RE: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
Alex At 10:34 16.01.2004 +0100, Alex Rhomberg wrote: Mike wrote: A Linux Embedded Appliance Framework delivered in easy-to-use branches. Specific branches target a variety of environments. Anything from enterprise networks and Internet service providers to small office/home office environments are supported. I haven't seen a LEAF branch that targets the enterprise. Some requirements of the enterprise are: - central management for multiple firewalls: Probably best addressed with the FWBuilder support and the LEAF construction kit I am trying to get LEAF to be a target for the ISCS framework, which might even be closer to an enterprise solution. ... cheers Erich --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
RE: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
Mike wrote: A Linux Embedded Appliance Framework delivered in easy-to-use branches. Specific branches target a variety of environments. Anything from enterprise networks and Internet service providers to small office/home office environments are supported. I haven't seen a LEAF branch that targets the enterprise. Some requirements of the enterprise are: - central management for multiple firewalls: Probably best addressed with the FWBuilder support and the LEAF construction kit - Firewalls with many ports (16 is common): Again probably the easiest with FWBuilder - HA clusters/Failover solutions - Central Log management - Multiple users supported Depending on the environment, you'll also want - VPN for roaming users with NAT Traversal and DHCP through the VPN (almost there..) - RADIUS support, SecurID support - dynamic firewall rules with login - trunking, VRRP, HSRP, whatever Considering the feedback on my contributions which are targeted at larger environments (but not large), I don't think many people are interested. People seem to prefer stonegate as a Linux solution. BTW, I have seen stonegate on a FW-500ME, the same appliance box that we use for LEAF. Cheers Alex --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
Re: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
Am Freitag, 16. Januar 2004 10:34 schrieb Alex Rhomberg: Mike wrote: A Linux Embedded Appliance Framework delivered in easy-to-use branches. Specific branches target a variety of environments. Anything from enterprise networks and Internet service providers to small office/home office environments are supported. I haven't seen a LEAF branch that targets the enterprise. Some requirements of the enterprise are: - central management for multiple firewalls: Probably best addressed with the FWBuilder support and the LEAF construction kit - Firewalls with many ports (16 is common): Again probably the easiest with FWBuilder - HA clusters/Failover solutions - Central Log management - Multiple users supported Depending on the environment, you'll also want - VPN for roaming users with NAT Traversal and DHCP through the VPN (almost there..) - RADIUS support, SecurID support - dynamic firewall rules with login - trunking, VRRP, HSRP, whatever Alex; we are talking about goals - some of them has eached, some of them not, but maybe in the future. LEAF works from home office to small office right now stable and with more features a usual user is asking for. We could even close down development and put everything in maintenance mode (only security fixes, providing support, improving docs) and most of LEAF users will be satisfied a long time. But some features already provided are mostly beyond this target audience - like zebra/quagga, your FWBuilder support and probably ipv6 (at least for the near future). On the other side there are members working on new ideas to make installation/configuration easier for home users. I believe moving any branch to support larger environments than small office is a _goal_, though we may fail :), like it is a goal to improve installation and configuration for SOHO users. kp --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
RE: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
On Thu, 2004-01-15 at 19:07, Mike Noyes wrote: A Linux Embedded Appliance Framework delivered in easy-to-use branches. Specific branches target a variety of environments. Anything from enterprise networks and Internet service providers to small office/home office environments are supported. (244 characters) - or - Linux Embedded Appliance Framework (LEAF) LEAF is a embedded network appliance framework delivered in branches. Branches are targeted at, but not limited to, the following appliance-oriented tasks: LAN/WAN router, Internet border router, wireless access point (WAP), and telemetry box. (243 characters) -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ SF.net Projects: ffl, leaf, phpwebsite, phpwebsite-comm, sitedocs --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
RE: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
On Fri, 2004-01-16 at 10:43, Mike Noyes wrote: Linux Embedded Appliance Framework (LEAF) LEAF is a embedded network appliance framework delivered in branches. Branches are targeted at, but not limited to, the following appliance-oriented tasks: LAN/WAN router, Internet border router, wireless access point (WAP), and telemetry box. (243 characters) Linux Embedded Appliance Framework (LEAF) LEAF is an embedded network appliance framework delivered in branches. Branches are targeted at, but not limited to, the following appliance-oriented tasks: LAN/WAN router, Internet border router/firewall, wireless access point (WAP), and telemetry box. (253 characters) Other appliance-oriented tasks: print server, mail forwarder, web server, X-10 controller, system rescue, thin client, and probably more that I forgot. -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ SF.net Projects: ffl, leaf, phpwebsite, phpwebsite-comm, sitedocs --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
RE: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
Linux Embedded Appliance Framework (LEAF) LEAF is an embedded network appliance framework delivered in branches. Branches are targeted at, but not limited to, the following appliance-oriented tasks: LAN/WAN router, Internet border router/firewall, wireless access point (WAP), and telemetry box. (253 characters) I like this one. Except for the Framework; I though that frameworks by definition don't do anything but just provide a framework that can be filled with your work. I wouldn't call LEAF a framework. I'd probably change the description to LAN/WAN/Internet border router/firewall and replace the telemetry box with VPN gateway Linux Embedded Appliance Firewall (LEAF) LEAF is an embedded network appliance framework delivered in branches. Branches are targeted at, but not limited to, the following appliance-oriented tasks: LAN/WAN/Internet border router/firewall, wireless access point (WAP), and VPN gateway. (a bit less than 253 characters) Cheers Alex --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
RE: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
we are talking about goals - some of them has eached, some of them not, but maybe in the future. LEAF works from home office to small office right now stable and with more features a usual user is asking for. We could even close down development and put everything in maintenance mode (only security fixes, providing support, improving docs) and most of LEAF users will be satisfied a long time. There is definitely some useful work that can be done in the management/configuration area und to improve the upgrading process (separate config and data) Even maintenance mode needs quite some work, just to compile new packages from new software releases. I believe moving any branch to support larger environments than small office is a _goal_, though we may fail :), like it is a goal to improve installation and configuration for SOHO users. Moving to larger environments is one thing, but the enterprise is and IMHO will remain beyond the reach of LEAF, because a big firewall has enough space for a current distro. Eventually a fully open source Linux firewall will be ready for the enterprise, probably because a hardware vendor wants to attack the Nokia/Checkpoint Combo. But it will hardly be based on LEAF. Cheers Alex --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
RE: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
On Fri, 2004-01-16 at 12:06, Alex Rhomberg wrote: Linux Embedded Appliance Framework (LEAF) LEAF is an embedded network appliance framework delivered in branches. Branches are targeted at, but not limited to, the following appliance-oriented tasks: LAN/WAN router, Internet border router/firewall, wireless access point (WAP), and telemetry box. (253 characters) Except for the Framework; I though that frameworks by definition don't do anything but just provide a framework that can be filled with your work. I wouldn't call LEAF a framework. Alex, Last time we were discussing a project description change framework was the best solution we came up with for replacing firewall. Neither describe LEAF well. I'm open to suggestions for F in our acronym. I think of a framework as a basic structure for creating things. Basic structure can be nebulously defined as our development model, build environment, and branch. Thing would be a network appliance-oriented task. Linux Embedded Appliance Firewall (LEAF) LEAF is an embedded network appliance framework delivered in branches. Branches are targeted at, but not limited to, the following appliance-oriented tasks: LAN/WAN/Internet border router/firewall, wireless access point (WAP), and VPN gateway. (a bit less than 253 characters) I like this. :-) Everyone, Are there any opinions, comments, or suggestions for the proposed project description above? -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ SF.net Projects: ffl, leaf, phpwebsite, phpwebsite-comm, sitedocs --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
RE: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
On Fri, 2004-01-16 at 12:51, Mike Noyes wrote: On Fri, 2004-01-16 at 12:06, Alex Rhomberg wrote: LEAF is an embedded network appliance framework delivered in branches. Branches are targeted at, but not limited to, the following appliance-oriented tasks: LAN/WAN/Internet border router/firewall, wireless access point (WAP), and VPN gateway. (a bit less than 253 characters) I like this. :-) Everyone, Are there any opinions, comments, or suggestions for the proposed project description above? Updated DocManager with new proposal. Please review and comment. Thanks. Description https://sourceforge.net/docman/display_doc.php?docid=1396group_id=13751 -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ SF.net Projects: ffl, leaf, phpwebsite, phpwebsite-comm, sitedocs --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
Re: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
At 12:08 PM 1/15/2004 -0800, Mike Noyes wrote: Everyone, The subject of our current project description and goals was brought up again. I'd like feedback on the state of the new version I posted here: Description https://sourceforge.net/docman/display_doc.php?docid=1396group_id=13751 I think this sentence should change from: An easy to use embedded Linux network appliance for use in small office, home office, and home automation environments. to: An easy to use embedded Linux network appliance for use in LAN, WAN, and WLAN environments. Why make this change? I don't know what the revised sentence is intended to convey. Really, any device that contains a NIC is for use in LAN, WAN, and WLAN environments ... making this new description not very ... well, not very descriptive of anything. The second sentence (not quoted above) identifies the main everyday use of LEAF quite nicely, without restricting us to routing and firewalling uses. But my reaction comes without knowing the reason why a change is even being considered. Did I somehow miss a recent thread here in which this topic was brought up again? Or are you (Mike) getting off-list requests for revisions? Personally, I like the existing wording just fine. Keep in mind, any change to our project description and goals must be approved by the SF.net staff. --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
Re: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
On Thu, 2004-01-15 at 12:40, Ray Olszewski wrote: But my reaction comes without knowing the reason why a change is even being considered. Did I somehow miss a recent thread here in which this topic was brought up again? Or are you (Mike) getting off-list requests for revisions? Ray, Yes. Some people want to move away from the SOHO definition to a broader interpretation. This was discussed as a possibility in the past, but wording was never agreed to. My attempt above was very poor. Sorry. It didn't convey the intended change. I'm open to suggestions. Personally, I like the existing wording just fine. I like the new proposed goals better than our current ones. We've completed most of our current ones. I believe it's our description that people wish to work on. It's very hard to write a good description in 255 characters. Current goals: Create an inclusive environment for current developers of the Linux Router Project to release their modifications to the public. Support continued development of Linux Router Project derived LEAF images and packages. Create a new LEAF version based on an embedded Linux distribution with 2.4 kernel support, while retaining the option to install the target environment on a floppy attached to the target. Proposed change: Create an inclusive environment where LEAF project members and the extended community are free to release content to the public. Support continued development of current LEAF releases/branches. Create new LEAF releases/branches with current Linux kernels and libraries, while retaining the option to install the target environment on various devices attached to the target. Maintain as small a footprint as possible for release/branch target installations. Promote creation of packages usable by all LEAF releases/branches. Note: I don't want to change our goals while a change to our description is being considered. I only want to approach the SF staff once. -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ SF.net Projects: ffl, leaf, phpwebsite, phpwebsite-comm, sitedocs --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
Re: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
On Thu, 2004-01-15 at 13:19, Mike Noyes wrote: On Thu, 2004-01-15 at 12:40, Ray Olszewski wrote: But my reaction comes without knowing the reason why a change is even being considered. Did I somehow miss a recent thread here in which this topic was brought up again? Or are you (Mike) getting off-list requests for revisions? Ray, Yes. Some people want to move away from the SOHO definition to a broader interpretation. This was discussed as a possibility in the past, but wording was never agreed to. Ray, The other description change under consideration was a move away from firewall to something like framework. -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ SF.net Projects: ffl, leaf, phpwebsite, phpwebsite-comm, sitedocs --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
RE: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
An easy to use embedded Linux network appliance for use in small office, home office, and home automation environments. to: An easy to use embedded Linux network appliance for use in LAN, WAN, and WLAN environments. What about: An easy-to-use Embedded Linux Network Applicance; LEAF, like Linux, aims to be scalable to all environments. I don't see the added value in LAN/WAN talk, although WLAN might add some relevance. Cheers, Peter M --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
RE: [leaf-devel] Project Description Goals
On Thu, 2004-01-15 at 14:14, Peter Mueller wrote: An easy-to-use Embedded Linux Network Applicance; LEAF, like Linux, aims to be scalable to all environments. I don't see the added value in LAN/WAN talk, although WLAN might add some relevance. Everyone, Does this sound any better? A Linux Embedded Appliance Framework delivered in easy-to-use branches. Specific branches target a variety of environments. Anything from enterprise networks and Internet service providers to small office/home office environments are supported. (244 characters) -- Mike Noyes mhnoyes at users.sourceforge.net http://sourceforge.net/users/mhnoyes/ SF.net Projects: ffl, leaf, phpwebsite, phpwebsite-comm, sitedocs --- The SF.Net email is sponsored by EclipseCon 2004 Premiere Conference on Open Tools Development and Integration See the breadth of Eclipse activity. February 3-5 in Anaheim, CA. http://www.eclipsecon.org/osdn ___ leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
