Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Now that's just a gross exaggeration. I've played ZM from time to time and most of the popular servers are pure. On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 4:11 PM, Christopher Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On the subject of this I can sometimes find myself siding with Valve. > There > are so many plugins for HL2 mods, without this interface, that have been > all > but ruined. Referred to as RPG mods they infect slowly all the servers of > a > mod changing everything the developers spent time to balance and giving > players unbalanced weaponry and stats. But the players who get these > things > must grind the server and then they can kill new people with ease. A lot > of > new people especially if Casual game will not know what a RPG plugin is > and > will probably blame the bad gameplay on the MOD itself. RPG Plugins are > IMO > a mod's worst nightmare. > > For Valve Official games this is fine because there are so many servers, > but > for mods a single RPG mod can single handedly ruin a MOD. For example > zombie > master has pretty much only RPG mod servers, etc. > > Chris > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of LDuke > Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2008 12:39 PM > To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for > Server Plugins? > > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > I think you just append ",mytag" to the sv_tags convar string. > > And I second the "Thank you" to Valve from Mattie. And a HUGE "thank you" > if that interface is in the CSS orangebox update. > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 1, 2008 at 6:04 AM, Saul Rennison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > Yeah you just made no sense. > > > > " imagine they added the functions like CreateEntityByName etc. again > > because they thought of themegatag serverbrowser function etc." > > > > Uhm... yes? What is the interface for the server tags anyway? > > > > On 1 Mar 2008, at 12:44, Tobias Kammersgaard wrote: > > > > > -- > > > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > > > I imagine they added the functions like CreateEntityByName etc. again > > > because they thought of themegatag serverbrowser function etc. > > > > > > Also, if this doesn't make any sense its because I've had a few > > > beers ;-) > > > (DRUNK ON THE INTERWEBLOLOLOL) > > > > > > Oh Lord. > > > > > > /ScarT > > > > > > > > > On 01/03/2008, Tony omega Sergi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >> > > >> -- > > >> [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > > >> They're not trying to 'thwart' them. > > >> You have to realize it's a matter of priority. > > >> > > >> You typically don't get support for anything that the game is going > > >> to > > >> have > > >> in situations like this. Look at any other game; unless it's > > >> something > > >> that > > >> benefits the host game, or is designed for the host game, you don't > > >> specifically have it. > > >> > > >> The problem is simply, there isn't anyone dedicated to doing > > >> "extra" stuff > > >> like that.Ie: the biggest complaint; lack of a real multiplayer > > >> vehicle. > > >> Well, the hardcore facts are, until valve decides: "Okay, our next > > >> game is > > >> going to be multiplayer vehicular combat" the likeliness of actually > > >> seeing > > >> them sit down and dedicate time AND money to writing a multiplayer > > >> vehicle, > > >> which they aren't going to use is rather slim. > > >> > > >> Does that make sense to you? Think about it this way; it's the same > > >> as > > >> with > > >> a mod. > > >> Are you going to sit there and implement a bunch of features that > > >> you're > > >> not > > >> going to use, just for the sake of "okay, well we aren't using y > > >> feature, > > >> but lets just make people happy and spend x hours on y feature just > > >> so > > >> they > > >> don't bitch, even if it's never going to be used in our mod." > > >>
Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
Christopher Harris wrote: For Valve Official games this is fine because there are so many servers, but for mods a single RPG mod can single handedly ruin a MOD. For example zombie master has pretty much only RPG mod servers, etc. I think Valve would make a lot of people happy by having a "pure" setting on the server (like Quake) so that people can filter out servers that are running any kind of plugin at all. No plugin(s) == Pure, for those that want just that. For others that want plugins, they could just uncheck that in the server browser and take their chances with what they connect to. -- Jeffrey "botman" Broome ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
RE: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
