Re: Computers

2022-12-11 Thread Seymour J Metz 
Yes, but you needed 5199-ARG, RPQ EG4653 to run 3330-11 and 3350 native.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of Joe 
Monk [joemon...@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 6:01 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Not true.

The 3350 could run in 3330 compatibility mode and could be used with OS/360.

Joe

On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 3:45 PM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> Yes, but not OS/360.
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf
> of David Spiegel <0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 3:23 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Computers
>
> Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
> I'm pretty sure that I ran IEHDASDR (OS/VS2 V3.8) to Back Up 3350s.
>
> Regards,
> David
>
> On 2022-12-11 15:17, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> > That may have been OS/VS only; I vaguely recall a PRPQ to add 3350
> support to OS/360.
> >
> > 
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on
> behalf of David Spiegel <0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> > Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 3:02 PM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: Computers
> >
> > Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
> > IIRC, IEHDASDR supported 3350.
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> > David
> >
> > On 2022-12-11 11:52, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> >> IEHDASDR was part of OS/360, OS/VS1 and OS/vs2, and continued to exist
> in MVS for lo these many releases. However, Direct Access Storage Dump
> Restore (DASDR), 5740-UT1, is a separate program, with a separate dump
> format, and was never part of any of them; you had to order and install it
> separately. Oh, the DASDR dump format was also not compatible with DF/DSS,
> 5740-UT3.
> >>
> >> As I recall, IEHDASDR did not support 3350, much less 3375, 3380 or
> 3390.
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> >>
> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7C290ad88fee1e4e0ff85208dadbcbafde%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638063965122880420%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=ZXVqlfLo%2BF3rTI17oSK3eH5YauMiwXrhCPb8mKgx%2FnM%3Dreserved=0
> >>
> >> ____
> >> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on
> behalf of David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
> >> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2022 1:53 PM
> >> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> >> Subject: Re: Computers
> >>
> >> IEHDASDR  was part of MVT (early '70s)
> >> DF/DSS came much later (maybe 10 years?)
> >>
> >> On 2022-12-09 13:12, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> >>> I believe that DASDR and DF/DSS came later.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> >>>
> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7C290ad88fee1e4e0ff85208dadbcbafde%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638063965122880420%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=ZXVqlfLo%2BF3rTI17oSK3eH5YauMiwXrhCPb8mKgx%2FnM%3Dreserved=0
> >>>
> >>> 
> >>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on
> behalf of Steve Beaver [st...@stevebeaver.com]
> >>> Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 7:29 AM
> >>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> >>> Subject: Re: Computers
> >>>
> >>> DSS.  Data Set Services
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>
> >>> No one said I could type with one thumb
> >>>
> >>>> On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?
> >>>>
> >>>>> On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz 
> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with
> prerequisite
> >>>>> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable
> units.
> >>>>> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
> >>>>>
> >>&

Re: Computers

2022-12-11 Thread Joe Monk 
Not true.

The 3350 could run in 3330 compatibility mode and could be used with OS/360.

Joe

On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 3:45 PM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> Yes, but not OS/360.
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf
> of David Spiegel <0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 3:23 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Computers
>
> Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
> I'm pretty sure that I ran IEHDASDR (OS/VS2 V3.8) to Back Up 3350s.
>
> Regards,
> David
>
> On 2022-12-11 15:17, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> > That may have been OS/VS only; I vaguely recall a PRPQ to add 3350
> support to OS/360.
> >
> > 
> > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on
> behalf of David Spiegel <0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> > Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 3:02 PM
> > To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: Computers
> >
> > Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
> > IIRC, IEHDASDR supported 3350.
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> > David
> >
> > On 2022-12-11 11:52, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> >> IEHDASDR was part of OS/360, OS/VS1 and OS/vs2, and continued to exist
> in MVS for lo these many releases. However, Direct Access Storage Dump
> Restore (DASDR), 5740-UT1, is a separate program, with a separate dump
> format, and was never part of any of them; you had to order and install it
> separately. Oh, the DASDR dump format was also not compatible with DF/DSS,
> 5740-UT3.
> >>
> >> As I recall, IEHDASDR did not support 3350, much less 3375, 3380 or
> 3390.
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> >>
> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7C85e25f6376b744e0cd3108dadbb5a0cb%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638063870375757633%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=f%2FhyR4crGpC8dHoKJrnfbQymUN0YRTjDxvQ6pag9jxI%3Dreserved=0
> >>
> >> ____
> >> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on
> behalf of David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
> >> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2022 1:53 PM
> >> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> >> Subject: Re: Computers
> >>
> >> IEHDASDR  was part of MVT (early '70s)
> >> DF/DSS came much later (maybe 10 years?)
> >>
> >> On 2022-12-09 13:12, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> >>> I believe that DASDR and DF/DSS came later.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> >>>
> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7C85e25f6376b744e0cd3108dadbb5a0cb%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638063870375757633%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=f%2FhyR4crGpC8dHoKJrnfbQymUN0YRTjDxvQ6pag9jxI%3Dreserved=0
> >>>
> >>> 
> >>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on
> behalf of Steve Beaver [st...@stevebeaver.com]
> >>> Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 7:29 AM
> >>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> >>> Subject: Re: Computers
> >>>
> >>> DSS.  Data Set Services
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>
> >>> No one said I could type with one thumb
> >>>
> >>>> On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?
> >>>>
> >>>>> On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz 
> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with
> prerequisite
> >>>>> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable
> units.
> >>>>> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
> >>>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> >>>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO
> IBM-MAIN
> >>> --

Re: Computers

2022-12-11 Thread Seymour J Metz 
Yes, but not OS/360.


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
David Spiegel <0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 3:23 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
I'm pretty sure that I ran IEHDASDR (OS/VS2 V3.8) to Back Up 3350s.

