Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Please fix weblate.

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

Not sure if it would fix this particular issue, but the latest upstream 
Weblate has nearly a half-year of improvements over the version we have 
on TDF Weblate. So... could we have an upgrade?


Tuomas

Olivier Hallot kirjoitti 19.9.2024 00:57:

Hi

At position 49 of a batch, I have the text below which weblate did not 
suggested anything and forced me to translate:


https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/swmessages/pt_BR/?q=state%3A%3Ctranslated&offset=49

English: "Select a margin preset for the footer."

Translated: "Selecione uma margem predefinida para o rodapé."

so far so good.

At position 60 of the same batch, a similar English text shows up with 
only ONE word difference:


https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/swmessages/pt_BR/?q=state%3A%3Ctranslated&offset=60


English: "Select a margin preset for the header."

Translated:  no suggestion


To me, weblate should suggest the string at position 49.

regards

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Please fix weblate.

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

Not sure if it would fix this particular issue, but the latest upstream 
Weblate has nearly a half-year of improvements over the version we have 
on TDF Weblate. So... could we have an upgrade?


Tuomas

Olivier Hallot kirjoitti 19.9.2024 00:57:

Hi

At position 49 of a batch, I have the text below which weblate did not 
suggested anything and forced me to translate:


https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/swmessages/pt_BR/?q=state%3A%3Ctranslated&offset=49

English: "Select a margin preset for the footer."

Translated: "Selecione uma margem predefinida para o rodapé."

so far so good.

At position 60 of the same batch, a similar English text shows up with 
only ONE word difference:


https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/swmessages/pt_BR/?q=state%3A%3Ctranslated&offset=60


English: "Select a margin preset for the header."

Translated:  no suggestion


To me, weblate should suggest the string at position 49.

regards

--
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LibreOffice Documentation Coordinator
Rio de Janeiro - Brasil - Local Time: UTC-03:00
LibreOffice – free and open source office suite: 
https://www.libreoffice.org

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] How to find Weblate descriptor of string in UI?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Lars,

You need to install an alpha or beta release of LO and the "KeyID"/"qtz" 
pseudo-language which contains the codes (on Windows you can just check 
the box in the installer), and then switch your UI language to it:

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language#KeyID

Developers BTW: could we have enabled for stable releases too? I don't 
really see any downside and it would help translators to have it in all 
releases:

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=72476

Tuomas

Lars Jødal kirjoitti 10.7.2024 23:06:

Hi

Is there some debugging feature that will allow you to see the Weblate 
descriptor codes for the strings in the UI of LO?


If yes, it could help to find a specific string that is wrong in the 
translated UI.


A specific example:

The English term "number" can be used in at least two different ways. 
"Number" can indicate the type of number (1, 2, 3, 3.14, etc.) rather 
than for instance a text string. But "Number" can also be used in the 
sense of counting, as in "the number of objects". In Danish, these two 
ways should be translated differently (as "tal" in the first sense, and 
as "antal" in the second sense, if you are curious).


Now, the Danish Calc UI has the wrong sense in the case of the data 
type of a cell: "Antal", where it should be "Tal". Both "Antal" and 
"Tal" are valid words, so searching for the word gives me several hits 
where the source string is simply "Number". Both translations can be 
correct, depending on the context, so it is not obvious which one 
should be corrected.


In fact, looking at the Norwegian, Swedish and German translations, I 
am by now quite sure that it is the string with code "YPFu3" that I 
should correct. But is there a way to start or set up Calc such that 
the code strings are visible to me from the UI? This would have helped 
me a lot.


Regards,
Lars




[cid:image001.png@FCE7X63HJNU4.HSIYRVHIQ3KW2]   Lars Jødal | 
Hospitalsfysiker

Direkte: 97 66 54 94 | l...@rn.dk
Aalborg Universitetshospital Nuklearmedicinsk Afdeling
Hobrovej 18-22 | 9000 Aalborg | Telefon: 97 66 55 00 | 
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Strings for LibreOffice websites

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Sophie & all,

There are a few other components too under the "website" project in 
Weblate. "extensions" is obviously the extensions website. I'm 
wondering, though, whether "newdesign" and
"mlmmj_footer" are still relevant (or will they be relevant once the new 
site is launched)? Should they be translated?


Thanks in advance,
Tuomas

sophi kirjoitti 3.4.2024 14:28:

Hello,

Strings for the new website design (Hugo site generator) are now 
available on Weblate:

https://translations.documentfoundation.org/projects/website/libreofficeorg/

Cheers
Sophie
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The Document Foundation


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Strings for LibreOffice websites

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Sophie & all,

It appears that the glossary "LibreOffice UI - master" is not in use in 
the website project on Weblate. It would be nice to have it active 
there, too.


Thanks,
Tuomas

sophi kirjoitti 3.4.2024 14:28:

Hello,

Strings for the new website design (Hugo site generator) are now 
available on Weblate:

https://translations.documentfoundation.org/projects/website/libreofficeorg/

Cheers
Sophie
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Foundation coordinator
The Document Foundation


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] blocked items on Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Christian,

Christian Lohmaier kirjoitti 5.6.2024 14:27:

Hi Tuomas, *,

On Mon, May 20, 2024 at 3:44 PM Tuomas Hietala  
wrote:


Also, could we have Weblate updated to the latest version? 5.5.5 is 
the
latest and greatest and there are useful fixes and improvements there 
as

usual.


The update to 5.5.x will have to wait until we update our baseline to
the new debian release, requirements were bumped to python 3.10 and
current baseline only has 3.9 - and while it might be possible to get
it running with the current system, I'd rather just wait until later
this summer for that.


Okay, let's wait, at least the update to 5.4 brought some very welcome 
bug fixes.


Tuomas



ciao
Christian


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] blocked items on Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Also, could we have Weblate updated to the latest version? 5.5.5 is the 
latest and greatest and there are useful fixes and improvements there as 
usual.


Thanks in advance,
Tuomas

Olivier Hallot kirjoitti 20.5.2024 14:40:

+1

On 5/19/24 03:26, kees...@libreoffice.org wrote:
A couple of days ago some items where added to the UI-master and the 
Help-master on Weblate.

However they are still blocked for translation.
When will they be released for translation?

Kind regards,
Kees



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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Proposal: Glossary's Terminology Guidelines

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Antonio,

I agree that the glossary feature is very helpful and that it's 
occasionally misused. However, I disagree with the proposed solution. 
The proper solution IMO would be to disallow translators from modifying 
other languages' glossaries by default:

https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/8807

That way we wouldn't have to first try to formulate a universal glossary 
policy which takes into account the idiosyncracies of every possible 
language and then try to get every translator (many of whom probably 
don't read this mailing list) to follow it.


Whether each language team should translate reserved words in 
programming, Calc functions, or whatever, should be IMO completely up to 
that language team. Also, "never translate this term" is not necessarily 
a good universal rule because of transliterations etc. I don't know 
what's considered best practice in translation for all 100+ languages LO 
supports, but luckily I don't have to: I believe each language team 
knows that best. The tool we use (Weblate) should respect that.


Best regards,
Tuomas

Antonio Vidal kirjoitti 21.3.2024 01:15:
Glossary are helpful because there are terms which could cause 
mistranslations, such as BASIC and Calc functions in sbasic and scalc, 
however there aren't rules to creating a glossary, which could cause 
warnings such as



DO NOT USE THE “TERMINOLOGY” CHECKBOX UNLESS IT’S REALLY WARRANTED!

PLEASE DON’T CROSS YOUR TEAM’S BOUNDARIES AND ADD GLOSSARY STRINGS 
ONLY TO YOUR OWN GLOSSARY, NOT TO EVERYONE ELSE’S, UNLESS STRICTLY 
NECESSARY

https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/glossary/en/?checksum=fa4ca0895bb6cde7


Docs for Glossary: 
https://docs.weblate.org/en/latest/user/glossary.html


- Untranslatable terms: Use this for brand names or other terms that 
should not be changed in other languages
- Forbidden translations: Use this to clarify translation when some 
words are ambiguous or could have unexpected meanings
- Terminology: Use this for important terms that should be 
well-thought-out, and retain a consistent meaning across all languages


Would like to propose guidelines for creating Terminology terms:

SHOULD: What should be in Terminology

- Code variables/functions such as BASIC and Python terms should be 
Untranslatable terms + Terminology

- Excel/Calc functions

SHOULDN'T: What should not be in Terminology

- Adjectives, prepositions, articles, verbs, and non-concrete nouns 
(common words in general)


Up to discussion:

- Should we use for LibreOffice UI elements/labels/menu such as layout, 
emphasis, home...?
- While Markdown, Python, Wiki are brand names, translations software 
such as DeepL and Google/LibreTranslate generally don't translate them, 
thus adding a glossary is unnecessary


If proposal accepted: add key points in 
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Translating_LibreOffice


Antonio Vidal (NamelessGO)


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Missing translation in several languages

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Andika,

Thanks, those are good suggestions. I opened a bug report:
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=160224

Let's continue the discussion there.

Tuomas

Andika Triwidada kirjoitti 15.3.2024 15:22:

Hi Tuomas,

I think this "built-in" was used as opposed to "online",
if "built-in" help was not installed, then LibreOffice
will use the online version instead, using an external browser to 
display

any requested content.

Maybe "local" or "offline" will be more appropriate instead of 
"built-in"?


On Fri, Mar 15, 2024 at 3:33 AM Tuomas Hietala  
wrote:


Hello Patrick,

The string in question appears to be something of a contradiction in
terms. If the help is indeed "built-in", by definition it should not
need to be installed!

Could we come up with a more descriptive adjective than "built-in"?

