AW: [Hornlist] Question about tone produced from different alloys.
Dear Diana, I hope that this quick response finds you well in Florida. I have assembled a few things for you to think about. Keep in mind that many people have differences of opinion when it comes to this subject, but I hope to provide you with somewhat of a standard as to the differences materials offer players. First and foremost, when thinking about material, we must compare apples to apples. What I mean is that if you compare a nickel silver instrument with a large throat bell to a yellow brass instrument with a more narrow throat bell we have no "constant" for our evaluation. So for the purposes of this exercise let's compare 3 Conn 8D horns to one another. With each instrument having the same sized bell, a more clear understanding of material effects can be noted. Bright to Dark is in this order: Nickel Silver, Yellow Brass, Gold Brass (also known as Red or Rose) Typically nickel silver is used on large bell horns because of it's bright characteristics. It tends to "clean up" the thick dark tone the large bell throat of an 8D is known for. The extra brightness helps the sound carry, and also picks up on microphones in the studio very well. Yellow brass offers a darker sound than nickel silver but the sound tends to be a bit more compact and muddy when you play. Yellow brass for this reason is normally used on horns with a slightly smaller bell throat which naturally brightens the sound and helps it carry to the back of the hall. Gold Brass is like yellow brass but with more copper in the alloy. This material is very interesting. It offers a dark rich sound in medium to low dynamics but at the compromise of a slightly slower response. At louder dynamics this material can easily get away from you and sound very edgy and bright. Nasty and untamed. Many professional players enjoy gold brass but may choose yellow brass instead because of this inconsistent, volatile nature. Also, many say that gold brass is brighter than yellow brass. This is a common misconception through a lack of seeing the "whole picture". But with all that said, it can certainly be a lot of fun to play. Keep in mind that horn players all have their own ideas of sound in respects to equipment, I offer you these characteristics to open your mind to the possibilities each material offers and to take that information with you when you choose to play test them. Please don't forget the importance of comparing apples to apples. An apple is an apple, but they come in different colors and tastes. Good luck and best wishes, PS. If you do speak with M. Stebelton, please send her my regards... Sincerely, Scott H. Bacon Sales, Marketing, and Service Verkauf, Marketing, und Service Specialist in French Horn Spezialist für Waldhorn Musikhaus Dürk Steuerstraße 16a 55411 Bingen - Dromersheim Germany Telephone: 49 ((0)6725) 1507 Fax: 49 ((0)6725) 6307 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Website: www.DuerkHorns.de. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Auftrag von Diana Li Lambert Gesendet: Donnerstag, 9. Oktober 2003 21:06 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Betreff: [Hornlist] Question about tone produced from different alloys. Hi everyone, This is the first time posting to this list, but I hope you guys can help me out. I've never owned my own horn, always borrowed, and I just had to give my horn back to it's owner. I'd like to buy my own very soon and have seen some conflicting information about the tone produced from different metals. I've read that the warmth of the tone increases in this order: yellow brass, rose brass, nickel silver. I've played on brass and nickel and I must say that the tone seemed to be whatever I made of it, but if I'm going to finally buy a horn I want to make sure and get one that fits best. Has anyone noticed striking differences between these metals? Thanks Diana Li Lambert Department of Oceanography Florida State University Tallahassee, FL 32306-4320 (850) 644-2599 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/s.bacon%40duerkhorns.de ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc
Best choice for a warm tone is single F brass, but what to do with the high notes ? Get a Bb-side added. If the Bb-side does not satify for the extreme high, get a high F added, etc. If the sound is quite small then, get a bigger bell added. If the sound is not warm enough then, get a red brass bell or perhaps a red brass lead pipe. You complain, that the sound gets dull then. Well, change the red brass bell against a yellow brass or nickel silver bell. The sound gets to brassy then. Well, put a "kranz" on the bell. The overall sound has become too dull now. Change the tubings against narrower tubings, perhaps entirely of nickel silver. How about changing the mouth piece: a silver mpc for the heavy stuff, brass for the mpah & titanium light weight for the chamber music. And the lacquer effect ? Take advantage of clean hands by lacquering the bell inside. To avoid the permanent polishing of the horn, get it plated. If the light reflex does disturb the camera men, get the horn shaved a bit with sand paper. Valves are too slow. Get a very thin oil. But now you cannot feel the valve action. Put some fat inside & they will stick. The same for the slides if too lose or too tight. Some people swear upon lightly leak valves as they - so they say - provide better slurs ??? Others like them tight absolutely. You have the choice of plating the valves or "over fitting". Some notes are not in tune perfectly. Add a special valve here & there at the tubing. It might help. The screw bell is very practical, if you complain about the odd horn case. But doesn´t a gig-bag look funny also ? If you cut your