European rivalry, Protestant Catholic rivalry etc etc. Once more, discourse is what I am trying to question and challenge. You raise an interesting point in the silence on the matter. WHy is there silence? perhaps because we dont want to discuss the issue? because it results only in the entire debate getting skewed. And we dont need right wing Hindus to skew the debate. the best skewers of the debate are Nationlist Catholics, Zionists, and Orieintalist/ racist Europeans. Each for their own reasons of being more Indian, for adding larger intellectual foundations for the zionist project, and the Euros who can reaffirm racial distinctions by saying how wrong it was to try to make INdians, who ought to be Hindu (and non-'western') into Christian and 'western'. in other words they should remain 'authentic'. sincerely, J On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 10:20 AM, Sapna Shahani sapnashah...@gmail.comwrote: Jason, It wasn't my intention at all to provoke. By the way, I was raised Catholic (I am Anglo-Indian). What gives me the impression that Inquisition information is not known to visitors from outside Goa are my interactions with people I have met over 20 years of living in Goa on and off. Please don't confuse me with right-wing Hindus whom I've been given to understand have used this history to their advantage. I have no affinity for those types, in fact, quite the opposite. I was just struck when I learned that the Inquisition in Goa was possibly one of the worst in the world (according to the Rough Guide). This was years after I had started visiting Goa and after numerous visits to Old Goa. So it made me wonder why I never heard about that before, and I simply wanted to hear perspectives on this subject from this list. I'm sorry if I touched some nerves, I didn't realize it was such a sensitive issue, and I thought this list had intellectuals who could respectfully debate with one another. I hope future posters would reply a little more gently, so as not to scare away first-time posters like myself who may be non-Goan, but have significant respect for the land, and are trying to contribute to the economy in a positive way. In particular Jason, I thought your comment that 'my lack of awareness about contemporary politics is just another one of my blind spots' was out of line. I didnt think we knew each other well enough for you to know any other blind spots that I may have. Best, Sapna. On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Jason Keith Fernandes jason.k.fernan...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Sapna, From the sounds of your email it sounds like you are provoking us. What gives you the impression that the cruelties that once took place in the vicinity of the Basilica are not known? How did you come to this information? Clearly it is not that difficult to ascertain as you make it out to be? If at all, there is more (mis)information about the Inquisition than there is information, so perhaps we would do well to investigate that. But I am curious, what exactly do you hope to achieve from broadcasting this information to the visitors to the site? Perhaps you know that the 'information' about the Inquisition, is very often used to place contemporary (and native) Catholics in an uncomfortable position. Is this the intent of your inquiry? If not, then perhaps the lack of awareness about contemporary politics is just another one of your blind spots. My apologies for the terseness of the message, the bite is not intended to offend, merely to make a point. sincerely, J -- Message: 10 Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 21:43:19 +0530 From: Sapna Shahani sapnashah...@gmail.com Subject: [Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin To: goa...@goanet.org Message-ID: 8c1ee09c0906120913j92f1c80wab680693362d3...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 As a non-Goan who's lived here on and off for 20 years, I'm very curious about Goa's history with the Inquisition. How is it that the gory history of Goa's past remains virtually unknown by outsiders or tourists? The Basilica of Bom Jesus is a beautiful building but I find it odd that visitors don't know what
[Goanet] Migrant labourers and outsiders.
This in response to Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami. I know you have not been raised in Goa but you have lived in Goa for a number of years, why have not attempted to learn our Mai bhas. Perhaps your employees (servants) could have inter reacted with you better if you spoke in their own language rather than in Hindi. Hindi is a foreign language not many indigenous people speak it. Perhaps they see you as a ghantti with your fluent Hindi. In my life I had to learn Swahili, English, Konkani Hindi and a little Portuguese. So I say learn Konkani and come back to the fold of Konkani speaking people. Regards Ignatius Fernandes., _ Get the best of MSN on your mobile http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/
Re: [Goanet] SFX and the Inquisition
As a person who is best known for his photographs of various Goan sites, JoeGoaUK is also known as being the anonymous BJP supporter who surely must have been disappointed by the recent election results. It is usually not worth commenting on comments put out by people who hide in anonymity, or by those who suddenly spring up and decide to hold 'intellectual' discussions armed with Rough Guides. Even so (and with the anticipation that some ex-priest will jump up and slam the Church - more or less like an ex-member of a political party slams his former party), here are my comments (interspersed). JoeGoaUk wrote(JGK) JGK[1] Non- Christian being the majority in Goa, they did try to bring it up, as a part of history, in the form of a VCD but it did not go well with the Christians and the same was withdrawn. jc 1: What a cowardly or ignorant (at best) statement that is. It fails to mention the crucial reason WHY this infamous VCD had to be withdrawn i.e. because it contained FAKE stuff and implications. -- JGK [2] It’s true, we being Goans, don’t know much about our tiny Goa’s history but we often learn it from others or outsiders. jc2: Perhaps, JGK is talking about himself. -- JGK [3] Talking about Bom Jesus Basilica, I was even told more than once that St. Francis Xavier himself ordered inquisition. jc3: Yes and I was told more than twice that JoeGoaUK ordered the inquisition on 4 separate occasions along with Kingfisher beer on each of those occasions. A few preliminary questions might help this point of JoeGoaUK. (1) What does JGK mean by the word ordered? (2) Was SFX alive when the Inquisition came to Goa - a full 9 years after his death? -- JGK [4] I don’t know if that is true. Some could send me a pointer (privately) to any such articles on the net etc jc4: Why is that? Are you unable to access the net (or saffron propaganda) in Goa? -- JGK [5] Saiba SFX, bhogos maka hanv chuklam zalear jc4: This is NOT a chuk. This is a mischievous attempt to use words to slander SFX. It might help the discussion IF people were not sniping from the shadows as JoeGoaUK is known to do. As far as the Sapna is concerned, I am sure she is also researching Sati, Devadasi, Female foeticide et other issues and will be meeting us at the laundry to wash ALL the dirty linen. Then we can talk about ALL the people killed in the Maha-Wars, Kalinga, Partition and perhaps JGK's Gujarat. We will NOT talk about the Jallianwalla Bagh massacre, the Black hole of Calcutta, Northern Ireland and other british enterprises as we have not yet firmly established that Sapna Shahani is in fact an Anglo-Indian. jc
[Goanet] Why governments cannot run a business
I recently took issue with the assertions of some that a government run health care system is an efficient way to provide health care for all, and showed that such systems in operation for decades in Canada and Britain have led to growing rationing of serious medical procedures as small groups of perhaps well-intentioned government officials try to grapple with the impossible task of knowing what's good for everyone else, better than they do. In the US context, of the estimated 40 million who are not covered by health insurance, about half are either illegal aliens or Americans who can afford health insurance but have simply chosen not to buy it. For the others who may be truly indigent, the most efficient way for the government to help them would be to simply buy private health insurance for them just as they are assisted by government programs for other essentials. Anything else would not only be far more inefficient and expensive, but would also drag everyone down towards the least common denominator which is what happens in a socialist economy. In case Goanetters have missed it in their relentless search for usable knowledge, the attached column by John Steele Gordon discusses the US government's track record in running businesses and explains in simple terms the logic of why government cannot run a business: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124277530070436823.html In addition, using the permutations and combinations from Math 101, Economics Professor, Walter E. Williams, shows how it is impossible for any group of individuals, no matter how brilliant, to grasp the complexities of even small portions of an economy, and be able to make intelligent decisions on how it should be managed from the top: http://townhall.com/columnists/WalterEWilliams/2009/02/18/economic_miracle
Re: [Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin
My own Sir-Swat ancestors arrived with Persian pullao, to charm afro-mahars into a land swap, fifteen hundred years ago. Cruelty was never in the picture: that Pashtun zaffran lamb worked wonders ! In Swatland, today, the picture is not so pretty for the indo-pak occupiers whose delusions take in Pashtu land from Peshawar to Azad Kashmir. eric --- On Sat, 6/13/09, Joe Lobo tw...@pathcom.com wrote: Sapna, As a goan who has spent more time outside Goa, I personally feel that this historical quest of yours is an attempt to stir up events that happened a good 400 years ago or so. which will engender communal discord between the Hindu and Christian communities. Sapna Shahani wrote: As a non-Goan who's lived here on and off for 20 years, I'm very curious about Goa's history with the Inquisition. How is it that the gory history of Goa's past remains virtually unknown by outsiders or tourists? The Basilica of Bom Jesus is a beautiful building but I find it odd that visitors don't know what cruelties once took place in the vicinity of the Basilica. Would love to hear the thoughts of people on this list... Best, Sapna.