Regards,
David

On 2022-12-11 15:17, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> That may have been OS/VS only; I vaguely recall a PRPQ to add 3350 support to 
> OS/360.
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
> David Spiegel <0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
> Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 3:02 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Computers
>
> Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
> IIRC, IEHDASDR supported 3350.
>
>
> Regards,
> David
>
> On 2022-12-11 11:52, Seymour J Metz wrote:
>> IEHDASDR was part of OS/360, OS/VS1 and OS/vs2, and continued to exist in 
>> MVS for lo these many releases. However, Direct Access Storage Dump Restore 
>> (DASDR), 5740-UT1, is a separate program, with a separate dump format, and 
>> was never part of any of them; you had to order and install it separately. 
>> Oh, the DASDR dump format was also not compatible with DF/DSS, 5740-UT3.
>>
>> As I recall, IEHDASDR did not support 3350, much less 3375, 3380 or 3390.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
>> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7C85e25f6376b744e0cd3108dadbb5a0cb%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638063870375757633%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=f%2FhyR4crGpC8dHoKJrnfbQymUN0YRTjDxvQ6pag9jxI%3Dreserved=0
>>
>> 
>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
>> David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
>> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2022 1:53 PM
>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>> Subject: Re: Computers
>>
>> IEHDASDR  was part of MVT (early '70s)
>> DF/DSS came much later (maybe 10 years?)
>>
>> On 2022-12-09 13:12, Seymour J Metz wrote:
>>> I believe that DASDR and DF/DSS came later.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
>>> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7C85e25f6376b744e0cd3108dadbb5a0cb%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638063870375757633%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=f%2FhyR4crGpC8dHoKJrnfbQymUN0YRTjDxvQ6pag9jxI%3Dreserved=0
>>>
>>> 
>>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
>>> Steve Beaver [st...@stevebeaver.com]
>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 7:29 AM
>>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>>> Subject: Re: Computers
>>>
>>> DSS.  Data Set Services
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> No one said I could type with one thumb
>>>
>>>> On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?
>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
>>>>> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units.
>>>>> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>>>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>>> --
>>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>> --
>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>> s

Re: Computers

2022-12-11 Thread David Spiegel 

Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
I'm pretty sure that I ran IEHDASDR (OS/VS2 V3.8) to Back Up 3350s.

Regards,
David

On 2022-12-11 15:17, Seymour J Metz wrote:

That may have been OS/VS only; I vaguely recall a PRPQ to add 3350 support to 
OS/360.


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of David 
Spiegel <0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 3:02 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
IIRC, IEHDASDR supported 3350.


Regards,
David

On 2022-12-11 11:52, Seymour J Metz wrote:

IEHDASDR was part of OS/360, OS/VS1 and OS/vs2, and continued to exist in MVS 
for lo these many releases. However, Direct Access Storage Dump Restore 
(DASDR), 5740-UT1, is a separate program, with a separate dump format, and was 
never part of any of them; you had to order and install it separately. Oh, the 
DASDR dump format was also not compatible with DF/DSS, 5740-UT3.

As I recall, IEHDASDR did not support 3350, much less 3375, 3380 or 3390.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7C%7Ca055fa229dd641498d0e08dadbb4d6a3%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638063867025469145%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=1sWk1kyDVsD9uAkVoa8%2FIDkbp9o5EnEYsGE0%2BIKi93c%3Dreserved=0


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2022 1:53 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

IEHDASDR  was part of MVT (early '70s)
DF/DSS came much later (maybe 10 years?)

On 2022-12-09 13:12, Seymour J Metz wrote:

I believe that DASDR and DF/DSS came later.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7C%7Ca055fa229dd641498d0e08dadbb4d6a3%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638063867025469145%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=1sWk1kyDVsD9uAkVoa8%2FIDkbp9o5EnEYsGE0%2BIKi93c%3Dreserved=0


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Steve Beaver [st...@stevebeaver.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 7:29 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

DSS.  Data Set Services

Sent from my iPhone

No one said I could type with one thumb


On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:

OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?


On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units.
In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-11 Thread Seymour J Metz 
That may have been OS/VS only; I vaguely recall a PRPQ to add 3350 support to 
OS/360.


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of 
David Spiegel <0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu>
Sent: Sunday, December 11, 2022 3:02 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
IIRC, IEHDASDR supported 3350.


Regards,
David

On 2022-12-11 11:52, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> IEHDASDR was part of OS/360, OS/VS1 and OS/vs2, and continued to exist in MVS 
> for lo these many releases. However, Direct Access Storage Dump Restore 
> (DASDR), 5740-UT1, is a separate program, with a separate dump format, and 
> was never part of any of them; you had to order and install it separately. 
> Oh, the DASDR dump format was also not compatible with DF/DSS, 5740-UT3.
>
> As I recall, IEHDASDR did not support 3350, much less 3375, 3380 or 3390.
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7Ccd2cd56a4d784b2f56fe08dadbb2a7e7%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638063857620845610%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=sS%2Bw863wRTtsRvuRCy%2BWWxiB%2FPb%2BNjBXAIVJNlT63b4%3Dreserved=0
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
> David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2022 1:53 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Computers
>
> IEHDASDR  was part of MVT (early '70s)
> DF/DSS came much later (maybe 10 years?)
>
> On 2022-12-09 13:12, Seymour J Metz wrote:
>> I believe that DASDR and DF/DSS came later.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
>> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7Ccd2cd56a4d784b2f56fe08dadbb2a7e7%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638063857620845610%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=sS%2Bw863wRTtsRvuRCy%2BWWxiB%2FPb%2BNjBXAIVJNlT63b4%3Dreserved=0
>>
>> 
>> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
>> Steve Beaver [st...@stevebeaver.com]
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 7:29 AM
>> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
>> Subject: Re: Computers
>>
>> DSS.  Data Set Services
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> No one said I could type with one thumb
>>
>>> On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:
>>>
>>> OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?
>>>
>>>> On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
>>>> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units.
>>>> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
>>>>
>>> --
>>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>> --
>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>>
>>
>> --
>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-11 Thread David Spiegel 

Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
IIRC, IEHDASDR supported 3350.


