[Haifux] Re: How to specify a separate directory for objects, while usingconfigure.in and makefile.am?
On Thu, 29 May 2003, AndreyB wrote: > Does anybody know? > > I have no problem with compiling and linking, but all the objects live in > the source directories - bad habit. > > What do I do? > At the beginning of the compilation, say: $ mkdir .objs Then run gcc -c -o .objs/hello.o hello.c Regards, Shlomi Fish > > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Real Time
On Thu, 29 May 2003, Orna Agmon wrote: > Hello Haifuxers, > > I talked to Iftach Hyams a bit about Real-Time systems, and realized I > know very little about that. Especially, the things that are important to > a real time programmer are very far from what I usually bump into. > > I would like to suggest asking him to give an overview lecture on the > topic. > > We would like to know (on-list answers, please) if people think such a > lecture would be interesting. > I would find such a lecture interesting. Regards, Shlomi Fish > Thanks, > Orna. > ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Autotools ROCK!
On Tue, 3 Jun 2003, AndreyB wrote: > After few days of experiments I was able compile a fairly complex project > without touching Makefile, but only writing Makefile.am and Configure.in. > These tools add a great deal of flexibility to project management and > portability, but, unfortunately, they are pretty complex for casual use. So > I wandered, maybe somebody could do a lecture on them? > Someone (me) already did: http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/Autotools/ (it's lecture no. 56) Regards, Shlomi Fish > ./make --ALL --happy > Andrey. > > > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: RFC: lecture ideas from Aviram Jenik
On Sat, 7 Jun 2003, Muli Ben-Yehuda wrote: > Aviram has three excellent lecture ideas for Haifux. Please let me > know, on or off list, which you prefer. > > The three possibilities are: > > - Wireless (in)security and war driving > - Setting up a SPAM filtering system (MUA independent) > - Full disclosure (non technical) > > Personally, my preference is 3, then 1, then 2. > My preferences are Spam filtering, then Full Disclosure then Wireless. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Idea from last meeting
On Thu, 26 Jun 2003, Orr Dunkelman wrote: > In the last meeting it was suggested (by several haifux members), to have > a dedicated for newbies email address, where they can send their > questions, and the volunteers will answer them. > > IMHO, this is quite similar to the GNUbies-IL mailing list, but if people > are willing to contibute, and don't feel at ease with the gnubies-il > mailing list, I will open such an address. > > So, those of you who are willing to particiapte as electronical support > group in such a setting, please mail me privately. > > Those of you who think this will just cuase confusion and division amongst > our forces (of having both gnubies-il and this address), are welcome to > explain why this is a bad idea, but if there will be enough people willing > to support this, then I will open such an address (no matter what my point > of view is). > I believe this is not necessary as GNUbies-IL is enough. > As you can guess, I think this might cuase confusion, but if 6 people will > approach and would like to take this project on themselves - welcome... > Regards, Shlomi Fish > ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Lecture proposal: proxying
On Sun, 29 Jun 2003, Orna Agmon wrote: > On Sun, 29 Jun 2003, Adir Abraham wrote: > > > Yes. I am for it. > > > Me too. > So do I. Regards, Shlomi Fish > > On Sat, 28 Jun 2003, Alon Altman wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > I propose a lecture about proxies: transparent HTTP proxying with and > > > without cache, mail proxying, SOCKS, FTP, etc. > > > > > > Will this lecture be of interest? > > > > > > Alon > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: [HAIFUX LECTURE] from python import lecture, by Muli Ben-Yehuda
On Fri, 4 Jul 2003, Vasiliev Michael wrote: > On Friday 04 July 2003 11:26, Orna Agmon wrote: > OA>Next Monday (06/07/2003), 18:30, the Haifa Linux Club will once again > > You probably mean 07/07/2003, right? Since that is the date on the website... > > Yes, 07/07. 06/07 is Sunday, and we meet on Monday. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Ride from Tel Aviv
It's a bit late, but is anybody going to drive to the meeting today from
Tel Aviv and can give me a lift?
Please call me at 03-6424668.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Send the reply message to the one you get to
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Google Search for "Haifa Linux Club" returns linuxclub.il.eu.org
Check: http://www.google.com/search?q=haifa%20linux%20club&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8 Maybe we should have an "Redirect permanent" directive on the old domain to direct it to the new www.haifux.org home. BTW, a search for "haifux" returns "www.haifux.org". Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Gimp Lecture Slides - now finished
Hi!
I finished writing the slides for the Gimp Lecture. The complete lecture
can be found here:
http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/Gimp/1/slides/
I guess it's better late than never.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: haifux.org is about to expire
On Fri, 8 Aug 2003, Adir Abraham wrote: > Hi to all, > > I suggest that we will check how many people can give X money for this > (I don't think that we will need to give more than 10-15NIS. Ofcourse, I > am in), and we will re-register the name by ourselves. I am not sure that > involving Hamakor with this is a good idea, in addition to the fact that > Orr is not here to decide about this (and he's the only one, in my > opinion, who should decide about transfering ownership). > I can give money for this cause. But there should be someone who will give the concentrated sum and then everyone will return him the money. Regards, Shlomi Fish > Flames are welcome. > > On Fri, 8 Aug 2003, Alon Altman wrote: > > > Hi, > > The domain of the Haifa Linux Club is about to expire on 24/9/2003. I > > suggest the domain be renewed by HaMakor, with a cheaper domain provider. > > Can the Amuta fund this? > > > > Alon > > > > > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: birthday celebration.
On Thu, 14 Aug 2003, Orna Agmon wrote: > On Thu, 14 Aug 2003, Muli Ben-Yehuda wrote: > > > > > - spargo (nice restaurant, no smoking) > > - frangelico (pub, sushi, smoking) > > Spargo - Let there be air! > I second that. (I dislike smoking very very much). Also, is anyone from Tel Aviv or somewhere close by, is going to attend this dinner? Having a ride home is a pre-requisite for me to attend it. And you can say this is my reservation. Regards, Shlomi Fish > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Updated the Lectures Manager Data
Greetings all!
I updated the lectures manager data. The url is as always:
http://haifux.berlios.de/lec_man/
Things to do:
1. Link to the Wine lecture slides when they are online.
2. Link to the slides of Muli and Orna's OLS presentation.
Note that the current web-page is generated from a different lectures
manager that Orr wrote. However, he refused to send it to me from some
reason. (while the code and data for mine is online) Based on what I
know of it, I suspect that it is inferior to my own.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Shlomi Loubaton (fwd)
-- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Forwarded message -- Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2003 19:59:47 +0300 (IDT) From: Shlomi Fish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Haifux] Shlomi Loubaton (fwd) -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ There's no point in keeping an idea to yourself since there's a 10 to 1 chance that somebody already has it and will share it before you. -- Forwarded message -- Date: Sun, 17 Aug 2003 10:27:08 +0300 From: Eli Marmor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: linux ILUG <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [Haifux] Shlomi Loubaton Hi, Sorry to bother the list, but I'm trying to contact Shlomi, and failed to do it through his e-mail address (he probably replaced it). So Shlomi, if you read this message, please contact me. If somebody else is in touch with him, I'll love to learn how to reach him (my purposes are positive, and he doesn't owe me anything, if somebody wondered... ;-). P.S. the addresses that I tried are: loubaton.shlomi AT 012.net.il, shlomil AT hotmail.com ( " AT " instead of "@") If you have another one, please let me know. Thanks, -- Eli Marmor [EMAIL PROTECTED] CTO, Founder Netmask (El-Mar) Internet Technologies Ltd. __ Tel.: +972-9-766-1020 8 Yad-Harutzim St. Fax.: +972-9-766-1314 P.O.B. 7004 Mobile: +972-50-23-7338 Kfar-Saba 44641, Israel = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word "unsubscribe" in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] W2L as "Linux in Action"
Hi all. I again suggest the idea that instead of having a 6-7 lectures where we try to teach people the basics of Linux, we would instead have 2-3 ones where the purpose would be to show how cool Linux is with various demonstrations. (Linux in Action). I believe that this idea would be much more appealing to people as: 1. It will give them the will to try Linux. 2. Individuals can already learn how to handle problems in Linux as they encounter them with the plenthora of forums that are available on the Internet. 3. Using Linux is not as difficult as it used to be. 4. People are usually bored by such trivial technicalities. 5. We will have more fun and be done with it in a shorter time frame. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: [HAIFUX LECTURE][HAPPY BIRTHDAY] Real Time and RT in Linux, byIftach Hyams
On Sat, 16 Aug 2003, Orna Agmon wrote: > Next Monday (18/08/2003), 18:30, the Haifa Linux Club will once again > meet to hear Iftach Hyams talk about: > > Real Time and RT in Linux >an introduction to the python programming language > There seems to be a typo here. I don't think the lecture has anything to do with Python. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Palladium's Immunity against Hardware Attacks
Check here for a Cryptogram article about Palladium: http://www.counterpane.com/crypto-gram-0208.html#1 It says: <<< Microsoft readily acknowledges that Pd will not be secure against hardware attacks. They spend some effort making the secure processor annoying to pry secrets out of, but not a whole lot of effort. They assume that the tamper-resistance will be defeated. It is their intention to design the system so that hardware attacks do not result in class breaks: that breaking one machine doesn't help you break any others. >>> A few people thought the opposite was the fact in one of our previous meetings. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: W2L0 Makefile basics, draft
On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Maor Meir wrote: > As promissed: attached is the text I wrote for basic Makefile use to add > to W2L0 > look it over, comment, I'll fix as necessary and than shlomi could > HTMLize it to fit with the rest of the beautyfied lecture slides. > > Meir. > > The problem is that you don't really explain the format of the makefile. It should be something like: <<< In a makefile, the target is followed by a colon (:), which is then followed by a list of its dependencies. Afterwards in a new line, there should be a tab character (and not any other whitespace before or afterwards), followed by the command used to generate the target from the dependencies. >>> ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: W2L0 Makefile basics, draft
On Mon, 15 Sep 2003, Alon Altman wrote: > Rewrite the examples to better resemble a real MATAM make file (change the > helper.o to be mtm_helper.o, etc.) > I don't think it's a good idea. What if the student is a Mamat student where such conventions are not used? And he'll probably not understand what mtm_helper is all about anyway. helper.o is a good name as it is. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Things to be done
On Tue, 16 Sep 2003, Alon Altman wrote: > Please read the list below and reply if you can help. If your name is > mentioned below, please reply in any case: > > Adir, Orna, Meir, Etzion, Ron, ShlomiF, Ori, and Shachar > > These things need to be done (in order of urgency): > --- > 1. Is the advertising material final? (Ron?) If so, please start spreading >the material. > 2. Build the W2L website - I'm working on it. If anyone can help with the >DESIGN of the site, please help now. > 3. Get SCREENS for the party. Ron - can you talk with the system people at >the faculty about lending us a bunch of screens for the day? Anyone else >has a good suggestion? >ShlomiF - did you find any extra sponsors? I was not aware that I was supposed to look. I was supposed to be Etzion's back-up, but did not hear from him. I'll look if possible. Regards, Shlomi Fish > 4. Somebody needs to talk with the KABAT, preferably technion staffers. If >anyone here can help, please email me in private. > 5. Lecutres: DEADLINE FOR ALL LECTURES: 13/10. By that date a FINAL DRAFT of >the lecture must be posted to the list. If you are assigned to write a >lecture, please plan on completing it by then. PLEASE start at least one >week in advance (6/10). > 6. EXTRA CD, PACKAGE SELECTION floppies, and install notes should be ready >by 20/10. Shachar, Meir -- please e-mail me when you are going to work on >that. > 7. Meir - what's the status with the music for the Linux day? > > Alon > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] New Version of the W2L "Linux for the Technion Student" Lecture
Check: http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Technion/ for a new version of the Linux for the Technion student lecture. It includes the part about makefiles. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Do you want to be there next Monday?