bell & find the sound has changed too much, there is a way to re-solder the bell. If some notes do not speak so well, try the special trick of inserting a thread into one of the slides. But then another note may not speak so well. Insert another thread into a different slide. You have six valve slides at least plus the several tuning slides. A combination of them would bring multiple chances to improve your horn. And all this effort did not make you the "master of horns". Well, how about changing or exchanging YOURSELF - or at least the way of PLAYING the horn ? The best solution at all, but with the side effect that it is at no cost. The last choice: if you have spent all your money for horn modifications & it does not work properly still, lift it up in the air & smash it to the bottom & jump on it - to end the terror (for you & the listeners). Prof.Hans Pizka, Pf.1136 D-85541 Kirchheim - Germany Fax: 49 89 903-9414 Phone: 903-9548 home: www.pizka.de email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc
I enjoyed that letter Hans. I can't begin to tell you how many people think that by getting their ultimate horn (and sadly I used to think this way) that all of a sudden your mistakes would all and dissappear and then magically you could play like Baumann. Wrong. I find that now that I own a superb horn I actually have to work harder because every hint of a bad habit is clearly audible or visible and of course unless you have a really awful instrument the horn is never at fault. I recently had to send my Schmid to Osmun to get a few repairs done and won't have it back until next Wednesday or so and I'm having to use a school owned Yamaha 668. I don't like the horn at all - it's non-responsive, clunky, heavy, and this particular one is extremely stuffy. Plus there's a silly finger hook which drives me crazy (I have small hands and as such never play with duck's feet or finger hooks because they cause more problems than solutions). In fact I'm not sure why people play with those things other than grip... seems to me they just add unnecessary pressure. There are times when I wish to blame the horn incessantly. However even though sometimes with a bad instrument you can't be a miracle worker; a decent player can make anything sound good. And, despite the "challenges" with it, I still practice as I normally would, working on things I'm supposed to. The sound is in you, not your Horn. -William PS: Speaking of Yamahas, every one I've ever played on is stuffy. Has anyone else had this experience or is it just me and my personal preferences? In a message dated 10/10/2003 5:05:42 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Subj: [Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc > Date: 10/10/2003 5:05:42 AM Pacific Daylight Time > From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Reply-to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">[EMAIL PROTECTED] > To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent from the Internet > > > > Best choice for a warm tone is single F brass, but what to do with the > high notes ? > > Get a Bb-side added. > > If the Bb-side does not satify for the extreme high, get a high F added, > etc. > > If the sound is quite small then, get a bigger bell added. > > If the sound is not warm enough then, get a red brass bell or perhaps a > red brass lead pipe. > > You complain, that the sound gets dull then. Well, change the red brass > bell against a yellow brass or nickel silver bell. > > The sound gets to brassy then. Well, put a "kranz" on the bell. > > The overall sound has become too dull now. Change the tubings against > narrower tubings, perhaps entirely of nickel silver. > > How about changing the mouth piece: a silver mpc for the heavy stuff, > brass for the mpah &titanium light weight for the chamber music. > > And the lacquer effect ? Take advantage of clean hands by lacquering the > bell inside. To avoid the permanent polishing of the horn, get it > plated. If the light reflex does disturb the camera men, get the horn > shaved a bit with sand paper. > > Valves are too slow. Get a very thin oil. But now you cannot feel the > valve action. Put some fat inside &they will stick. The same for the > slides if too lose or too tight. > > Some people swear upon lightly leak valves as they - so they say - > provide better slurs ??? Others like them tight absolutely. You have the > choice of plating the valves or "over fitting". > > Some notes are not in tune perfectly. Add a special valve here &there > at the tubing. It might help. > > The screw bell is very practical, if you complain about the odd horn > case. But doesn´t a gig-bag look funny also ? > > If you cut your bell &find the sound has changed too much, there is a > way to re-solder the bell. > > If some notes do not speak so well, try the special trick of inserting a > thread into one of the slides. But then another note may not speak so > well. Insert another thread into a different slide. You have six valve > slides at least plus the several tuning slides. A combination of them > would bring multiple chances to improve your horn. > > And all this effort did not make you the "master of horns". > > Well, how about changing or exchanging YOURSELF - or at least the way of > PLAYING the horn ? The best solution at all, but with the side effect > that it is at no cost. > > The last choice: if you have spent all your money for horn modifications > &it does not work properly still, lift it up in the air &smash it to > the bottom &jump on it - to end the terror (for you &the listeners). > > > Prof.Hans Pizka, Pf.1136 > D-85541 Kirchheim - Germany > Fax: 49 89 903-9414 Phone: 903-9548 > home: www.pizka.de > email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > ___ > post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > set your options at > http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/valkhorn%40aol.com > ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc
William asked: PS: Speaking of Yamahas, every one I've ever played on is stuffy. Has anyone else had this experience or is it just me and my personal preferences? --- I played a Yamaha 862 for several years and found it to be as open, or even more open, than an 8D. If I remember correctly, the 668, 668V, and 868 are also all Kruspe wraps, like the 862, but are constructed with a "tighter", or more compressed, wrap. I have not played any of the x68 Yamahas, but perhaps the tighter wrap results in the horn being less open. I believe your opinion of Yamahas always being stuffy would change if you played 10 minutes on an 862. Fred ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc
I've played the triples before but I've never played the Customs. I would expect a Yamaha Custom to be much better than the standard-issue 668 from what I hear about them. However some factories' "higher models" of horns like Holton (the 105 Tuckwell) don't feel much different than the regular 179's and 180's to me. In regards to the 8D, I've never been a real fan of them. I've played 8Ds from the 30's to the 50's and 60's to the 90's and even a brand new one from 2002 and they're just, well... not to my taste in what I want in a Horn. I'd much prefer something lighter and smaller. I find large horns just eventually get in the way for me because I'm not a big guy, I have small hands, and I'd rather just practice and not have to think about so much weight or having to reach so far for the spatulas. At least Schmids enable you to move the spatulas closer or further back, not to mention enabling one to transpose the entire instrument a half step higher or lower (that's invaluable). Of course, I'm a Schmid-a-holic now, and I haven't found a single horn that I've played that I like better, although the Paxman 25's and the Alex 1103's do come close in my opinion :P Finally, it is just opinion from my take on things. Different strokes are for different folks. -William In a message dated 10/10/2003 7:49:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > Subj: RE: [Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc > Date: 10/10/2003 7:49:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time > From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Reply-to: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">[EMAIL PROTECTED] > To: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]">[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent from the Internet > > > > William asked: > > PS: Speaking of Yamahas, every one I've ever played on is stuffy. Has anyone > else had this experience or is it just me and my personal preferences? > > --- > > I played a Yamaha 862 for several years and found it to be as open, or even > more open, than an 8D. If I remember correctly, the 668, 668V, and 868 are > also all Kruspe wraps, like the 862, but are constructed with a "tighter", > or more compressed, wrap. I have not played any of the x68 Yamahas, but > perhaps the tighter wrap results in the horn being less open. I believe > your opinion of Yamahas always being stuffy would change if you played 10 > minutes on an 862. > > Fred > > ___ > post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > set your options at > http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/valkhorn%40aol.com > ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Question about tone produced from different alloys.
There is another difference between the alloys that is of practical nature: the hardness. Nickel silver is the hardest of the three and does not dent so easily; however, it is also harder to repair. Rose brass is the softest; it will dent if you look at it cross-eyed (or if is Cabbaged, even by brussels sprouts). My rose brass horn has a couple of small dents that mysteriously appeared. It turned out that I had very lightly bumped it against the mouthpiece while I was putting it away. Just a non-musical consideration. Herb Foster - Original Message - From: "Diana Li Lambert" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 3:05 PM Subject: [Hornlist] Question about tone produced from different alloys. > Hi everyone, > This is the first time posting to this list, but I hope you guys can help > me out. I've never owned my own horn, always borrowed, and I just had to > give my horn back to it's owner. I'd like to buy my own very soon and have > seen some conflicting information about the tone produced from different > metals. I've read that the warmth of the tone increases in this order: > yellow brass, rose brass, nickel silver. I've played on brass and nickel > and I must say that the tone seemed to be whatever I made of it, but if I'm > going to finally buy a horn I want to make sure and get one that fits > best. Has anyone noticed striking differences between these metals? Thanks __ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Cryogenics
Hello all, Anyone have their horn cryogenically treated? I had an opportunity about 5 years ago to have it done for LITERALLY $25 but, back then, I never heard of such a process and thought it utter nonsense. Over the last 2 or 3 years I've been hearing stories of how wonderful it is... Anyone have any experience with this or know of anyone who has had it done? Any thoughts on it? Alex Mastrando New Milford, NJ USA ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Cryogenics
My horn is 12 years old and I considered it at one time, however "resonance enhancing" as I've heard it called supposedly ages the instrument to make it play as if it were older. http://www.osmun.com/services/re.htm";>http://www.osmun.com/services/re.htm I have thought about it from time to time but I'm not totally sure about it. The next thing on my agenda for my Horn when it comes back from Osmun will probably be the larger leadpipe and a different mouthpiece and since I'll probably have to have my leadpipe changed out up there anyways during the summer I may as well try the resonance enhancement for the fun of it although if it's irreversable I think so I'm not too sure if I want to try it. Just out of curiosity, is there a way to get some sort of screw system attached to your horn to enable you to swap out different leadpipes? I would love to try out the larger Schmid leadpipe but well I don't want it to be permanent in case I'm not completely sold on it. -William ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Rauch Horns
I live in NJ and am looking to try a Rauch Horn. I have heard many great things about these horns but cannot seem to find anybody who owns one. If anyone knows where I can go, aside from Norway and Minnesota, to play a Rauch please email me at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank you, Dan Wions ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Fwd: [Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc
Begin forwarded message: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri Oct 10, 2003 10:23:04 AM America/Chicago To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc Or an 861 or 867 for that matter- even a good 667. I see no problem in experimenting with equipment but when it affects your practice time stop! Nascar or Formula 1 would be pretty damn boring if every racer didn't have a trick up his sleeve to make his car faster. Recently I switched to a geyer wrap horn after being a tugboat player for my entire life. If I didn't experiment I probably never would have known how easy horn playing is again because I was really struggling on the Kruspe wrap. I didn't have any finesse and my sole goal was loud obnoxious playing- the reason being, I couldn't play soft no matter how hard or less I put into the horn. It's kind of like financial freedom in a way- you just don't know until you get there, but if you never get there you're screwed! Enough metaphors for today, Hoss ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Throwin' the high heat (NHR)
On Thursday, October 9, 2003, at 09:42 PM, Timothy A. Johnson wrote: Well, a bit, though in baseball you don't stop for tea, and usually events occur in less time than an elephant's gestation period. Absolutely true. And it _still_ manages to be just as boring. Tom -- My ol' grandaddy taught me to always; post in plain text, quote only that portion to which you are replying, post replies at the bottom. ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] (NHR) cold sores
The idea of lancing the blisters - if you let it get that far - makes one shiver - but I reckon it speeds up the process as you remove the nasty - BUT BEWARE of the fluid within - it is highly contagious and you MUST soak it up and dispose straight away, not reusing the dab to mop up anymore. I have a friend who, not knowing what a cold sore was, scratched, then scratched an itch on her shoulder and now gets an outbreak there too. There is a product called Dimethylsulfoxide [DMSO] which is a green jelly that you apply to the area and also the nape of the neck and the base of the spine where the virus lurks. This product is very quickly absorbed into the system and nobbles the up-coming outbreak by oxygenating the tissues since no virus can live in an oxygen-rich environment. (DMSO comes with a health warning that is should not be applied to 'anything' for some odd reason - if doctor prescribed, it is ok for human use, if not, it's described as a solvent and must be represented as such. Totally bizarre.) See http://www.hsv-free.com/DMSO_Disclaimer.htm Paul UK ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist]Re: Throwin' the high heat (NHR)
Go Marlins ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Publishing your own Transcriptions
Well, this is a big maybe, but you may want to e-mail someone like Thomas Bacon, who has headed the new line of publishings for horn entitled, "The Complete Hornist". If you don't get a response, or a response you like, you could even try writing to hornplanet.com to see if you could sell your works through there. You also could probably publish the music yourself, if you have any basic music notation software. Anyway, these are some ideas to get you started. I'd ask Mr. Bacon and/or the people at hornplanet the same questions. They may be very helpful. Michael Scheimer, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania 2003 Interlochen Arts Camp Concert Band, 2003 PMEA Honors Band and District Orchestra Founding co-member of Fünf Brass Quintet ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc
To hoss; There are many horns made with the "kruspe wrap" as you call it- some fine instruments, some poor ones. To condemn all horns made in a specific wrap because you happened to have a "not so easy to play horn" of this type is simply sophomoric. ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist]Re: Throwin' the high heat (NHR)
I can basically root for the Pirates still because of the Cubs: Aramis Ramirez, Kenny Lofton, Randall Simon; New York: Enrique Wilson; and Boston: Bronson Arroyo, Scott Sauerbeck, Tim Wakefield, Jeff Suppan, and the irreplacable Adrian Brown. That means that the only team that I can't root for now is the down-on-their-luck Marlins who don't get the honor me rooting for them. Prediction for the 100th World Series: Marlins over Yankees in 6 ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] tone color etc.
Best choice for a warm tone is single F brass, but what to do with the high notes ? Get a Bb-side added. If the Bb-side does not satify for the extreme high, get a high F added, etc. If the sound is quite small then, get a bigger bell added. If the sound is not warm enough then, get a red brass bell or perhaps a red brass lead pipe. You complain, that the sound gets dull then. Well, change the red brass bell against a yellow brass or nickel silver bell. The sound gets to brassy then. Well, put a "kranz" on the bell. The overall sound has become too dull now. Change the tubings against narrower tubings, perhaps entirely of nickel silver. How about changing the mouth piece: a silver mpc for the heavy stuff, brass for the mpah & titanium light weight for the chamber music. And the lacquer effect ? Take advantage of clean hands by lacquering the bell inside. To avoid the permanent polishing of the horn, get it plated. If the light reflex does disturb the camera men, get the horn shaved a bit with sand paper. Valves are too slow. Get a very thin oil. But now you cannot feel the valve action. Put some fat inside & they will stick. The same for the slides if too lose or too tight. Some people swear upon lightly leak valves as they - so they say - provide better slurs ??? Others like them tight absolutely. You have the choice of plating the valves or "over fitting". Some notes are not in tune perfectly. Add a special valve here & there at the tubing. It might help. The screw bell is very practical, if you complain about the odd horn case. But doesn´t a gig-bag look funny also ? If you cut your bell & find the sound has changed too much, there is a way to re-solder the bell. If some notes do not speak so well, try the special trick of inserting a thread into one of the slides. But then another note may not speak so well. Insert another thread into a different slide. You have six valve slides at least plus the several tuning slides. A combination of them would bring multiple chances to improve your horn. And all this effort did not make you the "master of horns". Well, how about changing or exchanging YOURSELF - or at least the way of PLAYING the horn ? The best solution at all, but with the side effect that it is at no cost. The last choice: if you have spent all your money for horn modifications & it does not work properly still, lift it up in the air & smash it to the bottom & jump on it - to end the terror (for you & the listeners). Prof.Hans Pizka, Pf.1136 D-85541 Kirchheim - Germany Fax: 49 89 903-9414 Phone: 903-9548 home: www.pizka.de email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist]Re: Throwin' the high heat (NHR)
Go Cubs. ;) A. At 03:46 PM 10/10/2003 -0400, you wrote: Go Marlins ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/amy-mcbeth%40uiowa.edu ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] tone color etc.
I think we already read this once Hans Pizka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:Best choice for a warm tone is single F brass, but what to do with the high notes ? Get a Bb-side added. If the Bb-side does not satify for the extreme high, get a high F added, etc. If the sound is quite small then, get a bigger bell added. If the sound is not warm enough then, get a red brass bell or perhaps a red brass lead pipe. You complain, that the sound gets dull then. Well, change the red brass bell against a yellow brass or nickel silver bell. The sound gets to brassy then. Well, put a "kranz" on the bell. The overall sound has become too dull now. Change the tubings against narrower tubings, perhaps entirely of nickel silver. How about changing the mouth piece: a silver mpc for the heavy stuff, brass for the mpah & titanium light weight for the chamber music. And the lacquer effect ? Take advantage of clean hands by lacquering the bell inside. To avoid the permanent polishing of the horn, get it plated. If the light reflex does disturb the camera men, get the horn shaved a bit with sand paper. Valves are too slow. Get a very thin oil. But now you cannot feel the valve action. Put some fat inside & they will stick. The same for the slides if too lose or too tight. Some people swear upon lightly leak valves as they - so they say - provide better slurs ??? Others like them tight absolutely. You have the choice of plating the valves or "over fitting". Some notes are not in tune perfectly. Add a special valve here & there at the tubing. It might help. The screw bell is very practical, if you complain about the odd horn case. But doesn´t a gig-bag look funny also ? If you cut your bell & find the sound has changed too much, there is a way to re-solder the bell. If some notes do not speak so well, try the special trick of inserting a thread into one of the slides. But then another note may not speak so well. Insert another thread into a different slide. You have six valve slides at least plus the several tuning slides. A combination of them would bring multiple chances to improve your horn. And all this effort did not make you the "master of horns". Well, how about changing or exchanging YOURSELF - or at least the way of PLAYING the horn ? The best solution at all, but with the side effect that it is at no cost. The last choice: if you have spent all your money for horn modifications & it does not work properly still, lift it up in the air & smash it to the bottom & jump on it - to end the terror (for you & the listeners). Prof.Hans Pizka, Pf.1136 D-85541 Kirchheim - Germany Fax: 49 89 903-9414 Phone: 903-9548 home: www.pizka.de email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/nafai23%40yahoo.com - Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] tone color etc.
c y <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said > I think we already read this once it was so nice he posted twice :) ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc
As the english would say, eat my shit Hoss ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] horn tone colour metal mpcs kranz bore etc
Not once did I say a specific wrap was better for anybody- I've had my luck with the geyer after a long stint with a Kruspe which was a fine typical Kruspe playing horn and it sold for a good chunk of money, It's dangerous to generalize which I never have done! Best of wishes, Hoss ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Rauch Horns
There was one on hornplayer.net not too long ago...might still be there. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 11:29 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Hornlist] Rauch Horns I live in NJ and am looking to try a Rauch Horn. I have heard many great things about these horns but cannot seem to find anybody who owns one. If anyone knows where I can go, aside from Norway and Minnesota, to play a Rauch please email me at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank you, Dan Wions ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/fbaucom%40sbcglobal.net ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Rauch Horns
there are three ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Cryogenics
Yes, I've had this done...to that same Yamaha 862 I was discussing earlier today. And, as I understand it, William is right...the idea behind the freezing treatment is to relax the tensions in the metal so that the horn plays "older" than its years. But I hasten to add that the metals are not 'aged' or 'broken down' during this process. These tensions, again as I have been told, dissipate over the years so that a horn of 15 years or so has much less of these than a newly built horn. To kind of tie-in to another current thread, my nickel-silver 862 when I first got it, was a bit on the 'metallic' side in terms of tone quality. I found that the sound was richer and the notes slotted better after treatment. I think I was as objective as one can be about thisit is admittedly a very subjective area of horn maintenance. I say this because I had this done twice to this horn...the first time I could detect no differences at all, so sent it back for a second treatment and asked them to leave in the maximum amount of time, and after this, I found the changes noted above. Fred -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Alex Mastrando Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 10:48 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Hornlist] Cryogenics Hello all, Anyone have their horn cryogenically treated? I had an opportunity about 5 years ago to have it done for LITERALLY $25 but, back then, I never heard of such a process and thought it utter nonsense. Over the last 2 or 3 years I've been hearing stories of how wonderful it is... Anyone have any experience with this or know of anyone who has had it done? Any thoughts on it? Alex Mastrando New Milford, NJ USA ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/fbaucom%40sbcglobal.net ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Rauch Horns
Well, that's interesting. These horns and Bergs have been almost unobtainable in the secondary market, and now there is a 'glut' of Rauch's. Guess we can blame this on the bad economy? Fred -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, October 10, 2003 3:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Rauch Horns there are three ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/fbaucom%40sbcglobal.net ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Rauch Horns
Wish I had a job There are also several lawsons and Lewis horns on here as well. All very reasonably priced, I think there are two or three schmids too. Hoss ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] tone color etc.
In response to Hans' recent posting, I thought it was wonderful, and deserved to be posted twice. Tons of wisdom with a touch of humor. The trouble is that everything he says does work. So, in spite of my best personal efforts, and the efforts of my teachers, I have been forced to resort to some of the "tricks" he's listed over the years. I now play a gold brass Alex 107 descant, but with a nickle silver bell flair. (Thank you Dave W. at BrassArts.) An excellent combination for my current situation. I have, however, spent many years on both Bb and triple horns, and have had my share of krantz(es). I use a "cabin" case because I find it the most practical, although it is heavy. I use a "custom designed" silver plated mouthpiece with a very thin gold rim. Again, a combination that gives me the most comfort, and most output for the least input. I would never recommend such equipment for my students, although I want them aware that it's out there should they find the need and have the money. I recommend that all of my students buy, and stay on, a yellow brass double for as long as possible. Yamaha or the Merker horns come to mind. My two cents. Wilbert in SC ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] set your options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