On the subject of this I can sometimes find myself siding with Valve. There are so many plugins for HL2 mods, without this interface, that have been all but ruined. Referred to as RPG mods they infect slowly all the servers of a mod changing everything the developers spent time to balance and giving players unbalanced weaponry and stats. But the players who get these things must grind the server and then they can kill new people with ease. A lot of new people especially if Casual game will not know what a RPG plugin is and will probably blame the bad gameplay on the MOD itself. RPG Plugins are IMO a mod's worst nightmare. For Valve Official games this is fine because there are so many servers, but for mods a single RPG mod can single handedly ruin a MOD. For example zombie master has pretty much only RPG mod servers, etc. Chris -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of LDuke Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2008 12:39 PM To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins? -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] I think you just append ",mytag" to the sv_tags convar string. And I second the "Thank you" to Valve from Mattie. And a HUGE "thank you" if that interface is in the CSS orangebox update. On Sat, Mar 1, 2008 at 6:04 AM, Saul Rennison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yeah you just made no sense. > > " imagine they added the functions like CreateEntityByName etc. again > because they thought of themegatag serverbrowser function etc." > > Uhm... yes? What is the interface for the server tags anyway? > > On 1 Mar 2008, at 12:44, Tobias Kammersgaard wrote: > > > -- > > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > > I imagine they added the functions like CreateEntityByName etc. again > > because they thought of themegatag serverbrowser function etc. > > > > Also, if this doesn't make any sense its because I've had a few > > beers ;-) > > (DRUNK ON THE INTERWEBLOLOLOL) > > > > Oh Lord. > > > > /ScarT > > > > > > On 01/03/2008, Tony omega Sergi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> > >> -- > >> [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > >> They're not trying to 'thwart' them. > >> You have to realize it's a matter of priority. > >> > >> You typically don't get support for anything that the game is going > >> to > >> have > >> in situations like this. Look at any other game; unless it's > >> something > >> that > >> benefits the host game, or is designed for the host game, you don't > >> specifically have it. > >> > >> The problem is simply, there isn't anyone dedicated to doing > >> "extra" stuff > >> like that.Ie: the biggest complaint; lack of a real multiplayer > >> vehicle. > >> Well, the hardcore facts are, until valve decides: "Okay, our next > >> game is > >> going to be multiplayer vehicular combat" the likeliness of actually > >> seeing > >> them sit down and dedicate time AND money to writing a multiplayer > >> vehicle, > >> which they aren't going to use is rather slim. > >> > >> Does that make sense to you? Think about it this way; it's the same > >> as > >> with > >> a mod. > >> Are you going to sit there and implement a bunch of features that > >> you're > >> not > >> going to use, just for the sake of "okay, well we aren't using y > >> feature, > >> but lets just make people happy and spend x hours on y feature just > >> so > >> they > >> don't bitch, even if it's never going to be used in our mod." > >> > >> It's common sense. > >> -Tony > >> > >> > >> On Fri, Feb 29, 2008 at 6:50 PM, Spencer 'voogru' MacDonald < > >> [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> > >>> I hate to rain on your bash valve parade... > >>> > >>> But this is in the Orange Box SDK: > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> > //-- > >>> --- > >>> // Purpose: Interface from engine to tools for manipulating entities > >>> > >>> > >> > //-- > >>> --- > >>> class IServerTools :
Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
>>> virtual void *NextEntity( void *pEntity ) = 0; > >>> virtual void *FindEntityByHammerID( int iHammerID ) = 0; > >>> > >>> // entity query > >>> virtual bool GetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, > >> char > >>> *szValue, int iMaxLen ) = 0; > >>> virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, > >> const > >>> char *szValue ) = 0; > >>> virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, > >> float > >>> flValue ) = 0; > >>> virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, > >> const > >>> Vector &vecValue ) = 0; > >>> > >>> // entity spawning > >>> virtual void *CreateEntityByName( const char *szClassName ) > >>> = 0; > >>> virtual void DispatchSpawn( void *pEntity ) = 0; > >>> > >>> // This reloads a portion or all of a particle definition > >>> file. > >>> // It's up to the server to decide if it cares about this file > >>> // Use a UtlBuffer to crack the data > >>> virtual void ReloadParticleDefintions( const char *pFileName, > >> const > >>> void *pBufData, int nLen ) = 0; > >>> > >>> virtual void AddOriginToPVS( const Vector &org ) = 0; > >>> }; > >>> > >>> #define VSERVERTOOLS_INTERFACE_VERSION "VSERVERTOOLS001" > >>> > >>> Oh, I wonder what this could be... > >>> > >>> virtual void *CreateEntityByName( const char *szClassName ) = 0; > >>> > >>> Oh and... > >>> > >>> virtual void *FirstEntity( void ) = 0; > >>> virtual void *NextEntity( void *pEntity ) = 0; > >>> > >>> Oh baby! We're getting raunchy now! > >>> > >>> Perhaps when CSS gets upgraded to the Orangebox engine this will > >>> be made > >>> available. It works in TF2 at least. > >>> > >>> Regardless of what valve does to try and limit plug-ins, programmers > >> will > >>> find ways around it. > >>> > >>> I think valve should welcome plug-ins, not try and thwart them. Not > >>> everybody wants to make a full blown mod, the original plug-in SDK > >>> was a > >>> sad > >>> joke. With regards to the HudMsg in CSS, I fully agree. > >>> > >>> One of what I believed to be AdminMOD's trademark (the pretty center > >>> says), > >>> removed from the new game purposely... by the creator of AdminMOD! > >>> > >>> But, center says work in TF2... but perhaps I should not speak so > >>> loudly > >>> cause valve might hear it, though with the new additions in the > >> Orangebox > >>> engine, I think valve is improving. Let's hope it continues. > >>> > >>> Bash valve all you want (I