Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Bottiger]

People might not want to add all your servers.

Wouldn't you want to avoid your server being unreachable for 24 hours? If
it is down for so long some people might even delete your server off their
favorites.

If you were worried about hammering Valve servers, well that was an
implementation fault that could have been avoided if it was DNS based as
per my suggestion.

I don't know why you think this can be abused. If a player doesn't like
whatever the server is doing, they can remove it from their favorites.


On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk wrote:

> In short, you want 1 feature, namely this migration feature which was
> mainly to help server owners to move to new hosts/providers etc, to
> mitigate a problem unrelated, the DDOS attacks on your systems.
>
> If you want to drill a hole to hang a painting, you use the .45, aim and
> shoot ?
>
> I proposed long(?) ago to have the steam group(s) hold server IP's of the
> group, so membership would deliver all servers of the group to the server
> browser, in maybe a new tab in there "Group Servers" or w/e. I never saw it
> as a replacement for the "favorited" system tho. The system would deliver
> then ALL servers of a group they are member of to somebody. That way
> someone can choose a few groups to be member of, and see all their servers
> in 1 go, within any valve game they use. Game or steam can just pull the
> group server info at start of the game.
>
> Hell, it can be a link to a XML file hosted on the webpage of the group,
> which would require very stringend rules on its layout, and client can pull
> it from the site's webserver without any load to Steam. Would be a bliss
> for automation with changes. And ofc trust issues, parser of it should be
> quite rigid in format.
>
>
>
>   --
>  *From:* E. Olsen 
>
> *To:* Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list <
> hlds@list.valvesoftware.com>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 19:35
>
> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts
> Resolve These Issues Now?
>
> I agree - having more frequent updates, or even a way to manually "push"
> an I.P./favorites update out at will (within reason, of course - like a max
> of once per hour or so, so as not to overload the system) would allow
> server operators to keep some I.P. addresses in reserve in the event the
> need to null-route one in the event of a DDOS.
>
> Ideally, I would love to see a web-based control panel for server
> operators that would allow us to handle all of this in an easy to use
> interface.
>
> I certainly hope Valve is considering some additional measures for helping
> server operators better deal with DOS attacks in Source 2.
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 1:21 PM, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> What about the title of this thread? DDOS.
>
> That's a great reason to update the IP more often. It would allow one to
> almost provide continuous service.
>
> IP is under attack so you can nullroute it and start the server on another
> IP. Then change it back when needed.
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk wrote:
>
> As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then???
>
> It almost sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push the
> changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes would
> be way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly updates to the
> players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of users.
>
> Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
> Server owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or whatever
> hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your playerbase
> informed/moved to the new IP for your server.
>
> I love the new feature, it allows us to give our users that have our
> servers Favorited a good service and keep them when we need to change to a
> new host.
>
> I really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any
> faster. You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over to
> a new IP, and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 days
> everybody will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage days of
> the week, and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24 hours for
> keeping stuff moderate with transferring between servers, clients, keeping
> up with the stuff etc, while they measure what bandwith/CPU costs it
> generates with 10.000s of servers, and millions of users.
>
> So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?
>
> Again, I do not see mu

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Mart-Jan Reeuwijk]

In short, you want 1 feature, namely this migration feature which was mainly to 
help server owners to move to new hosts/providers etc, to mitigate a problem 
unrelated, the DDOS attacks on your systems. 

If you want to drill a hole to hang a painting, you use the .45, aim and shoot ?


I proposed long(?) ago to have the steam group(s) hold server IP's of the 
group, so membership would deliver all servers of the group to the server 
browser, in maybe a new tab in there "Group Servers" or w/e. I never saw it as 
a replacement for the "favorited" system tho. The system would deliver then ALL 
servers of a group they are member of to somebody. That way someone can choose 
a few groups to be member of, and see all their servers in 1 go, within any 
valve game they use. Game or steam can just pull the group server info at start 
of the game.

Hell, it can be a link to a XML file hosted on the webpage of the group, which 
would require very stringend rules on its layout, and client can pull it from 
the site's webserver without any load to Steam. Would be a bliss for automation 
with changes. And ofc trust issues, parser of it should be quite rigid in 
format.





>
> From: E. Olsen 
>To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list 
> 
>Sent: Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 19:35
>Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
>Resolve These Issues Now?
> 
>
>
>I agree - having more frequent updates, or even a way to manually "push" an 
>I.P./favorites update out at will (within reason, of course - like a max of 
>once per hour or so, so as not to overload the system) would allow server 
>operators to keep some I.P. addresses in reserve in the event the need to 
>null-route one in the event of a DDOS.
>
>
>Ideally, I would love to see a web-based control panel for server operators 
>that would allow us to handle all of this in an easy to use interface.
>
>
>I certainly hope Valve is considering some additional measures for helping 
>server operators better deal with DOS attacks in Source 2.
>
>
>
>On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 1:21 PM, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>What about the title of this thread? DDOS.
>>
>>That's a great reason to update the IP more often. It would allow one to 
>>almost provide continuous service.
>>
>>IP is under attack so you can nullroute it and start the server on another 
>>IP. Then change it back when needed.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk  
>>wrote:
>>
>>As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then??? 
>>>
>>>It almost
 sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push the 
changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes 
would be way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly 
updates to the players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of 
users.
>>>
>>>Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
>>>Server
 owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or whatever 
hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your playerbase
 informed/moved to the new IP for your server.
>>>
>>>I love the new 
feature, it allows us to give our users that have our servers Favorited a
 good service and keep them when we need to change to a new host.
>>>
>>>I
 really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any 
faster. You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over 
to a new IP, and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 
days everybody will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage
 days of the week, and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24
 hours for keeping stuff moderate with transferring between servers, 
clients, keeping up with the stuff etc, while they measure what 
bandwith/CPU costs it generates with 10.000s of servers, and millions of
 users. 
>>>
>>>So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?
>>>
>>>Again,
 I do not see much added value, for a service you may only do use once in so
 many months. The only answers I can come up with have to do with trying
 to exploit some or whatever. Don't know, don't wanna know, and I am 
against such. I've been looking around, but not planning to move over 
within a month or so. Meanwhile letting all my players getting the ID.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> From: Jimmy Dorry 
>>>>To: Mart-Jan Reeuwijk ; Half-Life dedicated Win32 
>>>>server mailing list  
>>>>Sent: Wednesday, 26 February 201

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Jimmy Dorry]

As mentioned later in the thread, this is an email thread for ddos attacks. I 
can count on one hand the number of ISPs in my city in Australia that will not 
null route (exactly 0 of the service providers). Data is so expensive here that 
it purely is not economical to handle it. It is simply for this reason that I 
stopped hosting TF2 servers years ago.

However, IP addresses are dirt cheap here. Adding another IP address costs as 
little as $1/month depending on the ISP. The most cost effective ddos 
prevention has simply been to cycle through a pool of IPs when attacked. This 
can even be setup to happen automatically when an IP goes down, as we don't 
even need to worry about DNS issues.

I do not appreciate your minimising of this issue, and even your attempt to 
label it nefarious. You must not have thought very hard if this was all you 
could think of, given the email subject.

If you can't also see the need to minimise down-time, then perhaps you need a 
few wake up calls that happen for a few hours every day for a week. This can be 
arranged, and would cost significantly less than grief caused. :)

Sent from my iPad

> On 27 Feb 2014, at 4:15 am, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk  wrote:
> 
> As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then??? 
> 
> It almost sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push the 
> changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes would be 
> way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly updates to the 
> players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of users.
> 
> Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
> Server owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or whatever 
> hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your playerbase 
> informed/moved to the new IP for your server.
> 
> I love the new feature, it allows us to give our users that have our servers 
> Favorited a good service and keep them when we need to change to a new host.
> 
> I really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any faster. 
> You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over to a new IP, 
> and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 days everybody 
> will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage days of the week, 
> and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24 hours for keeping stuff 
> moderate with transferring between servers, clients, keeping up with the 
> stuff etc, while they measure what bandwith/CPU costs it generates with 
> 10.000s of servers, and millions of users. 
> 
> So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?
> 
> Again, I do not see much added value, for a service you may only do use once 
> in so many months. The only answers I can come up with have to do with trying 
> to exploit some or whatever. Don't know, don't wanna know, and I am against 
> such. I've been looking around, but not planning to move over within a month 
> or so. Meanwhile letting all my players getting the ID.
> 
> From: Jimmy Dorry 
> To: Mart-Jan Reeuwijk ; Half-Life dedicated Win32 server 
> mailing list  
> Sent: Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 15:17
> Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
> Resolve These Issues Now?
> 
> It would be nicer for steam to push changes instead requiring the clients to 
> pull. 
> 
> If you change ip, under the current scheme, you basically have to expect 
> no/reduced favourited joins for 24hours.
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 26 Feb 2014, at 8:43 pm, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk  wrote:
>> 
>> quote: 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>> 
>> Do you plan to keep changing your IP's every day? I really don't see the 
>> need.
>> 
>> From: Bottiger 
>> To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list 
>>  
>> Sent: Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 2:42
>> Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
>> Resolve These Issues Now?
>> 
>> Thanks for the update. I have a few questions.
>> 
>> 1. Does the user need to be online in order to load account ids into their 
>> favorites?
>> 2. If people were already logged in right before an IP change does this mean 
>> they won't see the new server for another 24 hours?
>> 3. If we leave a notice server up without an account at the old address, 
>> will there be no update because there was a working server at that address?
>> 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Tony Paloma  wrote:
>> Yes, you can change IP, port, or both and user’s favorites 

