Re: Test
I think for some reason it's related to when I do a Reply with History. I recently went to a newer version of Lotus Notes and suspect something is now different. Sorry for the bother to everyone. David, The two messages of yours which came through to me garbled had this in the mail headers: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 The test message had this instead: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" HTH Peter Have a nice day, Dave Betten DFSORT Development, Performance Lead IBM Corporation email: bet...@us.ibm.com 1-301-240-3809 DFSORT/MVSontheweb at http://www.ibm.com/storage/dfsort/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Test
David, The two messages of yours which came through to me garbled had this in the mail headers: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 The test message had this instead: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" HTH Peter -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of David Betten Sent: Friday, April 27, 2012 11:14 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Test Sorry about this post. Trying to determine why my posts are coming out garbled. Dave Betten -- This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee and may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If the reader of the message is not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail and delete the message and any attachments from your system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Test
David, Observation: Your encoding is ISO-8859-1, Mark's email is coded in Windows-1252. Maybe this is related to the problem Regards -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland W dniu 2012-04-27 17:13, David Betten pisze: Sorry about this post. Trying to determine why my posts are coming out garbled. Dave Betten -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Tre tej wiadomoci moe zawiera informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wycznie do uytku subowego adresata. Odbiorc moe by jedynie jej adresat z wyczeniem dostpu osób trzecich. Jeeli nie jeste adresatem niniejszej wiadomoci lub pracownikiem upowanionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, e jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne dziaanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i moe by karalne. Jeeli otrzymae t wiadomo omykowo, prosimy niezwocznie zawiadomi nadawc wysyajc odpowied oraz trwale usun t wiadomo wczajc w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorised to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. BRE Bank SA, 00-950 Warszawa, ul. Senatorska 18, tel. +48 22 829 00 00, fax +48 22 829 00 33, www.brebank.pl, e-mail: i...@brebank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2012 r. kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA (w caoci wpacony) wynosi 168.410.984 zotych. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Test
On 4/27/2012 9:13 AM, David Betten wrote: Sorry about this post. Trying to determine why my posts are coming out garbled. Dave Betten -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN Well, this one is fine! -- Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-355-2752 http://www.trainersfriend.com * To get a good Return on your Investment, first make an investment! + Training your people is an excellent investment * Try our tool for calculating your Return On Investment for training dollars at http://www.trainersfriend.com/ROI/roi.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Test 000-Z05
> > Does anyone have a sample of > Test 000-Z05: IBM System z and z/OS Fundamentals Mastery? > I am not sure you can get a copy of the test. On the ibm website it talks about a 10.00 USD fee for taking it Go to this link to learn more about the test. http://www-03.ibm.com/certify/mastery_tests/objZ05.shtml Lizette -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
--- --- On Sun, 8/29/10, Rick Fochtman wrote: From: Rick Fochtman Subject: Re: Test DASD performance tools To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Date: Sunday, August 29, 2010, 4:23 PM Ron, I understand your viewpoint, but it's hard for a customer shop to choose the RIGHT 24 hours to model. They can pick a "worst case", like maybe end-of-month or end-of-year, or they can pick a regular processing day, or anything in between.By providing the tools to the customer, the customer can pick and choose and run multiple scenarios that may be unique to his shop. I've had vendors tell me that this is how your shop will run with this equipment, only to have to remove it within a few months because the vendor didn't tell me the truth. And wouldn't show me the figures from his "modeling tool." The whole experience cost my company many thousands of dollars and a lot of weekend time for me. Most of the problem was caused because we used a hierarchical database and used a rather large amount of BDAM access to the database, which the vendor didn't understand and the tool (giving it a lot of credit) didn't account for. Freely granted that BDAM access patterns can be very hard to model. Rick Rick: I guess maybe we were lucky when it came to our database. Like yours it was BDAM but with a little difference. Our consulting company had mad one small change to BDAM (I am not lying) and small difference was on (my memory is foggy here) search key (I am not all that familiar with the actual change).We were a magazine/book publishing company and had many millions of subscribers. My memory is foggy here again (40 years ago and that is what happens) but at the time I think we had 32+ 3330-11 drives dedicated to the database. Plus a whole lot of smaller ones for other reasons. We were lucky (I guess) that there wasn't any issues with DASD response time as the address's were (I think) done in alpha sequence (definitely not sure) so access was fairly random. I do not know why our management ever agreed to the modification like they did but from little I remember it was done before I got there. Ed One of the biggest problems we encountered was locality-of-reference, which resulted in a LOT of index updates clustered very close together, as well as data updates similarly clustered. Rick -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
--- On Sun, 8/29/10, Rick Fochtman wrote: From: Rick Fochtman Subject: Re: Test DASD performance tools To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Date: Sunday, August 29, 2010, 4:23 PM Ron, I understand your viewpoint, but it's hard for a customer shop to choose the RIGHT 24 hours to model. They can pick a "worst case", like maybe end-of-month or end-of-year, or they can pick a regular processing day, or anything in between. By providing the tools to the customer, the customer can pick and choose and run multiple scenarios that may be unique to his shop. I've had vendors tell me that this is how your shop will run with this equipment, only to have to remove it within a few months because the vendor didn't tell me the truth. And wouldn't show me the figures from his "modeling tool." The whole experience cost my company many thousands of dollars and a lot of weekend time for me. Most of the problem was caused because we used a hierarchical database and used a rather large amount of BDAM access to the database, which the vendor didn't understand and the tool (giving it a lot of credit) didn't account for. Freely granted that BDAM access patterns can be very hard to model. Rick Rick: I guess maybe we were lucky when it came to our database. Like yours it was BDAM but with a little difference. Our consulting company had mad one small change to BDAM (I am not lying) and small difference was on (my memory is foggy here) search key (I am not all that familiar with the actual change).We were a magazine/book publishing company and had many millions of subscribers. My memory is foggy here again (40 years ago and that is what happens) but at the time I think we had 32+ 3330-11 drives dedicated to the database. Plus a whole lot of smaller ones for other reasons. We were lucky (I guess) that there wasn't any issues with DASD response time as the address's were (I think) done in alpha sequence (definitely not sure) so access was fairly random. I do not know why our management ever agreed to the modification like they did but from little I remember it was done before I got there. Ed -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
Rick, The problem is that most IO patterns, like BDAM, are difficult to model, unless you have a sample of the IO arrival - a GTF trace. Modeling complex, multivariate IO patterns using a series of averages at 900 or 1800 second rests is going to flaky at best. If I recall correctly even Jeff Buzon and his incredible team did not attempt this, but rather left response time and cache hits as knobs to twirl in the model rather than actually trying constructively model the 3990, 7980-3 and 6100 architectures. As I recall Leadtime was the last serious attempt at doing this, and it has been dead and buried for over ten years AFAIK. It is not a simple task to take performance data from a DMX4 architecture and make reliable decisions about how it will perform on a DS8700. One really needs to use the internal performance metrics, rather than those that are massaged into looking like an ESS for the sake of producing a compatible RMF record.. Why not turn it around and ask the incumbent vendor to provide an accurate model of how IO on the current storage will perform on the other two vendor's hardware. The result will be potentially be far more accurate because they have a far more granular view of what defines the current IO performance. But I assume a fair and honest model of the other vendor's hardware. In order to model Storage performance with a modicum of accuracy each vendor would require some very detailed information as to the back-end activity of each logical volume, including several items that are not in RMF. For example what about the distribution of RAID-1/5/6 overhead. Have you ever found an RMF report that has details on Parity chunk write cache hits, or sequential gathered write efficiency? What about performance models and guarantees during initial copy or resynch of 100s of in-system copies (Shadowimage/FlashCopy V1 and V2/Timefinder), or while when dynamic sparing or drive rebuild is occurring? The model would have to take into account the activity of both target and secondary volume, and the completion rate of the resynch as back-end IO moves from the source volume array group to the target volume array group as well as any piggy out-of-order promotion. Typically your IO subsystems are doing 20-200 times more IOPS than your OLTP system is doing TPS. When was the last time you had IBM model your 2000 TPS processor, let alone a 400K disk subsystems? Like I suggested, have a look at the SAS source code for FlashDA and tell me that this is some sort of incredibly accurate modeling, or some very safe estimates of the differential between SSD and FCAL drives.(note that I think FlashDA is a handy tool). I'm not saying that a vendor cannot take current RMF data and provide some fairly safe estimates of how the current IO for an RMF interval will perform on their storage. That is likely to be a weighted average of service time across the interval. I just think there is a rather large gap between a safe estimate from RMF, and an SMF based model that is good enough to prove claimed performance, purely because SMF does not really tell you anything about the IO source architecture - is it RVA, 9980V, or DMX4. Ron > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Rick Fochtman > Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2010 2:23 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Test DASD performance tools > > Ron, I understand your viewpoint, but it's hard for a customer shop to > choose the RIGHT 24 hours to model. They can pick a "worst case", like > maybe end-of-month or end-of-year, or they can pick a regular processing > day, or anything in between.By providing the tools to the customer, > the customer can pick and choose and run multiple scenarios that may be > unique to his shop. I've had vendors tell me that this is how your shop > will run with this equipment, only to have to remove it within a few > months because the vendor didn't tell me the truth. And wouldn't show me > the figures from his "modeling tool." The whole experience cost my > company many thousands of dollars and a lot of weekend time for me. Most > of the problem was caused because we used a hierarchical database and > used a rather large amount of BDAM access to the database, which the > vendor didn't understand and the tool (giving it a lot of credit) didn't > account for. Freely granted that BDAM access patterns can be very hard > to model. > > Rick > > Ron Hawkins wrote: > > >Rick, > > > >We were talking about getting vendors to model your performance on their > >respective offerings, not an existing IO problem. It's the sort of thing > >that was done by people at BGS that lived in small cells underground and > >they were occasionally rewarded with raw meat. > > > >The proposition is that a vendor can take 24 hour of data an accurately > >predict your performance with no other input than some S
