Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Edward Jaffe]

Ray Mullins wrote:


The only place I've found documentation on REP is in the z/VSE manuals -
that's how MiSHaP translates object code zaps, by adding REP cards to the
end of the object deck. 
 



Sorry. I missed the start of this thread. Are you saying the z/OS PM 
Binder accepts REP cards like the z/VSE linkage editor does? Yippee! 
Does it work for GOFF objects too?


--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
5200 W Century Blvd, Suite 800
Los Angeles, CA 90045
310-338-0400 x318
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Ray Mullins]

Maybe.  :-)

My e-mail provider (an ex-cow-orker) moved boxes this weekend, and I'm still
playing catch-up from that.

I don't recall how this subject came up in the thread.   You'll probably
have to check the archives.

Later,
Ray

 

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Edward Jaffe
> Sent: Tuesday April 18 2006 08:10
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor 
> really wants?)
> 
> Ray Mullins wrote:
> 
> >The only place I've found documentation on REP is in the 
> z/VSE manuals 
> >- that's how MiSHaP translates object code zaps, by adding 
> REP cards to 
> >the end of the object deck.
> >  
> >
> 
> Sorry. I missed the start of this thread. Are you saying the 
> z/OS PM Binder accepts REP cards like the z/VSE linkage 
> editor does? Yippee! 
> Does it work for GOFF objects too?

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Edward Jaffe]

Ray Mullins wrote:


Maybe.  :-)
 



Maybe what? Maybe the binder accepts REP cards? Or maybe the binder 
accepts REP cards for GOFF objects?


--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
5200 W Century Blvd, Suite 800
Los Angeles, CA 90045
310-338-0400 x318
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Ray Mullins]

Maybe.  :-)

I think this all started out of REP cards for object decks.  I was just
replying to the particular topic about documentation.

If I had some time today, I'd try an experiment on the older format side.  I
don't have any GOFF handy.

Later,
Ray 

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Edward Jaffe
> Sent: Tuesday April 18 2006 09:36
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor 
> really wants?)
> 
> Ray Mullins wrote:
> 
> >Maybe.  :-)
> >  
> >
> 
> Maybe what? Maybe the binder accepts REP cards? Or maybe the 
> binder accepts REP cards for GOFF objects?
> 

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Chris Mason]

Edward,

This topic started because Johnny Luo asked about the contents of an object
module. My reply included a reference to the REP card and thus another
strand of the original thread spun off. (This covers Ray's question.)

In the thread I reminisced over a particularly tricky use of the REP card to
compensate for a PL/1 bug in CICS. I believe it was an, I expect,
unintentional 32K limit to a CICS PL/1 transaction program. I'm pretty sure
this was a VS1 system since I'd outgrown DOS (VSE) by then and hadn't yet
made the complete step to MVS. It was 1973[1].

Since this indicates the use of the REP card was permitted in at least one
of the "big brother" systems, I'd be inclined to expect it to be available
to all. However, I checked the z/OS "Program Management" manuals and none
confess to knowing anything about the word "REP".

[1] The reason I recall the details is that I was getting a suite of
demonstration programs ready to show that Cyrillic 3270s actually worked.
The Soviet ministry's machines lacked PF keys which were a key feature of
the demonstration suite. Each program needed to be modified and one broke
the 32K mark. Fixing up the programs was more high pressure than it might
have been because I was having to do the work in Vienna[2] away from my
usual technical base. In Vienna the changed programs worked.  Did they work
in Moscow? No. Fortunately very shortly afterwards, it was discovered that
Cyrillic 3270s needed X'BF' as the poll character rather than X'7F' and the
suite worked as it should - so I was told.

[2] Something else I remember, as was a granite habit, I took two copies of
the programs on tape. In this case, the first one didn't work. Maybe it was
a reflection of the tape technology of the time.