Regards,
David

On 2022-12-11 11:52, Seymour J Metz wrote:

IEHDASDR was part of OS/360, OS/VS1 and OS/vs2, and continued to exist in MVS 
for lo these many releases. However, Direct Access Storage Dump Restore 
(DASDR), 5740-UT1, is a separate program, with a separate dump format, and was 
never part of any of them; you had to order and install it separately. Oh, the 
DASDR dump format was also not compatible with DF/DSS, 5740-UT3.

As I recall, IEHDASDR did not support 3350, much less 3375, 3380 or 3390.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7C%7C1333030bcaf449510e0908dadb982a27%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638063743923927464%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=ElFsy5cZk%2FxPN1iM1nnt1kUa0TMCIJnsNiZ3z2e%2FRLc%3Dreserved=0


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2022 1:53 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

IEHDASDR  was part of MVT (early '70s)
DF/DSS came much later (maybe 10 years?)

On 2022-12-09 13:12, Seymour J Metz wrote:

I believe that DASDR and DF/DSS came later.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7C%7C1333030bcaf449510e0908dadb982a27%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638063743923927464%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=ElFsy5cZk%2FxPN1iM1nnt1kUa0TMCIJnsNiZ3z2e%2FRLc%3Dreserved=0


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Steve Beaver [st...@stevebeaver.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 7:29 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

DSS.  Data Set Services

Sent from my iPhone

No one said I could type with one thumb


On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:

OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?


On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units.
In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-11 Thread Seymour J Metz 
IEHDASDR was part of OS/360, OS/VS1 and OS/vs2, and continued to exist in MVS 
for lo these many releases. However, Direct Access Storage Dump Restore 
(DASDR), 5740-UT1, is a separate program, with a separate dump format, and was 
never part of any of them; you had to order and install it separately. Oh, the 
DASDR dump format was also not compatible with DF/DSS, 5740-UT3.

As I recall, IEHDASDR did not support 3350, much less 3375, 3380 or 3390.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2022 1:53 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

IEHDASDR  was part of MVT (early '70s)
DF/DSS came much later (maybe 10 years?)

On 2022-12-09 13:12, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> I believe that DASDR and DF/DSS came later.
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7C17f86b4525594526ceb308dada184c87%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638062095144195930%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=AXwPlpH%2Fh7sp6wPf3qIpvJFAeipmfkiieDHS8ai8rKw%3Dreserved=0
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
> Steve Beaver [st...@stevebeaver.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 7:29 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Computers
>
> DSS.  Data Set Services
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> No one said I could type with one thumb
>
>> On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:
>>
>> OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?
>>
>>> On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:
>>>
>>> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
>>> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units.
>>> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
>>>
>> --
>> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
>> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-09 Thread David Spiegel 

IEHDASDR  was part of MVT (early '70s)
DF/DSS came much later (maybe 10 years?)

On 2022-12-09 13:12, Seymour J Metz wrote:

I believe that DASDR and DF/DSS came later.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7C%7C2c67cceb01da40ec9b3608dada11035b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638062063891207781%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=9RlaJntw%2F8uaYM%2BaU%2B4%2Fz4XSZAoCzmm3k%2F01no1U7cI%3Dreserved=0


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Steve Beaver [st...@stevebeaver.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 7:29 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

DSS.  Data Set Services

Sent from my iPhone

No one said I could type with one thumb


On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:

OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?


On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units.
In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-09 Thread Seymour J Metz 
I believe that DASDR and DF/DSS came later.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Steve Beaver [st...@stevebeaver.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 7:29 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

DSS.  Data Set Services

Sent from my iPhone

No one said I could type with one thumb

> On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:
>
> OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?
>
>> On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:
>>
>> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
>> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units.
>> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
>>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-07 Thread Seymour J Metz 
Dynamic Support System was a debugging facility in OS/VS1 and OS/VS2, roughly 
equivalent to Time Sharing Support System in TSS/360.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of Jay 
Maynard [jaymayn...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 7:21 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?

On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units.
> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
>

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-07 Thread Seymour J Metz 
See OS/VS Dynamic Support System, GC28·0640·1,, at 
<http://bitsavers.org/pdf/ibm/370/OS_VS2/Release_2_1973/GC28-0640-1_OS_VS_Dynamic_Support_System_Nov73.pdf>.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 8:59 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
You said: "...In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS ..."
What is DSS?

