Re: Searching for a process to clean my VTS

[Nobuhiko Furuya]

Hi,

You can delete them as follows.

1. Ensure the scratch category codes in DEVSUPxx is defined on the 
target VTS.
2. Create volume entry in the VOLCAT as follows.  If LIBNAME and/or 
SGNAME is not defined, define them before CREATE VOLENT.

  CREATE VOLUMEENTRY (NAME(Vvolser) LIBRARYNAME(libname) -
    MEDIATYPE(MEDIAn) LOCATION(LIBRARY) -
    STORAGEGROUP(sgname) USEATTRIBUTE(PRIVATE) RECORDING(36TRACK))
3. Add volume entry in RMM CDS as follows.
 RMM ADDVOLUME volcat STATUS(VOLCAT)
4. Release volumes in RMM as follows.
 RMM DELETEVOLUME volser RELEASE
5. Return to scratch by EDGSPLCS with INDD as follows.
 SQ volser
6. Eject the volumes as follows. Only 1,000 volumes eject request can be 
accepted at a time.

 RMM DELETEVOLUME volser REMOVE EJECT
    or
    EDGSPLCS with INDD as follows.
 EQ volser

Best regards,

Nobuhiko Furuya(古谷信彦)
V-SOL Inc.

On 2023/05/31 2:37, Tom Longfellow wrote:

Yes I have the list -- I know them by naming standard and I can do a Virtual 
Volume Search to the Cluster and get a downloadable list of volume names and 
their current category status.I already have a REXX roughed out that 
generates the command I think I need.   But I really need to find the set of 
actions that have be performed so I can generate all the commands I need.  
Along with RMM/IDCAMS/LI requests to kill these zombies for good and eject them 
from my life.

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Re: Q: Transient SVC ?

[Michael Stein]

> Back before SYS1.LPALIB, Nucleus-resident SVC routines were named IGCxxx
> and were linked into IEANUC00; transient SVC routines were named IGC00xxx
> with a C zone on the last digit, resided is SYS1.SVCLIB and ran out of
> 1 KiB SVC transient areas.

> The EBCDIC code pages I've used had C) as "{".

The name was generated by CVD (convert to decimal) which resulted in bytes
of dd and dC with C being the decimal sign zone.  The UNPK instruction
changed this to Fd Fd Cd.  So any SVC number ending in 0 resulted in a
last character of x'c0' or '{'.

from: MVT source pds AAPVT member IEATRANS

TRANSVC  LHRWORK3,SVCID(RRB) . GET SVCID  
 CVD   RWORK3,SVCNAME . CONVERT SVC NUMBER TO DECIMAL
 UNPK  SVCLPANM+4(4),SVCNAME+5(3) .UNPACK TO 4 DIGITS

In MVT the transient areas were each 1K and the transient SVC load modules
were created and linked to have no relocation needed and a maximum length
of 1K.  There was a lot of support to wait for a transient are to be
avaiable, get the correct module in it and run it (as well as release
it when done).

Also some SVCs took more than one 1K module and were implemented by
having multiple 1K modules which transfered control between them via XCTL.
So there were a lot of IGCxxnnn modules (and IGG and other prefixes).

While SVCLIB was a PDS with a directory as normal, for performance
reasons, modules were NOT usually locaed by name.  Instead a module which
transfered control to another had the name along with a place for the TTR
(disk address) of the target module.  There was a program which had to
be run anytime SVCLIB was reorganized which used the names to update
all the TTRs in the SVC modules.  Also the SVC table entry for SVCs
not in link pack contained the TTR of the module.

So transient area "program fetch" just had to read the block
(at most 1K) from the specified TTR...

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Re: Q: Transient SVC ?

[Steve Thompson]

Thank you Shmuel:

I had completely forgotten those libraries and that part of the 
system "gen". I didn't actually become a sysprog until MVS/SP2 (XA).


And I don't know about z/VSE either. I've gotten the latest 
manuals, just don't have time to read them all.


Steve Thompson


On 5/31/2023 10:36 PM, Seymour J Metz wrote:

Back before SYS1.LPALIB, Nucleus-resident SVC routines were named IGCxxx and were linked 
into IEANUC00; transient SVC routines were named IGC00xxx with a C zone on the last 
digit, resided is SYS1.SVCLIB and ran out of 1 KiB (2 KiB in OS/VS1) SVC transient areas. 
The names endured, but since SVS the system just pages in transient SVC routines. The 
EBCDIC code pages I've used had C) as "{".

DOS/360 had A and B transients; I don't know whether those survived to z/VSE.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Steve Thompson [ste...@wkyr.net]
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2023 9:32 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Q: Transient SVC ?

Sorry, but I have to ask this: What do you mean by a transient SVC?

In days gone by, I remember that SVCs had to have specific names,
so the last char of the SVC could be a "non" printable name (hazy
memories of this from having to fix/patch an SVC).

I know that DOS, DOS/V* had transients that we (DOS to MVS
migration teams), in some cases had to turn into an SVC for use
in MVS.

Just trying to remember how some of this stuff used to work/be done.

Steve Thompson

On 5/31/2023 8:42 PM, Seymour J Metz wrote:

For transient SVC name it was a trailing  C0; I was just contrasting member 
names with index levels. I guess that IBM decided to eliminate an alleged 
ambiguity between member name and relative generation.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3

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Regards,
Steve Thompson
VS Strategies LLC
Westfield IN
972-983-9430 cell

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Re: HOLD Action of a superseded PTF

[Seymour J Metz]

The superseding PTF should include any required HOLDDATA. But see my PUT 
PROCESS song if it's still in the songbook.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Munif Sadek [munif.sa...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2023 9:58 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: HOLD Action of a superseded PTF

My SMP APPLY CHECK has multi pages of ++ HOLDSYS ACTION items but APPLY only a 
couple.

 Do I have to take HOLDSYS Action of the Superseded PTFs as reported in the 
APPLY CHECK SMP Report but not listed in the APPLY JOB SMP report?

regards
Munif.

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Re: Q: Transient SVC ?

[Seymour J Metz]

Back before SYS1.LPALIB, Nucleus-resident SVC routines were named IGCxxx and 
were linked into IEANUC00; transient SVC routines were named IGC00xxx with a C 
zone on the last digit, resided is SYS1.SVCLIB and ran out of 1 KiB (2 KiB in 
OS/VS1) SVC transient areas. The names endured, but since SVS the system just 
pages in transient SVC routines. The EBCDIC code pages I've used had C) as "{".

