Re: Lilyjazz font and Score.markFormatter problem with Lily 2.23.6

[Tim McNamara]

> What I’d like is to have the chord names such Em7 in the lilyjazz font too, 
> though.

Note that I use a very outdated Lilypond version because it works for me just 
fine; the updates make for changes in input that I just don’t have the time or 
energy to learn.  I am a part time hobbyist musician with no background in 
coding, hence my resistance to change.  ;-)  I am also using this on a 9 year 
old Mac that is a couple of MacOS-es behind, with Frescobaldi as the front-end. 
 Macs historically have had issues with where the fonts are placed (had to be 
within the Lilypond directory rather than the usual system font location; that 
may not be true with newer versions of Lilypond).

This is the whole template for my charts, including some stuff that’s not 
germane to the discussion.  The template is also pretty old-fashioned and at 
least 10 years old; there are certainly much better ways to do this.  But it 
works for me and I can put together charts for the whole band in short order.  
I don’t know if it will be helpful to you since it is so outdated.

in \chordmode and \markup, the command 

\override ChordNames . ChordName #'font-name = “LilyJAZZText” 

invokes the use of the font.  I have always been puzzled as to why fonts for 
all forms of text (chordnames, markup, etc.) can’t be globally specified with a 
single statement (maybe it can in newer versions of Lilypond).  

in \melody, \jazzOn initiates using the font for notes and glyphs; \jazzOff 
terminates it and the font goes back to the default.




\version "2.18.2"

#(ly:set-option 'delete-intermediate-files #t)

\paper {
#(set-paper-size "letter")
indent = 0.0
ragged-last = ##f

} 

\header {
title = \markup {  \override #'(font-name . "LilyJAZZText")
   \fontsize #4  “Title" }
  subtitle = \markup {  \override #'(font-name . "LilyJAZZText")
   \fontsize #2  “Subtitle" }
  composer = \markup {  \override #'(font-name . "LilyJAZZText") 
  “Name" }
  meter = \markup {  \override #'(font-name . "LilyJAZZText")
  “Groove" }
  copyright = \markup {  \override #'(font-name . "LilyJAZZText")
   “As Needed" }
}

\include "../../roemer-chords.ly"
\include "../../LilyJAZZ.ily"
% \include "../../multimeasure.ly"
% \include "../../naturalize.scm"

\markup {  \override #'(font-name . "LilyJAZZText")
\fill-line {
\column {
\line { These are used for specifying soloing order }
\line { And other arrangement concerns }
\line { \hspace #0 }
}
}
}


harmonies =  \chordmode {
\override ChordNames . ChordName #'font-name = "LilyJAZZText"
\override ChordName #'font-size = #3
\override ParenthesesItem #'font-size = #1

% chords go here

}

melody =\relative c' {
\jazzOn
\numericTimeSignature
\time 4/4
\clef treble
\key 

\set Score.markFormatter = #format-mark-box-alphabet
% \mark #1

% \override Staff.KeySignature #'break-visibility = #all-invisible
% \override Staff.Clef #'break-visibility = #all-invisible
% \once \override Score.RehearsalMark #'break-visibility = 
begin-of-line-invisible

\set Score.markFormatter = #format-mark-box-alphabet
% \mark #1

% melody goes here

 
}

\score {
  <<

\new ChordNames
 {
  \set chordChanges = ##t
  \harmonies
}
\new Staff \melody
  >>  

}

Re: What is happening on the email thing? CONTENTS DELETED

[Tim McNamara]

Interesting.  This has not happened for me.

> On Jun 24, 2021, at 1:47 PM, darki...@jesusgod-pope666.info wrote:
> 
> Why are so many contents being deleted on the email list, like it seems to 
> grow wilder and wilder...
> 
> What is going on? Are people getting censored or have it been hacked or 
> something - or has the admin just gone wild in deleting responses?
> 
> Dearly regards
> - Darkijah
> 

Re: Jazz chords above slash notation

[Tim McNamara]

Are you thinking of this as a polychord (one chord above another, rather than a 
chord over a bass note as is usually with a “slash” chord)?

Here is a snippet intended to be used as an \include, if I recall correctly, to 
denote poly chords in \chordmode  I haven’t had occasion to use it in years, I 
didn’t write it, and have not tested it against more recent versions of 
Lilypond since I seem to never need to use polychords.  No doubt something more 
elegant could be constructed now, but hopefully there is seething helpful in 
here.


***
\version "2.18.0"

#(define-markup-command (transposed-chord-root-name layout props a b) (number? 
number?)
  #:properties ((cause #f))
  "Print the root of the chord transposed."
  (interpret-markup layout props
(markup (note-name->markup
 (ly:pitch-transpose (ly:event-property cause 'pitch) 
(ly:make-pitch 0 a b))
#f

#(define-markup-command (chord-root-name layout props) ()
  #:properties ((cause #f))
  "Print the root of the chord."
  (interpret-markup layout props
(markup (note-name->markup (ly:event-property cause 'pitch) #f)
)))

#(define-public (silent-chord-root-namer pitch lowercase?)
   (markup "")
)

%{
#(define-markup-command (polychord-column layout props args)
 (markup-list?)
  ;#:properties ((direction)
  ;(baseline-skip))

 (let* ((args-length-ls (sort (map (lambda (x)
(interval-length
   (ly:stencil-extent
  (interpret-markup layout props x)
X)))
args)
  >))
   ; baseline-skip is hard-coded!
   ; if you change this don't forget to change 0.65
   ; in: #:translate (cons 0 (* 0.65 baseline-skip))
   (baseline-skip 1.4)
   (ln-mrkp (markup #:translate (cons 0 (* 0.65 baseline-skip))
 #:draw-line (cons (car args-length-ls) 0)))
   (new-args (list (car args) ln-mrkp (cadr args
   ; direction is hard-coded!
 (stack-lines 1 ;(if (number? direction) direction -1)
  0.0
  baseline-skip
  (interpret-markup-list layout props new-args
%}
  
#(define (insert-elt l1 l2 elt)
 "Inserts a new element between every element of list l1
  and outputs this as new list l2.
  While starting, l2 is supposed to be '() "
  (set! l2 (reverse (append (list elt (car l1)) l2)))
  (if (= 1 (length (cdr l1)))
(append l2 (last-pair l1))
(insert-elt (cdr l1) (reverse l2) elt)))

#(define-markup-command (dir-column-line layout props direction args)
  (number? markup-list?)
  (let* ((args-length-ls (sort (map (lambda (x) 
(interval-length 
   (ly:stencil-extent 
  (interpret-markup layout props x) 
X))) 
args) 
  >))
 ; baseline-skip is hard-coded!
 (baseline-skip 0.4)
 (ln-mrkp (markup #:draw-line (cons (car args-length-ls) 0)
  #:vcenter
  #:vspace 0.2))
 (new-args (insert-elt args '() ln-mrkp)))
  (stack-lines (if (number? direction) direction -1)
   0.0
   baseline-skip
   (interpret-markup-list layout props new-args

polychordExceptionMusic = {
  1-\markup { \dir-column-line #1
   { \chord-root-name \transposed-chord-root-name #1 #-1/2 
} }
  1-\markup { \dir-column-line #1
   { \chord-root-name \transposed-chord-root-name #1 #0 } }
}

%#(top-repl)

polychordExceptions = #( append
  ( sequential-music-to-chord-exceptions polychordExceptionMusic #t)
 ignatzekExceptions)

cmJazz = {
  \set chordNameExceptions = #ignatzekExceptions
  \set chordRootNamer = #note-name->markup
}

cmPoly = {
  \set chordNameExceptions = #polychordExceptions
  \set chordRootNamer = #silent-chord-root-namer
}

theMusic = \chords { 
\cmPoly
   c1:5.9-.11.13-
   c1:5.9.11+.13
   des1:5.9.11+.13
   fis1:5.9.11+.13
\cmJazz
   c1:5.9-.11.13-
}

\layout {
  ragged-right = ##t
}


\score {
\new StaffGroup <<
<<
\context ChordNames \theMusic 
\new Staff = "staff" \relative c' { c1 d e f g }
>>
<<
\context ChordNames \theMusic
\new Staff = "staff" \relative c' { c1 d e f g }
>>
>>
}

**

> On Mar 24, 2021, at 6:50 PM, Calvin Ransom  wrote:
> 
> Thank you Aaron,
> I had to sleep on it and when I woke up it clicked instantly.
> I was able to get the chords to work but I ran across a chord that I am not 
> able to write the following chord, If anyone has any ideas on how I can write 
> this I would greatly appreciate it.
> This is what my attempt got me so far:
> %%%snippet begins%%%
> \version "2.22.0"
> \score{
>   \relative{
> b4

Re: Multi-measure rests with alternating time signatures

[Tim McNamara]

> On Nov 21, 2020, at 9:14 AM, Kieren MacMillan  
> wrote:
> 
> I don’t think that solves the OP’s problem, as I understand it to be… I think 
> the OP wants a compressed visual representation of a whole bunch of 4/4+3/4 
> two-measure chunks, without actually seeing them written out.

As far as I can tell from looking at the docs, the only way to do this using 
multi-measure rests will be in 7/4. It will count out the same, assuming the 
right number of measures is chosen.

Re: Markup Between Systems

[Tim McNamara]

I do something like that with notes for arrangements on lead sheets; this is 
the basic “skeleton” of my .ly file for these.  Perhaps that might work for 
you?  I separate the \score block at the bottom from the musical statements 
because that’s how I was shown to do it way back when.  I don’t know if that 
makes a difference regarding text input, I am really not that knowledgeable in 
Lilypond- more like painting by numbers than having any intelligent 
understanding of programming.  But hopefully this will be helpful.

\version "2.18.2"

\paper {

} 

\header {
  title = \markup {  \override  \fontsize #4  "" }
  etc = \markup {  \override \fontsize #2  "" }
}

\include ""

\markup { 
\fill-line {
\column {
\line {  }
\line {  }
\line {  }
\line {  }
}
}
}


harmonies =  \chordmode {

% Chordnames go here

}

melody =\relative c' {
\numericTimeSignature
\time 4/4
\clef treble
\key 

% melody goes here
   

}

\score {
  <<

\new ChordNames
 {
  \set chordChanges = ##t
  \harmonies
}
\new Staff \melody
  >>  

}

> On Oct 14, 2020, at 7:25 AM, Marc Shepherd  wrote:
> 
> So...what I am trying to do is put a block of text above a system that 
> occupies the full width of the page. This is a theatrical work, and the block 
> of text is a stage direction that is paragraph-length.
> 
> I can create a dynamics context at the top of the score, and attach my markup 
> to a spacer rest at the beginning of that system. But then, Lilypond counts 
> my markup as part of the spacing calculation of the system, which is not the 
> desired effect. Also, Lilypond wants to put my markup between the left- and 
> right-most barlines of the system, instead of using the full page width.
> 
> I know that free-standing markup (not attached to any note or rest) can 
> reside between \score’s, but not within a \score. Basically, I am looking for 
> a way to achieve that effect without having to end the current score and 
> start a new one.
> 
> Thanks
> Marc
> 
> On Mon, Oct 12, 2020 at 8:25 AM Andrew Bernard  > wrote:
> What's wrong with hanging it off a note or rest? I do this all the
> time for long sloping lines for accel. and rall. indicators. Works for
> me.
> 
> Can you send a sketch or image of your use case?
> 
> Andrew
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, 12 Oct 2020 at 07:40, Marc Shepherd  > wrote:
> >
> >
> > I want markup that is within a score (above a system), but not attached to 
> > a staff or note.
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Marc Shepherd

Re: Future of openLilyLib

[Tim McNamara]

On Sep 22, 2020, at 10:20 AM, Partitura Organum  wrote:
> 
> Karsten […] mentioned the lilypond-files: "OpenLilyLib is licensed under the 
> GPL. Thus, the copyleft effect forces that all Lilypond files which include 
> OpenLilyLib files, have also to be distributed under the terms of the GPL.". 
> Thus, if I use OLL in my lilypond and I want to make my lilypond files 
> public, I have to do so under the GPL v3 license. 
> Or so Karsten states.
> Secion 5 of GPL v3 does seem to imply this. The question here is whether 
> typing something like "include oll.ily" in your own ly-file makes your 
> ly-file a derivative work of OpenLilyLib. If "yes" the GPL v3 license demands 
> you license your ly-file as GPL as well if you ever publish it. If "no", well 
> then it is for you to decide which license works best for you.

Calling what amounts to a subroutine does not cause the subroutine to own the 
output, which is IMHO all that is being done with "\include oll.ily” (or any 
\include commands) so the answer to the question is “no.”  One may publish 
one’s input file, although the utility of that is questionable except as a 
teaching tool, under whatever license one wishes.  That may cause a cognitive 
conflict with the GPL for some users.  One may publish the output of the 
application under whatever license one wishes, including standard copyright 
within the jurisdiction where one lives.  Were the GPL to require creators to 
license their output under some specific copyleft arrangement, few people would 
use any GPL software.  And indeed, there may be people/entities that refuse to 
use free software due to that misunderstanding.  Lilypond and/or the GPL does 
not own the user's input or output files- any more than Microsoft owns all 
documents written in Word- as that would of course contravene the notion of 
freedom in free software.

I am curious- is there a parallel discussion among LaTeX users?  I’ve never 
used LaTeX nor been part of discussions in the that community, but the 
operating similarities are strong (a text input file with formatting markup 
producing an output file such as a PDF).

If one creates a word processing document using a font, whether copyleft or 
copyright, does the document publishing have to adhere to the licensing of the 
font?  Of course not.

Re: Future of openLilyLib

[Tim McNamara]

On Sep 22, 2020, at 10:17 AM, Karsten Reincke  wrote:
> On 22.09.20 14:58, Tim McNamara wrote:
>>> On Sep 22, 2020, at 4:30 AM, Karsten Reincke  
>>> <mailto:k.rein...@fodina.de> wrote:
>>> Dear Carl;
>>> 
>>> here is my explanation using the method of showing an analogy:
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>  If I use Emacs to write a letter to my Aunt Tillie, even though Emacs is 
>> licensed under the GPL my letter to Aunt Tillie remains copyrighted and 
>> private. [...]
> Unfortunately, you are mixing the levels of licensings here:
> 
> If you wrote a letter to aunt Tilly which included a sentence provided by my 
> famous text library to write wonderful letters to aunt Tilli (if such a lib 
> really existed, I of course would have licensed it under the GPL!) and if you 
> therefore had not to type the complete text by yourself, THEN your letter 
> would have to be distributed under the terms of the GPL too - not because, 
> you used the emacs, but because you included parts of my GPL licensed letter 
> lib and the copyleft effect it established.
> 
> That's point here: If I included the OLL into my musical work by using the 
> compiler option lilypond -I ./oll my-score.ly, the my work depends on OLL, 
> not because I use lilypond, but because I functions of the OLL. 
> 
Dear Karsten-

And, again, I must disagree.  A differentiation exists between the GPL software 
and input/output files used with/resulting from the operation of the software.  
Neither your .ly or .ily file nor the various output options produced by 
Lilypond are required to be released under the GPL or its variants.  Such a 
requirement would just be silly and would result in the termination of the use 
of free software everywhere, practically overnight.  Your input may include 
Scheme or other code to customize the performance of Lilypond for your specific 
purposes, but that is part of your input file and is not part of Lilypond or 
openlilylib and thus not subject to GPL or other such licenses.  Copywrite, 
performance rights, etc., would apply consistent with your local laws.

>> This is the sort of attack that the GPL and free software has been subjected 
>> to multiple times over decades. It has all been seen and resolved before.
> It is regrettable that the same methods are used here that the free software 
> community has had to experience for so long, namely personal discrediting as 
> an "argument" in posts without any salutation and any greetings. 
> Nevertheless, there is ever a way to come back to the free and respectful 
> discussion.
> 
I apologize for being an American and just getting to the point.  It’s how we 
do things and in this culture is not usually considered rude in non-socializing 
settings. I recognize that YMMV and in other cultures our style is considered 
rude.

It may not be your intent, but your argumentation reads like an attack on free 
software via Lilypond/openlilylib in particular.  You seem to be seeing 
obstacles that in practical senses do not exist.  Can you identify any cases in 
which what you are describing has happened in any enforceable manner?  
Hypotheticals can be informative but rarely if ever definitive.

What you are describing has been discussed many times before, in several venues 
in which I have had slight involvement, and has been settled time and again.  I 
have even committed the error I see in your writing.  Software development 
under the GPL has requirements that are not applied to the input or output of 
that software in use cases. 

Re: Future of openLilyLib

[Tim McNamara]

> On Sep 22, 2020, at 4:30 AM, Karsten Reincke  wrote:
> Dear Carl;
> 
> here is my explanation using the method of showing an analogy:
> 



You are conflating the GPL as applied to functional software versus the rights 
of the user for the content produced through the use of that functional 
software. The use of GPL software to produce content does not subject the 
content to the GPL.

GPL software can be used to produce copyrighted material without any difficulty 
whatsoever. If I use Emacs to write a letter to my Aunt Tillie, even though 
Emacs is licensed under the GPL my letter to Aunt Tillie remains copyrighted 
and private. The same is true with music produced through the use of Lily Pond; 
my input document ending in .LY is not subject to the GPL. Scheme calls, 
overrides, etc., are part of my content and not part of Lilypond.

This is the sort of attack that the GPL and free software has been subjected to 
multiple times over decades. It has all been seen and resolved before.

Re: registering a composition

[Tim McNamara]

You know, the human race managed this pretty successfully for a few hundred 
years before computers... seems like this might be overthinking it.

> On May 23, 2020, at 6:30 PM, David Wright  wrote:
> 
> On Sat 23 May 2020 at 23:35:10 (+0200), Hans Åberg wrote:
 On 23 May 2020, at 23:00, antlists  wrote:
 On 23/05/2020 20:21, Valentin Villenave wrote:
> I’m not saying the world is a nice place (it isn’t); you should, at
> the very least, secure*your*  copyright by having a solid proof of
> anteriority, as we discussed.  What I’m saying is that you shouldn’t
> overestimate the possible threat to your work if you were to publish
> it freely, nor the amount and quality of “protection” you’ll get from
> any RMO out there.
 for the sake of a few pennies, there's an easy way to prove the date. 
 Used, I believe, by some law firm in America for its legal documents, and 
 easy enough to do here in England too.
 Put all of your stuff on a CD. Now run a program that generates an MD5 
 checksum or whatever it is, and save both the command and output to a text 
 file. (I'd throw in a listing of the CD too.) Print this, as an advert, in 
 a legal newspaper such as - in London - Lloyds Gazette.
 That CD can now be copied freely, the MD5 sum won't change. And the advert 
 proves that it was in existence on the date of the newspaper. You don't 
 even need to save a copy of the newspaper - the fact that it is a 
 newspaper of legal announcements means that there will be loads of copies 
 kept, probably a lot of them by courts themselves!
>> Don’t use MD5 though, as it is not considered secure. SHA-256 and SHA-512 
>> are better.
> 
> Yes, not cyptographically secure. But that's not the threat model, is it?
> 
> So, I carefully craft a document whose MD5 digest matches the musical
> work. What shall I do? I've either created another work that the real
> owner can pass of as theirs, depriving me of the benefit, or I've
> created a confession of past crimes, which I can hand to the police
> so that the owner, my rival composer, gets locked up.
> 
> They don't seem very likely scenarios.
> 
> However, I don't expect it to cost many more pennies to publish
> several digests.
> 
> Cheers,
> David.

Re: registering a composition

[Tim McNamara]

> On May 21, 2020, at 3:34 AM, Valentin Villenave  
> wrote:
> 
> On 5/21/20, Francesco Petrogalli  wrote:
>> I have written it with lilypond, but it hasn't been performed yet. I
>> wanted to secure the copyright before performing it. Given that there
>> is no performing artist yet, there is no recording, so I cannot
>> register it with ASCAP. Have I got this right?
> 
> No registration anywhere is needed to "secure the copyright". All you
> need to have is a way of proving your anteriority if anyone were to
> come and claim they’ve written it instead of you. There are several
> commercial services that can do that for you (though many are scams),
> but there are cheaper and simpler ways; a simple web search brought me
> to the following page:
> https://copyright.co.uk/legal-copyright-law.html

Copyright law is nationally controlled, not internationally controlled for the 
most part.  There is a degree of reciprocity.  In the US, copyright is 
automatically granted to creators but copyright is also divided- the creator 
has rights but so does the publisher, which matters in terms of royalty 
payments if the work is recorded or performed.  As the saying goes, keep the 
publishing.  Thousands of artists and composers lost out on billions of dollars 
because they signed the publishing away in the early days of their careers in 
the fine print of a recording contract.  This has been standard practice in the 
recording industry since its inception and has beggared many a 
musician/composer.  I do not feel bad at all about the slow death of the major 
labels since the the internet made their business model basically non-viable; 
most of them have been right bastards to artists.  Create your own publishing 
company wholly owned by you.

I don't know about ASCAP; I use BMI and songs can be registered with them prior 
to recording or performance.  ASCAP and BMI seem to work about the same as do 
all the performance rights organizations (PROs) in the US; these only cover 
live performance.  I register my songs when I judge them completed, even though 
no one else will likely ever perform them since I am completely unknown and 
they are usually weird.  I write to amuse myself, mainly.  Recording royalties 
through mechanical licenses in the US are managed almost universally through 
the Harry Fox Agency.

As for proving that you are the originator of a composition, thankfully your 
computer records the creation date of your files.  That will almost certainly 
never be challenged unless you write a hit record and someone decides they want 
a piece of those royalties.  That has led to some truly bizarre examples of 
jurisprudence (suing an artist for plagiarizing themselves, for example; suing 
an artist for writing music that doesn't sound like stuff they've written 
before, etc.).

Re: ANN: Frescobaldi 3.1 has been released!

[Tim McNamara]

> On Dec 28, 2019, at 3:22 PM, Davide Liessi  wrote:
> 
> Il giorno sab 28 dic 2019 alle ore 20:01 Tim McNamara
>  ha scritto:
>> I downloaded the .dmg and installed on Catalina 10.15.1.  The app crashes on 
>> launch each time.  I have a log file for this which is attached as a PDF, as 
>> a non-programmer it’s gobbledygook to me.
> 
> Can you try running it again and checking the error messages in the
> Console application when Frescobaldi crashes?

That was what I attached to my previous e-mail, unless there is something 
different you are looking for.

Re: Mac OS 10.15 Catalina (fonts)

[Tim McNamara]

The default Catalina shell is zsh.  You can use bash but you may have to set it 
to that.

Re: Mac OS 10.15 Catalina

[Tim McNamara]

Thank you, Hans, for making this work!

> On Nov 16, 2019, at 11:21 AM, Hans Åberg  wrote:
> 
> Great! The other LilyPond programs are also in /opt/lilypond/bin/ would you 
> need them.
> 
> 
>> On 16 Nov 2019, at 15:32, Mario Bolognani  wrote:
>> 
>> On a second attempt, following your very useful suggestions, I was 
>> successful. Catalina with Frescobaldi 2.20 and LilyPond-devel are now 
>> operating normally.
>> 
>> Many thanks to all contributors
>> 
>> Mario Bolognani
>> www.baroquemusic.it
>> 
>> 
>> 
 Il giorno 16 nov 2019, alle ore 10:43, Hans Åberg  ha 
 scritto:
>>> 
>>> 
 On 16 Nov 2019, at 00:09, Mario Bolognani  
 wrote:
 
 After having installed Catalina I tried to install Frescobaldi plus 
 LilyPond (the 64bit version provided by Hans  Åberg) but, while 
 Frescobaldi 2.20 64bit apparently runs normally, I had no success with 
 LilyPond… I am a musician not a developer so I’m not able to understand 
 the reasons of this failure.
>>> 
>>> Did you try this:
>>> https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2019-11/msg00295.html
>>> 
 So I am back to Mojave and the 32bit versions of Frescobaldi and LilyPond. 
 Waiting for good news on the subject.
>>> 
>>> Just waiting may not help. :-)
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 

Re: Mac OS 10.15 Catalina

[Tim McNamara]

Frescobaldi itself does not generate sheet music. You need to install Lilypond 
also. In my experience with Catalina, Hans Aberg's .mkpg installs with a double 
click and works fine(except for convert-ly, apparently). 

Frescobaldi 3 does not work out of the box on the Mac; there are a half a dozen 
dependencies that have to be installed first. The 64-bit version of 2.20 does 
work well. I haven't gotten around to getting F3 running as obtaining and 
installing the dependencies on the Mac is kind of a nuisance due to how locked 
down MacOS is, unless one is using a package manager such as Homebrew, 
MacPorts, etc. I am not using one of those.


> On Nov 14, 2019, at 3:20 AM, Jeremiah Reilly  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Carl, thanks for both tips.
> 
> The Frescobaldi Downloads page states "Install a copy of Lilypond as well." 
> Not sure how that jives with Catalina.
> 
> Sorry to be inept re packages and making from source. I am a musician, not a 
> developer.
> 
> Your help much appreciated.
> 
>> On Wed, Nov 13, 2019 at 4:34 PM Carl Sorensen  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> From: Jeremiah Reilly 
>> Date: Wednesday, November 13, 2019 at 3:14 AM
>> To: 
>> Subject: Mac OS 10.15 Catalina
>> 
>> What is the status of running Lilypond under Mac os 10.15 Catalina?
>> 
>> Thanks.
>> 
>> 
>> (Apologies if the answer is clearly posted on the website or Lilypond blog. 
>> I searched 20+ minutes without success. I cannot upgrade to Catalina until I 
>> know whether Lilypond will run. I found posting for folks running Lilypond 
>> in a virtual machine or Decker, but that's not my bag.)
>> 
>> Search for 64-bit, and you’d find it.  But putting a response on a thread 
>> with Catalina in a title is probably a good idea.
>> 
>> You can get an installable LilyPond package created by Hans Aberg here:
>> 
>>   https://www.et.byu.edu/~sorensen/lilypond-devel-2.19.83_2.mpkg
>> 
>> There is a 64-bit Frescobaldi installer for Version 2.20: 
>> 
>> 
>> https://github.com/frescobaldi/frescobaldi/releases/download/v2.20.0/Frescobaldi-2.20.0-x86_64.dmg
>> 
>> HTH,
>> 
>> Carl
>> 
>> 
>> 

Re: Mac OS 10.15 Catalina

[Tim McNamara]

> On Nov 13, 2019, at 9:34 AM, Carl Sorensen  wrote:
> 
> You can get an installable LilyPond package created by Hans Aberg here:
> 
>   https://www.et.byu.edu/~sorensen/lilypond-devel-2.19.83_2.mpkg
> 
> There is a 64-bit Frescobaldi installer for Version 2.20: 
> 
> https://github.com/frescobaldi/frescobaldi/releases/download/v2.20.0/Frescobaldi-2.20.0-x86_64.dmg

I can confirm these work on Catalina.  

Re: transpose for baritone sax

[Tim McNamara]

Read up on \transpose which should do what you want, combined with octaves.

> On Sep 26, 2019, at 7:33 PM, Francesco Petrogalli 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I have written a part using the orchestral pitch (real note) of an
> instrument, the baritone sax (and other instruments, like trumpets,
> alto, and so on).
> 
> All the parts are rendered with the real notes, so that I can listen
> to the midi and check the music on the piano easily (I am no good at
> transposing on the fly).
> 
> Now I need to produce the parts for the single instruments with the
> correct transposition, but keeping the same pitch in the midi.
> 
> Is there already a facility to do so, say a function that I can place
> in front of a music sequence and get it transposed for saxophone? or
> do I have to come up with my own?
> 
> I understand that the correct way of doing this is first write the
> notes in the tonality of the instrument, and _then_ use \transposition
> to get the correct pitches in the midi, but I already have the notes
> in the ly file with the orchestral pitch and I would like to avoid
> rewriting the whole part.
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Francesco
> 
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Re: [Lilypond] How to get guitar chords to appear at each bar

[Tim McNamara]

> On Jun 9, 2019, at 6:32 PM, John Helly  wrote:
> 
> Aloha.
> 
> With various suggestions that I'm very grateful for, I've mostly gotten
> this guitar and vocal piece to score reasonably.  However, I'm now stuck
> trying to get the guitar chords to appear over each measure of the
> verses and chorus.  I've tried a variety of things but they all seem to
> cause the chords to appear as part of the lyrics.  I may have boxed
> myself in somehow since I'm still a newbie.

Is the default is for a chord to appear at its first instance and not in 
subsequent bars until it changes to a different chord. So if you have four bars 
of D, you'll get the D chord at the start of the first bar but not the 
subsequent bars. When it changes to a G chord, you'll get that chord listed and 
then not again until the next chord change. This is pretty much the norm in 
guitar charts in general as the page looks very busy and clunky with the same 
chord being repeated over each bar.

> Also, I'm getting a console message saying:
> 
> warning: forced break was overridden by some other event, should you be
> using bar checks?
> 
> I'm trying to figure out what this is due to as it may relate to the
> question above (I guess). 
> Any suggestions to get out of the box would be appreciated.

On my charts when that happens, somewhere I have made an error in the duration 
of a note or a chord. Typically I've got an quarter note notated as an eighth 
note, for example, or there's a problem with a dotted note. I use Lilypond to 
create jazz band lead sheets so there is a melody and a chord chart 
simultaneously; the error can be in either. usually it's a typo- I was typing a 
number of eighth notes and there was supposed to be a quarter note but I typed 
it as an eighth note.

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Re: Lilypond not rendering PDF on Mac

[Tim McNamara]

That's what I was wondering.  Might be helpful to make from source rather than 
using the precompiled binary.  The MacOS update to 14.2 might have broken 
something- different version of some library or other- but building anew might 
resolve it, at the risk of dependency hell.

> On Jan 9, 2019, at 6:36 AM, Andrew Bernard  wrote:
> 
> Do we even support that version of Mac OS?
> 
> 
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Re: parenthesized chord symbols

[Tim McNamara]

Here is something I have used for years with good results.  Someone on the list 
created this off the cuff.  I have not tried it with 2.19.x.  No doubt it could 
be improved, but it is short and simple.

\version "2.18.0"

#(define (left-parenthesis-ignatzek-chord-names in-pitches bass inversion 
context)
(markup #:line ("( " (ignatzek-chord-names in-pitches bass inversion context

#(define (right-parenthesis-ignatzek-chord-names in-pitches bass inversion 
context)
(markup #:line ((ignatzek-chord-names in-pitches bass inversion context) " )")))

LPC = { \set chordNameFunction = #left-parenthesis-ignatzek-chord-names }
RPC = { \set chordNameFunction = #right-parenthesis-ignatzek-chord-names }
NPC = { \unset chordNameFunction }

%%
% \LPC first-chord \NPC more chords \RPC last-chord \NPC
%%
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Re: Should the LilyPond website mention financial support for contributors?

[Tim McNamara]

There’ve been many discussions about how to manage funding and contributing 
especially for those of us who cannot contribute to the coding.  The Lilypond 
project doesn’t have any administration or central organization to be 
responsible for soliciting, collecting, accounting for and distributing money 
to developers.  Some people have put up bounties to get “feature X" developed.  
The most efficient- indeed the only- way to fund development of Lilypond is to 
send money directly to the specific developer.

A number of years back David Kastrup basically devoted himself to working on 
Lilypond full time and to correct many of the internal difficulties created by 
having a patchwork of developers writing things (sometimes in different 
development languages as well as different human languages) over a very long 
period of time.  He was able to afford to do this due to direct contributions 
from users to him.  He has done an amazing amount of heavy lifting in revamping 
the code base without which the current versions of the application would not 
exist with the functionality and stability they have.  Not that he is the only 
developer working on it, by far, but he has done such a lot for the community 
especially in the unglamorous hidden corners of the code- and also being a 
prolific troubleshooter and adviser on the lilypond-user list.  

I am very sorry to hear he has fallen on such difficult times and hope things 
get better!
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Re: Lilypond slow to start up on the Mac

[Tim McNamara]

> On Apr 23, 2018, at 1:13 PM, David Wright  wrote:
> 
> On Mon 23 Apr 2018 at 11:40:46 (-0400), Arle Lommel wrote:
>> I’ve noticed on the Mac for some time that the first time I invoke Lilypond 
>> from an external application after a reboot, it can take quite a while for 
>> it to respond. Normally this is something like a 40–60 second delay, after 
>> which Lilypond behaves normally. But a few days ago, after I updated to OS X 
>> 10.13.4, it seemed that Lilypond was totally unresponsive over much longer 
>> periods. After waiting about ten minutes, I finally walked away for dinner, 
>> and when I came back, it was working normally. This happened with the latest 
>> development build, but I’ve also had delays with the stable build (although 
>> never as long as this was).
>> 
>> I was invoking Lilypond through Frescobaldi, but I’ve had the same (shorter) 
>> initial delays on JEdit, and on multiple machines in the past.
>> 
>> During this longer wait, I could launch Lilypond.app and initiate a 
>> typesetting activity from within it with no problem, so it is not Lilypond 
>> itself that seems to be the problem, but rather something specific to 
>> external applications calling it.
>> 
>> Is this a known issue? If so, any ideas on ways to fix it other than 
>> typesetting something and walking away for 20 minutes before it responds?
> 
> Maybe you've hit this one which used to be a frequent problem here.
> The cure is usually either a newer version, or you could try
> deleting the font cache and hoping it will get rebuilt correctly
> (if there was a problem before) on the next run.
> 
> http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-user/2017-03/msg00066.html

I am seeing these very long launch times with 2.18.2-1 which the thread states 
is not showing the font cache rebuild problem.  I don’t use the development 
versions as I lack the actual computer skills necessary to deal with any 
problems that might occur.  I can’t even code “Hello, world” in any language.  
;-)
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Re: Lilypond slow to start up on the Mac

[Tim McNamara]

> On Apr 23, 2018, at 10:40 AM, Arle Lommel  wrote:
> 
> I’ve noticed on the Mac for some time that the first time I invoke Lilypond 
> from an external application after a reboot, it can take quite a while for it 
> to respond. Normally this is something like a 40–60 second delay, after which 
> Lilypond behaves normally. But a few days ago, after I updated to OS X 
> 10.13.4, it seemed that Lilypond was totally unresponsive over much longer 
> periods. After waiting about ten minutes, I finally walked away for dinner, 
> and when I came back, it was working normally. This happened with the latest 
> development build, but I’ve also had delays with the stable build (although 
> never as long as this was).
> 
> I was invoking Lilypond through Frescobaldi, but I’ve had the same (shorter) 
> initial delays on JEdit, and on multiple machines in the past.
> 
> During this longer wait, I could launch Lilypond.app and initiate a 
> typesetting activity from within it with no problem, so it is not Lilypond 
> itself that seems to be the problem, but rather something specific to 
> external applications calling it.
> 
> Is this a known issue? If so, any ideas on ways to fix it other than 
> typesetting something and walking away for 20 minutes before it responds?

I have also seen this on several prior versions of the Mac OS as well.  I am 
invoking Lilypond via Frescobaldi, so I don’t know if there is something with 
how the OS handles those requests or if the OS is just slow to launch Lilypond 
(I haven’t tested it from the command line in Terminal).  Once it’s been 
launched once, subsequent invocations are immediate.  I do not recall if this 
only happened after a reboot, my sense is that I see it somewhat randomly even 
without a reboot.

I don’t know if there would be anything helpful in any of the logs that might 
be explanatory.



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Re: Lead sheet with variables

[Tim McNamara]

> On Jan 23, 2018, at 9:23 AM, JH Austin  wrote:
> 
> I tried to modify the Lead Sheet example by using a variable:
> ---
> \version "2.19.40"
> 
> \music =   \relative c'' {
>a4 e c8 e r4
>b2 c4( d)
>  }
> \score {
> <<
>  \chords { c2 g:sus4 f e }
>  \music
>  \addlyrics { One day this shall be free __ }
>>> 

I think there should be >> here to match the << under \score.  Instead your 
example has something else.  AFAIK every bracket, parenthesis, etc., in 
Lilypond has to be balanced:  { }  ( )  << >> etc.  Not having the needed one 
will result in the compilation failing in most if not all cases.

>   \layout { }
> }
> 
> =
> and I got the following errors:
> ---
> Procesando «/Users/josephaustin/lilypond/scripts/TEST/leadSheet07.ly»
> Analizando...
> /Users/josephaustin/lilypond/scripts/TEST/leadSheet07.ly:3:1: error: cadena 
> de escape desconocida: `\music'
> 
> \music =   \relative c'' {
> Interpretando la música...
> Preprocesando los objetos gráficos...
> Buscando el número de páginas ideal...
> Disponiendo la música en una página...
> Dibujando los sistemas...
> Salida de la página hacia 
> «/var/folders/8c/krjhl46n5fq3wxbl0nvlfy6mgn/T//lilypond-M7rF1a»...
> Convirtiendo en «leadSheet07.pdf»...
> Suprimiendo 
> «/var/folders/8c/krjhl46n5fq3wxbl0nvlfy6mgn/T//lilypond-M7rF1a»...
> error fatal: archivos que han fallado: 
> "/Users/josephaustin/lilypond/scripts/TEST/leadSheet07.ly"
> =
> 
> My questions:
> 1. what did I do wrong?
> 2. Can I get the error messages in English?
> 
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Re: PDF woes

[Tim McNamara]

> On Jan 17, 2018, at 10:46 PM, Travis Weller  wrote:

> I'm using the default editor which is included in the MacOS build of 
> lilypond. I'm not using Frescobaldi. 
> 
> And yes, I've checked that I'm using preview mode. The links are there. I can 
> see them when I mouse over, and they work in Acrobat. I've looked through all 
> the options I can find in the Preview app and haven't seen anything that 
> might be blocking the links. I'd use Acrobat if the PDF would update 
> properly, but there is a disclaimer in the documentation that says only the 
> Mac preview app will auto-update after you typeset the file.



> On 18 January 2018 at 10:16, Travis Weller  wrote:
> 
> The link feature from the "Preview" app pointing back to the editor isn't 
> working (it doesn't show an error message, just an audio alert sound instead 
> of opening the editor at the correct point)

This has in my experience never worked.  The Preview.app apparently has no way 
to communicate back to the editor.  It is an exceedingly basic little 
application and philosophically Apple does not particularly like apps 
interacting and communicating with each other.  If Acrobat works, then I would 
suggest using that.

Personally I switched to Frescobaldi several years ago and would never go back 
to dealing with the default Lilypond editor or Preview.app for engraving music. 
 With Frescobaldi my time spent putting charts together is easily cut in half.  
The somewhat crude screen display is of no concern to me, only the printed 
output is.  That is the domain of Lilypond and is no different with Frescobaldi 
or another editor.

If you don't want to use Frescobaldi, would wonder if you would have better 
luck using an XWindow setup and more Unix tools, as those are designed to 
communicate with each other (xpdf, etc.).  I’ve never tried that myself.  
Installing Lilypond via Homebrew or similar would result in that kind of system.
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Re: fondu fails on newer OS X versions

[Tim McNamara]

> On Jan 12, 2018, at 12:03 PM, padovani  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> 
> it seems that I'm having the mentioned fondu issue while running LilyPond 
> 2.19.80 on OSX 10.11.6 - El Capitan.
> [http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/fondu-problems-on-El-Capitan-td189203.html]
>  
> 
> Is there a fix around? Digging the LilyPond user, developer and bug lists I 
> didn't found the fix, although someone mentioned a patch.
> 
> Thank you very much for any help on this

Testing this on my system is interesting.  On my Mac running 10.13.2, Lilypond 
2.18.2-1 and Frescobaldi 2.20.0 I do not see this issue.  Changing the font 
name with an override compiles the .ly file gracefully and with the correct 
font.  There is no fondu complaint at all.

This may not be comparing apples to apples.  Is there something different in 
LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/bin/fondu in 2.18.2-1 compared to 12.19.80?  Or 
perhaps Frescobaldi’s involvement changes things?  

Note that I downloaded the precompiled Lilypond and Frescobaldi binaries rather 
than rolling my own, although I am not 100% sure about the Lilypond install at 
this late date and possibly compiled that myself.  My current Lilypond install 
is dated 2014-3-17; Frescobaldi is dated 2017-2-19.
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Re: Next round on frescobaldi dependencies

[Tim McNamara]

On Dec 31, 2017, at 5:30 AM, bb  wrote:
> 
> I think you cannot install different versions of frescobaldi or parallel from 
> different sources. You might simply remove the repository version, try again 
> and see what happens. 
> 
> Concerning the description on http://www.frescobaldi.org/download.html
> there are some errors for frescobaldi 3.0.0, the dependency list is 
> incomplete and versions are wrongly noted
> one needs Python3-Poppler-Qt5, for me Python-Poppler-Qt5 did not work
> for some reason I argue python3-pyqt5.qtwebkit is neded, that is not on the 
> list 
> may be more issues? 

Looking at the Frescobaldi install from source page, it clearly indicates that 
the Python stuff should be from the same version (3.4 or higher).  I would hope 
that following the recipe will result in a working install for you.

**
Frescobaldi 3 needs Python version 3.4+, PyQt5 and Python-Poppler-Qt5. And of 
course python-ly and Python-PortMidi, installed for the same Python version.

Installation order:

• Install Python 3.4 or higher
• Install PyQt5, using the same Python version of course.
• Install python-ly
• Install Frescobaldi (will work, but without PDF and MIDI support)
• Install Python-Poppler-Qt5
• Install Python-PortMidi. If this one is difficult to install, you can 
also use Pygame, which too contains the Python-PortMidi library. Use the 
correct Python version!

**

Hope this helps!
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Re: Vintage Jazz Chords post in 2011 - Howto get it to display on Fresco?

[Tim McNamara]

On Dec 25, 2017, at 5:41 PM, James Harkins  wrote:

>> > I pasted this into Frescabaldi...
>> 
>> you have to paste it to where lilypond can find it. That is not necessarily 
>> the font directory of lilypond, but I think that is not a wrong place. 
>> lilypond does not have frescobaldi in the search path.
> 
> As I read the original post, it's quite plausible that the poster pasted the 
> LilyPond code into Frescobaldi and expected immediate display of music.
> 
> But Frescobaldi, with (AFAIK) default settings, displays nothing until you 
> engrave the document (command in the menu labeled "LilyPond").
> 
> Daryl's exact words: "there were no error, but it didn't display anything!"
> 
> That's exactly what would happen if you put LP code into the editor but don't 
> engrave it. (But, if he were engraving an LP document that depends on 
> LilyJazz without installing LilyJazz, certainly he would get errors.)
> 
> So I think the disconnect may be more basic than any of the replies so far 
> have addressed.
> 
> Daryl: After pasting the code into Frescobaldi, you need to hit ctrl-m 
> (Windows or Linux) or cmd-m (Mac).

I don't know how new Daryl is to Lilypond, but as noted pasting and compiling 
lilyjazz will do nothing useful.  It is intended to be used with the \include 
command to tell Lilypond how to format chords and also to use a font intended 
to mimic the look of the Real Books.  An example of that was given in an 
earlier post upthread.

Daryl, read up on the use of \include.

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Re: OT: Apple stealing "Lily"

[Tim McNamara]

> On May 6, 2017, at 3:47 AM, David Kastrup  wrote:
> 
> Robert Schmaus  writes:
> 
>>> Please cool down and stop overreacting.
>> 
>> 
>> Well your statement, which - very possibly without any bad intention - 
>> turned around the historical facts, so admirably matched that notion
>> that occasionally pops up also on this list ... namely that notion
>> that everything proprietary is an attack on one's freedom. And that
>> *is* paranoid.

Stallman, Lessig and the EFF all trend in that direction.  There is a tendency 
to try to keep the notions to computer code, but there are much larger 
implications to the foundational notions.  And sadly a certain amount of 
paranoia is called for in the modern information society:  who has your 
information and what they intend to do with it are salient questions for 
everyone.  I use Apple products because I find them practically superior to 
other options, but I do not trust Apple (or Microsoft, Google, Facebook, etc.)- 
they have their interests at heart, not mine.  As a result I take what steps I 
can to protect myself and my information.  Linux creates different risks, 
mainly mitigated by the ultra-tiny market share, as well as a number of 
practical problems that I do not have the time or skills to solve.  While I am 
sympathetic to Stallman’s and Lessig’s notions, they are not without problems.

> Uh, no.  That is the _definition_ of "proprietary": being not at liberty
> for the taking.  That does not preclude putting the respective
> consequences into proper relation to one's own personal standards and
> aims.

This is ultimately questioning whether ownership of anything is moral, when 
taken to the logical conclusion.  If something (whether real or conceptual) is 
owned by someone then it is proprietary:  my house, my bank account, my car, my 
guitars and amps, the music I have composed and recorded/published, etc.  
Otherwise we end up proposing that only certain classes or types of property 
should be exempt from ownership, which becomes mired the very sticky set of 
laws that govern copyright, patents* and trademark.  That is a rather larger 
issue than is perhaps apropos for the Lilypond mailing list, I think…  Most 
Americans and probably most people around the world consider their right to 
ownership to be part of their liberty and not an infringement of liberty.

*FWIW, the US government has had a law on the books since I think 1910 that 
allows it to claim ownership- without compensation- of the subject of any 
patent, if it is for the “public good”- an extension of eminent domain into 
so-called “intellectual property."  It has been used to circumvent the cost of 
proprietary patented medications, for example, and may soon be used again in 
the state of Louisiana for treating hepatitis C.  The current 12 week course of 
treatment costs $84,000 and Louisiana is looking to cut those costs 
dramatically to be able to afford to treat the thousands of its citizens on 
public health benefits.  At the current prices, treating those patients alone 
would bankrupt the state; not treating them causes significant long-term health 
risks which are in turn expensive for the state and its taxpayers.  Whether 
doing this increases or decreases liberty is an interesting question.



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Re: Apple stealing "Lily"

[Tim McNamara]

Thank you for your good sense, Andrew.

> On May 2, 2017, at 8:30 PM, Andrew Bernard  wrote:
> 
> Come on guys. Lilypond is not named Lily, the app is not developed by Apple, 
> Apple is not stealing anything, and it has nothing to do with music engraving.
> 
> Lilypond is not a brand and not a trademark. It's open source software, and 
> it does not compete in a market. Dear me. Lilypond software has no right or 
> monopoly over the English word lily.
> 
> It does not benefit the open source movement to say that any proprietary 
> product is an 'attack' on ones freedom. To say that is just trolling. You may 
> be restricted in your rights, but you are not being attacked. The current 
> trend towards weaponization of language is distressing. 
> 
> Andrew
> 
> 
>> On 2 May 2017 at 05:56, Peter Gentry  wrote:
>> https://www.groovypost.com/deals/lily-apple-free-app-of-week/
>> 
>> 
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Re: How to build LilyPond.app on macOS?