Thanks and regards,
David

On 2022-12-06 07:09, Seymour J Metz wrote:
> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite 
> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units. In 
> each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7C301f2c3e9f504ddbfe7208dad7924531%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638059320483740875%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=lWeMXfR4rQQuwzckpV%2FAQfgC1JOUCbp4WbkXngZwgoI%3Dreserved=0
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
> Lennie Dymoke-Bradshaw [032fff1be9b4-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
> Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 12:35 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Computers
>
> My recollection is that it didn't really become a viable alternative to SVS
> until MVS 3.7. Soon after was MVS 3.8 and then IBM embarked on a series of
> other versions and designations, starting, I think, with MVS SE1 later
> renamed to MVS SE1.1
> Lennie
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of
> Seymour J Metz
> Sent: 02 December 2022 16:13
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Computers
>
> Presumably OS/VS2 Release 3, the second release of MVS. The MVS releases of
> OS/VS2 ran from 2.0 to 3.8, with a bunch of optional selectable units ("By
> the pricking of my thumb, SU 7 this way comes.")
>
>
> --
> Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7C301f2c3e9f504ddbfe7208dad7924531%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638059320483740875%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=lWeMXfR4rQQuwzckpV%2FAQfgC1JOUCbp4WbkXngZwgoI%3Dreserved=0
>
> 
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of
> David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
> Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 6:41 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Computers
>
> Hi Leonard,
> You said: "... That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.
> ..."
> Is "MVS 3.0" a typo? (I do not recall ever hearing of MVS 3.0.)
>
> Thanks and regards,
> David
>
> On 2022-12-02 02:15, Leonard D Woren wrote:
>> Bill Hitefield wrote on 11/30/2022 10:39 AM:
>>> In college we had an IBM 1130 in the computer lab. Those of us
>>> working in the lab discovered an AM radio placed near the console
>>> switches made odd noises when you ran Fortran programs and set the
>>> radio to a specific "station". Further investigation revealed you
>>> could change the tone of the noise by using the "e to the x" function
>>> and varying the value of "x". Our goal in life then became to play
>>> "Smoke on the Water" using that radio. The temp wasn't too great, but
>>> you could recognize the main riff!
>>>
>>> Bill Hitefield
>>> Dino-Software Corporation
>>> 800.480.DINO
>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fnam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com%2F%3Furl%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwwwdata=05%7C01%7C%7C3392b0d0fe484e083d8808dad782c4c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638059253959233527%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=ErK22TngXUwD4FCieY5diPOjuBvhCa0jWvIWy0E7wK0%3Dreserved=0.
>>> dino-software.com%2Fdata=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7Cdee8b1d5fb
>>> 404060d1ff08dad45a3d7e%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C6
>>> 38055781337271398%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjo
>>> iV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=5V

Re: Computers

2022-12-07 Thread Seymour J Metz 
To clarify further,after SU7 killed DSS, SHARE passed a requirement to continue 
support of DSS and the massive change required to do so turned out to be one 
line of code. All seemed well until MVS/SE R2, when a prerequisite SU again 
killed DSS, but that time IBM refused to budge.

Yes, DSS was also available on OS/VS1 and SVS.

This fiasco was the reason for my paraphrase from the Scottish Play.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Tony Harminc [t...@harminc.net]
Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2022 9:11 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

On Tue, 6 Dec 2022 at 07:30, Steve Beaver  wrote:

> DSS.  Data Set Services
>

Presumably he doesn't mean *that* DSS. Dynamic Support System was an OS/VS
standalone debugger that allowed setting breakpoints, displaying storage,
and so on, including in dodgy places like SVC routines and interrupt
handlers. While using its console command interface the entire OS was
suspended.

IIRC DSS came along with SVS and VS1, and was continued into MVS, but not
for long. To invoke it you'd set a magic byte in low storage, and then hit
the Restart key. Of course people wrote little started tasks that would set
the byte and fake the Restart interrupt to make it easier to use.

Tony H.

> On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:
> >
> > OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?
> >
> >> On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:
> >>
> >> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
> >> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable
> units.
> >> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
>

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-06 Thread Tony Harminc 
On Tue, 6 Dec 2022 at 07:30, Steve Beaver  wrote:

> DSS.  Data Set Services
>

Presumably he doesn't mean *that* DSS. Dynamic Support System was an OS/VS
standalone debugger that allowed setting breakpoints, displaying storage,
and so on, including in dodgy places like SVC routines and interrupt
handlers. While using its console command interface the entire OS was
suspended.

IIRC DSS came along with SVS and VS1, and was continued into MVS, but not
for long. To invoke it you'd set a magic byte in low storage, and then hit
the Restart key. Of course people wrote little started tasks that would set
the byte and fake the Restart interrupt to make it easier to use.

Tony H.

> On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:
> >
> > OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?
> >
> >> On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:
> >>
> >> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
> >> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable
> units.
> >> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
>

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-06 Thread David Spiegel 

Hi R'Shmuel AMV"SH,
You said: "...In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS ..."
What is DSS?

Thanks and regards,
David

On 2022-12-06 07:09, Seymour J Metz wrote:

MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite 
selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units. In 
each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7C%7C3392b0d0fe484e083d8808dad782c4c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638059253959233527%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=teLk2nuJDhYaKsIFnuMMnfCTpeznjEMdH5cYzKFB1FQ%3Dreserved=0


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Lennie Dymoke-Bradshaw [032fff1be9b4-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 12:35 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

My recollection is that it didn't really become a viable alternative to SVS
until MVS 3.7. Soon after was MVS 3.8 and then IBM embarked on a series of
other versions and designations, starting, I think, with MVS SE1 later
renamed to MVS SE1.1
Lennie

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of
Seymour J Metz
Sent: 02 December 2022 16:13
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Presumably OS/VS2 Release 3, the second release of MVS. The MVS releases of
OS/VS2 ran from 2.0 to 3.8, with a bunch of optional selectable units ("By
the pricking of my thumb, SU 7 this way comes.")


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmason.gmu.edu%2F~smetz3data=05%7C01%7C%7C3392b0d0fe484e083d8808dad782c4c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638059253959233527%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=teLk2nuJDhYaKsIFnuMMnfCTpeznjEMdH5cYzKFB1FQ%3Dreserved=0


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of
David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 6:41 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Hi Leonard,
You said: "... That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.
..."
Is "MVS 3.0" a typo? (I do not recall ever hearing of MVS 3.0.)

Thanks and regards,
David

On 2022-12-02 02:15, Leonard D Woren wrote:

Bill Hitefield wrote on 11/30/2022 10:39 AM:

In college we had an IBM 1130 in the computer lab. Those of us
working in the lab discovered an AM radio placed near the console
switches made odd noises when you ran Fortran programs and set the
radio to a specific "station". Further investigation revealed you
could change the tone of the noise by using the "e to the x" function
and varying the value of "x". Our goal in life then became to play
"Smoke on the Water" using that radio. The temp wasn't too great, but
you could recognize the main riff!