DOS/360 had A and B transients; I don't know whether those survived to z/VSE.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Steve Thompson [ste...@wkyr.net]
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2023 9:32 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Q: Transient SVC ?

Sorry, but I have to ask this: What do you mean by a transient SVC?

In days gone by, I remember that SVCs had to have specific names,
so the last char of the SVC could be a "non" printable name (hazy
memories of this from having to fix/patch an SVC).

I know that DOS, DOS/V* had transients that we (DOS to MVS
migration teams), in some cases had to turn into an SVC for use
in MVS.

Just trying to remember how some of this stuff used to work/be done.

Steve Thompson

On 5/31/2023 8:42 PM, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> For transient SVC name it was a trailing  C0; I was just contrasting member 
> names with index levels. I guess that IBM decided to eliminate an alleged 
> ambiguity between member name and relative generation.
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3

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HOLD Action of a superseded PTF

[Munif Sadek]

My SMP APPLY CHECK has multi pages of ++ HOLDSYS ACTION items but APPLY only a 
couple.  

 Do I have to take HOLDSYS Action of the Superseded PTFs as reported in the 
APPLY CHECK SMP Report but not listed in the APPLY JOB SMP report? 

regards
Munif.

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Q: Transient SVC ?

[Steve Thompson]

Sorry, but I have to ask this: What do you mean by a transient SVC?

In days gone by, I remember that SVCs had to have specific names, 
so the last char of the SVC could be a "non" printable name (hazy 
memories of this from having to fix/patch an SVC).


I know that DOS, DOS/V* had transients that we (DOS to MVS 
migration teams), in some cases had to turn into an SVC for use 
in MVS.


Just trying to remember how some of this stuff used to work/be done.

Steve Thompson

On 5/31/2023 8:42 PM, Seymour J Metz wrote:

For transient SVC name it was a trailing  C0; I was just contrasting member 
names with index levels. I guess that IBM decided to eliminate an alleged 
ambiguity between member name and relative generation.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


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Re: z/OS 3.1: Now UNIXR Certified

[Seymour J Metz]

My impression of MVS OE was that IBM implemented only what it needed for 
certification.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Rick Troth [tro...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2023 12:19 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: z/OS 3.1: Now UNIXR Certified

It was 1995.
I remember because I was particularly enthused about the advent of
"OpenEdition" on MVS and on VM.
It was ironic, and a bit of a hoot, that other Unix systems (e.g.,
Slolaris, HPUX, even AIX) did not have the same certification.

There were two problems. First, USS was kinda slow for some things, and
a bit fragile when configuring and building many FLOSS applications.
Also EBCDIC. The POSIX spec didn't (or didn't clearly) address the
character set issue. I know that the problem has gotten "better", but
it's still a thing. I eventually backed off my own demand that "OE"
speak ASCII. The fact that newline was consistent and reliably
identifiable in both charsets was enough. But nobody really leveraged it
(newline as an A/E indicator) to the extent we should have.

In spite of the caveats, USS was (is) an excellent implementation.
OpenVM too!

-- R; <><



On 5/26/23 12:24, Mohammad Khan wrote:
> FSF and Linux can reasonably be ignored in this discussion but was there a 
> time when Unix System Services (of z/OS or OS/390) was competitor to other 
> platforms that claimed to be UNIX? How many third party apps were available / 
> supported / marketed for USS as against AIX, HPUX or Solaris? How many of 
> those were actually being run on USS? Certificate is fine on the wall but 
> what actually does the job is more important.
>
> mkk
>
> On Fri, 26 May 2023 15:40:34 +0200, Tony Harminc  wrote:
>
>>> To be contentious: nowadays nobody cares. Indeed, when we talk about
>>> non-Windows distributed system we usually think about Linux. Even POWER
>>> machines are more and more used for Linux workloads, not AIX. And the
>>> Linux is not UNIX certified.
>>>
>> The only use I have found in many years for having z/OS UNIX certified is
>> so that when someone says they hear that z/OS has a "UNIX emulator" or any
>> one of many similar bogus claims, I can say "No, z/OS *is* UNIX. And BTW
>> Linux is *not* UNIX." (Of course the FSF would say, Gnu's Not Unix.)"
>>
>> Tony H.
>>
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Re: Two related member generation questions

[Seymour J Metz]

For transient SVC name it was a trailing  C0; I was just contrasting member 
names with index levels. I guess that IBM decided to eliminate an alleged 
ambiguity between member name and relative generation.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Paul Gilmartin [042bfe9c879d-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2023 10:55 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Two related member generation questions

On Wed, 31 May 2023 11:57:07 +, Seymour J Metz wrote:
>
>I don't recall leading braces or hyphens in qualifiers,
>
Leading?  In member names?  I was told it was the result of UNPK
of a SVC number.

> ... but leading hyphens in member names used to work, and I was unhappy when 
> IBM tightened the validity check in the C/I.
>
They should have gone the other way and allowed quoting the member name.

--
gil

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Re: z/OS 3.1: Now UNIXR Certified

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Wed, 31 May 2023 15:57:19 -0400, Rick Troth  wrote:
>...
>Reasonable compromise ... it would seem so.
>IBM are such sticklers for the rules. What really *is*fork() and what
>does Unix do on systems without virtual memory?
>

RATIONALE
The posix_spawn() function and its close relation posix_spawnp() have been 
introduced to overcome the following perceived difficulties with fork(): the 
fork() function is difficult or impossible to implement without swapping or 
dynamic address translation.
o Swapping is generally too slow for a realtime environment.
o Dynamic address translation is not available everywhere that POSIX 
might be useful.

(But I think the IBM spawn() is a better design.)


If they're gonna implement vfork() they should call it
"vfork()", not fork().

>... This is a real question
>given that there is a group implementing Unix for 8-bit systems. (Plus
>the history that Unix originally ran on many HW platforms which lacked
>the ability.) So what canfork() do in cases like that? That might be a
>pattern OpenVM could follow.
>CMS doesn't do virtual memory ... and that's a feature.
>

   There are two reasons why POSIX programmers call fork(). One reason is to 
create
a new thread of control within the same program (which was originally only 
possible in
POSIX by creating a new process); the other is to create a new process 
running a
different program. In the latter case, the call to fork() is soon followed 
by a call to one
of the exec functions.

CMS fork() addresses the second, not the first.