Chris Mason

- Original Message - 
From: "Edward Jaffe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, 18 April, 2006 5:10 PM
Subject: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)


> Ray Mullins wrote:
>
> >The only place I've found documentation on REP is in the z/VSE manuals -
> >that's how MiSHaP translates object code zaps, by adding REP cards to the
> >end of the object deck.
> >
> >
>
> Sorry. I missed the start of this thread. Are you saying the z/OS PM
> Binder accepts REP cards like the z/VSE linkage editor does? Yippee!
> Does it work for GOFF objects too?
>
> -- 
> Edward E Jaffe
> Phoenix Software International, Inc
> 5200 W Century Blvd, Suite 800
> Los Angeles, CA 90045
> 310-338-0400 x318
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Ed Gould]

On Apr 18, 2006, at 2:26 PM, Chris Mason wrote:


Edward,

This topic started because Johnny Luo asked about the contents of  
an object

module. My reply included a reference to the REP card and thus another
strand of the original thread spun off. (This covers Ray's question.)

In the thread I reminisced over a particularly tricky use of the  
REP card to

compensate for a PL/1 bug in CICS. I believe it was an, I expect,
unintentional 32K limit to a CICS PL/1 transaction program. I'm  
pretty sure
this was a VS1 system since I'd outgrown DOS (VSE) by then and  
hadn't yet

made the complete step to MVS. It was 1973[1].

Since this indicates the use of the REP card was permitted in at  
least one
of the "big brother" systems, I'd be inclined to expect it to be  
available
to all. However, I checked the z/OS "Program Management" manuals  
and none

confess to knowing anything about the word "REP".

[1] The reason I recall the details is that I was getting a suite of
demonstration programs ready to show that Cyrillic 3270s actually  
worked.
The Soviet ministry's machines lacked PF keys which were a key  
feature of
the demonstration suite. Each program needed to be modified and one  
broke
the 32K mark. Fixing up the programs was more high pressure than it  
might
have been because I was having to do the work in Vienna[2] away  
from my
usual technical base. In Vienna the changed programs worked.  Did  
they work
in Moscow? No. Fortunately very shortly afterwards, it was  
discovered that
Cyrillic 3270s needed X'BF' as the poll character rather than X'7F'  
and the

suite worked as it should - so I was told.

[2] Something else I remember, as was a granite habit, I took two  
copies of
the programs on tape. In this case, the first one didn't work.  
Maybe it was

a reflection of the tape technology of the time.

Chris Mason



Chris,

I too remember rep cards but honestly don't remember where that they  
were documented. That is why I asked the question. I *vaguely*  
remember them from 25+ years ago. I was just hoping that someone  
would know if they are still supported and if so where they were  
documented. I would have suspected (if they still are supported) that  
they would be documented in the binder manual (program management).  
They (as you say) don't seem to.


Just a point of curiosity thats all.

Ed

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Tony Harminc]

Ed Gould wrote:

> I too remember rep cards but honestly don't remember where 
> that they were documented. That is why I asked the question. 
> I *vaguely* remember them from 25+ years ago. I was just 
> hoping that someone would know if they are still supported 
> and if so where they were documented. I would have suspected 
> (if they still are supported) that they would be documented 
> in the binder manual (program management).  
> They (as you say) don't seem to.

The place I encountered REP cards was in HASP II, in the early 1970s. There,
they did an on-the-fly ZAP as each module was loaded. I've never heard of
them in any linkage editor or Binder version, but I've never worked with
DOS/VSE.

Tony H.

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Eric N. Bielefeld]

I've seen a bunch of posts on this.  Are these the REP cards as are used in 
AMASPZAP, or is this something different.  For example:


VER 0012 AF21
REP 0012 2345

Eric Bielefeld
P&H Mining Equipment

- Original Message - 
From: "Edward Jaffe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2006 11:35 AM
Subject: Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)



Ray Mullins wrote:


Maybe.  :-)



Maybe what? Maybe the binder accepts REP cards? Or maybe the binder 
accepts REP cards for GOFF objects?


--
Edward E Jaffe
Phoenix Software International, Inc
5200 W Century Blvd, Suite 800
Los Angeles, CA 90045
310-338-0400 x318
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ 


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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Chris Mason]

Eric,

Similar but not identical.

A REP card belongs to the days when you had a 2540 card reader/punch
connected to your machine in the good old days of the  360 and 360 GT (aka
370).

