Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED], with whom I often diisagee not just intellectually but viscerally too, judges that nulled-out JCL defaults should be supported; and he has found an IBM JCL-statement option that does so. Tastes differ, sometimes radically. In my own HLASM macro definiitions I treat overriding a default value without replacement as a grievous error. For, say, | macro | example parm=gubbins, . . . | . . . | mend the macro instruction | example parm =, . . . triggers execution of the statements |in setb (t'parm ne 'O')--value supplied? | aif (in),parm_in --if so, examine it |abort setb 1 --no, set quit switch | mnote el,'mnpfx.07i. A value of the parm= keyword parameter* |must be but has not been supplied. Moreover, this error is an* |aggravated one. The default value parm=gubbins has been o* |verridden without replacement.' | ago .after_parm |.parm_in anop | . . . As this small example illustrates, macros can be written in different ways; and JCL support for parameter values can differ too. (Failure to understand that the original model for the syntax of JCL was that of the HLASM macro language is the root of much trouble.) Certain facilities may thus support the dubious practice of treating . . . ,parm=, . . . and . . . ,parm=default value, . . . as equivalent; but, I think fortunately, there is no mechanism currently avaiable for ensuring that all of them do so. John Gilmore Ashland, MA 01721-1817 USA _ FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar get it now! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a recent note, john gilmore said: Date: Fri, 12 May 2006 11:18:55 + and JCL support for parameter values can differ too. (Failure to understand that the original model for the syntax of JCL was that of the HLASM macro language is the root of much trouble.) Alas, one who starts from that understanding may be misled, for example, by assuming that keyword arguments may be supplied in arbitrary order. JCL does not allow this in all cases. Certain facilities may thus support the dubious practice of treating . . . ,parm=, . . . and . . . ,parm=default value, . . . as equivalent; but, I think fortunately, there is no mechanism currently avaiable for ensuring that all of them do so. I agree with you (but is it possible to agree viscerally?) that the latter form is safer. But when the latter form is not syntactically available, I'll resort to the former. My first statement was that all keyword arguments should have an explicit default value. And, regardless, the doc should not deny the validity of the former when it is in fact accepted. -- gil -- StorageTek INFORMATION made POWERFUL -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/10/2006 at 07:23 AM, Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: But my base complaint is with the original and persisting design of JCL, which was created without file tailoring in mind. Yes, file tailoring existed in those days Not even close. Manual editing of a card deck is not the FIle Tailoring service. even in the rudimentary form of inserting in or removing from a deck of punched cards one card containing a single option without the need to add or remove a comma from the preceding line. That's problematical in general, and always has been. This technique was well enough known to FORTRAN There are analogous problems if you try editing a FORTRAN program by removing one card. o Provide explicit assertion of default values for all keyword options, such as TYPRUN=NORMAL, or even simply TYPRUN=. That's in there. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a recent note, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) said: Date: Wed, 10 May 2006 00:23:16 -0300 JCL tailoring is a nightmare. Only if you didn't create your JCL with File Tailoring in mind. They (not I) didn't. Which is why I regularized it. But my base complaint is with the original and persisting design of JCL, which was created without file tailoring in mind. Yes, file tailoring existed in those days and should have been a consideration, even in the rudimentary form of inserting in or removing from a deck of punched cards one card containing a single option without the need to add or remove a comma from the preceding line. This technique was well enough known to FORTRAN (at least) programmers prior to the invention of JCL: Always put a label on a CONTINUE, not a nontrivial statement, lest you later need to insert another statement before or after that statement. Improvement is still possible: o Provide explicit assertion of default values for all keyword options, such as TYPRUN=NORMAL, or even simply TYPRUN=. o Provide a dummy keyword option (e.g. SKIP=) to use as a placeholder. This would serve the same valuable purpose as FORTRAN's CONTINUE, or a . alone on a line at the end of a list of SMP/E options, or a blank line at the end of a list of IDCAMS options each of which is followed by -. E.g.: //NAME JOB programmer,account, // TYPRUN=HOLD, /* This line may be deleted. */ // SKIP= or, even: //STEP EXEC PGM=IEFBR14, // SKIP= to allow inserting, perhaps, COND=whatever. (But there is an explicit default for COND, viz. COND=(0,GT).) Ideally, such a dummy option should be distinguished by being allowed to appear multiple times on a single statement. -- gil -- StorageTek INFORMATION made POWERFUL -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Interesting concept of a place holding, do nothing JCL parameter. I wonder if a JES exit could implement this? Just thinking out loud, so to speak, er write. -- John McKown Senior Systems Programmer HealthMarkets Keeping the Promise of Affordable Coverage Administrative Services Group Information Technology This message (including any attachments) contains confidential information intended for a specific individual and purpose, and its content is protected by law. If you are not the intended recipient, you should delete this message and are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, or distribution of this transmission, or taking any action based on it, is strictly prohibited. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a message dated 5/10/2006 8:40:31 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Interesting concept of a place holding, do nothing JCL parameter. I wonder if a JES exit could implement this? Just thinking out loud, so to Yeah, but where you gonna find a coder these days or one to support it down the road? Iffen it ain't point and click nobody wants to hear about it -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