>But ... yeah ... if you *know* that some programs will (in the source)
>be lazy and just callfork() to spawn a child, and immediately exec(),
>sher, makes sense. But more rigorous development would callspawn() instead.
>Call me lazy.
>
They shouldn't call it "fork()" while there are alternatives.

-- 
gil

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Re: z/OS 3.1: Now UNIXR Certified

[Rick Troth]

On 5/31/23 15:48, Phil Smith III wrote:

Gil wrote:

OpenVM fork()?  It's unforgivable that OpenVM provides
something it calls "fork", but which is not.

Heh. When that came out, I got a bunch of Taco Bell sporks, drilled holes in 
them so I could hang them from paper clips, and handed them out at SHARE to the 
VM crowd to dangle off badges. A couple of Endicott folks privately told me 
they liked them.

I'm not sure it wasn't a reasonable compromise, but I certainly understand the 
distaste.



Reasonable compromise ... it would seem so.
IBM are such sticklers for the rules. What really *is*fork() and what 
does Unix do on systems without virtual memory? This is a real question 
given that there is a group implementing Unix for 8-bit systems. (Plus 
the history that Unix originally ran on many HW platforms which lacked 
the ability.) So what canfork() do in cases like that? That might be a 
pattern OpenVM could follow.

CMS doesn't do virtual memory ... and that's a feature.

But ... yeah ... if you *know* that some programs will (in the source) 
be lazy and just callfork() to spawn a child, and immediately exec(), 
sher, makes sense. But more rigorous development would callspawn() instead.

Call me lazy.

-- R; <><




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CMS-like 'xmitmsg' for Linux (or Unix or MacOS or even Windoze)

[Rick Troth]

This was also posted to the Linux/390 list and the VM list, but seemed 
relevant for here too.


Over the past several days, I "cut a release" (that's GitHub speak) of 
the xmitmsgX package. The package mimics the behavior of the CMS 
'XMITMSG' command. This is release 2.1.3 of the project. The facility on 
CMS is what provides uniform messages (e.g., error messages, but more 
than just for errors). I was actually shocked to learn (several years 
ago) that MVS doesn't have the same thing. (Though BPXMTEXT is a rough 
approximation of a partial subset.)
Several have commented that they find it handy to have this function on 
POSIX and Unix-like systems, so here it is.


The wizard from Oz had turned the crank several weeks ago on USS and 
provided feedback. (We thank ye.) I have rolled that in but have not yet 
been able to re-test (since I do not have access to USS myself).


Those who know and love Rexx should take note that this release includes 
support for Regina. Similar support for ooRexx will come later if I can 
either get some help or wrap my limited gray matter around the ooRexx 
interface. (Kinda complicated for me.)


The project is here ...

https://github.com/trothr/xmitmsgx/

The "release" is here ...

https://github.com/trothr/xmitmsgx/releases/tag/2.1.3/

The "home" source repository is here ...

http://www.casita.net/pub/xmitmsgx/

The "open the repository" search has been improved: It now 
scans/usr/share/locale even if the compiled-in prefix is other than 
"/usr". It also scans/usr/lib/nls/msg and a couple others.
One effect of this change is that 'xmitmsg' should work more 
consistently in mixed environments (that is, messages possibly in 
different places) without needing a re-compile. Same goes for apps 
linked against the library.
I found that FreeBSD seems to prefer a default locale of "C" rather than 
(e.g.) "en_US" or similar, so the scanner looks for that too just in case.


-- R; <><



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Re: z/OS 3.1: Now UNIXR Certified

[Phil Smith III]

Gil wrote:
>OpenVM fork()?  It's unforgivable that OpenVM provides 
>something it calls "fork", but which is not.

Heh. When that came out, I got a bunch of Taco Bell sporks, drilled holes in 
them so I could hang them from paper clips, and handed them out at SHARE to the 
VM crowd to dangle off badges. A couple of Endicott folks privately told me 
they liked them.

I'm not sure it wasn't a reasonable compromise, but I certainly understand the 
distaste.


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D IZU command not always working

[ITschak Mugzach]

When I enter 'D IZU' in the console (z/os 2.4), I may get one of the
following responses (assuming that zOSMF is active):

   1. IZUG016I The server IZUSVR1 on system  is not available. ** msg
   CWWKF0011I: the server zosmfServer is ready to run a smarter planet is
   written to the job log before I enter the command **
   2. IZUG015I The command of DISPLAY IZU is performed in MODIFY command
   against server IZUSVS1 on system .

My system is heavily loaded, but from the IZUSVR1 log I can see that it has
completed initialization. Why is this happens?

ITschak


ITschak Mugzach
*|** IronSphere Platform* *|* *Information Security Continuous Monitoring
for z/OS, x/Linux & IBM I **| z/VM coming soon  *

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Re: z/OS 3.1: Now UNIXR Certified

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Wed, 31 May 2023 12:19:19 -0400, Rick Troth wrote:
>...
>In spite of the caveats, USS was (is) an excellent implementation.
>OpenVM too!
>
OpenVM fork()?  It's unforgivable that OpenVM provides something
it calls "fork", but which is not.

-- 
gil

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Re: SSRB/SSRX and LOCAL locks question

[David Cole]

Thanks Rob. That sounds rather definitive. And of course for 
scheduling SRBs, that make perfect sense.


But let me change the question slightly. I'm actually more interested 
in suspended local SRBs. I.E. SSRBs and SSRXs. Are they stabilized 
when the LOCAL lock is held?


Thanks,
Dave






At 5/31/2023 09:52 AM, Rob Scott wrote:

Dave
The answer from a work colleague who knows a LOT about the dispatcher is :
"The answer is no. SRB scheduling/dispatching does not use the local 
lock unless the SRB requests the local lock on dispatch.  If so it 
is obtained (or suspended to wait for it) as the dispatch occurs."