[Tim McNamara]

> On Dec 6, 2016, at 5:46 AM, Mojca Miklavec  wrote:
> 
>(b.2) I would actually like to know how to change the behaviour,
> so that my favourite text editor opens rather than LilyPond.app.

Wait, is all you want to do is to be able to assign *.ly files to open with a 
specific text editor if you double-click on them?  On Macs that’s settable in 
the Finder with no need to build anything from source.

Right-click or Control-click on the *.ly file.  Select “Open with…” from the 
popup menu that appears.  Select your desired application.  When it asks if you 
want all *.ly files mapped to that application, click “yes.”  Should be done.
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Re: New LilyPond website

[Tim McNamara]

> On Nov 29, 2016, at 3:57 AM, Andrew Bernard  wrote:

> If however you are discussing expanding the mindshare of lilypond in the
> music publishing world, then I hardly think the cosmetic appearance of a
> website is the most influential factor. That's a very shallow approach.
> Surely it must be the quality and engineering of the software itself that
> speaks for lilypond's virtues.

The cosmetic appearance of the web site is most certainly an influential factor 
in expanding the "mindshare" of Lilypond.  That is one of the realities of the 
world as it works.  The quality and engineering of the software itself is 
invisible to 99% of your potential users.  

Take me-  I am a musician.  I know nothing useful about C and it's variants, 
Scheme, etc.  Lilypond might have the most elegant code ever written and I will 
not see it, even if you point right at it.  The result?  I am not going to 
evaluate Lilypond by its engineering.  There's clearly some disadvantage to me 
for that, but at 57 years old with a full-time career, I'm not going to learn 
how to code.  But the advantage is that I get to look at the software and the 
website more naively- compared to someone who has an encyclopedic knowledge of 
what's under the hood- as a new potential user would.

Unless you only want people who already know how to code to be your customers.  
That's a small market.

For people just finding out about Lilypond, the Lilypond web site is the point 
of entry (I first heard about Lilypond on the MacUpdate site and followed the 
link from there).  Does it say to me "this is a modern, powerful application 
that will produce beautiful sheet music that you will be proud to hand out to 
your peers?"  Or does it say "this application is the product of spit, chewing 
gum and baling wire?"  OK, I am exaggerating a lot because the current web site 
doesn't actually say that to me, but it is dated now and looks a bit hobbyist 
by comparison.

Inasmuch as much of the FOSS community is often loathe to admit it, branding 
does actually matter.  Getting people to use the software matters.  Writing 
great free-as-in-speech software and then not persuading people to give it a 
try tends to shoot that software in the foot.  An attractive, modern website 
can help with that.

John's pages look pretty good and I thank him for the hours he put into it.  
The scrolling is not annoying on my tablets but was on my laptops, for some 
reason.  That being said, having looked at the sample web site on my laptops, 
tablets and phone, the Learn page is very difficult as it stands.  It's row 
upon row of basically undifferentiated choices- if you didn't go there already 
knowing what you wanted, the page doesn't help you choose.

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Re: Guitar harmonics indicators

[Tim McNamara]

Bear in mind, though, that fairly few guitarists are used to seeing guitar 
written as if for piano.  Johnny Smith advocated that, because it allows the 
guitar to be written as it sounds, but he was almost unique.  99% of the 
relatively few guitarists who can sight read expect to see treble clef, 
transposed up an octave.  Few could play the example given.

One fairly common standard is using an open diamond head to indicate the 
harmonic, but that is really only useful for octave harmonics.



> On May 20, 2016, at 6:35 AM, Andrew Bernard  wrote:
> 
> Not being a guitar player, I am out of my area here, hence my question. 
> Referring to the attached sample image, my composer uses a circled numeral to 
> indicate the string number, with superscript roman numerals to indicate the 
> fret on that string to play for a harmonic. Is this standard for fretted 
> instruments? Has anybody got a function written already that does this? I was 
> unable to find anything the same as this in the NR or LSR.
> 
> Andrew
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Added ninth chord (symbol)

[Tim McNamara]

> On Apr 29, 2016, at 12:22 PM, Henry Law  wrote:
> 
> I've searched the archives and the web generally; all that I have found on 
> this subject leads me to believe that the facility I need is not there, which 
> is perplexing since it's not particularly esoteric.  Can someone either 
> confirm my understanding or put me right?  (I'm using 2.18.2 on a 
> Debian-based system).
> 
> In a lead sheet I want to use the chord which I call an "added ninth". Using 
> the key of C as an example, I want the chord C-E-G-D: a plain major triad 
> with the ninth added on top.
> 
> "add9" is not a valid chord designator in Lilypond, as far as I can see.  I 
> can ask for "9" or "maj9" or "sus2" but none of these is my chord:
> 
> The ninth is a dominant ninth: C-E-G-Bb-D  Quite a different animal.
> Major ninth is C-E-G-B-D
> Sus2 is C-D-G, where the third is (temporarily, usually) /replaced/ by the 
> second.
> 
> Am I stuck?  I'm hoping there is some magic somewhere to help.

No magic as such but the answer is baked into LilyPond.  You need to create a 
chord exception; the instructions are somewhere in the LilyPond manual.  I am 
away from my laptop with all my LP stuff on it so I can't direct more 
specifically.  The exception can be formulated to produce Cadd9 as the 
chordname easily.  Just what you're looking for.

There is a file floating around called pop-chord.ly or pop-chords.ly that has a 
lot of these kinds of exceptions already done.  You use the \include command to 
utilize it; how to do that is also in the manual.  The file ought to be in the 
snippet repository, I would think.

Tim

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Re: Replying to posts

[Tim McNamara]

> On Apr 28, 2016, at 11:45 PM, Werner LEMBERG  wrote:
> 
> 
>> Reading your admonition to "don't use top-posting," I tried to
>> locate the command in Outlook 2013 that sets this option as default.
> 
> What about this?
> 
>  http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/outlook-quotefix/
> 
> I'm not an outlook user, but this looks quite promising (and is
> actively maintained)!

This is or used to be available for Mac as well, although the Mac Mail.app now 
has settings to address most of this without adding a plug-in.  QuoteFix used 
to break some other things on the Mac.

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Re: Replying to posts

[Tim McNamara]

> On Apr 28, 2016, at 9:37 PM, Andrew Bernard  wrote:
> 
> The whole reason I began this thread was to ask if there may be some
> simple way we could post the code of conduct/guidelines/policy for the
> mailing list so that people could be made aware of it. Nobody has
> addressed that simple point.
> 
> The problem with implicit rules is that they are hidden. Each person
> has to discover them by themselves, taking time and effort to do so,
> and making mistakes along the way, when a simple paragraph of explicit
> rules eliminates all ambiguity.
> 
> Debian has dozens of mailing lists. They state a clear policy here:
> 
> https://www.debian.org/MailingLists
> 
> If they can do it, why can't we?
> 
> [I can't help noting that the Debian mailing lists explicitly state
> that plain text only is to be used.]
> 
>> There are many web pages about (other) mailing lists etiquette.
> 
> Indeed. We ought to have one.

Most mailing lists send a copy of the rules with the "welcome e-mail" that is 
sent someone subscribes to the list.  It's been long enough that I don't 
remember what the one I received said on the topic.  

This mailing list has a quirk that newbies should be made aware of, which is 
that (unlike any other mailing list to which I belong) the Reply-To: header is 
not set to the list.

The plain text standard should be made explicit with either directions for how 
to do that or links to directions about how to do that for the most common mail 
applications (Outlook, Google Mac, the Mac Mail.app and iOS mail app, etc.).

And I also apologize to the list members that my public and private appeals for 
pragmatism in dealing with the mail format issue seem to have strongly 
contributed to David Kastrup's exit from the user list.  That was not my intent.



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Re: Replying to posts

[Tim McNamara]

> On Apr 25, 2016, at 8:11 AM, Michael Hendry  wrote:
> 
>> On 25 Apr 2016, at 13:39, Tim McNamara  wrote:
>> 
>> On Apr 25, 2016, at 5:00 AM, Andrew Bernard  wrote:
>> 
>>> Greetings All,
>>> 
>>> In a recent post David Wright asks of  a user:
>>> 
>>>> Please configure your client to post a text equivalent of your HTML code.
>>> 
>>> He also asked me to do that.
>> 
>> The reality is that the world, given the ubiquity of broadband and graphical 
>> interfaces, has moved on from plain text.  It is no longer the standard and 
>> has not been for a decade or more- most Internet users have, I suspect, no 
>> knowledge of this old standard any longer. Expecting others to accommodate 
>> what is now an out of date standard will simply continue to create issues.  
>> It's like expecting web developers to accommodate lynx in creating Web 
>> pages- probably not going to happen very often.  
>> 
>> One can choose to use text-only software but at this point we are 
>> responsible for our own problems if we do.  The world has changed and left 
>> us behind.
> 
> Heavens above!
> 
> You’ll be wanting us to start top-posting next!

LOL!  While top-posting is now normal as well, it really irks me and I can’t 
imagine ever wanting to do it that way.


A:  It’s backwards.

Q:  What’s wrong with top posting?


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Re: Replying to posts

[Tim McNamara]

On Apr 25, 2016, at 5:00 AM, Andrew Bernard  wrote:
> 
> Greetings All,
> 
> In a recent post David Wright asks of  a user:
> 
> > Please configure your client to post a text equivalent of your HTML code.
> 
> He also asked me to do that.

The reality is that the world, given the ubiquity of broadband and graphical 
interfaces, has moved on from plain text.  It is no longer the standard and has 
not been for a decade or more- most Internet users have, I suspect, no 
knowledge of this old standard any longer.  Expecting others to accommodate 
what is now an out of date standard will simply continue to create issues.  
It's like expecting web developers to accommodate lynx in creating Web pages- 
probably not going to happen very often.  

One can choose to use text-only software but at this point we are responsible 
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Re: Lilypond error behaviour

[Tim McNamara]

> On Apr 17, 2016, at 3:16 PM, David Kastrup  wrote:
> 
> Noeck  writes:
> 
>> These two are often similar but not always.
>> IMHO, it would make sense to consider both and have 3 categories:
>> - warning: user, please look at this
>> - error: this is severe, there is something definitely wrong, but
>>  Lilypond did its very best to keep running
>> - fatal error: this is severe and Lilypond could not rescue the
>>  situation, nothing was produced
> 
> We are not talking about "nothing was produced" since LilyPond can't
> change the past.  The demand rather boils down to "if LilyPond has
> already successfully produced anything, that should not be left
> available and the PDF should not be completed properly."

Having read this thread from the perspective of a musician who uses LilyPond 
rather than a programmer who is also a musician, I don't don't understand the 
controversy.  It seems to me that LilyPond should produce whatever output it 
can from the syntax such as it is- whether that is a garbled PDF file or MIDI 
file- because that helps point the user to the syntax error in a very concrete 
way.  "Oh, my forced breaks failed there and I see the note with the wrong 
duration that caused it."  For me it is helpful to have the output; having 
LilyPond say essentially "you effed up, son, and you can't have a PDF to check 
it out" is less helpful to me.

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Re: Transpose down a perfect fifth

[Tim McNamara]

Sent from my iPad

> On Apr 10, 2016, at 5:21 PM, Ryan Michael  wrote:
> 
> Hello . I have a score that I would the entirety of to be transposed down a 
> perfect fifth.
> I tried
> 
> \Transpose c f,{
> 
>  E4 e f g g f e d c c d e e4. D8 d2 r2
> }

Out of curiosity, did \Transpose really work?  The command is \transpose and I 
thought Lilypond is case-sensitive to these things; ditto the uppercase notes 
of E4 and D8.

There is something else happening here, since \transpose c f, ought to work.  I 
use it regularly to transpose horn parts.

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Re: creating chords like F/A(D/F#) with \chordmode { }

[Tim McNamara]

On Mar 12, 2016, at 11:24 AM, Eby Mani  wrote:
> 
> Here it is.
> 
>> On Sat, 12/3/16, Tim McNamara  wrote:
>> 
>> If you could point to an
>> existing example out on the web that looks like what you
>> want, it would be really easy to see what it is and figure
>> out how to achieve this with Lilypond.
> 
>>> On Mar 12, 2016, at 8:25
>>> AM, Eby Mani  wrote:
>>> 
>>> How do i create chords like - B flat(G) or F/A(D/F#) with \chordmode { } ?.

Thanks!  I see- you want to have the chords in an alternate key on the same 
chart (the melody as written would no longer fit the harmony, though, which 
seems problematic to me).  That is something I have never attempted to make 
Lilypond do- I would personally write the chart in one key and then use the 
convenient \transpose function to generate charts in alternate keys as needed 
with both the melody and the harmony transposed.  That's really easy to do- 
would that approach work for you?
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Re: creating chords like F/A(D/F#) with \chordmode { }

[Tim McNamara]

On Mar 12, 2016, at 8:25 AM, Eby Mani  wrote:
> 
> How do i create chords like - B flat(G) or F/A(D/F#) with \chordmode { } ?.

It would help if you would explain what you are trying to do a bit more fully.  
What is the chord "B flat(G)"?  Or "F/A(D/F#)"?  If I saw that on a lead sheet 
I would not know what to do because they don't make sense.  So my guess is that 
I don't understand something -probably quite simple- about your intent and thus 
don't know how to give you advice about using chordmode, which uses a 
standardized chord nomenclature and would not produce chord names that look 
like that.  

If you could point to an existing example out on the web that looks like what 
you want, it would be really easy to see what it is and figure out how to 
achieve this with Lilypond.
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Re: Lilypond and Jazz chords

[Tim McNamara]

> On Jan 17, 2016, at 3:28 PM, Carl-Henrik Buschmann  
> wrote:
> 
> A properly formatet complex chord stacks alterations in parenthesis.

Hemmm, that is a matter of individual preferences.  As a jazz musician I find 
parentheses in chords add to the visual clutter and add no useful information.  
More characters add more confusion.  Cmaj7#4 is less trouble to read than 
Cmaj7(#4) on the bandstand in an unfamiliar tune.

Of course 90% of the extensions that are written on lead sheets are ignored 
anyway in favor of what the musician’s ear tells him or her what to play.  
Composers should generally save themselves the bother.
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Re: ChordNames: Brandt & Roemer exceptions

[Tim McNamara]

Oh, don't give me credit for that!  It was sent to me by another list member a 
few years back as the pop-chords.ly file.

> On Nov 29, 2015, at 3:42 PM, Kieren MacMillan  
> wrote:
> 
> p.s. Thanks to Tim McNamara for the root-namer Scheme function!
> (Full documentation and credits will be added to the entire file before it 
> "goes public”…)
> 
>> On Nov 29, 2015, at 4:32 PM, Kieren MacMillan 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello all,
>> 
>> Here's the first step towards a comprehensive Brandt & Roemer chord-naming 
>> include file. I’ve attached both the exceptions/markup include file 
>> (ChordNames-brandtroemer.ly) and a "test suite” score file 
>> (ChordNames-brandtroemer-test.ly).
>> 
>> There are still lots of things I know how to implement and must do so (e.g., 
>> encapsulate redundant/shared/common markup situations into functions), and 
>> things I don’t yet know how to implement but must figure out soon (e.g., how 
>> to accomplish B&R’s “fraction” notation for polytonal chords).
>> 
>> In the meantime, I would love to hear comments, suggestions, etc. on what I 
>> have so far.
>> 
>> Thanks.
>> Kieren.
> 
> 
> Kieren MacMillan, composer
> ‣ website: www.kierenmacmillan.info
> ‣ email: i...@kierenmacmillan.info
> 
> 
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Re: Chord names

[Tim McNamara]

> On Nov 26, 2015, at 10:10 AM, Kieren MacMillan 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
>>> LilyPond's chord-naming names actually played chord notes,
>>> not anticipated chords.
> 
> I, for one, am grateful there are overrides, so I can easily label chords 
> with a chord name that my musicians prefer to see — in this case, a chord 
> name which actually helps them perform better — as opposed to being stuck 
> with whatever is suggested by the “rule” that’s currently implemented by 
> default.

Flexibility is one of the strengths of Lilypond.  The “rule” in question is 
implemented by default because there is no practical way to do it otherwise.  
Lilypond cannot predict the intent of the composer.  Sus chords do not resolve 
to a diatonic major or minor in quartal harmony for example, so for Lilypond to 
assume there is a resolution to a major or minor triad would be unwise.
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Re: Repeat with alternatives

[Tim McNamara]

> On Sep 30, 2015, at 8:22 AM, s.p.korzil...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> Dear Sir / Madam,
>  
> I’m trying to write a piece that has repeats with alternatives. It seems that 
> “\repeat volta 2” is the way to go with supplying the alternatives in 
> “\alternative”. However, this seems to work only for alternative endings, 
> while I have alternative middle parts.
>  
> I have tried to fix this manually with introducing volta brackets and repeat 
> signs. Unfortunately Lilypond doesn’t recognize this as a repeat and counts 
> the notes of the alternatives as if they are all played in one run (so that 
> the first note after the alternatives does not start a new measure, as it 
> should, see attachment).

Yes.  You are starting the alternative in the middle of the bar which, from the 
perspective of the musician reading the piece, is going to look very odd and be 
hard to follow.  The alternatives should always be full bars not only for 
Lilypond to function correctly but for the musicians to be able to play it 
correctly without needing a lot of instruction.

The updated file here corrects the issue and is more readable:




Example Updated.ly
Description: Binary data


Example Updated.pdf
Description: Adobe PDF document
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Re: Chords and what they mean

[Tim McNamara]

> On Sep 20, 2015, at 2:58 AM, BB  wrote:
> 
> On 20.09.2015 03:30, Flaming Hakama by Elaine wrote:
>>  ...
>>  
>> > I suppose that this is because some people (and Lilypond) think that
>> > C:sus2 is equally as valid or usual interpretation of "sus", and
>> 
>> May be I misundertand this? c:sus2 works with Lilypond and IS a valid
>> chord often used in pop/rock, not so frequently used in jazz? May be I
>> am wrong.
>> 
>> Of course sus2 is used.
>> 
>> The question is more like:  if you saw Csus, would you know how to interpret 
>> it musically?
>> Or would you be stuck in your tracks wondering, "is this a sus2, sus4, both? 
>>  something else?”

I would not be bothered by that.  The suspended 4th is the conventional meaning 
of a sus chord (a triad of root, 4th and 5th- Levine notwithstanding.  With the 
3rd in the chord, it’s really not a sus chord IMHO).  There are sus2 chords, 
IME these occur rarely in jazz except momentarily as voice leading- the melody 
note would be the obvious guide there.  In pop music what is often written as a 
“sus2” is really a triad plus 9 (root/3rd/5th/9th) without a 7th.

> c:sus is working correctly getting root and 5, but indeed is an 
> "unconventional" expression to get a C5 …

That is not working correctly IMO.  c:sus should not produce the chordname C5.

>> I tend to think that the sus implies 4, unless otherwise noted.
> 
> Why? Why not 2 or 3 or 5 or 6 or 7? I disagree!

Because as mentioned above the suspended 4th is the convention in Western music 
for a “sus” chord.  Also, you can’t have a sus3 or sus5 (or a sus root) by 
definition because those notes are already included- the terminology of 
suspension refers to the note above (typically) or below (occasionally) 
replacing the 3rd.  The use of the other notes such as the 6th, 7th and the 
extensions already has its own specific terminology.  Chord names should 
conform to standard nomenclature to avoid confusion the musicians in 
performance.  Disagreeing would put you outside of the normal language of 
chords and would be counterproductive.
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Re: LilyJAZZ

[Tim McNamara]

> On Aug 23, 2015, at 1:37 PM, Tim McNamara  wrote:
> 
> 
>> On Aug 23, 2015, at 6:56 AM, BB  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
>> Does anybody sucessful use LilyJAZZ?
> 
> Yes, I have been using it for over a year with excellent results, although 
> there are some quirks.  For example, it kills bar numbering.  It also 
> interferes with \improvisationOn and I have to turn off LilyJazz to be able 
> to use that.

Also, looking at the web page that was referenced in other threads, it appears 
that the old LilyJAZZ font has been completely replaced (looking at the example 
lead sheet).  To my eyes the old font was much better and I won’t be updating 
to the new version.  The new version looks awkward and doesn’t visually flow 
very well.  YMMV.
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Re: LilyJAZZ

[Tim McNamara]

> On Aug 23, 2015, at 6:56 AM, BB  wrote:



> Does anybody sucessful use LilyJAZZ?

Yes, I have been using it for over a year with excellent results, although 
there are some quirks.  For example, it kills bar numbering.  It also 
interferes with \improvisationOn and I have to turn off LilyJazz to be able to 
use that.



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Re: [Frescobaldi] ANN: Frescobaldi 2.18.1

[Tim McNamara]

Thank you, Davide!

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Re: Help please with alternate jazz chord naming system

[Tim McNamara]

> On Mar 10, 2015, at 8:35 PM, Peter Teeson  wrote:
> 
> Hi Tim:
> On 2015-03-09, at 2:53 PM, Tim McNamara  <mailto:tim...@bitstream.net>> wrote:
>> There is also the pop-chords.ly <http://pop-chords.ly/> file that can be 
>> used for chord names and I am working on modifying the same file to follow 
>> the Roemer chord name conventions which I will make available when done.
> Have you finished the Brandt Roemer conventions or is it still a wip?

It’s mostly done, at least for all the chords I use regularly.  There is a 
deviation in that I have not put the extensions/tensions as superscripts to the 
chord because I find that harder to read on the fly.  But I like these 
conventions because no one ever asks me what they mean.  I’d be happy to send 
you the file as it stands.

>>  It appears that the OP would like Real Book style chord names; the 
>> pop-chords.ly <http://pop-chords.ly/> file is easily modified.  It may be in 
>> the Lilypond snippet repository.  If not I can send a copy to the OP.
> I am the OP .

LOL!  Sorry, I quickly lost track in the thread.

> In fact I have both a "C" Edition Ultimate Jazz Fakebook published by Hal 
> Leonard 1988/
> this is a typeset book and was good for gigs.
>  
> I also have a "Real" book which was given to me. Don't like the font but the 
> chord changes are OK.

I use the JazzLILY font which looks a lot like the old Real Book handwritten 
chart.


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Re: Help please with alternate jazz chord naming system

[Tim McNamara]

There is also the pop-chords.ly file that can be used for chord names and I am 
working on modifying the same file to follow the Roemer chord name conventions 
which I will make available when done.  It appears that the OP would like Real 
Book style chord names; the pop-chords.ly file is easily modified.  It may be 
in the Lilypond snippet repository.  If not I can send a copy to the OP.




> On Mar 9, 2015, at 1:07 PM, Michael Hendry  wrote:
> 
> 
>> On 9 Mar 2015, at 17:31, Peter Teeson > > wrote:
>> 
>> I do not know how to set things up to use the alternate jazz chord naming 
>> system.
>> Notation p 392 "An alternate jazz chord system has been developed using 
>> these modifications. "
>> 
>> The snippet shows what I am doing now.
>> But the 2nd and 4th chord names are using the Ignatzek name. I want the 
>> alternative names per the chart in Notation on page 607
>> How do I do that?
>> 
>> 
>> http://chordsnippet.ly/>>
>> 
>> tia for your help…..
>> 
>> respect…
>> 
>> Peter
> 
> 
> I have a file called…
> 
> /Applications/LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/share/lilypond/current/ly/AccordsJazzDefs.ly
>  
> 
> …in my Mac installation of LilyPond, and I \include it near the beginning of 
> the file to get the alternative jazz chord names.
> 
> I can’t remember where I got it now, but no doubt Google would help.
> 
> Michael
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Naming convention brainstorming

[Tim McNamara]

Iteration mode?




> On Jan 31, 2015, at 5:41 PM, Urs Liska  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> for quite some time now I've been using a concept that is very useful, but 
> finally I'd like to give it an authoritative name to be used in different 
> places.
> 
> I'm talking about the working, thinking and compiling mode when I'm working 
> on the _content_ of a score and not it's final visual appearance. This mode 
> is characterized for example by
> - not caring too much about layout
> - not caring too much about engraving quality
> - being interested in visual feedback about manual interventions
>  (e.g. coloring annotations or the result of custom functions)
> 
> Originally we talked about it as "draft mode" but this doesn't seem to hit 
> the spot. Nor do "devel mode" or "preview mode".
> 
> I would really like to find the right term now because I want to make that 
> kind of an authoritative term for a configuration option in a redesigned 
> openLilyLib and sort of a general library specification in that context. 
> There should be a common configuration option that library authors can (and 
> are encouraged to) respect in their functions. Say I have a library function 
> "\crossVoiceTie" that does all the work for me with a hidden voice etc. Then 
> this should highlight that tie or the hidden noteheads when that special mode 
> is active.
> This approach has proven extremely useful and I'd be happy to promote this as 
> a more general best-practice.
> 
> So what are your feelings about this mode of working *before* finishing an 
> engraving to publication quality?
> 
> Thanks for any opinions
> Urs
> 
> -- 
> Urs Liska
> www.openlilylib.org
> 
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Re: sus7 chords in \chordmode

[Tim McNamara]

This has perhaps become off-topic and I don’t wish to prolong that; however, I 
have to take issue with the idea that “sus” could somehow apply to the 7th.  It 
can’t.  Suspensions specifically apply to replacing the 3rd with either the 4th 
or the 2nd (the latter being rare except in folk music played on guitar in the 
first position, and even then only a few chords lend themselves to this).  The 
7th cannot be suspended; it can be flatted or natural, in which case this is by 
convention denoted as a 7th or major 7th; the term “sus” is never applied to 
the 7th.  There should be no possible ambiguity when “sus” and “7” are used in 
the same chord.  

The main problem for me with “x7sus4” as a chord name is its length; when there 
are four chord names in a bar, every character counts in terms of legibility.  
Things can get crowded fast.  (This came up in preparing a chart for the Vince 
Guaraldi song “Cast Your Fate To The Wind” in which all the chords in the 
soloing section are suspended dominants.  Lots and lots of them, actually 
sounds pretty terrible on guitar; works somewhat better on piano which was 
Guaraldi’s instrument, but IMHO seriously overdone on this song).

However, I find that when I give musicians lead sheets done by the 
Roemer-Brandt standards I never get any question about what any chord means.  
It may not be especially modern but it is certainly effective.

Tim


> On Jan 26, 2015, at 6:08 PM, Kevin Barry  wrote:
> 
> 
> On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 10:57 PM, Flaming Hakama by Elaine 
> mailto:ela...@flaminghakama.com>> wrote:
> (Also, what is wrong with interpreting that the 7th resolve to a 6th?  That 
> seems pretty coherent.)
> 
> This allows for two possible interpretations of the same symbol, which is why 
> it is preferable to specify the chord (C7) and the suspension (sus or sus4) 
> separately: putting the `sus' in between `C' and `7' makes it unclear whether 
> it applies to the seventh or to the fourth.
> 
> The absence or presence of the seventh does not affect the chord quality (it 
> does not affect its function)
> 
> I have to disagree with this: there are plenty of situations where adding a 
> seventh does indeed change the chord's function.
> 
> Of course, getting any of the notes wrong is regrettable, which is why 
> unambiguity (i.e. C7sus4 IMO) is so desirable.
> 
> Kevin 
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Re: sus7 chords in \chordmode

[Tim McNamara]

> On Jan 26, 2015, at 1:32 AM, Johan Vromans  wrote:
> 
> On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 19:18:52 -0600
> Tim McNamara  wrote:
> 
>> I have repeatedly run into difficulties getting Lilypond to properly
>> render sus7 chord names in \chordmode.  It comes up with silly things
>> like "G7sus4 3” and the like.  What is the correct syntax to get a simple
>> “Gsus7” to print?
> 
> To not answer your question: I would not use Gsus7 since it is ambiguous.
> Gsus4 (or Gsus) has a suspended 4th, Gsus2 has a suspended 2nd, so Gsus7
> makes you think that the 7th is suspended -- which is not the case.
> 
> G7sus (or G7sus4) is the unambiguous way to express this chord.
> 
> See e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspended_chord .
> Chapter 8 of "Standardized Chord Symbol Notation" by Carl Brandt & Clinton
> Roemer.

I have the Roemer-Brandt book and will double check that, thanks for pointing 
it out.  I have been modifying the pop-chords.ly <http://pop-chords.ly/> file 
for my own use to use the Roemer-Brandt terminology and will make that 
available once I have completed it.  My recollection- without checking, of 
course- was that R-B used “sus” for plain suspended 4th chords and “sus7” for 
suspended 4th dominant chords.  My memory may well be faulty on this (again, as 
it has been so often as my wife reminds me).  If they use “7sus” or “7sus4” I 
will go with that.

Tim


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Re: sus7 chords in \chordmode

[Tim McNamara]

> On Jan 25, 2015, at 7:44 PM, Thomas Morley  wrote:
> 
> 2015-01-26 2:18 GMT+01:00 Tim McNamara :
>> I have repeatedly run into difficulties getting Lilypond to properly render 
>> sus7 chord names in \chordmode.  It comes up with silly things like "G7sus4 
>> 3” and the like.  What is the correct syntax to get a simple “Gsus7” to 
>> print?  I’ve tried every combination I can think of.
>> 
>> (By the way, I am also using the pop-chords exception list as I don’t like 
>> the Ignatzek standard that is the default in Lilypond).
> 
> Because different people understand different things under the same
> chord-symbol, please give us a minimal example. Also I'm not aware of
> the 'pop-chords exception list’.

pop-chords.ly is available in the snippet repository to provide more readable 
chord names than are provided by the default Ignatzek chord names.  I’ve never 
understood how those got to be the default because they are not very 
attractive.  I can make no pretense of understanding the Scheme code used in 
pop-chords.ly as my knowledge of coding is virtually nil; the definitions of 
the chords themselves within that file are pretty straightforward. 

> Which notes does a Gsus7 contain, the following ones?
> 
> \notemode {  }

Yes, G C D F   The 3rd is replaced with the 4th and the flat 7th is added.  
That is the standard definition of a sus7 chord (there are sus2 chords as well, 
but those are usually specified as sus2 whereas sus chords are understood to 
replace the 3rd with the 4th).

g1:4.7 and g1.7.4 both give a result of "G7 sus4 3” which is suboptimal.

g1:sus results in “G5” which makes no sense.

g1:4 results in "G4 sus4 3” which again is suboptimal.

With a bit more experimenting, I find that g1:7sus4 results in “G7sus4” which 
is a big improvement but I’d like to trim that down to “sus7” if possible.

I am puzzled by this- I cannot imagine that I am the first person attempting to 
get Lilypond to print a sus7 chord in \chordmode.  There must be a correct 
syntax but I can’t figure it out.  There is a reason I am not a coder!  :-P

Thanks!



