RE: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Try www.vermontcountrystore.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sylvia Rognstad Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 12:29 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies That's pretty close, except they don't seem to make them small enough for some of my actresses. Thanks. Sylrog On Sep 26, 2006, at 11:59 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is this what you're interested in? http://www.orchardcorset.com/Merchant2/p_G204.html I also recommend a look around the rest of the site as there are many other similar styles to choose from. Karen Seamstrix -- Sylvia Rognstad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Speaking of lift and separate bras, does anyone know if Playtex still makes those? I need some 50s looking bras and the closest I could find the last time I was looking was the Playtex variety. Sylrog ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Silvara wrote: Oh come on now it was done by the Rami brothers who did the Evil Dead movies its supposed to be campy.Calling that historical id like calling Army of Darkness historical. Some stuff is so awful these days I don't know how we're supposed to tell if it's silly on purpose or if they just didn't try. Dawn ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Oh come on now it was done by the Rami brothers who did the Evil Dead movies its supposed to be campy.Calling that historical id like calling Army of Darkness historical. Silvara [Original Message] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 9/25/2006 2:05:59 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies And exactly when did the historical Hercules live? Come on -- mythology is the original sci-fi/fantasy! For my addition to the horrible costuming hall of shame, I'd like to submit several episodes of Charmed which involved traveling back in time. One of them, I think, was called Viking vixens. I'll grant you, that show was in the scifi/fantasy category, but they could at least have made an effort! Tea Rose Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 13:09:31 EDT From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies God! Xena is OK because she's a complete fantasy [for some in more ways than one...wink wink] But what about the other show these producers did: HERCULES! Yikes! It looks like Xena! Where the hell are the Greeks?? Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
I remember once seeing part of a 1950s film (an Edgar Allan Poe, I think) which featured a woman in Elizabethan costume but with projecting bosoms in the middle of her stomacher. Kate Bunting Librarian and 17th century reenactor Melanie Schuessler [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23/09/2006 16:53 Scaramouche (the one made in 1952) has always been one of my favorites. It's set in the 18th century, but the women all have the 50s lift-and-separate bullet bras underneath their gowns. I'm sure there are many other costume gaffes as well, but that's the most noticeable one. It's a charming movie, though--good swordfight at the end. Melanie Schuessler __ ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Melanie Schuessler [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23/09/2006 16:53 Scaramouche (the one made in 1952) has always been one of my favorites. It's set in the 18th century, but the women all have the 50s lift-and-separate bullet bras underneath their gowns. I'm sure there are many other costume gaffes as well, but that's the most noticeable one. It's a charming movie, though--good swordfight at the end. Speaking of lift and separate bras, does anyone know if Playtex still makes those? I need some 50s looking bras and the closest I could find the last time I was looking was the Playtex variety. Sylrog ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Try ebay Kate 609-570-3584 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sylvia Rognstad Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2006 1:06 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies Melanie Schuessler [EMAIL PROTECTED] 23/09/2006 16:53 Scaramouche (the one made in 1952) has always been one of my favorites. It's set in the 18th century, but the women all have the 50s lift-and-separate bullet bras underneath their gowns. I'm sure there are many other costume gaffes as well, but that's the most noticeable one. It's a charming movie, though--good swordfight at the end. Speaking of lift and separate bras, does anyone know if Playtex still makes those? I need some 50s looking bras and the closest I could find the last time I was looking was the Playtex variety. Sylrog ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Is this what you're interested in? http://www.orchardcorset.com/Merchant2/p_G204.html I also recommend a look around the rest of the site as there are many other similar styles to choose from. Karen Seamstrix -- Sylvia Rognstad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Speaking of lift and separate bras, does anyone know if Playtex still makes those? I need some 50s looking bras and the closest I could find the last time I was looking was the Playtex variety. Sylrog ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