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Dill Bates]

Interesting. You're not Edge Gamers are you? Lol

> On Feb 26, 2014, at 1:01 PM, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Its unpredictable really. Two servers yesterday one today. 
> 
> Yesterday a server got attacked because the people on it at the time 
> votebanned a hacker for 30 minutes. Though the attack lasted much longer than 
> the ban itself and better yet the people playing on the server obviously 
> moved on immediately.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 2:52 PM, Dill Bates  wrote:
>> Just curious how often you guys get DDOS attacks on your servers? I've been 
>> attacked one time ever, and it was because I banned a couple of trolls. 
>> 
>> -Dill
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Feb 26, 2014, at 10:57 AM, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I've never had an attack stop immediately after shutting down the server 
>>> being attacked. Sometimes the attacks went on for hours with no change. 
>>> Other times the IP would get null routed and then restored later only to be 
>>> nullrouted again for even longer as the attack was ongoing.
>>> 
>>> Most of them would assume the server is dead while the attack is ongoing. 
>>> Just like it was before.
>>> Also different datacenters handle attacks differently. Some can filter them 
>>> sometimes, others charge very high fees or just nullroute. 
>>> 
>>> But if the location that server is in can't deal with a DDOS, yet I had the 
>>> opportunity to temporarily shift it to a host 1031 KM away then I might 
>>> just do that.
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Nomaan Ahmad  wrote:
>>>> I think the "panels" used by these skiddies to ddos servers have the 
>>>> ability to stop an attack and then continue the attack your newer IP.
>>>> So I think its kinda useless for that purpose.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On 26 February 2014 18:21, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> What about the title of this thread? DDOS.
>>>>> 
>>>>> That's a great reason to update the IP more often. It would allow one to 
>>>>> almost provide continuous service.
>>>>> 
>>>>> IP is under attack so you can nullroute it and start the server on 
>>>>> another IP. Then change it back when needed.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk  
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then??? 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> It almost sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push 
>>>>>> the changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes 
>>>>>> would be way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly 
>>>>>> updates to the players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of users.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
>>>>>> Server owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or whatever 
>>>>>> hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your playerbase 
>>>>>> informed/moved to the new IP for your server.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I love the new feature, it allows us to give our users that have our 
>>>>>> servers Favorited a good service and keep them when we need to change to 
>>>>>> a new host.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any 
>>>>>> faster. You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over 
>>>>>> to a new IP, and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 
>>>>>> days everybody will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage 
>>>>>> days of the week, and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24 
>>>>>> hours for keeping stuff moderate with transferring between servers, 
>>>>>> clients, keeping up with the stuff etc, while they measure what 
>>>>>> bandwith/CPU costs it generates with 10.000s of servers, and millions of 
>>>>>> users. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Again, I do not see much added value, 

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[1nsane]

Its unpredictable really. Two servers yesterday one today.

Yesterday a server got attacked because the people on it at the time
votebanned a hacker for 30 minutes. Though the attack lasted much longer
than the ban itself and better yet the people playing on the server
obviously moved on immediately.




On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 2:52 PM, Dill Bates  wrote:

> Just curious how often you guys get DDOS attacks on your servers? I've
> been attacked one time ever, and it was because I banned a couple of
> trolls.
>
> -Dill
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 26, 2014, at 10:57 AM, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I've never had an attack stop immediately after shutting down the server
> being attacked. Sometimes the attacks went on for hours with no change.
> Other times the IP would get null routed and then restored later only to be
> nullrouted again for even longer as the attack was ongoing.
>
> Most of them would assume the server is dead while the attack is ongoing.
> Just like it was before.
> Also different datacenters handle attacks differently. Some can filter
> them sometimes, others charge very high fees or just nullroute.
>
> But if the location that server is in can't deal with a DDOS, yet I had
> the opportunity to temporarily shift it to a host 1031 KM away then I might
> just do that.
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Nomaan Ahmad wrote:
>
>> I think the "panels" used by these skiddies to ddos servers have the
>> ability to stop an attack and then continue the attack your newer IP.
>> So I think its kinda useless for that purpose.
>>
>>
>> On 26 February 2014 18:21, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> What about the title of this thread? DDOS.
>>>
>>> That's a great reason to update the IP more often. It would allow one to
>>> almost provide continuous service.
>>>
>>> IP is under attack so you can nullroute it and start the server on
>>> another IP. Then change it back when needed.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then???
>>>>
>>>> It almost sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push
>>>> the changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes
>>>> would be way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly updates
>>>> to the players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of users.
>>>>
>>>> Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
>>>> Server owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or
>>>> whatever hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your
>>>> playerbase informed/moved to the new IP for your server.
>>>>
>>>> I love the new feature, it allows us to give our users that have our
>>>> servers Favorited a good service and keep them when we need to change to a
>>>> new host.
>>>>
>>>> I really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any
>>>> faster. You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over to
>>>> a new IP, and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 days
>>>> everybody will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage days of
>>>> the week, and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24 hours for
>>>> keeping stuff moderate with transferring between servers, clients, keeping
>>>> up with the stuff etc, while they measure what bandwith/CPU costs it
>>>> generates with 10.000s of servers, and millions of users.
>>>>
>>>> So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?
>>>>
>>>> Again, I do not see much added value, for a service you may only do use
>>>> once in so many months. The only answers I can come up with have to do with
>>>> trying to exploit some or whatever. Don't know, don't wanna know, and I am
>>>> against such. I've been looking around, but not planning to move over
>>>> within a month or so. Meanwhile letting all my players getting the ID.
>>>>
>>>>   --
>>>>  *From:* Jimmy Dorry 
>>>> *To:* Mart-Jan Reeuwijk ; Half-Life dedicated
>>>> Win32 server mailing list 
>>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 15:17
>>>>
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server
>&g

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Dill Bates]

Just curious how often you guys get DDOS attacks on your servers? I've been 
attacked one time ever, and it was because I banned a couple of trolls. 

-Dill

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 26, 2014, at 10:57 AM, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I've never had an attack stop immediately after shutting down the server 
> being attacked. Sometimes the attacks went on for hours with no change. Other 
> times the IP would get null routed and then restored later only to be 
> nullrouted again for even longer as the attack was ongoing.
> 
> Most of them would assume the server is dead while the attack is ongoing. 
> Just like it was before.
> Also different datacenters handle attacks differently. Some can filter them 
> sometimes, others charge very high fees or just nullroute. 
> 
> But if the location that server is in can't deal with a DDOS, yet I had the 
> opportunity to temporarily shift it to a host 1031 KM away then I might just 
> do that.
> 
> 
>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Nomaan Ahmad  wrote:
>> I think the "panels" used by these skiddies to ddos servers have the ability 
>> to stop an attack and then continue the attack your newer IP.
>> So I think its kinda useless for that purpose.
>> 
>> 
>>> On 26 February 2014 18:21, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> What about the title of this thread? DDOS.
>>> 
>>> That's a great reason to update the IP more often. It would allow one to 
>>> almost provide continuous service.
>>> 
>>> IP is under attack so you can nullroute it and start the server on another 
>>> IP. Then change it back when needed.
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk  
>>>> wrote:
>>>> As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then??? 
>>>> 
>>>> It almost sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push the 
>>>> changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes would 
>>>> be way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly updates to the 
>>>> players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of  users.
>>>> 
>>>> Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
>>>> Server owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or whatever 
>>>> hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your playerbase 
>>>> informed/moved to the new IP for your server.
>>>> 
>>>> I love the new feature, it allows us to give our users that have our 
>>>> servers Favorited a good service and keep them when we need to change to a 
>>>> new host.
>>>> 
>>>> I really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any 
>>>> faster. You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over to 
>>>> a new IP, and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 days 
>>>> everybody will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage days 
>>>> of the week, and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24 hours 
>>>> for keeping stuff moderate with transferring between servers, clients, 
>>>> keeping up with the stuff etc, while they measure what bandwith/CPU costs 
>>>> it generates with 10.000s of servers, and millions of users. 
>>>> 
>>>> So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?
>>>> 
>>>> Again, I do not see much added value, for a service you may only do use 
>>>> once in so many months. The only answers I can come up with have to do 
>>>> with trying to exploit some or whatever. Don't know, don't wanna know, and 
>>>> I am against such. I've been looking around, but not planning to move over 
>>>> within a month or so. Meanwhile letting all my players getting the ID.
>>>> 
>>>> From: Jimmy Dorry 
>>>> To: Mart-Jan Reeuwijk ; Half-Life dedicated Win32 
>>>> server mailing list  
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 15:17
>>>> 
>>>> Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
>>>> Resolve These Issues Now?
>>>> 
>>>> It would be nicer for steam to push changes instead requiring the clients 
>>>> to pull. 
>>>> 
>>>> If you change ip, under the current scheme, you basically have to expect 
>>>> no/reduced favourited joins for 24hours.
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[1nsane]

I've never had an attack stop immediately after shutting down the server
being attacked. Sometimes the attacks went on for hours with no change.
Other times the IP would get null routed and then restored later only to be
nullrouted again for even longer as the attack was ongoing.