Re: Test DASD performance tools
Ron, I understand your viewpoint, but it's hard for a customer shop to choose the RIGHT 24 hours to model. They can pick a "worst case", like maybe end-of-month or end-of-year, or they can pick a regular processing day, or anything in between.By providing the tools to the customer, the customer can pick and choose and run multiple scenarios that may be unique to his shop. I've had vendors tell me that this is how your shop will run with this equipment, only to have to remove it within a few months because the vendor didn't tell me the truth. And wouldn't show me the figures from his "modeling tool." The whole experience cost my company many thousands of dollars and a lot of weekend time for me. Most of the problem was caused because we used a hierarchical database and used a rather large amount of BDAM access to the database, which the vendor didn't understand and the tool (giving it a lot of credit) didn't account for. Freely granted that BDAM access patterns can be very hard to model. Rick Ron Hawkins wrote: Rick, We were talking about getting vendors to model your performance on their respective offerings, not an existing IO problem. It's the sort of thing that was done by people at BGS that lived in small cells underground and they were occasionally rewarded with raw meat. The proposition is that a vendor can take 24 hour of data an accurately predict your performance with no other input than some SMF records. These DASD controllers can do half a million IOPS and an accurate forecast of performance based on 900 or 1800 second averages over 24 hours is required. And then you have to guarantee that performance for 3 years no matter how the customer grows, shrinks or changes the workload. Have a look at the source code for FlashDA and tell me that it's going to do that :-( While Shane did not go easy on vendors, I thought that one of his points was that this sort of warranty protects the performance guy at a customer site from actually having to understand IO performance. Yes I work for a vendor, but I've spent more time working for customers. No need for me to put shields up, I have a thick skin and head to match. Yes there are many, many brilliant IO performance gals and guys out there working on MVS IO performance. I don't think Shane was referring to anyone in that category. Ron -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Rick Fochtman Sent: Friday, August 27, 2010 1:35 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Test DASD performance tools -- - That's a good idea, providing the customer is willing to provide accurate description of what they want to have modeled. SMF has a lot of really good averages, but very little in the way of detailed access patterns. Can you tell skip sequential access from random with a Type 74 record? Can a DASD vendor factor your CPU upgrade into a storage model? Will a customer agree not to change their IO patterns for the life of the performance warranty? In less polite company all this would be known as arse covering. The customer wants the vendor to indemnify their (the customers) lack of knowledge (due in no small degree to vendor obfuscation), and the vendors want to extract as much as possible for as long as possible without enlightening said customer. Business as usual to this jaundiced eye. -- I agree with Shane. You need to explain to this vendor, in no uncertain terms, that YOU are the arbiter of whether this equipment is performing or not, based on the regular performance of YOUR workload. If he/she/they want to cover their collective rear ends, then the equipment better live up to the specs they offered for it. PERIOD. Be nasty and unpleasant if you have to; it's your shop, not theirs. And it's your money! Don't be afraid to demand detailed information and try to get some references. As many as you can get~Preferably Rick -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html . -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the
Re: Test DASD performance tools
Ted, While this does not represent the majority of interactions with customers, it is one that has happened more often than I would have expected. The most common catalyst for this is that Omegamon or similar has highlighted so-called poor response time on a volume that is doing some inconsequential IO rate and getting erratic response time. V. Can you describe the problem to me? C. It's slower. V. Is the response time longer? C. I think so. V. Are all the metrics different, or just one like CMR time? C. CMR what? It's just slower. V. How much slower is the IO rate? C. 0.1 IO/sec. I have the monitor screen print. V. And what was the IO rate before? C. The IO rate has not changed. The response time is slower. The other vendor said they never go that slow. V. OK, so the VTOC on this empty volume is not always getting a cache hit when allocation or an SMF record check the free space. Would you like a solid state drive, or should we just bind the VTOC for every volume into cache? C. But we have a performance guarantee. V. For an empty volume that is doing 0.1 IOPS? This is not a single, specific discourse. It is an attempt to illustrate what I feel is an increasing cycle of "chicken little" performance problems. My observation is that customers do not seem to be providing or requiring the training that head off this sort of non-problem. For the customer case. Ted, I pretty much limit myself to a cheap shot. I would probably lose my job if I completely vented my spleen at the field guys that accept this sort of thing as a problem in the first place. Ten minutes with the customer and some RMF reports should see the issue explained and put to bed at the outset. Ron > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Ted MacNEIL > Sent: Friday, August 27, 2010 3:47 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Test DASD performance tools > > >that this sort of warranty protects the performance guy at a customer site > from actually having to understand IO performance. > > Cheap shot > > - > I'm a SuperHero with neither powers, nor motivation! > Kimota! > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
Rick, We were talking about getting vendors to model your performance on their respective offerings, not an existing IO problem. It's the sort of thing that was done by people at BGS that lived in small cells underground and they were occasionally rewarded with raw meat. The proposition is that a vendor can take 24 hour of data an accurately predict your performance with no other input than some SMF records. These DASD controllers can do half a million IOPS and an accurate forecast of performance based on 900 or 1800 second averages over 24 hours is required. And then you have to guarantee that performance for 3 years no matter how the customer grows, shrinks or changes the workload. Have a look at the source code for FlashDA and tell me that it's going to do that :-( While Shane did not go easy on vendors, I thought that one of his points was that this sort of warranty protects the performance guy at a customer site from actually having to understand IO performance. Yes I work for a vendor, but I've spent more time working for customers. No need for me to put shields up, I have a thick skin and head to match. Yes there are many, many brilliant IO performance gals and guys out there working on MVS IO performance. I don't think Shane was referring to anyone in that category. Ron > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Rick Fochtman > Sent: Friday, August 27, 2010 1:35 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Test DASD performance tools > > -- - > > >>That's a good idea, providing the customer is willing to provide accurate > >>description of what they want to have modeled. SMF has a lot of really good > >>averages, but very little in the way of detailed access patterns. > >> > >>Can you tell skip sequential access from random with a Type 74 record? Can a > >>DASD vendor factor your CPU upgrade into a storage model? Will a customer > >>agree not to change their IO patterns for the life of the performance > >>warranty? > >> > >> > > > >In less polite company all this would be known as arse covering. > >The customer wants the vendor to indemnify their (the customers) lack of > >knowledge (due in no small degree to vendor obfuscation), and the > >vendors want to extract as much as possible for as long as possible > >without enlightening said customer. > > > >Business as usual to this jaundiced eye. > > > > > -- > > I agree with Shane. > > You need to explain to this vendor, in no uncertain terms, that YOU are > the arbiter of whether this equipment is performing or not, based on the > regular performance of YOUR workload. If he/she/they want to cover their > collective rear ends, then the equipment better live up to the specs > they offered for it. PERIOD. Be nasty and unpleasant if you have to; > it's your shop, not theirs. And it's your money! > > Don't be afraid to demand detailed information and try to get some > references. As many as you can get~Preferably > > Rick > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
>that this sort of warranty protects the performance guy at a customer site >from actually having to understand IO performance. Cheap shot - I'm a SuperHero with neither powers, nor motivation! Kimota! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
--- That's a good idea, providing the customer is willing to provide accurate description of what they want to have modeled. SMF has a lot of really good averages, but very little in the way of detailed access patterns. Can you tell skip sequential access from random with a Type 74 record? Can a DASD vendor factor your CPU upgrade into a storage model? Will a customer agree not to change their IO patterns for the life of the performance warranty? In less polite company all this would be known as arse covering. The customer wants the vendor to indemnify their (the customers) lack of knowledge (due in no small degree to vendor obfuscation), and the vendors want to extract as much as possible for as long as possible without enlightening said customer. Business as usual to this jaundiced eye. -- I agree with Shane. You need to explain to this vendor, in no uncertain terms, that YOU are the arbiter of whether this equipment is performing or not, based on the regular performance of YOUR workload. If he/she/they want to cover their collective rear ends, then the equipment better live up to the specs they offered for it. PERIOD. Be nasty and unpleasant if you have to; it's your shop, not theirs. And it's your money! Don't be afraid to demand detailed information and try to get some references. As many as you can get~Preferably Rick -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
Shane, Are you saying you aren't allowed to look at any of the performance data in your storage. I know at least one vendor that bundles it with the storage and gives you export tools so you can analyze Microprocessor usage and internal path activity to your heart's content. Ron > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Shane > Sent: Friday, August 27, 2010 5:57 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Test DASD performance tools > > > That's a good idea, providing the customer is willing to provide accurate > > description of what they want to have modeled. SMF has a lot of really good > > averages, but very little in the way of detailed access patterns. > > > > Can you tell skip sequential access from random with a Type 74 record? Can a > > DASD vendor factor your CPU upgrade into a storage model? Will a customer > > agree not to change their IO patterns for the life of the performance > > warranty? > > In less polite company all this would be known as arse covering. > The customer wants the vendor to indemnify their (the customers) lack of > knowledge (due in no small degree to vendor obfuscation), and the > vendors want to extract as much as possible for as long as possible > without enlightening said customer. > > Business as usual to this jaundiced eye. > > Shane ... > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
> That's a good idea, providing the customer is willing to provide accurate > description of what they want to have modeled. SMF has a lot of really good > averages, but very little in the way of detailed access patterns. > > Can you tell skip sequential access from random with a Type 74 record? Can a > DASD vendor factor your CPU upgrade into a storage model? Will a customer > agree not to change their IO patterns for the life of the performance > warranty? In less polite company all this would be known as arse covering. The customer wants the vendor to indemnify their (the customers) lack of knowledge (due in no small degree to vendor obfuscation), and the vendors want to extract as much as possible for as long as possible without enlightening said customer. Business as usual to this jaundiced eye. Shane ... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
Bruce, That's a good idea, providing the customer is willing to provide accurate description of what they want to have modeled. SMF has a lot of really good averages, but very little in the way of detailed access patterns. Can you tell skip sequential access from random with a Type 74 record? Can a DASD vendor factor your CPU upgrade into a storage model? Will a customer agree not to change their IO patterns for the life of the performance warranty? Ron > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Bruce Richardson > Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2010 12:11 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Test DASD performance tools > > I say get the vendors to provide the tools and/or analysis to prove their > claims. > > They may ask for SMF data from the existing environment to put through their > modeling tools. Make sure they ask for specific SMF record types, as you do > not want to send huge volumes of SMF data to the vendors. > > My $0.02, Bruce > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
I say get the vendors to provide the tools and/or analysis to prove their claims. They may ask for SMF data from the existing environment to put through their modeling tools. Make sure they ask for specific SMF record types, as you do not want to send huge volumes of SMF data to the vendors. My $0.02, Bruce -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
AFAIK, there aren't -any- 'hard and fast' rules to go by :-) The OP seems to be looking for a way to evaluate and compare two different DASD vendor offerings. I think we all agree that the issue is really pretty complex, and the only real way to know how a specific device it going to perform is to observe it under fire servicing the specific workload. Even then, I think we can agree that there are lots of opportunities to mismanage any hardware such that performance suffers anywhere from barely noticeable to near catastrophic. Conversely, there are opportunities to achieve performance near what the salespersons claim. And those opportunities may vary depending on the machine. So, what is the OP to do? Lacking the opportunity to run side by side tests, I'd advise to take a hard look at the prices and features and let those be my key metrics. Just my $0.02. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ron Hawkins Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 10:32 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Test DASD performance tools Hal, I don't this is a hard and fast rule to go by, especially as response time can vary for many reasons that have nothing to do with the storage. Personally I feel that throughput is equally as important. Response time can increase 200-300% as throughput increases and it will have no discernable effect on your application as long as throughput is maintained. Because cache hits and misses for reads make for extreme differences in response time that are not reflected in any RMF number. You can be getting <1ms response time and be blissfully unaware that you have a sibling pend problem for 5% of your IO. If response time is your only metric then I'd suggest looking for ways to report response time in a far more granular manner. Use the Type 42 subtype 6 records, consider distributing disconnect time to the cache misses and remote copy writes only, or start using the internal response time and usage data that all the DASD vendors provide. When you have a 1000 disk drives and 2000 volumes doing 400K IOPS from 4 LPARS to a USP-V, Response time from RMF alone can prove to be somewhat inadequate. Ron > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Hal Merritt > Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 7:32 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Test DASD performance tools > > The bottom line in DASD performance is response time. RMF reports that. > > How well a given vendor performs in a given situation would be difficult to > simulate and therefore the results may not be very meaningful. > > > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Tommy Tsui > Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 9:16 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Test DASD performance tools > > Hi all, > Our shop needs to compare the EMC & IBM DASD performance. Is there any > free tools to test the DASD performance? such as online CICS/Batch > performance? > > Many thanks > > > NOTICE: This electronic mail message and any files transmitted with it are > intended > exclusively for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. The > message, > together with any attachment, may contain confidential and/or privileged > information. > Any unauthorized review, use, printing, saving, copying, disclosure or > distribution > is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please > immediately advise the sender by reply email and delete all copies. > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html NOTICE: This electronic mail message and any files transmitted with it are intended exclusively for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. The message, together with any attachment, may contain confidential and/or privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, printing, saving, copying, disclosure or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately advise the sender by reply email and delete all copies. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
But it is worth every dollar, peso, euro, renminbi, pound, dina, yen, rupee, whateva that you spend on it if this is something you do every year or so. > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Bill Fairchild > Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 10:00 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Test DASD performance tools > > Save yourself some time. The PA/IODRIVER is not free. > > Bill Fairchild > Rocket Software > > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Staller, Allan > Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 10:31 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: Test DASD performance tools > > PA/IODRIVER http://www.perfassoc.com/ > > > Our shop needs to compare the EMC & IBM DASD performance. Is there any > free tools to test the DASD performance? such as online CICS/Batch > performance? > > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
Save yourself some time. The PA/IODRIVER is not free. Bill Fairchild Rocket Software -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Staller, Allan Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 10:31 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Test DASD performance tools PA/IODRIVER http://www.perfassoc.com/ Our shop needs to compare the EMC & IBM DASD performance. Is there any free tools to test the DASD performance? such as online CICS/Batch performance? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
Tommy, There is nothing free on z/OS that I am aware of, apart from writing your own test programs. There are some free software tools that run in Open Systems that you may run on a LINUX LPAR with dedicated FICON volumes and get some results. Keep z/VM out of the picture, as it is still playing catch up in IO land. As far as I know the FICON drivers in LINUX do not support z/HPF, HyperPAV or MIDAW, but these are host centric features that should have minimal difference on the DASD controller. The important thing is to have a constant IO loads that you can compare across the vendors. Of course you still need to manually analyze your workload and come up with a workload mix that is representative of what you do. Don't start thinking that a few sequential read and writes and an SMF sort represent you 24 hour IO load. If you really want to do it properly though I would urge you to consider contacting Performance Associates, getting a PAIO license, and using the IO profiling tool to build your benchmarks. Ron > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Tommy Tsui > Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 7:16 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: [IBM-MAIN] Test DASD performance tools > > Hi all, > Our shop needs to compare the EMC & IBM DASD performance. Is there any > free tools to test the DASD performance? such as online CICS/Batch > performance? > > Many thanks > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
PA/IODRIVER http://www.perfassoc.com/ Our shop needs to compare the EMC & IBM DASD performance. Is there any free tools to test the DASD performance? such as online CICS/Batch performance? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
Hal, I don't this is a hard and fast rule to go by, especially as response time can vary for many reasons that have nothing to do with the storage. Personally I feel that throughput is equally as important. Response time can increase 200-300% as throughput increases and it will have no discernable effect on your application as long as throughput is maintained. Because cache hits and misses for reads make for extreme differences in response time that are not reflected in any RMF number. You can be getting <1ms response time and be blissfully unaware that you have a sibling pend problem for 5% of your IO. If response time is your only metric then I'd suggest looking for ways to report response time in a far more granular manner. Use the Type 42 subtype 6 records, consider distributing disconnect time to the cache misses and remote copy writes only, or start using the internal response time and usage data that all the DASD vendors provide. When you have a 1000 disk drives and 2000 volumes doing 400K IOPS from 4 LPARS to a USP-V, Response time from RMF alone can prove to be somewhat inadequate. Ron > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Hal Merritt > Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 7:32 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Test DASD performance tools > > The bottom line in DASD performance is response time. RMF reports that. > > How well a given vendor performs in a given situation would be difficult to > simulate and therefore the results may not be very meaningful. > > > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of > Tommy Tsui > Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 9:16 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Test DASD performance tools > > Hi all, > Our shop needs to compare the EMC & IBM DASD performance. Is there any > free tools to test the DASD performance? such as online CICS/Batch > performance? > > Many thanks > > > NOTICE: This electronic mail message and any files transmitted with it are > intended > exclusively for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. The > message, > together with any attachment, may contain confidential and/or privileged > information. > Any unauthorized review, use, printing, saving, copying, disclosure or > distribution > is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please > immediately advise the sender by reply email and delete all copies. > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test DASD performance tools