Best,
Tuomas

Patrick Luby kirjoitti 13.3.2024 16:34:
> Hello,
>
> While testing upcoming loclization changes in the macOS installer (see
> https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/c/core/+/163158), I found that the
> following “remote help dialog” string is only localized by roughly half
> of LibreOffice’s bundled languages:
>
>   ./config/soffice.cfg/sfx/ui/helpmanual.ui:
>  context="helpmanual|builtin">Learn more about installing the built-in
> help
>
> Below are the languages that are missing this string in their
> ./resource/*/LC_MESSAGES/sfx.mo file. Is there a process for submitting
> this message string to the volunteer translators? Adding more
> localizations to the macOS installer is planned for the LibreOffice
> 24.8 in summer 2024:
>
> am
> ar
> as
> ast
> be
> bg
> bn
> bn-IN
> bo
> br
> brx
> bs
> ca
> ca-valencia
> ckb
> da
> dgo
> dz
> el
> en-GB
> en-ZA
> eo
> es
> et
> eu
> fa
> fi
> fr
> fur
> fy
> ga
> gd
> gu
> gug
> hi
> hr
> hu
> id
> is
> it
> ja
> ka
> kab
> kk
> km
> kmr-Latn
> kn
> ko
> kok
> ks
> lb
> lo
> lt
> lv
> mai
> mk
> ml
> mn
> mni
> mr
> my
> ne
> nr
> nso
> oc
> om
> or
> pa-IN
> pt
> qtz
> ro
> ru
> rw
> sa-IN
> sat
> sd
> si
> sid
> sk
> sl
> sq
> sr
> sr-Latn
> ss
> st
> sw-TZ
> szl
> ta
> te
> tg
> th
> tn
> ts
> tt
> ug
> uz
> ve
> vec
> vi
> xh
> zh-TW
> zu
>
>
> Patrick

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Missing translation in several languages

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Patrick,

The string in question appears to be something of a contradiction in 
terms. If the help is indeed "built-in", by definition it should not 
need to be installed!


Could we come up with a more descriptive adjective than "built-in"?

Best,
Tuomas

Patrick Luby kirjoitti 13.3.2024 16:34:

Hello,

While testing upcoming loclization changes in the macOS installer (see 
https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/c/core/+/163158), I found that the 
following “remote help dialog” string is only localized by roughly half 
of LibreOffice’s bundled languages:


  ./config/soffice.cfg/sfx/ui/helpmanual.ui:
context="helpmanual|builtin">Learn more about installing the built-in 
help


Below are the languages that are missing this string in their 
./resource/*/LC_MESSAGES/sfx.mo file. Is there a process for submitting 
this message string to the volunteer translators? Adding more 
localizations to the macOS installer is planned for the LibreOffice  
24.8 in summer 2024:


am
ar
as
ast
be
bg
bn
bn-IN
bo
br
brx
bs
ca
ca-valencia
ckb
da
dgo
dz
el
en-GB
en-ZA
eo
es
et
eu
fa
fi
fr
fur
fy
ga
gd
gu
gug
hi
hr
hu
id
is
it
ja
ka
kab
kk
km
kmr-Latn
kn
ko
kok
ks
lb
lo
lt
lv
mai
mk
ml
mn
mni
mr
my
ne
nr
nso
oc
om
or
pa-IN
pt
qtz
ro
ru
rw
sa-IN
sat
sd
si
sid
sk
sl
sq
sr
sr-Latn
ss
st
sw-TZ
szl
ta
te
tg
th
tn
ts
tt
ug
uz
ve
vec
vi
xh
zh-TW
zu


Patrick


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Proposal for categories in Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Sophie,

Some belated comments for your comments below:

sophi kirjoitti 4.3.2024 15:19:

Hi Tuomas, all,
Le 02/03/2024 à 17:08, Tuomas Hietala a écrit :

Hello all,

Here is my proposal for dividing the components in LibreOffice UI in 
Weblate into categories. My idea is to have a category for each module 
and a few categories for shared components. Let me know if I 
miscategorised something or if you have better ideas for categories.


Thanks a lot for your work on this.
Maybe we could group Chart/Draw and Impress/Math in one category?


I followed the example of Help, where each of these is a separate 
module. "Draw and Impress" is an exception, because the strings for both 
applications are in the same component in Weblate (sd/messages), so they 
can't be separated into two categories.



Other comments between your lines:



Base
 dbaccess/messages
 officecfg/registry/data/org/openoffice

 Not sure if 'dbaccess/messages' would belong here or in the Data 
access category further below.


I think it's good to have it here, as it's not only for 
accessing/connecting to database but for creating/managing databases


Okay, so let it stay here.


BASIC
 basctl/messages
 basic/messages

Calc
 formula/messages
 nlpsolver/help/en/com.sun.star.comp.Calc.NLPSolver
 nlpsolver/src/com/sun/star/comp/Calc/NLPSolver
 nlpsolver/src/locale
 scaddins/messages
 sccomp/messages
 sc/messages

Chart
 chart2/messages

Common UI components
 accessibility/messages
 avmedia/messages
 cui/messages
 desktop/messages
 editeng/messages
 extensions/messages
 extensions/source/update/check/org/openoffice/Office
 extras/source/autocorr/emoji
 extras/source/gallery/share
 forms/messages
 framework/messages
 officecfg/registry/data/org/openoffice/Office
 officecfg/registry/data/org/openoffice/Office/UI
 oox/messages
 reportbuilder/java/org/libreoffice/report/function/metadata
 reportdesign/messages
 sfx2/messages
 svl/messages
 svtools/messages
 svx/messages
 sysui/desktop/share
 uui/messages
 vcl/messages
 wizards/messages
 wizards/source/resources
 xmlsecurity/messages

 A catch-all category which could perhaps be broken into smaller 
categories. I'd avoid getting overly specific, though, in order to 
keep the overall number of categories manageable.


I agree :)


Data access
 connectivity/messages
 connectivity/registry/ado/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/calc/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/dbase/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/evoab2/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/firebird/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/flat/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/hsqldb/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/jdbc/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/macab/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/mysqlc/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/mysql_jdbc/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/odbc/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/postgresql/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
 connectivity/registry/writer/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess

 I think these are not just specific to Base but used in other 
modules too? If not, this category could be merged with Base.


I've no real opinion here, or maybe rename the category Connectivity


"Connectivity" in computing tends to generally mean things like USB, 
Bluetooth, Ethernet etc., whereas here it refers to accessing databases 
and files. So I thought it might be a bit confusing name to people who 
are not familiar with LibreOffice's internals. But I'm not against 
calling it Connectivity, either, if that's deemed better.



Dictionaries
 Already created by Christian, no changes.

Draw and Impress
 sd/messages

File format filters
 filter/messages
 filter/source/config/fragments/filters
 filter/source/config/fragments/internalgraphicfilters
 filter/source/config/fragments/types
 writerperfect/messages

Installers and ReadMe
 instsetoo_native/inc_openoffice/windows/msi_languages
 readlicense_oo/docs
 scp2/source/activex
 scp2/source/base
 scp2/source/calc
 scp2/source/draw
 scp2/source/extensions
 scp2/source/gnome
 scp2/source/graphicfilter
 scp2/source/impress
 scp2/source/kde
 scp2/source/math
 scp2/source/onlineupdate
 scp2/source/ooo
 scp2/source/python
 scp2/source/quickstart
 scp2/source/winexplorerext
 scp2/source/writer
 scp2/source/xsltfilter
 setup_native/source/mac

Math
 starmath/messages

System integration
 fpicker/messages
 shell/messages

[libreoffice-l10n] Proposal for categories in Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

Here is my proposal for dividing the components in LibreOffice UI in 
Weblate into categories. My idea is to have a category for each module 
and a few categories for shared components. Let me know if I 
miscategorised something or if you have better ideas for categories.



Base
dbaccess/messages
officecfg/registry/data/org/openoffice

	Not sure if 'dbaccess/messages' would belong here or in the Data access 
category further below.


BASIC
basctl/messages
basic/messages

Calc
formula/messages
nlpsolver/help/en/com.sun.star.comp.Calc.NLPSolver
nlpsolver/src/com/sun/star/comp/Calc/NLPSolver
nlpsolver/src/locale
scaddins/messages
sccomp/messages
sc/messages

Chart
chart2/messages

Common UI components
accessibility/messages
avmedia/messages
cui/messages
desktop/messages
editeng/messages
extensions/messages
extensions/source/update/check/org/openoffice/Office
extras/source/autocorr/emoji
extras/source/gallery/share
forms/messages
framework/messages
officecfg/registry/data/org/openoffice/Office
officecfg/registry/data/org/openoffice/Office/UI
oox/messages
reportbuilder/java/org/libreoffice/report/function/metadata
reportdesign/messages
sfx2/messages
svl/messages
svtools/messages
svx/messages
sysui/desktop/share
uui/messages
vcl/messages
wizards/messages
wizards/source/resources
xmlsecurity/messages

	A catch-all category which could perhaps be broken into smaller 
categories. I'd avoid getting overly specific, though, in order to keep 
the overall number of categories manageable.


Data access
connectivity/messages
connectivity/registry/ado/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/calc/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/dbase/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/evoab2/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/firebird/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/flat/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/hsqldb/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/jdbc/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/macab/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/mysqlc/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/mysql_jdbc/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/odbc/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/postgresql/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess
connectivity/registry/writer/org/openoffice/Office/DataAccess

	I think these are not just specific to Base but used in other modules 
too? If not, this category could be merged with Base.


Dictionaries
Already created by Christian, no changes.

Draw and Impress
sd/messages

File format filters
filter/messages
filter/source/config/fragments/filters
filter/source/config/fragments/internalgraphicfilters
filter/source/config/fragments/types
writerperfect/messages

Installers and ReadMe
instsetoo_native/inc_openoffice/windows/msi_languages
readlicense_oo/docs
scp2/source/activex
scp2/source/base
scp2/source/calc
scp2/source/draw
scp2/source/extensions
scp2/source/gnome
scp2/source/graphicfilter
scp2/source/impress
scp2/source/kde
scp2/source/math
scp2/source/onlineupdate
scp2/source/ooo
scp2/source/python
scp2/source/quickstart
scp2/source/winexplorerext
scp2/source/writer
scp2/source/xsltfilter
setup_native/source/mac

Math
starmath/messages

System integration
fpicker/messages
shell/messages
shell/source/win32/shlxthandler/res

Writer
librelogo/source/pythonpath
swext/mediawiki/help
swext/mediawiki/help
swext/mediawiki/src/registry/data/org/openoffice/Office
swext/mediawiki/src/registry/data/org/openoffice/Office/Custom
sw/messages


Comments welcome,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Making use of Weblate's new features

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Christian,

Christian Lohmaier kirjoitti 28.2.2024 15:29:

HI Tuomas, *,

On Mon, Feb 26, 2024 at 5:31 PM Tuomas Hietala  
wrote:


First, there's the Category feature:
https://docs.weblate.org/en/weblate-5.0/admin/projects.html#category


Categories aren't completely new, but were improved, previously there
was the option to create component lists/aggregates of components and
I created https://translations.documentfoundation.org/#componentlists
as a first test back in the day, grouping help to their modules as one
way to structure them. I don't know if anyone actually used those for
translation, since they are quite "hidden" in the UI


Yes, the component lists have indeed been there for a while, but like 
you said they're a bit too hidden and IMO don't really fit into the rest 
of Weblate's navigation hierarchy.


I think it would be a good idea to make categories for Help based on the 
existing component lists and then maybe remove the component lists.



Currently on TDF Weblate there are dozens of sometimes somewhat
cryptically named components inside each project. You'll get used to
them after a while but we could reduce confusion and speed up 
navigation

by making use of categories. There could be one category per module
(Writer, Calc, etc.) and some common categories as well, as many
components are used across the whole suite.


Yep, some like cui and svx are used across everything. And it is
certainly possible to add them, but of course weblate doesn't know on
its own, so it would be ideal if someone could compile a hierarchy
that would make sense from a translator's perspective.


I'll see if I can come up with a proposal.


Also what we're not really using all that much is prioritization of
components/strings (that would change the order if you were to just
hit translate in a project and not manually pick a component).


There's at least one project on Hosted Weblate that uses prioritisation, 
but it can lead to sudden jumps into completely different position 
within the component you're translating when you would assume you're 
just moving to the neighbouring string. I find it unnecessarily 
confusing.


I wouldn't really recommend using it on TDF Weblate unless the way it's 
presented to translators is improved in upstream Weblate first.



I guess as a simple test to see how it looks I'll create a
"dictionaries" component - that is relatively easy to scope, has all
strings following the same pattern/basically only the language name
changes between the strings and thus might be a good candidate to
consolidate that way, also large number of components with few
individual strings...


Thanks, that already de-clutters the list of components a lot! But it 
seems it's only available here:

https://translations.documentfoundation.org/projects/libo_ui-master/

And not if you navigate to an individual language first:
https://translations.documentfoundation.org/projects/libo_ui-master/-/fi/

Can you configure it for the languages also or is this a missing feature 
in uptream Weblate?



Second, there's the Workflow customisation feature:
https://docs.weblate.org/en/weblate-5.1/workflows.html#workflow-customization

The idea was to allow each language team to make their own decicions
about workflow.


Yes, that's far more preference-dependent/requires input from the
corresponding l10n teams.


So I'm just making sure if it's now okay for teams to
make the switch if they want to?


I don't think our groups currently allow you to switch that yourself,
but you're more than welcome to request a specific workflow for your
language that Sophie or I can then configure for your language/for a
specific project and your language.


Okay, good to know. I'll ask for others' opinion before making 
decisions, though.



ciao
Christian


Thanks,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Making use of Weblate's new features

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Sophie,

sophi kirjoitti 27.2.2024 16:25:

Hi Tuomas,
Le 26/02/2024 à 17:30, Tuomas Hietala a écrit :




Second, there's the Workflow customisation feature:
https://docs.weblate.org/en/weblate-5.1/workflows.html#workflow-customization

The idea was to allow each language team to make their own decicions 
about workflow. So I'm just making sure if it's now okay for teams to 
make the switch if they want to?


Do you have access to it under your language > tools > edit?



No, I only seem to have "Failing checks" in the Tools menu. So it seems 
this feature can be accesses by administrators only as Christian 
explained.


Thanks,
Tuomas


Cheers
Sophie

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[libreoffice-l10n] Making use of Weblate's new features

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

As we know, TDF funded some improvements to Weblate last year. I think 
all the features have landed in Weblate by now, but some of them need to 
be specifically enabled.


First, there's the Category feature:
https://docs.weblate.org/en/weblate-5.0/admin/projects.html#category

Currently on TDF Weblate there are dozens of sometimes somewhat 
cryptically named components inside each project. You'll get used to 
them after a while but we could reduce confusion and speed up navigation 
by making use of categories. There could be one category per module 
(Writer, Calc, etc.) and some common categories as well, as many 
components are used across the whole suite.


Second, there's the Workflow customisation feature:
https://docs.weblate.org/en/weblate-5.1/workflows.html#workflow-customization

The idea was to allow each language team to make their own decicions 
about workflow. So I'm just making sure if it's now okay for teams to 
make the switch if they want to?


Best regards,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Placeholder string instead of tooltip?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Mihail,

It was fixed two days ago, but the fix hasn't reached Weblate yet:
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=157868

Tuomas

Mihail Balabanov kirjoitti 24.1.2024 12:57:

Hello,

This extended tooltip looks like a forgotten placeholder:

https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/sfx2messages/bg/?checksum=a5e915a57b801969

Cheers,
Mihail


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Abbreviation for Drag 'n Drop

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi all,

There's no commonly understood abbreviation for DnD in Finnish either, 
but the equivalent of "Shift+drag" would work. (Actually, I'm not sure 
if non-technical English speakers would understand "DnD" either?)


Heiko, is there any character limit on the translated string?

I also think that Shift should be written first, because that's the 
usual convention (and it's the logical order: you need to hold Shift 
before dragging).


Tuomas

Mihail Balabanov kirjoitti 8.1.2024 13:53:

Hi,
Since there is no commonly accepted Bulgarian abbreviation for drag and
drop, I would translate "DnD+Shift" as "Shift+плъзгане" (Shift+drag),
leaving "and drop" to be only implied. Maybe something similar would be
suitable for other languages?

On Mon, Jan 8, 2024 at 10:34 AM Heiko Tietze <
heiko.tie...@documentfoundation.org> wrote:


Some effort is currently made by Jim to allow drag'n drop from the
Navigator not
just as link but also to get cross-references into the document. Users 
can

trigger the function via pup-up menu or per accelerator. And to give a
clue
about the latter we should add some text to the menu, which could be
"Insert as
Text Reference (DnD+Shift)" (for the full list of commands see 
attachment

to
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=36310#c21).

Now I wonder if DnD for Drag'n Drop is well-known and easy to 
translate.

German
could be "Ziehen & Ablegen" abbreviated to "Z&A" - which users would 
never

understand. Any idea?
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Weblate glossaries policy

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

sophi kirjoitti 26.12.2023 15:02:

Hi Stanislav,

Le 21/12/2023 à 10:03, Stanislav Horáček a écrit :

Hi,

I would like to ask if there is a policy for adding strings to 
glossaries shared across all languages (i.e. the strings marked with 
the "terminology" flag).


Currently, there are many terminology strings which are not useful at 
all, only cluttering the glossaries (check yourself e.g. [1]). They 
are being added continuously and I deleted some of them, but I think 
it should be more controlled what is going in. In the glossary itself, 
I found a sentence suggesting that the initial idea was to use the 
shared part only rarely [2].


What are your opinions?


I agree with you. Do you have suggestions on how to enforce 
contributors to not use the Terminology flag? I can add it to the wiki, 
but not sure people will read there.


Having to delete unnecessary terminology strings is indeed annoying. IMO 
adding glossary entries to other languages should not be enabled by 
default. I opened an issue on Weblate's Github earlier:


https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/8807

If TDF is going to fund improvements to Weblate again (I hope so!), this 
could be one candidate.


Best regards,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Android Viewer translation on Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Seems to work. Thanks!

Tuomas

Christian Lohmaier kirjoitti 15.12.2023 16:21:

Hi Tuomas, *,

On Fri, Dec 15, 2023 at 3:18 PM Tuomas Hietala  
wrote:


Actually, there's still something I need to ask for :) Can you make 
the

glossary of "LibreOffice UI - master" also apply to Android Viewer, so
that there's no need to manually duplicate glossary entries?


Thx for the suggestion, done.

ciao
Christian


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Android Viewer translation on Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Actually, there's still something I need to ask for :) Can you make the 
glossary of "LibreOffice UI - master" also apply to Android Viewer, so 
that there's no need to manually duplicate glossary entries?


Tuomas

sophi kirjoitti 15.12.2023 16:07:

Le 15/12/2023 à 14:55, Tuomas Hietala a écrit :

Thanks, Finnish succesfully added!


Great :)
Cheers
Sophie


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Android Viewer translation on Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Thanks, Finnish succesfully added!

Tuomas

sophi kirjoitti 15.12.2023 12:50:

Hello all,

As it was requested by several of you, Android Viewer is now 
translatable on Weblate, thanks to Cloph :)


You can add the project to your dashboard. Currently there is master 
and 7.6 branches and translation propagation is active.


Cheers
Sophie
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[libreoffice-l10n] Translating LibreOffice Viewer

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

It was recently announced that LibreOffice Viewer is available again. It 
would be good to have it translated. I found a page on the wiki for 
translations of the Play store description:

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/LibreOffice_Viewer_Play_Store_listing

However, as the page was last updated in 2018, is it still relevant?

I didn't find anything related to translating the UI. There doesn't seem 
to be anything on TDF Weblate either. Is there some way to translate the 
UI?


Best regards,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Specifications for Weblate #5447

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Sophie & all,

Sorry for neglecting this issue! I added some comments on GitHub, but 
more input is certainly welcome.


What I had in mind originally was about reviews: currently, if some 
language team wants to switch to review-based workflow, it's not 
possible unless the switch is done site-wide, for every language team. 
But is there something else, too, that each team should be able to 
decice for themselves? And should this feature implemented in a way that 
makes it useful also for projects that host their translations on shared 
Weblate instances, like Hosted Weblate? https://hosted.weblate.org/


Best regards,
Tuomas

sophi kirjoitti 5.9.2023 14:58:

Hi all,

As you know most of the enhancements we requested to Weblate have been 
implemented (thanks to them and TDF for the funding :)


There is one which is not fixed, opened by Tuomas, but they need more 
details on what is wanted:

https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/5447

Which settings would help you most in your workflow? This will be then 
implemented in the next version.