On Wed, 10 May 2006 10:06:27 EDT, Ed Finnell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 5/10/2006 8:40:31 A.M. CDT, John McKown wrote: Interesting concept of a place holding, do nothing JCL parameter. I wonder if a JES exit could implement this? Just thinking out loud... Yeah, but where you gonna find a coder these days or one to support it down the road? Iffen it ain't point and click nobody wants to hear about it Ed, Your statement is a popularly repeated myth but inaccurate. Coders CAN be found and they will continue to exist. Corporate CIOs like to push the myth because it gets them bigger budgets and vendors like to push the myth because they employ some of the coders. Would you buy a used car from any CIO or most vendors? I wouldn't! This list, for example, has plenty of bench strength to provide an ample supply of such coders for years to come, if not decades. Dice.com is another source, as well as Monster.com and the list goes on and on. -- Tom Schmidt Madison, WI (one such coder who knows of plenty of others out there, lurking.) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a message dated 5/10/2006 10:34:58 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your statement is a popularly repeated myth but inaccurate. Coders CAN be found and they will continue to exist. Corporate CIOs like to push the myth because it gets them bigger budgets and vendors like to push the myth Rubbish. Clerks(mult-lingual) used to debug ALC for students as well as mount tapes in a pinch. Most of the silver backs on this list are not gonna make it to the next decade or so. They can be found but are not plentiful or cheap. The rest are converting to *Nix or contemplating early retirement. Who you gonna call at o'dark thirty, Exit busters? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
On Wed, 10 May 2006 12:05:40 EDT, Ed Finnell wrote: In a message dated 5/10/2006 10:34:58 A.M. TS in Central Daylight Time, writes: Your statement is a popularly repeated myth but inaccurate. Coders CAN be found and they will continue to exist. Corporate CIOs like to push the myth because it gets them bigger budgets and vendors like to push the myth... (snipped by Ed because he got tired?) Rubbish. Clerks(mult-lingual) used to debug ALC for students as well as mount tapes in a pinch. Most of the silver backs on this list are not gonna make it to the next decade or so. They can be found but are not plentiful or cheap. Your argument refutes itself: If the clerks (mult(i)-lingual) used to exist to debug ALC for students then they either (a) still exist and could help if their skills were refreshed or (b) could easily be reconstituted from a similar mix (just add water). Seriously, ALC isn't magic and isn't particularly difficult to learn. (It is easier to learn than, say, Chinese... and (surprise!) there are a growing number of Chinese who are, in fact, learning mainframes now - maybe that's your supply? The rest are converting to *Nix or contemplating early retirement. Early retirement won't last -- there are ample reasons to believe the retirees will come back or work (at least) part time. Your local Wal-Mart doesn't have a monopoly on retirement jobs (and doesn't pay well enough to be considered a strong competitor in the ALC marketplace, for sure). Who you gonna call at o'dark thirty, Exit busters? Why not? And as for the why aren't university students signing up for CompSci majors anymore? question -- have you seriously looked at many CompSci department's courses these days? They STINK!! I thought about going back for additional work and couldn't believe the mess my former university had become. I checked around - they compete but they seem to be competing for a multi-way tie for last place. (The local U won't see any of my money either.) I was very disappointed and entirely unimpressed. -- Tom Schmidt Madison, WI (no where near retirement age - I've got a good decade-and-a-half at least!) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ed Finnell Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 11:06 AM To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? snip Rubbish. Clerks(mult-lingual) used to debug ALC for students as well as mount tapes in a pinch. Most of the silver backs on this list are not gonna make it to the next decade or so. They can be found but are not plentiful or cheap. The rest are converting to *Nix or contemplating early retirement. Who you gonna call at o'dark thirty, Exit busters? If the oppertunity were given to me to go into the *NIX (especially z/Linux) arena, I would hop on it. But, here at least, the *NIX people are in the same group as the Windows people and are expected to support Windows. I don't do Windows! Businesses seem to be going, for good or ill, towards standardized plug and play IT. That's why they like Windows especially. No user serviceable parts inside makes it easier to replace one MSCE with another MSCE and there is little difference (ignoring the idiots who can pass a test without having any real knowledge - I've known some). We are going in that direction as well. The days of customized programming seem to be numbered for most businesses. -- John McKown Senior Systems Programmer HealthMarkets Keeping the Promise of Affordable Coverage Administrative Services Group Information Technology This message (including any attachments) contains confidential information intended for a specific individual and purpose, and its content is protected by law. If you are not the intended recipient, you should delete this message and are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, or distribution of this transmission, or taking any action based on it, is strictly prohibited. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
-Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Ed Finnell In a message dated 5/10/2006 10:34:58 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Your statement is a popularly repeated myth but inaccurate. Coders CAN be found and they will continue to exist. Corporate CIOs like to push the myth because it gets them bigger budgets and vendors like to push the myth Rubbish. Clerks(mult-lingual) used to debug ALC for students as well as mount tapes in a pinch. Most of the silver backs on this list are not gonna make it to the next decade or so. They can be found but are not plentiful or cheap. The rest are converting to *Nix or contemplating early retirement. Who you gonna call at o'dark thirty, Exit busters? How badly do you want/need it fixed? How much would leaving it busted cost? -jc- -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a message dated 5/10/2006 11:27:35 A.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: refreshed or (b) could easily be reconstituted from a similar mix (just add water). Last I checked, nursing home visiting hours are 6-7 five days a week. They were ALC knowledgable by osmosis. Usually the director or assistant taught ALC or advanced algorithms now they teach Word. So in reviewing the syllabus and/or class handouts they picked up a good working knowledge. Now they get reboot or reformat the hard drive. What's a good number for Exit busters? You willing to wait while you corps business is belly up? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
On May 9, 2006, at 10:26 PM, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) wrote: In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/08/2006 at 10:06 PM, Ed Gould [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Good memory. But I believe the fullgen is still needed to this day (to prime the CSI) at least. No; in fact, there would be no way to do a fullgen before you had primed the CSI. Where would the sysgen macros come from? SNIp--- The chicken or the egg conundrum.. I guess I would stay with the sysgen though. I vaguely remember creating the CSI with several inputs, so I think we are both correct. Ed -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Was that a reference to Life Of Brian ? :-) == Chris Mason == wrote2006-05-09 03:01: Paul, I trust you know how to deal with Romanes Eunt Domus :-) Chris Mason - Original Message - From: Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Tuesday, 09 May, 2006 1:10 AM Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? In a recent note, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) said: Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 16:58:32 -0300 De gustibus non disputandem est. I find REXX easies to use for simple ^^^ disputandUm? ... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- __ Mundus Vult Decipi __ They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Thomas, Got it in one. Amazingly there are more than 35,000 hits in Google and they say Latin is a dead language. Can so many remember their Latin lessons? Chris Mason - Original Message - From: Thomas Berg [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Tuesday, 09 May, 2006 1:24 PM Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? Was that a reference to Life Of Brian ? :-) == Chris Mason == wrote2006-05-09 03:01: Paul, I trust you know how to deal with Romanes Eunt Domus :-) Chris Mason - Original Message - From: Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Tuesday, 09 May, 2006 1:10 AM Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? In a recent note, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) said: Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 16:58:32 -0300 De gustibus non disputandem est. I find REXX easies to use for simple ^^^ disputandUm? ... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
On Mon, 8 May 2006 16:58:32 -0300, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) shmuel+ibm- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/07/2006 at 10:33 AM, Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Having attempted this sort of tailoring variously in Rexx, POSIX shell from a here-document, and sed, I find Rexx is uniformly hardest to use; POSIX shell is best for simple operations De gustibus non disputandem est. I find REXX easies to use for simple applications, use Perl for more complicated cases and would be most uncharitable to anyone who tried to convince me to use the POSIX shell. Of course, a tool like ISPF File Tailoring makes it easier regardless of the language used. ... My original take on Paul's comment was that I doubt I'm going to be fluent in Unix-based tools before I retire so will never know if he's right. Then (after Googling the Latin) I decided a spin on Shmuel's comment decided it for me. De gustibus non disputandem est ... and it doesn't matter. Pick whatever tool you are confortable with that gets the job done. I've been away from SPF diaglogs for to long do File Tailoring (Although I used to be reasonably good at it) and don't have a chance using Unix utilities. I'd probably start with REXX. If it worked with little difficulty, fine. Otherwise, I'd move over to NetView (even though this has nothing to do with traditional NetView functions) and whip out a solution using NetView Pipes. Would I expect anyone else to go that route? No. But so what? (Unless it's an ongoing process that someone else would have to maintain after I've been hit by a truck.) Pat O'Keefe -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