You submitted the compile job and went off to the coffee lounge. When you
came back the object deck was in the card punch stacker. You wrapped it in a
"link and go" job and tried it. One you had analysed the dump, you saw that
you had made just one most trivial mistake. Rather than go though that long
compile job again, you went over to the 029 card punch and "fixed up" the
error with a REP card, slipped the card into the object deck just before the
END card - or RLD cards - and tried again.

Once you had got a working program - REP cards and all - you filed the deck
away wrapped in an elastic band and with an explanation of what it was
written with a felt-tipped pen in a colour which contrasted with the card
colour.

I was in a project once where, as the junior, I was in charge of the
"library of past trials", the rubbish bin which nevertheless contained
neatly stacked bound and marked decks.

For completeness here's an explanation of what a REP card is from what
appears to be the help text for the CMS LOAD command (clearly a
non-proportional font is required to view it properly):



 Replace (REP) Statement

 A REP statement allows instructions and constants to be changed and
additions
 made. The REP statement must be punched in hexadecimal code.

 The format of an REP statement is shown in the following figure. The data
in
 columns 17-70 (excluding the commas) replaces what has already been loaded
 into virtual storage at the address specified in columns 5-12. REP
statements
 are placed in the file either (1) immediately preceding the last statement
 (END statement) if the text deck does not contain relocatable data such as
 address constants, or (2) immediately preceding the first RLD (relocatable
 dictionary) statement if there is relocatable data in the text deck. If
 additions made by REP statements increase the length of a control section,
an
 ICS statement, which defines the total length of the control section, must
be
 placed at the front of the deck.


+---
-+
 | Table 7. REP Statement Format
|

+--+
-+
 | Column   | Contents
|

+--+
-+
 | 1| X'02' (12-2-9 punch). Identifies this as a loader control
|
 |  | statement.
|

+--+
-+
 | 2-4  | REP -- identifies the type of load statement.
|

+--+
-+
 | 5-12 | Hexadecimal starting address of the area to be replaced as
|
 |  | assigned by the assembler. It must be right-justified in these
|
 |  | columns with unused leading columns filled with blanks or
|
 |  | zeros.
|

+--+
-+
 | 13-14| Blank.
|

+--+
-+
 | 15-16| ESID (External Symbol Identification) -- the hexadecimal
number |
 |  | assigned to the control section in which replacement is to be
|
 |  | made. The LISTING file produced by the compiler or assembler
|
 |  | indicates this number.
|

+--+
-+
 | 17-70| A maximum of 11 four-digit hexadecimal fields, separated by
|
 |  | commas, each replacing one previously loaded halfword (2
|
 |  | bytes). The last field must not be followed by a comma.
|

+--+
-+
 | 71-72| Blank.
|

+--+
-+
 | 73-80| Not used by the loader. This field may be left blank or
program |
 |  | identification may be inserted.
|

+--+
-+



73-80 What rot. As everyone knows, columns 73-80 are sequence numbers in
case there's a fumble when trying to slip on the elastic band. 

Information from ( http://mitvma.mit.edu/cmshelp.cgi?CMS%20LOAD%20(ALL )
where, just to show how close to AMASPZAP all this is, I see that there is
also a VER card.

Chris Mason

- Original Message - 
From: "Eric N. Bielefeld" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main
To: 
Sent: Wednesday, 19 April, 2006 3:33 AM
Subject: Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)


> I've seen a bunch of posts on this.  Are these the REP cards as are used
in
> AMASPZAP, or is this something different.  For ex

Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Ray Mullins]

That looks like it's been modified to support load modules over 1MB, because
here's z/VSE's version:

 A.5 Format of the REP (User Replace) Statement


Card Columns Content

1
X'02'. Identifies this as a statement of an object module.

2 - 4
REP -- Replace text statement.

5 - 6
Blank.

7 - 12
Assembled address of the first byte to be replaced (hexadecimal). Must
be right justified with leading zeros if needed to fill the field and must
be equal to or greater than the starting address of the control section
(columns 14-16). Note that there is no check to determine if the assembled
address is actually within this control section.

13
Blank.

14 - 16
External symbol identification number (ESID) of the control section (SD)
containing the text (hexadecimal). Must be right justified with leading
zeros if needed to fill the field.

17 - 70
From 1 to 11 4-digit hexadecimal fields separated by commas, each
replacing two bytes. A blank indicates the end of information in this
statement.

71 - 72
Blank.

73 - 80
May be used for program identification.

Man, this stuff is taking me down memory lane.

Later,
Ray

-- 
M. Ray Mullins 
Roseville, CA, USA 
http://www.catherdersoftware.com/
http://www.mrmullins.big-bear-city.ca.us/ 
http://www.the-bus-stops-here.org/ 

German is essentially a form of assembly language consisting entirely of far
calls heavily accented with throaty guttural sounds. 

--ilvi 



 

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chris Mason
> Sent: Tuesday 18 April 2006 19:31
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor 
> really wants?)
> 
> Eric,
> 
> Similar but not identical.
> 
> A REP card belongs to the days when you had a 2540 card 
> reader/punch connected to your machine in the good old days 
> of the  360 and 360 GT (aka 370).
> 
> You submitted the compile job and went off to the coffee 
> lounge. When you came back the object deck was in the card 
> punch stacker. You wrapped it in a "link and go" job and 
> tried it. One you had analysed the dump, you saw that you had 
> made just one most trivial mistake. Rather than go though 
> that long compile job again, you went over to the 029 card 
> punch and "fixed up" the error with a REP card, slipped the 
> card into the object deck just before the END card - or RLD 
> cards - and tried again.
> 
> Once you had got a working program - REP cards and all - you 
> filed the deck away wrapped in an elastic band and with an 
> explanation of what it was written with a felt-tipped pen in 
> a colour which contrasted with the card colour.
> 
> I was in a project once where, as the junior, I was in charge 
> of the "library of past trials", the rubbish bin which 
> nevertheless contained neatly stacked bound and marked decks.
> 
> For completeness here's an explanation of what a REP card is 
> from what appears to be the help text for the CMS LOAD 
> command (clearly a non-proportional font is required to view 
> it properly):
> 
> 
> 
>  Replace (REP) Statement
> 
>  A REP statement allows instructions and constants to be 
> changed and additions  made. The REP statement must be 
> punched in hexadecimal code.
> 
>  The format of an REP statement is shown in the following 
> figure. The data in  columns 17-70 (excluding the commas) 
> replaces what has already been loaded  into virtual storage 
> at the address specified in columns 5-12. REP statements  are 
> placed in the file either (1) immediately preceding the last 
> statement  (END statement) if the text deck does not contain 
> relocatable data such as  address constants, or (2) 
> immediately preceding the first RLD (relocatable
>  dictionary) statement if there is relocatable data in the 
> text deck. If  additions made by REP statements increase the 
> length of a control section, an  ICS statement, which defines 
> the total length of the control section, must be  placed at 
> the front of the deck.
> 
> 
> +-
> --
> +
> -+
>  | Table 7. REP Statement Format
> |
> 
> +--+--
> --
> +--+
> -+
>  | Column   | Contents
> |
> 
> +--+--
> --
> +--+
> -+
>  | 1| X'02' (12-2-9 punch). Identifies this as a 
> loader control
> |
>  |  | statement.
> |
> 
> +--+--
> --
> +--+
> -+
>  | 2-4   

Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Ed Gould]

On Apr 18, 2006, at 8:33 PM, Eric N. Bielefeld wrote:

I've seen a bunch of posts on this.  Are these the REP cards as are  
used in AMASPZAP, or is this something different.  For example:


VER 0012 AF21
REP 0012 2345

Eric Bielefeld
P&H Mining Equipment



Eric,

Sometime in the past there was an option to use rep cards as input to  
the linkage editor (now called Binder). The reports on here seem to  
indicate that these rep cards are no longer valid . The rep cards as  
you spoke are for amaspzap (like you said) . Two different IBM programs.


There seems to be conjecture that it was an early OS (MVT/MVT) that  
accommodated them. And in some past time was taken out of the OS.


Myself I don't care for the idea as it was to me a slick way a  
sysprog could be come indispensible. Only he knew where the magic  
deck (and rep cards were) . I can see the amaspzap way of doing  
things myself. OR USERMOD if you prefer.


Ed

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Eric Bielefeld]

Chris,

Well, thats more than I ever wanted to know about REP cards.  I can see 
why they are not documented anymore.  That reminds me of when I was an 
operator on a 1410 computer way long ago.  They used to patch the 
object decks on those, but I never knew much about it besides seeing 
the programmers putting cards in the deck.  

I did work on a 360/40 as an operator, and for a long time I read in 
card decks for most of my jobs.  Then they finally started putting the 
code in libraries.  That was under DOS.  

Eric Bielefeld
Sr. Systems Programmer
P&H Mining Equipment
414-671-7849
Milwaukee, Wisconsin


- Original Message -
From: Chris Mason <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tuesday, April 18, 2006 9:31 pm
Subject: Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really 
wants?)
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU

> Eric,
> 
> Similar but not identical.
> 
> A REP card belongs to the days when you had a 2540 card reader/punch
> connected to your machine in the good old days of the  360 and 360 
> GT (aka
> 370).
> 
> You submitted the compile job and went off to the coffee lounge. 
> When you
> came back the object deck was in the card punch stacker. You 
> wrapped it in a
> "link and go" job and tried it. One you had analysed the dump, you 
> saw that
> you had made just one most trivial mistake. Rather than go though 
> that long
> compile job again, you went over to the 029 card punch and "fixed 
> up" the
> error with a REP card, slipped the card into the object deck just 
> before the
> END card - or RLD cards - and tried again.
> 
> Once you had got a working program - REP cards and all - you filed 
> the deck
> away wrapped in an elastic band and with an explanation of what it was
> written with a felt-tipped pen in a colour which contrasted with 
> the card
> colour.
> 
> I was in a project once where, as the junior, I was in charge of the
> "library of past trials", the rubbish bin which nevertheless contained
> neatly stacked bound and marked decks.
> 
> For completeness here's an explanation of what a REP card is from what
> appears to be the help text for the CMS LOAD command (clearly a
> non-proportional font is required to view it properly):
> 
> 
> 
> Replace (REP) Statement
> 
> A REP statement allows instructions and constants to be changed and
> additions
> made. The REP statement must be punched in hexadecimal code.
> 
> The format of an REP statement is shown in the following figure. 
> The data
> in
> columns 17-70 (excluding the commas) replaces what has already 
> been loaded
> into virtual storage at the address specified in columns 5-12. REP
> statements
> are placed in the file either (1) immediately preceding the last 
> statement (END statement) if the text deck does not contain 
> relocatable data such as
> address constants, or (2) immediately preceding the first RLD 
> (relocatable dictionary) statement if there is relocatable data in 
> the text deck. If
> additions made by REP statements increase the length of a control 
> section,an
> ICS statement, which defines the total length of the control 
> section, must
> be
> placed at the front of the deck.
> 
> 
> +--
> -
> -+
> | Table 7. REP Statement Format
> |
> 
> +--+---
> -
> -+
> | Column   | Contents
> |
> 
> +--+---
> -
> -+
> | 1| X'02' (12-2-9 punch). Identifies this as a loader 
> control|
> |  | statement.
> |
> 
> +--+---
> -
> -+
> | 2-4  | REP -- identifies the type of load statement.
> |
> 
> +--+---
> -
> -+
> | 5-12 | Hexadecimal starting address of the area to be 
> replaced as
> |
> |  | assigned by the assembler. It must be right-
> justified in these
> |
> |  | columns with unused leading columns filled with 
> blanks or
> |
> |  | zeros.
> |
> 
> +--+---
> -
> -+
> | 13-14| Blank.
> |
> 
> +--+---
> -
> -+
> | 15-16| ESID (External Symbol Identification) -- the hexadecimal
> number |
> |  | assigned to the control section in which replacement 
> is to be
> |
> |  

Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Patrick O'Keefe]

On Tue, 18 Apr 2006 22:33:50 -0500, Ed Gould <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>...
>Sometime in the past there was an option to use rep cards as input to
>the linkage editor (now called Binder). The reports on here seem to
>indicate that these rep cards are no longer valid . The rep cards as
>you spoke are for amaspzap (like you said) . Two different IBM programs.
>
>There seems to be conjecture that it was an early OS (MVT/MVT) that
>accommodated them. And in some past time was taken out of the OS.
>...

Going back farther, or at least lower in functionality, they were also 
accommodated by card loaders (for BPS utilities?).  As I recall, the 
3-card loader did not support them, but the 7- and 12-card loader did.
Some utilities had parms set this way. 

I suspect they had a slightly different format.  They probably did not
need an ESDID field.

Pat O'Keefe

   

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 04/18/2006
   at 10:33 PM, Ed Gould <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>There seems to be conjecture that it was an early OS (MVT/MVT) that  
>accommodated them. And in some past time was taken out of the OS.

IMHO the change was a good thing.  It was too easy to shoot yourself
in the foot with '02'x REP, and AMASPZAP is also more user friendly.
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 04/18/2006
   at 08:33 PM, "Eric N. Bielefeld" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>I've seen a bunch of posts on this.  Are these the REP cards as are
>used in  AMASPZAP, or is this something different. 

Quite different, and there's no equivalent to VER.
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Chris Mason]

Shmuel,

Check this out. It appears to be CMS HELP for the LOAD command. It includes
a description of the REP card but also a VER card.

http://mitvma.mit.edu/cmshelp.cgi?CMS%20LOAD%20(ALL

I also found a page for the DOSLKED command which mentions only the usual
card types including the REP card but no VER card.

http://vm.uconn.edu/cgi-bin/cmshelp?CMS%20DOSLked

Chris Mason

- Original Message - 
From: "Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main
To: 
Sent: Sunday, 23 April, 2006 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)


> In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 04/18/2006
>at 08:33 PM, "Eric N. Bielefeld" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>
> >I've seen a bunch of posts on this.  Are these the REP cards as are
> >used in  AMASPZAP, or is this something different.
>
> Quite different, and there's no equivalent to VER.
>
> -- 
>  Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
>  ISO position; see <http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html>
> We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
> (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Chris Mason]

Shmuel,

The conjecture may be mine. The operating system was *not* DOS (VSE) or VM.
I'm pretty sure it was the usual "smaller" OS of the time, VS1 was it mot?
I'm pretty sure I had to fix up some code at the object level because the
source was a CICS transaction in PL/1 and using REP cards was the only way I
could get at the code I could see was wrong when the module size exceeded
32K. It was 1973 and it was September.

I can pin the month down to September because the head of the family I was
taken to see, a family planning to emigrate to Israel, so it was a somewhat
surreptitious visit, joked once we were safely in his flat (apartment) that
I should wait until later in the year than September to be wearing a
sheepskin coat in Moscow.

Chris Mason

- Original Message - 
From: "Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main
To: 
Sent: Sunday, 23 April, 2006 3:19 PM
Subject: Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)


> In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 04/18/2006
>at 10:33 PM, Ed Gould <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>
> >There seems to be conjecture that it was an early OS (MVT/MVT) that
> >accommodated them. And in some past time was taken out of the OS.
>
> IMHO the change was a good thing.  It was too easy to shoot yourself
> in the foot with '02'x REP, and AMASPZAP is also more user friendly.
>
> -- 
>  Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
>  ISO position; see <http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html>
> We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
> (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 04/24/2006
   at 01:29 AM, Chris Mason <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>Check this out. It appears to be CMS HELP for the LOAD command. It
>includes a description of the REP card but also a VER card.

Thanks.
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 04/24/2006
   at 01:46 AM, Chris Mason <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>The conjecture may be mine. The operating system was *not* DOS (VSE)
>or VM. I'm pretty sure it was the usual "smaller" OS of the time, VS1
>was it mot?

OS/VS1 was the follow-on to OS/360 MFT II. While smaller than MVS, it
was arguably larger than OS/VS2 R1 (SVS) and certainly larger than
DOS/VS and DOS/VSE. I would never have had occasion to check whether
OS/VS1 supported REP; my OS/VS experience was with OS/VS2 and by then
I had effectively abandoned EAM cards.
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: Binder REP Cards (Was: What's the linkage editor really wants?)

[Chris Langford]

However CMS LOAD rejects a SYM card as invalid. Assembler generates it, 
LOAD hiccups.


Chris Mason wrote:


Shmuel,

Check this out. It appears to be CMS HELP for the LOAD command. It includes
a description of the REP card but also a VER card.
 



--
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Cestrian Software:
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