Most of them would assume the server is dead while the attack is ongoing.
Just like it was before.
Also different datacenters handle attacks differently. Some can filter them
sometimes, others charge very high fees or just nullroute.

But if the location that server is in can't deal with a DDOS, yet I had the
opportunity to temporarily shift it to a host 1031 KM away then I might
just do that.


On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Nomaan Ahmad  wrote:

> I think the "panels" used by these skiddies to ddos servers have the
> ability to stop an attack and then continue the attack your newer IP.
> So I think its kinda useless for that purpose.
>
>
> On 26 February 2014 18:21, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> What about the title of this thread? DDOS.
>>
>> That's a great reason to update the IP more often. It would allow one to
>> almost provide continuous service.
>>
>> IP is under attack so you can nullroute it and start the server on
>> another IP. Then change it back when needed.
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then???
>>>
>>> It almost sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push
>>> the changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes
>>> would be way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly updates
>>> to the players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of users.
>>>
>>> Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
>>> Server owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or whatever
>>> hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your playerbase
>>> informed/moved to the new IP for your server.
>>>
>>> I love the new feature, it allows us to give our users that have our
>>> servers Favorited a good service and keep them when we need to change to a
>>> new host.
>>>
>>> I really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any
>>> faster. You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over to
>>> a new IP, and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 days
>>> everybody will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage days of
>>> the week, and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24 hours for
>>> keeping stuff moderate with transferring between servers, clients, keeping
>>> up with the stuff etc, while they measure what bandwith/CPU costs it
>>> generates with 10.000s of servers, and millions of users.
>>>
>>> So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?
>>>
>>> Again, I do not see much added value, for a service you may only do use
>>> once in so many months. The only answers I can come up with have to do with
>>> trying to exploit some or whatever. Don't know, don't wanna know, and I am
>>> against such. I've been looking around, but not planning to move over
>>> within a month or so. Meanwhile letting all my players getting the ID.
>>>
>>>   --
>>>  *From:* Jimmy Dorry 
>>> *To:* Mart-Jan Reeuwijk ; Half-Life dedicated Win32
>>> server mailing list 
>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 15:17
>>>
>>> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server
>>> Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?
>>>
>>> It would be nicer for steam to push changes instead requiring the
>>> clients to pull.
>>>
>>> If you change ip, under the current scheme, you basically have to expect
>>> no/reduced favourited joins for 24hours.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>> On 26 Feb 2014, at 8:43 pm, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> quote: 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>>>
>>> Do you plan to keep changing your IP's every day? I really don't see the
>>> need.
>>>
>>>   --
>>>  *From:* Bottiger 
>>> *To:* Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list <
>>> hlds@list.valvesoftware.com>
>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 2:42
>>> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] 

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Nomaan Ahmad]

I think the "panels" used by these skiddies to ddos servers have the
ability to stop an attack and then continue the attack your newer IP.
So I think its kinda useless for that purpose.


On 26 February 2014 18:21, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:

> What about the title of this thread? DDOS.
>
> That's a great reason to update the IP more often. It would allow one to
> almost provide continuous service.
>
> IP is under attack so you can nullroute it and start the server on another
> IP. Then change it back when needed.
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk wrote:
>
>> As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then???
>>
>> It almost sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push
>> the changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes
>> would be way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly updates
>> to the players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of users.
>>
>> Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
>> Server owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or whatever
>> hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your playerbase
>> informed/moved to the new IP for your server.
>>
>> I love the new feature, it allows us to give our users that have our
>> servers Favorited a good service and keep them when we need to change to a
>> new host.
>>
>> I really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any
>> faster. You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over to
>> a new IP, and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 days
>> everybody will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage days of
>> the week, and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24 hours for
>> keeping stuff moderate with transferring between servers, clients, keeping
>> up with the stuff etc, while they measure what bandwith/CPU costs it
>> generates with 10.000s of servers, and millions of users.
>>
>> So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?
>>
>> Again, I do not see much added value, for a service you may only do use
>> once in so many months. The only answers I can come up with have to do with
>> trying to exploit some or whatever. Don't know, don't wanna know, and I am
>> against such. I've been looking around, but not planning to move over
>> within a month or so. Meanwhile letting all my players getting the ID.
>>
>>   ------
>>  *From:* Jimmy Dorry 
>> *To:* Mart-Jan Reeuwijk ; Half-Life dedicated Win32
>> server mailing list 
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 15:17
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server
>> Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?
>>
>> It would be nicer for steam to push changes instead requiring the clients
>> to pull.
>>
>> If you change ip, under the current scheme, you basically have to expect
>> no/reduced favourited joins for 24hours.
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On 26 Feb 2014, at 8:43 pm, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk  wrote:
>>
>> quote: 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>>
>> Do you plan to keep changing your IP's every day? I really don't see the
>> need.
>>
>>   --
>>  *From:* Bottiger 
>> *To:* Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list <
>> hlds@list.valvesoftware.com>
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 2:42
>> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server
>> Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?
>>
>> Thanks for the update. I have a few questions.
>>
>> 1. Does the user need to be online in order to load account ids into
>> their favorites?
>> 2. If people were already logged in right before an IP change does this
>> mean they won't see the new server for another 24 hours?
>> 3. If we leave a notice server up without an account at the old address,
>> will there be no update because there was a working server at that address?
>> 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Tony Paloma wrote:
>>
>>  Yes, you can change IP, port, or both and user's favorites will update
>> within a day or the next time they refresh their favorites list thereafter.
>> What I mean by that is, the Steam client only asks for updated IP:port
>> information at most once every 24 hours. At the same time as that request,

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[E. Olsen]

I agree - having more frequent updates, or even a way to manually "push" an
I.P./favorites update out at will (within reason, of course - like a max of
once per hour or so, so as not to overload the system) would allow server
operators to keep some I.P. addresses in reserve in the event the need to
null-route one in the event of a DDOS.

Ideally, I would love to see a web-based control panel for server operators
that would allow us to handle all of this in an easy to use interface.

I certainly hope Valve is considering some additional measures for helping
server operators better deal with DOS attacks in Source 2.


On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 1:21 PM, 1nsane <1nsane...@gmail.com> wrote:

> What about the title of this thread? DDOS.
>
> That's a great reason to update the IP more often. It would allow one to
> almost provide continuous service.
>
> IP is under attack so you can nullroute it and start the server on another
> IP. Then change it back when needed.
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk wrote:
>
>> As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then???
>>
>> It almost sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push
>> the changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes
>> would be way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly updates
>> to the players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of users.
>>
>> Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
>> Server owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or whatever
>> hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your playerbase
>> informed/moved to the new IP for your server.
>>
>> I love the new feature, it allows us to give our users that have our
>> servers Favorited a good service and keep them when we need to change to a
>> new host.
>>
>> I really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any
>> faster. You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over to
>> a new IP, and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 days
>> everybody will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage days of
>> the week, and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24 hours for
>> keeping stuff moderate with transferring between servers, clients, keeping
>> up with the stuff etc, while they measure what bandwith/CPU costs it
>> generates with 10.000s of servers, and millions of users.
>>
>> So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?
>>
>> Again, I do not see much added value, for a service you may only do use
>> once in so many months. The only answers I can come up with have to do with
>> trying to exploit some or whatever. Don't know, don't wanna know, and I am
>> against such. I've been looking around, but not planning to move over
>> within a month or so. Meanwhile letting all my players getting the ID.
>>
>>   ------
>>  *From:* Jimmy Dorry 
>> *To:* Mart-Jan Reeuwijk ; Half-Life dedicated Win32
>> server mailing list 
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 15:17
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server
>> Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?
>>
>> It would be nicer for steam to push changes instead requiring the clients
>> to pull.
>>
>> If you change ip, under the current scheme, you basically have to expect
>> no/reduced favourited joins for 24hours.
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On 26 Feb 2014, at 8:43 pm, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk  wrote:
>>
>> quote: 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>>
>> Do you plan to keep changing your IP's every day? I really don't see the
>> need.
>>
>>   --
>>  *From:* Bottiger 
>> *To:* Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list <
>> hlds@list.valvesoftware.com>
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 2:42
>> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server
>> Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?
>>
>> Thanks for the update. I have a few questions.
>>
>> 1. Does the user need to be online in order to load account ids into
>> their favorites?
>> 2. If people were already logged in right before an IP change does this
>> mean they won't see the new server for another 24 hours?
>> 3. If we leave a notice server up without an account at the old address,
>> will there be no update because there was a working server at that address?
>> 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the fu

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[1nsane]

What about the title of this thread? DDOS.