Re: [Goanet] Comment about Inquisition
Thank you Gabriel for your perspective. I am aware of the witch-hunts, burning at the stake and other savage torture methods Europeans used in that period. In fact, I think the whole world was quite savage until the 18th century and one could argue that has gradually declined or taken different forms since then and until now in the 21st century. In any case, it would be interesting to read an account of the Inquisition that is considered honest and fairly comprehensive, not to compare where greater brutalities were taking place but simply to get a better understanding of those times. If anyone knows of such a scholarly work, please let me know. Finally, to make one more point about what Jason said earlier... I don't think Goan Catholics need to take any offense when the subject of the Inquisition is raised because it happened over a couple hundred years ago, and under colonial rule! To me, it's an unfortunate period in the past to accept as part of history and learn from... Best, Sapna.
[Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin
Drae Sapna, Why go so far back in time Just a few questions I want to know from you and Goa-Netters. 1) During the Partition of India a million people (conservative Guess) were murdered by both factions i.e. Indians and Pakistanis Did India or Pakistan bring these murderers to justice when everything settled down? 2) When Indira Gandhi was assassinated by a Sikh body guard a lot of Sikhs men, women, and children were indiscriminately burned,hacked and murdered by Hindus Were these criminals ever brought to justice? We should talk of recent events first before we tackle events in previous centuries. Cheers Ignatius Fernandes. _ With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos. http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/
[Goanet] Goa news for June 14, 2009
Goa News from Google News and Goanet.org Visit http://www.goanet.org/newslinks.php for the full stories. *** Injury-time penalty sees Goa through - Hindu http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/8-0fd=Rurl=http://www.hindu.com/2009/06/12/stories/2009061256292000.htmcid=1259303998ei=fDY0Sq2NB6XmNZX32IMIusg=AFQjCNET28rain66WUAYezOQ06EeroHfRQ *** London Passenger Tests Positive For H1N1 Flu In Goa - Bernama http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/6-0fd=Rurl=http://www.bernama.com/bernama/v5/newsworld.php?id=417600cid=1259278787ei=fDY0Sq2NB6XmNZX32IMIusg=AFQjCNH0TmR_jeJCyn1tRXwwnjjjPq6xnw *** Fan v/s Fan: West Bengal vs. Goa - Goal.com http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/1-0fd=Rurl=http://www.goal.com/en-india/news/2290/santosh-trophy/2009/06/13/1322854/fan-vs-fan-west-bengal-vs-goacid=1260413176ei=fDY0Sq2NB6XmNZX32IMIusg=AFQjCNGCPpHNq0VbG4ogzi4Szl0lEMuBAA *** Sesa Goa buys Dempo\'s mining - Wall Street Journal argest acquisition in India's iron ore industry, Sesa Goa, a subsidiary of London-listed Vedanta Resources, today acquired Goa-based Dempo group's mining and maritime businesses for Rs 17.5 billion in an all-cash deal. ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/0-0fd=Rurl=http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124477538725409047.html?mod=googlenews_wsjcid=1259165391ei=fDY0Sq2NB6XmNZX32IMIusg=AFQjCNGc1ZP6y9GkbXpHQhgUZ3WNMgr_YQ *** Goa mulls changes in marriage laws - Times of India http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/5-0fd=Rurl=http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Cities/Goa-mulls-changes-in-marriage-laws/articleshow/4648827.cmscid=1259593297ei=fDY0Sq2NB6XmNZX32IMIusg=AFQjCNFP4x-2sHMCad1ZyXYqhgJ66gXhww *** Goa, India, boasts quiet neatness and tropical vegetation - Hunterdon Review 605) in Old Goa, then glance at the ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/7-0fd=Rurl=http://www.recordernewspapers.com/articles/2009/06/12/entertainment/doc4a30e1bf6c176599952262.txtcid=1259796883ei=fDY0Sq2NB6XmNZX32IMIusg=AFQjCNGMVUPOO1xk-0KShLCcnuNAQlP7sw *** Naik reviews project work in South Goa - Times of India http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/4-0fd=Rurl=http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Goa/Naik-reviews-project-work-in-South-Goa/articleshow/4650752.cmscid=1259962064ei=fDY0Sq2NB6XmNZX32IMIusg=AFQjCNEnLl43hrPqJNlxDdAYwTyumI51mg *** Acquisition boosts Sesa Goa - Livemint vemint, IndiaSesa Goa Ltd's decision to buy out the mining assets of Goa's Dempo Grouphas been lauded by the stock market, with the company's shares rising by 5% to more than Rs200 a share.The acquisition includes rights to mineable reserves and resources of 70 ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/9-0fd=Rurl=http://www.livemint.com/2009/06/12214343/Acquisition-boosts-Sesa-Goa.html?h=Bcid=0ei=fDY0Sq2NB6XmNZX32IMIusg=AFQjCNECUWBf9C2lxQ9yOkP_Il2oWGKf9g *** Bengal look to end 10-year title drought, Goa eye revenge - Press Trust of India ear title drought when they face former champions Goa in the final of the 63rd National Football Championship for Santosh Trophy at Jawaharlal Nehru Stadium, here tomorrow. ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/3-0fd=Rurl=http://www.ptinews.com/pti%5Cptisite.nsf/0/9A7DA5638D8B6060652575D4003F81EA?OpenDocumentcid=0ei=fDY0Sq2NB6XmNZX32IMIusg=AFQjCNGsHp4C8WGt73v64YQx-2Y0VsTbdQ *** S Goa-based museum gets Lisbon invite - Times of India ased ethnographic museum hasreceived an invitation from ISCTE, superior institute of labour and enterprise sciences in Portugal to exhibit part of its collection on costumes and jewelleries of Goa's tribe, ... http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=Tct=us/2-0fd=Rurl=http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Goa/S-Goa-based-museum-gets-Lisbon-invite/articleshow/4650747.cmscid=0ei=fDY0Sq2NB6XmNZX32IMIusg=AFQjCNH3nsWElYm7QX3EGm7dtTmFohVrgQ Compiled by Goanet News Service http://www.goanet.org/newslinks.php
[Goanet] Torches in the Fields at Night
Ignorance is bliss Blasio essage: 6 Date: Tue, 09 Jun 2009 11:42:44 + From: Jim Fernandes amigo...@att.net Subject: Re: [Goanet] Torches in the Fields at Night To: goa...@goanet.org Message-ID: 060920091142.11671.4A2E4AB4000D11AF2D9722230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBFC9 cfcf0109070...@att.net I am NOT convinced that frog population in Goa reached so low that it's now threatening their existence. Any animal that has a capacity to lay thousands of eggs in a single season, cannot be in danger. Period. I do support the concept of conservation of wild life - but not frogs. In Earth's past history, millions of animals came and went extinct. But the animal world still survived even though it must have disrupted their food chain. For example, the Dinosaurs came and went. That gave a perfect opportunity for mammals to take charge - and then to eventually give rise to mankind. If Dinoaaurs were to still survive, you and I wouldn't be here discussing about the frogs. Jim F. New York.
Re: [Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders ofPortuguese origin
Dear Sapna, I didn't want to engage myself in this basically 'mindless' talk about Goa's so called 'worst in the world' shocking' Portuguese sponsored inquisition of the past 400 years. But since you seemed to me a gullible (non-goan) goanetter who didn't know that you may have touched the wrong chord wanting to know, in your expressed innocence, why Goa's historic past, more specifically Goa's past related to the inquisition, was not rattled off by every third rate tourist guide that takes you and people like you around in the vicinity of Old Goa', let me say that in Goa, in Goa, we had to put up with festering tumors which are 100 per cent communally malignant, who have been trying to label sincere, unsuspecting, secular and peaceful Goans, who would want nothing more but to keep Goa's historic past buried in the achieves and libraries and not have it flaunted on the roads, streets, pathways and alleyways of Goa, more specifically the streets of Mala Fontainhas, if you know what I mean, as Portuguese lackeys. I must bring to your kind attention that very recently, one of the most malignant and festering communal tumor, who happened to be elevated (or got himself elevated from the back door) to the chair of Goa's esteemed Chief Minister, tried to dig into Goa's inquisition past by promoting a VCD, a third rate one at that (as far as real and authentic information is concerned), but mostly intended to be pushed down the throat of Goa's schools so that this communal venom would be spread deep into the hearts of budding future Goans and cultivate a crop of communal vipers to bring peaceful Goa to its knees. Again for your kind information, secular minded and peace loving Goans (self included) fought tooth and nail to clip this malignant tumor, in other words 'showed him the door' and will want to keep the door shut for him forever, never to allow him and his ilk to spread the venom of communalism in Goa. Just as well, the 15th. Lok Sabha has seen to it that the job is well done. Therefore, you should not be surprised if you were barked at when you openly touched this live wound of Goa's inquisition. My qualified advice to you is to visit one or more of our excellent libraries to educate yourself on the topic which seems to be holding your attention, or simply hit the web pages (goggles etc) to keep yourself well informed. Lastly, I must confess that you may have been taken for one of them 'tumors' who most often invade goanet or otherwise with pseudo names, 'as Jason says' to provoke the more conscious and secular minded goanetters, who may be tired out arguing about the inquisition and would want to talk about more worthwhile things like how to bring in an altogether 'GOOD GOVERNANCE' oriented government in Goa and to banish from the face of Goa, the present 'self-seeking' congress government lead by Digamber Kamat as also the 'communally malignant' government of the recent past . I thank you for your patience. Best floriano goasuraj - Original Message - From: Sapna Shahani sapnashah...@gmail.com To: Jason Keith Fernandes jason.k.fernan...@gmail.com Cc: goanet@lists.goanet.org Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2009 10:20 AM Subject: Re: [Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders ofPortuguese origin Jason, It wasn't my intention at all to provoke. By the way, I was raised Catholic (I am Anglo-Indian). What gives me the impression that Inquisition information is not known to visitors from outside Goa are my interactions with people I have met over 20 years of living in Goa on and off. Please don't confuse me with right-wing Hindus whom I've been given to... for you to know any other blind spots that I may have. Best, Sapna. On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 9:31 AM, Jason Keith Fernandes jason.k.fernan...@gmail.com wrote: Dear Sapna, From the sounds of your email it sounds like you are provoking us.
[Goanet] Extortionate fees
Schools in Goa are governed by the School Education Act and Rules. The Act and Rules explicitly state that schools shall not charge fees beyond those which are prescribed in the Rules. In spite of this there are schools in North Goa which are charging extortionate fees which are beyond the scope of the School Education Act and Rules. Understandably, schools do charge a small amount at the beginning of the academic year to cover the cost of the calendar, journal, term fees, exam paper fees and the like, but these can amount to Rs. two or three hundred at the most. Anything more than that is uncalled for. In the month of June, parents are saddled with expenses like uniforms, school bags, raincoat, stationery, etc. To add to their burden by charging illegal fees is unwarranted. Many school managements force gullible parents to pay dubious and illegal fees such as for the following: text books and work books which are not prescribed, all manner of deposits, building maintenance fund (aren't the managements raking in money as rent from the Government?), uniforms to be stitched by the school tailor/ contractor, etc. The Education Department needs to investigate the matter thoroughly. I may add here that this practice is not so much prevalent in the village schools as in the city schools. -- tony Tony de Sa Ph: +91 832 2470 148 M: +91 9975162897 E: tonyd...@gmail.com The future will be better tomorrow. - Dan Quayle
Re: [Goanet] Torches in the Fields at Night
--- On Fri, 6/12/09, Alfred de Tavares alfredtava...@hotmail.com wrote: Santosh...Selma...pls help me remember the lines... Was it not my namesake, Tenysson, somewhere in the 'Idylls of the King' Dear Chacha, Unfortunately, I haven't read Idylls of the King. But if I had done so, I would not have remembered that line. Cheers, Santosh
Re: [Goanet] Is Indian Humility Virtuous or Despicable?
Thanks Gabriel for a very informative post. I have long felt that the Indian External Affairs should have years ago implemented the following initiative: Every Indian going abroad for study or work or some other temporary assignment, should be asked to attend a series of orientation sessions in the Consular Offices of the country they are going to. In those sessions, they should be familiarized with the customs and traditions of that country, how to be sensitive to them and how to definitely avoid those habits that in India may be acceptable but would be a definite no-no locally. In addition they should be made to take a test on the common local laws and legalities and how to respond to certain situations that may occur. Such an initiative is not unusual. For example in the Gulf countries, the British missions tell their nationals how to conduct themselves, what kind of minimum salary to demand, position to accept and how to contact their consular office in case of impending police arrest so that they could be issued an emergency passport and sent back to the UK before the police have a chance to arrest them for offences other than murder, drugs or similarly serious infringements. In fact the missions usually establish a rapport with the local police chief or an equally important person who will inform them when the police intend to arrest the British national. Of course Gabriel, you will want that Goans will be exempt from such an orientation requirement since we do not need to be told how to conduct ourselves and I would totally agree :-)) Roland. On Fri, Jun 12, 2009 at 10:44 AM, Gabriel de Figueiredogdefigueir...@yahoo.com.au wrote: Most if not all attacks have been opportunistic. As I said before, the law-and-order situation has gone down hill in the last 10 years or so, ever since Labour came into power in the state, and the civil libertarians have had the upper hand against police actions. The last Police Commissioner appointee had a softly, softly approach to criminal damage (personal attacks, graffiti et al), which IMHO has is the root cause of these issues. The current Police Commissioner is no better, and calls from the public for a tougher approach seem to fall on deaf ears.
[Goanet] Comments about Bom Jesus
The Rough Guide has inputs from the bharat right wing. And here we have a saffronite opening the score on Goanet. A polite conniving twister. BC was just struck when I learned that the Inquisition in Goa was possibly one of the worst in the world (according to the Rough Guide). This was years after I had started visiting Goa and after numerous visits to Old Goa. So it made me wonder why I never heard about that before, and I simply wanted to hear perspectives on this subject from this list.
Re: [Goanet] Migrant labourers and outsiders.
Ignatius, you seem to hone in on one of the problem: the mother tongue! That said, there are those of us, Goichis who despise our own, and think the lovely Concani is the 'servants language': one makes the rounds of the cocktail circuit which has a liberal splattering of the greasy upcountry desi splashing their ill gotten gains on the Jonie Wal*erit pays (for a Goichi) to low ball the fellow Goans no? I guess its twisted empowerment, to say I am the best of the Goans when you run down the rest? On the advertising cocktail circuit, the great Sylvester Da Chunha always managed a few lines of Concani when he met another Goan! To all those in Mumbai or Lundon who look down on their own (there are many many) and think our very lovely and colorful Concani is 'low culture' (there is no such thing btw), they have a problem. One character is defined by how comfortable one is with ones background, ones roots, ones mother tongue. Ofcourse, when some of these folks hit rock bottom, they return to the lovely Goa and the only way they think they stand out, again is by not talking the language. I say how shameful. Have you ever run into those hoity-toity, nice smelling, convent-educated Bengaali baais speaking their 'what-ever-their-language' with an accent? Aye deus...I think my blood pressure is climbing, gotta run! I say speak Concani with pride, its what gives us that colorful and hot brand 'Goan' for crying out loud! And hey, even the Mallya (you know the plump fellow who makes beer and lives in the convent-like casa in Candolim?)...proudly speaks Manglori Konkani, his mother tongue On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 7:52 AM, ignatius fernandesiggy.fernan...@hotmail.co.uk wrote: This in response to Ana Maria de Souza-Goswami. I know you have not been raised in Goa but you have lived in Goa for a number of years, why have not attempted to learn our Mai bhas. Perhaps they see you as a ghantti with your fluent Hindi. In my life I had to learn Swahili, English, Konkani Hindi and a little Portuguese. So I say learn Konkani and come back to the fold of Konkani speaking people. Regards Ignatius Fernandes.,
[Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin
Dear Sapna, I missed being one of the early ones out of the gate on this one. Fasting for 10 days and am a bit weak. But you have received some worthy responses to a large degree--in that all have chosen to see you as quite a genuine person. . Take this opportunity to state the gory history of Goa. You appear to know something, so just go ahead and say it. Then maintain a dialog or dialogs. You have a right to live in Goa so get a grip and decide what you want to know further to facilitate wholeness. Is it a good life, is it entry into politics, to become an entrepreneur. All possible. Who are these outsiders, and how would it help them? Conquerors do things to those conquered within the purview of their beliefs. This does not mean it is correct. That is power being used brutally to subjugate. What matters is that the insiders as well the Hindus know the reasons that comprised the gory pasts and have graciously chosen to live differently from their religious as well as cultural kin in other places in India. But it cannot be condoned and we have not, and yet a lot of water have gone under the bridge. Life is full of hurts and rancour and trust me no matter what anyone may say, the majority of Christians are not living in the lap of luxury. We are getting eroded little by little in a myriad of ways. Hey people can't even allow us to be left as artifacts. Is that not hilarious? If you are talking about unaware foreigners--that is different, but who can help them (avidhya). Is it our duty to tell them about our past? Must we also tell them about the current political and other despicable scenarios in Goan politics? Let me give you an example, and then you can make your own analogies. My mother brought us up on the mandate, Sot tem sot. That translates as, Truth is truth (or at least it did decades ago); No matter what truth must be upheld; Uphold Truth under any circumstances. The impact was we grew up questioning ever untoward incident, and on top of that seeing irregularities in benign actions. The point is it is not yet clear is that when one seeks truth one must consider (and others do so) what is one going after, Basically we paid a price for it. An example: My brother refused to squeal on the Hindu kids (incidentally not Goan) who caused some mischief in the class, resulting in him kept out side by the Headmistress. He was given the option to name names and then come back in. He refused, in this case believing that it was not up to him to reveal the truth and spare his skin and his future. The future being that it got messed up, weakened his foundation and failed his SSC. But believing the he had acted truthfully, he proudly (or perhaps with an edge) walked into her office the next year when he passed. That's another strand of truth. This way of being is only now beginning to dissipate. Perhaps mother meant, Right is right, and on account of our weak Konknni at that point we got totally baked. But still I am happy for that. I saw this since the Goan past fits into the life of all Goans in an enviromental (lived) and ecumenical sense. Besides this, out there, are also very aware foreigners. They know how to engage, interact, live and play with people. Do you feel they will be moved if they hear the brutal and temperamental histories in such as way that shifts their interest in a place. In they know the original precise reasons would that not be embarrassing. Unless the narrator lives the axiom, Sot tem sot. Not likely. The visitors come for experiences, to satiate their interests, strengths and weaknesses, seeking different climes and worlds to indulge in laissez-faire meanderings, to eat and drink relatively cheaply, to visit our museums, to enjoy architecture--Hindu, Muslim, Christian, the Buddhist caves, the Vetals and other older forms of animism, pick up ideas and ways of life that we believe in or have discarded--but which they may be used someplace else, to pick up seeds, to bed women and men and children, to claim newer fetishes, the list goes on. I have an ongoing series of works based on my reflections, :We do not come by our thoughts; they come to us. Where do they comes from, why do they come, how do they generate within the core of our being. I hope you get further worthy responses whether or not it is for scholarship. But what counts is when one first states distinctly so others may follow the trend of ones thought, in that, how is it that that particular curiosity: arose in the first place. I am not interested in debating anyone on this, but Sapna, do feel free to communicate directly with me if need be. Partly becuase it is also true that Hindus (even cultural ones, as in cultural Christians) rarely respond to such queries. And lastly does anyone believe that many of us even care what the survey says about Bom Jesu or any other edifice? Perhaps those playing their trades where they benefit from such statuses bestowed as a unique selling point. Why? Because, its better to light a
[Goanet] GOACAN calls on students in Goa to be cautious while pursuing further studies.
- Do GOACAN a favour, circulate this email to your family members, relatives, neighbours and friends. Help others be better informed CONSUMERS - - GOACAN calls on students to be cautious while pursuing further studies -- GOACAN calls upon all SSC, HSSC TY College students who are planning to pursue further studies through various educational institutions in Goa and other States of the country to be cautious when applying for the various courses and making payments for the same. In view of the various complaints received, GOACAN alerts all students and their families to take the maximum precautions before taking a final decision on their further studies. It maybe noted that every year students get cheated in various ways such as being provided incomplete admission forms, paying for courses not duly Recognised or Accredited, Courses not having facilities as promised at the time of admission and additional fees being collected without authorisation. Many advertisements on the print audio visual media and on websites offering various short term educational courses need to be carefully examined for false assurances made to enhance the credibility of the course and to entice the student applicant. GOACAN particularly appeals to students to cross check course fee discounts, special offers and other promotional schemes before making part or full payments and to verify whether the receipts issued are by the authorised persons of the Institution. GOACAN requests students and parents to check the validity or status of Degrees or Institutions, Accreditation status of University or Colleges by logging on to the following sites: Ministry of Human Resource Development (www.education.nic.in) University Grants Commission ( www.ugc.ac.in ) All India Council of Technical Education ( www.aicte.ernet.in ) Association of Indian Universities ( www.aiuweb.org ) National Assessment and Accreditation Council (NAAC) ( www.naacindia.org ) Medical Council of India ( www.mciindia.org ) Distance Education Council ( www.dec.ac.in ) Students are advised to file their complaints with the Department of Education, Department of Higher Education, Directorate of Technical Education, Goa Board of Secondary and Higher Secondary Education and Goa University as the case maybe and send copies of the same by post to the GOACAN Complaints Cell, Post Box 187 Margao 403 601 or by email to goa...@bsnl.in - -- GOA CIVIC AND CONSUMER ACTION NETWORK -- promoting civic and consumer rights in Goa -- GOACAN Post Box 187 Margao, Goa 403 601 GOACAN Post Box 78 Mapusa, Goa 403 507 mailto: goa...@bsnl.in --
[Goanet] Mega Project Realities
Mega-projects overwhelming favouring Non-Goans still grow un-opposed in Goa. Deceitful critics politicians show ignorance on the mega-project “definition” for obvious/selfish reasons; it may be not clearly defined but common sense should show that we don’t need to create residences for outsiders; to the Goan detriment. Mega residential projects for commercial purposes should be concretely defined, in consultation by Goans, to the scope of accommodating majority Goans only. It is not hatred to outsiders but just to preserve our scarce land for future generations besides maintain the Goan demographic majority/identity; which is not the case for the other bigger states or other countries. We must understand that Mega projects “affect Goans of all Castes, Creed Religions”: (1) Destruction of Beautiful landscapes rampant hill cutting. (2) Reduction in Tourists who find Goa’s natural beauty identity gradually being destroyed. (3) Pressure on fragile infrastructure, health/educational facilities, water electricity. (4) Increased Traffic Jams/Congestion Air pollution. (5) Increased wastes particularly toxic, leading to cancers other serious diseases. (6) Water contamination with understandable serious consequences E.g. Calangute today!! (7) Increased temperatures Carbon Dioxide emissions seriously affecting Goa’s Climate contributing to Global Warming (8) Create un-necessary employment influx of migrant workers. (9) Goans to minority, both from migrant workers brought in for constructions and the large percentage of Non-Goans purchasing the apartments. (10) Severely affecting livelihoods/housing of poor Goans to favour rich outsiders local politicians. (12) Agriculture which should be addressed for Goa’s sustenance self-reliance, is sadly being replaced by mega-projects... where’s the priority? (12) Increased pressure on police security services to protect a rapidly growing population. (13) Financing our corrupt politicians to keep them in power for destroying Goa. Un-necessary Constructions like the mega-projects clearly have serious negative implications have to be constrained. Needless to say, current ones illegally passed, should be razed to the ground!! Arwin Mesquita, UAE. -- Please post your comments on my Blog: http://goanidentity.blogspot.com/ Please also see below: 1. Benaulim Village Action Committee: http://www.bvacbenaulim.blogspot.com/ 2. Rape of Goa : http://www.parrikar.com/blog/therapeofgoa/therapeofgoa.html 3. Rape of Chicalim : http://rapeofchicalim.wordpress.com/ 4. Boycott Cidade de Goa : http://boycotthotelcidadedegoa.blogspot.com/ 5. MAND - an adivasi-rights resource centre : http://mandgoa.blogspot.com/
[Goanet] Shiroda - where could it be ?
Selma ( June 11 ) asks : '' Could anyone tell me if the Seroda that Richard Burton refers to in his book Goa and Blue Mountains is the same Shiroda in the outskirts of Ponda ''' It could indeed be Shiroda that is about 10 kms south of Ponda town on the right bank of the Zuari river opposite to Curtorim village of Salcete taluka which is on the left bank of the same river. From mid-sixteen to mid-eighteen centuries when Portuguese Goa consisted of only three talukas i.e. Salcete, Ilhas and Bardez, Zuari river formed the eastern boundary of southern Goa. According to oral traditions Shiroda was and still is a temple town famous for the temple dedicated to Goddess Kamakshi. In the temple area there were many matriarchal families who rendered yeoman service to Portuguese unattached young soldiers who were posted in the riverine or border villages from Guirdolim in the south to Chicalim in the north of Salcete peninsula. These matriarchal families whose daughters were very much sought \ after by the Portuguese soldiers crossed Zuari river ( aum saiba poltodi vetam ) and settled down inthe Portuguese controlled areas. Economically these daughters were precious assets and thus we could say the mestisso community was born in Goa.. But they also took pride in their sons. A typical matriarch, I believe, proudly boasted that her sons were sired by a porbhu, komoti, jyotyr etc.