Rob Scott
Rocket Software

From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On 
Behalf Of David Cole

Sent: 31 May 2023 11:01
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: SSRB/SSRX and LOCAL locks question
EXTERNAL EMAIL


I was enquiring specifically about SRBs, not RBs.
Dave Cole



At 5/31/2023 05:25 AM, Binyamin Dissen wrote:

>I don't see how that answers either question.
>The need for SUSPEND RB caller to be disabled is to allow the 
resume process

>to resume it. You cannot schedule the resume process until the suspend as
>otherwise the resume may try resuming before the suspend 
completes, causing

>the later suspend to never wake up. It works different than ECBs.
>On Wed, 31 May 2023 18:38:58 +1000 Attila Fogarasi 
mailto:fogar...@gmail.com>> wrote:

>>:>It's documented as needing either LOCAL or CML lock. See
>>:>https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/2.2.0?topic=processing-suspen 
ding-rb-until-event-completes-suspend 


>>
>>:>
>>:>On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 6:20?PM Binyamin Dissen
>>mailto:bdis...@dissensoftware.com>>
>>:>wrote:

>>>:>
>>>:>> On Tue, 30 May 2023 16:42:00 -0400 David Cole
>>>mailto:dbc...@colesoft.com>> wrote:

>>>:>>
>>>:>> :>Does any know if suspended SRB control blocks (SSRB/SSRX) are
>>>:>> :>stabilized by holding the LOCAL lock? (I'm 
considering logic in

>>>:>> :>support of setting up TRAP2 debugging for SRBs.)
>>>:>>

>>>:>> I am also curious to know what "owner serialized" means.


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Re: SSHD terminates immediately with permission(?) problem

[Kirk Wolf]

The PORT statement should be like we should in our "z/OS OpenSSH Quick Install 
Guide" that I referred to earlier.

https://coztoolkit.com/docs/pt-quick-inst/pto-inst-basic.html#pto-inst-tcpip

PORT
...
22 TCP SSHD* NOAUTOLOG  ; OpenSSH SSHD server


Kirk Wolf
Dovetailed Technologies
https://coztoolkit.com

On Tue, May 30, 2023, at 5:55 PM, Wendell Lovewell wrote:
> A big "Thank you" to all of you listers who chimed in on my "EDC5111I 
> Permission denied. (errno2=0x744C7246)." message.  
> 
> Almost everyone was on the right track.  Changing to port  showed that it 
> was just port 22.  Commenting out the RESTRICTLOWPORTS and the PORT 
> reservation for "22  SSHD" showed it was one of those.  Restoring 
> RESTRICTLOWPORTS showed it was the port reservation for "22 SSHD" that was 
> the problem.  
> 
> (The proc that's started is SSHD, but it always starts SSHDx--usually 3, 
> sometimes 4.) 
> 
> I didn't expect the TCPPROF entries--neither of those I mentioned have 
> changed for years.  My suspicion is that there was some service applied that 
> perhaps actually started enforcing the port reservation to just "SSHD".  
> 
> Thanks again, 
> Wendell
> 
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Re: z/OS 3.1: Now UNIXR Certified

[Rick Troth]

It was 1995.
I remember because I was particularly enthused about the advent of 
"OpenEdition" on MVS and on VM.
It was ironic, and a bit of a hoot, that other Unix systems (e.g., 
Slolaris, HPUX, even AIX) did not have the same certification.


There were two problems. First, USS was kinda slow for some things, and 
a bit fragile when configuring and building many FLOSS applications. 
Also EBCDIC. The POSIX spec didn't (or didn't clearly) address the 
character set issue. I know that the problem has gotten "better", but 
it's still a thing. I eventually backed off my own demand that "OE" 
speak ASCII. The fact that newline was consistent and reliably 
identifiable in both charsets was enough. But nobody really leveraged it 
(newline as an A/E indicator) to the extent we should have.


In spite of the caveats, USS was (is) an excellent implementation. 
OpenVM too!


-- R; <><



On 5/26/23 12:24, Mohammad Khan wrote:

FSF and Linux can reasonably be ignored in this discussion but was there a time 
when Unix System Services (of z/OS or OS/390) was competitor to other platforms 
that claimed to be UNIX? How many third party apps were available / supported / 
marketed for USS as against AIX, HPUX or Solaris? How many of those were 
actually being run on USS? Certificate is fine on the wall but what actually 
does the job is more important.

mkk

On Fri, 26 May 2023 15:40:34 +0200, Tony Harminc  wrote:


To be contentious: nowadays nobody cares. Indeed, when we talk about
non-Windows distributed system we usually think about Linux. Even POWER
machines are more and more used for Linux workloads, not AIX. And the
Linux is not UNIX certified.


The only use I have found in many years for having z/OS UNIX certified is
so that when someone says they hear that z/OS has a "UNIX emulator" or any
one of many similar bogus claims, I can say "No, z/OS *is* UNIX. And BTW
Linux is *not* UNIX." (Of course the FSF would say, Gnu's Not Unix.)"

Tony H.


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Re: Two related member generation questions

[Jeremy Nicoll]

On Wed, 31 May 2023, at 12:57, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> Keep? Still? I don't recall saying it more than once.

I thought (back in April) that I'd read your "are you sure you don't
mean in an old version of SMP, rather than SMP/E", comment at
least once before - possibly lots of years ago though.

I've only got a few hundred old IBM-MAIN posts accessible on
the system I'm using now so can't search right back to whenever
I started posting - which I expect was in the 1990s.  And searching
for old posts containing eg "member name" or "member-name"
plus "weird" or "strange" or something is likely to be unrewarding
as those words wll crop up in lots of posts.

-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

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Re: z/OS 3.1: Now UNIXR Certified

[Rick Troth]

The Linux kernel was at one time explicitly POSIX compliant. Lately, I 
have not seen that banner in the console output nor from 'dmesg'.


-- R; <><



On 5/26/23 18:48, Mike Schwab wrote:

I think MVS/ESA Unix was certified to  posix standard for U.S
government contracts.  Somebody paid for Linux to get the same
certification about the same era.  Most Linuxes are not certified.
https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/522413/why-are-most-linux-distributions-not-posix-compliant

On Fri, May 26, 2023 at 9:31 AM Matt Hogstrom  wrote:

IMHO Unix certification is not particularly relevant these days … it’s Linux 
tool chain compatibility that is.  I spend time frequently having to adjust to 
old “Unix” utilities and command line arguments that are not supported (grep -r 
anyone?)

A refresh of the toolchain and open source languages would be more awesome than 
Unix95 certification.

Matt Hogstrom
m...@hogstrom.org

“It may be cognitive, but, it ain’t intuitive."
— Hogstrom




On May 26, 2023, at 9:40 AM, Tony Harminc  wrote:

The only use I have found in many years for having z/OS UNIX certified is
so that when someone says they hear that z/OS has a "UNIX emulator" or any
one of many similar bogus claims, I can say "No, z/OS *is* UNIX. And BTW
Linux is *not* UNIX." (Of course the FSF would say, Gnu's Not Unix.)"