That's a great reason to update the IP more often. It would allow one to
almost provide continuous service.

IP is under attack so you can nullroute it and start the server on another
IP. Then change it back when needed.


On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk wrote:

> As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then???
>
> It almost sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push the
> changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes would
> be way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly updates to the
> players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of users.
>
> Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
> Server owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or whatever
> hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your playerbase
> informed/moved to the new IP for your server.
>
> I love the new feature, it allows us to give our users that have our
> servers Favorited a good service and keep them when we need to change to a
> new host.
>
> I really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any
> faster. You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over to
> a new IP, and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 days
> everybody will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage days of
> the week, and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24 hours for
> keeping stuff moderate with transferring between servers, clients, keeping
> up with the stuff etc, while they measure what bandwith/CPU costs it
> generates with 10.000s of servers, and millions of users.
>
> So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?
>
> Again, I do not see much added value, for a service you may only do use
> once in so many months. The only answers I can come up with have to do with
> trying to exploit some or whatever. Don't know, don't wanna know, and I am
> against such. I've been looking around, but not planning to move over
> within a month or so. Meanwhile letting all my players getting the ID.
>
>   --
>  *From:* Jimmy Dorry 
> *To:* Mart-Jan Reeuwijk ; Half-Life dedicated Win32
> server mailing list 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 15:17
>
> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts
> Resolve These Issues Now?
>
> It would be nicer for steam to push changes instead requiring the clients
> to pull.
>
> If you change ip, under the current scheme, you basically have to expect
> no/reduced favourited joins for 24hours.
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 26 Feb 2014, at 8:43 pm, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk  wrote:
>
> quote: 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>
> Do you plan to keep changing your IP's every day? I really don't see the
> need.
>
>   --------------
>  *From:* Bottiger 
> *To:* Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list <
> hlds@list.valvesoftware.com>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 2:42
> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts
> Resolve These Issues Now?
>
> Thanks for the update. I have a few questions.
>
> 1. Does the user need to be online in order to load account ids into their
> favorites?
> 2. If people were already logged in right before an IP change does this
> mean they won't see the new server for another 24 hours?
> 3. If we leave a notice server up without an account at the old address,
> will there be no update because there was a working server at that address?
> 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Tony Paloma wrote:
>
>  Yes, you can change IP, port, or both and user's favorites will update
> within a day or the next time they refresh their favorites list thereafter.
> What I mean by that is, the Steam client only asks for updated IP:port
> information at most once every 24 hours. At the same time as that request,
> the Steam client will also look at all the favorites it doesn't know the
> Steam ID for and check to see if it has a persistent account and then fill
> it in if so. So you may want to wait a few days before changing your IP or
> port to ensure people get the Steam update and get a chance to get your
> game server's Steam ID in their favorites list.
>
> *From:* hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:
> hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] *On Behalf Of *Weasels Lair
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 25, 2014 1:19 PM
> *To:* Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list; Half-Life dedicated
> Linux serve

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Mart-Jan Reeuwijk]

As I said: do you plan to change IP that often then??? 

It almost
 sounds like you want to change IP every hour or w/e and push the 
changes to the clients right away...  And pushing all those changes 
would be way too much imo. Its not for playing around with hourly 
updates to the players and pushing all that to 10's of millions of 
users.

Use this feature for what its intended, and long asked for:
Server
 owners near painless changing provider / server / VPS or whatever 
hosting that rare time you need to change this, and have your playerbase
 informed/moved to the new IP for your server.

I love the new 
feature, it allows us to give our users that have our servers Favorited a
 good service and keep them when we need to change to a new host.

I
 really cannot see any greater added value in having this update any 
faster. You know you going to have less players anyway when moving over 
to a new IP, and now they will come back gradually after a day, after 2 
days everybody will be updated. Plan the transition on your lowest usage
 days of the week, and the pain is the least. I think Valve set it to 24
 hours for keeping stuff moderate with transferring between servers, 
clients, keeping up with the stuff etc, while they measure what 
bandwith/CPU costs it generates with 10.000s of servers, and millions of
 users. 

So answer this: why would you want to change that often / fast of IP?

Again,
 I do not see much added value, for a service you may only do use once in so
 many months. The only answers I can come up with have to do with trying
 to exploit some or whatever. Don't know, don't wanna know, and I am 
against such. I've been looking around, but not planning to move over 
within a month or so. Meanwhile letting all my players getting the ID.



>
> From: Jimmy Dorry 
>To: Mart-Jan Reeuwijk ; Half-Life dedicated Win32 server 
>mailing list  
>Sent: Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 15:17
>Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
>Resolve These Issues Now?
> 
>
>
>It would be nicer for steam to push changes instead requiring the clients to 
>pull. 
>
>
>If you change ip, under the current scheme, you basically have to expect 
>no/reduced favourited joins for 24hours.
>
>Sent from my iPad
>
>On 26 Feb 2014, at 8:43 pm, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk  wrote:
>
>
>quote: 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>>
>>Do you plan to keep changing your IP's every day? I really don't see the need.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>____________
>>> From: Bottiger 
>>>To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list 
>>> 
>>>Sent: Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 2:42
>>>Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
>>>Resolve These Issues Now?
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>>Thanks for the update. I have a few questions.
>>>
>>>1. Does the user need to be online in order to load account ids into their 
>>>favorites?
>>>2. If people were already logged in right before an IP change does this mean 
>>>they won't see the new server for another 24 hours?
>>>3. If we leave a notice server up without an account at the old address, 
>>>will there be no update because there was a working server at that address?
>>>4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Tony Paloma  wrote:
>>>
>>>Yes, you can change IP, port, or both and user’s favorites will update 
>>>within a day or the next time they refresh their favorites list thereafter. 
>>>What I mean by that is, the Steam client only asks for updated IP:port 
>>>information at most once every 24 hours. At the same time as that request, 
>>>the Steam client will also look at all the favorites it doesn’t know the 
>>>Steam ID for and check to see if it has a persistent account and then fill 
>>>it in if so. So you may want to wait a few days before changing your IP or 
>>>port to ensure people get the Steam update and get a chance to get your game 
>>>server’s Steam ID in their favorites list.
>>>> 
>>>>From:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com 
>>>>[mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Weasels Lair
>>>>Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 1:19 PM
>>>>To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list; Half-Life dedicated 
>>>>Linux server mailing list
>>>>Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
>>>>Resolve These 

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Jimmy Dorry]

It would be nicer for steam to push changes instead requiring the clients to 
pull. 

If you change ip, under the current scheme, you basically have to expect 
no/reduced favourited joins for 24hours.

Sent from my iPad

> On 26 Feb 2014, at 8:43 pm, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk  wrote:
> 
> quote: 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
> 
> Do you plan to keep changing your IP's every day? I really don't see the need.
> 
> From: Bottiger 
> To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list 
>  
> Sent: Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 2:42
> Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
> Resolve These Issues Now?
> 
> Thanks for the update. I have a few questions.
> 
> 1. Does the user need to be online in order to load account ids into their 
> favorites?
> 2. If people were already logged in right before an IP change does this mean 
> they won't see the new server for another 24 hours?
> 3. If we leave a notice server up without an account at the old address, will 
> there be no update because there was a working server at that address?
> 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
> 
> 
> 
> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Tony Paloma  wrote:
> Yes, you can change IP, port, or both and user’s favorites will update within 
> a day or the next time they refresh their favorites list thereafter. What I 
> mean by that is, the Steam client only asks for updated IP:port information 
> at most once every 24 hours. At the same time as that request, the Steam 
> client will also look at all the favorites it doesn’t know the Steam ID for 
> and check to see if it has a persistent account and then fill it in if so. So 
> you may want to wait a few days before changing your IP or port to ensure 
> people get the Steam update and get a chance to get your game server’s Steam 
> ID in their favorites list.
>  
> From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com 
> [mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Weasels Lair
> Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 1:19 PM
> To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list; Half-Life dedicated Linux 
> server mailing list
> Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
> Resolve These Issues Now?
>  
> Related question to this ...
> In addition to tracking what IP ADDRESS the server moved to, I *assume* it 
> will track the before/after PORT?  In other words ADDRESS:PORT, not just 
> ADDRESS?
> Maybe somebody from Valve could confirm?
>  
> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:16 PM, Mike Vail  wrote:
> I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the following in 
> the General update notes:
>  
> “Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will automatically 
> update to new server IP addresses if the game server is using a persistent 
> account.”
>  
> I’m assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature now, 
> which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP addess(es).
>  
>  
>  
>  
> From: Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net] 
> Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
> To: 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
> Subject: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve 
> These Issues Now?
>  
> So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers almost 
> 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers. The 
> datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don’t have 
> advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so 
> I’m kinda stuck. I don’t even know the nature of the attack because the 
> datacenter isn’t helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30 minutes 
> so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned another 
> server-op who runs a similar server is having the same attacks so it’s likely 
> the same guy trying to take us both down so he can start his own server like 
> ours.
>  
> So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My affected 
> server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant respawn and 
> 100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That’s fine but here’s my 
> question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game server account 
> feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can change the IP 
> and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new server IP 
> address because their favorites will update after the IP change. Is this 
> correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after registering it and 
> people should find the server through their favorites like before even though

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Mart-Jan Reeuwijk]

quote: 4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?