Bill Hitefield
Dino-Software Corporation
800.480.DINO
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fnam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com%2F%3Furl%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwwwdata=05%7C01%7C%7C3392b0d0fe484e083d8808dad782c4c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638059253959233527%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=ErK22TngXUwD4FCieY5diPOjuBvhCa0jWvIWy0E7wK0%3Dreserved=0.
dino-software.com%2Fdata=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7Cdee8b1d5fb
404060d1ff08dad45a3d7e%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C6
38055781337271398%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjo
iV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=5V1
okCO5Sk%2BgqFt9zdA1nb32gMtrWUmTxIJQrHQmq8w%3Dreserved=0



I don't remember it very well, but I think the same could be done to
some extent on some 360 models.

In the mid-1970s, a college friend had a job as an off-hours computer
operator at RAND (amusingly, where that 1970 film was made).  He
wrote, and a musical friend tuned, a program which played music on a
2400 series tape drive by writing various length blocks -- the shorter
the repeated block, the higher the note.  I think one of their 2 songs
was Puff the Magic Dragon.  It was just hilarious to hear recognizable
music from a tape drive.  The program wore out tapes pretty quickly
though because all those short blocks were tough on the tape.  One
long channel program IIRC to keep the music from pausing when a
different job was dispatched.

Footnote:  That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.
It was the first time that I saw MVS with lots of new stuff compared
to MVT 21.  But no TSO -- they ran Wylbur.


/Leonard


--

Re: Computers

2022-12-06 Thread Steve Beaver 
DSS.  Data Set Services 

Sent from my iPhone

No one said I could type with one thumb 

> On Dec 6, 2022, at 06:21, Jay Maynard  wrote:
> 
> OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?
> 
>> On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:
>> 
>> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
>> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units.
>> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
>> 
> 
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-06 Thread Jay Maynard 
OK, this is a new one on me. What's DSS?

On Tue, Dec 6, 2022 at 6:09 AM Seymour J Metz  wrote:

> MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite
> selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units.
> In each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE
>

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-06 Thread Seymour J Metz 
MVS/SE installed on an OS/VS2 base; for R1 it was 3.7 with prerequisite 
selectable units and for R2 it was 3.8 with prerequisite selectable units. In 
each case a prerequisite SU killed DSS. MVS/SP replaced MVS/SE


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Lennie Dymoke-Bradshaw [032fff1be9b4-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 12:35 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

My recollection is that it didn't really become a viable alternative to SVS
until MVS 3.7. Soon after was MVS 3.8 and then IBM embarked on a series of
other versions and designations, starting, I think, with MVS SE1 later
renamed to MVS SE1.1
Lennie

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of
Seymour J Metz
Sent: 02 December 2022 16:13
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Presumably OS/VS2 Release 3, the second release of MVS. The MVS releases of
OS/VS2 ran from 2.0 to 3.8, with a bunch of optional selectable units ("By
the pricking of my thumb, SU 7 this way comes.")


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of
David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 6:41 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Hi Leonard,
You said: "... That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.
..."
Is "MVS 3.0" a typo? (I do not recall ever hearing of MVS 3.0.)

Thanks and regards,
David

On 2022-12-02 02:15, Leonard D Woren wrote:
> Bill Hitefield wrote on 11/30/2022 10:39 AM:
>> In college we had an IBM 1130 in the computer lab. Those of us
>> working in the lab discovered an AM radio placed near the console
>> switches made odd noises when you ran Fortran programs and set the
>> radio to a specific "station". Further investigation revealed you
>> could change the tone of the noise by using the "e to the x" function
>> and varying the value of "x". Our goal in life then became to play
>> "Smoke on the Water" using that radio. The temp wasn't too great, but
>> you could recognize the main riff!
>>
>> Bill Hitefield
>> Dino-Software Corporation
>> 800.480.DINO
>> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.
>> dino-software.com%2Fdata=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7Cdee8b1d5fb
>> 404060d1ff08dad45a3d7e%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C6
>> 38055781337271398%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjo
>> iV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=5V1
>> okCO5Sk%2BgqFt9zdA1nb32gMtrWUmTxIJQrHQmq8w%3Dreserved=0
>>
>>
>
> I don't remember it very well, but I think the same could be done to
> some extent on some 360 models.
>
> In the mid-1970s, a college friend had a job as an off-hours computer
> operator at RAND (amusingly, where that 1970 film was made).  He
> wrote, and a musical friend tuned, a program which played music on a
> 2400 series tape drive by writing various length blocks -- the shorter
> the repeated block, the higher the note.  I think one of their 2 songs
> was Puff the Magic Dragon.  It was just hilarious to hear recognizable
> music from a tape drive.  The program wore out tapes pretty quickly
> though because all those short blocks were tough on the tape.  One
> long channel program IIRC to keep the music from pausing when a
> different job was dispatched.
>
> Footnote:  That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.
> It was the first time that I saw MVS with lots of new stuff compared
> to MVT 21.  But no TSO -- they ran Wylbur.
>
>
> /Leonard
>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send
> email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email
to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email
to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-02 Thread Joe Monk 
http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/ibm/370/OS_VS2/Release_3.0_1975/

Joe

On Fri, Dec 2, 2022 at 5:42 AM David Spiegel <
0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:

> Hi Leonard,
> You said: "... That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid
> 1970s. ..."
> Is "MVS 3.0" a typo? (I do not recall ever hearing of MVS 3.0.)
>
> Thanks and regards,
> David
>
> On 2022-12-02 02:15, Leonard D Woren wrote:
> > Bill Hitefield wrote on 11/30/2022 10:39 AM:
> >> In college we had an IBM 1130 in the computer lab. Those of us
> >> working in the lab discovered an AM radio placed near the console
> >> switches made odd noises when you ran Fortran programs and set the
> >> radio to a specific "station". Further investigation revealed you
> >> could change the tone of the noise by using the "e to the x" function
> >> and varying the value of "x". Our goal in life then became to play
> >> "Smoke on the Water" using that radio. The temp wasn't too great, but
> >> you could recognize the main riff!
> >>
> >> Bill Hitefield
> >> Dino-Software Corporation
> >> 800.480.DINO
> >>
> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dino-software.com%2Fdata=05%7C01%7C%7C3be70de2f0a4461a031508dad43519eb%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638055621915923673%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=HYCO5ydHeECYap0cCUN2KL8RMGsSYHnM38onglYyJc8%3Dreserved=0
> >>
> >>
> >
> > I don't remember it very well, but I think the same could be done to
> > some extent on some 360 models.
> >
> > In the mid-1970s, a college friend had a job as an off-hours computer
> > operator at RAND (amusingly, where that 1970 film was made).  He
> > wrote, and a musical friend tuned, a program which played music on a
> > 2400 series tape drive by writing various length blocks -- the shorter
> > the repeated block, the higher the note.  I think one of their 2 songs
> > was Puff the Magic Dragon.  It was just hilarious to hear recognizable
> > music from a tape drive.  The program wore out tapes pretty quickly
> > though because all those short blocks were tough on the tape.  One
> > long channel program IIRC to keep the music from pausing when a
> > different job was dispatched.
> >
> > Footnote:  That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.
> > It was the first time that I saw MVS with lots of new stuff compared
> > to MVT 21.  But no TSO -- they ran Wylbur.
> >
> >
> > /Leonard
> >
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> > send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-02 Thread Lennie Dymoke-Bradshaw 
My recollection is that it didn't really become a viable alternative to SVS
until MVS 3.7. Soon after was MVS 3.8 and then IBM embarked on a series of
other versions and designations, starting, I think, with MVS SE1 later
renamed to MVS SE1.1
Lennie

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of
Seymour J Metz
Sent: 02 December 2022 16:13
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Presumably OS/VS2 Release 3, the second release of MVS. The MVS releases of
OS/VS2 ran from 2.0 to 3.8, with a bunch of optional selectable units ("By
the pricking of my thumb, SU 7 this way comes.")


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of
David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 6:41 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Hi Leonard,
You said: "... That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.
..."
Is "MVS 3.0" a typo? (I do not recall ever hearing of MVS 3.0.)

Thanks and regards,
David

On 2022-12-02 02:15, Leonard D Woren wrote:
> Bill Hitefield wrote on 11/30/2022 10:39 AM:
>> In college we had an IBM 1130 in the computer lab. Those of us 
>> working in the lab discovered an AM radio placed near the console 
>> switches made odd noises when you ran Fortran programs and set the 
>> radio to a specific "station". Further investigation revealed you 
>> could change the tone of the noise by using the "e to the x" function 
>> and varying the value of "x". Our goal in life then became to play 
>> "Smoke on the Water" using that radio. The temp wasn't too great, but 
>> you could recognize the main riff!
>>
>> Bill Hitefield
>> Dino-Software Corporation
>> 800.480.DINO
>> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.
>> dino-software.com%2Fdata=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7Cdee8b1d5fb
>> 404060d1ff08dad45a3d7e%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C6
>> 38055781337271398%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjo
>> iV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=5V1
>> okCO5Sk%2BgqFt9zdA1nb32gMtrWUmTxIJQrHQmq8w%3Dreserved=0
>>
>>
>
> I don't remember it very well, but I think the same could be done to 
> some extent on some 360 models.
>
> In the mid-1970s, a college friend had a job as an off-hours computer 
> operator at RAND (amusingly, where that 1970 film was made).  He 
> wrote, and a musical friend tuned, a program which played music on a
> 2400 series tape drive by writing various length blocks -- the shorter 
> the repeated block, the higher the note.  I think one of their 2 songs 
> was Puff the Magic Dragon.  It was just hilarious to hear recognizable 
> music from a tape drive.  The program wore out tapes pretty quickly 
> though because all those short blocks were tough on the tape.  One 
> long channel program IIRC to keep the music from pausing when a 
> different job was dispatched.
>
> Footnote:  That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.
> It was the first time that I saw MVS with lots of new stuff compared 
> to MVT 21.  But no TSO -- they ran Wylbur.
>
>
> /Leonard
>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send 
> email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email
to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email
to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-02 Thread Seymour J Metz 
Presumably OS/VS2 Release 3, the second release of MVS. The MVS releases of 
OS/VS2 ran from 2.0 to 3.8, with a bunch of optional selectable units ("By the 
pricking of my thumb, SU 7 this way comes.")


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
David Spiegel [0468385049d1-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Friday, December 2, 2022 6:41 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

Hi Leonard,
You said: "... That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid
1970s. ..."
Is "MVS 3.0" a typo? (I do not recall ever hearing of MVS 3.0.)

Thanks and regards,
David

On 2022-12-02 02:15, Leonard D Woren wrote:
> Bill Hitefield wrote on 11/30/2022 10:39 AM:
>> In college we had an IBM 1130 in the computer lab. Those of us
>> working in the lab discovered an AM radio placed near the console
>> switches made odd noises when you ran Fortran programs and set the
>> radio to a specific "station". Further investigation revealed you
>> could change the tone of the noise by using the "e to the x" function
>> and varying the value of "x". Our goal in life then became to play
>> "Smoke on the Water" using that radio. The temp wasn't too great, but
>> you could recognize the main riff!
>>
>> Bill Hitefield
>> Dino-Software Corporation
>> 800.480.DINO
>> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dino-software.com%2Fdata=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7Cdee8b1d5fb404060d1ff08dad45a3d7e%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638055781337271398%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=5V1okCO5Sk%2BgqFt9zdA1nb32gMtrWUmTxIJQrHQmq8w%3Dreserved=0
>>
>>
>
> I don't remember it very well, but I think the same could be done to
> some extent on some 360 models.
>
> In the mid-1970s, a college friend had a job as an off-hours computer
> operator at RAND (amusingly, where that 1970 film was made).  He
> wrote, and a musical friend tuned, a program which played music on a
> 2400 series tape drive by writing various length blocks -- the shorter
> the repeated block, the higher the note.  I think one of their 2 songs
> was Puff the Magic Dragon.  It was just hilarious to hear recognizable
> music from a tape drive.  The program wore out tapes pretty quickly
> though because all those short blocks were tough on the tape.  One
> long channel program IIRC to keep the music from pausing when a
> different job was dispatched.
>
> Footnote:  That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.
> It was the first time that I saw MVS with lots of new stuff compared
> to MVT 21.  But no TSO -- they ran Wylbur.
>
>
> /Leonard
>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-02 Thread David Spiegel 

Hi Leonard,
You said: "... That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 
1970s. ..."

Is "MVS 3.0" a typo? (I do not recall ever hearing of MVS 3.0.)

Thanks and regards,
David

On 2022-12-02 02:15, Leonard D Woren wrote:

Bill Hitefield wrote on 11/30/2022 10:39 AM:
In college we had an IBM 1130 in the computer lab. Those of us 
working in the lab discovered an AM radio placed near the console 
switches made odd noises when you ran Fortran programs and set the 
radio to a specific "station". Further investigation revealed you 
could change the tone of the noise by using the "e to the x" function 
and varying the value of "x". Our goal in life then became to play 
"Smoke on the Water" using that radio. The temp wasn't too great, but 
you could recognize the main riff!


Bill Hitefield
Dino-Software Corporation
800.480.DINO
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dino-software.com%2Fdata=05%7C01%7C%7C3be70de2f0a4461a031508dad43519eb%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C638055621915923673%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=HYCO5ydHeECYap0cCUN2KL8RMGsSYHnM38onglYyJc8%3Dreserved=0 





I don't remember it very well, but I think the same could be done to 
some extent on some 360 models.


In the mid-1970s, a college friend had a job as an off-hours computer 
operator at RAND (amusingly, where that 1970 film was made).  He 
wrote, and a musical friend tuned, a program which played music on a 
2400 series tape drive by writing various length blocks -- the shorter 
the repeated block, the higher the note.  I think one of their 2 songs 
was Puff the Magic Dragon.  It was just hilarious to hear recognizable 
music from a tape drive.  The program wore out tapes pretty quickly 
though because all those short blocks were tough on the tape.  One 
long channel program IIRC to keep the music from pausing when a 
different job was dispatched.


Footnote:  That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.  
It was the first time that I saw MVS with lots of new stuff compared 
to MVT 21.  But no TSO -- they ran Wylbur.



/Leonard


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-01 Thread Leonard D Woren 

Bill Hitefield wrote on 11/30/2022 10:39 AM:

In college we had an IBM 1130 in the computer lab. Those of us working in the lab discovered an AM radio placed near 
the console switches made odd noises when you ran Fortran programs and set the radio to a specific "station". 
Further investigation revealed you could change the tone of the noise by using the "e to the x" function and 
varying the value of "x". Our goal in life then became to play "Smoke on the Water" using that 
radio. The temp wasn't too great, but you could recognize the main riff!

Bill Hitefield
Dino-Software Corporation
800.480.DINO
www.dino-software.com



I don't remember it very well, but I think the same could be done to 
some extent on some 360 models.


In the mid-1970s, a college friend had a job as an off-hours computer 
operator at RAND (amusingly, where that 1970 film was made).  He 
wrote, and a musical friend tuned, a program which played music on a 
2400 series tape drive by writing various length blocks -- the shorter 
the repeated block, the higher the note.  I think one of their 2 songs 
was Puff the Magic Dragon.  It was just hilarious to hear recognizable 
music from a tape drive.  The program wore out tapes pretty quickly 
though because all those short blocks were tough on the tape.  One 
long channel program IIRC to keep the music from pausing when a 
different job was dispatched.


Footnote:  That computer center had MVS 3.0 running in the mid 1970s.  
It was the first time that I saw MVS with lots of new stuff compared 
to MVT 21.  But no TSO -- they ran Wylbur.



/Leonard


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-12-01 Thread Mark Zelden 
I liked the video too! 

I started in this business 10 years after that video in a clerical position 
using
punch interpreters and printers before becoming a computer operator.  That was 
basically all the same equipment I was using in 1981 still. 

Regards,

Mark
--
Mark Zelden - Zelden Consulting Services - z/OS, OS/390 and MVS
ITIL v3 Foundation Certified
mailto:m...@mzelden.com
Mark's MVS Utilities: http://www.mzelden.com/mvsutil.html

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-11-30 Thread Seymour J Metz 
Reminds me of all of those movies and TV shows that had shots of sorters or 
spinning reels on  tape drive.

Silly wabbit, trits are for kids.


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  on behalf of Tom 
Brennan 
Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2022 10:00 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Computers

I never knew each section of a computer had its own distinct sound.
https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DukyHECjKDoQdata=05%7C01%7Csmetz3%40gmu.edu%7Ce4b5d2ed5d9f4dde6eca08dad27f2209%7C9e857255df574c47a0c00546460380cb%7C0%7C0%7C638053740747798048%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=aIR979ZeYH9TsCpUoaZnxyIbnpemfylYgByF0e4jsZ8%3Dreserved=0

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-11-30 Thread Matt Hogstrom 
Are the ones we remember forever :)

Matt Hogstrom
m...@hogstrom.org
+1-919-656-0564
PGP Key: 0x90ECB270
Facebook   LinkedIn 
  Twitter 

“It may be cognitive, but, it ain’t intuitive."
— Hogstrom



> On Nov 30, 2022, at 2:24 PM, Farley, Peter 
> <031df298a9da-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> 
> The mostly useless things we think are interesting or important when we are 
> young and naïve . . .


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-11-30 Thread Bob Bridges 
LOL, I'm not convinced I won't think the very same thing, when I'm 500 years
old, about some of the games and projects that hold my interest now.
Personal growth goes on.

---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313

/* It is a good sign in a nation when things are done badly. It shows that
all the people are doing them.  And it is bad sign in a nation when such
things are done very well, for it shows that only a few experts and
eccentrics are doing them, and that the nation is merely looking on.  -G K
Chesterton, "Patriotism and Sport" */

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of
Farley, Peter
Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2022 14:24

Reminds me of staying up all night in the computer lab at college playing 3d
TicTacToe (4x4x4) against an IBM 1620 computer until I finally beat it by
playing its own moves back at it.  Wasted a whole box of console paper (not
to mention failing to do my Calculus and other homework that night) on that
little exercise . . .

The mostly useless things we think are interesting or important when we are
young and naïve . . .

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-11-30 Thread Farley, Peter 
Reminds me of staying up all night in the computer lab at college playing 3d 
TicTacToe (4x4x4) against an IBM 1620 computer until I finally beat it by 
playing its own moves back at it.  Wasted a whole box of console paper (not to 
mention failing to do my Calculus and other homework that night) on that little 
exercise . . .

The mostly useless things we think are interesting or important when we are 
young and naïve . . .

Peter

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Bill Hitefield
Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2022 1:39 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Computers

In college we had an IBM 1130 in the computer lab. Those of us working in the 
lab discovered an AM radio placed near the console switches made odd noises 
when you ran Fortran programs and set the radio to a specific "station". 
Further investigation revealed you could change the tone of the noise by using 
the "e to the x" function and varying the value of "x". Our goal in life then 
became to play "Smoke on the Water" using that radio. The temp wasn't too 
great, but you could recognize the main riff!

Bill Hitefield
Dino-Software Corporation
800.480.DINO

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> Behalf Of Rupert Reynolds
> Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2022 1:00 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Computers
> 
> Wow.
> 
> Reminds me of the times when some people spelled it "computor" instead of
> "computer" :-)
> 
> Roops
> 
> On Wed, 30 Nov 2022, 05:37 Phil Smith III,  wrote:
> 
> > Tom Brennan wrote:
> > >I never knew each section of a computer had its own distinct sound.
> >
> > Tsk. You don't have those sounds on your PC?
> >
> >
> > Srsly, this was great! A classic. I laughed, I cried. I give it ten stars.
--

This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee 
and may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If the reader 
of the message is not the intended recipient or an authorized representative of 
the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination of this 
communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication 
in error, please notify us immediately by e-mail and delete the message and any 
attachments from your system.

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-11-30 Thread Bill Hitefield 
In college we had an IBM 1130 in the computer lab. Those of us working in the 
lab discovered an AM radio placed near the console switches made odd noises 
when you ran Fortran programs and set the radio to a specific "station". 
Further investigation revealed you could change the tone of the noise by using 
the "e to the x" function and varying the value of "x". Our goal in life then 
became to play "Smoke on the Water" using that radio. The temp wasn't too 
great, but you could recognize the main riff!

Bill Hitefield
Dino-Software Corporation
800.480.DINO
www.dino-software.com

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On
> Behalf Of Rupert Reynolds
> Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2022 1:00 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Computers
> 
> Wow.
> 
> Reminds me of the times when some people spelled it "computor" instead of
> "computer" :-)
> 
> Roops
> 
> On Wed, 30 Nov 2022, 05:37 Phil Smith III,  wrote:
> 
> > Tom Brennan wrote:
> > >I never knew each section of a computer had its own distinct sound.
> > >https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww
> >
> >.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DukyHECjKDoQdata=05%7C01%7CBill.H
> itefi
> > >eld%40DINO-
> SOFTWARE.COM%7Cc59b820acb894ac60e2f08dad2fcc573%7Cbe5c5b1d
> >
> >ebb343f3a3641e98fd405647%7C0%7C0%7C638054280360932179%7CUnknow
> n%7CTWF
> >
> >pbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI
> 6
> >
> >Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7Csdata=rKOsvZyn123%2Bkld5vDGRrtUZjvP
> vy824mg
> > >6EJdjq6lI%3Dreserved=0
> >
> >
> >
> > Tsk. You don't have those sounds on your PC?
> >
> >
> > Srsly, this was great! A classic. I laughed, I cried. I give it ten stars.
> >
> >
> > --
> > For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send
> > email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
> >
> 
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to
> lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-11-30 Thread Rupert Reynolds 
Wow.

Reminds me of the times when some people spelled it "computor" instead of
"computer" :-)

Roops

On Wed, 30 Nov 2022, 05:37 Phil Smith III,  wrote:

> Tom Brennan wrote:
> >I never knew each section of a computer had its own distinct sound.
> >https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukyHECjKDoQ
>
>
>
> Tsk. You don't have those sounds on your PC?
>
>
> Srsly, this was great! A classic. I laughed, I cried. I give it ten stars.
>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-11-30 Thread Bfishing 
I had all of them on mine while playing this video.
Agreed with how great it is.  On a funny timing note, today's version would
just show a cloud :-)

On Wed, Nov 30, 2022 at 12:38 AM Phil Smith III  wrote:

> Tom Brennan wrote:
> >I never knew each section of a computer had its own distinct sound.
> >https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukyHECjKDoQ
>
>
>
> Tsk. You don't have those sounds on your PC?
>
>
> Srsly, this was great! A classic. I laughed, I cried. I give it ten stars.
>
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
>


-- 

><º>`·.¸¸´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸>(((º>
.·´¯`·.><º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸><º>

<>< Go fishing ><>

--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN

Re: Computers

2022-11-29 Thread Phil Smith III 
Tom Brennan wrote:
>I never knew each section of a computer had its own distinct sound.
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukyHECjKDoQ

 

Tsk. You don't have those sounds on your PC?


Srsly, this was great! A classic. I laughed, I cried. I give it ten stars.


--
For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN