Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
Kirsten Bowman wrote: Nina: Regarding your third question, I've often been faced with the same dilemma and found a good suggestion in Getting It Right by Mary H. Slawson. She recommends using the name by which the person would have called himself/herself. I had a Wilhelmus (baptism) or Wilhelm (marriage), but his will was signed William so that's what I use as the preferred name. My database is primarily for posting at RootsWeb, however, and other researchers of this line most often use Wilhelmus for this individual. In order to have my file picked up in searches, I now show him as William or Wilhelmus. May I add to this, since we have the wonderful feature of AKA's it is made easier to clarify all the names used by an ancestor. In the tittle suffix I place info about were the AKA was found. i.e. Say John Smith was spelled John Smitt in his marriage record in 1830. I place in the suffix His MARR-1830, this way I will always know, when I search through the name list which spellings were used and when. Very handy when I go through digitalized records. Before this I was taught to use the spelling of the name (first and last) of birth/bap etc All the other spellings went into the notes. Actually I believed then it was a general rule :-)) Still this way I always know were the name comes from, that's why I am still using the birth/bap etc name as main one, see no use in changing it with so many names in my database. I have an additional issue, that is, names in a non-Latin languages, this gives many different spellings when names pop up in latin languages or when you have to translate it yourself.. And no way of recording the original spelling. I started to put these in a document of Word, and now face the task of integrating them user-friendly into Legacy. Probably I will use PDF files or print screens .jpg and attach them to the individual. Any other idea's are welcome though I am still in doubt how to do this. Keren *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names
Some interesting questions here Nina - my comments are bewlow; Ron Ferguson _ For Genealogy, Software and Social visit: http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/fergys/ *Use Legacy Search - see My Blogs* Includes the family tree for Alan J Grimshaw http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/fergys/Grimshaw/ __ Date: Sat, 9 Dec 2006 10:01:15 + From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. I guess I should create an event but I'm not sure how to name it or how word it: [HeShe] signed the document... or the document is signed by [Name]. I normally don't record whether literate or otherwise. If I did I would probably just put some thing in the notes and use the document which illustrated this as a source. eg Signed own Wedding Certificate: Source Wedding Certificate (using the way I normally source them) It is an idea to use an Event. In which case I would probably have a general one called, say, Literacy and enter Literate or Illiterate in the description box. Again using the document from which the conclusion was drawn as a source. 2. Also how is best to capture veriations of the name - for example, the person is recorded on the document as THIJS, but he has signed THYS (presuming he's literate). So far, I'm just added both as AKAs with the details of where the version appears and by whom. In that case, who do you think know better - the official (who often seem to make a complete hash of even simple name) or the person? I can relate to the last one, because my first name is spelled HRISTINA, without C in front, and very often people just don't listen to me ;) In this case I always take the spelling used by the subject as being correct and add the variations in the AKAs 3. What do you consider the official name esp. in 17th and 18th century? I'm researching Belgium and of course in a short period of 30 years, I can have the same person with a Latin name (Birth certificate; say Petrus or Joannes), then French (for the Marriage, Pierre or Jean) and then Dutch (for the death certificate, Pieter or Jan)... All those are technically official because they were recorded by the authorities. As you say, all are official and if there is no indication as to what the person called him/herself then there is nothing to go on. In the case you illustrate I would tend to use the one relevant to the place of birth with the others as AKAs. Any thoughts? thanks! nina To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centrehttp://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail/uk/taglines/default/security_centre/*http://uk.security.yahoo.com/. *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp _ Be one of the first to try Windows Live Mail. http://ideas.live.com/programpage.aspx?versionId=5d21c51a-b161-4314-9b0e-4911fb2b2e6d *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
Nina, With regards to names, the name I use in the primary name fields is the name the person used themselves (or most likely used). This is will probably be in their native language. If variations appear in other documents then I record them as AKAs. I have NY dutch ancestors and from documents and signatures I've seen they mainly used dutch. However, in official government papers, some directories and other accounts like local historys the names have often been anglicised. Johanne has become John, Hendrick - Henry, or in Latin. The anglicised or latin version goes in my AKA fields. I've found Mary H. Slawson's book Getting It Right (isbn 1-57008-887-X (pbk) invaluable getting advice when stuck on how to record something. Regards Chris - Original Message - From: SKL 1750 To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 10:01 AM Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. I guess I should create an event but I'm not sure how to name it or how word it: [HeShe] signed the document... or the document is signed by [Name]. 