Thanks a lot in advance
Cheers
Sophie
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] "body text" and "text body"

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Olivier,

Wikipedia explains the concept: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_text

My guess is that possibly "body" refers to the largest mass or "bulk" of 
the text, or maybe the metaphor is "head and body" (headings being the 
"head").


Other languages may use different metaphors, though. In some languages 
the metaphor is "bread". For appropriate translation, I'd suggest 
consulting a dictionary.


Best regards,
Tuomas

Olivier Hallot kirjoitti 13.6.2023 19:45:

Hi L10n team

I have a question on English linguistics: the paragraph style "body 
text" is "text of the body" right? as opposed to  "body of the text".


I'm asking because I see translated as "body of the text" all over the 
internet and in several languages, including in doc from other 
softwares such as Adobe, MS for pt-BR.


Thanks in advance,

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=154933
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[libreoffice-l10n] GSoC 2021 translation tooling project

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

The wiki says a GSoC project for improving translation tooling was 
successfully implemented in 2021.

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/GSoC/Successfully_Implemented_Ideas#Integrate_.ui_dialogs_with_translation_tooling/string_search_webservice_to_help_translators

However, I haven't seen anything like this in use in TDF Weblate. Is it 
possible to actually enable this? Or if the code needs more work, could 
this be a project idea for this year's GSoC?


Best regards,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Mistakes in source strings

[Tuomas Hietala]

Maybe I should clarify that I'm not in favour of changing the source 
strings just for fun every two weeks, but thankfully that's not the 
situation in LibreOffice. However, reducing the translators' workload 
can IMO more effectively be accomplished by improving the tools and 
processes rather than avoiding useful changes.


Tuomas

Tuomas Hietala kirjoitti 7.10.2022 21:04:

Hi all,

FWIW as a translator I'm always in favour of fixing mistakes in the
source strings even if it creates extra work for myself. That's
because trying to figure out whether some unusual spelling or choice
of words is intentional or not is work too. Sometimes a lot more work
than just straightforward translation.

The extra work only happens if the string was translated previously.
For example, Help is currently 47% translated into Finnish, so it's
more likely than not that a change in a Help string will not cause any
extra work for Finnish translators (and might actually save some in
the future).

It would be better, of course, if mistakes could be caught earlier.
And the visual diff feature in Weblate, which I mentioned on this list
a while ago, would make updating the translation quicker by showing
the change in the source string and the previous translation. If we
had that feature working, often the previous translation could be used
with just two clicks, if there's e.g. just some minor punctuation
change in the source string.

Tuomas

Andras Timar kirjoitti 20.9.2022 22:05:

Hi Annabelle,

I think you are right, the rules are laid down in UX Guidelines, cf.
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Guidelines/UIWriting
However, LibreOffice is a huge project and you cannot expect that 
every UI

string (some were added 20+ years ago) complies. I'm not a big fan of
cosmetic changes, because they create work for translators. But I'm 
not in

charge and would not oppose such patches from contributors.

Best regards,
Andras

On Tue, Sep 20, 2022 at 8:22 PM Annabelle Wübbelsmann 


wrote:


Hi Andras,

thank you for your answer.

Can you tell me, why the word "From" have a capitalised initial 
letter?

Usually "from" is written with a lowercase initial letter.


Regards
Annabelle Wübbelsmann

Member of the German translation team
Andras Timar:
> Hello Annabelle,
>
> "Macro From" is correct, i.e. the library where the macro comes from.
>
> You are right about the second issue, LibreOffice vs. %PRODUCTNAME, and
it
> has been already fixed in later versions. Usually we do not backport
> English string fixes for minor issues like this, in order not to break
> existing translations.
>
> Best regards,
> Andras
>
> On Sun, Sep 4, 2022 at 7:02 PM Annabelle Wübbelsmann 
> wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>> I think I found two mistakes in Weblate source strings.
>>
>> I think in the following string the word "from" is misspelled. Should it
>> be "form"?
>>
>>
>>
https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_help-7-3/textsbasicpython/de/?checksum=710756571ee1eec0
>>
>> In the following string the word "LibreOffice" should be replaced with
>> "%PRODUCTNAME" as it is at the beginning of the string.
>>
>>
>>
https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_help-7-3/textsbasicpython/de/?checksum=82cc7f9bc84cdac0
>>
>> --
>> Regards
>> Annabelle
>>
>> Member of the German translation team
>>
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Mistakes in source strings

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi all,

FWIW as a translator I'm always in favour of fixing mistakes in the 
source strings even if it creates extra work for myself. That's because 
trying to figure out whether some unusual spelling or choice of words is 
intentional or not is work too. Sometimes a lot more work than just 
straightforward translation.


The extra work only happens if the string was translated previously. For 
example, Help is currently 47% translated into Finnish, so it's more 
likely than not that a change in a Help string will not cause any extra 
work for Finnish translators (and might actually save some in the 
future).


It would be better, of course, if mistakes could be caught earlier. And 
the visual diff feature in Weblate, which I mentioned on this list a 
while ago, would make updating the translation quicker by showing the 
change in the source string and the previous translation. If we had that 
feature working, often the previous translation could be used with just 
two clicks, if there's e.g. just some minor punctuation change in the 
source string.


Tuomas

Andras Timar kirjoitti 20.9.2022 22:05:

Hi Annabelle,

I think you are right, the rules are laid down in UX Guidelines, cf.
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Guidelines/UIWriting
However, LibreOffice is a huge project and you cannot expect that every 
UI

string (some were added 20+ years ago) complies. I'm not a big fan of
cosmetic changes, because they create work for translators. But I'm not 
in

charge and would not oppose such patches from contributors.

Best regards,
Andras

On Tue, Sep 20, 2022 at 8:22 PM Annabelle Wübbelsmann 


wrote:


Hi Andras,

thank you for your answer.

Can you tell me, why the word "From" have a capitalised initial 
letter?

Usually "from" is written with a lowercase initial letter.


Regards
Annabelle Wübbelsmann

Member of the German translation team
Andras Timar:
> Hello Annabelle,
>
> "Macro From" is correct, i.e. the library where the macro comes from.
>
> You are right about the second issue, LibreOffice vs. %PRODUCTNAME, and
it
> has been already fixed in later versions. Usually we do not backport
> English string fixes for minor issues like this, in order not to break
> existing translations.
>
> Best regards,
> Andras
>
> On Sun, Sep 4, 2022 at 7:02 PM Annabelle Wübbelsmann 
> wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>> I think I found two mistakes in Weblate source strings.
>>
>> I think in the following string the word "from" is misspelled. Should it
>> be "form"?
>>
>>
>>
https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_help-7-3/textsbasicpython/de/?checksum=710756571ee1eec0
>>
>> In the following string the word "LibreOffice" should be replaced with
>> "%PRODUCTNAME" as it is at the beginning of the string.
>>
>>
>>
https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_help-7-3/textsbasicpython/de/?checksum=82cc7f9bc84cdac0
>>
>> --
>> Regards
>> Annabelle
>>
>> Member of the German translation team
>>
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Will changing keyword translations break existing documents?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Olivier,

I'm not currently planning to change any of the translations of function 
names, for the reasons you mention. Just making sure it's possible in 
case there's a serious mistake that needs to be corrected.


Tuomas

Olivier Hallot kirjoitti 30.9.2022 16:50:

Hi Tuomas

Brazilian Portuguese translated all Calc functions names with their
similar names from MS Excel.

For the good and for the bad. Some Excel functions names were poorly
translated but we decided to keep the bad translation to avoid noise
and rant from end users.

Regards



Em 28/09/2022 10:01, Tuomas Hietala escreveu:
I'm also interested in hearing what's the situation with regard to 
other kinds of keywords, such as function names in Calc.


Best regards,
Tuomas


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Will changing keyword translations break existing documents?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Eike,

Eike Rathke kirjoitti 4.10.2022 20:37:

Hi Tuomas,

On Wednesday, 2022-09-28 16:01:16 +0300, Tuomas Hietala wrote:


There's an error I'd like to fix in Finnish translation of one of the
strings in librelogo/source/pythonpath. It seems to be one of the 
LibreLogo

keywords.

However, I wonder if changing the translation will break any existing
documents that use that keyword.


I don't know details, but I think it would break. It just looks like 
the

script text is processed.


Thanks, good to know. I have to think about what to do in this case.



Is there a locale-independent
representation in the file format that is decoupled from the UI
translations?


Doesn't look like.


I'm also interested in hearing what's the situation with regard to 
other

kinds of keywords, such as function names in Calc.


Completely different. Calc function names are stored using fixed 
English

or programmatical names in both ODF OpenFormula (ODFF) and OOXML. UI
translations of function names are only view and input related.

Make sure you don't translate to duplicated function names and use only
allowed characters. See also
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=128200


Sure, I'll keep that in mind.

Tuomas



  Eike

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[libreoffice-l10n] Will changing keyword translations break existing documents?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

There's an error I'd like to fix in Finnish translation of one of the 
strings in librelogo/source/pythonpath. It seems to be one of the 
LibreLogo keywords. Here's the link if you're interested: 
https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/librelogosourcepythonpath/fi/?checksum=ecc96ea232c9cc71


However, I wonder if changing the translation will break any existing 
documents that use that keyword. Is there a locale-independent 
representation in the file format that is decoupled from the UI 
translations?


I'm also interested in hearing what's the situation with regard to other 
kinds of keywords, such as function names in Calc.


Best regards,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Deleting old projects in weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Annabelle & Christian,

Weblate normally indicates what's changed in strings by highlighting the 
changed characters in green (for additions) and red (for deletions). For 
example: 
https://hosted.weblate.org/translate/weblate/application/fi/?checksum=f846be721a973beb


However, this has never (AFAIK) been the case for LO strings in TDF 
Weblate, where strings just get replaced with no indication of what was 
there before. I've assumed that there's perhaps some technical 
limitation preventing the use of this feature, but perhaps Christian 
could enlighten us?