I will never forget the Latin lesson John Cleese give in that scene. It is hilarious. (Although I didn't remember the exact wording from the film, my mind immediate recalled that scene.) Thomas == Chris Mason == wrote2006-05-09 17:41: Thomas, Got it in one. Amazingly there are more than 35,000 hits in Google and they say Latin is a dead language. Can so many remember their Latin lessons? Chris Mason - Original Message - From: Thomas Berg [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Tuesday, 09 May, 2006 1:24 PM Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? Was that a reference to Life Of Brian ? :-) == Chris Mason == wrote2006-05-09 03:01: Paul, I trust you know how to deal with Romanes Eunt Domus :-) Chris Mason - Original Message - From: Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Tuesday, 09 May, 2006 1:10 AM Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? In a recent note, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) said: Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 16:58:32 -0300 De gustibus non disputandem est. I find REXX easies to use for simple ^^^ disputandUm? ... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html -- __ Mundus Vult Decipi __ They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a message dated 5/9/2006 3:56:15 P.M. Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I will never forget the Latin lesson John Cleese give in that scene. It is hilarious. The Graphics project at SHARE sponsored the continuous running of 'Meetings Bloody meetings' with John Cleese. Guess the only mainframe funny to compare was the old IBM sponsored 8mm films of Bob Newhart on his phone explaining hollerith cards... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Guess the only mainframe funny to compare was the old IBM sponsored 8mm films of Bob Newhart on his phone explaining hollerith cards... When Parallel Sysplex was announced, IBM produced an advertising film. It featured a serious youngish woman who asserted that the new capability would allow customers to harvest data from fields that were previously too thick to plow. It was unintentionally hilarious. Bob Shannon -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/08/2006 at 05:10 PM, Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: disputandUm? Well, lower case. I don't believe Rexx can compete with a shell script containing a here-document containing substitutable symbols. But if I wanted a here document then I'd use Perl. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/08/2006 at 06:01 PM, Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: JCL tailoring is a nightmare. Only if you didn't create your JCL with File Tailoring in mind. It's easy enough to do: CHANGE ALL 'TYPRUN=HOLD' 'TYPRUN=SCAN' File Tailoring is not EDIT. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/08/2006 at 10:06 PM, Ed Gould [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Good memory. But I believe the fullgen is still needed to this day (to prime the CSI) at least. No; in fact, there would be no way to do a fullgen before you had primed the CSI. Where would the sysgen macros come from? I *THINK* there are a few products that are not supported by the sysgen method anymore. Yes, like z/OS. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/07/2006 at 10:33 AM, Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Having attempted this sort of tailoring variously in Rexx, POSIX shell from a here-document, and sed, I find Rexx is uniformly hardest to use; POSIX shell is best for simple operations De gustibus non disputandem est. I find REXX easies to use for simple applications, use Perl for more complicated cases and would be most uncharitable to anyone who tried to convince me to use the POSIX shell. Of course, a tool like ISPF File Tailoring makes it easier regardless of the language used. I haven't tried assembler, but it intrigues me. Does the AREAD ... PUNCH sequence perform symbol substitution, presumably of GBLC variables? No, but you can parse the input and request substitution. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/07/2006 at 07:24 PM, Chris Mason [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: As a matter of interest, since I managed to avoid this particular task, when was it no longer necessary to generate OS, where OS refers to the ancestors of z/OS? I believe that it was the advent of MVSCP that did away with the IOGEN, but that might have been optional at first. The full SYSGEN went away in the same time frame. It was well into the MVS era, and AFAIK you needed a SYSGEN for OS/VS1 until the bitter end. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/07/2006 at 11:31 AM, Chris Mason [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Bill's reference misses a key step, namely how to get the SYSPUNCH output submitted as a job. The typical way to do this is to make the SYSPUNCH a DISPosition NEW and PASSed temporary data set. The next job step can then be an IEBGENER with the temporary data set as input with DISPosition OLD and DELETE and the output going to the internal reader, SYSOUT=(*,INTRDR). Surely the typical way is to simply define SYSPUNCH as SYSOUT(*,INTRDR). first post I think the natural tool to use is Rexx but perhaps there are better ways involving minimal coding? You can run ISPF in batch, and this looks like a natural for FIle Tailoring. Assembler maybe? IMHO it would be easier in REXX. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a recent note, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) said:
Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 16:58:32 -0300
De gustibus non disputandem est. I find REXX easies to use for simple
^^^
disputandUm?
applications, use Perl for more complicated cases and would be most
uncharitable to anyone who tried to convince me to use the POSIX
shell. Of course, a tool like ISPF File Tailoring makes it easier
regardless of the language used.
I don't believe Rexx can compete with a shell script containing
a here-document containing substitutable symbols. I've regularly
taken existing JCL and wrapped it with:
{ cat end-of-JCL
...
end-of-JCL
} | submit
... put '$' before selected names to make them variables,
and run it.
The deficiency of Rexx here is that it has no facility for
instream data.
I haven't tried assembler, but it intrigues me. Does
the AREAD ... PUNCH sequence perform symbol substitution,
presumably of GBLC variables?
No, but you can parse the input and request substitution.
I hereby retract any enthusiasm I may have mistakenly expressed
for the assembler option.
As for the ordering of processing of PUNCH statements, questioned
elsewhere in this thread:
Title: HLASM V1R4 Language Reference
Document Number: SC26-4940-03
5.37 PUNCH Instruction
The assembler writes the record produced by a PUNCH
statement when it writes the object deck. The
ordering of this record in the object deck is
determined by the order in which the PUNCH
statement is processed by the assembler. The record
appears after any object deck records produced by
previous statements, and before any other object
deck records produced by subsequent statements.
