RE: [Hornlist] I'm Too Nervous
I know some people that take 2 Ibuprofen about an hour before they perform for something, just to help keep the muscles in their body semi-relaxed, but without knocking them over, as would a regular muscle relaxant. On the other hand, something that I like to do is breathing exercises about 15 minutes before playing. Jut sit there and breathe in for 2 counts, out for 4. In for 3, out for 6. In for 4, out for 8. Etc. It gives you something easy and relaxing to concentrate on instead of performance nerves. Concentrate on keeping your shoulders down while breathing like this to keep them from becoming tense and bunched up around your neck. This almost always works for me Julia _ Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] I'm Too Nervous
In a message dated 4/28/2005 8:45:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I know some people that take 2 Ibuprofen about an hour before they perform for something, just to help keep the muscles in their body semi-relaxed, but without knocking them over, as would a regular muscle relaxant. Ibuprofen is not even a muscle relaxant, regular or otherwise. So, what is the point here? As an analgesic and anti-inflammatory, Ibuprofen could ameliorate the effects of swelling in the muscles, and could reduce pain, but there could only be a psychosomatic effect as far as relaxing the muscles. Dave Weiner Brass Arts Unlimited ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] I'm Too Nervous
Well, if it were going to be a marathon performance, (the whole Ring in one sitting :) ) the anti-inflammatory properties might help the lip muscles make it to the end. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 9:30 AM To: horn@music.memphis.edu Subject: Re: [Hornlist] I'm Too Nervous In a message dated 4/28/2005 8:45:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I know some people that take 2 Ibuprofen about an hour before they perform for something, just to help keep the muscles in their body semi-relaxed, but without knocking them over, as would a regular muscle relaxant. Ibuprofen is not even a muscle relaxant, regular or otherwise. So, what is the point here? As an analgesic and anti-inflammatory, Ibuprofen could ameliorate the effects of swelling in the muscles, and could reduce pain, but there could only be a psychosomatic effect as far as relaxing the muscles. Dave Weiner Brass Arts Unlimited ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/bgross%40airmail.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] My old Monnig
Hey everyone! Some might remember about a year ago I asked if anyone had any recommendations about how to deal with shot valves on a nice old german horn. Well, I've sunk a pretty penny into the horn and had it completely restored and worked on for other stuffs. If anyone's still interested, I have an ad up for it on hornplayer.net. I have a physical condition and a few reasons for not being able to play it like it should be anymore. Thanks again for everyone's advice a year ago as well! Shane ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] My old Monnig
Hey everyone! Some might remember about a year ago I asked if anyone had any recommendations about how to deal with shot valves on a nice old german horn. Well, I've sunk a pretty penny into the horn and had it completely restored and worked on for other stuffs. If anyone's still interested, I have an ad up for it on hornplayer.net. I have a physical condition and a few reasons for not being able to play it like it should be anymore. Thanks again for everyone's advice a year ago as well! Shane ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn
Hi List, I usually try to avoid controversy or blatant advertising on the horn list but I feel I need to respond to the comments made by THE VOICE regarding cryogenic processing. His unsupported remarks are a direct attack on my integrity and have no place on this list. If Mr. THE VOICE reads our promotional literature carefully he will notice that nowhere do we make specific claims for the results to be obtained by cryogenically processing. What we do say, and I reiterate here, is that we, and over 99% of the several hundred customers who have had instruments processed by us, feel that the instruments were improved and that the process was worth the time and the money. The effects of cryogenic processing are subtle and definitely fall into the last five per cent of horn modifications, for players looking to get as much as they can from their equipment. It's not for student instruments or for casual (I don't mean amateur) players. The tests recently undertaken at Tufts University by Selmer, utilizing a panel of high school students and weekend warriors are a case in point. You don't get smart answers by asking dumb questions. Since Mr. THE VOICE writes under a pseudonym we have no way of knowing what qualifications he has for making his attack. I have to suspect that he's an engineer or a science type who knows that the physical changes that take place in steel when cryogenically treated have no parallel in brass. Therefore he concludes that, since he hasn't measured any change, none has taken place. (Remember, these are the same guys who proved that the material or thickness of an instrument has no effect on the sound.) It seems to me that, when confronted by an unexplained phenomenon that has been confirmed by many experienced musicians, the thoughtful scientist would be looking for an experiment to explain it, not casually dismissing it as a scam. Those of us who have spent years working to improve instruments and the