Best regards,
Tuomas Hietala

Annabelle Wübbelsmann kirjoitti 27.7.2022 18:10:

Hello Christian,

thank you for your explanations. This small changes are sometimes no
important for the translated text. For example "can not" changes to
"cannot" or something in the xml tags. If I know this, I can just copy
the German translation from the "old" branch because this changes
doesn't affect the German text. This saves time. If the 7.2 project 
will

now deleted I can't check the differences for the 7.3 project. For the
German language there are about 1000 untranslated strings. Therefore 
the

7.2 project should kept until the 7.3 project reaches EOL.

Regards
Annabelle Wübbelsmann

Member of the German translation team

Christian Lohmaier:

Hi Annabelle, *,

On Tue, Jul 19, 2022 at 3:33 PM Annabelle Wübbelsmann 
 wrote:


is there a "plan" which says when an old project will be deleted in
weblate? I ask because it is helpful when an old project will be kept
for a certain period of time to compare the change between the 
different

projects.


There is no fixed schedule for that, but even if the projects (in our
case just different branches of the same project), the files are still
in the repository and could be retrieved from there if necessary.

Since the use of weblate and its translation propagation feature, the
difference between the different projects should be minimal (as
translations done on one branch will also be done on identical strings
on the other branches).

I do plan to remove the 7-2 projects after 7.4.0 is released and I
create the 7-4 projects in weblate (and make master reflect
master/upcoming 7.5)

HTH,
ciao
Christian



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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] No notifications in weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

I'm not currently receiving notifications from Weblate, either, even 
though I should be. The last time I received a notification is 7th of 
March.


Tuomas

Annabelle Wübbelsmann kirjoitti 28.3.2022 11:51:

Good morning,

since 14.03.22 I don't get notification emails for my watched projects
in weblate again. This problem was already occurs last year when 
weblate

was updated.

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Bot behaving badly in the wiki

[Tuomas Hietala]

Thanks!

Ilmari Lauhakangas kirjoitti 14.5.2022 15:20:

Append &action=edit to the URL.

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/TDF_Wiki/Multilingual#Migrating_old_translated_content_to_the_current_system

Ilmari

On 14.5.2022 12.58, Tuomas Hietala wrote:
Okay, I'll try to restore the relevant content. Is there a way to view 
the wiki markup of the past versions? I seem to only be able to view 
the pages themselves.


Tuomas

Ilmari Lauhakangas kirjoitti 14.5.2022 7:38:

On 13.5.2022 22.11, Tuomas Hietala wrote:

Hello,

It appears "FuzzyBot" has decided to revert the Finnish main page of 
TDF wiki [1] to English. I don't have the rights to undo this.


The Finnish wiki main page is not meant to be a translation of the 
English main page. How can I get the old page back and prevent bot 
misbehaviour in the future?


Tuomas

[1] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Main_Page/fi


It's not misbehaviour, but part of the migration to Translate
extension that has been going on for years. I have now added blocks 
to

the beginning and end that are invisible (commented out) in the
English version, so localisers can add unique content. Ie. you can 
add

your own {{portal box|...}} content box(es) to the beginning and end,
which gives you the possibility to add substantial amounts of
localised info to the main page.

Translators can always access the old content for copying from View
History of the respective translated page. I've already migrated over
French content and will look at others in the coming days.

Ilmari




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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Bot behaving badly in the wiki

[Tuomas Hietala]

Okay, I'll try to restore the relevant content. Is there a way to view 
the wiki markup of the past versions? I seem to only be able to view the 
pages themselves.


Tuomas

Ilmari Lauhakangas kirjoitti 14.5.2022 7:38:

On 13.5.2022 22.11, Tuomas Hietala wrote:

Hello,

It appears "FuzzyBot" has decided to revert the Finnish main page of 
TDF wiki [1] to English. I don't have the rights to undo this.


The Finnish wiki main page is not meant to be a translation of the 
English main page. How can I get the old page back and prevent bot 
misbehaviour in the future?


Tuomas

[1] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Main_Page/fi


It's not misbehaviour, but part of the migration to Translate
extension that has been going on for years. I have now added blocks to
the beginning and end that are invisible (commented out) in the
English version, so localisers can add unique content. Ie. you can add
your own {{portal box|...}} content box(es) to the beginning and end,
which gives you the possibility to add substantial amounts of
localised info to the main page.

Translators can always access the old content for copying from View
History of the respective translated page. I've already migrated over
French content and will look at others in the coming days.

Ilmari


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[libreoffice-l10n] Bot behaving badly in the wiki

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

It appears "FuzzyBot" has decided to revert the Finnish main page of TDF 
wiki [1] to English. I don't have the rights to undo this.


The Finnish wiki main page is not meant to be a translation of the 
English main page. How can I get the old page back and prevent bot 
misbehaviour in the future?


Tuomas

[1] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Main_Page/fi

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[libreoffice-l10n] Unexpected translations appeared

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

There were new strings added to Weblate a few days ago. Mostly nothing 
unusual, but two strings are unexpectedly already translated, despite 
being just added.


https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/officecfgregistrydataorgopenofficeofficeui/fi/?checksum=5d47902cd8b720d3

https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/officecfgregistrydataorgopenofficeofficeui/fi/?checksum=bee64c1d783dbc54

Where do these translations come from, seeing that they were not added 
by any Finnish l10n team member?


Best regards,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Weblate: help ranking what you need :)

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

Thanks to the Board for this initiative.

For me the most important enhancement would be the this:
https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/1861
Search should ignore hotkey symbols

However, it looks like it could be difficult to implement in Weblate's 
current architecture.


The following would be useful for translators who prefer to use external 
tools for translating:

https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/5519
Glossary import and export with explanations

Might be interesting to TDF:
https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/4551
Download in ODS file format

Tuomas

sophi kirjoitti 23.2.2022 10:47:

Hi all,

The Board would like to dedicate a budget to fund some Weblate
issues/enhancements and I'd like to have your feedback on what would
be the most important for your team.

Below is a list of tickets that I monitor on Weblate project. This is
what I think would help l10n teams to work faster but you may have
others in mind. So please review and rank the list. If you have other
tickets, also add them in the ranking. Thanks a lot in advance!



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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Weblate: help ranking what you need :)

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Sophie,

sophi kirjoitti 23.2.2022 16:13:

Hi Olivier,

Answering in detail to your request,
Le 23/02/2022 à 14:13, Olivier Hallot a écrit :

HI Sophie

My suggestions for weblate are

1) a link in the Weblate UI to go to the root of the project. In other 
words: to be able to go directly to


https://translations.documentfoundation.org/languages/pt_BR/libo_help-master/

I guess this is what Tuomas requested on #5447


What I was referring to in that issue is described here: 
https://docs.weblate.org/en/latest/workflows.html
Being able to set the translation workflow setting individually for each 
language could be useful if different language teams prefer different 
workflows. Currently in Weblate it's only possible to set it for all 
languages at once.


Best regards,
Tuomas



Cheers
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[libreoffice-l10n] Special cases translators ought to know?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

JO3EMC made an interesting observation a few days ago in Weblate: "It 
appears that the translated word for each of STRPOOLCOLLBLAHBLAHBLAH 
must be unique." [1]


At least I was unaware of this requirement and it isn't mentioned 
anywhere in the wiki as far as I can tell. Now the question arises: are 
there other special cases like this that translators ought to be aware 
of? There's a little bit of information on the wiki [2], but I don't 
know how up to date or complete that is.


BR,
Tuomas

[1] 
https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/swmessages/en/?checksum=567eac4187d03720#comments
[2] 
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/UI_and_Help_files_Content_Guide#Unique_terms


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] The word "common" in Chinese conversion dialog

[Tuomas Hietala]

Thanks, this is a very good explanation.

Tuomas

Kevin Suo kirjoitti 27.8.2021 3:22:

As explained in the Help page:

*"Translate common terms*
Converts words with two or more characters that are in the list of
common terms. After the list is scanned, the remaining text is
converted character by character."

The "Common Terms" list can be found on the UI if you open "Tools >
Language > Chinese Conversion" where there is a "Edit Terms" button.
Clicking on the button will open an "Edit Dictionary" dialog where you
can define your Common Terms.

For instance, if I've defined the following in the Common Terms list:
中国 --> 美国
(meaning: China --> United States)

Then if I type (or copy paste) the word 中国 into Writer and check the
"Translate common terms" opinion in the Chinese Conversion dialog, the
conversion result would be "美国".

That is to say, the "Common Terms" means the List of Common Terms
dictionary you have defined by yourself (which is blank by default).
In other words, it has nothing to do with "shared".

Please correct me if I am wrong.


Kevin Suo


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] The word "common" in Chinese conversion dialog

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Sophie,

sophi kirjoitti 25.8.2021 18:56:

below, there is the extended tip:
 Converts
words with two or more characters that are in the list of common terms.
After the list is scanned, the remaining text is converted character by
character.
So I'd say frequently occurring terms that are in the list.
But I don't write Chinese, so my understanding of the context may be
wrong :)


That would be my guess too, but in at least Finnish and Swedish it's 
currently translated the other way, i.e. "mutually shared". Are those 
translations based on guessing or knowledge? I have no idea.


Tuomas

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[libreoffice-l10n] The word "common" in Chinese conversion dialog

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

Does anyone know in which sense is the word "common" used in the 
following string?

https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/svxmessages/en/?checksum=904e3236f1d69307

In other words, is the meaning "translate mutually shared terms", 
"translate frequently occurring terms", or something else entirely?


As you can see, there are many possible meanings: 
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/common


Regards,
Tuomas Hietala

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[libreoffice-l10n] Glossary: strange additions & weakened discoverability

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

On Weblate just a moment ago, an unknown user added three strings to 
glossaries of at least several (I suspect all) languages. These are 
"Apply", "_OK" and "_Apply". How is this possible and was it 
intentional?


Also the recent Weblate update made glossaries more usable while 
translating, but unfortunately also harder to find otherwise. There's no 
direct link to glossary any more from the language pages. Would it be 
possible to change the glossary into a project that is listed among the 
other projects, as seen e.g. here: 
https://hosted.weblate.org/projects/mypaint/ Also, it would be nice to 
rename the glossary to something like "LibreOffice Glossary" as it is 
used for all projects, anyway, not just UI master.