-- gil
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Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a recent note, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) said: Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 17:04:42 -0300 You can run ISPF in batch, and this looks like a natural for FIle Tailoring. JCL tailoring is a nightmare. I was once confronted with a library of JCL members, each of which contained TYPRUN=HOLD. (Must've been a coding standard -- it was expected each job would be released from a console.) I wanted to change this. It's easy enough to do: CHANGE ALL 'TYPRUN=HOLD' 'TYPRUN=SCAN' ... but dreadful to tailor each job to run normally. The authors were inconsistent -- I might see: //NAME JOB USER,ACCOUNT, // TYPRUN=HOLD,CLASS=A OK. CHANGE ALL 'TYPRUN=HOLD,' '' But what does this do to: //NAME JOB USER,ACCOUNT, // TYPRUN=HOLD, // CLASS=A Oops. Need to delete the line entirely in order not to introduce an empty JCL statement. Or: //NAME JOB USER,ACCOUNT, // CLASS=A, // TYPRUN=HOLD Double oops. Need to delete the line and reach back and remove the comma from the preceding line. I normalized the source, rather than trying to deal with the variants. And, in tailoring there's always the hazard of overflowing column 72. It tempts one to put each option on a separate continuation line, which only aggravates the problems above. TSO, IDCAMS, SMP/E are much friendlier in these respects. I distill some design principles to facilitate automatic generation of commands: o The language should tolerate null entries. For example, in the above friendly languages, I can nullify an entire option with an editor. If it introduces an empty continuation line, there's no problem. In fact, I have the habit of putting a continuation mark on every option line and ending the command with a blank line, so I can delete any option or the line containing it without repairing its predecessor. (Sort of like putting labels on EQU * (don't start that thread here, please), rather than on nontrivial statements.) o Each keyword option should admit restating the default value for convenience in tailoring and automatic generation. E,g., there should be a TYPRUN=NORMAL, which would eliminate the problems above with: CHANGE ALL 'TYPRUN=HOLD' 'TYPRUN=NORMAL' Here, SMP/E fails. Automatically generating MCS, I found I get a syntax error for FILES(0); I must entirely omit the option when there are no relative files, even as for the default TYPRUN. Another case of IBM's designers' not treating boundary conditions rationally. Omitting the FILES() operand should be regarded as merely an economizing of FILES(0); either form should be acceptable. -- gil -- StorageTek INFORMATION made POWERFUL -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Yes, I read that too. But it didn't answer my question because it doesn't say when the object deck is written. My question was not as to *where* in the deck the PUNCH output appears but *when* the deck, PUNCH output and all, is written. In any event, as pointed out by Bill Lalonde and Shmuel Metz, it's irrelevant. As for the ordering of processing of PUNCH statements, questioned elsewhere in this thread: Title: HLASM V1R4 Language Reference Document Number: SC26-4940-03 5.37 PUNCH Instruction The assembler writes the record produced by a PUNCH statement when it writes the object deck. The ordering of this record in the object deck is determined by the order in which the PUNCH statement is processed by the assembler. The record appears after any object deck records produced by previous statements, and before any other object deck records produced by subsequent statements. -- gil _ Dont just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Paul, I trust you know how to deal with Romanes Eunt Domus :-) Chris Mason - Original Message - From: Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Tuesday, 09 May, 2006 1:10 AM Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? In a recent note, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) said: Date: Mon, 8 May 2006 16:58:32 -0300 De gustibus non disputandem est. I find REXX easies to use for simple ^^^ disputandUm? ... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Shmuel, Thanks. Some folk one can rely on. Chris Mason - Original Message - From: Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Monday, 08 May, 2006 10:11 PM Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/07/2006 at 07:24 PM, Chris Mason [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: As a matter of interest, since I managed to avoid this particular task, when was it no longer necessary to generate OS, where OS refers to the ancestors of z/OS? I believe that it was the advent of MVSCP that did away with the IOGEN, but that might have been optional at first. The full SYSGEN went away in the same time frame. It was well into the MVS era, and AFAIK you needed a SYSGEN for OS/VS1 until the bitter end. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
On May 8, 2006, at 8:03 PM, Chris Mason wrote: Shmuel, Thanks. Some folk one can rely on. Chris Mason - Original Message - From: Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Monday, 08 May, 2006 10:11 PM Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? In [EMAIL PROTECTED], on 05/07/2006 at 07:24 PM, Chris Mason [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: As a matter of interest, since I managed to avoid this particular task, when was it no longer necessary to generate OS, where OS refers to the ancestors of z/OS? I believe that it was the advent of MVSCP that did away with the IOGEN, but that might have been optional at first. The full SYSGEN went away in the same time frame. It was well into the MVS era, and AFAIK you needed a SYSGEN for OS/VS1 until the bitter end. Good memory. But I believe the fullgen is still needed to this day (to prime the CSI) at least. I *THINK* there are a few products that are not supported by the sysgen method anymore. Ed -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
To the listeners, This thread was discovered in a Google digest. I did not spot it in e-mails so I can't reply correctly, that is, linking to the existing thread, nor can I produce the usual references. Hal, Bill's reference misses a key step, namely how to get the SYSPUNCH output submitted as a job. The typical way to do this is to make the SYSPUNCH a DISPosition NEW and PASSed temporary data set. The next job step can then be an IEBGENER with the temporary data set as input with DISPosition OLD and DELETE and the output going to the internal reader, SYSOUT=(*,INTRDR). Chris Mason first post Hello, I have the following JCL to do a selective restore from a logical dump as follows ... //*-8-8-8-8-8-8-8 //RESTORE EXEC PGM=ADRDSSU,PARM='TYPRUN=NORUN' //SYSPRINT DD SYSOUT=* //RESTFROM DD ... //TO DD VOL=SER=... //SYSINDD * RESTORE DATASET(INCLUDE( - HAL.A.CNTL - HAL.LIB.JCL- HAL.MAIN.CLIST - HAL.MAIN.PARMLIB - HAL.MAIN.PROCLIB - SYS1.IPLPARM - SYS1.PARMLIB - SYS1.PROCLIB - ) ) - RENUNC(- (HAL.A.CNTL , TUSER1.HH.HAL.A.CNTL ), - (HAL.LIB.JCL , TUSER1.HH.HAL.LIB.JCL ), - (HAL.MAIN.CLIST , TUSER1.HH.HAL.MAIN.CLIST ), - (HAL.MAIN.PARMLIB , TUSER1.HH.HAL.MAIN.PARMLIB ), - (HAL.MAIN.PROCLIB , TUSER1.HH.HAL.MAIN.PROCLIB ), - (SYS1.IPLPARM , TUSER1.HH.SYS1.IPLPARM ), - (SYS1.PARMLIB , TUSER1.HH.SYS1.PARMLIB ), - (SYS1.PROCLIB , TUSER1.HH.SYS1.PROCLIB ), - ) - INDD(RESTFROM) OUTDD(TO) CANCELERROR TOL(ENQFAILURE) SHR - CATALOG /* //*-8-8-8-8-8-8-8 I would prefer to use some sort of macro processing in a prior step so that I can have input similar to this: //*-8-8-8-8-8-8-8 PFX TUSER.HH RST ADCD.A.CNTL RST ADCD.LIB.JCL RST ADCD.ZOSV14S.CLIST RST ADCD.ZOSV14S.PARMLIB RST ADCD.ZOSV14S.PROCLIB RST SYS1.IPLPARM RST SYS1.PARMLIB RST SYS1.PROCLIB END //*-8-8-8-8-8-8-8 which can then be fed into the sysin for the restore step. This avoids duplicating the names and looks a lot cleaner. I think the natural tool to use is Rexx but perhaps there are better ways involving minimal coding? Assembler maybe? Are there any free tools which address this that are easy to implement on z/os? Sample code would be appreciated. Thanks in advance Hal. second post Whoops, should have been:- PFX TUSER.HH RST HAL.A.CNTL RST HAL.LIB.JCL RST HAL.MAIN.CLIST RST HAL.MAIN.PARMLIB RST HAL.MAIN.PROCLIB RST SYS1.IPLPARM RST SYS1.PARMLIB RST SYS1.PROCLIB END third post Have a look at http://members.tripod.com/billlalonde/mvshint.htm Bill -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Submit job from SYPUNCH was (fwd) Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
On 7 May 2006 02:32:09 -0700, in bit.listserv.ibm-main [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Chris Mason) wrote: To the listeners, This thread was discovered in a Google digest. I did not spot it in e-mails so I can't reply correctly, that is, linking to the existing thread, nor can I produce the usual references. Hal, Bill's reference misses a key step, namely how to get the SYSPUNCH output submitted as a job. The typical way to do this is to make the SYSPUNCH a DISPosition NEW and PASSed temporary data set. The next job step can then be an IEBGENER with the temporary data set as input with DISPosition OLD and DELETE and the output going to the internal reader, SYSOUT=(*,INTRDR). Why don't you have SYSPUNCH SYSOUT=(*,INTRDR)? Chris Mason rest snipped -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: Submit job from SYPUNCH was (fwd) Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Why don't you have SYSPUNCH SYSOUT=(*,INTRDR)? Because it's a good idea to check the assembly completion code to ensure that the generated JCL is good. That way you can avoid submitting partially and/or incorrectly built jobs to the internal reader. From: Clark Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: IBM Mainframe Discussion List IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Submit job from SYPUNCH was (fwd) Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? Date: Sun, 7 May 2006 09:34:14 -0300 On 7 May 2006 02:32:09 -0700, in bit.listserv.ibm-main [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Chris Mason) wrote: To the listeners, This thread was discovered in a Google digest. I did not spot it in e-mails so I can't reply correctly, that is, linking to the existing thread, nor can I produce the usual references. Hal, Bill's reference misses a key step, namely how to get the SYSPUNCH output submitted as a job. The typical way to do this is to make the SYSPUNCH a DISPosition NEW and PASSed temporary data set. The next job step can then be an IEBGENER with the temporary data set as input with DISPosition OLD and DELETE and the output going to the internal reader, SYSOUT=(*,INTRDR). Why don't you have SYSPUNCH SYSOUT=(*,INTRDR)? Chris Mason rest snipped -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
REXX is probably your best bet, but in the 1970s and 1980s, REXX wasn't
available on MVS and I often used the AREAD capability of ASMH (also
available in HLASM) to generate job streams. See example below (it's
been a while, correct syntax is NOT guaranteed):
MACRO
JPUNCH
.LOOP ANOP
AREAD CARD
AIF ('CARD' EQ '').EOJ
PUNCH 'CARD'
AGO .LOOP
.EOJ END
MEND ---
JPUNCH , -- execute macro and read data cards
PFX TUSER.HH
RST ADCD.A.CNTL
RST ADCD.LIB.JCL
/*
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Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a recent note, Gilbert Saint-Flour said:
Date: Sun, 7 May 2006 11:50:33 -0400
REXX is probably your best bet, but in the 1970s and 1980s, REXX wasn't
available on MVS and I often used the AREAD capability of ASMH (also
available in HLASM) to generate job streams. See example below (it's
been a while, correct syntax is NOT guaranteed):
Having attempted this sort of tailoring variously in Rexx,
POSIX shell from a here-document, and sed, I find Rexx is
uniformly hardest to use; POSIX shell is best for simple
operations (the sort of thing that could almost be done
with JCL symbol substitutions except for various onerous
restrictions), and sed is best for complex operations or
any use of external prototype data.
I haven't tried assembler, but it intrigues me. Does
the AREAD ... PUNCH sequence perform symbol substitution,
presumably of GBLC variables? (I assume that's the main
point of the exercise.) This could well bypass the
limitations of JCL symbol substitutions so often discussed
here, and permit self-contained tailorable jobs with no
external skeletons, filters, etc. Might be easier than
Rexx.
MACRO
JPUNCH
.LOOP ANOP
AREAD CARD
AIF ('CARD' EQ '').EOJ
No specific EOF test? Pity. What if the input data contain
an actual empty line?
PUNCH 'CARD'
AGO .LOOP
.EOJ END
MEND ---
JPUNCH , -- execute macro and read data cards
PFX TUSER.HH
RST ADCD.A.CNTL
RST ADCD.LIB.JCL
/*
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Re: Submit job from SYPUNCH was (fwd) Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Clark, Quite correct - although J R[1] has provided quite a good reason which has now been challenged by John Gilmore, such is the way with these exchanges. Although it was a Sunday morning and the brain was mostly shut down I think I was recalling how I used to do the sort of thing the original poster was trying to do. It may have consisted of a rather more complex structure where only part of the eventual job, perhaps the utility statements, was generated by the assembler. Thus the IEBGENER was used to pull the parts together as the concatenation of the input data sets. Whatever it was - and it wasn't necessarily the most efficient technique - it got the job done, the job being, typically, how to perform one task in up to eight versions for, typically, defining/deleting VSAM data sets on test systems - assuming my memory isn't failing me again. Chris Mason - Original Message - From: Clark Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Sunday, 07 May, 2006 2:34 PM Subject: Submit job from SYPUNCH was (fwd) Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? On 7 May 2006 02:32:09 -0700, in bit.listserv.ibm-main [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Chris Mason) wrote: To the listeners, This thread was discovered in a Google digest. I did not spot it in e-mails so I can't reply correctly, that is, linking to the existing thread, nor can I produce the usual references. Hal, Bill's reference misses a key step, namely how to get the SYSPUNCH output submitted as a job. The typical way to do this is to make the SYSPUNCH a DISPosition NEW and PASSed temporary data set. The next job step can then be an IEBGENER with the temporary data set as input with DISPosition OLD and DELETE and the output going to the internal reader, SYSOUT=(*,INTRDR). Why don't you have SYSPUNCH SYSOUT=(*,INTRDR)? Chris Mason rest snipped -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Paul,
You are clearly rather new to this game - and you can be very, very thankful
for that. Some, perhaps many, perhaps most, who subscribe to this list/group
will remember the bad old days when if it needed installing, it was
installed with the aid of the assembler macro language[1]. Very often,
when you wanted to install a product, you coded up one or, more likely,
many macros and submitted an assembler compile. You then took the cards
out of the card punch stacker, took a couple of steps round the 2540 card
reader/punch and put the cards into the hopper. Then you went to the coffee
lounge, read the paper or had a chat and came back some time later to find
your product installed - with any luck.
Alternatively, you had to generate an NCP or a TCAM network where much
the same thing was done - although you probably had a good book to read in
the coffee lounge.