playing experience for our customers work in a subtle realm and deal in differences in instruments and playing qualities that are invisible and inaudible to the laymen, or even to many musicians. Indeed, a lot of the tonal differences we sweat over don't travel much past the podium. Lots of good players can't hear (or are indifferent to) loose valves, red brass, garlands, (pitch), etc., but that doesn't mean that everyone should ignore these qualities. Cryogenics is one more arrow in the quiver. A candidate for a job in a professional orchestra (not Chicago, New York, Boston, just a small regional orchestra) will have to audition against 100-200 people to win his job. That's just the number who the audition committee actually hears, not all the applicants. Those are pretty tough odds. Studies of stress have shown that being a principal horn player is one of the most stressful of jobs. These people need the best and most finely tuned equipment they can get. Don't ask me to throw away a valuable tool without a better supported analysis than the one presented here. Bob Osmun www.osmun.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of THE VOICE OF THE GUILD Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 11:16 PM To: hornlist Subject: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn from: Steve Freides [EMAIL PROTECTED] subject: [Hornlist] Cryogenically Frozen horn I was poking around looking at used horns on the Internet and found one that said the horn had been cryogenically frozen by Osmun - could anyone explain this process to me, please? (The horn wasn't for sale at Osmun, it was at Dillon Music in NJ.) Steve, Cryogenically freezing a horn is a proven method of removing money from your pocket. Enjoy the rest of the posts, but this is the truth. THE VOICE ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/rosmun%40osmun.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] I'm Too Nervous
Cant be due to the working rules. They will not allow 17 hours work . Anyway, horn sections change after act1/2 Siegfried act 1 Goetterdaemmerung. Ha, ha, ho, ho !!! But be aware Flying Dutchman in the old version without a break. That´s killing ! === -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bill Gross Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 3:58 PM To: 'The Horn List' Subject: RE: [Hornlist] I'm Too Nervous Well, if it were going to be a marathon performance, (the whole Ring in one sitting :) ) the anti-inflammatory properties might help the lip muscles make it to the end. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 9:30 AM To: horn@music.memphis.edu Subject: Re: [Hornlist] I'm Too Nervous In a message dated 4/28/2005 8:45:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I know some people that take 2 Ibuprofen about an hour before they perform for something, just to help keep the muscles in their body semi-relaxed, but without knocking them over, as would a regular muscle relaxant. Ibuprofen is not even a muscle relaxant, regular or otherwise. So, what is the point here? As an analgesic and anti-inflammatory, Ibuprofen could ameliorate the effects of swelling in the muscles, and could reduce pain, but there could only be a psychosomatic effect as far as relaxing the muscles. Dave Weiner Brass Arts Unlimited ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/bgross%40airma il.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans%40pizka.d e ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn
Dear Friends, I don't know the identity of the mystery E-Mailer I have no dog in this particular fight. Still all, I believe it's possible Mr. or Ms. Voice was just poking fun (as folks do on this list sometimes) rather than attacking integrity -- pretty much like pointing out that Walt Disney would spare no expense in the pursuit of making money. However that may be (or possibly may not be), I strongly suspect (on the basis of no analysis zero experience) that it would be advisable for most of us who are in operational contact with brass instruments to spend more time practicing them less money freezing them. If I'm wrong, it's not for the 1st time. In my case, I'm guessing the tangible benefit I would get from cryogenic treatment of my horn would be about the same as the tangible benefit I would get from taking a couple of ibuprofen tablets before a performance, I don't know. The main thing about cryogenic treatment I don't understand is whether it can be reversed. That is, suppose I have my Josef Lidl compensating double horn or my Holton Farkas Model full double horn treated cryogenically after the treatment I decide the horn plays worse than before the treatment. How do I get the cryogenic treatment undone? Heating beyond a certain point would melt the solder, no? I'm guessing that nothing can be done to reverse cryogenic treatment of brass instruments. If I have my horn frozen don't like the result, all I can do is sell off the treated horn buy an untreated replacement. Then again, when I list the treated horn on eBay, I can sing the praises of its cryogenic enhancement to bid up the price. And despite the fact I have no dog in the cryogenics fight, I do have experience with Osmun Brass -- positive experience. Years ago I bought 1 of their close-out Yamaha YHR-666 horns for $1,050 brand new. Great horn. Great deal. Shucks, they're going for more than that nowadays after 20+ years of use -- when you can even find 1 at all (they're becoming semi-rare). I gave the horn to my then-teenage son, who gave up horn after a couple of years sold the YHR-666 (for more than Osmun Brass charged for it new) used the proceeds to buy a rock roll electronic keyboard instrument. So it goes. -- Alan Cole, rank amateur McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA. ~ I feel I need to respond to the comments made by THE VOICE regarding cryogenic processing. His unsupported remarks are a direct attack on my integrity and have no place on this list. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.10.4 - Release Date: 4/27/2005 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] slow air
Don't forget, we put air into the horn at what? maybe 30 miles an hour let's say, but the sound goes through the horn at something like 700 miles an hour. It's not the air that's making the sound. With a little practice, you can play by sucking in instead of blowing out (who needs circular breathing!) - Steve Mumford ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] I'm Too Nervous
Hi Everyone, I have to agree totally with Ellen and Gary. I would like to relate a story about the chairman of the Music Dept. at Harding University. Dr. Erle T. Moore was answering questions one morning in his music theory class (I know this to be true, I was there) and a young woman was complaining about the number of Music Dept. Recitals just before the close of the spring semester. To answer her question about the number of recitals we were required to attend he simply replied, My dear children, Music is Performance. One must learn how to be comfortable performing, and the only way is to perform. I use almost the same kind of analogy when my students are preparing for State Solo and Ensemble. They usually cringe the first year they go to state and have to sight read. I tell them the only way they will become comfortable is to sight read a lot of music... My .02 on this thread. Walt Lewis At 12:57 PM 4/27/2005 -0500, you wrote: I totally agree with Gary. I have noticed that my students who play regularly in church or for relatives or in similar little or no pressure situations do the best on auditions, tryouts, and school playing tests, even though the material they play may differ with the situation. So I recommend that a person play as often as possible - volunteer to play hymns or patriotic tunes at a nursing home; play at church or church activities; play for relatives - they are interested in your accomplishments. You will share your gift of music with others as well as preparing yourself for auditions and adjudicated performances. Think of playing, no matter what the situation, as a chance to share your music and the wonderful sound of the horn. Ellen Hi, Unfortunately, the best way to beat any kind of anxiety is to continually put yourself in situations that create the anxiety, as many on the list have already told you. Performance anxiety decreases in relation to the amount of performances you give. In the mental health field, we call it immersion therapy. Performance-enhancing drugs (Inderal) are a last resort, and should only be tried after everything else. Gary Suits, MSW, ACSW -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.10.4 - Release Date: 4/27/2005 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn
I am an engineer, and I don't find it difficult to believe a small improvement can be had through the process. My suspicion is that the low temperature contraction generates forces that can stretch stresses out of parts that may have been forced to mate during assembly. With a little thought, it should be possible to duplicate that condition and directly measure the effect of cryogenic cooling. It wouldn't surprise me if the effect comes from differential cooling, in which case, running the instrument through the cycle several times, rather tha soaking, might have more effect. This theory also predicts that some horns will respond more than others. When doing product engineering, there are a never ending string of problems that must be solved. Gross problems must be solved first before the more subtle ones are recognizable above the noise. Cryogenics isn't going to make a noticible difference unless the horn is pretty well debugged to start with. If you want to try something that I have found can make a huge difference to a factory horn, buy an adjustible blade, 15/32 reamer, from McMaster-Carr, and open up all the internal solder joints to a full .468 bore. I'm beginning to believe the small constrictions of the bore define distinct resonating chambers that subtly color the overtones. You'll be amazed at how much crud come out before a .468 ball will pass. -Original Message- From: Robert Osmun [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'THE VOICE OF THE GUILD' [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'The Horn List' horn@music.memphis.edu Sent: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 11:32:26 -0400 Subject: RE: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn Hi List, I usually try to avoid controversy or blatant advertising on the horn list but I feel I need to respond to the comments made by THE VOICE regarding cryogenic processing. His unsupported remarks are a direct attack on my integrity and have no place on this list. If Mr. THE VOICE reads our promotional literature carefully he will notice that nowhere do we make specific claims for the results to be obtained by cryogenically processing. What we do say, and I reiterate here, is that we, and over 99% of the several hundred customers who have had instruments processed by us, feel that the instruments were improved and that the process was worth the time and the money. The effects of cryogenic processing are subtle and definitely fall into the last five per cent of horn modifications, for players looking to get as much as they can from their equipment. It's not for student instruments or for casual (I don't mean amateur) players. The tests recently undertaken at Tufts University by Selmer, utilizing a panel of high school students and weekend warriors are a case in point. You don't get smart answers by asking dumb questions. Since Mr. THE VOICE writes under a pseudonym we have no way of knowing what qualifications he has for making his attack. I have to suspect that he's an engineer or a science type who knows that the physical changes that take place in steel when cryogenically treated have no parallel in brass. Therefore he concludes that, since he hasn't measured any change, none has taken place. (Remember, these are the same guys who proved that the material or thickness of an instrument has no effect on the sound.) It seems to me that, when confronted by an unexplained phenomenon that has been confirmed by many experienced musicians, the thoughtful scientist would be looking for an experiment to explain it, not casually dismissing it as a scam. Those of us who have spent years working to improve instruments and the playing experience for our customers work in a subtle realm and deal in differences in instruments and playing qualities that are invisible and inaudible to the laymen, or even to many musicians. Indeed, a lot of the tonal differences we sweat over don't travel much past the podium. Lots of good players can't hear (or are indifferent to) loose valves, red brass, garlands, (pitch), etc., but that doesn't mean that everyone should ignore these qualities. Cryogenics is one more arrow in the quiver. A candidate for a job in a professional orchestra (not Chicago, New York, Boston, just a small regional orchestra) will have to audition against 100-200 people to win his job. That's just the number who the audition committee actually hears, not all the applicants. Those are pretty tough odds. Studies of stress have shown that being a principal horn player is one of the most stressful of jobs. These people need the best and most finely tuned equipment they can get. Don't ask me to throw away a valuable tool without a better supported analysis than the one presented here. Bob Osmun www.osmun.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of THE VOICE OF THE GUILD Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 11:16 PM To: hornlist Subject: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn from: Steve Freides [EMAIL PROTECTED] subject: [Hornlist]
RE: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn
There was a 667V listed, and sold I assume, on hornplayer.net that said it had been cryogenically frozen. I emailed the seller and asked him about it and he said it did make a difference. Whether or not it was improvement was subjective, but he said it definetly didn't make it any worse. He said that he had it done after the horn was fairly well broken in, so the effects were expectedly less dramatic. Exactly like it says on the Resonance Enhancement page, he said the effects were easily felt but sort of hard to describe. Now I wonder, would this process work on a lacquered horn? Chris --- Pandolfi, Orlando [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Having tested horns that underwent this process both before and after, there is undoubtedly a difference. Some horns were much improved, in my opinion. Other horns didn't seem to need the process. As for the horn on the internet...who is to say? Nevertheless, I would not be quite so dismissive. O. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of THE VOICE OF THE GUILD Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 11:16 PM To: hornlist Subject: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn from: Steve Freides [EMAIL PROTECTED] subject: [Hornlist] Cryogenically Frozen horn I was poking around looking at used horns on the Internet and found one that said the horn had been cryogenically frozen by Osmun - could anyone explain this process to me, please? (The horn wasn't for sale at Osmun, it was at Dillon Music in NJ.) Steve, Cryogenically freezing a horn is a proven method of removing money from your pocket. Enjoy the rest of the posts, but this is the truth. THE VOICE ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/pandolfi%40deerfield.edu ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/tedesccj%40yahoo.com __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn
Osmun folks could probably answer better, but I would think the process would cause the lacquer to fall off. Difference in thermal coefficients between the metal and the lacquer would cause differential dimension changes causing the bond between the metal and lacquer to fail. Or so I would think. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chris Tedesco Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 12:32 PM To: The Horn List Subject: RE: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn There was a 667V listed, and sold I assume, on hornplayer.net that said it had been cryogenically frozen. I emailed the seller and asked him about it and he said it did make a difference. Whether or not it was improvement was subjective, but he said it definetly didn't make it any worse. He said that he had it done after the horn was fairly well broken in, so the effects were expectedly less dramatic. Exactly like it says on the Resonance Enhancement page, he said the effects were easily felt but sort of hard to describe. Now I wonder, would this process work on a lacquered horn? Chris --- Pandolfi, Orlando [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Having tested horns that underwent this process both before and after, there is undoubtedly a difference. Some horns were much improved, in my opinion. Other horns didn't seem to need the process. As for the horn on the internet...who is to say? Nevertheless, I would not be quite so dismissive. O. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of THE VOICE OF THE GUILD Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 11:16 PM To: hornlist Subject: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenicall Frozen horn from: Steve Freides [EMAIL PROTECTED] subject: [Hornlist] Cryogenically Frozen horn I was poking around looking at used horns on the Internet and found one that said the horn had been cryogenically frozen by Osmun - could anyone explain this process to me, please? (The horn wasn't for sale at Osmun, it was at Dillon Music in NJ.) Steve, Cryogenically freezing a horn is a proven method of removing money from your pocket. Enjoy the rest of the posts, but this is the truth. THE VOICE ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/pandolfi%40deerfield.edu ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/tedesccj%40yahoo.com __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/bgross%40airmail.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] RE: Cryogenically Frozen horn
From my point of view, there is no possibility that you would want that treatment 'undone'I found it to be of great benefit - notes slotted better, horn had more playing consistency from bottom to top, and the tone quality of the horn (nickel) was improved. I did have to have the treatment done twice (this was not with Osmun) - I noticed no change the first time, and was able to ascertain that they may not have left the horn in long enough. So sent it back again with instructions to leave it in there a good long time - definitely a difference after that second time. Fred Alan Cole [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Friends, I don't know the identity of the mystery E-Mailer I have no dog in this particular fight. Still all, I believe it's possible Mr. or Ms. Voice was just poking fun (as folks do on this list sometimes) rather than attacking integrity -- pretty much like pointing out that Walt Disney would spare no expense in the pursuit of making money. However that may be (or possibly may not be), I strongly suspect (on the basis of no analysis zero experience) that it would be advisable for most of us who are in operational contact with brass instruments to spend more time practicing them less money freezing them. If I'm wrong, it's not for the 1st time. In my case, I'm guessing the tangible benefit I would get from cryogenic treatment of my horn would be about the same as the tangible benefit I would get from taking a couple of ibuprofen tablets before a performance, I don't know. The main thing about cryogenic treatment I don't understand is whether it can be reversed. That is, suppose I have my Josef Lidl compensating double horn or my Holton Farkas Model full double horn treated cryogenically after the treatment I decide the horn plays worse than before the treatment. How do I get the cryogenic treatment undone? Heating beyond a certain point would melt the solder, no? I'm guessing that nothing can be done to reverse cryogenic treatment of brass instruments. If I have my horn frozen don't like the result, all I can do is sell off the treated horn buy an untreated replacement. Then again, when I list the treated horn on eBay, I can sing the praises of its cryogenic enhancement to bid up the price. And despite the fact I have no dog in the cryogenics fight, I do have experience with Osmun Brass -- positive experience. Years ago I bought 1 of their close-out Yamaha YHR-666 horns for $1,050 brand new. Great horn. Great deal. Shucks, they're going for more than that nowadays after 20+ years of use -- when you can even find 1 at all (they're becoming semi-rare). I gave the horn to my then-teenage son, who gave up horn after a couple of years sold the YHR-666 (for more than Osmun Brass charged for it new) used the proceeds to buy a rock roll electronic keyboard instrument. So it goes. -- Alan Cole, rank amateur McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA. ~ I feel I need to respond to the comments made by THE VOICE regarding cryogenic processing. His unsupported remarks are a direct attack on my integrity and have no place on this list. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.10.4 - Release Date: 4/27/2005 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/fbaucom%40sbcglobal.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] RE: Cryogenics
Having worked at Osmun Brass when cryogenics was first coming onto the scene I did some research of my own at the time. Many of you have heard my opinion on cryogenic freezing many times here... however here it is once more. At the time that we were considering Cryogenic freezing I contacted my Uncle, who was the dean of Metallurgy at U.Penn, and quite well respected in his field. His response to the claims (that were made at THAT time) was that all the claims were true HOWEVER,,, since it wasn't a god fearing metal meaning a ferrous metal, the brass would return to its exact original state when it returned to room temperature. Cryogenics works well with steel... but does nothing to brass. Recently one of the large musical instrument makers did their own double blind study (I believe it was Selmer - but I may be wrong) - and concluded that the cryogenic process did absolutely nothing to the instruments. If I can find the link (or if someone has it) I'll post it on my website for you all to read. Though I respect Bob immensely, I disagree with him entirely on this process. My feeling is that is someone gives me their horn, and $300.00 (or what ever it costs) - their horn will play differently... Ken (in full support of THE Voice) Just Put Your Lips Together And Blow http://www.poperepair.com US Dealer: Kuhn Horns Bonna Cases Pope Instrument Repair 80 Wenham Street Jamaica Plain, MA 02130 617-522-0532 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] RE: Cryogenics
Ibuprofen is lots cheaper. -AC. My feeling is that if someone gives me their horn, and $300.00 (or whatever it costs) - their horn will play differently. -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.10.4 - Release Date: 4/27/2005 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] RE: Cryogenics Phenomenon
There is another phenomenon that should be discussed here... That is that the more someone pays for a 'procedure' the more they tend to believe the claims. I say try charging $5.00 for it... and see what the results look like then!!! Ken Bob says: It seems to me that, when confronted by an unexplained phenomenon that has been confirmed by many experienced musicians, the thoughtful scientist would be looking for an experiment to explain it, not casually dismissing it as a scam. Just Put Your Lips Together And Blow http://www.poperepair.com US Dealer: Kuhn Horns Bonna Cases Pope Instrument Repair 80 Wenham Street Jamaica Plain, MA 02130 617-522-0532 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods
The figure I refered to in 1968 was for all fees as noted. At that time at a land grant university tuition was still a blanket $50.00 per semester. A few years later the school had gone to credit hours to determine tuition. The GI bill plus one outside job put me through grad school. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 4:36 PM To: The Horn List; The Horn List Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Robert Dickow Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods An interesting observation. When I first started my college attendance, full tuition for all credits taken was $50. per semester. In a couple of years or so the GI bill was instrumental in the change for state schools to start charging for each credit hour taken as private schools were getting more from Uncle Sam than the state schools. The practice hung on and the state schools marched steadily onward and upward with their fees and credit hour charges. Even so, the GI Bill only provided $500. a year to those greedy institutions who got the maximum. When I started school on GI Bill I got a whole $65. per month out of which I had to pay $20 for a room and $30. for meals at a boarding house. That left me the awesome sum of $15. a month for catting around, dating, clothes, toothpaste and other essentials. CORdially, Paul Mansur Pete Exline's description of the 'olden days' was fun. Maybe the olden days really were the 'good old days.' I was teaching at a little private college in Kentucky during the late 70s until 1984. Our band was very small, only one horn, no trombones, a couple of clarinets, etc. No orchestra existed. Yet one day while rummaging in some file cabinets I ran across a school program from the early 50s. The 55 piece orchestra in the cover photo had played Scheherezade on the evening's program. What had happened over the intervening years?!! I'm not sure. I did learn, however, that all those students were on FULL SCHOLARSHIP. A full scholarship was $350.00, which just happened to exactly equal the 'activity grant' that the students are still getting today. The aid amount never went any higher during those years, while tuitions, however, had gone up to about $14,000 a year. Go figure. Bob Dickow Lionel Hampton School of Music -- From: Wendell L Exline [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: horn@music.memphis.edu Subject: Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods Date: Thursday, April 21, 2005 5:31 PM Hi Paul, Your message about the olden days was fun. How familiar it all sounded. My 7th grade band had eight horns in the section. snip ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/p_mansur1%40comcast.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/bgross%40airmail.net ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Beginning Methods now tuition
Hi Jack, I have seen what my son receives for his GI Bill. He is working full time, and going to school full time to get his BS and is barely squeaking by. To contrast that, when my older brother was getting his almost 40 years ago, he was able to go to school full time and not have to work...Your comments are right on the mark. These people defend us and as soon as they want their piece of the pie, the schools and landlords are right there to relieve them of it... It's also ironic how the months my son John is not enrolled full time, the government decreases his allotment. Walt Lewis At 04:28 PM 4/28/2005 -0600, you wrote: The GI bill plus one outside job put me through grad school. + The problem with the GI Bill and BAH today is that the schools/landlords know about increases in allotments before the soldier/Marine/sailor/airman does. No matter how much Congress might increase the amounts it is negated almost before it is passed. The Jack Attack! ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/wlewis9637%40wowway.com -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.10.4 - Release Date: 4/27/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.10.4 - Release Date: 4/27/2005 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] I'm Too Nervous
I just confirm that: READ MUSIC, NEW MUSIC AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE, NEW NEW NEW AGAIN, TONS OF MUSIC OF ANY KIND. Then you have no time for nervosity. == -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Walter E. Lewis Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 6:06 PM To: The Horn List Subject: Re: [Hornlist] I'm Too Nervous Hi Everyone, I have to agree totally with Ellen and Gary. I would like to relate a story about the chairman of the Music Dept. at Harding University. Dr. Erle T. Moore was answering questions one morning in his music theory class (I know this to be true, I was there) and a young woman was complaining about the number of Music Dept. Recitals just before the close of the spring semester. To answer her question about the number of recitals we were required to attend he simply replied, My dear children, Music is Performance. One must learn how to be comfortable performing, and the only way is to perform. I use almost the same kind of analogy when my students are preparing for State Solo and Ensemble. They usually cringe the first year they go to state and have to sight read. I tell them the only way they will become comfortable is to sight read a lot of music... My .02 on this thread. Walt Lewis At 12:57 PM 4/27/2005 -0500, you wrote: I totally agree with Gary. I have noticed that my students who play regularly in church or for relatives or in similar little or no pressure situations do the best on auditions, tryouts, and school playing tests, even though the material they play may differ with the situation. So I recommend that a person play as often as possible - volunteer to play hymns or patriotic tunes at a nursing home; play at church or church activities; play for relatives - they are interested in your accomplishments. You will share your gift of music with others as well as preparing yourself for auditions and adjudicated performances. Think of playing, no matter what the situation, as a chance to share your music and the wonderful sound of the horn. Ellen Hi, Unfortunately, the best way to beat any kind of anxiety is to continually put yourself in situations that create the anxiety, as many on the list have already told you. Performance anxiety decreases in relation to the amount of performances you give. In the mental health field, we call it immersion therapy. Performance-enhancing drugs (Inderal) are a last resort, and should only be tried after everything else. Gary Suits, MSW, ACSW -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.10.4 - Release Date: 4/27/2005 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/hans%40pizka.d e ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Kruspe/Holton (was Holton's German Design team)
date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 13:57:12 -0500 from: Leonard Brown [EMAIL PROTECTED] subject: [Hornlist] Holton's German Design team Wrong list or not, I had heard the same story from Farkas, he told them= =20 they had the worst horn in the business and they asked him to help design a= =20 better one. I once had my hands on a very old Kruspe that the owner said w= as the=20 horn Phil copied the layout from while he was studying with him. It had th= e=20 Holton-looking layout with the Bb tuning slide but an enormous bell. =20 Unfortunately he had let the kids at the junior high use it for years and i= t was toast. - Steve Mumford I am very bad with Holton model numbers. The Kruspe I had for a few weeks = was laid out like the standard Holton, was medium bore, and nickle silver.= It reminded me a great deal of the Holtons with that configuration. I th= ink Kruspe made that design some years after the Horner models the 8D is co= pied after. Can anyone back me up on the name New Symphony being the Kru= pse model that Holton copied? Leonard in Laredo Leonard, I'm not at all familiar with the Holton horn in question, but I can shed a bit of light concerning the Kruspe New Symphony model. I bought this one as a basket case and had it restored. See link below. It is definitely made of yellow brass, and somewhat resembles the Conn 6D in overall configuration. It does have a separate Bb tuning slide on the front of the horn (see pics). As best as I can measure with my calipers, it has a .472 bore (i.e. large bore, a la 8D), and the bell throat feels to me to be the same size as an 8D or Lawson Fourier. In fact, it plays very similar to an 8D. It also has what appears to be a nickle silver krantz around the edge of the bell. The bell measures 12 1/4 in diameter. The engraving (complete with the eagle as other Kruspes), has New Symphony Model and Made in Germany spelled out in English. Perhaps intended for the English speaking export market? The best info I have on its history (from another owner) is that they were supposedly built sometime during the 1920's. Here are a couple of pics of my horn that I uploaded last night for anyone who is interested. http://www.geocities.com/sewelljp57/index.html And to confuse the issue even more, a Kruspe catalog from 1930 published on the Japanese website below (brought to my attention by Kendall Betts) indicates that this horn was also known as the Walter model at some point in its career. http://www.geocities.co.jp/MusicHall-Horn/2569/kruspe/krusp.html Is it safe to say that the New Symphony model is not the horn that you were remembering? It sounds more like the one Steve M. was describing. Regards, Jay Sewell Granbury, Texas ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