On Tue, 23 Sep 2003, Ori Idan wrote: > > While I am at it, I might as well already vote: I think we should hold a > > lecture, and I would like to hear Ron on that date. We will have a long > > drought period right after (regarding hearing lectures, not giving them!), > > and I see no point in making it longer. > > I am with you, I also think we should have a lecture. > I am sorry to hear there is a cancleation but this lecture might also be good. > > I also think we should have a lecture. +1 on this. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Forums' Coverage of the Initial Announcement
This is a report I prepared with the forums' coverage of the initial
announcement:
iglu.org.il - check
Whatsup - check
Walla (username: shlomif6) - cannot log in.
Tapuz (username: Shlomi Fish) - check
Ynet (no login required) - check
So, I have only Walla left and other forums I'm not aware of. What are
they?
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
------
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Forums' Coverage of the Initial Announcement
On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, Muli Ben-Yehuda wrote: > On Wed, Sep 24, 2003 at 02:43:13PM +0300, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > Ynet (no login required) - check > > link, please? > It's on the front page of the forum. Search for "Shlomi Fish" (in Hebrew) or "Sidrat \"Brukhim Haba'im Lelinux\"". I cannot give a more exact link because the forum is Javascript-based (and IE-specific). Regards, Shlomi Fish > Nana: http://forums.nana.co.il/forum.asp?id=2092 > OK. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Forums' Coverage of the Initial Announcement
On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, Adir Abraham wrote: > On Wed, 24 Sep 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > This is a report I prepared with the forums' coverage of the initial > > announcement: > > > > iglu.org.il - check > > Whatsup - check > > Walla (username: shlomif6) - cannot log in. > > Tapuz (username: Shlomi Fish) - check > > Ynet (no login required) - check > > > > So, I have only Walla left and other forums I'm not aware of. What are > > they? > > Asat's, ofcourse. > > http://www.asat.co.il/php/forum > Done. I was sure glad to see it's a PHP-BB forum and so works flawlessly with any Linux browser. Regards, Shlomi Fish > > > > Regards, > > > > Shlomi Fish > > > > > > -- > > Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ > > > > An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two > > doctors away. > > > > Falk Fish > > > > -- > > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Updated Forums Coverage
Here it is:
<<<
iglu.org.il - check
Whatsup - check
Walla (username: shlomif6) - cannot log in.
Tapuz (username: Shlomi Fish) - check
Ynet (no login required) - check
Nana (no login required) - check
Asat (username: shlomif) - check
>>>
I still cannot login to Walla and would appreciate if anyone does it in my
place.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
------
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] DocBook
Back at the lecture I was surprised to hear that someone there (who was
otherwise very knowledgable in TeX and LaTeX) did not hear about DocBook.
So here's an introduction to it.
DocBook started as a documentation preparation system based on SGML. The
idea was to have a common document from which one could derive other
document formats, than tend to be more visual. DocBook sports a wide
variety of tags, all of them structured and logical, with a strong support
for hypertext; technical/programming markup; footnotes, end-notes,
bibliography, revision history, glossary etc.
DocBook (that now can be written with SGML or with XML, giving the name
to DocBook/SGML and DocBook/XML) can be translated into a multitude of
format: man pages, TeX (and from which to Postscript and PDF), HTML (which
is guaranteed to work correctly), Word RTF, and other formats.
Earlier stylesheets were based on DSSSL, which is Scheme-based, and
implemented in the openjade converter. More recent stylesheets are using
the W3C XSLT transformations, which are in turn converted to HTML or
XSL-FO (another W3C recommendation).
DocBook is, IMO, very, very cool. Some of its drawbacks are:
1. Very verbose tags (... to make a list
item)
2. At the moment, it has limited support for bi-directionality. (sometimes
due to problems with the back-ends).
3. Two few visual markups (only one tag).
OTOH, DocBook greates very good HTML, and also very good PDFs (with
hyperlinks, tables of contents and all).
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] RFC: "Basic Use" Lecture + "Linux for the Technion Student" Lecture
The revised "Basic Use" lecture is available here: http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Basic_Use/slides/ The formatted "Linux for the Technion Student" lecture is available here: http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Technion/ Please go over the slides and voice your comments. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: RFC: "Basic Use" Lecture + "Linux for the Technion Student" Lecture
On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Maor Meir wrote: > > > On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > The formatted "Linux for the Technion Student" lecture is available here: > > > > http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Technion/ > > You maid the first emacs slide vanish all together leaving the > presentation broken. It should be as was before. > Hmmm.. that was a compilation bug. I'll probably have to tweak my code to stop after the first page was incorrectly rendered. > I also maid an extra ddd slide, show as to have some actuall usefull stuff > written down. Attached is the rough draft it should come in after the > existing ddd slide. Other than that I think all is well. > OK, I'll look at it. Regards, Shlomi Fish > Meir > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: RFC: "Basic Use" Lecture + "Linux for the Technion Student" Lecture
On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote:
> On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Maor Meir wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > On Thu, 2 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote:
> >
> > > The formatted "Linux for the Technion Student" lecture is available here:
> > >
> > > http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Technion/
> >
> > You maid the first emacs slide vanish all together leaving the
> > presentation broken. It should be as was before.
> >
>
> Hmmm.. that was a compilation bug. I'll probably have to tweak my code to
> stop after the first page was incorrectly rendered.
>
> > I also maid an extra ddd slide, show as to have some actuall usefull stuff
> > written down. Attached is the rough draft it should come in after the
> > existing ddd slide. Other than that I think all is well.
> >
>
> OK, I'll look at it.
>
OK - your tips, with minor corrections are now included in the lecture
online.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
> Regards,
>
> Shlomi Fish
>
>
> > Meir
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
>
> An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
> doctors away.
>
> Falk Fish
>
> ------
> Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
> To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
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[Haifux] Re: DocBook
lear enough. I don't think visual tags would be reasonable in DocBook. However, I find it distressing that the only way to emphasize text is using the tag. In XHTML I have (bold), (italic) and (underline), which I can assign different styles to each using CSS. In DocBook I only have and I have to start tempering with the generating stylesheets to create different classes for it, so I'll have more variety. OTOH, DocBook has dozens of tags for marking computer text, anything from function parameters, to screen output. But who is John Galt? Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: JVM
On Sun, 5 Oct 2003, Nahum Cohen wrote: > I have a question regarding Sun JVM runtime version: > > I am running RedHat 9 and I installed Netscape 7.1. > When I am trying to browse to a web page containing Java applet, I get > prompt that I don't have the necessary plug-in, and I have to download > it. Then I get to this web page: http://java.sun.com/j2se/downloads.html > > I downloaded J2SE v 1.4.2_01 (Linux RPM in self-extracting file), > extracted the bin file and got the RPM. After installing the RPM I got > Java installed under /usr/java > > But when I am trying to run a web page containing Java applet - I still > get the same prompt that I don't have the right plug-in... I checked in > Netscape under preferences that "Enable Java" is checked. > > What else do I have to do enable to run Java applet ? > Are you using Mozilla or Konqueror? If you are using Mozilla check here: http://plugindoc.mozdev.org/linux.html If you are using Konqueror, check the Java tab in the Konqueror configuration. Regards, Shlomi Fish > P.S: > When I run /usr/java/j2re1.4.2_01/bin/java -version I get the following: > Java(TM) 2 Runtime Environment, Standard Edition (build 1.4.2_01-b06) > Java HotSpot(TM) Client VM (build 1.4.2_01-b06, mixed mode > > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: recomendations for free format presentation creators
On Sun, 5 Oct 2003, Orna Agmon wrote: > Hello people, > > I have updated http://www.haifux.org/givelecture.html to include a list of > tools which create free-format presentations. Where I knew, I included a > link to a lecture with both outcome and source, to set an example. > > I guess not all the examples I found were the best we can get (one of > them is mine...), since some are very simple, and it is not > always good to learn from a very simple example. > > I would appreciate it if you recommended the tools you use yourselves, and > /or supplied sources for lectures you gave in Haifux (and are now > presented only as PDF/ PS), for the sake of future lecturers in Haifux. > I will soon upload the source for my "Basic Use" slides. The source of my "The Cathedral and the Bazaar" lecture is already online on Quad-Pres' site, but it is a less sophisticated lecture. A few comments on the existing page: 1. s/postsccript/postscript/ 2. I would not recommend MagicPoint if I were you. It creates huge Post-Script files and its HTML output is lacking (either plaintext without any markup or huge GIFs). If you like using it fine, but I think it's a sub-standard tool. The OpenOffice/KOffice tools provide a viable alternative for it if you want a WYSIWYG slides creator, and LaTeX is more than enough for the non-WYSIWYG crowd. Regards, Shlomi Fish > Thanks, > > Orna. > > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: recomendations for free format presentation creators
Oh and other tools I'm aware of:
1. PerlPoint -
http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/Pres-Tools/Perl-Point/
Which is a self-documenting lecture made by it (that includes the source).
Translates into HTML, or LaTeX from the same source. Very brief input
(which I very much liked). Creates some quirky HTML, but still quite
usable (reminds me that I should write pp2xhtml ASAP).
2. DocBook - http://www.docbook.org/
Contains a slide presentor that can translate DocBook/XML into a multitude
of formats: HTML, TeX, Word RTF, etc. Very verbose, though.
3. Also check:
http://www.perl.org.il/20021107.html
Apparently in Israel alone, at least 5 people have wrote their own
presentation tools in Perl and at least one in zsh, and another one in
Python.
I'm not sure how usable are any of these.
4. This link:
http://www.perl.org.il/pipermail/perl/2002-October/000510.html
contains links to many other slide creators, none of them were used by
people I know.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
On Sun, 5 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote:
> On Sun, 5 Oct 2003, Orna Agmon wrote:
>
> > Hello people,
> >
> > I have updated http://www.haifux.org/givelecture.html to include a list of
> > tools which create free-format presentations. Where I knew, I included a
> > link to a lecture with both outcome and source, to set an example.
> >
> > I guess not all the examples I found were the best we can get (one of
> > them is mine...), since some are very simple, and it is not
> > always good to learn from a very simple example.
> >
> > I would appreciate it if you recommended the tools you use yourselves, and
> > /or supplied sources for lectures you gave in Haifux (and are now
> > presented only as PDF/ PS), for the sake of future lecturers in Haifux.
> >
>
> I will soon upload the source for my "Basic Use" slides. The source of my
> "The Cathedral and the Bazaar" lecture is already online on Quad-Pres'
> site, but it is a less sophisticated lecture.
>
> A few comments on the existing page:
>
> 1. s/postsccript/postscript/
>
> 2. I would not recommend MagicPoint if I were you. It creates huge
> Post-Script files and its HTML output is lacking (either plaintext without
> any markup or huge GIFs). If you like using it fine, but I think it's a
> sub-standard tool.