Best regards,
Tuomas Hietala

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

[Tuomas Hietala]

Sophie kirjoitti 20.5.2021 21:32:

Le 20 mai 2021 18:52:03 GMT+02:00, Tuomas Hietala
 a écrit :

Hello,

sophi kirjoitti 20.5.2021 12:28:

I understand your point of view, but there is nothing we can do on

our

side, technically we need an existing ISO language code.


Looking at the list of languages at hosted.weblate.org, there seem to
be
at least several which probably don't have (official) ISO codes:
https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/

So I don't think having an official ISO language code is a strict
requirement on Weblate's part, at least.


Could you be more specific and name which ones?
Cheers
Sophie


I don't think "English (Developer)" is any officially ISO-recognised 
language, for example: 
https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/en_devel/#information


There's also stuff like this: 
https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/_DE/#information

Abd this: https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/untranslated/#information

It would seem to me that Weblate is happy to accept just about any 
made-up code, it doesn't have to be one of the officially recognised 
codes.


Cheers,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Setting Up Sesotho For LibreOffice Languages

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

sophi kirjoitti 20.5.2021 12:28:

I understand your point of view, but there is nothing we can do on our
side, technically we need an existing ISO language code.


Looking at the list of languages at hosted.weblate.org, there seem to be 
at least several which probably don't have (official) ISO codes: 
https://hosted.weblate.org/languages/


So I don't think having an official ISO language code is a strict 
requirement on Weblate's part, at least.


Best regards,
Tuomas

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[libreoffice-l10n] BASIC vs. basic

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

In LibreOffice, the programming language BASIC is mostly written as 
"Basic". This is a source of some confusion for translators (and I 
imagine many English-speaking users, too) as it's not always clear 
whether "Basic" should be interpreted as "basic" (a normal English word) 
or "BASIC" (the programming language).


Is there any particular reason for the current convention? Microsoft 
seems to be doing the same, but I don't know if that's a good enough 
reason for perpetuating the confusion.


Cheers,
Tuomas

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[libreoffice-l10n] Finnish l10n team update

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

The long-time Finnish l10n team leader Harri Pitkänen (CC'd) has stepped 
down from doing translations some time ago (although he has continued to 
contribute in other ways) and therefore is not up-to-date with the 
workings of Weblate. On the other hand I've been the de facto contact 
person for new translators for a while now and also the most active 
Finnish translator lately. So we agreed it's best that I take the 
contact person / team lead role officially.


I'd like to take the opportunity to thank Harri for his many years of 
volunteer translation work and for creating and maintaining the Voikko 
language tool, which provides Finnish spellchecking, hyphenation and 
grammar checking for LibreOffice as an extension. These are huge 
contributions, without which LibreOffice would be far less useful for 
Finnish speakers.


Best regards,
Tuomas Hietala

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Bulk translation of new " stock" strings

[Tuomas Hietala]

I see, thanks. I'm not subcribed to that list.

Tuomas

Caolán McNamara kirjoitti 18.2.2021 22:23:

This is from
https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/libreoffice/2021-January/086638.html
where previously all the ok, cancel, help buttons didn't have
translatable strings but used "stock" names like gtk-ok, gtk-cancel,
gtk-help. These "stock" names are deprecated in gtk3 and gone in gtk4
so we will need to provide our own translations for them in each
module.mo.

The attempted compromise was to use a context of "stock" for those
translations so each set would only appear once in each module.


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Bulk translation of new " stock" strings

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

What are these "stock" strings for anyway? And why isn't there a more 
meaningful context string?


BR,
Tuomas

Christian Lohmaier kirjoitti 25.1.2021 15:40:

Hi Olivier,

On Sat, Jan 23, 2021 at 12:44 AM Olivier Hallot
 wrote:

1) The recent additions of LibreOffice UI has some "stock" strings
repeated in many files. For example

https://translations.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/dbaccessmessages/pt_BR/?q=state:%3Ctranslated

_Add
_Cancel
_Delete
_OK
...
Up to 13 new strings like these above.

Is there a way to apply a translated string to all occurrences of 
these

"stock" strings in the many weblate projects?


Well, yes and no..
Stock weblate would handle this by going to the "other occurrences"
tab and using the "apply translation to all propagated strings".
However we modified the part that determines how to propagate strings
(across projects) - so doesn't work that way, as for that to work the
component name needs to be the same.

I did just modify it to also deal with context "stock" differently, so
that then is the way to do it in weblate.

And then there of course is scripted way for advanced users.

ciao
Christian


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Spellcheck in (latest) Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Sophie and Olivier,

Both issues seem to be fixed in the latest version (4.4.2).

Cheers,
Tuomas

sophi kirjoitti 18.1.2021 19:32:
It's a known issue of the last version see #4977. See also #5114 for 
the

loss of focus in the editor, however it works with the shortcut ctrl+n

Cheers
Sophie


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Localised gallery item titles - yay or nay?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

Ideally, yes, it would be nice to have them translatable. But I don't 
think it's high priority, as most languages have plenty of unfinished 
translation work left in other parts of LO.


Tuomas

Ilmari Lauhakangas kirjoitti 1.12.2020 19:30:

There is this old request:
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=90864
GALLERY: image tooltips/names not translated

If it were to be implemented, localisation information would have to
be somehow included inside the gallery packages. In other words, many
unknowns and moving parts. Also pending the finishing of the migration
to the new gallery package format.

I wanted to ask from the localisation community, do you consider it
important to have these translatable?

Ilmari


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Status of the ahelp -> extended tips migration?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Olivier,

Olivier Hallot kirjoitti 21.11.2020 0:23:

Hi Tuomas




We migrated of the ahelp contents to the extended tips of the
corresponding widgets in the *dialogs* only.

As you correctly pointed, many other ahelp tags are related to UNO
commands (menus and toolbars) as well as an old internal HID number, 
and

the migration/reuse is still open.

Therefore, we keep these non-migrated ahelp contents within tags in the
Help pages because there are relevant contents to preserve and is
scattered in all the Help awaiting a proper solution to reuse them.


Good to know. Is there any way to distinguish between the "dialog" and 
"non-dialog" ahelp strings in Help?



Any bulk changes will be addressed in a way to reduce to a minimum
translation rework.

The extended tips of dialogs will not be bulk-rewritten anymore. You 
can

translate them. Some languages had the Help fully translated and our
script reused the translation. Other languages hadn't the Help
translated so the translation now is on the UI part of weblate.

Last but not least, extended tips in dialogs can be updated, improved
and corrected. That must be carried with the dialog tools such as 
Glade,

in the /core/ project. The translation procedure works as usual. Feel
free to report mistakes in the weblate comments.

Kind regards
Olivier



Thanks for the information. It's not that I'm running out of things to 
translate either way, but the extended tips could be good "easyhacks" 
for new translators. It's still quite a lot of work in total and I 
wouldn't recommend people to start working on them if there was a risk 
of their translations being overwritten in bulk.


I'll keep reporting mistakes as I find them.

Best regards,
Tuomas

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[libreoffice-l10n] Status of the ahelp -> extended tips migration?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello all,

What's the current status of the "ahelp" -> extended tips migration? For 
the most part it looks like done, but on the other hand I found an ahelp 
string which does not seem to have a corresponding extended tip in LO UI 
master. [1]


Are there more changes still to come, or should the extended tips be 
considered ready to translate? In the latter case, can someone confirm 
that the extended tips in LO UI will be considered the "source of truth" 
going forward, so that translators will not painstakingly translate and 
review them just to find them later overwritten by the ahelp strings in 
Help?


Best regards,
Tuomas

[1] 
https://weblate.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_help-master/textshared/fi/?checksum=cc9e6c0edad1839d


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Translation of extended tooltips

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Rhoslyn,

The extended tips have landed in LO UI master, meaning that the 
translations will eventually appear in 7.1. I don't think there are 
plans to backport them to 7.0 (but maybe someone can confirm?).


Tuomas

Rhoslyn Prys kirjoitti 21.10.2020 16:43:

Will the Extended Tips work for locales of LibreOffice that do not
have a translation of the Help files?

I've tried checking the Welsh translations of the Extended Tips in
LibreOffice 7.0.2.2 (64bit) but none of the ones translated appear.

I've checked the Tools - Options- LibreOffice - General > Extended 
tips.


When I try turning them on temporarily Shift+F1 I get a dialog:

The internal LibreOffice help for the UI language has not been
installed (back translated ;-) )

or nothing.

It could be that none of the Welsh translation of Extended Tips that
I've done so far have been included in 7.0.2.2.

At the moment I'm not getting anything via any of these options. I'm a
hesitant to continue to translate the Extended Tips if they will not
appear without the whole Help files having been translated.

Any suggestions? Thanks.

Rhos


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Large increase in translation strings

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi all,

I noticed that besides the string "extended_tip", some of the extended 
tips are marked with "extended tip" (without the underscore) or 
"extended tips". It would be nice if the latter two varieties were 
changed to "extended_tip" in order to make searching easier.


Thanks,
Tuomas

Tuomas Hietala kirjoitti 3.9.2020 12:05:

Hi Rhoslyn,

It appears at least some of the extended tips can be identified by
looking for the string "extended_tip" in the Context part. If all of
them are marked like that, you should be able to find everything else
by searching "NOT extended_tip" in Weblate.

BR,
Tuomas

Rhoslyn Prys kirjoitti 1.9.2020 18:22:

Is there any way of being able to identify new content coming through
and separate them from the 'extended help tips project'?


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Large increase in translation strings

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Rhoslyn,

It appears at least some of the extended tips can be identified by 
looking for the string "extended_tip" in the Context part. If all of 
them are marked like that, you should be able to find everything else by 
searching "NOT extended_tip" in Weblate.


BR,
Tuomas

Rhoslyn Prys kirjoitti 1.9.2020 18:22:

Is there any way of being able to identify new content coming through
and separate them from the 'extended help tips project'?


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Translation of extended tooltips

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Olivier,

Olivier Hallot kirjoitti 20.8.2020 14:59:

The strings are copied. No changes in Help, and contents inside 
tag will continue.