2. Also how is best to capture veriations of the name - for example, the person is recorded on the document as THIJS, but he has signed THYS (presuming he's literate). So far, I'm just added both as AKAs with the details of where the version appears and by whom. In that case, who do you think know better - the official (who often seem to make a complete hash of even simple name) or the person? I can relate to the last one, because my first name is spelled HRISTINA, without C in front, and very often people just don't listen to me ;) 3. What do you consider the official name esp. in 17th and 18th century? I'm researching Belgium and of course in a short period of 30 years, I can have the same person with a Latin name (Birth certificate; say Petrus or Joannes), then French (for the Marriage, Pierre or Jean) and then Dutch (for the death certificate, Pieter or Jan)... All those are technically official because they were recorded by the authorities. Any thoughts? thanks! nina --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0655-1, 08/12/2006 Tested on: 09/12/2006 11:11:02 avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2006 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
Thanks, Ron. My thinking goes along the same lines. The only thing on nr 3 - which language version of the name to use, I tend to go with Dutch, simply because Latin, while official at the time of birth, was not really the 'common' language. (Isn't that why Martin Luther nailed the church door??) It's the same with the French - just because the official language has changed, because the country has been run over, the people's language and names don't change. Sometimes, I do have indication of the common name - a woman was named first Isabella, then Isabeau or Isabelle, and at the end, a marriage of one of her children mentioned Bello... which i think is what she was really called in daily life. I'm not sure if there is something like this in the UK - perhaps Welsh names? Were they ever tried to be anglicised in official records? n - Original Message From: ronald ferguson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com Sent: Saturday, 9 December, 2006 11:45:13 AM Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names Some interesting questions here Nina - my comments are bewlow; Ron Ferguson _ For Genealogy, Software and Social visit: http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/fergys/ *Use Legacy Search - see My Blogs* Includes the family tree for Alan J Grimshaw http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/fergys/Grimshaw/ __ Date: Sat, 9 Dec 2006 10:01:15 + From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. I guess I should create an event but I'm not sure how to name it or how word it: [HeShe] signed the document... or the document is signed by [Name]. I normally don't record whether literate or otherwise. If I did I would probably just put some thing in the notes and use the document which illustrated this as a source. eg Signed own Wedding Certificate: Source Wedding Certificate (using the way I normally source them) It is an idea to use an Event. In which case I would probably have a general one called, say, Literacy and enter Literate or Illiterate in the description box. Again using the document from which the conclusion was drawn as a source. 2. Also how is best to capture veriations of the name - for example, the person is recorded on the document as THIJS, but he has signed THYS (presuming he's literate). So far, I'm just added both as AKAs with the details of where the version appears and by whom. In that case, who do you think know better - the official (who often seem to make a complete hash of even simple name) or the person? I can relate to the last one, because my first name is spelled HRISTINA, without C in front, and very often people just don't listen to me ;) In this case I always take the spelling used by the subject as being correct and add the variations in the AKAs 3. What do you consider the official name esp. in 17th and 18th century? I'm researching Belgium and of course in a short period of 30 years, I can have the same person with a Latin name (Birth certificate; say Petrus or Joannes), then French (for the Marriage, Pierre or Jean) and then Dutch (for the death certificate, Pieter or Jan)... All those are technically official because they were recorded by the authorities. As you say, all are official and if there is no indication as to what the person called him/herself then there is nothing to go on. In the case you illustrate I would tend to use the one relevant to the place of birth with the others as AKAs. Any thoughts? thanks! nina To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centrehttp://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail/uk/taglines/default/security_centre/*http://uk.security.yahoo.com/. *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp _ Be one of the first to try Windows Live Mail. http://ideas.live.com/programpage.aspx?versionId
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
SKL 1750 wrote 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. I include this information in the Notes, if it is something like a Marriage. A typical entry in Marriage Notes would be The marriage was solemnised by Rev John Doe, Vicar, after Banns. Witnesses were Jane Doe and Fanny Adams. The bridegroom signed and the bride made her mark. (Incidentally, if the Witnesses were relatives who appear on my tree, they would have an Event named Witness to record this.) I guess I should create an event but I'm not sure how to name it or how word it: [HeShe] signed the document... or the document is signed by [Name]. It isn't really an Event in its own right, though, is it? Just part of another Event - the Marriage or whatever. 2. Also how is best to capture veriations of the name - for example, the person is recorded on the document as THIJS, but he has signed THYS (presuming he's literate). So far, I'm just added both as AKAs with the details of where the version appears and by whom. In that case, who do you think know better - the official (who often seem to make a complete hash of even simple name) or the person? You have to appreciate that the spelling of people's names was very fluid in the old days. Even a literate person might not use the same spelling every time. (cf William Shakespeare!) For use as the main name in my file, I would choose the most commonly used spelling. 3. What do you consider the official name esp. in 17th and 18th century? I'm researching Belgium and of course in a short period of 30 years, I can have the same person with a Latin name (Birth certificate; say Petrus or Joannes), then French (for the Marriage, Pierre or Jean) and then Dutch (for the death certificate, Pieter or Jan)... All those are technically official because they were recorded by the authorities. As you say, all these are the official name - they are really all the same name but with different spellings. Again, for the main entry in my file I would use the one the person was most often known by in their daily life and enter the other versions as AKAs. -- Jenny M Benson *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
Greetings! I saw an interesting CT award winning family history, which used the signature in the introduction paragraph about individual. It was used as we normally would place a photograph in Legacy. In a time period where photos were not available, it added something personal of the individual. Diane - Original Message - From: SKL 1750 To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 2:01 AM Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. I guess I should create an event but I'm not sure how to name it or how word it: [HeShe] signed the document... or the document is signed by [Name]. 2. Also how is best to capture veriations of the name - for example, the person is recorded on the document as THIJS, but he has signed THYS (presuming he's literate). So far, I'm just added both as AKAs with the details of where the version appears and by whom. In that case, who do you think know better - the official (who often seem to make a complete hash of even simple name) or the person? I can relate to the last one, because my first name is spelled HRISTINA, without C in front, and very often people just don't listen to me ;) 3. What do you consider the official name esp. in 17th and 18th century? I'm researching Belgium and of course in a short period of 30 years, I can have the same person with a Latin name (Birth certificate; say Petrus or Joannes), then French (for the Marriage, Pierre or Jean) and then Dutch (for the death certificate, Pieter or Jan)... All those are technically official because they were recorded by the authorities. Any thoughts? thanks! nina *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
Having found my 4th greatgrandfather's signature (ca 1800-1805), I am planning on placing it on the cover of the book I am writing regarding our FERGUS family! And, if I can afford the extra cost, I would like it to be in metallic gold, though not 14K, just a gold imprint! Cynthia N. Russell Diane Murach [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Greetings! I saw an interesting CT award winning family history, which used the signature in the introduction paragraph about individual. It was used as we normally would place a photograph in Legacy. In a time period where photos were not available, it added something personal of the individual. Diane - Original Message - From: SKL 1750 To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 2:01 AM Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. I guess I should create an event but I'm not sure how to name it or how word it: [HeShe] signed the document... or the document is signed by [Name]. 2. Also how is best to capture veriations of the name - for example, the person is recorded on the document as THIJS, but he has signed THYS (presuming he's literate). So far, I'm just added both as AKAs with the details of where the version appears and by whom. In that case, who do you think know better - the official (who often seem to make a complete hash of even simple name) or the person? I can relate to the last one, because my first name is spelled HRISTINA, without C in front, and very often people just don't listen to me ;) 3. What do you consider the official name esp. in 17th and 18th century? I'm researching Belgium and of course in a short period of 30 years, I can have the same person with a Latin name (Birth certificate; say Petrus or Joannes), then French (for the Marriage, Pierre or Jean) and then Dutch (for the death certificate, Pieter or Jan)... All those are technically official because they were recorded by the authorities. Any thoughts? thanks! nina *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names