The bottom line in DASD performance is response time. RMF reports that. How well a given vendor performs in a given situation would be difficult to simulate and therefore the results may not be very meaningful. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Tommy Tsui Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 9:16 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Test DASD performance tools Hi all, Our shop needs to compare the EMC & IBM DASD performance. Is there any free tools to test the DASD performance? such as online CICS/Batch performance? Many thanks NOTICE: This electronic mail message and any files transmitted with it are intended exclusively for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. The message, together with any attachment, may contain confidential and/or privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, printing, saving, copying, disclosure or distribution is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately advise the sender by reply email and delete all copies. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST geographically separate from PROD
I think we did that at one place I worked in the ME. There were TEST and PROD LPARs in the main centre, but there were other TEST and DR LPARs located a few hundred kliks at our secondary data centre. Generally, I don't think you have to have that much separation for pure TEST/PROD, but I think it's vital to have DR several hundred miles apart (I like the 1000 mile sep) and then using the DR site for TEST LPAR processing that supports the main site (leaving more room for PROD processing on the main iron). If you're logon is too slow, is it your system or is it your home service? I've got a cable modem with 30 meg/sec and logons to remote sites on either coast is pretty darn good! I use GoToMyPC for some sites, but even on the "regular" ones I've never had a problem. If you've got DSL, that might be the problem. Either that, or your front-end at the office is configured in such a manner that you have to go through a zillion hoops to authenticate. Hope this helps. Many thanks. Doc Farmer Senior Security Specialist InfoSec, Inc. http://www.InfoSecInc.com http://www.linkedin.com/in/DocFarmer http://tinyurl.com/2t6bwd (Click to Connect) On Thu, 10 Sep 2009 09:33:29 -0600, Frank Swarbrick wrote: >The whole combined versus separate TEST and PROD LPARs was interesting. I can't imagine not having them separate (with shared DASD for at least the load libraries), but then it's just what I'm used to. > >So here's a question... Anyone out there have DEV/TEST not only in a separate LPAR, or even a separate machine, but in a separate data center? We have our primary data center in Lakewood, CO (near Denver) and our "alternate data center" (DR site) in Scottsdale, AZ. So about 1000 miles apart. Management has the idea that we should move the applications development LPAR to the ADC. As an applications developer this makes me more than a bit nervous. Does anyone do this? Is a GDPS essentially required to make this workable? We currently do DASD replication to our ADC using DS8100s. > >One other thing I'm concerned about is TN3270 response time. I feel that logging on to work from home is too slow, and I only live 8 miles away. > >Thanks, >Frank > > > >The information contained in this electronic communication and any document attached hereto or transmitted herewith is confidential and intended for the exclusive use of the individual or entity named above. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient or the employee or agent responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any examination, use, dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication or any part thereof is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please immediately notify the sender by reply e- mail and destroy this communication. Thank you. > >-- > >Frank Swarbrick >Applications Architect - Mainframe Applications Development >FirstBank Data Corporation - Lakewood, CO USA >P: 303-235-1403 > >-- >For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, >send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO >Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST geographically separate from PROD
Hi Frank, Usually and is the way i've used, in the same location, separated machines for prod and test. But, having them in separated location, maybe due to costs or DR, i mean, DR locations are normaly used only when the main location is being affected due to a disaster, so the DR machine is not being used when normal operations. Due to the costs related to having a DR machine, i think is correct to use it for development or testing purposes when is not being used for real DR or DR tests. 7 years ago, i worked for an American company with 5 mainframes, 2 for development and DR purposes and the other 3 for production, all of them in separated locations, this is normal in several big companies, specially in application development companies. Related to the TN3270, no matter how far or near you are from your work, the response time depends on the connection speed, as an example, if you are connected at 1 mile from your work using an old dialup modem, then the response time will be slow, but if you are connected at the other side of the world using a 1Gb or T1 connection, then the response time will be fast. So i suggest you to check your connection speed, also check how much people is being connected using the same connection. Luck. Enrique Montero El jue, 10-09-2009 a las 09:33 -0600, Frank Swarbrick escribió: > The whole combined versus separate TEST and PROD LPARs was interesting. I > can't imagine not having them separate (with shared DASD for at least the > load libraries), but then it's just what I'm used to. > > So here's a question... Anyone out there have DEV/TEST not only in a > separate LPAR, or even a separate machine, but in a separate data center? We > have our primary data center in Lakewood, CO (near Denver) and our "alternate > data center" (DR site) in Scottsdale, AZ. So about 1000 miles apart. > Management has the idea that we should move the applications development LPAR > to the ADC. As an applications developer this makes me more than a bit > nervous. Does anyone do this? Is a GDPS essentially required to make this > workable? We currently do DASD replication to our ADC using DS8100s. > > One other thing I'm concerned about is TN3270 response time. I feel that > logging on to work from home is too slow, and I only live 8 miles away. > > Thanks, > Frank > > > >>> > > The information contained in this electronic communication and any document > attached hereto or transmitted herewith is confidential and intended for the > exclusive use of the individual or entity named above. If the reader of this > message is not the intended recipient or the employee or agent responsible > for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any > examination, use, dissemination, distribution or copying of this > communication or any part thereof is strictly prohibited. If you have > received this communication in error, please immediately notify the sender by > reply e-mail and destroy this communication. Thank you. > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST geographically separate from PROD
>So here's a question... Anyone out there have DEV/TEST not only in a separate LPAR, or even a separate machine, but in >a separate data center? We have our primary data center in Lakewood, CO (near Denver) and our "alternate data center" >(DR site) in Scottsdale, AZ. So about 1000 miles apart. Management has the idea that we should move the applications >development LPAR to the ADC. As an applications developer this makes me more than a bit nervous. Does anyone do this? >Is a GDPS essentially required to make this workable? We currently do DASD replication to our ADC using DS8100s. I have seen this done. The actual decision to support a remote development site is more of a financial one than anything else. A GDPS is a consideration only if the application availability demands it. "Separate" sites can work fine in this situation. IMO, one of the *BIG* requirements to a successful implementation of this type is communications band width. Not only for the teleprocessing traffic, but also for file transfers and (in the case of GDPS) DASD replication. WARNING Will Robinson WARNING High bandwidth communication can get *VERY* expensive. >One other thing I'm concerned about is TN3270 response time. I feel that logging on to work from home is too slow, and >I only live 8 miles away. This is probably a function of your ISP and/or dial-up connection. Remote access in these days and times is nearly as good as local access. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test Posting, please ignore
Duly ignored. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Anthony Fletcher Sent: Friday, August 28, 2009 5:37 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Test Posting, please ignore Test only -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: E-Mail legalise (was Re: Test)
>3. It is a legal cya that some view as worthwhile In Canada, it's called 'prior restraint'. If you don't know about it before you read it, it's unenforcable. And, as such a waste of time, space & band-width. - Too busy driving to stop for gas! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: E-Mail legalese (was Re: Test)
Which is why I do not put a "delete if not for you" message. Makes about as much sense as telling a jury to ignore testimony. Mine is simply to release others from liability should I say something that I should not say. I was taught a long time ago not to put anything in an email that I did not mind seeing on the evening news (that would be a real slow night). Dennis Roach GHG Corporation Lockheed Martin Mission Services Flight Design and Operations Contract NASA/JSC Address: 2100 Space Park Drive LM-15-4BH Houston, Texas 77058 Mail: P.O. Box 58487 Mail Code H4C Houston, Texas 77258 Phone: Voice: (281)336-5027 Cell: (713)591-1059 Fax:(281)336-5410 E-Mail: dennis.ro...@lmco.com All opinions expressed by me are mine and may not agree with my employer or any person, company, or thing, living or dead, on or near this or any other planet, moon, asteroid, or other spatial object, natural or manufactured, since the beginning of time. > -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On > Behalf Of Lionel B Dyck > Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 10:04 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: E-Mail legalise (was Re: Test) > > Steve is right - having the disclaimer at the bottom of the e-mail is > almost worthless for several reasons: > > 1. On a long e-mail you won't see it until you read down thru the e- > mail > causing you to scroll to the bottom > > 2. Just because it is there will not prevent inappropriate usage of the > contents > > 3. It is a legal cya that some view as worthwhile > > A better approach would be a popup to force you to acknowledge that you > are authorized and which logs such action before allowing one to read > the > e-mail. But then that would be a major pain in the (pick your part) to > have to do on every e-mail which might make people more inclined to use > the phone or to communicate in person or in some cases not send out an > e-mail. > > Cheers > > > Lionel B. Dyck, Consultant/Specialist > ?Never attribute to malice what can be caused by miscommunication.? > > NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: If you are not the intended recipient of this e- > mail, > you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or > disclosing > its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify > the > sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail > and > any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you. > > > > From: > "Thompson, Steve" > To: > IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Date: > 05/07/2009 07:38 AM > Subject: > Re: Test > Sent by: > IBM Mainframe Discussion List > > > > -----Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On > Behalf Of Rich Smrcina > Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 9:13 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: Test > > Ron wrote: > > Funny part is that these type of notices are always at the bottom of > the email. > > > > Just the place I always scroll to immediately when receiving and > reading an > > email... > > > No, he was referring to the Netzero advertisement that was appearing in > his sent email, in addition to the customary IBM-Main verbage. > > > > Actually, I was referring to the legalese at the bottom of a posting > that boils down to, if this email isn't meant for you you have to > unread > it, forget that you saw it and then reply to the sender to let them > know > you didn't read it. > > To that, I took something from Get Smart (the old fogies version), to > Burn Before Reading. > > Regards, > Steve Thompson > > -- Opinions expressed by this poster may not reflect those of poster's > employer. -- > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
E-Mail legalise (was Re: Test)
Steve is right - having the disclaimer at the bottom of the e-mail is almost worthless for several reasons: 1. On a long e-mail you won't see it until you read down thru the e-mail causing you to scroll to the bottom 2. Just because it is there will not prevent inappropriate usage of the contents 3. It is a legal cya that some view as worthwhile A better approach would be a popup to force you to acknowledge that you are authorized and which logs such action before allowing one to read the e-mail. But then that would be a major pain in the (pick your part) to have to do on every e-mail which might make people more inclined to use the phone or to communicate in person or in some cases not send out an e-mail. Cheers Lionel B. Dyck, Consultant/Specialist ?Never attribute to malice what can be caused by miscommunication.? NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you. From: "Thompson, Steve" To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Date: 05/07/2009 07:38 AM Subject: Re: Test Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Rich Smrcina Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 9:13 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Test Ron wrote: > Funny part is that these type of notices are always at the bottom of the email. > > Just the place I always scroll to immediately when receiving and reading an > email... > No, he was referring to the Netzero advertisement that was appearing in his sent email, in addition to the customary IBM-Main verbage. Actually, I was referring to the legalese at the bottom of a posting that boils down to, if this email isn't meant for you you have to unread it, forget that you saw it and then reply to the sender to let them know you didn't read it. To that, I took something from Get Smart (the old fogies version), to Burn Before Reading. Regards, Steve Thompson -- Opinions expressed by this poster may not reflect those of poster's employer. -- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Rich Smrcina Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 9:13 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Test Ron wrote: > Funny part is that these type of notices are always at the bottom of the email. > > Just the place I always scroll to immediately when receiving and reading an > email... > No, he was referring to the Netzero advertisement that was appearing in his sent email, in addition to the customary IBM-Main verbage. Actually, I was referring to the legalese at the bottom of a posting that boils down to, if this email isn't meant for you you have to unread it, forget that you saw it and then reply to the sender to let them know you didn't read it. To that, I took something from Get Smart (the old fogies version), to Burn Before Reading. Regards, Steve Thompson -- Opinions expressed by this poster may not reflect those of poster's employer. -- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
Ron wrote: Funny part is that these type of notices are always at the bottom of the email. Just the place I always scroll to immediately when receiving and reading an email... No, he was referring to the Netzero advertisement that was appearing in his sent email, in addition to the customary IBM-Main verbage. -- Rich Smrcina Phone: 414-491-6001 http://www.linkedin.com/in/richsmrcina Catch the WAVV! http://www.wavv.org WAVV 2009 - Orlando, FL - May 15-19, 2009 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
Funny part is that these type of notices are always at the bottom of the email. Just the place I always scroll to immediately when receiving and reading an email... On Thu, 7 May 2009 09:47:48 -0400, Thompson, Steve wrote: The old BURN BEFORE READING ploy? NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you. > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Lionel B Dyck Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 5:04 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Test NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, = you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing = its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the = sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and=20 any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you.=20 The old BURN BEFORE READING ploy? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
Yup. Thanks! All the best, Scott T. Harder -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu]on Behalf Of Lionel B Dyck Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 6:04 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Test Switch e-mail providers Try gmail - its free and works fine Lionel B. Dyck, Consultant/Specialist ?Never attribute to malice what can be caused by miscommunication.? NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you. From: "Scott T. Harder" To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Date: 05/06/2009 02:57 PM Subject: Re: Test Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List I just noticed that Netzero (it must be... or what?) is appending ads to the bottom of my emails. I don't appreciate it. When I look at my Sent folder the "hot tub" crap is not there! Any shoves in the direction where I can stop this is much appreciated. All the best, Scott T. Harder -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu]on Behalf Of Scott T. Harder Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 5:50 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Test Test post. Sorry. All the best, Scott T. Harder Keep the bad stuff out and the good stuff in with a new hot tub cover. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2241/fc/BLSrjpYTmpJ3dEIZJcAWi5qoBY1pP xZycEnpQNgMpjBwai6BIDH8nAErk9C/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html Click here for expert wrinkle removal with Botox cosmetic solutions! http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2241/fc/BLSrjpYZldhdtfUXN0PdQ7fs8Yz7CbWCtWLVlV1FnzTNmTO7dP1Qbnu6KH2/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
Switch e-mail providers Try gmail - its free and works fine Lionel B. Dyck, Consultant/Specialist ?Never attribute to malice what can be caused by miscommunication.? NOTICE TO RECIPIENT: If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are prohibited from sharing, copying, or otherwise using or disclosing its contents. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply e-mail and permanently delete this e-mail and any attachments without reading, forwarding or saving them. Thank you. From: "Scott T. Harder" To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Date: 05/06/2009 02:57 PM Subject: Re: Test Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List I just noticed that Netzero (it must be... or what?) is appending ads to the bottom of my emails. I don't appreciate it. When I look at my Sent folder the "hot tub" crap is not there! Any shoves in the direction where I can stop this is much appreciated. All the best, Scott T. Harder -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu]on Behalf Of Scott T. Harder Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 5:50 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Test Test post. Sorry. All the best, Scott T. Harder Keep the bad stuff out and the good stuff in with a new hot tub cover. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2241/fc/BLSrjpYTmpJ3dEIZJcAWi5qoBY1pP xZycEnpQNgMpjBwai6BIDH8nAErk9C/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
>I just noticed that Netzero (it must be... or what?) is appending ads to the bottom of my emails. >I don't appreciate it. >When I look at my Sent folder the "hot tub" crap is not there! >Any shoves in the direction where I can stop this is much appreciated. 1. Complain. 2. Pick another provider. Life's too short to live with idiot e-mail providers! - Too busy driving to stop for gas! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
I just noticed that Netzero (it must be... or what?) is appending ads to the bottom of my emails. I don't appreciate it. When I look at my Sent folder the "hot tub" crap is not there! Any shoves in the direction where I can stop this is much appreciated. All the best, Scott T. Harder -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu]on Behalf Of Scott T. Harder Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 5:50 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Test Test post. Sorry. All the best, Scott T. Harder Keep the bad stuff out and the good stuff in with a new hot tub cover. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2241/fc/BLSrjpYTmpJ3dEIZJcAWi5qoBY1pP xZycEnpQNgMpjBwai6BIDH8nAErk9C/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test...Please Acknowledge.
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 3:20 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Test...Please Acknowledge. Thanks _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test...Please Acknowledge.
Acknowledged Regards, Ahmed Rahim System Z Technical support Group Technology (011) 500-6490 Fax2Email 086 539 2113 -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: 13 November 2008 10:20 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Test...Please Acknowledge. Thanks _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html Nedbank Limited Reg No 1951/09/06. The following link displays the names of the Nedbank Board of Directors and Company Secretary. [ http://www.nedbank.co.za/terms/DirectorsNedbank.htm ] This email is confidential and is intended for the addressee only. The following link will take you to Nedbank's legal notice. [ http://www.nedbank.co.za/terms/EmailDisclaimer.htm ] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test...Please Acknowledge.
Got it Patrick Hayward, Code Magus Limited (England reg. no. 4024745) Apartment 6, 69 Woodstock Road, Oxford, OX2 6EY, United Kingdom Voice: +44 1844 208127 Mob: +44 7711 273014 Fax: +44 1865 316979 http://www.codemagus.com mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test...Please Acknowledge.
Howard, got it good luck John Hamman Senior Systems Programmer BlueCross BlueShield of Mississippi 601.664.4410 [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>> "Howard Rifkind" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 11/13/2008 2:19:57 PM >>> Thanks _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html * The information contained in this message, and attachments hereto, may be privileged/confidential, and may contain protected health information that is subject to use and disclosure restrictions under federal law. It is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete the original message and any copy of it from your computer system. All recipients are expected to maintain appropriate protections on the information contained herein. * -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test...Please Acknowledge.
Acknowledgment -- Original message from Howard Rifkind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: -- > Thanks > _ > LEGAL NOTICE > Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential > and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. > Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. > If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the > contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in > reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an > addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this > message and empty from your trash. > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test...Please Acknowledge.
Got it. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Martinez, Frank J Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 3:42 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Test...Please Acknowledge. Got it -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pat Mihalec Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 3:27 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Test...Please Acknowledge. I got it. Pat Mihalec Rush University Medical Center Senior System Programmer (312) 942-8386 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html This email, including attachments, may include confidential and/or proprietary information, and may be used only by the person or entity to which it is addressed. If the reader of this e-mail is not the intended recipient or his or her authorized agent, the reader is hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by replying to this message and delete this e-mail immediately. Thank you. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test...Please Acknowledge.
Got it -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pat Mihalec Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 3:27 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Test...Please Acknowledge. I got it. Pat Mihalec Rush University Medical Center Senior System Programmer (312) 942-8386 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test...Please Acknowledge.
I got it. Pat Mihalec Rush University Medical Center Senior System Programmer (312) 942-8386 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test...Please Acknowledge.
receipt acknowledgedJohn Gilmore Ashland, MA 01721-1817 USA> Date: Thu, 13 Nov 2008 15:19:57 -0500> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Test...Please Acknowledge.> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU> > Thanks> _> LEGAL NOTICE> Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential> and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only.> Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized.> If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the> contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in> reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an> addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this> message and empty from your trash.> > > --> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,> send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO> Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html> _ Get 5 GB of storage with Windows Live Hotmail. http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_5gb_112008 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
replied Patrick Hayward, Code Magus Limited (England reg. no. 4024745) Apartment 6, 69 Woodstock Road, Oxford, OX2 6EY, United Kingdom Voice: +44 1844 208127 Mob: +44 7711 273014 Fax: +44 1865 316979 http://www.codemagus.com mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Howard Rifkind wrote: > TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. > > Thanks. > > _ > LEGAL NOTICE > Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential > and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. > Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. > If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the > contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in > reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an > addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this > message and empty from your trash. > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html > > > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
Reply sent. GJW On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 11:40 AM, Howard Rifkind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote: > TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. > > Thanks. > > _ > LEGAL NOTICE > Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential > and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. > Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. > If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the > contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in > reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an > addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this > message and empty from your trash. > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html > > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
Test reply Bill Bates Sr Systems Programmer EOT IT Services 10 Park Plaza Room 7110 Boston, MA 02116 (617) 973-8906 Cell 617-719-3344 -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:41 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: TEST TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. Thanks. _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
Test reply -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:41 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: TEST TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. Thanks. _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
Here! -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:41 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: TEST TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. Thanks. _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
5x5 -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 10:41 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: TEST TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. Thanks. _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- NOTICE: This electronic mail message and any attached files are confidential. The information is exclusively for the use of the individual or entity intended as the recipient. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, printing, reviewing, retention, disclosure, distribution or forwarding of the message or any attached file is not authorized and is strictly prohibited. If you have received this electronic mail message in error, please advise the sender by reply electronic mail immediately and permanently delete the original transmission, any attachments and any copies of this message from your computer system. Thank you. == -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
Thanks all. Some thing has stopped working on my end... >>> Pat Harlow <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 9/22/2008 11:54 AM >>> replied Regards, Pat Harlow Director of Technical Support NewEra Software Inc. (800)421-5035 For more info on SAE, click here. For more info on Image FOCUS, click here. The information in this e-mail, and any attachment therein, is confidential and for use by the addressee only. If you are not the intended recipient, please be advised that any disclosure, distribution and/or copying of the contents is prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please notify NewEra Software, Inc. immediately by telephone at 800-421-5035 and delete the email from your computer. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 8:41 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: TEST TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. Thanks. _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
Replying . . . -- Original message from Howard Rifkind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: -- > TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. > > Thanks. > > _ > LEGAL NOTICE > Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential > and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. > Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. > If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the > contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in > reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an > addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this > message and empty from your trash. > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it. From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:41 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: TEST TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. Thanks. _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
replied Regards, Pat Harlow Director of Technical Support NewEra Software Inc. (800)421-5035 For more info on SAE, click here. For more info on Image FOCUS, click here. The information in this e-mail, and any attachment therein, is confidential and for use by the addressee only. If you are not the intended recipient, please be advised that any disclosure, distribution and/or copying of the contents is prohibited. If you have received this email in error, please notify NewEra Software, Inc. immediately by telephone at 800-421-5035 and delete the email from your computer. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 8:41 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: TEST TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. Thanks. _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
Replied.> Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2008 16:43:28 +0100> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: TEST> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU> > -Original Message-> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf> Of Howard Rifkind> Sent: 22 September 2008 16:41> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU> Subject: TEST> > TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply.> > Thanks.> > _> LEGAL NOTICE> Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential> and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only.> Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized.> If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the> contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in> reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an> addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this> message and empty from your trash.> > > --> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,> send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO> Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html> > > > This email has been scanned for all known viruses by the MessageLabs Email> Security Service and the Macro 4 plc internal virus protection system.> > > > > This email has been scanned for all known viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security Service and the Macro 4 plc internal virus protection system.> > > --> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,> send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO> Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html> -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: 22 September 2008 16:41 To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: TEST TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. Thanks. _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html This email has been scanned for all known viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security Service and the Macro 4 plc internal virus protection system. This email has been scanned for all known viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security Service and the Macro 4 plc internal virus protection system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST
replied -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 11:41 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: TEST TEST to the List...Please be kind enough to reply. Thanks. _ LEGAL NOTICE Unless expressly stated otherwise, this message is confidential and may be privileged. It is intended for the addressee(s) only. Access to this E-mail by anyone else is unauthorized. If you are not an addressee, any disclosure or copying of the contents of this E-mail or any action taken (or not taken) in reliance on it is unauthorized and may be unlawful. If you are not an addressee, please inform the sender immediately, then delete this message and empty from your trash. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST MESSAGE TO THE LIST...PLEASE ACKNOWLEDGE
Sorry! Mixup. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lindy Mayfield Sent: 28. elokuuta 2008 14:09 To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: TEST MESSAGE TO THE LIST...PLEASE ACKNOWLEDGE Seven. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Warren Brown Sent: 28. elokuuta 2008 14:07 To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: TEST MESSAGE TO THE LIST...PLEASE ACKNOWLEDGE ACKNOWLEDGE -- Original message from Howard Rifkind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: -- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST MESSAGE TO THE LIST...PLEASE ACKNOWLEDGE
Seven. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Warren Brown Sent: 28. elokuuta 2008 14:07 To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: TEST MESSAGE TO THE LIST...PLEASE ACKNOWLEDGE ACKNOWLEDGE -- Original message from Howard Rifkind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: -- > THANKS > > > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST MESSAGE TO THE LIST...PLEASE ACKNOWLEDGE
ACKNOWLEDGE -- Original message from Howard Rifkind <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: -- > THANKS > > > > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html > -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: TEST MESSAGE TO THE LIST...PLEASE ACKNOWLEDGE
Howard Rifkind wrote: THANKS Got it. Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-393-8716 http://www.trainersfriend.com z/OS Application development made easier * Our classes include + How things work + Programming examples with realistic applications + Starter / skeleton code + Complete working programs + Useful utilities and subroutines + Tips and techniques ==> Check out the Trainer's Friend Store to purchase z/OS <== ==> application developer toolkits. Sample code in four<== ==> programming languages, JCL to Assemble or compile, <== ==> bind and test. <== ==> http://www.trainersfriend.com/TTFStore/index.html<== -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test; please ignore
I read your message using Pine on a Linux system. To the best of my knowledge, Pine does not support Microsoft's "rich text" format. Your message looked to me like it was in plain text. It was formatted as you indicated. I also like plain text posts only. The use of "rich text" or "html" formatting simply bugs me. They are to make things "pretty". I don't want "pretty". I like the steak, not the sizzle (to change metaphors). RTF and HTML only require more bandwidth, they don't contribute to the content of the message. And to those who say "so what? bandwidth is cheap!", that's what we used to say about gas. "Waste not, want not." -- Q: What do theoretical physicists drink beer from? A: An EIN stein. Maranatha! John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test; please ignore
Dave Salt wrote: This message is being sent to IBM-MAIN in 'rich text' format. The purpose is to test whether this email will be formatted correctly when it is sent using a different computer at a different location and with a different internet connection. This test was requested by Microsoft as part of their investigation to determine why emails sent in rich text format are not being formatted correctly. For example, the 3 middle lines in the following paragraph should have leading spaces: When I received your message, I see a paragraph, breaking at screen width When I look at it in a Reply window, it shows as one long line, no breaks This is on a line by itself. This is also on a line by itself but indented 3 spaces. Also on a line by itself but indented 6 spaces. As above but once again indented 3 spaces. On a line by itself but not indented. The lines above all conform to your description, both on original receipt and in the Reply window As I don't have access to a mainframe at this location, the following paragraph is identical to the above but has been copied and pasted from Notepad: This is on a line by itself. This is also on a line by itself but indented 3 spaces. Also on a line by itself but indented 6 spaces. As above but once again indented 3 spaces.On a line by itself but not indented. I see the above as a single paragraph breaking at screen width on input, and as a single line with no breaks in a reply window Finally, my signature below should appear as 4 separate lines. The first line contains my name, then a blank line, then a catch phrase, and then a link to a web site. Thank you for your patience while Microsoft gets this sorted out! Dave SaltSimpList(tm) - try it; you'll get it! http://www.mackinney.com/products/SIM/simplist.htm _ I see the above as a single paragraph breaking at screen width on input, and as a single line with no breaks in a reply window I'm running WinXP Pro SP2, Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 with options set at: Wrap plain text at 80 characters For messages that contain 8-bit characters, use 'quoted printable' MIME encoding - NOT checked Fonts: Proportional: Serif Serif: Times New Roman Sans-serif: Arial Monospace: Courire New Can you just stop sending rich text? Plain text is the proper way to send emails, as I understand it, both from an email support and a security (lower risk) point of view. The Enter key and space bar are great. I don't even use tabs, just a monospace font. Kind regards, -Steve Comstock The Trainer's Friend, Inc. 303-393-8716 http://www.trainersfriend.com z/OS Application development made easier * Our classes include + How things work + Programming examples with realistic applications + Starter / skeleton code + Complete working programs + Useful utilities and subroutines + Tips and techniques ==> Check out the Trainer's Friend Store to purchase z/OS <== ==> application developer toolkits. Sample code in four<== ==> programming languages, JCL to Assemble or compile, <== ==> bind and test. <== ==> http://www.trainersfriend.com/TTFStore/index.html<== -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: test message test
On Mon, 5 May 2008, Philip Hitti wrote: > test me too! -- Q: What do theoretical physicists drink beer from? A: An EIN stein. Maranatha! John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: test message test
Got you 5x5. Daniel McLaughlin Z-Series Systems Programmer Information & Communications Technology Crawford & Company 4680 N. Royal Atlanta Tucker GA 30084 phone: 770-621-3256 fax: 770-621-3237 email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: www.crawfordandcompany.com IBM Mainframe Discussion List wrote on 05/05/2008 08:54:17 AM: > -- Information from the mail header > --- > Sender: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > Poster: Philip Hitti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: test message test > --- > > test > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html > > Best Overall Third-Party Claims Administrator - 2007 "Business Insurance" Readers Choice Awards Consider the environment before printing this message. This transmission is intended exclusively for the individual or entity to which it is addressed. This communication may contain information that is confidential, proprietary, privileged or otherwise exempt from disclosure. If you are not the named addressee, you are NOT authorized to read, print, retain, copy or disseminate this communication, its attachments or any part of them. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete this communication from all computers. This communication does not form any contractual obligation on behalf of the sender, the sender's employer, or the employer's parent company, affiliates or subsidiaries. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test message
This message arrived in my inbox about 45 minutes after sending it. And that was after contacting the BAMA EDU help desk to ask questions. I had gone to the web site and noticed that it was not showing any postings for 8-NOV-07. Bill Klein's COBOL copy message was the first to show up, at about 15 minutes after contacting the BAMA EDU help desk. Darren's retirement ripples being felt? Regards, Steve Thompson -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thompson, Steve Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 9:06 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Test message Is IBM Main down? This is a test message. If this had been a real message, then various of the members could argue as to whether or not this message contained any intelligence. Alas, this is only a test message, similar to a sharp stick, with which to poke the IBM Main server to see if it will respond. However, y'all can argue the merits if you want, but wait until Friday for OT day. Regards, Steve Thompson -- All opinions expressed by me are my own and may not necessarily reflect those of my employer. -- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test message
In a message dated 11/8/2007 9:47:00 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Is IBM Main down? >> It was, but the three finger salute made it all better. I was mentioning Parker Brothers and Monopoly but doesn't seem as funny today ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test message
In a message dated 11/8/2007 9:47:00 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Is IBM Main down? This is a test message. IBM-Main is not down as far as I can determine. It's downness for others is undetermined. Bill Fairchild Franklin, TN ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test tools, was: Strobe equivalents
Beate, Compuware have a wide range of products for all your test management needs (one bright example, the Strobe in the title of this thread). Please feel free to contact me offline, or your local friendly Compuware rep, to discuss this further. ciao! Aurora Emanuela Dell'Anno Compuware Ltd. Systems Engineer, Mainframe pre-Sales ___ email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] tel. : +44 (0)1753 444331 cell.: +44 (0)7779 881331 ___ No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However - a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced. -Original Message- From: Beate Kawelke [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 01 August 2006 08:58 Subject: Test tools, was: Strobe equivalents Wow, this list is cool ! We are currently looking for tools to help us manage test scenarios - up to now to no avail. We would like to define test scenarios and also manage the data / processes. For example, a test scenario would consist of some user input in ISPF panels, a server request, a result being displayed, a dataset being created. After a major change to our software, we would run that scenario (as automated as possible) and check if the results are the same. Anybody got input on that ? Regards, Beate The contents of this e-mail are intended for the named addressee only. It contains information that may be confidential. Unless you are the named addressee or an authorized designee, you may not copy or use it, or disclose it to anyone else. If you received it in error please notify us immediately and then destroy it. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test tools, was: Strobe equivalents
I forgot to mention some others: * IBM Application Workload Modeler http://www.ibm.com/software/network/awm/index.html If I mentioned DB2 Test Database Generators (for the DB2 shops) I should also mention this one (for VSAM et. al.): * IBM File Export for z/OS http://www.ibm.com/software/awdtools/fileexport/index.html For MQ-related testing specifically there are some SupportPacs available at no additional charge that I'd look at first: * Testing SupportPacs for MQ (Various) http://www.ibm.com/support/docview.wss?uid=swg27007197 I can't even begin to describe the Web-related products (e.g. Rational Performance Tester for z/OS, one of my favorites). Like I said, there are undoubtedly many others out there, and I encourage comparison shopping. There is no shortage of testing products for mainframes. :-) - - - - - Timothy Sipples IBM Consulting Enterprise Software Architect Specializing in Software Architectures Related to System z Based in Tokyo, Serving IBM Japan and IBM Asia-Pacific E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test tools, was: Strobe equivalents
On 1 Aug 2006 22:11:44 -0700, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: > > >Beate Kawelke writes: >>We are currently looking for tools to help us manage test >>scenarios - up to now to no avail. We would like to define >>test scenarios and also manage the data / processes. For >>example, a test scenario would consist of some user input >>in ISPF panels, a server request, a result being displayed, >>a dataset being created. After a major change to our >>software, we would run that scenario (as automated as >>possible) and check if the results are the same. >>Anybody got input on that ? > >I'll give you some IBM examples (in no particular order), and there are >undoubtedly others. As another commenter hinted, this category is gigantic >in the mainframe "we're fanatical about software quality" world of >application development. That depends on the shop. I've seen plenty of grungy mainframe application code, both buggy and inefficient. We all have the vendors we like to hate for various reasons. > >> some snippage >- - - - - >Timothy Sipples >IBM Consulting Enterprise Software Architect >Specializing in Software Architectures Related to System z >Based in Tokyo, Serving IBM Japan and IBM Asia-Pacific >E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test tools, was: Strobe equivalents
Beate Kawelke writes: >We are currently looking for tools to help us manage test >scenarios - up to now to no avail. We would like to define >test scenarios and also manage the data / processes. For >example, a test scenario would consist of some user input >in ISPF panels, a server request, a result being displayed, >a dataset being created. After a major change to our >software, we would run that scenario (as automated as >possible) and check if the results are the same. >Anybody got input on that ? I'll give you some IBM examples (in no particular order), and there are undoubtedly others. As another commenter hinted, this category is gigantic in the mainframe "we're fanatical about software quality" world of application development. IBM Workload Simulator for z/OS http://www.ibm.com/software/awdtools/workloadsimulator IBM Teleprocessing Network Simulator (TPNS) http://www.ibm.com/software/network/tpns IBM Rational Functional Tester Extension for Terminal-Based Applications http://www.ibm.com/software/awdtools/tester/functional/ext All three have test managers available or included. You may also want to browse the Rational software quality Web site. http://www.ibm.com/software/rational/offerings/testing.html Finally, if you're a DB2 shop, you'll probably want to take a look at the IBM DB2 Test Database Generator. http://www.ibm.com/software/data/db2imstools/db2tools/db2tdbg - - - - - Timothy Sipples IBM Consulting Enterprise Software Architect Specializing in Software Architectures Related to System z Based in Tokyo, Serving IBM Japan and IBM Asia-Pacific E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test tools, was: Strobe equivalents
In a message dated 8/1/2006 2:58:45 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: of some user input in ISPF panels, a server request, a result being displayed, a dataset being created. After a major change to our software, we would run that scenario (as automated as possible) and check if the results are the same. Anybody got input on that ? >> Might try googling ===>regression sofware testing At least raise your level of expectations. We had a major level set several years back and one of the end users complained she wasn't getting her 'numbers report'. Turns out few PTFs to COBOL runtime library and the S0C7 in the old report went away! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: test CICS up from TCPIP on client
Why not just attempt a TN3270 session? If you get a logon screen, it must be somewhat operational. Some auditors take exception to opening such listeners. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Eric Weil Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 9:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: test CICS up from TCPIP on client Applications has requested TCPIPSERVICE be activated so that CSOL (sockets listener) can be queried by a dummy request & if he responds positively they will know all systems are go. Does anyone do something similar to this? What is an example of an efficient client request to accomplish this task? eric w, cics sysprog -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: test CICS up from TCPIP on client
> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Eric Weil > Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 9:52 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU > Subject: test CICS up from TCPIP on client > > > Applications has requested TCPIPSERVICE be activated so that > CSOL (sockets > listener) can be queried by a dummy request & if he responds > positively they > will know all systems are go. > > Does anyone do something similar to this? What is an example of an > efficient client request to accomplish this task? > > eric w, cics sysprog Gee, Is CSOL a standard name? Does anybody else get an "evil grin" about what it could stand for? Or am I just a evil, nasty old man? Or both? -- John McKown Senior Systems Programmer HealthMarkets Keeping the Promise of Affordable Coverage Administrative Services Group Information Technology This message (including any attachments) contains confidential information intended for a specific individual and purpose, and its content is protected by law. If you are not the intended recipient, you should delete this message and are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, or distribution of this transmission, or taking any action based on it, is strictly prohibited. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test - Please Reply
Got it -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 2:17 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Test - Please Reply Hi all, I'm no longer getting any messages back from the list. Would some one be kind enough to respond to this message. Thanks. - Yahoo! Mail Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test - Please Reply
Test -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Howard Rifkind Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 3:17 PM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Test - Please Reply Hi all, I'm no longer getting any messages back from the list. Would some one be kind enough to respond to this message. Thanks. - Yahoo! Mail Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test, pls ignore
A fairly common spam filter assumes that one doesn't send oneself mail. In other words, if the "from" address is the same as the recipient's address, the mail gets blocked. And, guess what, that's exactly how one's own posts arrive. At 2006-01-26 12:30, you wrote: True. However, like me, it appears that something ON OUR SIDE is blocking the responses, but ONLY if they were sent by us. Likely MS Exchange. Or maybe Mail Marshall. Likely due to the silly think thinking that the email coming to us is being sent by us and so determining that it is unnecessary to deliver it (Eg. a telephone cannot call its own number) -- John McKown Senior Systems Programmer UICI Insurance Center Information Technology -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test, pls ignore
On Thu, 26 Jan 2006, Chase, John wrote: > >REPRO (echo own posts back) | NOREPRO. I believe NOREPRO is the default for >IBM-MAIN. > REPRO is the default. Always has been. Darren -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test, pls ignore
> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Phil Payne > Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2006 8:59 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU > Subject: Test, pls ignore > > > > Testchecking my posts, I don't see them arrive > > Just your own? ISTR there's a subscription option that > determines whether the LISTSERV copies > your own posts back to you. > > -- > Phil Payne True. However, like me, it appears that something ON OUR SIDE is blocking the responses, but ONLY if they were sent by us. Likely MS Exchange. Or maybe Mail Marshall. Likely due to the silly think thinking that the email coming to us is being sent by us and so determining that it is unnecessary to deliver it (Eg. a telephone cannot call its own number) -- John McKown Senior Systems Programmer UICI Insurance Center Information Technology This message (including any attachments) contains confidential information intended for a specific individual and purpose, and its content is protected by law. If you are not the intended recipient, you should delete this message and are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, or distribution of this transmission, or taking any action based on it, is strictly prohibited. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test, pls ignore
> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Phil Payne > Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2006 8:59 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU > Subject: Test, pls ignore > > > Testchecking my posts, I don't see them arrive > > Just your own? ISTR there's a subscription option that > determines whether the LISTSERV copies your own posts back to you. REPRO (echo own posts back) | NOREPRO. I believe NOREPRO is the default for IBM-MAIN. -jc- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test, pls ignore
In a message dated 1/26/2006 9:18:13 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: LISTSERV copies your own posts back to you. >> REPRO or ACK which sends back a confirmation w/o the double entry. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test, pls ignore
M$ Exchange server has been known to do this. I wouldn't doubt a few other mail server systems work the same way. Worked(?) with our company's e-mail admin, and was never able to get them to recognize it was a problem, let alone this anomaly did exist. Every once in a while a message would slip through. (I didn't change anything (Honest!) ) On Thu, 26 Jan 2006 13:23:08 +0100, Vernooy, C.P. - SPLXM <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >Testchecking my posts, I don't see them arrive. > >Kees. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
Thanks All. Bob -Original Message- From: Ed Finnell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 10:04 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Test In a message dated 8/23/2005 9:02:23 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Got your EMAIL, Robert.. >> If you use ACK as an option listserv will notify you if accepted. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
In a message dated 8/23/2005 9:02:23 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Got your EMAIL, Robert.. >> If you use ACK as an option listserv will notify you if accepted. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
I see you out there Cletus McGee Technical Sevices -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robert Pelletier Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 8:56 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Test Our LAN department has messed with the firewall and IBM List was not working for a while. Can someone please confirm they got this e-mail? Thanks all. Bob Pelletier Connecticut Student Loan Foundation Rocky Hill, Connecticut -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html - The information contained in this email/fax is confidential; it is intended only for the use of the individual or entity named above. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are notified that any dissemination, distribution, or use of this information is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please contact us immediately at the telephone number or e-mail address set forth above and destroy all copies of the original message. Although this email/fax is believed to be free of any virus or other defect that might affect any computer system in which it is received, it is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that it is virus free; Alfa accepts no responsibility for any loss or damage arising in any way from its use. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test
Got your EMAIL, Robert.. Lenny Foster Kemper Auto and Home Jacksonville, Fl. Office: 904.596.8476 Cell: 904.338.7529 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > -Original Message- > From: Robert Pelletier [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 9:56 > To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU > Subject: Test > > Our LAN department has messed with the firewall and IBM List was not > working for a while. Can someone please confirm they got this e-mail? > Thanks all. > > > Bob Pelletier > Connecticut Student Loan Foundation > Rocky Hill, Connecticut > > -- > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, > send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO > Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html - CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: The information contained in this e-mail and attached document(s) may contain confidential information that is intended only for the addressee(s). If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby advised that any disclosure, copying, distribution or the taking of any action in reliance upon the information is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify the sender and delete it from your system. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Test (was What is a Systems Programmer)
I haven't come up with a good definition for Systems Programmer but here's a test to see if you are one (no offense meant to anyone): Are You Qualified To Be a Systems Programmer? The following test will determine that without any questions. Read carefully. Answer all questions. Time limit: four hours. Begin immediately. I. HISTORY - Describe the history of the papacy from its origins to the present day, concentration especially, but not exclusively, on its social, political, economic, religious, and philosophical impact on Europe, Asia, Americas, and Africa. Be brief, concise, and specific. II. MEDICINE - You have been provided with a razor blade, a piece of gauze, and a bottle of Scotch. Remove your appendix. If your appendix has already been removed, reinsert it. Do not suture until your work has been inspected. You have 15 minutes. III.PUBLIC SPEAKING - 2,500 riot-crazed aborigines are storming your office. Calm them. You may use any ancient language, except Greek. IV. BIOLOGY - Create life. Estimate the differences in subsequent human culture if this form of life had developed 500 million years earlier, with special attention to its probable effect on the English parliamentary system. Prove your thesis. V. MUSIC - Write a piano concerto. Orchestrate and perform it with flute and drum. You will find a piano under your seat. VI. PSYCHOLOGY - Based on your knowledge of their works, evaluate the emotional stability, degree of adjustment, and repressed frustrations of each of the following: Alexander of Aphrodisias, Ramses II, Gregory of Nicia, Hammurabi. Support your evaluation with quotations from each man's work, making appropriate references. It is not necessary to translate. VII.ENGINEERING - The disassembled parts of a high-powered rifle have been placed on your desk. You will also find an instruction manual, printed in Swahili. In 10 minutes, a hungry Bengal tiger will be admitted to the room. Take whatever action you feel appropriate. Be prepared to justify your decision. VIII. SOCIOLOGY - Estimate the sociological problems that might accompany the end of the world. Construct an experiment to test your theory. IX. POLITICAL SCIENCE - There is a red telephone on the desk beside you. Start World War III. Report at length on its sociopolitical effects, if any. X. EPISTEMOLOGY - Take a position for or against truth. Prove the validity of your stand. XI. GENERAL KNOWLEDGE - Describe in detail. Be objective and specific. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