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sus7 chords in \chordmode

[Tim McNamara]

I have repeatedly run into difficulties getting Lilypond to properly render 
sus7 chord names in \chordmode.  It comes up with silly things like "G7sus4 3” 
and the like.  What is the correct syntax to get a simple “Gsus7” to print?  
I’ve tried every combination I can think of.  

(By the way, I am also using the pop-chords exception list as I don’t like the 
Ignatzek standard that is the default in Lilypond).
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Re: Frecobaldi 2 Mac OS X install guide

[Tim McNamara]

Why not install the Frescobaldi.app bundle instead, which is installed like any 
Mac app?


> On Nov 18, 2014, at 5:18 AM, signorpantofola  
> wrote:
> 
> Hi Philippe, thanks for your post. Hopefully I can finally install
> frescobaldi on my computer (10.10.1).
> Unfortunately, i am getting stuck after I download this link :
> https://python-poppler-qt4.googlecode.com/files/python-poppler-qt4-0.16.3.tar.gz
> 
> I double-click to unzip, get the folder... then I don't understand this
> instruction : "In the Terminal you have to go to the folder where it was
> unzipped (for instance cd Downloads/python-poppler-qt4-0.16.3 )" 
> Is there actually something to do before I run the next two commands : 
> "python setup.py build" and "sudo python setup.py install"
> At this point, if I try to run these commands, it says "no such file..."
> 
> Sorry if my question seems dumb, I am obviously not very literate with
> computers...
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Silvan. 
> 
> 
> 
> --
> View this message in context: 
> http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/Frecobaldi-2-Mac-OS-X-install-guide-tp145898p168789.html
> Sent from the User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> 
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Re: Install Lilyjazz on Mac.

[Tim McNamara]

On Sep 17, 2014, at 10:12 PM, Éric  wrote:

> Dears, 
> 
> In order to install and use LiliJazz  on my Mac, I try to locate these files, 
> but I cannot find them.
> 
> INSTALLDIR/LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/share/lilypond
> /current/scm
> 
> INSTALLDIR/LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/share/lilypond
> /current/fonts/otf
> 
> INSTALLDIR/LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/share/lilypond
> /current/fonts/svg
> 
> 
> I have the Lilypond version 2.19.14-1.
> My mac is on OX Version 10.9.2
> And Lilypond works find with Frescobaldy.
> 
> Anybody can tell me where to find them?

Replace INSTALLDIR/ with the directory that Lilypond is installed.  If, like 
me, you have it in the Applications folder then it would be 
/Applications/Lilypond.app/etc.

However, the easy way is to go to the Lilypond application and do a 
Control-click on it, then select “Open Package Contents” and from there click 
to the folders you need and drop the fonts into those folders.  Note that you 
will have to repeat this whenever you update or otherwise replace Lilypond.

Hope this helps!
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Re: Lilypond notation for Bm7b5

[Tim McNamara]

b1:min7.5-

> On Jul 25, 2014, at 7:12 AM, Guptila de Silva  wrote:
> 
> Hi, How do I write Bm7b5 in Lilypond notation? I can get the fretboard 
> diagram show up but cannot work out how to get the chord name in this format.
> 
> Many thanks.
> 
> Guptila
> 
> -- 
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> 
> 
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Re: Mac testers needed for Frescobaldi! (again)

[Tim McNamara]

On Jun 17, 2014, at 10:17 AM, Davide Liessi  wrote:

> Dear Frescobaldi&LilyPond&Mac users,
> some months ago I published a DMG disk image containing an
> experimental Frescobaldi.app bundle.
> 
> Some packaging problems were reported ([1]):
> - lack of MIDI support (PortMIDI was not included),
> - impossibility to run convert-ly and musicxml2ly (the wrong Python
> interpreter was used for the scripts bundled in LilyPond.app).
> 
> During the last days I was able to fix these problems (at least on my 
> machine).
> I uploaded a new version of Frescobaldi.app, based on the newly
> released 2.0.16, at
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/whu5qnn5pys81ix/Frescobaldi-2.0.16-devapp-20140616.dmg

I have only run the MIDI so far as all my files are updated via convert-ly and 
I don’t use musicxml for anything so wouldn’t be able to tell if it was 
processed correctly.  Thank you so much for your efforts with this.

Tim



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Re: \bar partially broken for just me or everyone?

[Tim McNamara]

On Jun 1, 2014, at 11:59 AM, Malte Meyn  wrote:

> It’s not a bug, it’s a feature (see documentation; Changes for 2.18 and 
> Notation Reference). \bar ".|:" and \bar ":|." should do what you want.

Huh!  Thanks, it took me a couple minutes to see the logic to that change.
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\bar partially broken for just me or everyone?

[Tim McNamara]

Since updating to 2.18.2 and using JazzLILY I notice that when I compile scores 
with \bar “|:” or \bar “:|” the repeat signs are not printed.  The opening 
repeat is omitted and the closing repeat is omitted and the end barline is also 
missing (if the repeat happens at the end of a line, anyway).  \bar “|.” works, 
however.  

Is this something peculiar to my situation or is this happening for others, too?



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Re: [Frescobaldi] Mac testers needed for Frescobaldi!

[Tim McNamara]

On May 19, 2014, at 8:24 AM, Marnen Laibow-Koser  wrote:

> Hear, hear!  Is the standalone Mac app ready for real use yet?  I thought it 
> wasn’t.

So far so good for me, I use it for all my Lilypond editing these days.  The 
only problem I have run into is that running convert-ly from within Frescobaldi 
doesn’t work, complaining about zlib not being available (despite it being 
present on my Mac and other applications being able to use it).  That may be 
something specific to my Mac and not to Frescobaldi.
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Re: convert-ly question

[Tim McNamara]

On May 17, 2014, at 11:41 AM, Malte Meyn  wrote:

> On 17.05.2014 18:20, Tim McNamara wrote:
>> 
>> On May 16, 2014, at 1:54 PM, David Kastrup  wrote:
>> 
>>> Tim McNamara  writes:
>>> 
>>>> Is there a syntax for running convert-ly on a directory without having
>>>> to cd into the directory and invoking
>>>> 
>>>>   convert-ly -e *.ly
>>>> 
>>>> There doesn’t seem to be a recursive option.  Since I’ve got .ly files
>>>> in 158 different directories it’d be really nice to be able to batch
>>>> update them with something like:
>>>> 
>>>> convert-ly -e -r *.ly
>>>> 
>>>> instead of having to cd in to 158 directories by hand.  Maybe there is
>>>> good reason for convert-ly not having this capability.
>>> 
>>> find -name "*.ly" -exec convert-ly -e {} \;
>>> 
>>> is how one would likely do it under POSIXy systems.
>> 
>> Thanks, although when I run this I get:
>> 
>> find: illegal option -- n
>> usage: find [-H | -L | -P] [-EXdsx] [-f path] path ... [expression]
>>find [-H | -L | -P] [-EXdsx] -f path [path ...] [expression]
>> 
>> 
>> This is on a Mac using bash as the shell.
> 
> Have you already tried the simpler version I posted yesterday? I wrote 
> something like “for Linux” but if you have a bash on a Mac (I didn’t know 
> there was something like that ;)) it should work for you, too.


That one worked where David’s didn’t.  I don’t understand shell scripting 
adequately to understand the difference.  
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Re: convert-ly question

[Tim McNamara]

On May 16, 2014, at 1:54 PM, David Kastrup  wrote:

> Tim McNamara  writes:
> 
>> Is there a syntax for running convert-ly on a directory without having
>> to cd into the directory and invoking
>> 
>>   convert-ly -e *.ly
>> 
>> There doesn’t seem to be a recursive option.  Since I’ve got .ly files
>> in 158 different directories it’d be really nice to be able to batch
>> update them with something like:
>> 
>> convert-ly -e -r *.ly
>> 
>> instead of having to cd in to 158 directories by hand.  Maybe there is
>> good reason for convert-ly not having this capability.
> 
> find -name "*.ly" -exec convert-ly -e {} \;
> 
> is how one would likely do it under POSIXy systems.

Thanks, although when I run this I get:

find: illegal option -- n
usage: find [-H | -L | -P] [-EXdsx] [-f path] path ... [expression]
   find [-H | -L | -P] [-EXdsx] -f path [path ...] [expression]


This is on a Mac using bash as the shell.
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convert-ly question

[Tim McNamara]

Is there a syntax for running convert-ly on a directory without having to cd 
into the directory and invoking

   convert-ly -e *.ly

There doesn’t seem to be a recursive option.  Since I’ve got .ly files in 158 
different directories it’d be really nice to be able to batch update them with 
something like:

 convert-ly -e -r *.ly

instead of having to cd in to 158 directories by hand.  Maybe there is good 
reason for convert-ly not having this capability.
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Re: Any advice for getting emacs working with lilypond on MacOsX?

[Tim McNamara]

On May 14, 2014, at 12:56 PM, David Kastrup  wrote:
> 
> Tim McNamara  writes:
> 
>>> On May 13, 2014, at 12:55 PM, Marnen Laibow-Koser  wrote:
>>> 
>>>> On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 1:25 PM, Davide Liessi  
>>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> @Marnen: can you confirm that `brew install frescobaldi` asks the user
>>> to manually install XQuartz and MacTeX? Maybe we should clarify this
>>> in [2].
>>> 
>>> I don't think it asks for XQuartz.  Rather, installing Lilypond
>>> displays the following message:
>>> 
>>> lilypond: A LaTeX distribution is required to install.
>> 
>> Out of curiosity, why is a LaTeX distribution required?  Lilypond
>> doesn’t use LaTeX.
> 
> lilypond-book can produce LaTeX input which is at least required for
> compiling LilyPond's documentation.

Ah.  Thanks.
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Re: Any advice for getting emacs working with lilypond on MacOsX?

[Tim McNamara]

On May 13, 2014, at 12:55 PM, Marnen Laibow-Koser  wrote:

> On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 1:25 PM, Davide Liessi  
> wrote:

> @Marnen: can you confirm that `brew install frescobaldi` asks the user
> to manually install XQuartz and MacTeX? Maybe we should clarify this
> in [2].
> 
> I don't think it asks for XQuartz.  Rather, installing Lilypond displays the 
> following message:
> 
> lilypond: A LaTeX distribution is required to install.

Out of curiosity, why is a LaTeX distribution required?  Lilypond doesn’t use 
LaTeX.
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Re: Frescobaldi/Mac question

[Tim McNamara]

Also interesting is that I can run convert-ly from Terminal using the command 
line and successfully update .ly files to 2.18.0.  The issue lies within 
Frescobaldi rather than Lilypond, as far as I can tell.



On May 13, 2014, at 8:52 AM, MarcM  wrote:

> you may want to try this Frescobaldi version bundled as a Mac app: 
> http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/Mac-testers-needed-for-Frescobaldi-td161735.html

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Re: Frescobaldi/Mac question

[Tim McNamara]

An interesting thing is that I already am using David’s .app bundle- from which 
my error message was generated- but it is trying to use the Python installed 
via MacPorts instead of the Python that’s part of the default Mac OS 
installation.


On May 13, 2014, at 8:52 AM, MarcM  wrote:

> you may want to try this Frescobaldi version bundled as a Mac app: 
> http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/Mac-testers-needed-for-Frescobaldi-td161735.html
> 
> 
> 
> --
> View this message in context: 
> http://lilypond.1069038.n5.nabble.com/Frescobaldi-Mac-question-tp162363p162378.html
> Sent from the User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> 
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Frescobaldi/Mac question

[Tim McNamara]

Running convert-ly results in:

 Traceback (most recent call last):
  File 
"/opt/local/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.7/lib/python2.7/site-packages/py2app/apptemplate/lib/site.py",
 line 22, in 
import os
zipimport.ZipImportError: can't decompress data; zlib not available



“locate zlib” finds multiple instances including slib.h, zlib.so, zlib.py, 
zlib.pyc, zlib.pyo, zlib.tcl, etc..  I’ve got zlib coming out of my ears.  
What’s being looked for that I don’t have?
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Re: Any advice for getting emacs working with lilypond on MacOsX?

[Tim McNamara]

Oh, dear.  Very sorry for what seemed no doubt like an entire school of red 
herring.  

There is an incantation to use for installing Frescobaldi via MacPorts (sudo 
port install lilypond) but not AFAIK Homebrew.  

Much, much easier is David L’s .dmg Frescobaldi package that has already been 
identified with URL.  Had my answer been more complete (i.e., had I thought to 
include the flamin’ URL for the Frescobaldi package) things would have been 
much, much simpler for you.  

IMHO Frescobaldi works better than Emacs and lilypond-mode, but some folks have 
Emacs keybindings coded into their fingers and prefer to stay with that.

In this case the incomplete answer was much worse than no answer at all.  I 
apologize, rif!





On May 10, 2014, at 8:01 AM, rif  wrote:

> FWIW, I spent multiple hours in install hell trying to get a homebrew install 
> of frescobaldi to work, with zero success.  AFAICT homebrew doesn't really 
> have forums or mailing lists?  I might stick with emacs for now.
> 
> rif
> 
> 
> 
> On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 8:32 PM, rif  wrote:
> And just to be clear, when you see Frescobaldi is easy to install, it looks 
> to me like I have to first install Homebrew, then I have to manually install 
> XQuartz and and MacTeX [neither of which is packaged with Homebrew], and 
> *then* I can just do a "brew install frescobaldi"?
> 
> 
> On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 8:15 PM, rif  wrote:
> Cool.  Maybe it makes sense to update the documentation to indicate the elisp 
> files are in the precompiled tarball and just to point at them?  That "make 
> install" is a red herring.
> 
> 
> On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 12:15 PM, R. Mattes  wrote:
> On Fri, 9 May 2014 13:44:31 -0500, Tim McNamara wrote
> > [...snip...]
> > (setq path
> >
> "/bin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/usr/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/Users/tim/bin:/Users/YOUR_USER_NAME/Applications/LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/bin")
> > (setenv "PATH" path)
> >
> > (setq load-path (append (list
> (expand-file-name"/Applications/LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/share/emacs/site-lisp"))
> load-path))
> 
> Much easier to do:
> (add-to-list 'load-path
> (expand-file-name"/Applications/LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/share/emacs/site-lisp"))
> 
> 
> Cheers, Ralf Mattes
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 


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Re: Canonical[ish] place to get pop-chords.ly or jazz-chords.ly? Also, chords advice?

[Tim McNamara]

> On May 10, 2014, at 9:11 AM, rif  wrote:
> 
> Apparently I can get just say f:7.9- to get an F7b9.  Hooray!  Still 
> wondering if there's a canonical place for pop-chords.
> 
> 
>> On Sat, May 10, 2014 at 7:06 AM, rif  wrote:
>> I see many references to this on the mailing list, but are these files 
>> anywhere standard?  I grabbed an old jazz-chords.ly from some mailing list 
>> message, but then it didn't work when I included it, and it had no version 
>> number so I couldn't figure out how to convert it.
>> 
>> What I actually want to do: single line melodies with chord symbols.  I'm 
>> using the "Simple lead sheet" from 
>> http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.16/Documentation/snippets/chords as an example, 
>> but I cannot for the life of me figure out how to do things like get an F7b9 
>> symbol in there.  Most of the "chords" examples I find lying around seem to 
>> be built around the idea that you want to show a bunch of pitches of a chord 
>> and then get the name automatically?  What am I missing?

The Lilypond Snippet Repository (a.k.a LSR) is a very helpful place to look for 
this sort of thing.  I don't have the URL handy on my iPad but the name ought 
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Re: Any advice for getting emacs working with lilypond on MacOsX?

[Tim McNamara]

On May 9, 2014, at 12:43 PM, rif  wrote:

> The documentation seems spotty and inadequate compared to when I tried this a 
> few years ago.  I feel hopelessly lost.
> 
> I found 
> http://www.lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/usage/text-editor-support. 
> This tells me I need to do a "make install".  This implies I need the source 
> to do anything at all with emacs mode? I found a source bundle here, along 
> with the warning "We do not recommend that you attempt to build LilyPond 
> yourself; almost all user needs are better met with the pre-built version." 
> Unclear whether using emacs is included in "almost all user needs" or not.
> 
> [Side issue: the parallel structure of the documentation on the website is 
> *very* confusing.  In particular, I spent quite a few minutes puzzled about 
> why the "Source" link in the Download tab at the top of 
> http://www.lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/web/download led to 
> http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.19/Documentation/web/source/Documentation/web/index.html
>  rather than back to the source bundle.  Is this intentional?]
> 
> OK, so I download the source bundle, and now I'm left with no more 
> instructions than "make install".  But in what directory?  I tried it in the 
> elisp directory and the lilypond directory above it, but in both cases I got 
> errors.
> 
> I also tried skipping the install step and just directly pointing at the 
> directories.  This seems to give me at least a partial solution, although 
> it's warning me that lilypond-words doesn't exist.  Probably because it needs 
> to compile that somehow?
> 
> Am I missing something basic/obvious/simple?  Any advice is welcome.  I'd 
> love to get emacs and lilypond working.  I'm happy to contribute a doc fix to 
> make this easier for others later.

I used lilypond-mode in Emacs once upon a time but use other tools now.  Just 
use the standard Lilypond pre-compiled bundle and put it in your /Applications 
folder.  You do not need to roll your own and it’s probably best if you don’t 
for the reasons you mention.  IIRC there is a site-lisp directory inside the 
Lilypond.app bundle which contains lilypond-mode and/or lilypond-mode comes 
with Emacs by default.  I don’t think this is maintained or updated but I could 
well be wrong on that, so it may have been left behind by developments in 
Lilypond.  Frescobaldi is now so easy to install that I wouldn’t recommend 
bothering with lilypond-mode in Emacs unless you really like Emacs (I like 
Emacs but find it’s like using a sledgehammer to crack walnuts most of the 
time- gets the job done but there are better tools).

Add some things to your .emacs file:


;;_
;;lilypond-mode
;;_

(autoload 'LilyPond-mode "lilypond-mode" "LilyPond Editing Mode" t)
(add-to-list 'auto-mode-alist '("\\.ly$" . LilyPond-mode))
(add-to-list 'auto-mode-alist '("\\.ily$" . LilyPond-mode))
(add-hook 'LilyPond-mode-hook (lambda () (turn-on-font-lock)))


and tell Emacs where the stuff it needs in Lilypond is to be found (this is Mac 
specific to deal with the app bundle; other *nixen would have Lilypond stuff 
elsewhere. Note there is a place you need to edit to put in your user name):

(setq path 
"/bin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/usr/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/Users/tim/bin:/Users/YOUR_USER_NAME/Applications/LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/bin")
(setenv "PATH" path)

(setq load-path (append (list 
(expand-file-name"/Applications/LilyPond.app/Contents/Resources/share/emacs/site-lisp"))
 load-path))



I think that’s it.  Hope this helps!
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Re: Diatonic transposition within a key

[Tim McNamara]

On Apr 28, 2014, at 7:26 PM, David Kastrup  wrote:

> Tim McNamara  writes:
> 
>> Can I put \modalTranspose inside the existing \transpose?  Or should
>> it go outside?  Or will the two hopelessly disagree?  My head hurts
>> trying to figure this sort of thing out...
> 
> When in doubt, try it out.
> 
> It would seem most likely to me that you can use \modalTranspose inside
> of the \transpose to transpose according to the scale with which the
> music has been entered, and outside of \transpose to transpose according
> to the scale with which the music will get printed.

OK, I think I get part of that.  I’m confused about how to implement the 

diatonicScale = \relative c' { c d e f g a b }
motif = \relative c' { c8 d e f g a b c }

parts of the command.  Does one put in the scale of the parent key into the 
diatonicScale (e.g., \relative c’ { g a b c d e fis } for the key of G)?  And 
would this go inside or outside \transpose with the \modalTranspose command?

So far no matter where I put this in the score, compilation fails.


Tim


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Re: Diatonic transposition within a key

[Tim McNamara]

On Apr 28, 2014, at 6:38 PM, David Kastrup  wrote:

> Tim McNamara  writes:
> 
>> I’ve been hunting around (without success) for a method to transpose a
>> melody up or down an interval diatonically.  It’s easy to transpose
>> into a new key to deal with transposing instruments, but I want to
>> shift a melody up a third within the original key to create a harmony
>> line.  Does Lilypond have that capability to save me having to do it
>> manually?
> 
> http://www.lilypond.org/doc/v2.18/Documentation/notation/changing-multiple-pitches.html#modal-transformations>

Thank you!  Unfortunately I can’t figure out how to make it work based on 
what’s in the docs (musician here rather than having any competence at all in 
writing code).

Perhaps the scenario will help along with a snippet.  The chart I am trying to 
generate is a trumpet chart.  It is already transposed from the concert key 
using \transpose to account for the Bb transposition of the horn.  Now I want 
to lift the melody up a third to place the trumpet in a harmony line with a 
tenor sax playing the original melody.  Does that make sense so far?

Can I put \modalTranspose inside the existing \transpose?  Or should it go 
outside?  Or will the two hopelessly disagree?  My head hurts trying to figure 
this sort of thing out...


Here’s a snippet of the modified melody, hopefully this will be sufficient (the 
way the file is laid out, there is a \paper block, a block for chords, a block 
for melody and then they are put together in a \score block at the end of the 
document).




 melody = \transpose c d \relative c' {
\numericTimeSignature
\time 4/4
\clef treble
\key g \major

\partial 4*2 \times 2/3 { r4 e4 fis4}

% 1
\bar "|:"
g1~
g4. b8 a8 g8 r8 a16 g16 
fis1~
fis2 \times 2/3 { r4 e4 g4 }
}
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Diatonic transposition within a key

[Tim McNamara]

I’ve been hunting around (without success) for a method to transpose a melody 
up or down an interval diatonically.  It’s easy to transpose into a new key to 
deal with transposing instruments, but I want to shift a melody up a third 
within the original key to create a harmony line.  Does Lilypond have that 
capability to save me having to do it manually?

Thanks!
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Re: Mac testers needed for Frescobaldi!

[Tim McNamara]

On Apr 23, 2014, at 2:05 AM, Thomas Scharkowski  
wrote:

> 
> 
>  Original-Nachricht 
> 
>> The application bundle works fine for me on 10.9.2 running it from the disk 
>> image.
>> 
>> I notice the same behavior with this bundle and my regular installation: 
>> After the splash screen the application moves to the background. I have to 
>> click on the Frescobaldi icon in the dock to bring it to the front. Using 
>> [command]+[tab] to cycle through active applications doesn’t bring it to the 
>> front unless I’ve already clicked on the icon in the dock.
>> 
>> Thanks for your work on this, Davide!
>> Holland
>> 
> 
> Exactly the same here.
> Thanks to Davide and Wilbert!

And also for me, which has been the same for the version installed with 
MacPorts as well.  The .app bundle is much more convenient, thank you David for 
your work on this!
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Re: more leadsheet questions

[Tim McNamara]

On Mar 20, 2014, at 5:31 PM, Martin Tarenskeen  wrote:

> 
> Hi,
> 
> Trying to (re-)typeset some "Real Book" leadsheets is a good learning 
> experience for me :-)
> 
> I have another question now:
> 
> How can I make something like:
> 
>   \chords { c1:m | c:m | c:m | cm }
> 
> look like:
> 
>   Cm  %   %   %
> 
> where the % is not really a percentage sign, but people familiar with 
> leadsheets will know what I mean.

Look up "\repeat percent" in the manual.  Hopefully that will help.
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Re: frescobaldi macports broken after update

[Tim McNamara]

On Feb 15, 2014, at 3:14 AM, Davide Liessi  wrote:

> 2014-02-15 5:52 GMT+01:00 Tim McNamara :
>> That produces a new full-screen window with the music in it, floating over 
>> the window with the .ly file in it.
> 
> If you drag the Music View window over the main window's right edge,
> you should be able to dock the Music View in the right half of the
> main window.

Yay, thank you!


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Re: frescobaldi macports broken after update

[Tim McNamara]

On Feb 14, 2014, at 5:36 PM, Davide Liessi  wrote:

> Dear Tim,
> 
> 2014-02-14 23:35 GMT+01:00 Tim McNamara :
>> Unfortunately now I no longer have the side-by-side view of the .ly file and 
>> the .pdf file.  I can’t for the life of me figure out how that happened or 
>> how to get it back.
> 
> Maybe you just need to enable "Music View" in the "Tools" menu.
> However I don't know why it could have been deactivated.

That produces a new full-screen window with the music in it, floating over the 
window with the .ly file in it.
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Re: frescobaldi macports broken after update

[Tim McNamara]

Updating proceeded normally and double-clicking a .ly file in the Finder 
launches Frescobaldi and loads the file, so that bug seems squashed.  
Unfortunately now I no longer have the side-by-side view of the .ly file and 
the .pdf file.  I can’t for the life of me figure out how that happened or how 
to get it back.



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Re: frescobaldi macports broken after update

[Tim McNamara]

On Jan 25, 2014, at 12:54 AM, Philippe Massart  wrote:

> Davide Liessi-2 wrote
>>> Frescobaldi/MacPorts users: can you please report how does Frescobaldi
>>> behave on your system?
>>> Here is what should happen (and happens on my 10.6 machine and on a
>>> 10.8 machine I can access sometimes):
>>> if you either
>>> - drag and drop a ly file (or any text file, for what is worth) over
>>> the icon of Frescobaldi in the Dock, or
>>> - right-click on a ly file and choose "Open with..." > "Frescobaldi
>>> ([version])", or
>>> - double-click on a ly file associated with Frescobaldi, then Frescobaldi
>>> should start, if it is not already running, and open the file.
>> 
> 
> With all the latest updates, all file opening situations work only is 
> Frrescobaldi is already launched. If double-clicked, right-click etc. on the 
> file with Frescobaldi not yet running, it opens Frescobaldi but not the file.

I see the same on my install (Mavericks 10.9.1 with updated Frescobaldi install 
in the past 48 hours).  Double-clicking a .ly file launches Frescobaldi but 
does not open the file-  I get a blank, untitled document.  If Frescobaldi is 
already open, double clicking a .ly file in the Finder opens the new document 
in Frescobaldi.

Also, there is a non-Mac-like behavior.  Clicking the close button on the upper 
left hand corner of the document window quits the app.  I realize that on 
some/most OSes this is normal behavior, but not Macs.  FWIW.
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Re: What should be the default B7 chord?

[Tim McNamara]

On Jan 11, 2014, at 1:06 PM, Carl Sorensen  wrote:

> There has been a difference of opinion on why the default B7 guitar chord
> shape should be.  I'm making a poll to determine what the users would
> prefer.
> 
> Would you like the first chord in the attachment (barred on fret 2) or the
> second chord (open chord in first position)?

I prefer the second form that you demonstrated, simply because the first form 
doesn’t sound very good (at least to a jazz guitarist).  
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Re: Start creating with Finale 2014 today

[Tim McNamara]

On Jan 7, 2014, at 10:00 AM, Francois Planiol  wrote:

> Own the future engraving music... who will believe this crap?
> :-o

Lots of people.  It’s not a conscious belief, more of an unconscious one.  
That’s the goal of marketing.  It’s too bad that Finale output tends to look so 
crappy.

Maybe Lilypond’s slogan ought to be:  “Music engraving that actually looks 
good."
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Re: Frescobaldi 2.0.13

[Tim McNamara]

The MacPorts installation includes Cairo +quartz +x11, the +quartz of which is 
incompatible with Pango.  Apparently the +quartz backend for Cairo is broken.  
Pango is a dependency for xpn, which I would like to install, but Pango refuses 
to install with Cairo +quartz.  Is the +quartz necessary for Fresobaldi?  Or 
can I clean the Cairo port and install it with just+x11?
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Re: Alternative notation for guitar 7th chords

[Tim McNamara]

The easiest thing is using the pop-chords.ly alternatives to the default 
chordname style, using \include.  I think it is available in the snippet 
repository.  Or you can write your own chordname exceptions, the procedure for 
which should be in the Notation reference.



> On Dec 21, 2013, at 8:46 PM, Marten Visser  wrote:
> 
> Hi Lilyponders,
> 
> Typesetting my masterpiece is drawing to completion, and one fine point of 
> typesetting remains.
> 
> \chordmode { c1:7 } typesets the 7 as a superscript. I'd like to know how 
> the 7 can be typeset on the baseline, like the m of a minor chord. I 
> couldn't find any tweak that does that for me.
> 
> Regards,
> Marten
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: A thought on Windows Experience

[Tim McNamara]

On Dec 4, 2013, at 6:18 PM, Phil Burfitt  wrote:

> From: "Janek Warchol" 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2013 11:55 PM
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> a couple of thoughts:
>> 
>> 2013/12/4 Francisco Vila :
>>> I find this path tortuous. People double-click
>>> the lilypond icon, and don't see this shell as many of them could
>>> expect. Instead, ugly things happen. Therefore, lilypond is ugly. I
>>> think this summarizes the start and the end of a newcomer's
>>> experience.
>> 
>> AMEN.
>> Francisco nailed it on the head.
>> Such things may seem small, but they make all the difference, and the
>> biggest companies (like Apple) know about this.  First impression,
>> elegance, simplicity, intuitiveness, etc. are very important.

Apple's applications are written by a legion of well paid professionals who do 
nothing but live up to the Apple aesthetic.  Lilypond is written by a bunch of 
volunteers in their spare times, none of whom (as far as I know) is an GUI 
interface expert.

Powerful software and simple software are usually mutually exclusive.  Compare 
Word, Pages and LaTeX, for example.  Pages is more elegant but can do a small 
fraction of what Word can do.  Word can't do a lot of things that LaTeX can.


> AMEN+1
> 
> I also think lilypond's website is terrible. It looks like something out of 
> the eighties knocked up on a dos machine. By comparison, take a look at the 
> home pages of musescore, finale and sibelius.

All things considered, I'd rather focus Lilypond's meager resources to software 
that creates beautifully engraved sheet music.  The printed output of Lilypond 
is vastly superior (and more readable by musicians) than MuseScore, Finale or 
Sibelius.  I'm always amazed at how crappy Finale output looks, in particular.

If you think that Lilypond's web page needs a facelift, then volunteer to roll 
up your sleeves and help change it by writing text blocks, creating better 
HTML, creating better graphics, etc.  There is no well-funded corporation 
behind Lilypond, just a bunch of dedicated and amazingly talented volunteer 
programmers.


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Re: [ANNOUNCE] New Portfile for Frescobaldi on Mac

[Tim McNamara]

On Oct 30, 2013, at 4:54 AM, Jean-Alexis Montignies  
wrote:

> Warning!
> 
> Don’t try to do update on Mavericks (MacOS 10.9) as QT is currently not 
> compiling.
> If installed before upgrading to 10.9, Frescobaldi continues to work.

Thanks for the heads-up.  

It may be necessary to install the new version of the developer software and 
the associated command line tools in order for MacPorts to update correctly.  
It may also be that the new OS broke something that has to be fixed.  

I hadn't updated to Mavericks yet and may put that off for a while due to this 
and another issue- I will also lose my favorite NNTP client as it requires Open 
Transport (a legacy item that's almost 20 years old, finally expunged after 
hanging around from System 7.5.2 through OS X 10.8.5).  Sad to see 
MT-NewsWatcher go.

OTOH, for the first time in many installation attempts, Frescobaldi does 
finally work on my Mac under 10.8.5 thanks to the latest portfile.  I was 
highly surprised when it worked!  Nice job, David L.

I do still find myself using Marc's LilyEditor as it's quicker to launch (I 
apparently can't assign .ly and .ily files to go to Frescobaldi when double 
clicked, for some reason unknown to me, so when I have to do something quick 
LilyEditor gets the file).
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Re: Problems with LilyJAZZ.ily

[Tim McNamara]

On Oct 9, 2013, at 6:40 PM, Thomas Morley  wrote:

> 2013/10/9 Jim Long :
>> On Wed, Oct 09, 2013 at 12:53:35AM +0200, Thomas Morley wrote:
>>> 2013/10/9 Jim Long :
>>> 
  \override ChordName #'font-name = #"lilyjazzchord"
>>> 
>>> Hi Jim,
>>> 
>>> never heard of "lilyjazzchord".
>>> Where to get?
>>> 
>>> Compiling your snippet returns LilyPond-default for the ChordNames.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>>  Harm
>> 
>> It's available from the French-language page at:
>> 
>> https://sites.google.com/site/jpgzic/home/la-police
>> 
>> 
>> Jim
> 
> Hi,
> 
> this is another font and simply installing the font doesn't changes
> accidentals in chords with alterations.
> 
> So I made some effort and fully coded chords with Torstens font.
> -> ignatzek-jazz-chords.ily

Thanks for having a bash at that.  As a matter of taste, I think I prefer not 
having the font's sharps and flats used in the chord names because they look 
disproportionately large compared to the text, whereas the default accidentals 
look fine to my eyes.  Also, the lack of a lower case "m" in the font has 
confused my horn players so I use "-" instead of "m" in minor chords.



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Re: Help with Chordname

[Tim McNamara]

> On Sep 27, 2013, at 7:23 PM, Steve Noland  wrote:
> 
> I am trying to typeset a score for jazz orchestra.  I am having problems with 
> some of the jazz chordnames engraving correctly.  Specifically, a Dm7(b5) 
> chord (D minor 7, flat 5) engraves as a Dº, or D diminished.  What can be the 
> problem?

In the example you provide, the chord is properly rendered as a half-diminished 
chord, not a diminished chord- note the slash through the superscripted O which 
indicates half-diminished.

That is the Ignaztek (sp?) symbol for the chord which is the Lilypond default 
and is commonly used in hand-written lead sheets especially among jazz 
musicians, although it seems like this has fallen out of favor.  If you want 
the chords spelled out rather than using symbols (major 7 instead of delta, 
min7b5 instead of slashed O, dim7 instead of O7, etc.) the  you will need to 
include a chordname exception file for this.  There are several already written 
and available, probably on the snippet site.  I use pop-chords.ly for my jazz 
lead sheets.
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Re: [ANNOUNCE] New Portfile for Frescobaldi on Mac

[Tim McNamara]

On Sep 11, 2013, at 7:50 AM, Jacques Menu  wrote:

> Building python-poppler-qt4-0.16.3 fails on Mac OS X 10.8.4, though, you'll 
> find the trace below.

The choice of Poppler is highly problematic on the Mac for some reason.  I 
wonder if it is possible to rejigger this to use Preview as the engine for 
displaying PDFs.  I would have no idea how to do that...
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Re: mea máxima culpa

[Tim McNamara]

On Sep 10, 2013, at 11:14 PM, David Kastrup  wrote:

> Patrick or Cynthia Karl  writes:
> 
>>> From: Thomas Morley 
>>> To: Patrick or Cynthia Karl 
>> 
>>> [deleting billions of lines]
>> 
>>> From: James Harkins < jamshar...@gmail.com>
>>> Patrick or Cynthia Karl  mac.com> writes:
>> 
>>> Well, I don't have an answer to the question, but... a reminder... it is 
>>> VERY 
>>> uncool to quote an *entire digest* when you're replying to only one message.
>> 
>> I am so sorry and will try to do much better.
> 
> Maybe the reply-to header of the digest should not even point to the
> list?  Replying to a digest makes no sense with regard to message
> threading 

It would be logically consistent since the reply-to header is not set to the 
list for non-digest subscribers, but what would be the alternative?  
no-reply-lilyp...@gnu.org?
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Re: [ANNOUNCE] Scale Matcher website built with LilyPond

[Tim McNamara]

I think posting announcements to some of the rec.music.makers.* Usenet groups 
would make sense, as well as other fora for musicians (especially jazz 
musicians since they are likely to be interested in the chord-scale 
relationship more than a lot of other musical styles).  I'll scatter a few over 
the next couple of days.

Tim


On Aug 24, 2013, at 7:16 AM, Ralph Palmer  wrote:

> Wow! Great work, Adam.
> 
> Is this worth some other publicity, Listers?
> 
> Ralph
> 
> 
> On Sat, Aug 24, 2013 at 7:51 AM, Adam Spiers  
> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> Thought you might be interested to hear that I built a new music
>> harmony website which uses LilyPond to dynamically generate images of
>> chords and scales:
>> 
>> http://scalematcher.adamspiers.org/
>> 
>> Look in the FAQ for details of how to see the LilyPond source code ;-)
>> 
>> Now I have to figure out how to install LilyPond 2.17.x on Debian 6 in
>> order to be able to use \markLengthOn :-/
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Adam
>> 
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> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Ralph Palmer
> Brattleboro, VT
> USA
> palmer.r.vio...@gmail.com
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Re: explicit 7 on a half diminished 7

[Tim McNamara]

On Aug 21, 2013, at 5:40 PM, Derek Klinge  wrote:

> For the life of me I cannot figure this out.
> I would like the following example to explicitly include the 7. Is there a 
> way to change the way it handles half diminished 7ths?
> 
> EXAMPLE
> \chords {
>   c4:7.9- c:7.9-/g
>   \set slashChordSeparator = \markup { " over " }
>   \break
>   c4:7.9- c:7.9-/g
> }



I am confused as well.  I don't understand his code in terms of his question 
because c4:7.9- is not a half-diminished chord, it is an altered chord that 
should print as C7b9.  

The default rendering of a C half-diminished chord of c4:min7.5- in LilyPond, 
at least prior to 2.17, would be Cø and my guess is that he wants it printed as 
Cmin7b5 or C-7b5.  To achieve that the OP needs to write a chordname exception.
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Re: frescobaldi on mac

[Tim McNamara]

On Aug 16, 2013, at 3:40 AM, Davide Liessi  wrote:

> 2013/8/16 Christian Andersson :
>> This issue with running Frescobaldi on MacOS X must be one of the most
>> long-running among threads of this list. Why can't some of you Mac users
>> please take your responsibility for the community, and see to that a working
>> distribution gets created, from which everybody (with Macs) can benefit,
>> with all the tweaks and dependencies, and then donate this for download from
>> the official Frescobaldi-site. I'd love to be able to recommend a number of
>> friends of mine, sadly (for them) with Apple boxes, to take a look at
>> Frescobaldi, but given the state of affairs here this is simply not possible
>> at the moment. Of course it is easier to do this in, e.g., a Linux platform,
>> but I just can't imagine that it would be that impossible for Macs as is
>> suggested by all these howtos, neither of which seems to work for everybody.
> 
> Yesterday I submitted to MacPorts new Portfiles for frescobaldi and
> python-poppler-qt4.
> There's a couple of small changes that are needed, but I hope they
> will be approved soon.
> After they are in MacPorts' repository, frescobaldi should be easier to 
> install.
> It will essentially be a matter of two/three MacPorts commands (plus
> maybe install Qsynth as a fluidsynth GUI and a soundfont for MIDI
> support): no more manually compiling the software.
> (I know, Mac users are more used to single packages you can download
> and copy in /Application/ folder. MacPorts is not that simple, but I
> would still say it is easy to use.)
> 
> I will announce on this list when the Portfiles will be approved and
> available...

Very nice, David, and a huge thank you.  While MacPorts takes a few steps to 
use, it borders on trivial when the portfiles are correct.
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Re: frescobaldi on mac

[Tim McNamara]

On Aug 16, 2013, at 3:22 AM, Christian Andersson 
 wrote:

> This issue with running Frescobaldi on MacOS X must be one of the most 
> long-running among threads of this list. Why can't some of you Mac users 
> please take your responsibility for the community, and see to that a working 
> distribution gets created, from which everybody (with Macs) can benefit, with 
> all the tweaks and dependencies, and then donate this for download from the 
> official Frescobaldi-site. I'd love to be able to recommend a number of 
> friends of mine, sadly (for them) with Apple boxes, to take a look at 
> Frescobaldi, but given the state of affairs here this is simply not possible 
> at the moment. Of course it is easier to do this in, e.g., a Linux platform, 
> but I just can't imagine that it would be that impossible for Macs as is 
> suggested by all these howtos, neither of which seems to work for everybody.

One problem is that most Mac users, like myself, don't have those skills.  For 
the most part it is not something we have to know when installing apps.  The 
Mac application design philosophy is much different than Linux when it comes to 
dependencies and the like.  We never have to install dependencies to install a 
Mac app, for example.  If there is something needed by the app that is not 
already part of the operating system, the developer includes it in the app 
package and the app is delivered precompiled.  Drop it somewhere on your hard 
drive, double click it, and it works.  That is what Mac users are used to.  We 
don't troubleshoot installs.  If an app doesn't work, word gets around and we 
use an alternative app.

And, like many people, I just don't have time to learn those things.  I have a 
full time-plus career that has nothing to do with computers, plus a marriage, 
plus aging parents in ill health, plus a band, plus other hobbies and 
interests, a house and yard to take care of, etc.  For better and for worse, 
like most Mac users I am reliant on developers.  My one computer class was in 
1978 and involved punch cards and Fortran IV; all I remember from that is that 
my comprehension of program design sucked and I barely passed the class.

The issue with Frescobaldi is simply that the developer is not a Mac developer, 
he is obviously a very talented and dedicated Linux developer.  And even though 
the Mac OS is based on Unix (mostly OpenBSD using the Mach kernel) and 
technically POSIX compliant, Apple has not made it particularly easy to just 
run Linux apps on the Mac.  Especially when that app is written in Python (the 
majority of Mac apps are written in Objective-C, which is more or less the 
"native" programming language for the Apple Mac SDK).

The sticking point for my attempts to install Frescobaldi is its dependence on 
Poppler to see the PDF output.  There is a bit of software necessary that also 
has to be installed, the Python-Poppler-Qt library; for me this seems to be 
broken by something.

The best hopes are for someone to make an .app package or to use the MacPorts 
repository to set up installation of all the necessary bits and bobs.  I don't 
have the know-how, but I would be happy to toss in some cash for someone who 
does have the skills to make either of those happen.  That's the best I can do.

In the meantime I continue to use Marc's LilyEditor which does what I need and 
is the best current Mac option for editing Lilypond files.
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Re: Steinberg's progress report on new notation software

[Tim McNamara]

On Aug 8, 2013, at 5:06 AM, Jan-Peter Voigt  wrote:

> I'm not that surprised.
> During the last few years I became something nerd-like. After beeing a 
> Mac-User for a long time, I now only use Ubuntu or Debian and all its related 
> tools for my everyday work.
> So for me using lilypond is a quite natural thing and I am getting better and 
> quicker using emacs - well, frescobaldi is still my lilyeditor.
> But most people I talk to say something like: "I want switch on my computer 
> and immediatly work with my everyday tools without needing to touch the 
> keyboard! Beyond the mouse there is a touch-screen ..."
> To see, that one is giving away a lot of control over his own work that way, 
> is not a matter of course.

Difference in end-user philosophy.  

Most computer users do not see themselves giving away that control because they 
didn't need it or want it in the first place.  Linux distributions like Ubuntu, 
Debian, etc., are simply inappropriate tools for probably 98% of computer 
users- which is exactly why the market share of those OSes is what it is.  Most 
users need a hammer and a screwdriver- Linux is a whole machine shop.  For the 
people who need the machine shop, Linux is the thing they want.  Most people 
want to use their computer like they use a refrigerator or a toaster:  just use 
it, no reading of documentation necessary.

I write 40 pages of reports a day for work.  I don't use LaTeX because it's too 
complicated to use; I use LibreOffice because the default operation for text is 
fine.  If I was writing out complex math equations, it'd be a different story.

Similarly LilyPond is probably not the most appropriate tool for most people 
just looking to print out some chord charts for their coffee house open mic 
night.  I don't think that it's presented as the tool for those folks- LilyPond 
is aimed at the people who want that fine-grained control over output (although 
for people like me, writing lead sheets for jazz combos, the default ways of 
doing things works well for almost everything and only a few tweaks are 
necessary.  A few minutes and I've got charts for everyone that are vastly more 
readable than Real Book charts).  I find it faster than MuseScore, which I also 
tried, and the output is vastly better than Finale.

I don't really know who Steinberg's target market is, although it looks like it 
is more towards the LilyPond end of things.
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Re: tablet

[Tim McNamara]

I use my iPad with unRealBook to organize lead sheets produced by LilyPond for 
all my gigs.  With the Retina display it works fine for lead sheets but might 
be too small for orchestral or even piano music.  Rumor has it that Apple is 
planning a 13" iPad, but then rumor has all sorts of things about Apple- most 
of it wrong.

The thing that makes this work is the clean-ness of LilyPond output, even 
better with the simpler "hand written" jazz font that was recently shared.  
Even at the small screen size, the clarity of the scores is excellent.

A band mate gives us things he's done in Finale and I am always surprised by 
how poor the engraving looks.


Tim



On Jul 31, 2013, at 2:52 PM, "Jan Rosseel"  wrote:

> From: Olivier Biot 
> To: Kieren MacMillan 
> Cc: lilypond-user 
> Subject: Re: Anyone using a tablet for lily?
> Message-ID:
>
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
> 
>> I have been browsing the Internet for ePaper solutions, and have only
> reached potential products so far.
> 
>> The Brussels Philharmonic quit using paper less than a year ago.
> 
> Uh no, they didn't. Short demo with big fanfare, tablets went back to
> Samsung after that. Still playing on paper at the moment. 
> There was another demo with the choir section of the orchestra in April,
> but a choir member has his hands free, so no problem in turning pages. 
> 
>> I'm still unsure what device to get for replacing my pile of music
> scores.
> 
> Most tablets are really too small for comfortable playing. If you look
> around, you can find some 13.3"tablets. Makes a boatload of difference
> for playing. 
> 
>> Best regards,
> 
>> Olivier
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Running Lilypond from Fraise

[Tim McNamara]

On Jun 27, 2013, at 6:51 AM, luis jure  wrote:

> 
> on 2013-06-27 at 11:56 Alexander Deubelbeiss wrote:
> 
>>> From: Philippe de Rochambeau 
>>> 
>>> could someone please explain how to run Lilypond from Fraise?
>>> 
>> 
>> In my experience Lilypond does not interact usefully with fruit; so
>> presumably you mean some sort of software product?
> 
> i think he might be referring to a fork of Smultron, a text editor for the 
> mac.


In context that seems correct. Both Smultron and Fraise have a menu where one 
can create commands and associate them with a keybinding. One can set up a 
command to send a file to Lily Pond under this menu.  IIRC this is in the 
Commands menu; my recollection is that you write something like a shell script. 
 It's been a couple years since I used it.

Fraise is an open source version of Smultron; it was created in 2010 when 
Smultron fell out of active development for a while.  Smultron is now a 
commercial app available in the Mac app store, I don't know what license the 
current version is under; Smultron 4 was under the Apache 2.0 license.  One can 
get Fraise from GitHub, although it is not actively being developed since v. 
3.7.2 or so.
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