As a matter of interest, since I managed to avoid this particular task, when
was it no longer necessary to generate OS, where OS refers to the
ancestors of z/OS?
[1] I did this twice in my time. Once was for a diagnostic package for
BTAM-based network programming where I managed to produce a sort in macro
language - for device addresses. Another time was for my adaption layer
product. Unfortunately the latter broke down a bit when one customer site
fooled it by having volume serial numbers actually starting with a number
and I was using the volume serial numbers as names - :-(
Chris Mason
- Original Message -
From: Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Sent: Sunday, 07 May, 2006 6:33 PM
Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a recent note, Gilbert Saint-Flour said:
Date: Sun, 7 May 2006 11:50:33 -0400
REXX is probably your best bet, but in the 1970s and 1980s, REXX wasn't
available on MVS and I often used the AREAD capability of ASMH (also
available in HLASM) to generate job streams. See example below (it's
been a while, correct syntax is NOT guaranteed):
Having attempted this sort of tailoring variously in Rexx,
POSIX shell from a here-document, and sed, I find Rexx is
uniformly hardest to use; POSIX shell is best for simple
operations (the sort of thing that could almost be done
with JCL symbol substitutions except for various onerous
restrictions), and sed is best for complex operations or
any use of external prototype data.
I haven't tried assembler, but it intrigues me. Does
the AREAD ... PUNCH sequence perform symbol substitution,
presumably of GBLC variables? (I assume that's the main
point of the exercise.) This could well bypass the
limitations of JCL symbol substitutions so often discussed
here, and permit self-contained tailorable jobs with no
external skeletons, filters, etc. Might be easier than
Rexx.
MACRO
JPUNCH
.LOOP ANOP
AREAD CARD
AIF ('CARD' EQ '').EOJ
No specific EOF test? Pity. What if the input data contain
an actual empty line?
PUNCH 'CARD'
AGO .LOOP
.EOJ END
MEND ---
JPUNCH , -- execute macro and read data cards
PFX TUSER.HH
RST ADCD.A.CNTL
RST ADCD.LIB.JCL
/*
--
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Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
In a recent note, Chris Mason said: Date: Sun, 7 May 2006 19:24:11 +0200 You are clearly rather new to this game - and you can be very, very thankful many macros and submitted an assembler compile. You then took the cards out of the card punch stacker, took a couple of steps round the 2540 card reader/punch and put the cards into the hopper. Was this, then, even before passed data sets existed? There was no other way to pass data from one job step to another? (Did jobs even have multiple steps?) -- gil -- StorageTek INFORMATION made POWERFUL -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Was this, then, even before passed data sets existed? There was no other way to pass data from one job step to another? (Did jobs even have multiple steps?) but, agreeable as it is to describe the privations of our salad days, things were never quite so bad. Even OS PCP (Primary Control Program), which preceded MFT, supported multiple job steps. The sequence translate==link==execute (CLG) long antedates the System/360. Only in the most primitive situations was it necessary or common to use cards for anything but source-program and data entry. Card images written to and read from magnetic tapes were used all but ab initio under OS/360. John Gilmore Ashland, MA 01721-1817 USA _ Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os?
Paul, I'm afraid you missed the emphasis in my reply. I was reacting to your haven't tried assembler, but it intrigues me. statement from your earlier post. As I see Anne Lynn Wheeler describing in some detail in a post which. for some reason, hasn't popped up in my - I almost said reader - in-box, installing software was very heavily reliant on the assembler macro language even if you contrived to punch to some media other than cards and submit from there. I tried to think when I last really used cards and then managed to convert to, well, something else, maybe VM/CMS with a guest VS1 system - thus, logically, I may still have been using cards - but memory fades with respect to these more trivial tasks. Probably my last efforts with the 029 and the 2540 was in 1976 in Oberedonaustrasse, Vienna. I must have started using VM shortly after that - and never punched a card thereafter :-) Come to think of it that's probably a significant moment in everyone's mainframe career - if your long enough in the teeth. Another aspect to my viewpoint is that, perhaps unlike John Gilmore, I started with the original DOS where using cards for the object, literally, deck was taken for granted. Tape wasn't always available and, in my DOS days, I can't recall DASD being an option - but maybe I just remember fanning nice new cards so that they didn't jam. :-) Chris Mason - Original Message - From: Paul Gilmartin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Sunday, 07 May, 2006 8:42 PM Subject: Re: rexx or other macro processor on z/os? In a recent note, Chris Mason said: Date: Sun, 7 May 2006 19:24:11 +0200 You are clearly rather new to this game - and you can be very, very thankful many macros and submitted an assembler compile. You then took the cards out of the card punch stacker, took a couple of steps round the 2540 card reader/punch and put the cards into the hopper. Was this, then, even before passed data sets existed? There was no other way to pass data from one job step to another? (Did jobs even have multiple steps?) -- gil -- StorageTek INFORMATION made POWERFUL -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