[Goanet] Torches in the Fields at Night
Ignorance is bliss? What a crappy mentality in the twenty-first century !!! I say, knowledge is power. Be happy in the knowledge that sometimes extinction of a species is good (see my response in my previous email on this - which is reproduced below). Are frogs really going to vanish, if a few thousand a year are consumed by humans in Goa? Get real, millions are being born every new season. Jim F New York. -- Original message -- From: Blasio Fernandes blasio.fernan...@emirates.com Ignorance is bliss Blasio ... ... ... Date: Tue, 09 Jun 2009 11:42:44 + From: Jim Fernandes amigo...@att.net Subject: Re: [Goanet] Torches in the Fields at Night ... ... ... In Earth's past history, millions of animals came and went extinct. But the animal world still survived even though it must have disrupted their food chain. For example, the Dinosaurs came and went. That gave a perfect opportunity for mammals to take charge - and then to eventually give rise to mankind. If Dinoaaurs were to still survive, you and I wouldn't be here discussing about the frogs. Jim F. New York.
[Goanet] Talking photos: Over 250 years Old St. Anthony's Chapel at Goa-Velha
Over 250 years OldSt. Anthony Chapel at Goa-Velha There is life size statue of St. Anthony on the main altar (see pics) Many devotees came here year after year to attend 13 novena starting from June 1. On the feast day i.e. 13th June, it was like any other church feast with fair etc But this year, it was different. The Goa-velha church conducted parallel novenas/feast at the church advising devotee not to attend the chapel? (locals say it was due to the non-corporation of the so called proprietor) The proprietor of the chapel? (whose house is next to the chapel, see pic) claims the family has been looking after the chapel for 82 years. many years ago, we even heard that a priest before dying handed over the chapel to this man or family many years ago. However, despite church parallel services (with news items in Goan dailies) some local people continue attending the services at the chapel. They claim there were regular novena services and mass on the feast day. When we arrived there just after 4pm, preparation was going on for the 4.30 mass. the pics (taken today 13.6.09 after 4pm) St. Anthony http://www.flickr.com/photos/joegoaukchurches/3622116449/sizes/l/ Main altar http://www.flickr.com/photos/joegoaukchurches/3622936566/sizes/l/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/joegoaukchurches/3622117879/sizes/l/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/joegoaukchurches/3622116919/ The chapel and the proprietor’s house http://www.flickr.com/photos/joegoaukchurches/3622121253/sizes/l/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/joegoaukchurches/3622120097/sizes/l/ it says something about the proprietor here Marble stone name plate below the main altar http://www.flickr.com/photos/joegoaukchurches/3622937486/sizes/l/ This one taken from NT today. In 1752, a Portuguese nobleman Dom Joao Antonio de Melo, who had lost his eyesight, was being taken by a machila (palanquin) from Agassaim to Ribandar. When his bearers needing rest at Goa Velha below the Pilar hillock, they made a stop beneath the mango tree and told the nobleman that a statue of St Anthony was placed in a niche carved at the wayside log of a coconut tree at Goa Velha. Immediately, the nobleman prayed to St Anthony, �You are known as the Saint of miracles, you are here in the open, in the sun or rain; if you restore my eyesight, I will build a beautiful chapel to keep your statue in.� On return journey, Dom Joao again was lowered in the same place and there the miracle is reported to have taken place. And Dom Joao could see the statue of the Saint. When the nobleman was back home, without help he climbed the steps to the palace. As his wife could not believe, he came out in the veranda and counted the vessels he could see in the bay. Faithful to the vow, he brought the copies of best altars from Portugal, built the Chapel, placed the life-size statue of St Anthony, which still exists in the Chapel Read more http://www.navhindtimes.com/story.php?story=200906121 joego...@yahoo.co.uk for Goa NRI related info... http://in.groups.yahoo.com/group/GOAN-NRI/ For Goan Video Clips http://youtube.com/joeukgoa In Goa, Dial 1 0 8 For Hospital, Police, Fire etc
[Goanet] Brendan Fernandes- Toronto Artist links
Here are some links to a Toronto cntemperory artist Brendan Fernandes (born in Kenya): Pictures from his recent exhibit in Toront, http://www.diazcontemporary.ca/Artists_Fernandes.html His Bio, web site, http://www.brendanfernandes.ca/artiststatement.php http://www.brendanfernandes.ca/ The exhibition was a few weeks ago I guess.
[Goanet] Aitaracheo Katkutleo: Avoy Taptta Tednam
Avoy Taptta Tednam “Bapu” “Sang Xanu” “Arithmetik tticherin mhaka gonit galem.” “Koslem?” “Tinnem vicharlem: Don Aii, anik don Aii, anik don Aii. Kitleo zaleo? Hanvem sanglem, sat. Tinnem mhonnlem sarkem na. Uprant tinnem dusre toren vicharlem. Don chokleti, anik don chokleti, anik don chokleti. Ani hanvem 6 zatat mhunn zap dili. Tinnem mhonnlem sarkem asa. Hech toren tinnem porot ekdam don Aii ditam, anik don Aii, anik don Aii. Atam sang kitleo Aii zaleo? Mhagele Aii-k hixeobar dovorlear 7 zatat, hanvem zap dili” “Are pixea, ghora koddle Aii-chi khobor tticherik kiteak zai axil’li? Tticher dita ti Aii ghevn yevncho nhi?” “Ani mhagele Aii-k kitem korchem asle? Boro asa tum! Kombo.” “Bapu” “Sang Xanu.” “General Knowledge tticherin ek gozal sangli. Eka khunik (kirmidorak) mornnachi faxi favlli. Taka tin kudd vo rooms dakhoile. Poilea kuddint torsadi (sword) ghevn tachi gomtti kapunk monis axil’le. Dusre kuddint ujeachi baim asa. Taka baint duklun udovpak monis ravtale. Ani tisre kuddint 6 mhoinnem bhuken tollmolltole xinv axil’le. Khuni khuinchea kuddint vochun aplo jiv vatovtolo? Ho tticherigelo prons.” “Tugele ttichericho bezo kollmela. Poilea kuddint torsadin kapunk monis ravtat, dusrea kuddint uzo asa ani tisrea kuddint bhukil’le xinv ekach ghansan taka nach kortole. Sang pora, to kirmidor koxo apnnalo jiv vatoitolo?” “Budd’du tumi, sarke budd’du. Ho prons hanvem sodoilo.” “Koso?” “Are Bapu. Poir tumi, mhagele Aii thaim zhogoddtale nhi?” “Goddie karan axi’lem zait.” “Mhagele Aii-k tumi mhonntale. Puro, puro Jayanti. Tugele ‘Karwa Chauth’ upas chodduch zale. Don sumana zalim hanv upaxim. Anik ‘purima’ upas korta mhollear hanv upaxim mortolom.” “Pora, to vichar ghov-baile modim ubzovta.” “Ani hench lokxan ghevn hanvem tticherik sanglem. Magelea bapu lagim don sumana upaxim ravunk zaina zalear 6 mhoinnem bhukelole xinv koxe jive urtole? Kirmidor melolea xinvanche kuddan apnnacho jiv vatovpak rigtolo.” “Bhouch huxear mure tum?” “Konacho por tor hanv?” “Bapu” “Sang Xanu” “Mhaka prem’ zala.” “Vorsam kitlim tuka?” “Ghelea vorsa birthday cake-ir nnov mennvatio (candels) pettovloleo. Anik 2 sumanan mhozo zolm dis yeta.” “Konnacho mog zala?” “Science tticherigele choliecho. Mhojech vorgan xikta ti” “Punn ek sang. Tuvem tticheriche choliek koxi faraili?” “Poir khelltana ti sango, hanv tika avoddtam.” “Zalear, tuvem kitem zap dili?” “Hanvem tika divnk na. Fuddarak zat’le sasuk zap dili.” “Kosli zap?” “Science vorg choltana, tticherin vicharlem. Bhurgim koxim zolman yetat? Ani hanvem soroll zap dili. Rupan (tticherigele choliechem nanv) ani hanvem mog korunk zai.” “Sarko mosto por mure tum?” “Ti ragovli dista mhaka. Tuka ani Aii-k falleam iskolant apoileant” “Kiteak?” “Ghoddie lognachem tharavpak.” Bapui-putacheo gozaleo (conversation) chalu astana bazarant gel’li Jayanti bhitor sorta. Sodam porim por, Aii fuddem veta ani bazarantli pixi (bag) sonspunk kori tedna Aii aroddta. “Hat lanvchona.” Por sarkoch ghonddollta. Roddunk lagta. Poilech khepek ragacho dhengxo Aii koddlean khata. Bapaik vaitt dista. “Oxe toren porak boball korcho nhi” “Tuvenuch piddear kela taka. Tageli science tticher bhazarant gavleli.” “Falleam amkam iskolant apoileant. Oxem nhi.” “Tuka koxem koll’llem?” “Amgelea poran sanglam.” “Loz zali mhaka. Porak kosli xist (discipline) xikoilea kai mhunn tticher vichari.” “Bapu.” “Sang Xanu.” “Aii taptta mure! Tticher ditali tich Aii haddpak zai axil’li nhi?” Lino B. Dourado
[Goanet] Save the Frog Campaign in Goa 2009
I support the campaign for the many reasons mentioned below in the FAQ put out by the WildGoa group. Do not kill or consume frogs, it is against the law in Goa. George __ Frogs in Goa: Frequently Asked Questions Are frog populations in Goa really on the decline? Yes they are. Bio-indicators as well as studies conducted by herpetologists and amphibian specialists in Goa confirm that frog populations are falling, just as it is in the rest of the world. Globally, frogs are disappearing at an increasingly rapid rate than creatures have ever done in the past 65 million years. While studies in 1999 and 2002 were conducted by amphibian specialists in coordination with International agencies like the International Union for the Conservation of Nature and Natural Resources (IUCN), basic surveys and compiling of checklists have also been done by researchers at the Goa University’s Department of Zoology, the Goa Forest Department and others. There is however, a need for long term monitoring of Goan frog populations as frogs found in Goa. What are the reasons for this decline? A number of threats to frogs exist, however, in Goa the chief threats are: 1. Catching, killing and consumption of frogs at the onset of the monsoons. Frogs end their aestivation after the first rains and come out to breed. This is when they are at their most vocal, and hence easy to track down and catch. And as most of the frog-hunting is done before the frog can breed, this has a drastic effect on the future populations of frogs. 2. The widespread use of fertilizers and pesticides in agriculture. Flooded paddy fields are a hotspot for frogs, and since frogs absorb water through their skin, they are particularly vulnerable to the toxic effects of residual chemicals in our fields. 3. Habitat destruction - filling of fields, clearing of forest cover are a few of the main reasons. Encroachment of forests by human activities such as mining, construction, etc have caused entire resident populations to disappear within a short period. 4. A significant global trend that is threatening frog populations as a whole worldwide include climate change, global warming, introduction of invasive species and spread of disease from farmed to wild frog populations. Are some species more vulnerable than others? Yes. In Goa, the Indian Bullfrog (Hoplobatrachus Tigerinus) the Jerdon’s Bullfrog (Hoplobatrachus Crassus) are the ones most prized for their meat due to their large size. The Indian Pond Frog and Grass Frog are also occasionally hunted. Burgeoning demand at restaurants illegally serving frog dishes have ensured that a pair of frog legs can fetch as much as Rs. 65-70 for the poacher. Due to their falling populations, the Indian Bullfrog and the Jerdon’s Bullfrog are now on the Government of India’s Schedule-I list of threatened species as well the international IUCN Red List of animals that are facing a high risk of global extinction. Ok, but why do I have to stop eating frog? What’s in it for me? A lot more than you think… Eating frog meat is very dangerous to human health. Due to the massive toxic pesticide residues that accumulate in the fat deposits of frog meat, consumption of frogs can trigger paralytic strokes, cancer, kidney failures and other deformities. Besides frog meat being contraband, frogs are usually killed in unsanitary conditions. Frogs are like the pulse rate or the blood pressure of the Goan environment. Frogs are a crucial part of the ecosystem and a vital link as predator and prey in the food chain. If frogs go extinct, the ripple effect on the ecosystem will be felt by us all. Frogs and tadpoles are voracious eaters, and consume millions of mosquitoes and mosquito larvae every year. One of the suspected reasons for the increase in cases of malaria and other vector borne diseases in Goa is the decline in the number of frogs. The increasing incidents of snakes being found in urban semi-urban areas is also being linked to the decline of frogs, their natural prey, and their subsequent shifting to alternate prey like rats that are more readily found in populated areas. In Goan mythology frogs are believed to bring prosperity and good rainfall. Are frogs protected by law? Yes. The Government of India in 1985 declared a ban on catching and killing of wild frogs under the Wildlife (Protection) Act 1972. This means that any person or restaurant found catching, killing, selling, serving or eating frog meat violates the provisions of the act. This would attract stringent punishment with a fine of Rs 25,000 and/or imprisonment upto 3 years. In 2008, 10 persons were detained and fined under this act. So what can I do to help save the frog? Firstly, stop eating frogs yourself and discourage others from doing so. If there is no demand for frog legs, frog-catchers simply won’t catch them. Secondly, if you come across people hunting frogs
[Goanet] Goa news clips: 1135_Lithographs at Sant Ann Talaulim
Any idea anyone how it was restored, who the restorer was, was it done in India or abroad, how old are the lithographs? venantius j pinto From Goa news clips: 1135 Art Object At Talaulim Church Get Kiss Of Life: French-made Lithographs of antique value and a rare wooden panel painting depicting Christ's Crusifixion are among the art objects that have got a fresh lease of life as part of the 4.80 crore project to restore the 432 years old St Anne Church At Talaulim. [TOI]
[Goanet] G’bye Goa, Indo-Aryans-2: HERALD (Goa), June 14, 2009
G’BYE GOA: INDO-ARYANS-2 By Valmiki Faleiro Indo-Aryans entered India as invaders. The first major sign of human civilization they encountered was the Dravidian settlement, part of what is now known as Indus Valley Civilization: the walled Harappan city of Mohenjo-daro (excavated in 1922, by the banks of the Indus River, in Sind, now in Pakistan.) They attacked, looted and destroyed it. Similar was the fate of Harappa (excavated in 1921, in the Punjab, also in Pakistan.) Such was the fate of the ancient Dravidian civilization that it was extinct by 1700 BC. (Sites to the south, where the Indo-Aryans did not reach, however, continued upto about 1000 BC.) The Indo-Aryans chased the native Dravid, Mundari and Proto-Australoid tribes southwards, and settled themselves in ‘Saptasindhu’ – a region extending from the Kabul River in the northwest to the doab of the Saraswati and Upper Ganga-Yamuna in the southeast. Over time, as their numbers increased, they felt the need to expand into ‘Madhyadesh’ towards the Gangetic valley, but had to contend with the Dravidians. By then, they had mastered the skill of making iron. The earliest occurrence of iron in India is circa 1500 BC. Smelting iron, or ‘krsna ayas’ (dark metal), helped them make tools to stabilize agriculture … and weapons to subdue the Dravidians and expand settlements. They contacted the Turvasas and Yadus who had been settled by Indra in Surastra. And informed them of Indra’s death, his deification, their onward march under Divodassa, and arrival by the banks of the Sindhu. The Turvasas and Yadus built a temple to Indra on the shores Surastra and called it ‘Somnath.’ Because, as they remembered in gratitude, Indra loved the sacrificial drink ‘Soma’ which gave him strength to go to battle. A part of the Indo-Aryan community was settled in the doab between Hinduism’s most sacred river, Saraswati, and the Drishadvati. A 12-year famine helped teach Saraswats to survive eating fish – the only Brahmin denomination in India that eats fish. When the Indo-Aryans arrived in India, they had brought with them the horse and the chariot, the Sanskrit language, and the seeds of latter day Brahmanism or Vedism. Between about 2000 and 1500 BC, as Indo-Aryans spread into east and central India, there was growing interaction between them and the natives. A synthesis emerged by 1000 BC, as seen from expression of Aryan ethnicity in the Rigveda (“Wisdom of the Verses”), written into 10 books over several centuries but completed circa 1000 BC. Modern Hinduism began to get crystallized from the end of the Rigvedic period. The Rigveda was later supplemented by the three other Vedas and, still later, by the Brahmanas and the Upanishads. If Indo-Aryans used iron weapons to subdue the Dravidians in an earlier age, they now changed strategy. The new one was aimed to placate and avoid frequent confrontations, with the use of diplomacy. Even if they privately regarded Dravidians as people beyond the ‘Aryavarta’ and termed them ‘mlecchas’ – impure barbarians, unfamiliar with the speech and customs of the Aryas – they shrewdly adopted the Dravidian dark-skinned god Shiva, and made him part of their ‘Trimurti’ (Brahma-Vishnu-Shiva, from the earlier Brahma-Vishnu-Mahesh.) This can be inferred to have happened during the early Vedic period (2nd millennium to 7th century BC) because in the Vedas, Shiva is referred to as Rudra (the old tribal god ‘Rouduro,’ now Rudreshwar), who becomes Shiva only in the Upanishads, centuries later. A major earthquake in North India towards the end of the second millennium BC destroyed the Saraswati riverbed. The upheaval caused a substantial migration of Indo- Aryans from North India to Gujarat, where Mulraja, the ruler of Kathiawad, gave them shelter in an area that came to be referred to as ‘Saraswat Mandal.’ Several centuries later, a warrior-pastoral Bhargava clan from the Saraswat Mandal, moved to South Gujarat and settled in Surat and Navsari. It is a group of these Bhargavas from Surat/Navsari that ventured southwards by sea and became the first Indo-Aryans to settle in Goa. (To continue.) (ENDS.) The Valmiki Faleiro weekly column at: http://www.goanet.org/index.php?name=Newsfile=articlesid=330 == The above article appeared in the June 14, 2009 edition of the Herald, Goa
[Goanet] Falklands to participate in World Busk to Support Goa Charity
Friends of GOA ! Even the Falklanders are to paticipate in WORLD BUSK to support Goa Charity = = = = 12 Jun: Falkland Island News. Students from the Falklands are going to participate in a World Busk on Sunday, 14 June 2009… The money raised will help set up new projects - Musequality is actively fundraising for a string instrument project in Goa… For full text, 1429 words,the link at: http://www.goanvoice.org.uk/ The London Goans picnic to support the busk takes place at Ruislip Lido on Sunday, 14 June. For details check out the last item in the Photo Gallery on this page.more details.: http://www.goanvoice.org.uk/ = = = = === Just Giving : http://www.justgiving.com/goansformusequality GOAN_MUSEQUALITY : http://goanmusequality.blogspot.com/ Lets work TOGETHER to put UNITY back into our Goan commUNITY ! Don't just say it - let s JUST DO IT ? rene = = = = =
[Goanet] Snake Awareness Programme At Lourdes Convent Primary School.
Dear nettekars, Griselda Nobay, Tarika Suhail Kiran, all members of Green Cross's Saligao unit, conducted a snake awareness programme on 13 June 2009, at the Lourdes Convent Primary School, Saligao. Around 380 students and staff attended the session. Using Dean Alice D'Cruz's LCD slide projector and screen, Griselda, Tarika Suhail taught the I-IV graders to identify the 4 venomous - also called the Big4 - and various non-venomous snakes of the 55 species in Goa. While Green Crossers Alfred D'mello from Nagoa and Mario Mascarenhas from Saligao provided backup, Ashley Delaney volunteered with his laptop, like he usually does for all such programmes. Ashley also printed the 'Snakesheet' that was later photocopied and given to each student. It contained information on how to handle snakebite and where to get immediate medical attention in case of an encounter with the the Big4. Since this was a session for Saligao, only the following snake rescuers and their phone numbers were provided in the handout: Griselda Nobay, Donvaddo, Saligao - 9923802842 / 2278567 Tarika Suhail, Donvaddo, Saligao - 240 / 2278276 Alfred D'Mello, Nagoa - 9823053474 / 2278903 Suneel Korajjkar, Mapusa - 9822123042 / 2253715 As part of their committent to the village and its environment, Saligao Green Crossers provide their assistance free of cost within the village. While they do not even charge for fuel, volunteers riding or driving in from outside Saligao, may request for a small amount to cover fuel costs. The actual service of rescuing the snake, together with the time and effort involved, is totally free. The sankes presented live were (English + Konkani names): - Buff Striped Keelback - Naneti or Rakt Mandoli - Rat Snake - Divod - Cobra - Nag - Indian Rock Python - Har There also was the venomous and dangerous Russels Viper (Ganas or Agior Cusdo), caught the previous night by Tarika, Alfred, Suhail and Griselda at Ashley Delaney's house (his father Gerard and their dog Duffy had a narrow escape!), but it could not be displayed for lack of time. Other snakes that could not be displayed were: - Bronze Back - Naneto - Chequered Keelback - Evalem - Sand Boa - Maloon - Wolf Snake - Kavade Sorop The Green Cross team were pleasantly surprised to see the openness and enthusiasm of the Principal, Sr. Esmeralda. Sessions like these are very important for our children and are part of their education for life. We always welcome anything like this, she said after the programme. Way to go, Lourdes Convent! In slithering solidarity! MM. -- . there *is* anOTHERgoa @ www.anothergoa.blogspot.com '' muriel mario, 4/4 tabravaddo, opp. st. anne's chapel, saligao. bardez. goa. 403511. tel: 0832-2278276 / 240 another...@gmail.com '''
Re: [Goanet] Comment about Bom Jesus Basilica among 7 wonders of Portuguese origin
2009/6/12 Sapna Shahani sapnashah...@gmail.com As a non-Goan who's lived here on and off for 20 years, I'm very curious about Goa's history with the Inquisition. How is it that the gory history of Goa's past remains virtually unknown by outsiders or tourists? The Basilica of Bom Jesus is a beautiful building but I find it odd that visitors don't know what cruelties once took place in the vicinity of the Basilica. Would love to hear the thoughts of people on this list... Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2009 18:28:49 -0400 From: J. Colaco jc cola...@gmail.com You apear to be a genuine person. So I say to you: If today is the day to wash clothes, and the washing machines are not being used, Let us wash ALL the dirty laundry - in public. Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 10:35:00 +0900 From: Joao Barros-Pereira joaobarrospere...@gmail.com A sign of a civilized and mature people, in my view, is to let bygones be bygones. We have a recorded history of the Inquisition but it does not mean it has to have a place of pride on tourism billboards. Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 02:37:21 + (GMT) From: Bernado Colaco ole_...@yahoo.co.uk First off all your stay in Goa is illegal. Second the In quistion issue has been trashed on this forum. In fact could you tell us about Hatti Mere SATI. Date: Sat, 13 Jun 2009 09:31:33 +0530 From: Jason Keith Fernandes jason.k.fernan...@gmail.com If at all, there is more (mis)information about the Inquisition than there is information, so perhaps we would do well to investigate that. But I am curious, what exactly do you hope to achieve from broadcasting this information to the visitors to the site? Perhaps you know that the 'information' about the Inquisition, is very often used to place contemporary (and native) Catholics in an uncomfortable position. Is this the intent of your inquiry? If not, then perhaps the lack of awareness about contemporary politics is just another one of your blind spots. My apologies for the terseness of the message, the bite is not intended to offend, merely to make a point. Mario responds: Whoa! What the heck happened here? As the lone voice on Goanet of reason, truth and peace I am shocked at the responses so far to a simple question by a curious non-Goan Hindu lady about a historical FACT. It's like she poked a hornet's nest with a stick and a bunch of angry Goan Christians flew out to defend the faith and the Portuguese who perpetrated the Inquisition with considerable brutality in India. JC, along with sati, caste discrimination, female infanticide and bride burnings, the Inquisition is a FACT, so why try to obfuscate it by referring to those other gory facts of Indian history, and the ongoing female infacticide and bride burnings, without answering the question dispassionately? Joao, bygones are bygones by definition, but history requires an honest accounting of what happened so that we learn from the good and avoid repeating the bad. Bernardo, your comment that her stay in Goa was illegal is pure poppycock. Jason Keith, you were rude in addition to terse when you questioned Sapna's intentions and/or her blind spot both of which you have no way of knowing. The only point you made is that you are unnecessarily touchy and defensive about a FACT of Portuguese-Indian history that you had nothing to do with. Since I don't know Sapna, I prefer to give her the benefit of the doubt. So, let's get back to her question. Sapna asked, How is it that the gory history of Goa's past remains virtually unknown by outsiders or tourists? She says she finds it odd that visitors don't know the cruelties that once took place in the vicinity of Bom Gesu. Frankly, Sapna, you may have made an assumption that may not hold water. Since there are all kinds of outsiders and tourists who visit Old Goa, you have no way of knowing what all these outsiders and tourists know or not know. I know many Americans who are interested in history who are quite familiar with the entire dark period of Christian fascism, which included the Crusades and the Inquisition, when Christianity was essentially derailed by its own fanatics, paradoxically in the name of Christ. After all, YOU seem to know, and many of the visitors may know as well. However, if you are saying that there are no museums or exhibits of atrocities that took place during the Inquisition you are correct, there are none that I know of. Perhaps there should be. I would have no problem as long as it was factual, just as I have no problem with the possibility that my Hindu ancestors may have been forced to convert by Portuguese zealots, and I am perfectly happy with what the founder of my Christian faith taught, even though I find much to decry about some of the policies and practices of some of my fellow Christians. As with any dark event or period in a country's history that has since been stamped out hundreds of years ago, most countries try to focus on the good rather than
[Goanet] Understanding the Financial Crises
Understanding the Financial Crises - Derivative Markets Learning from other people's mistakes The following was forwarded to me. It is a great learning example of how shallow thinking can lead to big mistakes. Short-term gains are not long-term successes and profits. Regards, GL An Easily Understandable Explanation of Financial Crises - Derivative MarketsHeidi is the proprietor of a bar in Detroit. She realizes that virtually all of her customers are unemployed alcoholics and, as such, can no longer afford to patronize her bar. To solve this problem, she comes up with new marketing plan that allows her customers to drink now, but pay later. She keeps track of the drinks consumed on a ledger (thereby granting the customers loans). Word gets around about Heidi's drink now, pay later marketing strategy and, as a result, increasing numbers of customers flood into Heidi's bar. Soon she has the largest sales volume for any bar in Detroit. By providing her customers' freedom from immediate payment demands, Heidi gets no resistance when, at regular intervals, she substantially increases her prices for wine and beer, the most consumed beverages. Consequently, Heidi's gross sales volume increases massively. A young and dynamic vice-president at the local bank recognizes that these customer debts constitute valuable future assets and increases Heidi's borrowing limit. He sees no reason for any undue concern, since he has the debts of the unemployed alcoholics as collateral. At the bank's corporate headquarters, expert traders transform these customer loans into DRINKBONDS, ALKIBONDS and PUKEBONDS. These securities are then bundled and traded on international security markets. Naive investors don't really understand that the securities being sold to them as AAA secured bonds are really the debts of unemployed alcoholics. Nevertheless, the bond prices continuously climb, and the securities soon become the hottest-selling items for some of the nation's leading brokerage houses. One day, even though the bond prices are still climbing, a risk manager at the original local bank decides that the time has come to demand payment on the debts incurred by the drinkers at Heidi's bar. He so informs Heidi. Heidi then demands payment from her alcoholic patrons, but being unemployed alcoholics they cannot pay back their drinking debts. Since, Heidi cannot fulfill her loan obligations she is forced into bankruptcy. The bar closes and the eleven employees lose their jobs. Overnight, DRINKBONDS, ALKIBONDS and PUKEBONDS drop in price by 90%. The collapsed bond asset value destroys the banks liquidity and prevents it from issuing new loans, thus freezing credit and economic activity in the community. The suppliers of Heidi's bar had granted her generous payment extensions and had invested their firms' pension funds in the various BOND securities. They find they are now faced with having to write off her bad debt and with losing over 90% of the presumed value of the bonds. Her wine supplier also claims bankruptcy, closing the doors on a family business that had endured for three generations, her beer supplier is taken over by a competitor, who immediately closes the local plant and lays off 150 workers. Fortunately though, the bank, the brokerage houses and their respective executives are saved and bailed out by a multi-billion dollar no-strings attached cash infusion from the Government. The funds required for this bailout are obtained by new taxes levied on employed, middle-class, non-drinkers. Now, do you understand?
[Goanet] Conversion focus of inter-faith talks
Goanetters, Poor Kandhamal! http://www.dnaindia.com/mumbai/report_conversion-focus-of-inter-faith-talks_ 1264434 rubygoes
[Goanet] Holistic Cardiac Rehabilitation Unit Inaugurated in Mumbai
Holistic Cardiac Rehabilitation Unit Inaugurated in Mumbai http://www.expresshealthcaremgmt.com/200906/market02.shtml The centre can accommodate up to 40 patients in various departments in a day A holistic cardiac rehabilitation unit with exclusive cardio-respiratory and other heart care treatment services was inaugurated in Mumbai. The cardiac rehabilitation unit— Apex Beat holistic heart care centre— would offer integrated services of allopathic, physiotherapy and ayurvedic specialties. It aims to rehabilitate every heart that seeks quick pre-operative or post-operative cardiac care. . . . About four years of intense planning has gone into Apex Beat CRU, explained Dr Rohit Sane, Director of Vaidya SaneAyurved Lab Private Limited. Over time, with advanced research on fundamental and clinical aspects of heart diseases and their treatments, we developed a new Ayurvedic technology incorporating various levels of customised and monitored exercise plan. The treatment worked hand in hand with panchakarma therapy, diet, meditation and counseling. Thus programmes are tailored to individual needs and health condition and it is arguably the first time that cardiac rehabilitation has been approached so holistically, said Dr Sane. Shrikant Vinayak Barve Convener: We Love Ayurved 9403175973 Explore and discover exciting holidays and getaways with Yahoo! India Travel http://in.travel.yahoo.com/
[Goanet] A historic inter-faith meeting
I am enclosing a report about a historic meeting in Mumbai. It is particularly heartening to see such senior religious leaders present from both sides. I hope this leads to something positive coming out. Best regards, Dr U. G. Barad Conversion focus of inter-faith talks http://www.dnaindia.com/mumbai/report_conversion-focus-of-inter-faith-talks_ 1264434 Linah Baliga / DNA Saturday, June 13, 2009 Mumbai: An inter-faith interaction between Hindu and Catholic religious leaders, held at Mumbai's Shanmukhananda Hall on Friday, appears to have focused a lot of time on the issue of conversions and the killings at Kandhamal in Orissa last year. While the Hindu side was represented, among others, by the Sankaracharya of Kanchi Kamakoti Peetham, Jayendra Saraswati, and Sri Sri Ravi Shankar, the Christian side was represented by Mumbai Archbishop Cardinal Oswald Gracias, and Cardinal Jean Louis P Tauran, the Pope's representative from the Vatican. According to sources, the Vatican representative wanted to know why Christians were facing violence when India was supposed to be a tolerant country. The Sankaracharya reportedly sought an assurance that conversion activities would be stopped, and referred to the assurances sought by Jewish rabbis last month from the Pope. The Vatican did not comment on the aspect of stopping conversions, but pointed out that there were many Protestant groups doing conversions, and the Catholic Church had no control over that. The Sankaracharya, who spoke softly in Hindi, said the meeting can be considered useful if the points agreed are faithfully followed. Unless the church reassures Hindus that it will not conduct itself in a manner that wounds Hindu sensibilities and follows up on those assurances, such inter-faith meetings, no matter how frequently held, will be futile and not serve any meaningful cause, he added.nbsp;nbsp; Although conversion is a personal choice, I want to endorse that there will be no forced conversions. It has no meaning, and is considered invalid. The Catholic Church is totally against forced conversions. The Vatican documents are clear about that, said Cardinal Gracias. At an impromptu news briefing after the dialogue, it was announced that the two religious groups would work together, where possible, in charity and social work. The Sankaracharya noted that very large amounts of money come into this country for churches and Christian groups, ostensibly for charity work. These funds should be used only for social causes like health and education. Similarly, Hindu temples and Hindus will share their resources, he said. The Sankaracharya said he wanted India to be a spiritual country. We should take moral lessons from each religion and educate our children. To which Cardinal Gracias responded: Our country is spiritual and we must continue to deepen the spirituality of our people. Moral lessons should be included in the school syllabus, to help make better human beings, said Cardinal Gracias. Among the other Hindu leaders who attended the dialogue were Swami Chidananda Saraswati of Uttaranchal, Swami Vishveshwarananda Giri Maharaj of Mumbai, Swami Nikhileshwarananda of Vadodara, the Prajapita of Brahmakumaris from Rajasthan, and Chaturvedi Swami of Chennai. The Catholic side was represented, apart from Cardinal Gracias and Cardinal Tauran, by Archbishop Quintana of the Vatican Nunciature in Delhi, Cardinal Topno of Ranchi, Archbishop Gali Bali of Guntur, Archbishop Felix Machado of Nashik, and Bishop Thomas Dabre of Pune. Cardinal Tauran had this to say: India is a cradle of many religions. What impresses me is that Indians are open minded and tolerant with positive values. We know this inter-faith meeting will have a positive outcome. It gives an orientation and a beginning of something. The Sankaracharya also said that there should be no interference from the US Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF) in the internal affairs of the country, including the attacks on Christians in Kandhamal and Gujarat. We see the USCIRF as an intrusive mechanism of a foreign government to interfere in the internal affairs of this country. The USCIRF, which has been permitted to hold meetings with our people to ascertain religious freedom in our country, must no longer be permitted to enter this country on this intrusive mission. We will not allow external interference in our internal affairs, the Sankaracharya asserted.