do it too!), but they are leaps and > >>> bounds > >>> ahead > >>> of other companies when it comes to customization. > >>> > >>> I'll give them credit where it's due. > >>> > >>> - voogru. > >>> > >>> -Original Message- > >>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of LDuke > >>> Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 4:50 PM > >>> To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com > >>> Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name > >>> APIs > >> for > >>> Server Plugins? > >>> > >>> -- > >>> [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > >>> My point was that that is going to be the only way. Not only has > >>> Valve > >>> made > >>> it clear that mod-specific API items won't be provided, they've > >>> removed > >> as > >>> much as possible the functionality of plugins. > >>> > >>> As an example, remember the SpawnEntityByName function (from June > >>> 2005)? > >>> That function has long been removed from the codebase. - Alfred > >>> Spawning entities into a map from a plugin is not supported. - > >>> Alfred > >>> We are more concerned with giving people consistent gameplay > >>> rather than > >>
Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
osely... by the creator of AdminMOD! But, center says work in TF2... but perhaps I should not speak so loudly cause valve might hear it, though with the new additions in the Orangebox engine, I think valve is improving. Let's hope it continues. Bash valve all you want (I do it too!), but they are leaps and bounds ahead of other companies when it comes to customization. I'll give them credit where it's due. - voogru. -----Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of LDuke Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 4:50 PM To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins? -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] My point was that that is going to be the only way. Not only has Valve made it clear that mod-specific API items won't be provided, they've removed as much as possible the functionality of plugins. As an example, remember the SpawnEntityByName function (from June 2005)? That function has long been removed from the codebase. - Alfred Spawning entities into a map from a plugin is not supported. - Alfred We are more concerned with giving people consistent gameplay rather than any specific cheat problem. You would be amazed at the number of people that get confused (i.e email us complaining) when joining a HL1 based server with some of the noisier mods (I am looking at the warcraft3 superhero mod here...). - Alfred Or another example, the HudMsg that allows you to print text anywhere on the screen? The font definition was intentionally removed from ClientSchemes.res to prevent plugins from using HudMsg. I'm 95% certain they won't add that. Properly done, signature scans don't break that often. I haven't had to find a new signature for CSS in a long time. Usually when one of mine is invalid it's because I've missed a wild card flag. On Fri, Feb 29, 2008 at 1:12 PM, Saul Rennison <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote: The problem is, LDuke, Mattie doesn't want to add hacks and signature scans to EventScripts (or whatever he wants it for), as it can break pretty easily with an update or maybe throughout mods. Especially ones that change the core. LDuke wrote: -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] That's what I've done...sig scan for the event queue and some of the overloads of AddEvent. With CreateNamedEntity, KeyValues, and AddEvent, you can do some cool stuff. For example, I have a trip mine setup that works completely based on those three things without need for the plugin to monitor players and see which player's tripmine killed which player. It would be nice to have access to those things via plugins without hacking, but so far we haven't seen much in the way of access to mod- specific functions. -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders -- -omega -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
ntity( void *pEntity ) = 0; > > > > Oh baby! We're getting raunchy now! > > > > Perhaps when CSS gets upgraded to the Orangebox engine this will be made > > available. It works in TF2 at least. > > > > Regardless of what valve does to try and limit plug-ins, programmers > will > > find ways around it. > > > > I think valve should welcome plug-ins, not try and thwart them. Not > > everybody wants to make a full blown mod, the original plug-in SDK was a > > sad > > joke. With regards to the HudMsg in CSS, I fully agree. > > > > One of what I believed to be AdminMOD's trademark (the pretty center > > says), > > removed from the new game purposely... by the creator of AdminMOD! > > > > But, center says work in TF2... but perhaps I should not speak so loudly > > cause valve might hear it, though with the new additions in the > Orangebox > > engine, I think valve is improving. Let's hope it continues. > > > > Bash valve all you want (I do it too!), but they are leaps and bounds > > ahead > > of other companies when it comes to customization. > > > > I'll give them credit where it's due. > > > > - voogru. > > > > -Original Message- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of LDuke > > Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 4:50 PM > > To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com > > Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs > for > > Server Plugins? > > > > -- > > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > > My point was that that is going to be the only way. Not only has Valve > > made > > it clear that mod-specific API items won't be provided, they've removed > as > > much as possible the functionality of plugins. > > > > As an example, remember the SpawnEntityByName function (from June 2005)? > > That function has long been removed from the codebase. - Alfred > > Spawning entities into a map from a plugin is not supported. - Alfred > > We are more concerned with giving people consistent gameplay rather than > > any specific cheat problem. You would be amazed at the number of people > > that get confused (i.e email us complaining) when joining a HL1 based > > server with some of the noisier mods (I am looking at the warcraft3 > > superhero mod here...). - Alfred > > > > Or another example, the HudMsg that allows you to print text anywhere on > > the > > screen? The font definition was intentionally removed from > > ClientSchemes.res to prevent plugins from using HudMsg. > > > > I'm 95% certain they won't add that. Properly done, signature scans > don't > > break that often. I haven't had to find a new signature for CSS in a > long > > time. Usually when one of mine is invalid it's because I've missed a > wild > > card flag. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 29, 2008 at 1:12 PM, Saul Rennison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > wrote: > > > > > The problem is, LDuke, Mattie doesn't want to add hacks and signature > > > scans to EventScripts (or whatever he wants it for), as it can break > > > pretty easily with an update or maybe throughout mods. Especially ones > > > that change the core. > > > > > > LDuke wrote: > > > > -- > > > > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > > > > That's what I've done...sig scan for the event queue and some of the > > > > overloads of AddEvent. With CreateNamedEntity, KeyValues, and > > AddEvent, > > > you > > > > can do some cool stuff. For example, I have a trip mine setup that > > > works > > > > completely based on those three things without need for the plugin > to > > > > monitor players and see which player's tripmine killed which player. > > > > > > > > It would be nice to have access to those things via plugins without > > > hacking, > > > > but so far we haven't seen much in the way of access to mod-specific > > > > functions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > > > > > ___ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > > > > > > -- > -omega > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
--
[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ]
voogru-- That's officially the best news I've heard all day. Thanks very
much for mentioning this-- this is the second time I've wanted to thank you
in the past two days (for another old post of you). I didn't see this in
early OB SDK drops.
I've tested tools->CreateEntityByName() and it works (I see the entity in
the entity list).
Now to see how well the rest of the APIs work to simulate some of the other
features we need.
Huge thanks to Valve for adding this-- I'm already stunned and exceptionally
happy just to see the attempt.
-Mattie
On 2/29/08, Spencer 'voogru' MacDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I hate to rain on your bash valve parade...
>
> But this is in the Orange Box SDK:
>
>
> //--
> ---
> // Purpose: Interface from engine to tools for manipulating entities
>
> //--
> ---
> class IServerTools : public IBaseInterface
> {
> public:
> virtual IServerEntity *GetIServerEntity( IClientEntity
> *pClientEntity ) = 0;
> virtual bool SnapPlayerToPosition( const Vector &org, const QAngle
> &ang, IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL ) = 0;
> virtual bool GetPlayerPosition( Vector &org, QAngle &ang,
> IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL ) = 0;
> virtual bool SetPlayerFOV( int fov, IClientEntity *pClientPlayer =
> NULL ) = 0;
> virtual int GetPlayerFOV( IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL ) =
> 0;
> virtual bool IsInNoClipMode( IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL )
> =
> 0;
>
> // entity searching
> virtual void *FirstEntity( void ) = 0;
> virtual void *NextEntity( void *pEntity ) = 0;
> virtual void *FindEntityByHammerID( int iHammerID ) = 0;
>
> // entity query
> virtual bool GetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, char
> *szValue, int iMaxLen ) = 0;
> virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField,
> const
> char *szValue ) = 0;
> virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField,
> float
> flValue ) = 0;
> virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField,
> const
> Vector &vecValue ) = 0;
>
> // entity spawning
> virtual void *CreateEntityByName( const char *szClassName ) = 0;
> virtual void DispatchSpawn( void *pEntity ) = 0;
>
> // This reloads a portion or all of a particle definition file.
> // It's up to the server to decide if it cares about this file
> // Use a UtlBuffer to crack the data
> virtual void ReloadParticleDefintions( const char *pFileName,
> const
> void *pBufData, int nLen ) = 0;
>
> virtual void AddOriginToPVS( const Vector &org ) = 0;
> };
>
> #define VSERVERTOOLS_INTERFACE_VERSION "VSERVERTOOLS001"
>
> Oh, I wonder what this could be...
>
> virtual void *CreateEntityByName( const char *szClassName ) = 0;
>
> Oh and...
>
> virtual void *FirstEntity( void ) = 0;
> virtual void *NextEntity( void *pEntity ) = 0;
>
> Oh baby! We're getting raunchy now!
>
> Perhaps when CSS gets upgraded to the Orangebox engine this will be made
> available. It works in TF2 at least.
>
> Regardless of what valve does to try and limit plug-ins, programmers will
> find ways around it.
>
> I think valve should welcome plug-ins, not try and thwart them. Not
> everybody wants to make a full blown mod, the original plug-in SDK was a
> sad
> joke. With regards to the HudMsg in CSS, I fully agree.
>
> One of what I believed to be AdminMOD's trademark (the pretty center
> says),
> removed from the new game purposely... by the creator of AdminMOD!
>
> But, center says work in TF2... but perhaps I should not speak so loudly
> cause valve might hear it, though with the new additions in the Orangebox
> engine, I think valve is improving. Let's hope it continues.
>
> Bash valve all you want (I do it too!), but they are leaps and bounds
> ahead
> of other companies when it comes to customization.
>
> I'll give them credit where it's due.
>
>
> - voogru.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of LDuke
> Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 4:50 PM
> To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com
>
> Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for
> Server Plugins?
>
> --
>
> [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ]
> My point was that that is going to be
Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
--
[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ]
They're not trying to 'thwart' them.
You have to realize it's a matter of priority.
You typically don't get support for anything that the game is going to have
in situations like this. Look at any other game; unless it's something that
benefits the host game, or is designed for the host game, you don't
specifically have it.
The problem is simply, there isn't anyone dedicated to doing "extra" stuff
like that.Ie: the biggest complaint; lack of a real multiplayer vehicle.
Well, the hardcore facts are, until valve decides: "Okay, our next game is
going to be multiplayer vehicular combat" the likeliness of actually seeing
them sit down and dedicate time AND money to writing a multiplayer vehicle,
which they aren't going to use is rather slim.
Does that make sense to you? Think about it this way; it's the same as with
a mod.
Are you going to sit there and implement a bunch of features that you're not
going to use, just for the sake of "okay, well we aren't using y feature,
but lets just make people happy and spend x hours on y feature just so they
don't bitch, even if it's never going to be used in our mod."
It's common sense.
-Tony
On Fri, Feb 29, 2008 at 6:50 PM, Spencer 'voogru' MacDonald <
[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I hate to rain on your bash valve parade...
>
> But this is in the Orange Box SDK:
>
>
> //--
> ---
> // Purpose: Interface from engine to tools for manipulating entities
>
> //--
> ---
> class IServerTools : public IBaseInterface
> {
> public:
>virtual IServerEntity *GetIServerEntity( IClientEntity
> *pClientEntity ) = 0;
>virtual bool SnapPlayerToPosition( const Vector &org, const QAngle
> &ang, IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL ) = 0;
>virtual bool GetPlayerPosition( Vector &org, QAngle &ang,
> IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL ) = 0;
>virtual bool SetPlayerFOV( int fov, IClientEntity *pClientPlayer =
> NULL ) = 0;
>virtual int GetPlayerFOV( IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL ) =
> 0;
>virtual bool IsInNoClipMode( IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL )
> =
> 0;
>
>// entity searching
>virtual void *FirstEntity( void ) = 0;
>virtual void *NextEntity( void *pEntity ) = 0;
>virtual void *FindEntityByHammerID( int iHammerID ) = 0;
>
>// entity query
>virtual bool GetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, char
> *szValue, int iMaxLen ) = 0;
>virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, const
> char *szValue ) = 0;
>virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, float
> flValue ) = 0;
>virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, const
> Vector &vecValue ) = 0;
>
>// entity spawning
>virtual void *CreateEntityByName( const char *szClassName ) = 0;
>virtual void DispatchSpawn( void *pEntity ) = 0;
>
>// This reloads a portion or all of a particle definition file.
>// It's up to the server to decide if it cares about this file
>// Use a UtlBuffer to crack the data
>virtual void ReloadParticleDefintions( const char *pFileName, const
> void *pBufData, int nLen ) = 0;
>
>virtual void AddOriginToPVS( const Vector &org ) = 0;
> };
>
> #define VSERVERTOOLS_INTERFACE_VERSION "VSERVERTOOLS001"
>
> Oh, I wonder what this could be...
>
> virtual void *CreateEntityByName( const char *szClassName ) = 0;
>
> Oh and...
>
> virtual void *FirstEntity( void ) = 0;
> virtual void *NextEntity( void *pEntity ) = 0;
>
> Oh baby! We're getting raunchy now!
>
> Perhaps when CSS gets upgraded to the Orangebox engine this will be made
> available. It works in TF2 at least.
>
> Regardless of what valve does to try and limit plug-ins, programmers will
> find ways around it.
>
> I think valve should welcome plug-ins, not try and thwart them. Not
> everybody wants to make a full blown mod, the original plug-in SDK was a
> sad
> joke. With regards to the HudMsg in CSS, I fully agree.
>
> One of what I believed to be AdminMOD's trademark (the pretty center
> says),
> removed from the new game purposely... by the creator of AdminMOD!
>
> But, center says work in TF2... but perhaps I should not speak so loudly
> cause valve might hear it, though with the new additions in the Orangebox
> engine, I think valve is improving. Let's hope it continues.
>
> Bash
RE: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
I hate to rain on your bash valve parade...
But this is in the Orange Box SDK:
//--
---
// Purpose: Interface from engine to tools for manipulating entities
//--
---
class IServerTools : public IBaseInterface
{
public:
virtual IServerEntity *GetIServerEntity( IClientEntity
*pClientEntity ) = 0;
virtual bool SnapPlayerToPosition( const Vector &org, const QAngle
&ang, IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL ) = 0;
virtual bool GetPlayerPosition( Vector &org, QAngle &ang,
IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL ) = 0;
virtual bool SetPlayerFOV( int fov, IClientEntity *pClientPlayer =
NULL ) = 0;
virtual int GetPlayerFOV( IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL ) = 0;
virtual bool IsInNoClipMode( IClientEntity *pClientPlayer = NULL ) =
0;
// entity searching
virtual void *FirstEntity( void ) = 0;
virtual void *NextEntity( void *pEntity ) = 0;
virtual void *FindEntityByHammerID( int iHammerID ) = 0;
// entity query
virtual bool GetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, char
*szValue, int iMaxLen ) = 0;
virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, const
char *szValue ) = 0;
virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, float
flValue ) = 0;
virtual bool SetKeyValue( void *pEntity, const char *szField, const
Vector &vecValue ) = 0;
// entity spawning
virtual void *CreateEntityByName( const char *szClassName ) = 0;
virtual void DispatchSpawn( void *pEntity ) = 0;
// This reloads a portion or all of a particle definition file.
// It's up to the server to decide if it cares about this file
// Use a UtlBuffer to crack the data
virtual void ReloadParticleDefintions( const char *pFileName, const
void *pBufData, int nLen ) = 0;
virtual void AddOriginToPVS( const Vector &org ) = 0;
};
#define VSERVERTOOLS_INTERFACE_VERSION "VSERVERTOOLS001"
Oh, I wonder what this could be...
virtual void *CreateEntityByName( const char *szClassName ) = 0;
Oh and...
virtual void *FirstEntity( void ) = 0;
virtual void *NextEntity( void *pEntity ) = 0;
Oh baby! We're getting raunchy now!
Perhaps when CSS gets upgraded to the Orangebox engine this will be made
available. It works in TF2 at least.
Regardless of what valve does to try and limit plug-ins, programmers will
find ways around it.
I think valve should welcome plug-ins, not try and thwart them. Not
everybody wants to make a full blown mod, the original plug-in SDK was a sad
joke. With regards to the HudMsg in CSS, I fully agree.
One of what I believed to be AdminMOD's trademark (the pretty center says),
removed from the new game purposely... by the creator of AdminMOD!
But, center says work in TF2... but perhaps I should not speak so loudly
cause valve might hear it, though with the new additions in the Orangebox
engine, I think valve is improving. Let's hope it continues.
Bash valve all you want (I do it too!), but they are leaps and bounds ahead
of other companies when it comes to customization.
I'll give them credit where it's due.
- voogru.
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of LDuke
Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 4:50 PM
To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com
Subject: Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for
Server Plugins?
--
[ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ]
My point was that that is going to be the only way. Not only has Valve made
it clear that mod-specific API items won't be provided, they've removed as
much as possible the functionality of plugins.
As an example, remember the SpawnEntityByName function (from June 2005)?
That function has long been removed from the codebase. - Alfred
Spawning entities into a map from a plugin is not supported. - Alfred
We are more concerned with giving people consistent gameplay rather than
any specific cheat problem. You would be amazed at the number of people
that get confused (i.e email us complaining) when joining a HL1 based
server with some of the noisier mods (I am looking at the warcraft3
superhero mod here...). - Alfred
Or another example, the HudMsg that allows you to print text anywhere on the
screen? The font definition was intentionally removed from
ClientSchemes.res to prevent plugins from using HudMsg.
I'm 95% certain they won't add that. Properly done, signature scans don't
break that often. I haven't had to find a new signature for CSS in a long
time. Usually when one of mine is invalid it's because I've missed a wild
card flag.
On Fri, Feb 29, 2008 at 1:12 PM, Saul Rennison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> The problem is, LDuke, Matt
Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] My point was that that is going to be the only way. Not only has Valve made it clear that mod-specific API items won't be provided, they've removed as much as possible the functionality of plugins. As an example, remember the SpawnEntityByName function (from June 2005)? That function has long been removed from the codebase. - Alfred Spawning entities into a map from a plugin is not supported. - Alfred We are more concerned with giving people consistent gameplay rather than any specific cheat problem. You would be amazed at the number of people that get confused (i.e email us complaining) when joining a HL1 based server with some of the noisier mods (I am looking at the warcraft3 superhero mod here...). - Alfred Or another example, the HudMsg that allows you to print text anywhere on the screen? The font definition was intentionally removed from ClientSchemes.res to prevent plugins from using HudMsg. I'm 95% certain they won't add that. Properly done, signature scans don't break that often. I haven't had to find a new signature for CSS in a long time. Usually when one of mine is invalid it's because I've missed a wild card flag. On Fri, Feb 29, 2008 at 1:12 PM, Saul Rennison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The problem is, LDuke, Mattie doesn't want to add hacks and signature > scans to EventScripts (or whatever he wants it for), as it can break > pretty easily with an update or maybe throughout mods. Especially ones > that change the core. > > LDuke wrote: > > -- > > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > > That's what I've done...sig scan for the event queue and some of the > > overloads of AddEvent. With CreateNamedEntity, KeyValues, and AddEvent, > you > > can do some cool stuff. For example, I have a trip mine setup that > works > > completely based on those three things without need for the plugin to > > monitor players and see which player's tripmine killed which player. > > > > It would be nice to have access to those things via plugins without > hacking, > > but so far we haven't seen much in the way of access to mod-specific > > functions. > > > > > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
I would like to second this. I have tried creating plugins, and getting stopped at the Sigscanning methods/vtable (And not understanding it which doesnt help), i have given up on making server plugins. A nice exposed API for the entity list / entity functions, etc, would be great (Server side only so you dont expose crap for hackers :P) Saul Rennison wrote: The problem is, LDuke, Mattie doesn't want to add hacks and signature scans to EventScripts (or whatever he wants it for), as it can break pretty easily with an update or maybe throughout mods. Especially ones that change the core. LDuke wrote: -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] That's what I've done...sig scan for the event queue and some of the overloads of AddEvent. With CreateNamedEntity, KeyValues, and AddEvent, you can do some cool stuff. For example, I have a trip mine setup that works completely based on those three things without need for the plugin to monitor players and see which player's tripmine killed which player. It would be nice to have access to those things via plugins without hacking, but so far we haven't seen much in the way of access to mod-specific functions. On Thu, Feb 28, 2008 at 10:47 PM, Tony Paloma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I agree that Valve does need to offer more interfaces to plugins for things like this. Doing anything with entities is incredibly limited given the provided resources. However, I think each one of these things is a simple vfunc call away to the desired result. ent_fire and ent_name can be accomplished using the AcceptInput virtual function, and give can be done with GiveNamedItem. There is no hooking or sig scanning required unless you meant to do something more advanced like get at the event queue or something. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of MattieC Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2008 9:33 PM To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins? -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Can you consider adding ent_fire and ent_name API equivalents for Source server plugins? (Ideally these interact via index/pointer rather than name, but if we can name entities by index that would be the same thing, really.) Getting access to the entity event/message queue without hacks/tricks would open many stable doors and I've voiced this opinion in the past. This is one of the biggest deficiencies of the server-side plugin SDK. Ideally, the "give" API (or any name-based entity creation method) would also be included, but there may be more mod-specific issues for you there, perhaps. Currently without hacks/hooks it's very difficult to emulate this. Is there any reason entity inputs/messaging weren't exposed via interfaces that server plugins can access? If the above is not possible, what kind of things could the Source engine offer for better entity manipulation? Thanks very, very much in advance--- -Mattie http://www.eventscripts.com -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
The problem is, LDuke, Mattie doesn't want to add hacks and signature scans to EventScripts (or whatever he wants it for), as it can break pretty easily with an update or maybe throughout mods. Especially ones that change the core. LDuke wrote: -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] That's what I've done...sig scan for the event queue and some of the overloads of AddEvent. With CreateNamedEntity, KeyValues, and AddEvent, you can do some cool stuff. For example, I have a trip mine setup that works completely based on those three things without need for the plugin to monitor players and see which player's tripmine killed which player. It would be nice to have access to those things via plugins without hacking, but so far we haven't seen much in the way of access to mod-specific functions. On Thu, Feb 28, 2008 at 10:47 PM, Tony Paloma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I agree that Valve does need to offer more interfaces to plugins for things like this. Doing anything with entities is incredibly limited given the provided resources. However, I think each one of these things is a simple vfunc call away to the desired result. ent_fire and ent_name can be accomplished using the AcceptInput virtual function, and give can be done with GiveNamedItem. There is no hooking or sig scanning required unless you meant to do something more advanced like get at the event queue or something. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of MattieC Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2008 9:33 PM To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins? -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Can you consider adding ent_fire and ent_name API equivalents for Source server plugins? (Ideally these interact via index/pointer rather than name, but if we can name entities by index that would be the same thing, really.) Getting access to the entity event/message queue without hacks/tricks would open many stable doors and I've voiced this opinion in the past. This is one of the biggest deficiencies of the server-side plugin SDK. Ideally, the "give" API (or any name-based entity creation method) would also be included, but there may be more mod-specific issues for you there, perhaps. Currently without hacks/hooks it's very difficult to emulate this. Is there any reason entity inputs/messaging weren't exposed via interfaces that server plugins can access? If the above is not possible, what kind of things could the Source engine offer for better entity manipulation? Thanks very, very much in advance--- -Mattie http://www.eventscripts.com -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
Re: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] That's what I've done...sig scan for the event queue and some of the overloads of AddEvent. With CreateNamedEntity, KeyValues, and AddEvent, you can do some cool stuff. For example, I have a trip mine setup that works completely based on those three things without need for the plugin to monitor players and see which player's tripmine killed which player. It would be nice to have access to those things via plugins without hacking, but so far we haven't seen much in the way of access to mod-specific functions. On Thu, Feb 28, 2008 at 10:47 PM, Tony Paloma <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I agree that Valve does need to offer more interfaces to plugins for > things > like this. Doing anything with entities is incredibly limited given the > provided resources. However, I think each one of these things is a simple > vfunc call away to the desired result. ent_fire and ent_name can be > accomplished using the AcceptInput virtual function, and give can be done > with GiveNamedItem. There is no hooking or sig scanning required unless > you > meant to do something more advanced like get at the event queue or > something. > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of MattieC > Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2008 9:33 PM > To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com > Subject: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for > Server Plugins? > > -- > [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] > Can you consider adding ent_fire and ent_name API equivalents for Source > server plugins? (Ideally these interact via index/pointer rather than > name, > but if we can name entities by index that would be the same thing, > really.) > > Getting access to the entity event/message queue without hacks/tricks > would > open many stable doors and I've voiced this opinion in the past. This is > one > of the biggest deficiencies of the server-side plugin SDK. > > Ideally, the "give" API (or any name-based entity creation method) would > also be included, but there may be more mod-specific issues for you there, > perhaps. Currently without hacks/hooks it's very difficult to emulate > this. > > Is there any reason entity inputs/messaging weren't exposed via interfaces > that server plugins can access? If the above is not possible, what kind of > things could the Source engine offer for better entity manipulation? > > Thanks very, very much in advance--- > -Mattie > http://www.eventscripts.com > -- > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > > > ___ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders > > -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
RE: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
I agree that Valve does need to offer more interfaces to plugins for things like this. Doing anything with entities is incredibly limited given the provided resources. However, I think each one of these things is a simple vfunc call away to the desired result. ent_fire and ent_name can be accomplished using the AcceptInput virtual function, and give can be done with GiveNamedItem. There is no hooking or sig scanning required unless you meant to do something more advanced like get at the event queue or something. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of MattieC Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2008 9:33 PM To: hlcoders@list.valvesoftware.com Subject: [hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins? -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Can you consider adding ent_fire and ent_name API equivalents for Source server plugins? (Ideally these interact via index/pointer rather than name, but if we can name entities by index that would be the same thing, really.) Getting access to the entity event/message queue without hacks/tricks would open many stable doors and I've voiced this opinion in the past. This is one of the biggest deficiencies of the server-side plugin SDK. Ideally, the "give" API (or any name-based entity creation method) would also be included, but there may be more mod-specific issues for you there, perhaps. Currently without hacks/hooks it's very difficult to emulate this. Is there any reason entity inputs/messaging weren't exposed via interfaces that server plugins can access? If the above is not possible, what kind of things could the Source engine offer for better entity manipulation? Thanks very, very much in advance--- -Mattie http://www.eventscripts.com -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
[hlcoders] Requesting (again): ent_fire and ent_name APIs for Server Plugins?
-- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] Can you consider adding ent_fire and ent_name API equivalents for Source server plugins? (Ideally these interact via index/pointer rather than name, but if we can name entities by index that would be the same thing, really.) Getting access to the entity event/message queue without hacks/tricks would open many stable doors and I've voiced this opinion in the past. This is one of the biggest deficiencies of the server-side plugin SDK. Ideally, the "give" API (or any name-based entity creation method) would also be included, but there may be more mod-specific issues for you there, perhaps. Currently without hacks/hooks it's very difficult to emulate this. Is there any reason entity inputs/messaging weren't exposed via interfaces that server plugins can access? If the above is not possible, what kind of things could the Source engine offer for better entity manipulation? Thanks very, very much in advance--- -Mattie http://www.eventscripts.com -- ___ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlcoders