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Re: Two related member generation questions

[Jeremy Nicoll]

On Wed, 31 May 2023, at 11:50, David Spiegel wrote:
> Hi Jeremy,
> "...I've no idea if that is or was correct ..."
> Have you ever heard of the CSI (Consolidated  Software Inventory)?
> This/these VSAM Dataset(s) has/have been part of SMP/e since the day it 
> came out in the '80s.

Yes, of course.  But I answered in the context of I/O to the PDSes.  It
seems weird that they'd be VSAM.

-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

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Re: Two related member generation questions

[David Spiegel]

Hi Gil,
"... Leading? In member names? I was told it was the result of UNPK of a 
SVC number.  ..."

Not leading, but trailing.

Regards,
David

On 2023-05-31 10:55, Paul Gilmartin wrote:

On Wed, 31 May 2023 11:57:07 +, Seymour J Metz wrote:

I don't recall leading braces or hyphens in qualifiers,


Leading?  In member names?  I was told it was the result of UNPK
of a SVC number.


... but leading hyphens in member names used to work, and I was unhappy when 
IBM tightened the validity check in the C/I.


They should have gone the other way and allowed quoting the member name.



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Re: Two related member generation questions

[Paul Gilmartin]

On Wed, 31 May 2023 11:57:07 +, Seymour J Metz wrote:
>
>I don't recall leading braces or hyphens in qualifiers, 
>
Leading?  In member names?  I was told it was the result of UNPK
of a SVC number.

> ... but leading hyphens in member names used to work, and I was unhappy when 
> IBM tightened the validity check in the C/I.
>
They should have gone the other way and allowed quoting the member name.

-- 
gil

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Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: zOSMF

[Marna WALLE]

Hi Phil,
If you are not interested in looking at videos to see the flow in action, the 
complete documentation (with Helps you see on the display) are on IBM 
Documentation.  

The "Model" function can be found here:  
https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/2.5.0?topic=wizard-model-page 

-Marna WALLE
z/OS System Install and Upgrade
 IBM Poughkeepsie

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Re: SSRB/SSRX and LOCAL locks question

[Rob Scott]

Dave

The answer from a work colleague who knows a LOT about the dispatcher is :

"The answer is no. SRB scheduling/dispatching does not use the local lock 
unless the SRB requests the local lock on dispatch.  If so it is obtained (or 
suspended to wait for it) as the dispatch occurs."

Rob Scott
Rocket Software

From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
David Cole
Sent: 31 May 2023 11:01
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: SSRB/SSRX and LOCAL locks question

EXTERNAL EMAIL



I was enquiring specifically about SRBs, not RBs.

Dave Cole




At 5/31/2023 05:25 AM, Binyamin Dissen wrote:
>I don't see how that answers either question.
>The need for SUSPEND RB caller to be disabled is to allow the resume process
>to resume it. You cannot schedule the resume process until the suspend as
>otherwise the resume may try resuming before the suspend completes, causing
>the later suspend to never wake up. It works different than ECBs.
>On Wed, 31 May 2023 18:38:58 +1000 Attila Fogarasi 
>mailto:fogar...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>:>It's documented as needing either LOCAL or CML lock. See
>>:>https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/2.2.0?topic=processing-suspending-rb-until-event-completes-suspend
>>
>>:>
>>:>On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 6:20?PM Binyamin Dissen
>>mailto:bdis...@dissensoftware.com>>
>>:>wrote:
>>>:>
>>>:>> On Tue, 30 May 2023 16:42:00 -0400 David Cole
>>>mailto:dbc...@colesoft.com>> wrote:
>>>:>>
>>>:>> :>Does any know if suspended SRB control blocks (SSRB/SSRX) are
>>>:>> :>stabilized by holding the LOCAL lock? (I'm considering logic in
>>>:>> :>support of setting up TRAP2 debugging for SRBs.)
>>>:>>
>>>:>> I am also curious to know what "owner serialized" means.

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Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: zOSMF

[Steve Thompson]

This is why I like the way Linux handles things. I can have two 
different Linux installs, as along as I have two different 
partitions or disks on which to put those installs. And then the 
user data is off in /home which can be yet another single or 
group of partitions on one or more disks.


By doing this, this way, if I have a problem after maint, getting 
a level of Linux to start, I can reboot, and select the "old" 
install and come back up.


VM doing this kind of thing is wonderful. It makes for using VM 
to build a new VM, boot it as a second level machine to test 
it Now, if I were only a VM sysprog


Windows, I always have to make a full back up of the "user data 
area" and any third party software, to do an install, because M/S 
assumes they own the disk drive(s) -- well effectively from where 
I sit/stand. It makes it interesting to have a dual boot machine. 
First you install Windows, then you install Linux. Do it the 
other way and Linux is no longer bootable. Ah, then there is the 
"live" CD|DVD|thumb drive And one can recover that way as well.


So I hope IBM is looking more at the Linux world for how to do 
installs than Microsoft's way of doing things.


Steve Thompson

On 5/30/2023 4:58 PM, Phil Smith III wrote:

FWIW (perhaps nothing), IBM solved the upgrade problem ~30 years ago for VM by 
separating the operating system nucleus (kernel) from the filesystem. That is, 
you can have multiple copies of the VM nucleus on various CMS (the end-user 
environment) minidisks, which CP (the hypervisor) knows how to read. To 
upgrade, you build a new VM nucleus on a new minidisk, then tell the standalone 
loader to IPL from that. If it fails, you just swap it back and go figure out 
the problem. It's super-slick. Not realistic for z/OS, I suspect, though I 
don't know enough to know why. And it was done as sort of a skunkworks project 
by David Boloker and Rich Corak in what was left of the Cambridge Scientific 
Center, in offices above the Copley Place mall IIRC. I doubt anyone could get 
away with that today; even at the time, I was surprised it was accepted into 
the base.

  


Windows has gotten better about upgrading, although, like most of you, I rarely upgrade a machine-usually by 
the time I'm forced to consider a new version, it's time for new hardware. But Windows upgrade difficulties 
mostly reflect the fact that the data isn't well separated from the OS: I still have a folder on my current 
machine called "From", where  is the name of a machine four machines ago. This is itself a 
Bad Thing. Microsoft has tried, but then there's all the  under c:\users\phsiii\Documents\ that isn't MY 
data, and cannot just be copied to a new machine. They should have separated "user data" and 
"installed stuff data" better. (I suspect the Registry was supposed to be the end-all here, but of 
course isn't.)

  


It's fine for IBM to push toward a standardized layout. I don't think that's a bad thing at all, in 
principle-except for the existing shops who have zero time/resources/interest in "fixing" 
their configuration. Could all the PARMLIB stuff be pushed into one standard layout? Probably. 
Would it be easy? No, and it would make a lot of shops very nervous, I'm sure-"Yeah, Bob is 
the one who set that up before his heart attack, and nobody really knows the dependencies. I'm not 
touching it!" This isn't ideal, obviously, but it means that when an incremental change is 
needed, it can be made and tested in isolation, vs. some sort of big-bang reorg that's high-risk.

  


It still sounds to me like the real problem here is that there hasn't been enough thought 
put into the impact on existing customers from the changes to install/upgrade beyond 
"Use z/OSMF".

  


P.S. "Just watch this video"-sorry, that isn't how I (or, I suspect, many of 
the old-timers on here) do things. I don't have time to watch some video: I want a manual 
that explains the thing, so I can flip back and forth, add Post-Its, and/or copy/print 
excerpts. This is a growing trend that ignores that videos are a SLOW and inefficient way 
to learn many things; I attribute their rise to the fact that most people can't write a 
coherent sentence to save their lives, but they sure can talk.

  


...phsiii (sounding grumpy on a virtual Monday)


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Re: z/OSMF

[Schmutzok, Mike (US - Georgia)]

+1

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of VER 
Z038
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2023 8:14 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: z/OSMF

  ⚠ EXTERNAL MESSAGE – Think Before You Click



Why so much hate for z/OSMF? We sound like a bunch of grumpy old boomers 
resistant to change. 🙂

I always found ServerPac clunky and unnecessarily complicated. Longing for that 
is not a hill I would choose to die on. 🙂

I have been supporting a 4 LPAR organisation since 2018 using z/OSMF Software 
Management and I think it's OK. It has its quirks but so does anything. It 
suits how I like to work.

I like having an automated inventory of what I deployed where and when. I also 
like being able to model a new deployment on an old one so the bulk of 
definitions do not need to happen from scratch. I also like how the integrated 
workflow for a new software level forces you to eyeball and action anything 
that is needed for the upgrade.

Using z/OSMF Software Management does not mean you have to turn your brain off. 
You can still augment or change how things happen if you need to. Jobs are 
generated that you can look at before submission. Job output is captured so you 
can look at it after it executes.

In my 4 LPAR environment, when building a new SYSRES, I only use z/OSMF to 
construct the first system. After that I choose to ADRDSSU full dump restore it 
the other 3 LPARs because I think redoing the z/OSMF work is simply too tedious 
to be worth doing over and over. But that is OK. I am sure IBM will get there 
eventually fixing things that need fixing. That has been happening consistently 
throughout the life of z/OSMF from the early days where simply starting it 
would completely paralyse your system.

Neil.



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Re: z/OSMF

[Jack Zukt]

Hate? Hell, no. Just contempt for a poorly developed product that IBM
forces us to use.
It is true that IBM as an history of user unfriendly interfaces for using
its products. This one, on top of that, is also poorly designed which
results, as it is been said, on a ghastly performance.
Jack

On Wed, May 31, 2023, 01:15 VER Z038  wrote:

> Why so much hate for z/OSMF? We sound like a bunch of grumpy old boomers
> resistant to change. 🙂
>
> I always found ServerPac clunky and unnecessarily complicated. Longing for
> that is not a hill I would choose to die on. 🙂
>
> I have been supporting a 4 LPAR organisation since 2018 using z/OSMF
> Software Management and I think it's OK. It has its quirks but so does
> anything. It suits how I like to work.
>
> I like having an automated inventory of what I deployed where and when. I
> also like being able to model a new deployment on an old one so the bulk of
> definitions do not need to happen from scratch. I also like how the
> integrated workflow for a new software level forces you to eyeball and
> action anything that is needed for the upgrade.
>
> Using z/OSMF Software Management does not mean you have to turn your brain
> off. You can still augment or change how things happen if you need to. Jobs
> are generated that you can look at before submission. Job output is
> captured so you can look at it after it executes.
>
> In my 4 LPAR environment, when building a new SYSRES, I only use z/OSMF to
> construct the first system. After that I choose to ADRDSSU full dump
> restore it the other 3 LPARs because I think redoing the z/OSMF work is
> simply too tedious to be worth doing over and over. But that is OK. I am
> sure IBM will get there eventually fixing things that need fixing. That has
> been happening consistently throughout the life of z/OSMF from the early
> days where simply starting it would completely paralyse your system.
>
> Neil.
>
>
>
> --
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Re: z/OSMF

[Seymour J Metz]

There seems to be a lot of variability in who finds what intuitive. I recall a 
discussion about "for(;;;)", a construction in a language I hate, being hard, 
and I thought that it was perfectly clear. Other things that some found obvious 
seemed strange to me.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Roberto Halais [roberto.hal...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2023 7:52 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: z/OSMF

Panel options are not intuitive.

On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 7:42 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> TINW.
>
> Perhaps some are just resistant to change, but even those (hypothetical)
> people may have valid objections, e.g.,
>
> Performance
>
> Inadequate testing against a wide variety of installations
>
> Inadequate documentation and training
>
> Inadequate transition tools
>
> Inadequate transition period
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf
> of VER Z038 [ver.z...@outlook.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2023 8:14 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: z/OSMF
>
> Why so much hate for z/OSMF? We sound like a bunch of grumpy old boomers
> resistant to change. 🙂
>
> I always found ServerPac clunky and unnecessarily complicated. Longing for
> that is not a hill I would choose to die on. 🙂
>
> I have been supporting a 4 LPAR organisation since 2018 using z/OSMF
> Software Management and I think it's OK. It has its quirks but so does
> anything. It suits how I like to work.
>
> I like having an automated inventory of what I deployed where and when. I
> also like being able to model a new deployment on an old one so the bulk of
> definitions do not need to happen from scratch. I also like how the
> integrated workflow for a new software level forces you to eyeball and
> action anything that is needed for the upgrade.
>
> Using z/OSMF Software Management does not mean you have to turn your brain
> off. You can still augment or change how things happen if you need to. Jobs
> are generated that you can look at before submission. Job output is
> captured so you can look at it after it executes.
>
> In my 4 LPAR environment, when building a new SYSRES, I only use z/OSMF to
> construct the first system. After that I choose to ADRDSSU full dump
> restore it the other 3 LPARs because I think redoing the z/OSMF work is
> simply too tedious to be worth doing over and over. But that is OK. I am
> sure IBM will get there eventually fixing things that need fixing. That has
> been happening consistently throughout the life of z/OSMF from the early
> days where simply starting it would completely paralyse your system.
>
> Neil.
>
>
>
> --
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>
> --
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Re: Two related member generation questions

[Seymour J Metz]

Keep? Still? I don't recall saying it more than once.

I overlooked SCDS.

I don't recall leading braces or hyphens in qualifiers, but leading hyphens in 
member names used to work, and I was unhappy when IBM tightened the validity 
check in the C/I.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Jeremy Nicoll [jn.ls.mfrm...@letterboxes.org]
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2023 6:20 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Two related member generation questions

On Tue, 30 May 2023, at 21:41, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> SMP/E uses VSAM

I've no idea if that is or was correct

> and doesn't have the wonky member names of SMP through SMP4.

You keep saying this ... and you're still wrong.  I don't know why you're so
sure.  Maybe it's changed since then (sometime between 1985 and 2000
or so, I expect).

I only ever used SMP/E, and wonky member names did exist in one (at least)
of the PDSes it used to store stuff.   I seem to remember also that the PDS
I found them in had a vast number of members in it - can't recall just how
many that was though.

Last time we discussed this (around 09 APRIL this year) I guessed which PDS
it might have been - and was probably wrong.  Someone else said they
thought it was perhaps the SMPSCDS.


I've just run a search of my PC copies of some old mainframe notes, JCL
etc, looking for "SMPSCDS" and I found a reference to this exact issue
inside the transcript of a discussion I had with IBM support (from, I think,
the year 2000), when we were using  os390 2.6 ... though that's not the
os in which I first noticed the weird member names).


The discussion was on the wider issue of poor documentation of
just exactly which characters were valid in datasetnames.  For
example I'd found it was psossible to create dsnames with dashes
/ minus signs / hyphens in their qualifiers.

IBM said it was impossible.  It wasn't - I'd successfully created

   MYHLQ.TEST--

via ispf option 3.2  and also

   MYHLQ.TEST-

in JCL, without having single quotes around those dsnames.

Another character one could get into a qualifier was the left curly
bracket (of course those are in some SVC member names) and
perhaps the code that allowed those in ispf accidentally allowed
them in qualifiers as well.  I can't remember.

The conversation then moved on to implications of not being
able to SMS-manage datasets whose names didn't meet the
tighter rules that SMS used.

--
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

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Re: z/OSMF

[Roberto Halais]

Panel options are not intuitive.

On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 7:42 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> TINW.
>
> Perhaps some are just resistant to change, but even those (hypothetical)
> people may have valid objections, e.g.,
>
> Performance
>
> Inadequate testing against a wide variety of installations
>
> Inadequate documentation and training
>
> Inadequate transition tools
>
> Inadequate transition period
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf
> of VER Z038 [ver.z...@outlook.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2023 8:14 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: z/OSMF
>
> Why so much hate for z/OSMF? We sound like a bunch of grumpy old boomers
> resistant to change. 🙂
>
> I always found ServerPac clunky and unnecessarily complicated. Longing for
> that is not a hill I would choose to die on. 🙂
>
> I have been supporting a 4 LPAR organisation since 2018 using z/OSMF
> Software Management and I think it's OK. It has its quirks but so does
> anything. It suits how I like to work.
>
> I like having an automated inventory of what I deployed where and when. I
> also like being able to model a new deployment on an old one so the bulk of
> definitions do not need to happen from scratch. I also like how the
> integrated workflow for a new software level forces you to eyeball and
> action anything that is needed for the upgrade.
>
> Using z/OSMF Software Management does not mean you have to turn your brain
> off. You can still augment or change how things happen if you need to. Jobs
> are generated that you can look at before submission. Job output is
> captured so you can look at it after it executes.
>
> In my 4 LPAR environment, when building a new SYSRES, I only use z/OSMF to
> construct the first system. After that I choose to ADRDSSU full dump
> restore it the other 3 LPARs because I think redoing the z/OSMF work is
> simply too tedious to be worth doing over and over. But that is OK. I am
> sure IBM will get there eventually fixing things that need fixing. That has
> been happening consistently throughout the life of z/OSMF from the early
> days where simply starting it would completely paralyse your system.
>
> Neil.
>
>
>
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Re: z/OSMF

[Seymour J Metz]

TINW.

Perhaps some are just resistant to change, but even those (hypothetical) people 
may have valid objections, e.g.,

Performance

Inadequate testing against a wide variety of installations

Inadequate documentation and training

Inadequate transition tools

Inadequate transition period


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of VER 
Z038 [ver.z...@outlook.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2023 8:14 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: z/OSMF

Why so much hate for z/OSMF? We sound like a bunch of grumpy old boomers 
resistant to change. 🙂

I always found ServerPac clunky and unnecessarily complicated. Longing for that 
is not a hill I would choose to die on. 🙂

I have been supporting a 4 LPAR organisation since 2018 using z/OSMF Software 
Management and I think it's OK. It has its quirks but so does anything. It 
suits how I like to work.

I like having an automated inventory of what I deployed where and when. I also 
like being able to model a new deployment on an old one so the bulk of 
definitions do not need to happen from scratch. I also like how the integrated 
workflow for a new software level forces you to eyeball and action anything 
that is needed for the upgrade.

Using z/OSMF Software Management does not mean you have to turn your brain off. 
You can still augment or change how things happen if you need to. Jobs are 
generated that you can look at before submission. Job output is captured so you 
can look at it after it executes.

In my 4 LPAR environment, when building a new SYSRES, I only use z/OSMF to 
construct the first system. After that I choose to ADRDSSU full dump restore it 
the other 3 LPARs because I think redoing the z/OSMF work is simply too tedious 
to be worth doing over and over. But that is OK. I am sure IBM will get there 
eventually fixing things that need fixing. That has been happening consistently 
throughout the life of z/OSMF from the early days where simply starting it 
would completely paralyse your system.

Neil.



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Re: Two related member generation questions

[David Spiegel]

Hi Jeremy,
"...I've no idea if that is or was correct ..."
Have you ever heard of the CSI (Consolidated  Software Inventory)?
This/these VSAM Dataset(s) has/have been part of SMP/e since the day it 
came out in the '80s.


Regards,
David

On 2023-05-30 18:20, Jeremy Nicoll wrote:

On Tue, 30 May 2023, at 21:41, Seymour J Metz wrote:

SMP/E uses VSAM

I've no idea if that is or was correct


and doesn't have the wonky member names of SMP through SMP4.

You keep saying this ... and you're still wrong.  I don't know why you're so
sure.  Maybe it's changed since then (sometime between 1985 and 2000
or so, I expect).

I only ever used SMP/E, and wonky member names did exist in one (at least)
of the PDSes it used to store stuff.   I seem to remember also that the PDS
I found them in had a vast number of members in it - can't recall just how
many that was though.

Last time we discussed this (around 09 APRIL this year) I guessed which PDS
it might have been - and was probably wrong.  Someone else said they
thought it was perhaps the SMPSCDS.


I've just run a search of my PC copies of some old mainframe notes, JCL
etc, looking for "SMPSCDS" and I found a reference to this exact issue
inside the transcript of a discussion I had with IBM support (from, I think,
the year 2000), when we were using  os390 2.6 ... though that's not the
os in which I first noticed the weird member names).


The discussion was on the wider issue of poor documentation of
just exactly which characters were valid in datasetnames.  For
example I'd found it was psossible to create dsnames with dashes
/ minus signs / hyphens in their qualifiers.

IBM said it was impossible.  It wasn't - I'd successfully created

MYHLQ.TEST--

via ispf option 3.2  and also

MYHLQ.TEST-

in JCL, without having single quotes around those dsnames.

Another character one could get into a qualifier was the left curly
bracket (of course those are in some SVC member names) and
perhaps the code that allowed those in ispf accidentally allowed
them in qualifiers as well.  I can't remember.

The conversation then moved on to implications of not being
able to SMS-manage datasets whose names didn't meet the
tighter rules that SMS used.



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Re: SSRB/SSRX and LOCAL locks question

[David Cole]

I was enquiring specifically about SRBs, not RBs.

Dave Cole




At 5/31/2023 05:25 AM, Binyamin Dissen wrote:

I don't see how that answers either question.
The need for SUSPEND RB caller to be disabled is to allow the resume process
to resume it. You cannot schedule the resume process until the suspend as
otherwise the resume may try resuming before the suspend completes, causing
the later suspend  to never wake up. It works different than ECBs.
On Wed, 31 May 2023 18:38:58 +1000 Attila Fogarasi  wrote:

:>It's documented as needing either LOCAL or CML lock.  See
:>https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/2.2.0?topic=processing-suspending-rb-until-event-completes-suspend 


:>
:>On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 6:20?PM Binyamin Dissen 


:>wrote:

:>
:>> On Tue, 30 May 2023 16:42:00 -0400 David Cole 
 wrote:

:>>
:>> :>Does any know if suspended SRB control blocks (SSRB/SSRX) are
:>> :>stabilized by holding the LOCAL lock? (I'm considering logic in
:>> :>support of setting up TRAP2 debugging for SRBs.)
:>>
:>> I am also curious to know what "owner serialized" means.


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Re: SSRB/SSRX and LOCAL locks question

[Binyamin Dissen]

I don't see how that answers either question. 

The need for SUSPEND RB caller to be disabled is to allow the resume process
to resume it. You cannot schedule the resume process until the suspend as
otherwise the resume may try resuming before the suspend completes, causing
the later suspend  to never wake up. It works different than ECBs.

On Wed, 31 May 2023 18:38:58 +1000 Attila Fogarasi  wrote:

:>It's documented as needing either LOCAL or CML lock.  See
:>https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/2.2.0?topic=processing-suspending-rb-until-event-completes-suspend
:>
:>On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 6:20?PM Binyamin Dissen 
:>wrote:
:>
:>> On Tue, 30 May 2023 16:42:00 -0400 David Cole  wrote:
:>>
:>> :>Does any know if suspended SRB control blocks (SSRB/SSRX) are
:>> :>stabilized by holding the LOCAL lock? (I'm considering logic in
:>> :>support of setting up TRAP2 debugging for SRBs.)
:>>
:>> I am also curious to know what "owner serialized" means.

--
Binyamin Dissen 
http://www.dissensoftware.com

Director, Dissen Software, Bar & Grill - Israel

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Re: Searching for a process to clean my VTS

[kekronbekron]

That's good news then.
The tapetool I linked to earlier should have everything you need.

- KB

--- Original Message ---
On Tuesday, May 30th, 2023 at 11:07 PM, Tom Longfellow 
<03e29b607131-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:


> Yes I have the list -- I know them by naming standard and I can do a Virtual 
> Volume Search to the Cluster and get a downloadable list of volume names and 
> their current category status. I already have a REXX roughed out that 
> generates the command I think I need. But I really need to find the set of 
> actions that have be performed so I can generate all the commands I need. 
> Along with RMM/IDCAMS/LI requests to kill these zombies for good and eject 
> them from my life.
> 
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Re: SSRB/SSRX and LOCAL locks question

[Attila Fogarasi]

It's documented as needing either LOCAL or CML lock.  See
https://www.ibm.com/docs/en/zos/2.2.0?topic=processing-suspending-rb-until-event-completes-suspend

On Wed, May 31, 2023 at 6:20 PM Binyamin Dissen 
wrote:

> On Tue, 30 May 2023 16:42:00 -0400 David Cole  wrote:
>
> :>Does any know if suspended SRB control blocks (SSRB/SSRX) are
> :>stabilized by holding the LOCAL lock? (I'm considering logic in
> :>support of setting up TRAP2 debugging for SRBs.)
>
> I am also curious to know what "owner serialized" means.
>
> --
> Binyamin Dissen 
> http://www.dissensoftware.com
>
> Director, Dissen Software, Bar & Grill - Israel
>
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Re: SSRB/SSRX and LOCAL locks question

[Binyamin Dissen]

On Tue, 30 May 2023 16:42:00 -0400 David Cole  wrote:

:>Does any know if suspended SRB control blocks (SSRB/SSRX) are 
:>stabilized by holding the LOCAL lock? (I'm considering logic in 
:>support of setting up TRAP2 debugging for SRBs.)

I am also curious to know what "owner serialized" means.

--
Binyamin Dissen 
http://www.dissensoftware.com

Director, Dissen Software, Bar & Grill - Israel

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