That's pretty close, except they don't seem to make them small enough for some of my actresses. Thanks. Sylrog On Sep 26, 2006, at 11:59 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is this what you're interested in? http://www.orchardcorset.com/Merchant2/p_G204.html I also recommend a look around the rest of the site as there are many other similar styles to choose from. Karen Seamstrix -- Sylvia Rognstad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Speaking of lift and separate bras, does anyone know if Playtex still makes those? I need some 50s looking bras and the closest I could find the last time I was looking was the Playtex variety. Sylrog ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/24/2006 9:51:38 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: One of the major points made in Hollywood and History is that women's costumes (particularly the female lead) tend to be heavily influenced (if not totally based on) current fashion trends of the day in which the movie is actually made, And also that the female extras' costumes might actually be better than the leads, because of this--that was certainly the case in the 1958 Buccaneer. Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/24/2006 11:42:57 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 'Better round up the yurts 'cause the Tatars are startin' to circle' LOL! Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 24, 2006 9:11 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies In a message dated 9/24/2006 8:56:00 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The Conqueror, with John Wayne? ( Said conqueror is Genghis Khan, right? Ann Wass I believe so. I've never seen the movie, but the few photos I have seen from it made me shudder! Dianne ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
On Sep 25, 2006, at 7:42 AM, Catherine Kinsey wrote: That is what really bugs me, when a production claims to be historically accurate but so glaringly misses the mark. Also I have mellowed a bit with age and at times can grudgingly forgive a production that does not claim to be historically accurate. In part this is probably because I have also recently been exposed to some of the theatrical attitudes about period costuming. I helped costume a production of Moliere's The Miser this summer for one of our oldest community theaters. I knew we couldn't afford to be period (and in fact pushed it out about 100 years for pattern availability) so I was calling it period 'style'. The director still insisted on calling it period costumeing and we had several good natured arguments about the semantics of our chosen terminologies :). Since I am a theatrical costume designer, I don't mind stylistic deviations from history. God knows we see more Shakespeare productions in costumes from other periods than we see them in Elizabethan dress. But the whole movie must exhibit the same style then, not just the costumes. I think that is actually one of the reasons I work in theatre and not film, in order to be able to create a stylistic production from a conceptual viewpoint. You don't see that often on film. I don't very often design plays that need to be totally historically accurate.When you get into your modern realism it becomes more important, but even then there are exceptions. If I am trying to be historically accurate, which I am at the moment, working on a realistic play set in the 1950s, it always bothers me to put a costume piece on stage that shouldn't be there. Like, in this case, men wearing crepe soled shoes. You tell them they have to supply their own dress shoes, and that's what they think dress shoes are these days. Sylrog ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
I have thought about this business of costumes reflecting fashion at the time they were made before. If you look at a period film from the 40's the costumes look 40's and so on. But now that I think about it more seriously, I suspect is they are done that way to appeal to the majority of the audience who are NOT well informed about the clothing of other eras. They are trying to make a movie that will sell, not one that is historically accurate. At least that is the way I see it. Does that make it right? No, but it makes them money and that is why they are in business. Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender _ Netscape. Just the Net You Need. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
One of the sad things that came out of that movie is not the costumes. I read somewhere that all of the lead actors -- and who knows how many of the crew-- died of cancer. I think it was filmed in somewhere that they had been doing nuclear testing. Monica -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Dianne Greg Stucki Sent: Monday, September 25, 2006 6:46 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 24, 2006 9:11 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies In a message dated 9/24/2006 8:56:00 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The Conqueror, with John Wayne? ( Said conqueror is Genghis Khan, right? Ann Wass I believe so. I've never seen the movie, but the few photos I have seen from it made me shudder! Dianne ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/24/2006 5:32:43 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: most modern historicals owe more to Xena Warrior Princess and the like than any historical research for their costuming... God! Xena is OK because she's a complete fantasy [for some in more ways than one...wink wink] But what about the other show these producers did: HERCULES! Yikes! It looks like Xena! Where the hell are the Greeks?? ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies (The Costume I)
In a message dated 9/24/2006 8:28:16 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: until being shown how even more rediculous some real crinolines of the period were, *** For balls, but not everyday wear. Of course she IS at court. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/25/2006 1:11:08 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: HERCULES! Yikes! It looks like Xena! Where the hell are the Greeks?? Yeah, but gotta love them leather pants! Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/24/2006 9:57:39 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: But if you are thinking of films like Troy (which I'm convinced was costumed primarily from the local Indian bazaar) and Alexander (Angelina Jolie in a one-shouldered spandex chiton--really!), I'm inclined to agree with you. Troy was not great [one of my fave designers though, Bob Ringwood. He designed Dune. But maybe he was having a bad day on Troy] Still there's a consistency to the look. The movie I love to hate the costumes in is Bram Stoker's Dracula Dreadful...doubly dreadful! Some lov-er-ly bustles gownsin 1898 [they emblazon that date in 20 foot numbers on the screen at the beginning] The men are all over the place...sometimes in one costume. Dracula 1st looks like a Chinese opera singer in drag, then once in London, he looks like Leon Russell, Then he rises out of his coffin in a Gustav Klimt robeand that Kabuki costume Lucy is supposed to get married in It was all over the place. There was no logic or center to the very concept of the costumes. I don't get it. A big fat F for the designer. She gets an F instead of F- because she can design a beautiful gown. Then there's Vanity Fair...that one gets the minus. Yuk! Of course historical accuracy rarely works for film or theatre. Design elements have to enhance the concept of the show. Even Dangerous Liaisons has some aspects that were tweaked to make otherwise accurate costumes look better. The only film [films...it's really two] I've seen where accuracy really worked is Little Dorrit ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Troy was not great [one of my fave designers though, Bob Ringwood. He designed Dune. But maybe he was having a bad day on Troy] Still there's a consistency to the look. The movie I love to hate the costumes in is Bram Stoker's Dracula Dreadful...doubly dreadful! Some lov-er-ly bustles gownsin 1898 [they emblazon that date in 20 foot numbers on the screen at the beginning] The men are all over the place...sometimes in one costume. Dracula 1st looks like a Chinese opera singer in drag, then once in London, he looks like Leon Russell, Then he rises out of his coffin in a Gustav Klimt robeand that Kabuki costume Lucy is supposed to get married in It was all over the place. There was no logic or center to the very concept of the costumes. I don't get it. A big fat F for the designer. She gets an F instead of F- because she can design a beautiful gown. Then there's Vanity Fair...that one gets the minus. Yuk! Of course historical accuracy rarely works for film or theatre. Design elements have to enhance the concept of the show. Even Dangerous Liaisons has some aspects that were tweaked to make otherwise accurate costumes look better. The only film [films...it's really two] I've seen where accuracy really worked is Little Dorrit I thought Dangerous Liasons was one of the better costume movies - always excep[ting my personal bete noir Mr Malcovich, who was quoted as saying that he was wearing his costumes as if it was a pair of jeans, and it looked like it. Has the man never heard of acting as if you are a French nobleman of the 18th century? Suzi ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/25/2006 10:49:56 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: But now that I think about it more seriously, I suspect is they are done that way to appeal to the majority of the audience who are NOT well informed about the clothing of other eras. Remember, the designers, actors and producers, directors and crews of the old films are all living in the time the film was made too. Their ideas are shaped by what is modern for that time they are in the thick of. They are not necessarily thinking about doing something the audience will like, but it's what THEY like and find attractive at the time too. Available fabrics and technologies of the period determine what can be done as well. A film like Tom Jones has great costumes that reflect the characters who wear them, but they are all made a la 1960's. The shapes and silhouettes and accessories are all very good, but the fabrics are 60's and the construction is 60's. Still, the designs themselves are appropriate and enhancing. You could use the same designs todaybut choose better fabrics and cuts and eliminate the zippers up the back! ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/25/2006 1:56:40 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I thought Dangerous Liasons was one of the better costume movies - It is yummy and delicious with chocolate sauce and a cherry! James Acheson, the designer, always demanded to see the research for whatever we were making for extras and bit players when I worked with him on Last of the Mohicans. But if a polyester was right for the look he wanted, he'd use it [though I must say he prefers silks and linen]. He is concerned with character 1st of all. Glen Close's silk gowns are accurate to a degree. But, for instance, the French backs are cut to make them more flattering. Each set of pleats on each side of CB are cut separately. They are two long gores...wider at the bottom than the pleated up top. This makes her gown sweep up the stair more gracefully than the traditional straight panelwhich you actually see in Michelle Pfeiffer's more modest gowns. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
On Monday 25 September 2006 6:22 am, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/24/2006 9:51:38 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: One of the major points made in Hollywood and History is that women's costumes (particularly the female lead) tend to be heavily influenced (if not totally based on) current fashion trends of the day in which the movie is actually made, And also that the female extras' costumes might actually be better than the leads, because of this--that was certainly the case in the 1958 Yes, HH says that that often was true. -- Cathy Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity. --Robert Frost ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
And exactly when did the historical Hercules live? Come on -- mythology is the original sci-fi/fantasy! For my addition to the horrible costuming hall of shame, I'd like to submit several episodes of Charmed which involved traveling back in time. One of them, I think, was called Viking vixens. I'll grant you, that show was in the scifi/fantasy category, but they could at least have made an effort! Tea Rose Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 13:09:31 EDT From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies God! Xena is OK because she's a complete fantasy [for some in more ways than one...wink wink] But what about the other show these producers did: HERCULES! Yikes! It looks like Xena! Where the hell are the Greeks?? Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/25/2006 5:05:28 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: And exactly when did the historical Hercules live? Come on -- mythology is the original sci-fi/fantasy! * C'moncan't they at least make him look a LITTLE Greek? I mean, he could be Seigfreid or Conan for all I know, the way they dressed him. And Charmed is a show that has dreadful costumes no matter what period they are dealing with. The utter crap they put the girls in is a pity. The men fair better because someone just buys their stuff at a high end men's store. Sure the girls things might be bought, but they are tasteless! ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
IMNSHO, the entire movie was having a bad day. Llamas, for cris' sake...the animals are native to South America, not the Mediterranean! --sue - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 25, 2006 11:45 AM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies Troy was not great [one of my fave designers though, Bob Ringwood. He designed Dune. But maybe he was having a bad day on Troy] Still there's a consistency to the look. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/25/2006 9:34:45 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: IMNSHO, the entire movie [Troy] was having a bad day. * Llamas are the least of our worries. They stab Agamemnon to death on the battle field. Boy, Electra's gonna have a dull life! ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
No movie with Yul Brenner could be really awful. :o) Lalah, Never give up, Never surrender --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Elizabeth Walpole [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies Date: Sun, 24 Sep 2006 09:39:14 +1000 Although The King and I is not as really awful as some other movies of that era the direct comparison is kinda nice. Elizabeth Elizabeth Walpole Canberra Australia ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au http://au.geocities.com/amiperiodornot/ ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume _ Netscape. Just the Net You Need. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
On Saturday 23 September 2006 11:46 pm, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/23/2006 11:43:14 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Somehow they managed to make everything look as though it was made from polyester even though the movie was made before the polyester era. Maybe it was nylon, the miracle fiber of the early '50s? I don't know, but it certainly could have been--that would explain a lot! Thanks. -- Cathy Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity. --Robert Frost ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
On Sunday 24 September 2006 1:35 am, Melody Watts wrote: hmmm. what about The Vikings with Kirk Douglas,Tony (yonda lies da castle of my Fadda) Curtis and Janet Leigh, all leather and fur and quasi med-evil looking dresses,made of some gawd awful shiny fabric,and chiffon headgear on Janet Leigh. I thought the castle of my Fadda the King etc., etc. was *from* Black Shield of Falworth. :-) The Vikings may have been no better (it certainly involves the same actors, and probably the same costume department) but I've never seen it. There's a great book called Hollywood and History which discusses at length the particular ways in which Hollywood screws up historic costuming in movies. Sylvia, you may want to see if you can track it down. Here's the information on it. Hollywood and History: Costume Design in Film by Edward Maeder, Alicia Annas, Satch Lavalley, Elois Jenssen Hardcover: 256 pages Publisher: Thames Hudson (August 1990) ISBN: 0500014221 Amazon has used copies available for as little as $5.65: http://www.amazon.com/Hollywood-History-Costume-Design-Film/dp/0500014221/sr=8-15/qid=1159121482/ref=sr_1_15/104-4935471-9868767?ie=UTF8s=books -- Cathy Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity. --Robert Frost ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Somehow they managed to make everything look as though it was Such an off-centre look may be thier way of indicating past times or another era? For instnace, I am presently preparing a very bright, vivid movie with some 1970s flashbacks. Clear instructions for the cinematographer for the flashbacks is to keep things looking flat in spite of what I know to be true (I was there but don't tell anyone!) -C. This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
- Original Message - From: Catherine Olanich Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 24, 2006 2:15 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies On Sunday 24 September 2006 1:35 am, Melody Watts wrote: hmmm. what about The Vikings with Kirk Douglas,Tony (yonda lies da castle of my Fadda) Curtis and Janet Leigh, all leather and fur and quasi med-evil looking dresses,made of some gawd awful shiny fabric,and chiffon headgear on Janet Leigh. How about The Conqueror, with John Wayne? (I feel this Tartar woman is for me, and my blood says Take her!) Dianne ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
At 8:30 AM -0600 9/23/06, Sylvia Rognstad wrote: ... costumes from movies, and not just good examples but some really bad ones. For instance, I happened to see on tv a bit of an old movie from the 1950s a couple weeks ago called Princess of the Nile which took place in the Middle East and the costumes were so bad they were really laughable. The women were wearing high spiked heels for instance. So I'm wondering if you all can name some other old movies with really anachronistic or just plain wrong historical costumes. Three movies that illustrate how movie costumes aren't about actual history but rather modern ideas (whether those modern ideas are about modern or historical fashion) are _Brigadoon_, _Rob Roy_, and TFWNSNBU**. Taken together, there are some interesting similarities and contrasts in the films approaches and ideas about historical costuming. Particularly fascinating to me is what the three films reveal about the changes in popular ideas about what historical clothing ought to look like. (The modern fashion is for unkempt fantasy savages, quite a change from Brigadoon.) Interestingly, _Brigadoon_, for all its straight out of the 1950s women's clothing, actually manages to get it's Scottish men's clothing a lot more historically accurate than Mel They really did that Gibson's flick, despite the much hyped (and publicized) specially woven tartans and similar promotional copy efforts. Mind you, getting Scottish clothing a lot more accurate than a Mel Gibson's film isn't exactly saying much... ;-) And, of course, part of that is probably because, unlike Mel's film, Brigadoon (and Rob Roy) are actually set in a period (or at least from a period) when historically men were dressed in a form of the well known popular stereotypes of Scottish clothing. Another potential factor that probably works both for and against Brigadoon is that it was made before the latest major wave of Celtic Romanticism... Sharon **That Film Whose Name Shall Not Be Uttered -- that is, the one with Mel Gibson supposedly portraying William Wallace. -- Sharon Krossa, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Need help with technology for your research or teaching? Hire me! http://MedievalScotland.org/hireme/ Resources for Scottish history, names, clothing, language more: Medieval Scotland - http://MedievalScotland.org/ ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/24/2006 8:56:00 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The Conqueror, with John Wayne? ( Said conqueror is Genghis Khan, right? Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/24/2006 9:03:55 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: It isn't just summer popcorn historical movies that get a great deal of their historical costuming ideas from sf/fantasy films/programs. Someone just mentioned Hollywood and History. It considers movies by historic eras, ending with the future, and part of the discussion is how future films often seem to borrow from classical Greek and Roman styles. So you have sf borrowing from history, then history borrowing from sf, which already borrowed from history, ad infinitum (or is that ad nauseam)? Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Quoting [EMAIL PROTECTED]: In a message dated 9/24/2006 8:56:00 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The Conqueror, with John Wayne? ( Said conqueror is Genghis Khan, right? Wasn't there one about The Vikings and Genghis Kahn? susan - Susan Farmer [EMAIL PROTECTED] University of Tennessee Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/ ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies -----the Duke with a eye job
oh yeah, they did some weird make-up on John Waynes eyes (It looks like they stuck a rubberband across his eyelids) to make him look Mongolianwhat a film! too funny now--very serious then... [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/24/2006 8:56:00 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The Conqueror, with John Wayne? ( Said conqueror is Genghis Khan, right? Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume - Get your email and more, right on the new Yahoo.com ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2006/09/24 Sun PM 09:11:37 EST To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies In a message dated 9/24/2006 8:56:00 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The Conqueror, with John Wayne? ( Said conqueror is Genghis Khan, right? Ann Wass Yes indeedy! Every time I see this movie I think to myself: 'Better round up the yurts 'cause the Tatars are startin' to circle' Sheridan ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Scaramouche (the one made in 1952) has always been one of my favorites. It's set in the 18th century, but the women all have the 50s lift-and-separate bullet bras underneath their gowns. I'm sure there are many other costume gaffes as well, but that's the most noticeable one. It's a charming movie, though--good swordfight at the end. Melanie Schuessler Sylvia Rognstad wrote: Since we always rant so much about how bad Hollywood does historical costumes in movies, here's a question that ought to get a lot of replies. I am teaching a class in the costume and fashion industries and thought it would be fun to show some clips of costumes from movies, and not just good examples but some really bad ones. For instance, I happened to see on tv a bit of an old movie from the 1950s a couple weeks ago called Princess of the Nile which took place in the Middle East and the costumes were so bad they were really laughable. The women were wearing high spiked heels for instance. So I'm wondering if you all can name some other old movies with really anachronistic or just plain wrong historical costumes. Sylrog ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
How about the Black Shield of Falworth (1954)? Pure medieval mystery meat. Somehow they managed to make everything look as though it was made from polyester even though the movie was made before the polyester era. -- Cathy Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity. --Robert Frost ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
At 16:53 23/09/2006, you wrote: Scaramouche (the one made in 1952) has always been one of my favorites. It's set in the 18th century, but the women all have the 50s lift-and-separate bullet bras underneath their gowns. I'm sure there are many other costume gaffes as well, but that's the most noticeable one. It's a charming movie, though--good swordfight at the end. Melanie Schuessler Sylvia Rognstad wrote: Since we always rant so much about how bad Hollywood does historical costumes in movies, here's a question that ought to get a lot of replies. I am teaching a class in the costume and fashion industries and thought it would be fun to show some clips of costumes from movies, and not just good examples but some really bad ones. For instance, I happened to see on tv a bit of an old movie from the 1950s a couple weeks ago called Princess of the Nile which took place in the Middle East and the costumes were so bad they were really laughable. The women were wearing high spiked heels for instance. So I'm wondering if you all can name some other old movies with really anachronistic or just plain wrong historical costumes. Sylrog And Ivanhoe - Robert Taylor and Elizabeth Taylor. (Again men fairly reasonable). Same period Quo Vadis with Robert Taylor, again, and Ava Gardner? And who could forget Errol Flynn in tights as Robin Hood? Suzi ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/23/2006 10:31:24 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: but some really bad ones. The 1940 Pride and Prejudice, with costumes in highly fantasized 1830s-era. Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Oh! Oh! The Court Jester with Danny Kaye and Angela Landsbury. :D Some of the best twisty-silly dialogue EVER, but oh my the clothes! Althea On Sep 23, 2006, at 7:38 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 9/23/2006 10:31:24 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: but some really bad ones. The 1940 Pride and Prejudice, with costumes in highly fantasized 1830s-era. Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume Althea Turner [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ignorant themselves of the forces of nature and wanting to have company in their ignorance, they don't want people to look into anything; they want us to believe like peasants and not ask the reasons behind things. William of Conches, 12th century ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
On Saturday 23 September 2006 12:40 pm, Althea Turner wrote: Oh! Oh! The Court Jester with Danny Kaye and Angela Landsbury. :D Some of the best twisty-silly dialogue EVER, but oh my the clothes! Yes! You are quite right. My husband loves that movie--but not for the costumes. :-) -- Cathy Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity. --Robert Frost ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
The Pirate with Gene Kelly and Judy Garland. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sylvia Rognstad Sent: Saturday, September 23, 2006 7:30 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies Since we always rant so much about how bad Hollywood does historical costumes in movies, here's a question that ought to get a lot of replies. I am teaching a class in the costume and fashion industries and thought it would be fun to show some clips of costumes from movies, and not just good examples but some really bad ones. For instance, I happened to see on tv a bit of an old movie from the 1950s a couple weeks ago called Princess of the Nile which took place in the Middle East and the costumes were so bad they were really laughable. The women were wearing high spiked heels for instance. So I'm wondering if you all can name some other old movies with really anachronistic or just plain wrong historical costumes. Sylrog ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
- Original Message - From: Sylvia Rognstad [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Historical Costume [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 24, 2006 12:30 AM Subject: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies Since we always rant so much about how bad Hollywood does historical costumes in movies, here's a question that ought to get a lot of replies. I am teaching a class in the costume and fashion industries and thought it would be fun to show some clips of costumes from movies, and not just good examples but some really bad ones. For instance, I happened to see on tv a bit of an old movie from the 1950s a couple weeks ago called Princess of the Nile which took place in the Middle East and the costumes were so bad they were really laughable. The women were wearing high spiked heels for instance. So I'm wondering if you all can name some other old movies with really anachronistic or just plain wrong historical costumes. Sylrog Actually I did a presentation on historical films as a genre a few years ago, I did a direct comparison between 'The King and I' (1950s musical version with Deborah Kerr wearing hoops as wide as she is tall) and 'Anna and the King' (pretty darned good costuming and the story was a major improvement on the 1950s version, though Hollywood still needed the love interest so they brought the King's age down from over 60 to 30 something, both versions are still banned in Thailand) I showed the equivalent scene in both films (where Anna first meets the children) and pointed out the differences (like the fact that _The King and I_ was clearly shot on a Hollywood set whereas _Anna and the King_ had been filmed on location, although they couldn't get filming permission from the Thai government and had to film in Singapore). Although The King and I is not as really awful as some other movies of that era the direct comparison is kinda nice. Elizabeth Elizabeth Walpole Canberra Australia ewalpole[at]tpg.com.au http://au.geocities.com/amiperiodornot/ ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Oh, history shmystory...I kind'a like the Corman science firction movie (think it was Battle Beyond the Stars) where we are chased by frayed peasant mutants in brown (yes, brown) smocks -- every time they rounded a corner running at high speed, the smocks would flap up and reveal Levis, -C. This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/23/2006 11:43:14 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Somehow they managed to make everything look as though it was made from polyester even though the movie was made before the polyester era. Maybe it was nylon, the miracle fiber of the early '50s? Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
In a message dated 9/23/2006 11:35:34 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: From what I remember, Desiree with Marlon Brando as Napoleon and Jean Simmons as Desiree. Men's uniforms seem to be O.K. but I'm sure I saw the ladies in high heels under their Regency dresses - and I love the film. I have to look that one up--saw it years and years ago, and seem to remember that Josephine's coronation gown wasn't what David painted. Will look for high heels, too! Ann Wass ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
Sylrog, I tried to watch an old British BW movie of David Copperfield the other day. The costumes were so bad that I turned it off. My husband and I couldn't figure out what decade the costumes were supposed to represent. The men were one decade and the women were a mixture of everything from 1820s to 1850s. I will rarely turn off something because of bad costumes, but this one is my all time worse film. I think this version was playing On Demand for Stars, HBO, or Encore. I just checked and it isn't playing this month. Penny Ladnier, Owner, The Costume Gallery Websites www.costumegallery.com www.costumelibrary.com www.costumeclassroom.com www.costumeencyclopedia.com ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] Bad historical costume movies
hmmm. what about The Vikings with Kirk Douglas,Tony (yonda lies da castle of my Fadda) Curtis and Janet Leigh, all leather and fur and quasi med-evil looking dresses,made of some gawd awful shiny fabric,and chiffon headgear on Janet Leigh. Sylvia Rognstad [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Since we always rant so much about how bad Hollywood does historical costumes in movies, here's a question that ought to get a lot of replies. I am teaching a class in the costume and fashion industries and thought it would be fun to show some clips of costumes from movies, and not just good examples but some really bad ones. For instance, I happened to see on tv a bit of an old movie from the 1950s a couple weeks ago called Princess of the Nile which took place in the Middle East and the costumes were so bad they were really laughable. The women were wearing high spiked heels for instance. So I'm wondering if you all can name some other old movies with really anachronistic or just plain wrong historical costumes. Sylrog ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume - Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1ยข/min. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