>
> The OpenOffice/KOffice tools provide a viable alternative for it if you
> want a WYSIWYG slides creator, and LaTeX is more than enough for the
> non-WYSIWYG crowd.
>
> Regards,
>
> Shlomi Fish
>
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Orna.
> >
> > ------
> > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
> > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
>
> An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
> doctors away.
>
> Falk Fish
>
> --
> Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
> To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
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[Haifux] Is the redirect to /newcomers/ a good idea?
I don't think the redirect to newcomers is a good idea. First of all,
people who surf to our site internationally, or take the last parts of the
URL will be annoyed by this behaviour. Secondly, it would be hard to link
to the club (http://www.haifux.org/) from web-directories that wish the
content to be in English. Thirdly, it is just plain annoying.
The site has interests to people besides the newcomers series. Most of the
links I gave were directly to http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/ so there's
no problem here. And we can put a large link in the front of the page
to direct people there.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
------
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
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[Haifux] Re: Is the redirect to /newcomers/ a good idea?
On Fri, 10 Oct 2003, Alon Altman wrote: > On Fri, 10 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > > > I don't think the redirect to newcomers is a good idea. First of all, > > people who surf to our site internationally, or take the last parts of the > > URL will be annoyed by this behaviour. Secondly, it would be hard to link > > to the club (http://www.haifux.org/) from web-directories that wish the > > content to be in English. Thirdly, it is just plain annoying. > > > > The site has interests to people besides the newcomers series. Most of the > > links I gave were directly to http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/ so there's > > no problem here. And we can put a large link in the front of the page > > to direct people there. > > This is a temporary measure to help promote the W2L series. Link to > http://www.haifux.org/index.html if you want to force the standard English > page. I have put an English link on the top of the newcomers/ page to the > regular homepage. It's just one more click for international visitors (which > didn't follow a deep link). > I could add content negotiation to this forward, and have it done only for > people who prefer Hebrew pages. What do you think? Yes, that would be a good idea. In any case, I think that the / should be the front page, and that the newcomers should be at /newcomers/. A big link at the top of the page would be enough promotion. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Please recommend linux sites
On Sun, 12 Oct 2003, Alon Altman wrote: > Hi, > We are building the branding for the "Haifux distro" based on RH9. We are > looking for Hebrew linux sites and useful English sites to include in the > bookmarks of the installed system. > http://lwn.net/ Regards, Shlomi Fish > We currently have the following sites (including sponsors): > http://counter.li.org/ > http://fr2.rpmfind.net > http://freshmeat.net/ > http://li.org/ > http://linux.israel.net/ > http://slashdot.org/ > http://sourceforge.net/ > http://www.asat.co.il > http://www.beyondsecurity.com/ > http://www.cs.technion.ac.il/ > http://www.google.com/en > http://www.haifux.org/index.html > http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/ > http://www.hamakor.org.il/ > http://www.iglu.org.il/ > http://www.ligad.com/ > http://www.linux.org.il/ > http://www.penguin.org.il/ > http://www.tldp.org/ > http://www.whatsup.co.il/ > > Thanks, > Alon > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Sponsors
What do we have to do about the sponsors? I was responsible for bugging Etzion about them, and I'm sorry to admit that I did not do anything about it. I don't suppose it's too late because there's still some time until the insta-party. In any case, a few questions: 1. Who are the prospective sponsors? 2. How are they supposed to contribute (equipment, lunch, T-shirts, etc.)? 3. How are we supposed to contact them? (it probably should not be me in person) Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Language of the W2L Slides
Are the slides for the W2L lectures required to be in Hebrew or can they
be in English as well? Someone whom I talked to right now (on the phone)
claimed it was agreed that they should be in Hebrew.
Note that both the Basic Use slides and the "Linux for the Technion
student" one are in English at the moment, and it would take a great deal
of work to translate them.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
------
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
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[Haifux] Re: RFC: Hebrew Lecture
On Thu, 16 Oct 2003, Alon Altman wrote: > Hi, > My Hebrew lecture is complete (for now). Please proofread it and suggest > corrections. It is available at http://alon.wox.org/hebrewlec/ > > Alon > > In: http://alon.wox.org/hebrewlec/node7.html#h There's a trailing slash in the path to the XF86Config file instead of a leading slash. ditto for XkbMap. In: http://alon.wox.org/hebrewlec/node11.html#h "Bemida Ve" - Bemida Ve is an incorrect form. Use "Bemida She". In: http://alon.wox.org/hebrewlec/node18.html#h "Ha'akademith" ==> Ha'akademia Other than that: a nit-pick. Are you sure it is a good idea to refer to Linux as GNU/Linux? Some people only heard of "Linux" and would wonder what the GNU/ means and if it's different than plain Linux. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: RFC: Hebrew Lecture
Also note that there are some problems viewing the lecture in Konqueror 3.1.3. Namely, the right edge is cut and hides some of the letters. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Slides for the Networking Lecture
The slides for the networking lecture can be found here: http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Network/slides/ Note that at the moment I did not work too hard to create them. I just converted the OpenOffice document to HTML, fixed the HTML, and inserted it into the slides. I believe there is too much text there, but Shachar may want it this way. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Slides for the Networking Lecture
On Sat, 18 Oct 2003, Maor Meir wrote: > > > On Sat, 18 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > > > The slides for the networking lecture can be found here: > > > > http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Network/slides/ > > in layer1.html > "IEE standard 802.11" should be: IEEE... > Fixed. Regards, Shlomi Fish > I think the lecture as a whole does not fit very well as > a "practical networking" lecture for a linux newbie. > > It mostly defint;y gives a nice overview of the OSI model, > but I am not sure if this should be its goal. > > As for more practical comments I did not seem to find any refernce > to DHCP which I think is an important concept. > > When talking about Masquerading IPs I think the term NAT should > be introduced as it is one that the newbies will bump into. > > There is too much text per slide. > > Meir > > > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: title
On Sat, 18 Oct 2003, Alon Altman wrote: > I think the title for the networking lecture should be something other > than "My lecture title" :). > Oops! :-) Will be fixed. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] In the Nick of Time: Networking Lecture (take 2) is Prepared
Check:
http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Network/slides/
I split it into slides according to Shachar's input. I also bulleted the
information and omitted some unnecessary one.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
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[Haifux] Re: RFC: 'basic admin' lecture
On Sat, 18 Oct 2003, guy keren wrote: > On Sat, 18 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > http://users.actcom.co.il/~choo/basic-admin/node6.html#h > > > > "similar to the way the urpmi utility works on Debian" > > > > I think you meant Mandrake. > > fixed. > > > In: > > > > http://users.actcom.co.il/~choo/basic-admin/node15.html#h > > > > The link to the Questions-Asking HOWTO should be: > > > > http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html > > fixed. why on earth did he remove the faq from its former place to begin > with? > The entire homepage of ESR moved, without a redirection from the old location. At time accessing any link there used to forward to all kind of places like the FSF homepage, Freshmeat, etc. Regards, Shlomi Fish > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: In the Nick of Time: Networking Lecture (take 2) is Prepared
In http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/lectures/5/layer5.html, please make > each sentence a bullet. > Done. > In http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/lectures/5/layer6.html, once again, > bullets. > OK. Done. > In http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/lectures/5/layer7.html, bulletize. If > you can find a good and not obselete document about configuring DNS > client, link to it. The ones in tldp doesn't even mention > /etc/nsswitch.conf. > Done. I don't know of a good DNS tutorial. Regards, Shlomi Fish > > Note: I haven't covered ISDN in my lecture. do you think it is necceserry? > If the list thinks it is, We will probably want to add a sub-topic to > layer 1, similar to the slide about WiFi, with pointer to the relevant > FAQ (http://www.isdn4linux.de/faq/). > >Cheers >Shachar > > On Sat, 18 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > > > Check: > > > > http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Network/slides/ > > > > I split it into slides according to Shachar's input. I also bulleted the > > information and omitted some unnecessary one. > > > > Regards, > > > > Shlomi Fish > > > > > > -- > > Shlomi Fish [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ > > > > An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two > > doctors away. > > > > Falk Fish > > > > -- > > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: In the Nick of Time: Networking Lecture (take 2) is Prepared
Shachar,
can you go over Guy's corrections (in regard to the updated copy) and let
me know which changes to accept? (I'm only following orders from you)
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
------
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
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[Haifux] Re: In the Nick of Time: Networking Lecture (take 2) is Prepared
uot;which is not > > enough, if you have several computers at home you want to connect to > > the internet at once". > > > > We want to change the second bullet, to something like: "When we wnat to > connect more than one computer to the internet using a normal connection, > this becomes a problem. The solution is to give the computers in the > internal network a "virtual" IP, which is in one of the ranges reserved > for internal networks, and make one of the computers redirect the packets > from the external interface to the correct owner in the internal network." > Done. > > also, change "the relevant HOWTO" to "the MASQUERADING HOWTO". > > > > Agreed. Shlomi, can you fix? > Done. > > 15. in the 'firewalls' slide, first bullet, change "this layer" to "layer > > 4". also, this sentence is not correct any longer. stateful inspection > > (which accounts for a large part of firewall's operation) occures at > > the application protocol level. blocking pings is done in layer 3, and > > so on. > > > > I agree. the problem is how to explain it to the people, without getting > them totally confused. The clasical firewall operates in layers 4 and 3, > maybe with some hooks to layer 7 (I have once encounter a firewall which > enforced the usage of FTP protocol on port 21, and acctually speaked FTP). > Yet, the filterring itself occurs in layers 3 and 4. Maybe we want to > drop the first bullet? > Shachar, what should I do exactly here? > > also, second bullet, the firewall is not supposed to 'filter the > > packets', but rather 'filter packets that we want to block'. > > > > How about this: "* The main action of firewalls is to filter the packets > transferred on the network, so that only the packets we wish to accept > will come throgh." > Done. And also changed "action" to "function". > > also, in the link to the HOWTOs, state which HOWTO the user should > > read (the packet-filtering HOWTO). > > > > I will say it verbly. > > > also, perhaps give a link to the ip-tables lecture slides that were > > given in the club? > > > > Yep, I agree. How about adding a bullet: "* Eli Billauer has given a > lecture about iptables, available here: > http://www.haifux.org/lectures/70/"; > Actually, Dani Arbel also gave two lectures about iptables. But I added this bullet. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] W2L Networking Lecture - Take 3
Check:
http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Network/slides/
or:
http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/lectures/5/
Changes since last time:
* Integrated the commentary from Shachar and from Guy Keren -> Shachar.
BTW, I noticed some small inconsistency between the URLs of the pages and
their titles. Like:
http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/lectures/5/layer2/pptp-pppoe/
Where the title is VPN - PPTP, PPPoE and L2TP or:
http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/lectures/5/layer2/pptp-pppoe/pptp-l2tp.html
Where the title is "Back to Cable TV Connections...".
Is it critical that these would be fixed?
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
------
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
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[Haifux] Bullets from the Coordination Meeting Yesterday
Here are the notes Adir and I wrote down during the coordination meeting
yesterday:
* All the lectures are ready.
* RedHat Additions Disk - Almost Done (Lacks the Lectures) - RC1 (?)
* The title "Linux for the Technion Student" should be substituted to
"Software Development in Linux"
* "Terem Nikb'a" (under Basic Use) in the schedule should be substituted
to "Martzim Shonim".
* Convert Lectures so they would be viewable from the Hard-Disk.
* Orr is responsible for the Electricity and interaction with the Technion
Qabat. (=Head Security Officer)
* The Lecturers should send an E-mail to Orr about their Car Number, Car
Vendor, and Car Colour so they can park their car inside the Technion.
(send to [EMAIL PROTECTED])
* A Panel of Experts ("Hakeh eth Hamumheh") should be set up to answer
people's questions regarding their Linux installations.
* Tags for all the Haifux members. (for everyone)
* Lectures of length one hour with overflow of up to 15 minutes.
* In RedHat the configuration tools are called redhat-config-* for the
lecture of the Basic Use.
* Check apt.
* Alon -> responsible for the laptops
-> Link to "aida".
* Shlomif: talk to Edi Aronovich about the installation party in Tel Aviv.
* Each lecturer is reponsible for making sure he has a laptop for his
lecture (with Linux installed)
* Alon - install Mplayer and OpenOffice on the laptop he'll bring to the
Intro lecture.
* Alon - checks the readiness of the laptop a long time before the
lectures. (+ various possible lecturing halls)
* We decided there should be a common host in the lectures that would
introduce the lecturers and tell what the lecture is about. Orna has been
volunteered to be the host (with fallback on Orr).
* We should have laptops for all the lectures.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
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[Haifux] Re: RFC: Intro lecture
On Tue, 21 Oct 2003, Alon Altman wrote: > Hi, > > The intro lecture is available at: > http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/lectures/1/linux-intro.pdf > Please send your comments to the list. > > Alon > Some notes: 1. In the slide "Mah Zeh Ma'arekhet Hafa'ala". (page 3) "Applications that work with the OS" ==> "Applications that work above (me'al) the OS" 2. Slide 4 (What is Free Software): Ki Tamid Le'ha'atik ==> Add Efshar or Nithan. 3. Slide 5 (When did it start and why) Add commas in the second bullet. Third bullet: s/LINUX/Linux. 4. Slide 9: Replace Fontim with Gofanim? Regards, Shlomi Fish > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Announcement about the new lectures in web forums
I now have to announce the upcoming lectures ("Intro to Linux" and
"Software Development in Linux") in the various web forums. Here's the
text of the English announcement in IGLU. I'll later translate it to
Hebrew. Please voice your opinion.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
The http://www.haifux.org/";>Haifa Linux Club will start his
http://www.haifux.org/newcomers/";>Welcome to Linux series
with
two lectures: "Introduction to Linux: What is Linux and why it is good for
you?" given by Ori Idan, and "Software Development in Linux" given by
Meir Maor.
The lectures will be given twice each. The schedule is as follows:
Monday, 27/Oct - "Intro to Linux"
Wednesday, 29/Oct - "Development in Linux"
Monday, 3/Nov - "Development in Linux (re-run)
Wednesday, 5/Nov - "Intro to Linux" (re-run)
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
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[Haifux] Re: Announcement about the new lectures in web forums
On Tue, 21 Oct 2003, Maor Meir wrote:
>
>
> On Tue, 21 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote:
>
> >
> > I now have to announce the upcoming lectures ("Intro to Linux" and
> > "Software Development in Linux") in the various web forums. Here's the
> > text of the English announcement in IGLU. I'll later translate it to
> > Hebrew. Please voice your opinion.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Shlomi Fish
> >
> >
> > The http://www.haifux.org/";>Haifa Linux Club will start his
>
> I would not noramlly refer to the Haifa Linux Club using "his".
>
You are right: it should be "its" in English.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
> Meir
>
>
>
> --
> Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
> To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
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Falk Fish
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[Haifux] Re: Announcement about the new lectures in web forums
OK, since I did not receive any more input, I'll post the ad as it is, with Meir's correction. There's no time to lose. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Forums Coverage for Lectures 0-1.
This time it's better because I also was able to login and post to Walla.
iglu.org.il - check
Whatsup - check
Asat (username: shlomif) - check
Ynet (no login required) - check
Nana (no login required) - check
Tapuz (username: Shlomi Fish) - check
Walla (username: shlomif6) - check
Did I miss anything?
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
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[Haifux] Re: Forums Coverage for Lectures 0-1.
On Wed, 22 Oct 2003, guy keren wrote: > > On Wed, 22 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > iglu.org.il - check > > Whatsup - check > > Asat (username: shlomif) - check > > Ynet (no login required) - check > > Nana (no login required) - check > > Tapuz (username: Shlomi Fish) - check > > Walla (username: shlomif6) - check > > does penguin.org.il have its own linux forum? > what about linux.israel.net - does it have an active forum? > linux.israel.net seems to have an active forum and I sent an E-mail there with a post. As for penguin.org.il it has a Slahdot-like front-page, but it's quite low-volume. So many forums, so little time. Regards, Shlomi Fish > ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Problem with the Basic Use Lecture in context with RedHat 9
At:
http://vipe.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/lecture/W2L/Basic_Use/slides/console/opening.html
I say that:
<<<
To open a console window, press the screen-and-clamshell icon at the KDE
panel.
>>>
However, according to what Eli said, this icon is not placed by default
there on RedHat 9 installations, where RH9 will be installed by default
in the instaparty. So what do we do?
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
------
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
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[Haifux] Re: Schedule problems
On Sun, 26 Oct 2003, Raindel Shachar wrote: > Hi, > Due to the strike today, one of my lectures got rescheduled to tommorow, > starting at 18:30. There is a video version of the lecture, but I prefer > to go to the live lecture. If anyone can replace me as the helper in the > lecture tommorow, I will be grateful. > Hopefully, I will be able to. I'm coming with Ori. Regards, Shlomi Fish > Cheers > Shachar > > > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Re: Schedule problems
On Sun, 26 Oct 2003, Ori Idan wrote: > On Sunday 26 October 2003 12:43, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > On Sun, 26 Oct 2003, Raindel Shachar wrote: > > > Hi, > > > Due to the strike today, one of my lectures got rescheduled to > > > tommorow, starting at 18:30. There is a video version of the lecture, but > > > I prefer to go to the live lecture. If anyone can replace me as the > > > helper in the lecture tommorow, I will be grateful. > > > > Hopefully, I will be able to. I'm coming with Ori. > > > > Regards, > > > > Shlomi Fish > > > > > Cheers > > > Shachar > OK > I would like again to make sure that there is a suitable computer with mplayer > or other multimedia player, browser and OpenOffice. > You might wish to have ogle as well, because it's a very good DVD player. Regards, Shlomi Fish > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Re: Schedule problems
On Sun, 26 Oct 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote: > On Sun, 26 Oct 2003, Ori Idan wrote: > > > On Sunday 26 October 2003 12:43, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > On Sun, 26 Oct 2003, Raindel Shachar wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > Due to the strike today, one of my lectures got rescheduled to > > > > tommorow, starting at 18:30. There is a video version of the lecture, but > > > > I prefer to go to the live lecture. If anyone can replace me as the > > > > helper in the lecture tommorow, I will be grateful. > > > > > > Hopefully, I will be able to. I'm coming with Ori. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Shlomi Fish > > > > > > > Cheers > > > > Shachar > > OK > > I would like again to make sure that there is a suitable computer with mplayer > > or other multimedia player, browser and OpenOffice. > > > > You might wish to have ogle as well, because it's a very good DVD player. > Which reminds me: how do I instruct mplayer to play with sub-titles? Especially Hebrew ones. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Rewriting the tutorials in OS course (fwd)
This message lacks some essential information:
1. What's wrong with the current slides?
2. What has to be the format of the new slides?
3. What should be changed in the new slides?
4. Is there a payment involved?
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
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Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
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[Haifux] Re: Call for Lecture: X
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003, Orna Agmon wrote: > Hello Linuxers, > > Consider a lecture regarding: > > The Design and Implementation of X > > > I find the subject very interesting. > Well, I wanted to say: X-Windows... *boring*, but then thought of a few other things. 1. To read from the jargon file: <<< [after the name of an earlier window system called `W'] An over-sized, over-featured, over-engineered and incredibly over-complicated window system developed at MIT and widely used on Unix systems. >>> So it is possible that covering its implementation in its entirety would be a bit hard. 2. I think one can learn a lot about the X internals from the XLib API. This is the library that is used by all the widget libraries, and has a more or less one-to-one mapping to the X operations. During the brief time I worked with it, I found it extremely tedious to get many operations done (in regards to article #1 above). I wish I could call this process enlightening, but it was just tedious. (much more so than the Win32 API that I worked with in the past) 3. I think the X server is a single-process, single thread monolith. This is mainly because synchronizing multiple access to a single hardware graphical device is very hard. So, they just handle each transaction at a time. 4. How interesting are the algorithms behind X-Windows? Standard graphics and windowing algorithms can be found in many textbooks and simplistic ones can be invented and implemented even by quite inexperienced programmers. I think X delegates all the job of layout and typesetting into the client libraries. 5. Things that interest me: 1. Framebuffer acceleration, 3d effects, etc. and how they work. 2. Managing of fonts and internationlization. 6. X-Windows did not become the de-facto standard because it was the most superior system. Many people agreed that Sun's NeWS system for example, was better in most respects. However, X was the only system that was open source, and in fact, Digital Equipment Corporation at one time funded its development in order to squash the other competition, and to maintain one common Windowing system across all UNIX systems. A much more recent attempt to make the core X code (at X11R6.4) deviate from open source failed when the XFree86 developers said they will keep their system under the original BSD-like license, and base their work on X11R6.3. This eventually caused the X consortium to make X11 open source again. 7. For many years, the primary toolkit for writing X11 applications was Motif, which was sourceware but still proprietary and costed money. This fact has made it hard for developers to develop applications for the X Windowing System and the toolkit developed slowly. Many legacy applications are still based on Motif and as such exhibit an unusually ugly look, and inconsistency with the other desktop. Now, the toolkit world is dominated by other toolkits: Qt, Gtk+, wxWindows and the occasional FOX and Fltk. Motif can safely be declared dead and few people will miss it. Recently the OpenMotif initiative has made the source code of Motif and the binaries freely avaialable for use for open-source applications under a non-open-source-license. I don't conceive it as an attempt to revive Motif, but rather as a way to let it die gracefully. These are my thoughts of the moment. Regards, Shlomi Fish > The only question is: Who can (and wishes to) talk about this subject? > > Thanks, > Orna. > > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Ride to the Linux Day from Tel Aviv
Hi!
Is anyone coming up early in the morning to the Linux Day from Tel Aviv? I
could use a ride. I live in Ramat Aviv Gimel and so can meet at Keren
Kayemeth's junction with Haifa Road or with the Ayalon.
Please call me at 03-6424668 to synchronize a time and place.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Falk Fish
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[Haifux] Hebrew LaTeX-generated PDFs in Acrobat Reader
Hi!
Can anyone give me a step by step tutorial on how to make my Hebrew
Latex-generated PDFs not look like crap on Acrobat Reader and not have
blocks instead of the many mathematical signs?
Namely, my fonts are blurry, and there are several signs that appear as
grey blocks. I have the culmus fonts and the MS core fonts installed (and
can install other fonts) so this isn't a problem.
I'm using Mandrake 9.1, elatex and ps2pdf.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
------
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
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[Haifux] Re: Hebrew LaTeX-generated PDFs in Acrobat Reader
On Sun, 9 Nov 2003, Tzafrir Cohen wrote: > On Sun, Nov 09, 2003 at 05:40:08PM +0200, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > > Hi! > > > > Can anyone give me a step by step tutorial on how to make my Hebrew > > Latex-generated PDFs not look like crap on Acrobat Reader and not have > > blocks instead of the many mathematical signs? > > > > Namely, my fonts are blurry, and there are several signs that appear as > > grey blocks. I have the culmus fonts and the MS core fonts installed (and > > can install other fonts) so this isn't a problem. > > > > I'm using Mandrake 9.1, elatex and ps2pdf. > > 1. install ivritex from CVS , or recent snapshot from >http://iglu.org.il/pub/Hebrew/HebLatex/ > I installed the ivritex-1.2-3. By itself it did not help. Then I installed the fonts-type1-hebrew package from Mandrake 9.2. After I installed it, all the Hebrew from my documents disappeared. I get the following error: (repeatedly) kpathsea: Running mktexpk --mfmode ljfour --bdpi 8000 --mag 1+0/8000 --dpi 8000 rdavid mktexpk: don't know how to create bitmap font for rdavid. dvips: Font rdavid not found, characters will be left blank. What should I do? Regards, Shlomi Fish > Hebrew should then default to postscript fonts (Culmus), and should look > well on PDF. > > As for the rest: I don't recall, sorry. > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Hebrew LaTeX-generated PDFs in Acrobat Reader
On Mon, 10 Nov 2003, Ron Artstein wrote: > On Sun, 9 Nov 2003, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > Can anyone give me a step by step tutorial on how to make my > > Hebrew Latex-generated PDFs not look like crap on Acrobat > > Reader and not have blocks instead of the many mathematical > > signs? > > Bitmap fonts look blurry when viewed in Acrobat because it performs > a very poor job of antialiasing them (compared, say, to gv). For a > sarcastic comment about this, see: > > http://www.math.utah.edu/~beebe/fonts/outline-vs-bitmap-fonts.html > > The solution is to switch to outline fonts in PDF documents > designed for on-screen viewing (or use a different PDF viewer, > but you can't count on this if your documents are intended for > wide distribution). > > LaTeX support for the Culmus outline fonts is in the pre-release > version of IvriTeX-1.2, as Tzafrir has noted. > > Mathematical symbols appearing as blocks may be the result of a > number of factors: > > - Acrobat is set to display characters under a certain size as gray > blocks. This has nothing to do with the file, but rather with > the configuration of Acrobat: under File|Preferences|Generals, > adjust the option "Greek text below nn pixels". > Thanks, this worked. Regards, Shlomi Fish > - You may be using bitmap cm fonts; this is the default for dvips > in many distributions. There are many ways to change this, but > the easiest is running dvips with the -Ppdf switch, in which case > you normally also need the -G0 switch, as Orna has mentioned. > > - You may be using math fonts other than cm, and certain symbols > that are not available show as boxes: for example, the popular > mathptm and mathptmx packages lack some symbols such as \jmath. > If you need these symbols and still want to have Times-like > math fonts, you probably need to use the package mathtime > which as a default relies on proprietary fonts; in a teTeX > distro, see $TEXMF/doc/fonts/belleek/README for instructions > on how to configure your system to use the free belleek fonts > instead, which are a suitable replacement. > > -Ron. > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Linux source code
On Thu, 20 Nov 2003, Yehuda Zadik wrote: > Hi > > RH provides SRPM to anything it releases, it's called a source CDs. > the SRPM contains the source code for Linux. > Do we have the SRPM in the CDs we bought > in the installation party ? > No, the SRPM CDs were not burned or supplied there. (just the regular binary packages). You can download them from the Net if you want. Regards, Shlomi Fish > Best regards > Yehuda Zadik > 054-530938 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Linux source code
On Thu, 20 Nov 2003, Eli Billauer wrote: > Hello, > > It's quite weird that the Linux source would not be in the three > "normal" CDs. Source or not, it's a mainstream part of the distro. > Eli: he was talking about the source to the entire GNU/Linux operating system with all of its components, not just to the source of the Linux kernel. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Una Pregunta Peqnia (One little question)
On Tue, 25 Nov 2003, Orr Dunkelman wrote: > > Iorsh Maxim, the "developer" of the culmus fonts, has agreed to give a > lecture regarding culmus. > > He asked me what kind of questions you want him to answer, or what might > interest you about this. > > Please send Iorsh your input. > I'll send it here: 1. The legal status of the culmus fonts - design patents their implications, etc. 2. How were the fonts designed? With what tools, etc. 3. The Culmus Fonts are Licensed under the GPL. Why did you choose this license for them? What are its implications on creating documents and artwork using them? (especially if they are proprietary). Why did you choose a license suitable for source code for a fonts package? 4. Can the Culmus fonts be converted to True Type to be used by Windows and other TTF enabled programs somehow? These are the things off the top of my head. Maybe I'll think of more later. BTW, thanks for a great contribution! My LaTeX files now look much nicer and also render as an Acrobat Reader-friendly PDF. Open Office is happy, too... ;-) Yishar Kohekha! Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Ride from Haifa to Tel Aviv
Hi!
Is anybody who is coming to the club meeting tomorrow, can give me a ride
back to Tel-Aviv? (or somewhere along Kvish Ha'huf?)
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
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[Haifux] Web Forums Coverage
Hi! I was responsible for doing the web forums coverage this year. I can say it was a tedious job as many forums had various quirks and were not so easy to handle. Every forum has its own format, and so I ended up opting to write a one-size-fit-all HTML that rendered on all them, but sub-optimally. I was wondering what are we planning to do about it next year? Will I still be in charge? Also should I send announcements for the Staying in Linux series as well? Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: New haifux site
On Fri, 19 Dec 2003, Orna Agmon wrote:
> On Fri, 19 Dec 2003, Alon Altman wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 19 Dec 2003, Orna Agmon wrote:
> >
> > > Hello Haifuxers,
> > >
> > > I am proud to present the new haifux site, located as (almost) always at:
> > > http://www.haifux.org
> > >
> > > "haifux: about the making of the movie" can be found in
> > > http://www.haifux.org/about.html
> > > where all the site scripts are documented and linked.
> > >
> > > Note that the site has a blank box at the top, waiting for a logo- so far,
> > > no suggestions :(
> > >
> > > Comments and advices are welcome, as always.
> >
> > My suggestions:
> > 1. There is too little space from the top of the page, which makes the pages
> >look too crowded. I suggest adding 1em top margin for the body element
> >(instead of the "margin: 0" you currently have there). A small left
> >margin could also help.
>
> adding margin : 1.0em in the body makes the whole page have boundaries,
> which looks silly on the bar on the left (the color detaches from the
> side). How can I do that for just one table cell? (in td.main class)
>
You can say:
.main { margin-top : 1.0em }
Or whatever.
> > 2. I was upset to see that the new site uses tables-based layout. See the
> >example from the W2L site on how to make a static sidebar using pure CSS.
>
> Why is it better?
>
Not to start a religious war here, but I personally find nothing wrong in
table based layouts. Most of them are even very accessible to people with
disabilities. (as I was told).
When using CSS layout, I sometimes have to work very to get the design I
want and even that is suboptimal. Implementing a navigation bar using a
table is not a big deal.
> > 3. The source directories don't have read permssion, thus causing dead links
> >from the about page.
> They have read permissions. What they do not have is an index.html inside
> them, so the http server does not allow browsing them. How do we change
> that, and who can change that? I think it has with apache configuration
> more than with site design.
>
In .htaccess put:
<<<
Options Indexes
>>>
That is assuming Apache allows you to change this particular configuration
in the .htaccess there. Else you'll need access to the main Apache
configuration file.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
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To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: New haifux site
On Fri, 19 Dec 2003, Orna Agmon wrote:
> > > > My suggestions:
> > > > 1. There is too little space from the top of the page, which makes the pages
> > > >look too crowded. I suggest adding 1em top margin for the body element
> > > >(instead of the "margin: 0" you currently have there). A small left
> > > >margin could also help.
> > >
> > > adding margin : 1.0em in the body makes the whole page have boundaries,
> > > which looks silly on the bar on the left (the color detaches from the
> > > side). How can I do that for just one table cell? (in td.main class)
> > >
> >
> > You can say:
> >
> > .main { margin-top : 1.0em }
>
> It has no effect, as far as I can see (mozilla 1.5).
>
Sorry, my mistake. That should be:
.main { padding-top: 1.0em; }
I also added
.pinmenu { padding : 0.5em }
which makes it look nicer.
> > > > 3. The source directories don't have read permssion, thus causing dead links
> > > >from the about page.
> > > They have read permissions. What they do not have is an index.html inside
> > > them, so the http server does not allow browsing them. How do we change
> > > that, and who can change that? I think it has with apache configuration
> > > more than with site design.
> > >
> >
> > In .htaccess put:
> >
> > <<<
> > Options Indexes
> > >>>
> >
> > That is assuming Apache allows you to change this particular configuration
> > in the .htaccess there. Else you'll need access to the main Apache
> > configuration file.
>
> I tried putting it both in the main directory, and in its subdirs, and got
> no effect. any of the vipe admins?
>
Then probably they forbidden people from overriding it. So, you'll need
access to the main page.
> And another question: Originally, as some of you may have noticed, these
> scripts and css were built for syscalltrack's site. There, Shlomi defined
> the standard as XHTML 1. I am using html4.01 transitional now. Which one
> would we like haifux.org to support?
>
Well XHTML 1.0 is essentially HTML 4.01 only modelled around an XML
foundation. See:
http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/#diffs
As being XML it can be more easily parsed and processed, and there are
also some common mistakes that can be prevented using its stricter syntax.
Thus, I like it better. There is a slight possibility that XHTML will not
be understood correctly by older browsers, but this is the case for any
page with CSS, anyhow.
Both XHTML 1.0 and HTML 4.01 come in Strict and Transitional modes.
Transitional has more visual HTML attributes available. I use XHTML 1.0
Strict for all my sites.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
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[Haifux] Re: Suggestions for part 2 of SiL#1
On Tue, 23 Dec 2003, Orna Agmon wrote: > On Tue, 23 Dec 2003, Alon Altman wrote: > > > Hi, > > Now that the SiL#1 lecture was split into two, we can add more material to > > the lecture. Here are my suggestions. > > > > I think the following things should be added to the lecture: > >- umask > >- sTicky bit > >- a bit more on symbolic links (what happens when you delete the link > > target, etc.) > > Alos, whar are the meanings of the colors ls produces- a link to such a > table or soemthing (we don't need to study colors by heart, except for > red=don't walk :) ) > Well, three notes are in order: 1. The exact colors are user configurable (via the LS_COLORS env var or otherwise) and may vary from distribution to distribution or from system to system. 2. ls can color files which match a certain glob in different colors, like *.zip or *.gz. This is a coloring that is only a convenience and does not indicate that the file is special in any way. (it may also not belong to its correct type). 3. colors can be misleading. For example, on my Mandrake system, all files ending with .sh are colored green (which is the same color for exacutables) even if they are not executable. I remember trying to execute a shell script I prepared because I saw its color was green (./upload.sh) only to discover it was not executable as far as its permissions were concerned. Regards, Shlomi Fish > And I think the left slides plus what alon wrote upto this point would > fill a lecture completely. > > plus, anyone who has not heard the Hanukah story guy told us lost :) > > > > > If there is time: > >- hard links > >- device files > >- chroot > > > > Alon > > > > > > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two doctors away. Falk Fish -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: New haifux site
On Wed, 24 Dec 2003, Orna Agmon wrote:
> On Wed, 24 Dec 2003, Ron Artstein wrote:
>
> > > I am proud to present the new haifux site, located as (almost)
> > > always at: http://www.haifux.org
> >
> > Three comments:
> >
> > 1. The link to the mailing list archives stops in early
> >April 2003; the traffic since then is archived at
> >http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
> >A link is needed.
> >
> > 2. Links to future lectures are not prominent enough. It is
> >not obvious that the sidebar link "Lectures - Dates and
> >Slides" refers to future lectures, I suggest rephrasing
> >it to something like "upcoming lectures". And on the home
> >page, elevate the "future lectures" link from the position
> >it's currently buried at by making it into a heading (I'm
> >not sure which level is appropriate), and placing it right
> >after the next meeting.
> >
> > 3. The lecture tables render terribly in lynx, because of the
> >use of the tag to center-align cells. I believe that
> >align=center as an attribute of is standard html 4.01
> >(strict), so it should be used instead.
> >
> > -Ron.
> >
>
> The first two points I just did. The last point I found a bit harder, so I
> wrote a script to replace regular expressions in multiple files while
> asking for confirmation each time. The perl script is at
>
> http://www.haifux.org/source/reg.pl
>
> I wonder, was there a really easy was to do this, and I am the only one
> who writes scripts for such things?
>
First of all, you are not alone - we all write scripts to do such global
manipulations, albeit msot of my scripts so far were not interactive.
Scripts like that can be written using regexps, or in the case of HTML
using the Perl HTML::Parser module. In the case it's XML, or XHTML (which
is HTML that is valid XML), you can do such manipulations using an XML
Parser, and some XML processing. This is generally easier than most HTML
processing because XML is guaranteed to be well-formed.
Now, a better idea of course is to avoid such patterns, a priori. What my
script does is that the user maintains relational database tables with
meta-information that specifies the content of the pages. The rendering of
the cells and the entire table is done at the procesor, which adds the
relevant markup.
It's not perfect as there is still HTML markup in the tables. (mainly
for the contents of the comments cell) But I suppose it can be abstracted
away if the need arises.
Back to our case, I believe that using the "{text-align : center}" CSS
rule would have been preferable to the align="center" tag. You can do it
by deisgnating the class of the cells differently. I.e:
And in the stylesheet:
.c { text-align : center}
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
> Orna.
>
> p.s.
> Indeed lynx now renders the tables a lot better. Thanks Ron!
>
> --
> Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
> To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
An apple a day will keep a doctor away. Two apples a day will keep two
doctors away.
Falk Fish
--
Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
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[Haifux] Re: Kdevelop
On Fri, 26 Dec 2003, Orna Agmon wrote: > On Fri, 26 Dec 2003, Yehuda Tzadik wrote: > > If the last thing has made you discover you do not have kdevelop, you can > search for the rpm, (Red Had Package, don't know what the M stands for), Actually RPM stands for "RPM Package Manager" (a recursive acronym): http://www.rpm.org/ Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Favour: Being Guine Pigs for my "Template Toolkit" Lecture
Hi good people! I know it's a short notice, but I prepared a presentation about the "Template Toolkit" (a Perl framework for text templates): http://www.iglu.org.il/shlomif/lecture/Template-Toolkit/ It's a 5-minutes long lightning talk, and I'd like to test it on some audience before the final presentation at YAPC::Israel::2004 (YAPC == Yet Another Perl Conference). Can I do it, either before or after Orr's lecture this Monday? Please voice your opinion. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Favour: Being Guine Pigs for my "Template Toolkit" Lecture
On Sat, 27 Dec 2003, Orna Agmon wrote: > On Sat, 27 Dec 2003, Eli Billauer wrote: > > > Having been at the previous YAPC, I think that *after* the lecture would > > a more realistic simulation, especially regardnig people's patience > > during lightning sessions. In addition, this assure that this little > > drill won't be forced on anyone. > > > > Eli > > Sounds like a good idea to me. 5 minutes, after Orr is done. Possibly a > feedback session afterwards, if shlomi wants it? > Yes, a feedback session would be very helpful. Note that someone will need to prepare me a working copy of OpenOffice 1.1.x. I could export it to PowerPoint, but I'm not sure the export works perfectly. Via VNC would be fine. Regards, Shlomi Fish > > > > Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > > >Hi good people! > > > > > >I know it's a short notice, but I prepared a presentation about the > > >"Template Toolkit" (a Perl framework for text templates): > > > > > >http://www.iglu.org.il/shlomif/lecture/Template-Toolkit/ > > > > > >It's a 5-minutes long lightning talk, and I'd like to test it on some > > >audience before the final presentation at YAPC::Israel::2004 (YAPC == Yet > > >Another Perl Conference). > > > > > >Can I do it, either before or after Orr's lecture this Monday? Please > > >voice your opinion. > > > > > >Regards, > > > > > > Shlomi Fish > > > > > >-- > > >Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ > > > > > >You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! > > > > > >Hey? I'm just kidding! > > > > > >-- > > >Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > > >To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: sms in israel
On Wed, 31 Dec 2003, Nadav Har'El wrote: > On Tue, Dec 30, 2003, Gustavo Halperin wrote about "Re: [Haifux] sms in israel": > > The script does not find the file "Encode.pm", that is in the directory > > usr/share/perl5/Mail/Message/Body/ > > It appears that the Encode stuff is perhaps available only in Perl 5.8, and > I wasn't aware of that. Feel free to remove the line containing decode/encode, > at worst you'll lose the ability to send Hebrew messages to Cellcom and > Pelephone. > It is actually possible to try to load Encode and if it fails, just perform something else or define a decode/encode function that does nothing. I'm a bit hazy on the exact syntax, but it can be found with some RTFMing, STFWing or simply asking. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: slides for monday's 'kernel, modules, drivers' lecture
On Mon, 19 Jan 2004, Muli Ben-Yehuda wrote: > On Mon, Jan 19, 2004 at 02:37:28PM +0200, guy keren wrote: > > > > - the capitalization of Kernel, Driver and Hardware is a bit > > > jarring. Same thing for all other slides. > > > > i want the terms discussed in the lecture to Stand Out, in the > > least-intrusive possible manner. > > Then make them bold, or italic, or even _like this_. Capitalizing > inappropriate Words Makes it Look silly. > I second that. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: [HAIFUX LECTURE] Eran Sandler on The Mono Project
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004, Orna Agmon wrote: > Staying in Linux - How to Install a New Driver (cont) > by guy keren on 2/2/04 > Linux Device Drivers - 9/2/2004 > Staying in Linux - Multimedia in Linuxby Alon Altman on 16/2/04 > Multilingual TeX by Ron Artstein 23/2/04 > Staying in Linux - Shell by Orna Agmon 1/3/2004 > Staying in Linux - CVS by Tzahi Fadida on 15/3/2004 > Culmus and fonts by Maxim Iorsh on 22/3/2004 > Ingo Molnar's O(1) scheduler by Erez Hadad on 19/4/2004 > Staying in Linux - Firewall with IPtables by Adir Abraham 3/5/04 > Firewall with IPtables by Adir Abraham 10/5/04 > Web hacking for fun and profit Alon Altman 17/5/2004 > Linux kernel 2.6 by Muli Ben-Yehuda 7/6/04 > User Mode Linux by Muli Ben-Yehuda 21/6/04 > Pardon my query, but why do we need so many more Staying in Linux lectures? What are we trying to achieve with them, precisely? It's bad enough that we had the W2L series with dwindling attendance, now we have to have the SiL for the rest of the year. The best way to learn about Linux and to stay there, is by experimenting on your own, and reading web resources. People who've been to the W2L series can post messages to the mailing list or other resources asking for questions and people can answer them. Other than that, I don't think we need to guide them by the hand from now until infinity. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: [HAIFUX LECTURE] Eran Sandler on The Mono Project
That put aside, I don't think I understand the division between the SiL lectures and the regular lectures: Up to shell everything is fine. Then CVS, why does it has to be in SiL? Then "Trust and Open Source" - again, why in SiL? Afterwards Adir has two "Firweall with IP-Tables" lectures - one of them SiL and the others not. Then we have an SiL open slot - why do we need it? Isn't SiL going to end sometime? Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: SIL lectures
On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, Orna Agmon wrote: > Regarding all question about the Staying in Linux Lectures, aka SiL: > > Guy started the SiL with three incredibly useful topics: > > 1.Users, groups, persmissions. > 2.Drivers, modules, kernel. > 3.Multimedia. > > Then a forth was added: > 4.Shell. > > The problem of W2L is that it takes place every week, and since most > Haifux members do not come to W2L, and most of them learn nothing new in > W2L, I call this time "the W2L drought". > > Since the SiL lectures take place only every two weeks, this does not hurt > the regular Haifux lectures, which are still given every two weeks. > > Usually, during a regular Haifux lecture, we go over the material rather > quickly. For example, compare the lectures we had regarding python, lambda > calculus, php, to your first programming language course, if you had any: > we cover the material fast, not aiming to teach everything, but to have an > intro, to get the concept, and go back to the manual if needed. To get > exposed to new subjects. In short, we assume a rather > high common denominator of knowledge, in order to make those regular > Haifux lectures interesting. > > Even in the W2L lectures we go fast over the material, for another reason: > we want to squeeze 6-8 lectures in the time between the beginning of the > semester and the mid-term exams. Again: we run fast over the material. > > In the SiL lectures, following the great example Guy gave at the > lectures he has so far given, we go slow. We give examples. we make it > possible to learn frontally. In short, instead of "going over the > material", we teach. Also, we go in the beginning over material that is > basic Linux, but for lack of time does not get into the W2L. > > We assume no prior knowledge. Hence, it makes it possible for people who > only heard the W2L, to join Haifux at an easy rate. > > If you do not like the SiL, you can just ignore it: regular (advanced) > Haifux lectures are still given at a two-weeks interval. > > If you like a SiL topic, you can simply come - everyone is invited. As > guy's drivers lecture showed, many regular Haifux members (veterans) came > to hear it. > > > On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, Shlomi Fish > wrote: > > > > > That put aside, I don't think I understand the division between the SiL > > lectures and the regular lectures: > > > > Up to shell everything is fine. > > > > Then CVS, why does it has to be in SiL? > > > > Then "Trust and Open Source" - again, why in SiL? > > because it requires no prior knowledge. I don't think that lectures that do not require any prior knowledge must automagically be placed in SiL. Lectures that are of interest to the club's at large should be proper lectures regardless of the knowledge they require. Otherwise, the newcomers will be confused and will think they need to attend these lectures. I don't think we should teach newcomers about CVS, so there's no reason to put it there. Likewise, "Trust and Open Source" is of interest to the club at large so it should be on the proper lectures. You're overduing it with the SiL series. > > > > Afterwards Adir has two "Firweall with IP-Tables" lectures - one of them > > SiL and the others not. > > > > The first is intro - no prior knowledge. The next one requires prior > knowledge or hearing the first one. people with less background can listen > to both of them, while people with more background may skip the first one. > Then please designate them as part I, and part II. I personally think that we can simply assume that some proper Haifux lectures will require little or no prior knowledge, so we don't need to stretch the SiL series beyond the Shell lecture. Instead, we can have more lectures on our queue. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: SIL lectures
On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, Orna Agmon wrote: > On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > > I don't think that lectures that do not require any prior knowledge must > > automagically be placed in SiL. Lectures that are of interest to the > > club's at large should be proper lectures regardless of the knowledge they > > require. Otherwise, the newcomers will be confused and will think they > > need to attend these lectures. > > As you may have noticed, the SiL lectures, which were numbered as SiL-1, > SiL-2 etc. before, are now numbered as club lectures. The SiL indication > next to the number simply says that people who took the W2L will not feel > akward in them, and that they are of a slower rate. > Then you might as well label or comment them as beginner-friendly, or whatever. There's no reason to call them by the illegible SiL next to them, especially that "Staying in Linux" was meant to be an ad-hoc series to complement W2L. > > > > I don't think we should teach newcomers about CVS, so there's no reason to > > put it there. Likewise, "Trust and Open Source" is of interest to the club > > at large so it should be on the proper lectures. > > > > As I said, the SiL lectures are available to everybody. Regarding CVS, I > think everybody who does not have a good version control tool, should have > one, no matter their experiance. CVS _is not_ a good version control tool. ;-) > It is not a question of "need to know", > this is not the intelligence force. It is a question of "has the proper > background to follow the lecture". > OK. > > You're overduing it with the SiL series. > > > > > > > > > > Afterwards Adir has two "Firweall with IP-Tables" lectures - one of them > > > > SiL and the others not. > > > > > > > > > > The first is intro - no prior knowledge. The next one requires prior > > > knowledge or hearing the first one. people with less background can listen > > > to both of them, while people with more background may skip the first one. > > > > > > > Then please designate them as part I, and part II. I personally think that > > we can simply assume that some proper Haifux lectures will require little > > or no prior knowledge, so we don't need to stretch the SiL series beyond > > the Shell lecture. Instead, we can have more lectures on our queue. > > > > Have you checked the queue lately? We are almost full till the next W2L. > Doesn't the next W2L start at October or November. We only have a queue until June. But never mind. > > Regards, > > > > Shlomi Fish > > > > -- > > Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ > > > > You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! > > > > Hey? I'm just kidding! > > > > And please have a proper signature at last. Every time I answer you (this > is the fifth today, I think) I have > to trim your signature. I did not do it this time to show you how it > looks, in case you have not noticed. > I don't mind people quoting the signature. (I do many time). And I dislike dash-dash-space signatures for these reasons: 1. You cannot quote them in many mailers. 2. If you forward a mail with the signature at the beginning and forget to remove the signature, then the answerer cannot quote the forwarded message. (which is highly annoying) If it bothers you so much, you can have a procmail rule to remove it manually. Shouldn't be too hard to write using sed or whatever. > You know the standard:dash dash space and then no more than four lines. > Then the mail qlient trims it itself. See also (In your favorate CatB > site): > > http://www.catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/M/McQuary-limit.html > It reads: <<< Accordingly, the McQuary limit should be considered a rule of thumb rather than a hard limit; >>> Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Why SiL (Was: Eran Sandler on The Mono Project)
OK, let me take back what I said and address different issues.
My problem with SiL is two fold:
1. That we now have perfectly good club lectures as part of this SiL
scheme, which is very confusing. (sometimes even the first part as part of
the SiL, and the second part as part of the regular meetings).
We held lectures that were friendly to beginners before, and we didn't
call them SiL or anything. As far as I can tell, the SiL was supposed to
be a _short_, _ad-hoc_ series to complement the W2L one.
2. That we now meet once per week, and on odd weeks we could have lectures
that would interest the club members proper. (like CVS or shell). We
agreed we are not going to meet once per week.
So, to sum up if you want to designate a lecture as a newbie-friendly,
just do so, while scheduling them sometimes on our bi-weekly schedule.
Don't stretch this SiL too far.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
------
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[Haifux] Re: Acks on logo votes
Hi! I prefer logo 4 to logo 6 to the rest. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Acks on logo votes
On Tue, 27 Jan 2004, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > Hi! > > I prefer logo 4 to logo 6 to the rest. > Oops! Replied to all by accident - sorry. Regards, Shlomi Fish > Regards, > > Shlomi Fish > > > > ------ > Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ > > You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! > > Hey? I'm just kidding! > > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] InstaParty Thought - Buy/Receive the CD or Bust
Hi all!
I think that in future installation parties we should simply mandate that
people who wish to install their systems will either:
1. Buy a set of CDs from us.
2. Bring one from home, so we can install it for them.
3. Wouldn't mind downloading extra packages from the Internet using urpmi,
apt, yum, or whatever.
This will make sure we can install a minimal or default system which will
take less time, and will cause us less aggravations. It will also be good
for the installees because they will be able to customize their system
and install missing components, a posteriori.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
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[Haifux] Re: InstaParty Thought - Buy/Receive the CD or Bust
On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Ez-Aton wrote: > time==money. > Installing customizable setup means every desktop is to pass a whole series of > adding/removing packages, according to the client's wishes. I did not say we are going to use custmizable setup (how on earth did you decide I said that from my message). I said we are going to use default/minimal setup and give them the CDs. Given that, your entire message is moot. And installing 5GB takes a lot of time as we all witnessed during the last Installation Party. I don't want to do it again. BTW, my friend who is a newbie, had installed RedHat 9.0 on his own. The Internet works, but otherwise he has tons of trouble and thing don't work. I suggest we never install RedHat/Fedore again. Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: InstaParty Thought - Buy/Receive the CD or Bust
On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Adir Abraham wrote: > We've already discussed most of the issues, but let's have a reminder. > > On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > Hi all! > > > > I think that in future installation parties we should simply mandate that > > people who wish to install their systems will either: > > > > 1. Buy a set of CDs from us. > > They already do it. However, they don't have to do it. > Right, and I want them to have to do it, so it will simplify matters for us. > > 2. Bring one from home, so we can install it for them. > > Bringing one from home is no good, unless they bring the exact > distribution(s) that we support. We can't do a "choose your distribution" > party because it will cause a mess, unless someone really wants to try > controlling anarchy. It won't happen in the regular instaparties that we have. > Eifhr. > > 3. Wouldn't mind downloading extra packages from the Internet using urpmi, > > apt, yum, or whatever. > > You assume that the person: 1) will know how to update (including all > sorts of dependancies). 2) will bother to update. 3) has fast connection to > the Internet. No, it's not a good idea. > Yes, it is. There were a few updates for RedHat 9.0 since the last instaparty, and if the people who installed the computers did not update, there systems are vulnerable now. We can't escape the fact that we cannot leave the newcomers at a clueless stage. Cluelessness doesn't work when dealing with computers. > > This will make sure we can install a minimal or default system which will > > take less time, and will cause us less aggravations. It will also be good > > for the installees because they will be able to customize their system > > and install missing components, a posteriori. > > They will not want to install missing components.. You assume that they > know how to install, and you assume that they want to install. You don't > understand that WE are the ones who need to give the kickstarts (in > addition to lectures, etc). Because if they could do all that, we wouldn't > be needed. Fact is, that the instaparties are needed, and people still > need them to ask questions and install Linux. Our mission is to give them > a wide-use machine, working with Linux. > We have to teach them how to install stuff on their own! Many people are able to install stuff for Windows as well, as a pristine Windows machine does not come with all the required components. (it doesn't come up with anything that isn't Microsoft). Installing things is not so hard. Regards, Shlomi Fish > > > > Regards, > > > > Shlomi Fish > > > > > > > > -- > > Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ > > > > You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! > > > > Hey? I'm just kidding! > > > > -- > > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Re: InstaParty Thought - Buy/Receive the CD or Bust
On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Adir Abraham wrote: > On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > decide I said that from my message). I said we are going to use > > default/minimal setup and give them the CDs. > > The default should have many applications inside. We can't, and we > shouldn't give the installee a minimal installation (unless we don't have > another choice. For instance - storage reasons, or he knows in advance > that it's going to be a server. In this case, we might want to minimize > the installation). The installee should have a machine with many applications > that we can use. He'll get a fully installed desktop machine, and from there > (after some reading), he can choose what he likes to do with it. > > > Given that, your entire message is moot. And installing 5GB takes a lot of > > time as we all witnessed during the last Installation Party. I don't want > > to do it again. > > In average, it takes about a hour to start and finish a full installation > on a Celeron or Duron machine @ 1200MHz (I did those checks before the > instaparty and I had the pleasure to install to such a machine in the > instaparty itself). Ofcourse - if we don't have any special problems > during the installation itself (hardware mismatch and other weird > problems), and it goes smooth. You can conclude what happens with faster > machines or those that include rich hardware features. I also assume that > we'll have faster machines next year, so it will not take more than 40 > minutes in average. So, 5GB doesn't sound so big, anymore. > Some installations I've been at took several hours, (seriously), as they were on underpowered computers. The updating of the updates also took forever. And it barely fit on the hard-disk and filled in the partition with zsh and other useless software. Even one hour may be too long. > > BTW, my friend who is a newbie, had installed RedHat 9.0 on his own. The > > Internet works, but otherwise he has tons of trouble and thing don't work. > > I suggest we never install RedHat/Fedore again. > > RedHat 9.0 had many problems, I agree. But from that, going so far to > "never install RedHat/Fedore again" ?! > Mandrake is a much superior distribution to RedHat. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Re: InstaParty Thought - Buy/Receive the CD or Bust
On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Ez-Aton wrote: > ago, when MDK8.2 failed to install Lilo after failed X test. I had to write > manually (running rescue mode) the /etc/lilo.conf file, and to hope for the > best, as well as setup all kinds of post install scripts and actions, > manually. It happened on too many computers. It's a stupid claim, and it has > no basis, therefore, I did not claim the same. MDK9.2 had few troubles (esp. > regarding Heb interface, but not only), and we voted agains installing it. > One could come up with the claim "We should install MDK next time, and never > install RH based distro (not to mention that after all, MDK is based on > RH...), but this claimer does not know what could have happened if we > actually did install MDK. Also, nice claim, but I never actually used MDK > KickStart mechanism, and during an instaparty, is not the best time for the > first run. It might work, it might fail. Then can you please do us all a favour and use the Mandrake KickStart mechanism for the first few times? So we'll be better prepared for the next installation party? Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Re: InstaParty Thought - Buy/Receive the CD or Bust
On Sun, 1 Feb 2004, Oron Peled wrote: > On Sunday 01 February 2004 11:18, Adir Abraham wrote: > > [a lot of valid points] > > ... You can conclude what happens with faster > > machines or those that include rich hardware features. I also assume that > > we'll have faster machines next year, so it will not take more than 40 > > minutes in average. > > Just adjusting some over-optimism: installation is very I/O bounded, and > disk speed is advancing very slow (comparing to Moore's law for CPU). > > So unless next year you'll have everybody with SCSI disks, you won't > see a lot of speedup. > > Still, I completely agree that the ~5GB full install is a wise decision in > the context of install parties to newbies who would have hard time > adding software. Worse, the typical newbie would assume that > if some 'Z' software isn't on her system -- than Linux doesn't have 'Z' > at all (actually, if an icon for 'Z' isn't on the menu than Linux doesn't > have 'Z' software :-) > That's quite unlikely. If people see that 'Z' is not available on Windows, they don't assume that Windows does not have 'Z' at all. They go to the Internet and find it. We can assume this will be the case for Linux as well. The best thing we can do is explain them how they can install more software, update their system, etc. Otherwise: 1. They eventually will find something that isn't on Linux, and won't know what to do. 2. They will cause their system to become vulnerable eventually. (unless we assume that absolutely no security bugs will be discovered from the time we install it until infinity). Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Re: InstaParty Thought - Buy/Receive the CD or Bust
On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, Adir Abraham wrote: > On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, Shlomi Fish wrote: > > > > > 1. Buy a set of CDs from us. > > > > > > They already do it. However, they don't have to do it. > > > > > > > Right, and I want them to have to do it, so it will simplify matters for > > us. > > Hmm.. You can't force anyone to buy CDs. Once you do it, you will miss the > whole point of "free" (it's like forcing someone to buy an "entrance > ticket" to a free event). > It's free as in speech not free as in beer. Either we burn enough CDs to give to anyone on our own expense, or tell them that either they buy CDs, download stuf over an Internet, or simply be content with what they'll get on their system. > > Eifhr. > > ?! (should I google this?) > Sorry, I meant to say "Right" but my hand was one key to the left on the keyboard. > > > You assume that the person: 1) will know how to update (including all > > > sorts of dependancies). 2) will bother to update. 3) has fast connection to > > > the Internet. No, it's not a good idea. > > > > > > > Yes, it is. There were a few updates for RedHat 9.0 since the last > > instaparty, and if the people who installed the computers did not update, > > there systems are vulnerable now. We can't escape the fact that we cannot > > leave the newcomers at a clueless stage. Cluelessness doesn't work when > > dealing with computers. > > People do not think of maintenance, usually. The "simple user" will not > think of updates. Not too soon, whatsoever. He might even wait for the > next instaparty to occur. People do not think neither care of "vulnerable > systems" (fact, but true). Since no viruses are involved, other security > issues might not interest him (expolits and others). > Cluelessness is the default when one uses a computer with a new OS. You > install to such a person the new OS and from there he would like to have a > working system. He can RTFM and do other things with it - but he doesn't > have to. > So you're saying: fine! Let's install a system that can be eventually exploited for crackers to gain access on the machine and do all kinds of nasty stuff there. Fine, let's not educate people that they need to be responsible and clueful when using a computer. Sorry, but it doesn't work in the long run. It will be bad for them and will be bad for us. -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Re: Re: InstaParty Thought - Buy/Receive the CD or Bust
On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, Ez-Aton wrote: > Some people do, some people talk. Don't forget. > Would *you* test mass deployment of Mandrake, as you say with such a clear > voice RH sux, and Mandrake rulez. Sure, but I'll need some computers to test it on, as my father would kill me if I test it with our own computers. > Grow up. Mandrake is better in some things, and RH is better on others. Wrong! Mandrake is superior to RedHat in any way, but let's not get into it. (except for bugs that occur in both randomly). Regards, Shlomi Fish ------ Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: InstaParty Thought - Buy/Receive the CD or Bust
On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, Ez-Aton wrote: > > > Some people do, some people talk. Don't forget. > > > Would *you* test mass deployment of Mandrake, as you say with such a > > > clear voice RH sux, and Mandrake rulez. > > > > Sure, but I'll need some computers to test it on, as my father would kill > > me if I test it with our own computers. > > That's your problem, not mine. > You like mandrake, you test and setup "Mass Deployment". > Sorry, but it's _our_ problem. If we can't install Mandrake we are stuck with the sub-standard Fedora. We're all in the same boat here. Can anyone give me a couple of computers where I can test-drive KickStart for Mandrake? Regards, Shlomi Fish > Ez. > > > -- > Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) > To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Haifux] Re: Why is Haifux a Linux and not a GNU/Linux club?
Caveat Emptor: these are my opinions and not the "official" opinions of the club. Feel free to disagree. On Fri, 6 Feb 2004, Yoni Rabkin Katzenell wrote: > > First let me say that I like the new Web site very much. It does my > heart good to see valid HTML in a well structured Web site. > Thanks! > Now on to my questions: > > Why is Haifux called a Linux club and not a GNU/Linux club? > Well, Haifa Linux Club sounds much better than Haifa GNU/Linux Club. I don't think it is wrong to call a Linux system a "Linux system" and not a "GNU/Linux system. It's shorter, and everyone will know what you mean. GNU/Linux is longer, for no particularly good reason, and so makes little sense in common use. (some people would even pronounce it gee-en-you-slash-lee-nox. - oh the humanity!). I don't have anything against using the term "GNU/Linux". Sometimes I use it to say that I want a nice Linux system with everything installed instead of something that has the kernel and nothing besides. But I don't use it consistently where appropriate. > What is Haifux's official stance on software licenses? Are we just going > with the flow or should we take a stance and say "We at Haifux believe > that software licensed under the GNU/GPL and compatible licenses promote > collaboration, cooperation and the advancement of software development > both for the individual and the software industry."? > I hold the opinion that writing any sofware for any purpose is highly moral (as all software like that can be written) and just its use may be contreversial. I think most software in the world if distributed to the public, used in Embedded systems, etc. increases the well-being of the world. I like GNU/Linux better because it's superior than Windows. Technically. I also prefer free software over non-free software because I can better rely on it available and because I can only blame myself if it doesn't work right, because the code is available for me to fix. Otherwise, I have used proprietary software in the past, am using it now (including to write this E-mail) and may use such that seem nice or interesting, or useful. Some commercial software is much superior than any of its open source equivalents, and some software has such a small market that it is not of the public interest to produce an open source equivalent. And some proprietary software is just very nice and convenient. As for the GPL vs. other free software licenses: when contributing to a GPLed program, I kept my patches as GPLed. (naturally). For my own progams I have consistently used public-domain licenses. (like MIT X11). I used to be flavourgusted from the GPL complexity and mock it in any way I could. Now I realize it is important to make sure some software remains free and not abused. (and many very large commercial entities like IBM, HP, Sun, and even non-IT companies that actively use GNU/Linux agree with me). I can tell you of one project where if I used GPL, it would have made it dead-on-arrival, and I'm glad I used the public domain. The mileage of other members here may vary, and we are not going to enforce a public opinion on everybody. (we are not GPL nazis). > Was there a vote taken some time in the past? Did people decide to go > the OSI way? If so why is there no link to the OSI's web page. > Links.. links. I think we should have much more links, but of course someone has to take the time and send the patch. > I was quite surprised to find that the site does not even contain a link > to www.gnu.org, not even in the "Linux Links" section. > :-) > Is this they way we want people curious about Linux to go? Why should we > keep them ignorant of the history and the licenses that make > collaboration possible? If not to actively support the FSF with words on > the site and with the group's official title, then at least we can give > a single HTML link to their site. > I will gladly link to the Free Software Foundation. I think we definetly should. However, I'd also like a link to the Open Source Initiative, because they are also an integral part of the Free and Open Source Software culture. We could also use many other links. (but not too many, because too many links are confusing) Nevertheless, Haifux is not an arm of the FSF, and does not represent its causes. Some of our members do agree with some of these opinions. Some of our members just use Linux because it works and do not care too much about its ideology. The last thing I want is some kind of FSF-like draconian homogenia. > BTW I've donned my asbestos body armor prior to posting so feel free to > flame me to a crisp. My FSF associate membership card (#1250) will > protect me! > Heh heh. My "in-for-free-beer-and-just-someone-who-prefers-
[Haifux] Re: Why is Haifux a Linux and not a GNU/Linux club?
On Sat, 7 Feb 2004, Maor Meir wrote:
>
> I think ideology is important and we shold try to say something about it
> I also have noticed that by looking over past lectures they fit the title
> Free Software much better than the title Linux (Linux is also GPL'ed) even
> though I believe ther aren't many club members running BSD as theier
> primary OS.
>
Well, I sometimes refer to the open source world as the Linux world,
because most of the development and the action takes place in regards to
Linux. I realize that there's a huge difference between Linux, GNU/Linux
or even GNU to "the free software world", but it's a fact that their
intersection is greater than their exclusive parts.
> I do not think names are terribly important,
On the contrary names are very important. I think the "Haifa Linux Club"
and "Haifux" (which some pronounce with an heih and others with a cheith)
are good names because they roll off the tongue, are short, descriptive
and as such make good marketing. I can't think of a better name involving
"free software", "open source" or both.
If you think about it, you can see that Hamakor despite being titled
"Hamakor - an Israeli Society for Free Software and Open Source Code" is
just known as hamakor. I don't mind saying on our own homepage "Haifa
Linux Club - Home for Free Software and Open Source Enthusiasts in the
Haifa Area", but I'm still just going to say "Haifux".
> but I think it whould be
> apropriate to put something on our web site which says something about
> Free Software and Open Source. In our W2L lectures we made sure to speak
> of ideology and no one seemed to complain.
>
Of course we should.
> It is probably possible to right something that says software should be
> open source and preferbly free. That most people would agree with.
> It is also possible to say something showing both the OSI way and the FS
> way.
>
I usually avoid discussing the difference between the free software
definition and the open source definition/Debian Free Software Guidelines.
Most software out there either not open source or both open source and
free software. The difference in terminology is in cronotation and the
difference between the Stallmanist and Raymondist Point-of-Views. For more
information refer to my article:
http://fc-solve.berlios.de/oss-fs/docbook/
("Open Source, Free Software and Other Beasts").
I hope it nicely summarizes most of one needs to know about the FOSS
world.
> As to my opinion, I prefer FreeSoftware and I prefer the GPL, but in
> somecases for the intrest of a better product for me and others I will use
> other licences. And when pushed to the corner I do use closed-source
> software.
>
That's a very good ideology. I hold a slightly different one, but I have
better things to do than to try and push it into otherwise productive,
honest, and healthy-minded people. Everyone is entitled to his opinion,
especially on such relatively ammoral preferences.
Regards,
Shlomi Fish
--
Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/
You are banished! You are banished! You are banished!
Hey? I'm just kidding!
--
Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org)
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[Haifux] Re: An Apology
On Tue, 10 Feb 2004, Yoni Rabkin Katzenell wrote: > > I have been told that my previous mail to the list in relation to > Haifux being Linux or GNU/Linux, was an inappropriate and inflammatory > email. > I did not felt it was inappropriate or flammatory. It was a bit of a flame-bait, but I think the distringuishe Haifuxers did not respond in flames. (and hope I did not as well). > It is your list and I should have respected the house rules. I was out > of line. > You were not. > My apologies to the Haifux mailing list. > In any case, I don't want to see too many other why we call it "Haifa Linux Club" and not "Haifa GNU/Linux Club" or "Haifa GNU Club" or "Haifa Free Software Club" discussions. But I guess some prompt responses like that, should do just fine. This is the first time it happened and I'd suggest to take some friendly measures only when it is repeated another time or two. Regards, Shlomi Fish -- Shlomi Fish[EMAIL PROTECTED] Home Page: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/ You are banished! You are banished! You are banished! Hey? I'm just kidding! -- Haifa Linux Club Mailing List (http://www.haifux.org) To unsub send an empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