I concur! I also use a Witness event as well as His/Her Godfather/Godmother and Godfather/Godmother to record baptismal data. If anyone would like to see examples, I can direct you to my website. Mary -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jenny M Benson Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 7:42 AM To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyFamilyTree.com Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names SKL 1750 wrote 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. I include this information in the Notes, if it is something like a Marriage. A typical entry in Marriage Notes would be The marriage was solemnised by Rev John Doe, Vicar, after Banns. Witnesses were Jane Doe and Fanny Adams. The bridegroom signed and the bride made her mark. (Incidentally, if the Witnesses were relatives who appear on my tree, they would have an Event named Witness to record this.) I guess I should create an event but I'm not sure how to name it or how word it: [HeShe] signed the document... or the document is signed by [Name]. It isn't really an Event in its own right, though, is it? Just part of another Event - the Marriage or whatever. 2. Also how is best to capture veriations of the name - for example, the person is recorded on the document as THIJS, but he has signed THYS (presuming he's literate). So far, I'm just added both as AKAs with the details of where the version appears and by whom. In that case, who do you think know better - the official (who often seem to make a complete hash of even simple name) or the person? You have to appreciate that the spelling of people's names was very fluid in the old days. Even a literate person might not use the same spelling every time. (cf William Shakespeare!) For use as the main name in my file, I would choose the most commonly used spelling. 3. What do you consider the official name esp. in 17th and 18th century? I'm researching Belgium and of course in a short period of 30 years, I can have the same person with a Latin name (Birth certificate; say Petrus or Joannes), then French (for the Marriage, Pierre or Jean) and then Dutch (for the death certificate, Pieter or Jan)... All those are technically official because they were recorded by the authorities. As you say, all these are the official name - they are really all the same name but with different spellings. Again, for the main entry in my file I would use the one the person was most often known by in their daily life and enter the other versions as AKAs. -- Jenny M Benson *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names
I would not rely on just a signature as proof of literacy. y paternal grandfather only had 1one day of schooling and thus was not able to read or write a single word. My grandmother taught him how to sign his name but that was the extent of his writing, Don -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of SKL 1750 Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 5:01 AM To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. (snipped) Any thoughts? thanks! nina _ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail/uk/taglines/default/security_centre/*http://uk. security.yahoo.com/ Security Centre. *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
To add to that. I had always been told my great grandmother could not read nor write. When I copied her husbands Civil War pension file there were documents with her signature, but they were written in German. My guess is she didn't read or write English but was literate in German, BUT I have very little to back that statement up. Marie Marie Varrelman Melchiori, CG, CGL Melchiori Research Services, L.L.C. --- CG, Certified Genealogist and CGL, Certified Genealogical Lecturer are service marks of the Board for Certification of Genealogists, used under license by Board-certified associates after periodic competency evaluations. *** In a message dated 12/9/2006 11:44:53 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: would not rely on just a signature as proof of literacy. y paternal grandfather only had 1one day of schooling and thus was not able to read or write a single word. My grandmother taught him how to sign his name but that was the extent of his writing, Don -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of SKL 1750 Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 5:01 AM To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. (snipped) Any thoughts? thanks! nina *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names
I have Norwegian and German ancestors, with the Norwegian being most challenging for the primary name version. My paternal grandfather and his brothers emigrated to the US from Germany and anglicized their names, but I have copies of German documents with the German version. I use the names they used in the US (e.g., Henry) for primary, with the German as AKAs (e.g., Heinrich). For my Norwegian ancestors who emigrated to the US, the names they used here are primary, and the Norwegian names are AKAs. For those who remained in Norway, it is often a coin-flip as to which name is primary and which are AKAs.. Their names were often spelled differently in different Norwegian official parish register events and census records for the same person. For example, a person I know as Jonsen might also be spelled Johnsen (an AKA). In another case, Finkelsen is also spelled Finchelsen and Fengalsen, and he may also be known by the name of the farm he was from (e.g., Finkel Øvsteland). As another example, a daughter of Gunder Torjusen (or Torjussen) might be known by the typical surname of Gundersdatter or by the surname Torjusen - or even by her husband's surname (e.g., Nilsen). As far as signatures go, I agree that some are suspect. I have two versions of one US document, one of which shows a signature for the person and the other his mark. Both are alleged to be official county records. Byrom Wehner Houston, TX *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names
Nina: Regarding your third question, I've often been faced with the same dilemma and found a good suggestion in Getting It Right by Mary H. Slawson. She recommends using the name by which the person would have called himself/herself. I had a Wilhelmus (baptism) or Wilhelm (marriage), but his will was signed William so that's what I use as the preferred name. My database is primarily for posting at RootsWeb, however, and other researchers of this line most often use Wilhelmus for this individual. In order to have my file picked up in searches, I now show him as William or Wilhelmus. Kirsten -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of SKL 1750 Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 2:01 AM To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. I guess I should create an event but I'm not sure how to name it or how word it: [HeShe] signed the document... or the document is signed by [Name]. 2. Also how is best to capture veriations of the name - for example, the person is recorded on the document as THIJS, but he has signed THYS (presuming he's literate). So far, I'm just added both as AKAs with the details of where the version appears and by whom. In that case, who do you think know better - the official (who often seem to make a complete hash of even simple name) or the person? I can relate to the last one, because my first name is spelled HRISTINA, without C in front, and very often people just don't listen to me ;) 3. What do you consider the official name esp. in 17th and 18th century? I'm researching Belgium and of course in a short period of 30 years, I can have the same person with a Latin name (Birth certificate; say Petrus or Joannes), then French (for the Marriage, Pierre or Jean) and then Dutch (for the death certificate, Pieter or Jan)... All those are technically official because they were recorded by the authorities. Any thoughts? thanks! nina *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
Hi all, One other little wrinkle: at one time it was common in Sweden for the common people to be taught to read (so they could read the Bible for themselves). But they were often not taught how to write (maybe their name?). So literate as we define it (reading *and* writing) didn't necessarily exist. Ruth Ann p.s. I've got another case: an ancestor in Norway carved his name into the doorframe of his house (the house is now in a museum). So that particular proof of literacy isn't anything that we would ordinarily think of as an event. Don Brown wrote: I would not rely on just a signature as proof of literacy. y paternal grandfather only had 1one day of schooling and thus was not able to read or write a single word. My grandmother taught him how to sign his name but that was the extent of his writing, *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
Kirsten Bowman wrote: I had a Wilhelmus (baptism) orWilhelm (marriage), but his will was signed "William" so that's what I use as the preferred name. My database is primarily for posting at RootsWeb, however, and other researchers of this line most often use "Wilhelmus"for this individual. In order to have my file picked up in searches, I now show him as "Williamor Wilhelmus." Kirsten, It sounds to me like this baptism information was obtained from church records of a Roman Catholic church. In almost every such record that I have looked at the priest made an attempt to Latin-ize the first name of the child, whether there ever was such a Latin name or not. Some of the results are almost hilarious, and in many instances there was no consistency from priest to priest or parish to parish about how the real name given to the child by the parents was converted to fake Latin. If that is the case, you can be sure that the person was NEVER known by the name Wilhelmus, even by the priest who wrote that entry in the church records! Bob *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. ***Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.aspTo find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.aspTo unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names
As some have commented, a signature shouldn't be regarded as absolute proof of literacy, I wouldn't rely too much on not signing a document as proof of illiteracy either. Imagine someone in authority saying Make your mark here or indicating the space with a small cross, or the situation where the bride could read and write, but didn't want to shame her bridegroom who couldn't. I have situations from the 19th century where the women in my family of Norfolk Ag Labs were literate, they kept up the family correspondence, but men were often illiterate. I also have at least one instance when a young bride signed the marriage register with a cross, yet I have copies of letters written by her both before and after the marriage. Margaret In NZ *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
I make a *.jpg graphic of the document and attach it in the picture galley of the marriage, event or source file or direct to the individuals galley if appropriate. With PrintKey and a scanner the graphic is easy to make. Art Seddon Everett, Washington - Original Message - From: Jenny M Benson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: LegacyUserGroup@LegacyFamilyTree.com Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 4:41 AM Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names SKL 1750 wrote 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
One of my 2nd Great mothers could sign her name, I've a copy of the register entry she signed when she married, but a few years later she registered the birth of a child and simply made her mark. I've no idea how literate she was but perhaps registering a child was not important enough to go through the effort of writing her signature! Chris - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 4:52 PM Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names To add to that. I had always been told my great grandmother could not read nor write. When I copied her husbands Civil War pension file there were documents with her signature, but they were written in German. My guess is she didn't read or write English but was literate in German, BUT I have very little to back that statement up. Marie Marie Varrelman Melchiori, CG, CGL Melchiori Research Services, L.L.C. --- CG, Certified Genealogist and CGL, Certified Genealogical Lecturer are service marks of the Board for Certification of Genealogists, used under license by Board-certified associates after periodic competency evaluations. *** In a message dated 12/9/2006 11:44:53 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: would not rely on just a signature as proof of literacy. y paternal grandfather only had 1one day of schooling and thus was not able to read or write a single word. My grandmother taught him how to sign his name but that was the extent of his writing, Don -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of SKL 1750 Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 5:01 AM To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. (snipped) Any thoughts? thanks! nina *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0655-1, 08/12/2006 Tested on: 09/12/2006 20:26:43 avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2006 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names
IMHO, I use thet most current name as 'computer' name. That is because, as Kristen notes, the will is the most likely to be written/spelled as he/she did in life. In some cases, the only one is the birth/baptism record, and as I find more data, the 'computer' name will change. Used to drive me crazy. But now that I have loaded the AKA with most of the variants, using the SHOW AKAs in list keeps it tolerable. Rich --- Kirsten Bowman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nina: Regarding your third question, I've often been faced with the same dilemma and found a good suggestion in Getting It Right by Mary H. Slawson. She recommends using the name by which the person would have called himself/herself. I had a Wilhelmus (baptism) or Wilhelm (marriage), but his will was signed William so that's what I use as the preferred name. My database is primarily for posting at RootsWeb, however, and other researchers of this line most often use Wilhelmus for this individual. In order to have my file picked up in searches, I now show him as William or Wilhelmus. Kirsten -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of SKL 1750 Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 2:01 AM To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. I guess I should create an event but I'm not sure how to name it or how word it: [HeShe] signed the document... or the document is signed by [Name]. 2. Also how is best to capture veriations of the name - for example, the person is recorded on the document as THIJS, but he has signed THYS (presuming he's literate). So far, I'm just added both as AKAs with the details of where the version appears and by whom. In that case, who do you think know better - the official (who often seem to make a complete hash of even simple name) or the person? I can relate to the last one, because my first name is spelled HRISTINA, without C in front, and very often people just don't listen to me ;) 3. What do you consider the official name esp. in 17th and 18th century? I'm researching Belgium and of course in a short period of 30 years, I can have the same person with a Latin name (Birth certificate; say Petrus or Joannes), then French (for the Marriage, Pierre or Jean) and then Dutch (for the death certificate, Pieter or Jan)... All those are technically official because they were recorded by the authorities. Any thoughts? thanks! nina *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names
That is why on American census records, they asked BOTH. Rich --- Ruth Ann Larson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, One other little wrinkle: at one time it was common in Sweden for the common people to be taught to read (so they could read the Bible for themselves). But they were often not taught how to write (maybe their name?). So literate as we define it (reading *and* writing) didn't necessarily exist. Ruth Ann p.s. I've got another case: an ancestor in Norway carved his name into the doorframe of his house (the house is now in a museum). So that particular proof of literacy isn't anything that we would ordinarily think of as an event. Don Brown wrote: I would not rely on just a signature as proof of literacy. y paternal grandfather only had 1one day of schooling and thus was not able to read or write a single word. My grandmother taught him how to sign his name but that was the extent of his writing, *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names
Bob: Actually it was the Reformed Dutch Church of Stone Arabia, and I agree that probably nobody ever called him Wilhelmus, but if people search for him that way at RootsWeb then I would like to have my database found also. (This is the case since the record appears as Wilhelmus in some published references.) Hence the use of or and the alternative name. And as a result of an off-list note from a helpful Legacy expert, plus some experimenting of my own, I've found that using or between two *first* names will cause either one to be found in a RootsWeb search but this is not true of *surnames*. When there is more than one surname spelling, apparently it's necessary to use the AKA field but I have yet to test and see if AKA's will be found in RootsWeb WorldConnect searches. Does anyone know? Kirsten -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Bob Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 11:06 AM To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names Kirsten Bowman wrote: I had a Wilhelmus (baptism) or Wilhelm (marriage), but his will was signed William so that's what I use as the preferred name. My database is primarily for posting at RootsWeb, however, and other researchers of this line most often use Wilhelmus for this individual. In order to have my file picked up in searches, I now show him as William or Wilhelmus. Kirsten, It sounds to me like this baptism information was obtained from church records of a Roman Catholic church. In almost every such record that I have looked at the priest made an attempt to Latin-ize the first name of the child, whether there ever was such a Latin name or not. Some of the results are almost hilarious, and in many instances there was no consistency from priest to priest or parish to parish about how the real name given to the child by the parents was converted to fake Latin. If that is the case, you can be sure that the person was NEVER known by the name Wilhelmus, even by the priest who wrote that entry in the church records! Bob *** Give the gift of Legacy for the holidays! Order online at http://legacyfamilytree.com/Redirect/Store-Legacy.asp or call 1-800-753-3453. *** Legacy User Group guidelines can be found at: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp To find past messages, please go to our searchable archives at: http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com/ For online technical support, please visit http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Help.asp To unsubscribe please visit: http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/LegacyLists.asp
RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names
I agree that Belgium prsents something of a problem as the spelling used at birth would largely depend on whereabouts in the country the person lived ie. the Flemish or French speaking areas. I would ignore the Latin for the main name and use the spelling appropriate to the birth area. You are quite correct in that in the UK Gaelic names were often anglicised when a person moved to England and it is my practice to use the spelling on the original birth records ie. the Gaelic if appropriate. I do not use the Latin except when quoting eg. a note saying Christened as Ron Ferguson _ For Genealogy, Software and Social visit: http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/fergys/ *Use Legacy Search - see My Blogs* Includes the family tree for Alan J Grimshaw http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/fergys/Grimshaw/ __ Date: Sat, 9 Dec 2006 11:08:28 + From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] signatures names To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Thanks, Ron. My thinking goes along the same lines. The only thing on nr 3 - which language version of the name to use, I tend to go with Dutch, simply because Latin, while official at the time of birth, was not really the 'common' language. (Isn't that why Martin Luther nailed the church door??) It's the same with the French - just because the official language has changed, because the country has been run over, the people's language and names don't change. Sometimes, I do have indication of the common name - a woman was named first Isabella, then Isabeau or Isabelle, and at the end, a marriage of one of her children mentioned Bello... which i think is what she was really called in daily life. I'm not sure if there is something like this in the UK - perhaps Welsh names? Were they ever tried to be anglicised in official records? n - Original Message From: ronald ferguson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: legacyusergroup@legacyfamilytree.com Sent: Saturday, 9 December, 2006 11:45:13 AM Subject: RE: [LegacyUG] signatures names Some interesting questions here Nina - my comments are bewlow; Ron Ferguson _ For Genealogy, Software and Social visit: http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/fergys/ *Use Legacy Search - see My Blogs* Includes the family tree for Alan J Grimshaw http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/fergys/Grimshaw/ __ Date: Sat, 9 Dec 2006 10:01:15 + From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [LegacyUG] signatures names To: LegacyUserGroup@legacyfamilytree.com Hello everyone, I have a few questions and would love to hear your suggestions: 1. When researching various records - marriage certificates, court papers, etc. - I would like to capture the fact that the person has signed the document (as an indicator for literacy). Does anyone of you capture this information and how do you think it's best done. I guess I should create an event but I'm not sure how to name it or how word it: [HeShe] signed the document... or the document is signed by [Name]. I normally don't record whether literate or otherwise. If I did I would probably just put some thing in the notes and use the document which illustrated this as a source. eg Signed own Wedding Certificate: Source Wedding Certificate (using the way I normally source them) It is an idea to use an Event. In which case I would probably have a general one called, say, Literacy and enter Literate or Illiterate in the description box. Again using the document from which the conclusion was drawn as a source. 2. Also how is best to capture veriations of the name - for example, the person is recorded on the document as THIJS, but he has signed THYS (presuming he's literate). So far, I'm just added both as AKAs with the details of where the version appears and by whom. In that case, who do you think know better - the official (who often seem to make a complete hash of even simple name) or the person? I can relate to the last one, because my first name is spelled HRISTINA, without C in front, and very often people just don't listen to me ;) In this case I always take the spelling used by the subject as being correct and add the variations in the AKAs 3. What do you consider the official name esp. in 17th and 18th century? I'm researching Belgium and of course in a short period of 30 years, I can have the same person with a Latin name (Birth certificate; say Petrus or Joannes), then French (for the Marriage, Pierre or Jean) and then Dutch (for the death certificate, Pieter or Jan)... All those are technically official because they were recorded by the authorities. As you say, all are official