Synching back from extended tips to  is possible but will 
require

some amount of development in the Help build.

Note: At the moment, we are only working to copy  contents that
belongs to a dialog (known as an *.ui file). Contents related to .uno
command and HID codes often related to menus and toolbars) will be
addressed later.


Thanks for the information. Is there a way to search for only the 
 contents that
belong to a dialog in Weblate (so I could review the translations for 
just those and leave the rest for later)?


Best regards,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Translation of extended tooltips

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello Sophie (& Olivier & Christian),

sophi kirjoitti 18.8.2020 18:20:

Hi Milos,
Le 18/08/2020 à 16:35, Milos Sramek a écrit :

Hi,

maybe that you have already noticed - strings of extended tooltips
started to appear in the UI strings, there are currently 170 of them.
Originally, they were a part of the help files, where they were marked
by the  tag. There are currently 6000+ extended tooltips there.

This means that their translations need to to be transferred from the
help files to the UI files (I exclude the option to translate them 
again).


Maybe the developers will solve this somehow.


Olivier and Christian were looking at it, yes.


Will there be an easy way to identify the translations transferred from 
the help files? If not, would you mind holding this off for Finnish for 
now? I'm currently reviewing the Finnish UI translations, whereas the 
Help translations are not reviewed. Adding 6000+ unreviewed strings to 
the mix would cause confusion as to which strings have been reviewed and 
which have not been. It would be easier the review the translations of 
extended tips on the Help side before transferring them the UI side.


Also, will the strings be moved or just copied? I.e. will there be two 
copies of each extended tip to keep in sync?


Best regards,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] LibreOffice 7.0 banner for translation

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

For Finnish (fi):
Tehokas - Yhteensopiva - Helppokäyttöinen

Cheers,
Tuomas

Mike Saunders kirjoitti 29.7.2020 18:58:

Hello,

I've created this banner, that we can use for social media and other
things around the LibreOffice 7.0 launch:

https://blog.documentfoundation.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/LO70_banner_tagline_hires.png

If anyone wants me to make a localised version, just post your
translation of the three words "Performance - Compatibility - 
Usability"

and I'll put them into the dark blue bar. Here's what I did for German,
for instance:

https://de.blog.documentfoundation.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/7/2020/07/LO70_banner_tagline_hires_DE.png

Note that the English uses nouns, and the German version adjectives, so
feel free to play around and use whatever's best for your language. The
main goal is to show those three focal points of the release!

--
Mike Saunders, Marketing and Community Coordinator
The Document Foundation


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Incorrectly translated string in many languages

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi,

Thanks for pointing this out. The exception works, Finnish translation 
fixed.


BR,
Tuomas

Mihkel Tõnnov kirjoitti 8.7.2020 21:57:
For a handful of languages, there has been an exception added to the 
code

to use %MOD1+comma and Shift+%MOD1+comma instead:
Finnish (fi) - translations still refers to semicolon


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Combine Weblate glossaries?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Seems to work. Thanks!

BR,
Tuomas

Christian Lohmaier kirjoitti 7.7.2020 12:26:
On Tue, Jul 7, 2020 at 10:52 AM Tuomas Hietala  
wrote:


In TDF Weblate, LO UI master and LO Online are different projects. 
This

means the glossaries could not be shared previously.

Weblate 4.1, however, introduced the ability to use glossaries across
projects. TDF Weblate admins should just enable it.


Just did that now...

ciao
Christian


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Combine Weblate glossaries?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

In TDF Weblate, LO UI master and LO Online are different projects. This 
means the glossaries could not be shared previously.


Weblate 4.1, however, introduced the ability to use glossaries across 
projects. TDF Weblate admins should just enable it.


BR,
Tuomas

Donald kirjoitti 7.7.2020 1:09:

After working on LO UI Master in Weblate and entering lots of strings
into the glossary, I have changed to editing LO Online. There appears
to be no glossy entries available.

The Help says:
Glossaries are shared among all components of the same project and you
can also choose to share them with another projects.

Therefore I expected that the glossary entries that I have entered for
the UI and for Help would be available for Online as well. Is there
something I have to do for this to happen?

--
Donald


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Re: [libreoffice-website] Translation contributors page not updated

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi all,

Yes, I too think using the wiki is a good idea going forward. But how 
about the translators between 2015 (when, judging by the version 
numbers, the contributor page was last updated) and 2019 (when Weblate 
was adopted)? Are the names of contributors still recoverable from 
Pootle?


BR,
Tuomas

sophi kirjoitti 6.7.2020 15:07:

Hi Adolfo,
Le 06/07/2020 à 13:56, Adolfo Jayme Barrientos a écrit :

On Mon, Jul 6, 2020 at 6:43 AM sophi  wrote:
Thanks a lot for pointing on that, I'll update the page taking the 
stats

provided by Weblate. I'll do so on Wednesday.


Oh, so the page is manually updated after all. I stand corrected.

Then, why not move that information to the wiki so any of us in each
translation team can take that burden off you at any point?
After all, this page exists:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language/Contributors

Let’s integrate everything in one place to avoid confusing people and 
visitors.


Yes, that's a good idea. So if all are happy with that, what I can do 
is

add all the l10n contributors we have in Weblate to that page.
Also, for information, Weblate contributions will also be reflected 
soon

here: https://dashboard.documentfoundation.org/
Cheers
Sophie

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Translation contributors page not updated

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

The information on that page was not up to date last year either, before 
the introduction of Weblate. So it certainly wasn't being automatically 
updated back then, and it looks like it probably hasn't been updated in 
a few years.


It certainly *should* be automatically updated, or someone should make 
manually the effort to properly credit translators for their 
contributions.


BR,
Tuomas

Adolfo Jayme Barrientos kirjoitti 5.7.2020 12:04:

That page is automatically updated by the software itself whenever a
user logs on and works on something. Since we translators don’t use it
anymore, how do you expect it to still be up to date?


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[libreoffice-l10n] Tags in Help: never to be translated?

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

There's quite a bit of information on translating Help content on the 
wiki: 
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/UI_and_Help_files_Content_Guide


A TL;DR sort of summary or guideline on the XML tags part would be 
useful, so I'm asking if the following statement would be correct:
"Do not translate anything inside a tag (that is, between angle 
brackets)."


Reading the wiki page, my understanding is that anything between < and 
the nearest > either should not be translated or has no effect if 
translated. The only exception to this would appear to be the xml-lang 
attribute in the  tag. However, based on a quick search, the 
xml-lang attribute doesn't seem to be actually used in  tags 
anywhere in Help. Perhaps the information on the wiki is outdated?


Best regards,
Tuomas

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Weblate documentation on the wiki

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Sophie,

I would prioritise information that is specific to LO/TDF and therefore 
isn't (and won't be) included in Weblate's documentation. For new 
translators, that would mean things like where to start, what to 
prioritise, who to contact in case there are problems, how the LO 
release process works, how/where to report errors in strings, what 
LO/TDF-specific settings or customisations are there in Weblate, etc. 
For translators who have participated in the Pootle era, a quick summary 
of the main differences between Pootle and Weblate might be useful.


Also the names of the components can be quite confusing. It's hard to 
tell what something like nlpsolver/src/com/sun/star/comp/Calc/NLPSolver 
does, exactly. If it's not possible to add more descriptive names in 
Weblate, the current names should be explained in the wiki.


Cheers,
Tuomas

sophi kirjoitti 20.2.2020 16:48:

Hi all,

For Pootle we had a guide here:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/PootleGuide
because there was no documentation on Pootle at the beginning.
Do you think it's needed to have the same level of documentation for
Weblate? There is already a help provided with the product, so I think
to detail only our settings when they are specific or not obvious.
What do you think?
Cheers
Sophie


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Behaviour of the "Needs editing" flag in Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Christian,

Thanks for the detailed explanation. I think perhaps the key issue here 
is Weblate using the words "Needs editing" with two quite different 
meanings, depending on the configuration. In some projects hosted on 
other Weblate instances, "Needs editing" basically means "I'll let this 
one pass for now but someone needs to take a look at it at some point" 
whereas currently in TDF Weblate it means "Nope, not gonna fly, this one 
goes immediately back to the drawing board". But this is of course not 
specifically related to LO/TDF and should probably be addressed 
upstream.


I'm fine with the current configuration, too, but I think it will keep 
causing surprises to translators in the future if it's not documented 
properly. With regard to search, in Weblate it mostly works very well, 
but is not the answer here when the problem is how to mark found dubious 
strings for later review/editing. As for the review workflow, I have no 
experience of it but I'd guess it would probably need more active 
translators than the Finnish l10n team currently has to be worthwhile.


Cheers,
Tuomas

Christian Lohmaier kirjoitti 14.2.2020 16:53:

Hi *,

On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 11:22 AM sophi  wrote:

Le 14/02/2020 à 10:49, Tuomas Hietala a écrit :
>
> I already unflagged many of them as I saw what was happening, but here's
> an example that I can cofirm showing up in English in Finnish-language
> LO as of 6.4.0:
> 
https://weblate.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/filtermessages/fi/?checksum=90e8d59d903deeb9
>
> It's in the PDF export dialog, on the second tab from the left.

That should not fall back to English if the string is fuzzy.


That's default behaviour for gettext/msgfmt though. By default fuzzy
strings are ignored and not taken into account/are omitted from the
generated .mo file.
And fuzzy/needs work is default behaviour in weblate, so no changes
here. So if other projects treat fuzzy translations as valid in the
program, they either explicitly use the --use-fuzzy switch to msgfmt
or filter it out using some other means.

And traditionally it is used to flags strings that were
auto-translated during the update of templates, where the change looks
similar enough for the msgmerge program that it thinks the translation
is the same, but with slight changes that make it not 100% certain
about it. Sure it can be used by humans as well, but for that most
tools (at least the web-based ones) have replaced that by the concept
of suggestions. (but they would work similar fashion: unless it is
accepted the string will be treated as untranslated (or the current
translation will be used in case the suggestion is to change an
existing one)

Weblate would allow for a dedicated review workflow, in which a
translated string would still be listed as translated, but will still
be flagged for review.
This would be a project-wide setting though and not a language specific 
one.

https://docs.weblate.org/en/weblate-3.10.3/workflows.html#dedicated-reviewers

If it is about reviewing changes by new translators, you could also
use a project's history and advanced search.
There's history available under e.g.
https://weblate.documentfoundation.org/languages/fi/#history for all
projects for a language or
https://weblate.documentfoundation.org/languages/fi/libo_help-master/#history
for a specific project.

Also you can use search with advanced query tags, e.g.
changed:>=2020-01-01 AND NOT changed_by:cloph

for all changes done since January first and not done by me. (I assume
excluding a small group of reviewers here is easier than listing
"untrusted"/watched users here.)

tldr;
* fuzzy strings are considered untranslated
  → could be changed in msgfmt invocation
  → changing that requires consensus of ~all translation teams
* weblate would support review workflow
  → can only be changed on a per-project level
 → should have consensus by significant number of translation teams
 (not using the process will not break things per se, it just
means that permissions need to be tweaked that every translator can
also set their own translation as reviewed or people need to ignore
"needs review" state)
* weblate has history/powerful search that can be used to review
strings manually/in batch without a special flag
  → no consensus needed/each project can do whatever they want
 → manual work/need to manually keep track of "last checked date"
or similar.

ciao
Christian


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Behaviour of the "Needs editing" flag in Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Sophie,

I already unflagged many of them as I saw what was happening, but here's 
an example that I can cofirm showing up in English in Finnish-language 
LO as of 6.4.0: 
https://weblate.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/filtermessages/fi/?checksum=90e8d59d903deeb9


It's in the PDF export dialog, on the second tab from the left.

Best regards,
Tuomas

sophi kirjoitti 11.2.2020 16:02:

Hi Tuomas,
Le 10/02/2020 à 12:48, Tuomas Hietala a écrit :

Hello,

Currently TDF Weblate seems to be set up to revert to the original
English string when a translated string is flagged as "needs editing".
I.e. the English string is shown in the UI instead of the flagged
translation. As the Weblate workflow in LibreOffice has not been
documented yet, I don't know whether this is intentional or not.
However, this is different from some other projects I have translated 
on

other Weblate instances, so the behaviour may be different from what
some people are used to.

Because of this, it's currently probably not a good idea to flag all
strings needing editing as "needs editing" (as I initially did), but
only to flag strings where the translation is clearly wrong or 
confusing

enough that the English string is preferred. I think this limits the
usefulness of the flag somewhat, but I guess comments could be used 
for

the same purpose also.


Could you send a direct link to an example of such string? Thanks in 
advance

Cheers
Sophie

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[libreoffice-l10n] Behaviour of the "Needs editing" flag in Weblate

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

Currently TDF Weblate seems to be set up to revert to the original 
English string when a translated string is flagged as "needs editing". 
I.e. the English string is shown in the UI instead of the flagged 
translation. As the Weblate workflow in LibreOffice has not been 
documented yet, I don't know whether this is intentional or not. 
However, this is different from some other projects I have translated on 
other Weblate instances, so the behaviour may be different from what 
some people are used to.


Because of this, it's currently probably not a good idea to flag all 
strings needing editing as "needs editing" (as I initially did), but 
only to flag strings where the translation is clearly wrong or confusing 
enough that the English string is preferred. I think this limits the 
usefulness of the flag somewhat, but I guess comments could be used for 
the same purpose also.


Best regards,
Tuomas Hietala

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Please clarify translation deadlines

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Christian,

I updated the wiki page myself. Please correct if needed:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Translating_LibreOffice

-Tuomas

Christian Lohmaier kirjoitti 3.2.2020 16:54:

Hi Tuomas, *,

On Mon, Feb 3, 2020 at 3:39 PM Tuomas Hietala  
wrote:


Thanks for the explanation. However, it's not explained on either of 
the

wiki pages mentioned earlier that tags are created already on the
previous week. Would you mind adding that bit of information?


The times for each RC are listed. And the weeks for the RCs are also
the week that applies to the translation-deadline (1st day of the
week, aka the Monday)

e.g: for 6.4.0:
[…]
RC2  Week 2 , Jan 6, 2020 - Jan 12, 2020
RC3  Week 4 , Jan 20, 2020 - Jan 26, 2020

To have the translations included in the RC2, which is tagged in Week
2, the translations have to be submitted until January 6.
For RC3, week4, it is January 20.

Or better yet, there is a "whiteboard" feature in Weblate, which 
allows

admins to send messages to translators. It would be good to have the
deadlines announced in advance. Or this mailing list or the wiki could
also be used.


The ReleasePlan is pretty static, changes to the plan are rare.
(and most of the times it then would be delays, and not shifting the
deadline to an earlier date).
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleasePlan/6.4

ciao
Christian


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Please clarify translation deadlines

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Christian,

Thanks for the explanation. However, it's not explained on either of the 
wiki pages mentioned earlier that tags are created already on the 
previous week. Would you mind adding that bit of information?


Or better yet, there is a "whiteboard" feature in Weblate, which allows 
admins to send messages to translators. It would be good to have the 
deadlines announced in advance. Or this mailing list or the wiki could 
also be used.


-Tuomas

Christian Lohmaier kirjoitti 3.2.2020 16:14:

Hi Tuomas, *,

On Mon, Feb 3, 2020 at 2:11 PM Tuomas Hietala  
wrote:


I've been updating a lot of the Finnish translations of LO recently
(translated in Weblate on master branch, automatically propagated to 
6.3

and 6.4) However, I noticed many of them didn't make it to the 6.4.0
release.


There was a bug/oversight that caused a problem here: not all
translations that were done on weblate were actually flushed out and
committed to the repository when I prepared the release.


Reading [1] and [2], I was under the impression that
translations made on Monday 27th January or earlier should have been
picked up in 6.4.0,


No, you missed something up. While it is true that if translations are
done on Monday, they are included in the release, since prepping of
the tag typically happens Tuesday evening or on Wednesday.
But it needs to be the Monday of the tag-creation week, not the one of
the final release announcement. The last RC is renamed and released as
final, so no updates to translations are possible.
So for 6.4.0 the translations the deadline would have been January 20.
I did export the translations from weblate on Tuesday the 21st - but
as mentioned that didn't include all translations that were done in
pootle, the changes only were partially reflected in the repository.


but this clearly isn't the case. Did I misunderstand
something, is the information in the wiki wrong, or was there some 
other

issue?


Both a misunderstanding (the RC week is the deadline, not final
release), and specifically for 6.4.0 there also was another issue.

see also https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=130365

ciao
Christian


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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Please clarify translation deadlines

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Ming,

Thanks for the explanation. I think there's something else going on too, 
though, because it looks like even changes older than Jan 20 - Jan 26 
didn't make it in. For example, an item in the Help menu:


https://weblate.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-master/officecfgregistrydataorgopenofficeofficeui/fi/?checksum=3a686476bd15eb83#history
Weblate says this is three weeks old (no exact date unfortunately).

It was also correctly propagated to 6.4 branch, so that not the issue 
here:

https://weblate.documentfoundation.org/translate/libo_ui-6-4/officecfgregistrydataorgopenofficeofficeui/fi/?checksum=3a686476bd15eb83

-Tuomas

Ming H. kirjoitti 3.2.2020 15:46:

Hi Tuomas,

-- Original --
From: "Tuomas Hietala" ;
Subject: [libreoffice-l10n] Please clarify translation deadlines


I've been updating a lot of the Finnish translations of LO recently
(translated in Weblate on master branch, automatically propagated to 
6.3

and 6.4) However, I noticed many of them didn't make it to the 6.4.0
release. Reading [1] and [2], I was under the impression that
translations made on Monday 27th January or earlier should have been
picked up in 6.4.0, but this clearly isn't the case. Did I 
misunderstand
something, is the information in the wiki wrong, or was there some 
other

issue?

[1] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Translating_LibreOffice
[2] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleasePlan


While I agree the deadline section of [1] is not clear, one thing you 
missed

is that for the final release of a version (i.e. not RC1, RC2, etc.),
there is an
extra week of "wait for testing and make sure no showstopper in there"
period, and the actual code-changing deadline should be a week before 
the
release week, the same as the last RC.  So for the 6.4.0 case, the code 
was

tagged in Git sometime in the Jan. 20th - Jan. 26th week [3], and your
expectation of Jan 27th was definitely too late.

I'll leave the clarification of the exact dates to others.

3. https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleasePlan/6.4#6.4.0_release

Hope this helps,
Ming


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[libreoffice-l10n] Please clarify translation deadlines

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hello,

I've been updating a lot of the Finnish translations of LO recently 
(translated in Weblate on master branch, automatically propagated to 6.3 
and 6.4) However, I noticed many of them didn't make it to the 6.4.0 
release. Reading [1] and [2], I was under the impression that 
translations made on Monday 27th January or earlier should have been 
picked up in 6.4.0, but this clearly isn't the case. Did I misunderstand 
something, is the information in the wiki wrong, or was there some other 
issue?


Best regards,
Tuomas Hietala

[1] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Translating_LibreOffice
[2] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleasePlan

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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Weblate meeting at Fosdem, feedback needed

[Tuomas Hietala]

Hi Sophie,

Here are a couple:

Search should ignore ampersands #1861
https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/1861
In LibreOffice the characters to be ignored by default should be 
underscores and tildes instead of ampersands, though.
This might have to wait for the backend changes coming in Weblate 4.0 in 
April.


Translation propagation #3166
https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/3166
The patches in TDF Weblate that make this work should be contributed 
upstream, if feasible.


Best regards,
Tuomas Hietala


Hi all,



During Fosdem, we (Christian and me) will attend Michal's BOF and will
meet with other projects.



Here is a list of issues that we would like to discuss and see how we
can help to solve them:



Team management possibility by language admins
Return "Edit user" privilege back in a better way #2493
https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/2127



Per language glossary management (instead of per project)
https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/1158



Glossary matches on a single word instead of the whole string
https://github.com/WeblateOrg/weblate/issues/2183



Are there any other issues you have under your radar that should be
discussed?
Thanks in advance,
Cheers
Sophie


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