Do you plan to keep changing your IP's every day? I really don't see the need.



>
> From: Bottiger 
>To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list 
> 
>Sent: Wednesday, 26 February 2014, 2:42
>Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
>Resolve These Issues Now?
> 
>
>
>Thanks for the update. I have a few questions.
>
>1. Does the user need to be online in order to load account ids into their 
>favorites?
>2. If people were already logged in right before an IP change does this mean 
>they won't see the new server for another 24 hours?
>3. If we leave a notice server up without an account at the old address, will 
>there be no update because there was a working server at that address?
>4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
>
>
>
>
>
>On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Tony Paloma  wrote:
>
>Yes, you can change IP, port, or both and user’s favorites will update within 
>a day or the next time they refresh their favorites list thereafter. What I 
>mean by that is, the Steam client only asks for updated IP:port information at 
>most once every 24 hours. At the same time as that request, the Steam client 
>will also look at all the favorites it doesn’t know the Steam ID for and check 
>to see if it has a persistent account and then fill it in if so. So you may 
>want to wait a few days before changing your IP or port to ensure people get 
>the Steam update and get a chance to get your game server’s Steam ID in their 
>favorites list.
>> 
>>From:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com 
>>[mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Weasels Lair
>>Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 1:19 PM
>>To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list; Half-Life dedicated Linux 
>>server mailing list
>>Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
>>Resolve These Issues Now?
>> 
>>Related question to this ...
>>In addition to tracking what IP ADDRESS the server moved to, I *assume* it 
>>will track the before/after PORT?  In other words ADDRESS:PORT, not just 
>>ADDRESS?
>>Maybe somebody from Valve could confirm?
>> 
>>On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:16 PM, Mike Vail  wrote:
>>I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the following in 
>>the General update notes:
>> 
>>“Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will automatically 
>>update to new server IP addresses if the game server is using a persistent 
>>account.”
>> 
>>I’m assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature now, 
>>which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP addess(es).
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>From:Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net] 
>>Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
>>To: 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
>>Subject: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve 
>>These Issues Now?
>> 
>>So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers almost 
>>10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers. The 
>>datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don’t have 
>>advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so 
>>I’m kinda stuck. I don’t even know the nature of the attack because the 
>>datacenter isn’t helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30 minutes 
>>so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned another 
>>server-op who runs a similar server is having the same attacks so it’s likely 
>>the same guy trying to take us both down so he can start his own server like 
>>ours.
>> 
>>So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My affected 
>>server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant respawn and 
>>100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That’s fine but here’s my 
>>question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game server account 
>>feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can change the IP 
>>and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new server IP 
>>address because their favorites will update after the IP change. Is this 
>>correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after registering it and 
>>people should find the server through their favorites like before even though 
>>the server won’t work with quick-play right?
>> 
>>Lastly, with game server accounts beco

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Tony Paloma]

Does the user need to be online in order to load account ids into their 
favorites?
Yes. This will happen as soon as they start Steam and it's been > 24 hours 
since the last time the client has refreshed accounts/IPs.

If people were already logged in right before an IP change does this mean they 
won't see the new server for another 24 hours?
Yes

If we leave a notice server up without an account at the old address, will 
there be no update because there was a working server at that address?
The IP will still update even if there is a server running at the old IP 
address.

Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?
It's possible


From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com 
[mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Bottiger
Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 5:42 PM
To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list
Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve 
These Issues Now?

Thanks for the update. I have a few questions.

1. Does the user need to be online in order to load account ids into their 
favorites?
2. If people were already logged in right before an IP change does this mean 
they won't see the new server for another 24 hours?
3. If we leave a notice server up without an account at the old address, will 
there be no update because there was a working server at that address?
4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?


On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Tony Paloma 
mailto:to...@valvesoftware.com>> wrote:
Yes, you can change IP, port, or both and user's favorites will update within a 
day or the next time they refresh their favorites list thereafter. What I mean 
by that is, the Steam client only asks for updated IP:port information at most 
once every 24 hours. At the same time as that request, the Steam client will 
also look at all the favorites it doesn't know the Steam ID for and check to 
see if it has a persistent account and then fill it in if so. So you may want 
to wait a few days before changing your IP or port to ensure people get the 
Steam update and get a chance to get your game server's Steam ID in their 
favorites list.

From: 
hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com<mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com> 
[mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com<mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com>]
 On Behalf Of Weasels Lair
Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 1:19 PM
To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list; Half-Life dedicated Linux 
server mailing list
Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve 
These Issues Now?

Related question to this ...
In addition to tracking what IP ADDRESS the server moved to, I *assume* it will 
track the before/after PORT?  In other words ADDRESS:PORT, not just ADDRESS?
Maybe somebody from Valve could confirm?

On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:16 PM, Mike Vail 
mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net>> wrote:
I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the following in 
the General update notes:

"Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will automatically update 
to new server IP addresses if the game server is using a persistent account."

I'm assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature now, 
which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP addess(es).




From: Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net<mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net>]
Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
To: 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
Subject: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve 
These Issues Now?

So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers almost 10 
years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers. The datacenter 
null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don't have advanced 
firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so I'm kinda 
stuck. I don't even know the nature of the attack because the datacenter isn't 
helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30 minutes so it too is 
useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned another server-op who runs a 
similar server is having the same attacks so it's likely the same guy trying to 
take us both down so he can start his own server like ours.

So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My affected 
server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant respawn and 100% 
crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That's fine but here's my 
question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game server account 
feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can change the IP and 
players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new server IP address 
because their favorites will update after the IP change. Is this correct

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Bottiger]

Thanks for the update. I have a few questions.

1. Does the user need to be online in order to load account ids into their
favorites?
2. If people were already logged in right before an IP change does this
mean they won't see the new server for another 24 hours?
3. If we leave a notice server up without an account at the old address,
will there be no update because there was a working server at that address?
4. Would it be possible to increase the update rate in the future?



On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Tony Paloma wrote:

>  Yes, you can change IP, port, or both and user's favorites will update
> within a day or the next time they refresh their favorites list thereafter.
> What I mean by that is, the Steam client only asks for updated IP:port
> information at most once every 24 hours. At the same time as that request,
> the Steam client will also look at all the favorites it doesn't know the
> Steam ID for and check to see if it has a persistent account and then fill
> it in if so. So you may want to wait a few days before changing your IP or
> port to ensure people get the Steam update and get a chance to get your
> game server's Steam ID in their favorites list.
>
>
>
> *From:* hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:
> hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] *On Behalf Of *Weasels Lair
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 25, 2014 1:19 PM
> *To:* Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list; Half-Life dedicated
> Linux server mailing list
> *Subject:* Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts
> Resolve These Issues Now?
>
>
>
> Related question to this ...
>
> In addition to tracking what IP ADDRESS the server moved to, I *assume* it
> will track the before/after PORT?  In other words ADDRESS:PORT, not just
> ADDRESS?
>
> Maybe somebody from Valve could confirm?
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:16 PM, Mike Vail  wrote:
>
> I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the following
> in the General update notes:
>
>
>
> "Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will automatically
> update to new server IP addresses if the game server is using a persistent
> account."
>
>
>
> I'm assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature
> now, which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP
> addess(es).
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net]
> *Sent:* Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
> *To:* 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
> *Subject:* [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts
> Resolve These Issues Now?
>
>
>
> So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers
> almost 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers.
> The datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don't
> have advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008
> Firewall so I'm kinda stuck. I don't even know the nature of the attack
> because the datacenter isn't helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes
> every 30 minutes so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also
> learned another server-op who runs a similar server is having the same
> attacks so it's likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can
> start his own server like ours.
>
>
>
> So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My
> affected server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant
> respawn and 100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That's fine
> but here's my question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game
> server account feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can
> change the IP and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the
> new server IP address because their favorites will update after the IP
> change. Is this correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after
> registering it and people should find the server through their favorites
> like before even though the server won't work with quick-play right?
>
>
>
> Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make
> since for Valve to game servers' IP addresses from everyone in the future
> so the ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that
> dedicated attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP
> addresses from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of
> attacks by script kiddies.
>
>
>
> What do you guys think?
>
>
>
> Happy Saturday,
>
> Mike
>
>
> __

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Mike Vail]

@Violent Crimes

 

It's  a 24/7 TF2 Mario Kart Server. I've been in touch with a few other
Mario Kart owners and they are having the same problem. It's probably some
guy trying to start his own server and is looking to kill off his
competition. 

 

After the IP was nulled for a few days, the datacenter randomly un-nulled it
and the attacks have stopped. I have no doubt they will start up again.  I
don't want to move the server. I've been hosted in many p[laces and have
been in California for many years. I collocate my own dedi with all my game
servers. Moving the box and changing IPs is an absolute nightmare. Even if I
did, I can't afford to pay more for hosting the box. I don't use 3rd parties
to host. I don't run ads and have very few donors. I pay the datacenter
directly at $135.00/mo. to avoid a middle man. I shopped for weeks to get
that price and no one else came close for the same level of service here. At
this point,  I'd rather shutdown go through another move. A hardware
firewall is simply too costly from what I hear, though I'm still considering
that option. 

 

I know and IP change may not solve my attack problems, but at least I can
try it now that Valve implemented this change.  My hope is that someday IPs
will no longer be listed anywhere so these attacks are a thing of the past.
At least it would make it harder for little kids to start these attacks
anyway.

 

 

From: Violent Crimes [mailto:violentcri...@convictgaming.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 3:49 PM
To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list
Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts
Resolve These Issues Now?

 

Hey Mike what are you running on the server that is getting hit?

On 2/25/2014 4:16 PM, Mike Vail wrote:

I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the following in
the General update notes:

 

"Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will automatically
update to new server IP addresses if the game server is using a persistent
account."

 

I'm assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature now,
which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP addess(es).

 

 

 

 

From: Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net] 
Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
To: 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
Subject: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve
These Issues Now?

 

So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers almost
10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers. The
datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don't have
advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so
I'm kinda stuck. I don't even know the nature of the attack because the
datacenter isn't helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30
minutes so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned
another server-op who runs a similar server is having the same attacks so
it's likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can start his own
server like ours.

 

So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My affected
server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant respawn and
100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That's fine but here's my
question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game server account
feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can change the IP
and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new server IP
address because their favorites will update after the IP change. Is this
correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after registering it and
people should find the server through their favorites like before even
though the server won't work with quick-play right?

 

Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make since
for Valve to game servers' IP addresses from everyone in the future so the
ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that dedicated
attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP addresses
from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of attacks by
script kiddies.

 

What do you guys think?

 

Happy Saturday, 

Mike






___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
please visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

 

___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Violent Crimes]

Hey Mike what are you running on the server that is getting hit?

On 2/25/2014 4:16 PM, Mike Vail wrote:


I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the 
following in the General update notes:


"Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will 
automatically update to new server IP addresses if the game server is 
using a persistent account."


I'm assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature 
now, which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP 
addess(es).


*From:*Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net]
*Sent:* Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
*To:* 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
*Subject:* [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
Resolve These Issues Now?


So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers 
almost 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my 
servers. The datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these 
cases. I don't have advanced firewall protection right now other than 
Windows 2008 Firewall so I'm kinda stuck. I don't even know the nature 
of the attack because the datacenter isn't helpful at all. Wireshark 
hangs and crashes every 30 minutes so it too is useless in identifying 
the attack.  I also learned another server-op who runs a similar 
server is having the same attacks so it's likely the same guy trying 
to take us both down so he can start his own server like ours.


So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My 
affected server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has 
instant respawn and 100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. 
That's fine but here's my question. As I read the recent thread about 
the new Game server account feature, by adding my server to a game 
server account, I can change the IP and players with it saved in their 
favorites will receive the new server IP address because their 
favorites will update after the IP change. Is this correct? If so, I 
should be able to change the IP after registering it and people should 
find the server through their favorites like before even though the 
server won't work with quick-play right?


Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make 
since for Valve to game servers' IP addresses from everyone in the 
future so the ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I 
realize that dedicated attackers will always find a way to do evil, 
but by hiding the IP addresses from players, it may go a long way to 
reducing the frequency of attacks by script kiddies.


What do you guys think?

Happy Saturday,

Mike



___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds


___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Mart-Jan Reeuwijk]

Nice Tony, thnx.

I'd change only after a week or 2 or maybe a month, to allow the ppl that 
aren't online that much (weekends only etc) to have it too. Comm's worked long 
enough to get ppl to favorite the server, that extra couple weeks would not 
change much. Must allow first to get all ppl to populate it in their steam 
client.

Its not fit to negate DDOS attacks, it never was in anyway imo. At earliest a 
day after ppl would be getting the new location, which defeats any DDOS counter 
for the players one has.

But that is my opinion.



>
> From: Tony Paloma 
>To: 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list' 
> 
>Sent: Tuesday, 25 February 2014, 22:28
>Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
>Resolve These Issues Now?
> 
>
>
>Yes, you can change IP, port, or both and user’s favorites will update within 
>a day or the next time they refresh their favorites list thereafter. What I 
>mean by that is, the Steam client only asks for updated IP:port information at 
>most once every 24 hours. At the same time as that request, the Steam client 
>will also look at all the favorites it doesn’t know the Steam ID for and check 
>to see if it has a persistent account and then fill it in if so. So you may 
>want to wait a few days before changing your IP or port to ensure people get 
>the Steam update and get a chance to get your game server’s Steam ID in their 
>favorites list.
> 
>From:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com 
>[mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Weasels Lair
>Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 1:19 PM
>To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list; Half-Life dedicated Linux 
>server mailing list
>Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts 
>Resolve These Issues Now?
> 
>Related question to this ...
>In addition to tracking what IP ADDRESS the server moved to, I *assume* it 
>will track the before/after PORT?  In other words ADDRESS:PORT, not just 
>ADDRESS?
>Maybe somebody from Valve could confirm?
> 
>On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:16 PM, Mike Vail  wrote:
>I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the following in 
>the General update notes:
> 
>“Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will automatically update 
>to new server IP addresses if the game server is using a persistent account.”
> 
>I’m assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature now, 
>which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP addess(es).
> 
> 
> 
> 
>From:Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net] 
>Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
>To: 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
>Subject: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve 
>These Issues Now?
> 
>So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers almost 
>10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers. The 
>datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don’t have 
>advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so I’m 
>kinda stuck. I don’t even know the nature of the attack because the datacenter 
>isn’t helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30 minutes so it too 
>is useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned another server-op who 
>runs a similar server is having the same attacks so it’s likely the same guy 
>trying to take us both down so he can start his own server like ours.
> 
>So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My affected 
>server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant respawn and 
>100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That’s fine but here’s my 
>question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game server account 
>feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can change the IP and 
>players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new server IP 
>address because their favorites will update after the IP change. Is this 
>correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after registering it and 
>people should find the server through their favorites like before even though 
>the server won’t work with quick-play right?
> 
>Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make since 
>for Valve to game servers’ IP addresses from everyone in the future so the 
>ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that dedicated 
>attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP addresses 
>from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of attacks by 
>script kiddies.
> 
>What do you guys think?
> 
>Happy Satu

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Mike Vail]

I still have all my servers in my favorites thank God. I run a Windows 7 Steam 
Client. It would suck if a bunch of players lost their favorites over this like 
1nsane did!

-Original Message-
From: ics [mailto:i...@ics-base.net] 
Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 1:30 PM
To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list
Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve 
These Issues Now?

Many people complain the same thing on our servers.

Also, while steam supports this feature, there is only 1 game that supports 
this atm.

-ics

1nsane kirjoitti:
> Soon as I got this update all my favorites were deleted.
>
> Anyone else had this issue happen to them?
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Mike Vail  <mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net>> wrote:
>
> I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the
> following in the General update notes:
>
> “Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will
> automatically update to new server IP addresses if the game server
> is using a persistent account.”
>
> I’m assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client
> feature now, which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change
> their IP addess(es).
>
> *From:*Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net
> <mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net>]
> *Sent:* Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
> *To:* 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
> *Subject:* [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server
> Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?
>
> So this week for the first time since I started running Valve
> servers almost 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one
> of my servers. The datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical
> in these cases. I don’t have advanced firewall protection right
> now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so I’m kinda stuck. I don’t
> even know the nature of the attack because the datacenter isn’t
> helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30 minutes so it
> too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned another
> server-op who runs a similar server is having the same attacks so
> it’s likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can
> start his own server like ours.
>
> So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts.
> My affected server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has
> instant respawn and 100% crits, which disqualifies it from
> Quick-play. That’s fine but here’s my question. As I read the
> recent thread about the new Game server account feature, by adding
> my server to a game server account, I can change the IP and
> players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new
> server IP address because their favorites will update after the IP
> change. Is this correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP
> after registering it and people should find the server through
> their favorites like before even though the server won’t work with
> quick-play right?
>
> Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not
> make since for Valve to game servers’ IP addresses from everyone
> in the future so the ability to attack them would be greatly
> diminished? I realize that dedicated attackers will always find a
> way to do evil, but by hiding the IP addresses from players, it
> may go a long way to reducing the frequency of attacks by script
> kiddies.
>
> What do you guys think?
>
> Happy Saturday,
>
> Mike
>
>
> ___
> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list
> archives, please visit:
> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds
>
>
>
>
> ___
> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
> visit:
> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds


___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds


___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[ics]

Many people complain the same thing on our servers.

Also, while steam supports this feature, there is only 1 game that 
supports this atm.


-ics

1nsane kirjoitti:

Soon as I got this update all my favorites were deleted.

Anyone else had this issue happen to them?


On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Mike Vail > wrote:


I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the
following in the General update notes:

“Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will
automatically update to new server IP addresses if the game server
is using a persistent account.”

I’m assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client
feature now, which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change
their IP addess(es).

*From:*Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net
]
*Sent:* Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
*To:* 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
*Subject:* [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server
Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

So this week for the first time since I started running Valve
servers almost 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one
of my servers. The datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical
in these cases. I don’t have advanced firewall protection right
now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so I’m kinda stuck. I don’t
even know the nature of the attack because the datacenter isn’t
helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30 minutes so it
too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned another
server-op who runs a similar server is having the same attacks so
it’s likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can
start his own server like ours.

So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts.
My affected server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has
instant respawn and 100% crits, which disqualifies it from
Quick-play. That’s fine but here’s my question. As I read the
recent thread about the new Game server account feature, by adding
my server to a game server account, I can change the IP and
players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new
server IP address because their favorites will update after the IP
change. Is this correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP
after registering it and people should find the server through
their favorites like before even though the server won’t work with
quick-play right?

Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not
make since for Valve to game servers’ IP addresses from everyone
in the future so the ability to attack them would be greatly
diminished? I realize that dedicated attackers will always find a
way to do evil, but by hiding the IP addresses from players, it
may go a long way to reducing the frequency of attacks by script
kiddies.

What do you guys think?

Happy Saturday,

Mike


___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list
archives, please visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds




___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds



___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Tony Paloma]

Yes, you can change IP, port, or both and user's favorites will update within a 
day or the next time they refresh their favorites list thereafter. What I mean 
by that is, the Steam client only asks for updated IP:port information at most 
once every 24 hours. At the same time as that request, the Steam client will 
also look at all the favorites it doesn't know the Steam ID for and check to 
see if it has a persistent account and then fill it in if so. So you may want 
to wait a few days before changing your IP or port to ensure people get the 
Steam update and get a chance to get your game server's Steam ID in their 
favorites list.

From: hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com 
[mailto:hlds-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Weasels Lair
Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 1:19 PM
To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list; Half-Life dedicated Linux 
server mailing list
Subject: Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve 
These Issues Now?

Related question to this ...
In addition to tracking what IP ADDRESS the server moved to, I *assume* it will 
track the before/after PORT?  In other words ADDRESS:PORT, not just ADDRESS?
Maybe somebody from Valve could confirm?

On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:16 PM, Mike Vail 
mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net>> wrote:
I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the following in 
the General update notes:

"Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will automatically update 
to new server IP addresses if the game server is using a persistent account."

I'm assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature now, 
which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP addess(es).




From: Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net<mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net>]
Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
To: 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
Subject: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve 
These Issues Now?

So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers almost 10 
years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers. The datacenter 
null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don't have advanced 
firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so I'm kinda 
stuck. I don't even know the nature of the attack because the datacenter isn't 
helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30 minutes so it too is 
useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned another server-op who runs a 
similar server is having the same attacks so it's likely the same guy trying to 
take us both down so he can start his own server like ours.

So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My affected 
server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant respawn and 100% 
crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That's fine but here's my 
question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game server account 
feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can change the IP and 
players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new server IP address 
because their favorites will update after the IP change. Is this correct? If 
so, I should be able to change the IP after registering it and people should 
find the server through their favorites like before even though the server 
won't work with quick-play right?

Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make since 
for Valve to game servers' IP addresses from everyone in the future so the 
ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that dedicated 
attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP addresses 
from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of attacks by 
script kiddies.

What do you guys think?

Happy Saturday,
Mike

___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[1nsane]

Soon as I got this update all my favorites were deleted.

Anyone else had this issue happen to them?


On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Mike Vail  wrote:

> I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the following
> in the General update notes:
>
>
>
> "Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will automatically
> update to new server IP addresses if the game server is using a persistent
> account."
>
>
>
> I'm assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature
> now, which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP
> addess(es).
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net]
> *Sent:* Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
> *To:* 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
> *Subject:* [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts
> Resolve These Issues Now?
>
>
>
> So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers
> almost 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers.
> The datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don't
> have advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008
> Firewall so I'm kinda stuck. I don't even know the nature of the attack
> because the datacenter isn't helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes
> every 30 minutes so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also
> learned another server-op who runs a similar server is having the same
> attacks so it's likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can
> start his own server like ours.
>
>
>
> So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My
> affected server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant
> respawn and 100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That's fine
> but here's my question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game
> server account feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can
> change the IP and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the
> new server IP address because their favorites will update after the IP
> change. Is this correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after
> registering it and people should find the server through their favorites
> like before even though the server won't work with quick-play right?
>
>
>
> Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make
> since for Valve to game servers' IP addresses from everyone in the future
> so the ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that
> dedicated attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP
> addresses from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of
> attacks by script kiddies.
>
>
>
> What do you guys think?
>
>
>
> Happy Saturday,
>
> Mike
>
> ___
> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
> please visit:
> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds
>
>
___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Weasels Lair]

Related question to this ...
In addition to tracking what IP ADDRESS the server moved to, I *assume* it
will track the before/after PORT?  In other words ADDRESS:PORT, not just
ADDRESS?
Maybe somebody from Valve could confirm?


On Tue, Feb 25, 2014 at 1:16 PM, Mike Vail  wrote:

> I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the following
> in the General update notes:
>
>
>
> "Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will automatically
> update to new server IP addresses if the game server is using a persistent
> account."
>
>
>
> I'm assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature
> now, which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP
> addess(es).
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net]
> *Sent:* Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
> *To:* 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
> *Subject:* [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts
> Resolve These Issues Now?
>
>
>
> So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers
> almost 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers.
> The datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don't
> have advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008
> Firewall so I'm kinda stuck. I don't even know the nature of the attack
> because the datacenter isn't helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes
> every 30 minutes so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also
> learned another server-op who runs a similar server is having the same
> attacks so it's likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can
> start his own server like ours.
>
>
>
> So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My
> affected server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant
> respawn and 100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That's fine
> but here's my question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game
> server account feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can
> change the IP and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the
> new server IP address because their favorites will update after the IP
> change. Is this correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after
> registering it and people should find the server through their favorites
> like before even though the server won't work with quick-play right?
>
>
>
> Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make
> since for Valve to game servers' IP addresses from everyone in the future
> so the ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that
> dedicated attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP
> addresses from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of
> attacks by script kiddies.
>
>
>
> What do you guys think?
>
>
>
> Happy Saturday,
>
> Mike
>
> ___
> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
> please visit:
> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds
>
>
___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Mike Vail]

I just got a Steam Client update this morning that included the following in
the General update notes:

 

"Add IP tracking to game server favorites. Favorites will automatically
update to new server IP addresses if the game server is using a persistent
account."

 

I'm assuming that this feature is no longer just a beta client feature now,
which is wonderful news for anyone looking to change their IP addess(es).

 

 

 

 

From: Mike Vail [mailto:supp...@boomgaming.net] 
Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:49 AM
To: 'Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list'
Subject: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve
These Issues Now?

 

So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers almost
10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers. The
datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don't have
advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so
I'm kinda stuck. I don't even know the nature of the attack because the
datacenter isn't helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30
minutes so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned
another server-op who runs a similar server is having the same attacks so
it's likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can start his own
server like ours.

 

So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My affected
server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant respawn and
100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That's fine but here's my
question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game server account
feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can change the IP
and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new server IP
address because their favorites will update after the IP change. Is this
correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after registering it and
people should find the server through their favorites like before even
though the server won't work with quick-play right?

 

Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make since
for Valve to game servers' IP addresses from everyone in the future so the
ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that dedicated
attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP addresses
from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of attacks by
script kiddies.

 

What do you guys think?

 

Happy Saturday, 

Mike

___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Kevin]

On 2/15/2014 3:09 PM, Kyle Sanderson wrote:

If so, I should be able to change the IP after registering it and people should 
find the server
through their favorites like before even though the server won’t work with 
quick-play right?

Propagation if I can recall correctly is designed to take a few days.
Admittedly, I tested the feature about a week and a half ago, as of
Friday (yesterday) the old address still exists. However, that was
using CS:S (albeit I only ported the test server after it officially
shipped in TF); the beta client was still in development.

You should test moving servers before trying this, being doubly hooped
is the worst.
Kyle.

On Sat, Feb 15, 2014 at 10:48 AM, Mike Vail  wrote:

So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers almost
10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers. The
datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don’t have
advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so
I’m kinda stuck. I don’t even know the nature of the attack because the
datacenter isn’t helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30
minutes so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned
another server-op who runs a similar server is having the same attacks so
it’s likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can start his own
server like ours.



So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My affected
server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant respawn and
100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That’s fine but here’s my
question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game server account
feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can change the IP
and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new server IP
address because their favorites will update after the IP change. Is this
correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after registering it and
people should find the server through their favorites like before even
though the server won’t work with quick-play right?



Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make since
for Valve to game servers’ IP addresses from everyone in the future so the
ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that dedicated
attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP addresses
from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of attacks by
script kiddies.



What do you guys think?



Happy Saturday,

Mike


___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
please visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds


___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds
In my testing it took a few minutes for the new address to be applied to 
my favorites file. Tested in TF2.


___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Kyle Sanderson]

> If so, I should be able to change the IP after registering it and people 
> should find the server
> through their favorites like before even though the server won’t work with 
> quick-play right?

Propagation if I can recall correctly is designed to take a few days.
Admittedly, I tested the feature about a week and a half ago, as of
Friday (yesterday) the old address still exists. However, that was
using CS:S (albeit I only ported the test server after it officially
shipped in TF); the beta client was still in development.

You should test moving servers before trying this, being doubly hooped
is the worst.
Kyle.

On Sat, Feb 15, 2014 at 10:48 AM, Mike Vail  wrote:
> So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers almost
> 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers. The
> datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don’t have
> advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008 Firewall so
> I’m kinda stuck. I don’t even know the nature of the attack because the
> datacenter isn’t helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes every 30
> minutes so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also learned
> another server-op who runs a similar server is having the same attacks so
> it’s likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can start his own
> server like ours.
>
>
>
> So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My affected
> server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant respawn and
> 100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That’s fine but here’s my
> question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game server account
> feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can change the IP
> and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the new server IP
> address because their favorites will update after the IP change. Is this
> correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after registering it and
> people should find the server through their favorites like before even
> though the server won’t work with quick-play right?
>
>
>
> Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make since
> for Valve to game servers’ IP addresses from everyone in the future so the
> ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that dedicated
> attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP addresses
> from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of attacks by
> script kiddies.
>
>
>
> What do you guys think?
>
>
>
> Happy Saturday,
>
> Mike
>
>
> ___
> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
> please visit:
> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds
>

___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Weasels Lair]

Well, changing the IP address might provide "temporary" relief from a
denial of service attack.  But, if your servers are being specifically
targeted, then sooner or later whoever is doing that is going to notice and
look-up your servers new IP address and start hitting that.

Of course, if its not just your server being attacked but perhaps an entire
block of IP addressed that your server happens to be part of (perhaps
because somebody has a grudge against your hosting provider), then changing
to another IP address from that same hosting provider might not help at all.


On Sat, Feb 15, 2014 at 10:57 AM, Nomaan Ahmad  wrote:

> It's very easy to find out the IP even if its not publicly shown. An
> example would be joining your server with wireshark running.
>
>
> On 15 February 2014 18:48, Mike Vail  wrote:
>
>> So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers
>> almost 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers.
>> The datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don't
>> have advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008
>> Firewall so I'm kinda stuck. I don't even know the nature of the attack
>> because the datacenter isn't helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes
>> every 30 minutes so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also
>> learned another server-op who runs a similar server is having the same
>> attacks so it's likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can
>> start his own server like ours.
>>
>>
>>
>> So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My
>> affected server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant
>> respawn and 100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That's fine
>> but here's my question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game
>> server account feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can
>> change the IP and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the
>> new server IP address because their favorites will update after the IP
>> change. Is this correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after
>> registering it and people should find the server through their favorites
>> like before even though the server won't work with quick-play right?
>>
>>
>>
>> Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make
>> since for Valve to game servers' IP addresses from everyone in the future
>> so the ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that
>> dedicated attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP
>> addresses from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of
>> attacks by script kiddies.
>>
>>
>>
>> What do you guys think?
>>
>>
>>
>> Happy Saturday,
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> ___
>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
>> please visit:
>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds
>>
>>
>
> ___
> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
> please visit:
> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds
>
>
___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Kevin]

On 2/15/2014 1:48 PM, Mike Vail wrote:


So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers 
almost 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my 
servers. The datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these 
cases. I don't have advanced firewall protection right now other than 
Windows 2008 Firewall so I'm kinda stuck. I don't even know the nature 
of the attack because the datacenter isn't helpful at all. Wireshark 
hangs and crashes every 30 minutes so it too is useless in identifying 
the attack.  I also learned another server-op who runs a similar 
server is having the same attacks so it's likely the same guy trying 
to take us both down so he can start his own server like ours.


So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My 
affected server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has 
instant respawn and 100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. 
That's fine but here's my question. As I read the recent thread about 
the new Game server account feature, by adding my server to a game 
server account, I can change the IP and players with it saved in their 
favorites will receive the new server IP address because their 
favorites will update after the IP change. Is this correct? If so, I 
should be able to change the IP after registering it and people should 
find the server through their favorites like before even though the 
server won't work with quick-play right?


Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make 
since for Valve to game servers' IP addresses from everyone in the 
future so the ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I 
realize that dedicated attackers will always find a way to do evil, 
but by hiding the IP addresses from players, it may go a long way to 
reducing the frequency of attacks by script kiddies.


What do you guys think?

Happy Saturday,

Mike



___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds
You could move the game server to another IP and keep it in everyone's 
favorites, yes. Remember this feature is only implemented in the beta 
client, so most players will not have the game servers ID saved. When 
all clients have this feature enabled, if you start a new server(on a 
new IP) with the same steam ID, the master server should be updated, and 
when clients favorites get synced it should show the new servers IP.


With that said, null routing is not "the norm" for the best GSPs. A 
better action to take would be moving to a quality host that can handle 
DDOS attacks after valve implements this feature. Email me directly and 
I will tell you more about said host.


Anyone looking in a simple tool like resource monitor can see traffic 
flowing to a game server from their hl2.exe process. Hiding game server 
IPs will (probably)never be possible.
___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds

Re: [hlds] IP Changes & DDOS Attacks - Do Game Server Accounts Resolve These Issues Now?

[Nomaan Ahmad]

It's very easy to find out the IP even if its not publicly shown. An
example would be joining your server with wireshark running.


On 15 February 2014 18:48, Mike Vail  wrote:

> So this week for the first time since I started running Valve servers
> almost 10 years ago, I began getting ddos attacked on one of my servers.
> The datacenter null-routed the IP, which is typical in these cases. I don't
> have advanced firewall protection right now other than Windows 2008
> Firewall so I'm kinda stuck. I don't even know the nature of the attack
> because the datacenter isn't helpful at all. Wireshark hangs and crashes
> every 30 minutes so it too is useless in identifying the attack.  I also
> learned another server-op who runs a similar server is having the same
> attacks so it's likely the same guy trying to take us both down so he can
> start his own server like ours.
>
>
>
> So then I started thinking about these new game server accounts. My
> affected server is by no means stock. It runs a custom map, has instant
> respawn and 100% crits, which disqualifies it from Quick-play. That's fine
> but here's my question. As I read the recent thread about the new Game
> server account feature, by adding my server to a game server account, I can
> change the IP and players with it saved in their favorites will receive the
> new server IP address because their favorites will update after the IP
> change. Is this correct? If so, I should be able to change the IP after
> registering it and people should find the server through their favorites
> like before even though the server won't work with quick-play right?
>
>
>
> Lastly, with game server accounts becoming the norm, would it not make
> since for Valve to game servers' IP addresses from everyone in the future
> so the ability to attack them would be greatly diminished? I realize that
> dedicated attackers will always find a way to do evil, but by hiding the IP
> addresses from players, it may go a long way to reducing the frequency of
> attacks by script kiddies.
>
>
>
> What do you guys think?
>
>
>
> Happy Saturday,
>
> Mike
>
> ___
> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
> please visit:
> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds
>
>
___
To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please 
visit:
https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds