Re: [LyX/master] print callstack on assert

[Stephan Witt]

Am 29.08.2014 um 08:28 schrieb Peter Kuemmel syntheti...@gmx.net:

 
 It's Friday:
 
 
 There are no traces of LYX_CALLSTACK_PRINTING in automake files.
 
 Not important, automake will be dropped anyway ;)
 
 So, you're working on a cmake way to produce Mac packages? When is it 
 finished? ;)
 
 Isn't the package created by a bash script after building?
 Or is the cmake-build broken on Mac?

Sorry, I've missed your reply.

I'm using the cmake-generator to produce a Xcode project. 
I didn't know what command line parameters I have to pass to cmake
and xcodebuild to build a reasonable LyX package.

This is what I've tried:

$ cmake ... -DLYX_INSTALL_PREFIX=/Users/Shared/LyX/cmake/LyX-2.2 -DLYX_DMG=ON
$ xcodebuild -project lyx-build/cmake/2.2.0dev/LyX.xcodeproj -target install

After this I have a working LyX2.2.app in /Users/Shared/LyX/cmake/LyX-2.2 but
cannot find any disk image.

$ xcodebuild -project lyx-build/cmake/2.2.0dev/LyX.xcodeproj -target package

looks better. I get a LyX22-2.2.0-Darwin.dmg inside install dir. It opens with
a english GNU GPL disclaimer and if I agree with it I'm able to start the LyX 
app.

Not that bad, but not production ready, I'd say. E.g. if I don't agree but do
something else I'm unable to open the disk image again. The GPL query isn't 
shown
anymore and there is no possibility to agree or disagree. The disk image isn't
usable anymore…

Stephan

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:
 Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
 skost...@lyx.org

  IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
  the users should get appropriate error message (and break compilation).

 Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
 think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
 compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.

 In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a regression too.
 I am not ready to adopt this view :)

For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
We received a lot of reports that LyX doesn't compile my document
anymore. Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

Are you opposed to the approach suggested there, which is to give a
warning in the next major release and in the warning state in the
next version this will be an error and your document will not
compile?

Scott

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Kornel Benko]

Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
skost...@lyx.org
 On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:
  Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
  skost...@lyx.org
 
   IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
   the users should get appropriate error message (and break compilation).
 
  Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
  think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
  compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.
 
  In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a regression 
  too.
  I am not ready to adopt this view :)
 
 For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
 the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
 https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
 We received a lot of reports that LyX doesn't compile my document
 anymore. Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
 the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
Quoting Vincent:
Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major release 
we can
 error out on BibTeX errors as we do now.
May I understand version 2.2 as major?

 Are you opposed to the approach suggested there, which is to give a
 warning in the next major release and in the warning state in the
 next version this will be an error and your document will not
 compile?

I vote for error out, if there is error in compiling.

Maybe some document option
Output - Default Output Format:
Output - Synchronize with Output
new Output - Ignore errors if export file created
Output Options - XHTML Output Options


or new
Bibliography - Bibliography generation - Ignore errors

 Scott

Kornel

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Description: This is a digitally signed message part.

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:
 Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
 skost...@lyx.org
 On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:
  Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
  skost...@lyx.org

   IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
   the users should get appropriate error message (and break compilation).
 
  Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
  think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
  compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.
 
  In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a regression 
  too.
  I am not ready to adopt this view :)

 For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
 the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
 https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
 We received a lot of reports that LyX doesn't compile my document
 anymore. Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
 the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

 I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
 Quoting Vincent:
 Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major 
 release we can
  error out on BibTeX errors as we do now.

Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error.
- I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.

 May I understand version 2.2 as major?

Yes.

 Are you opposed to the approach suggested there, which is to give a
 warning in the next major release and in the warning state in the
 next version this will be an error and your document will not
 compile?

 I vote for error out, if there is error in compiling.

I'm fine with this. And from what I understand so is Jürgen. I'm also
now fine with the warning - error approach.

 Maybe some document option
 Output - Default Output Format:
 Output - Synchronize with Output
 new Output - Ignore errors if export file created
 Output Options - XHTML Output Options


This is a good proposal and in fact I was fearing that if we do the
warning - error approach users will request this feature anyway. If
we do decide to do warning - error approach, we should decide now
whether to take a hard stance on no we will not give you the option
to ignore errors in the future or if we will consider it if enough
users request it.

 or new
 Bibliography - Bibliography generation - Ignore errors

I would prefer your first suggestion above. Or a centralized place to
choose which errors to ignore. We could even add \nonstopmode to
ignore LaTeX errors. We could have a do whatever it takes to give me
a PDF mode.

ugh it is very painful to discuss helping users to avoid fixing errors
in their documents. But I guess many users would like it.

Scott

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Richard Heck]

On 09/17/2014 10:30 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:

Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
skost...@lyx.org

On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:

Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
skost...@lyx.org

IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
the users should get appropriate error message (and break compilation).

Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.

In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a regression too.
I am not ready to adopt this view :)

For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
We received a lot of reports that LyX doesn't compile my document
anymore. Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
 Quoting Vincent:
 Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major release 
we can
  error out on BibTeX errors as we do now.

Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error.
- I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.


I think that meant we could do it in a minor version. Like the next one. 
And I think it's a
good idea. Not issuing any kind of error here is wrong. The user thinks 
everything went

well, and it did not.

Richard

Re: Torvalds says he has no strong opinions on systemd

[Richard Heck]

On 09/15/2014 12:39 PM, José Matos wrote:

While the above piece
http://www.itwire.com/business-it-news/open-source/65402-torvalds-says-he-has-no-strong-opinions-on-systemd

I noticed that Linus refers to LyX in the context of the unix way:

And systemd is in no way the piece that breaks with old UNIX legacy. Graphical applications 
seldom worked that way (there are certainly _echoes_ of it in things like LyX, but I 
think it's the exception rather than the rule)...

Funny and interesting to read at the same time. :-)


Nice to see that we are on his radar somehow. And of course he's right. 
This value gets invoked here from time to time. No BibTeX editor as part 
of LyX, e.g.


Richard

Re: Torvalds says he has no strong opinions on systemd

[John Tapsell]

Oh, so that's why it's so difficult to use bibtex.  Hmm, I think then
you've just convinced me that systemd's approach is better :-)

On 17 September 2014 15:42, Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:
 On 09/15/2014 12:39 PM, José Matos wrote:

 While the above piece

 http://www.itwire.com/business-it-news/open-source/65402-torvalds-says-he-has-no-strong-opinions-on-systemd

 I noticed that Linus refers to LyX in the context of the unix way:

 And systemd is in no way the piece that breaks with old UNIX legacy.
 Graphical applications seldom worked that way (there are certainly _echoes_
 of it in things like LyX, but I think it's the exception rather than the
 rule)...

 Funny and interesting to read at the same time. :-)


 Nice to see that we are on his radar somehow. And of course he's right. This
 value gets invoked here from time to time. No BibTeX editor as part of LyX,
 e.g.

 Richard

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:32 AM, Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:
 On 09/17/2014 10:30 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

 On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:

 Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
 skost...@lyx.org

 On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:

 Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
 skost...@lyx.org

 IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
 the users should get appropriate error message (and break
 compilation).

 Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
 think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
 compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.

 In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a
 regression too.
 I am not ready to adopt this view :)

 For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
 the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
 https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
 We received a lot of reports that LyX doesn't compile my document
 anymore. Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
 the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

 I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
  Quoting Vincent:
  Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major
 release we can
   error out on BibTeX errors as we do now.

 Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
 as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
 a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error.
 - I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
 with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.


 I think that meant we could do it in a minor version. Like the next one. And
 I think it's a
 good idea.

I'm fine with this but only because I'm fine with not going through
the warning phase. I think there are very few LyX users that install
consecutive minor versions. Out of the 10 or so people I know running
LyX, the median LyX version is probably 2.0.5. Also, anyone on a Linux
distribution installing from their repos will have a few minor
versions skipped.

 Not issuing any kind of error here is wrong. The user thinks
 everything went
 well, and it did not.

Agreed.

Scott

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Richard Heck]

On 09/17/2014 11:04 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:32 AM, Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:

On 09/17/2014 10:30 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:

Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
skost...@lyx.org

On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:

Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
skost...@lyx.org

IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
the users should get appropriate error message (and break
compilation).

Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.

In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a
regression too.
I am not ready to adopt this view :)

For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
We received a lot of reports that LyX doesn't compile my document
anymore. Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
  Quoting Vincent:
  Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major
release we can
   error out on BibTeX errors as we do now.

Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error.
- I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.


I think that meant we could do it in a minor version. Like the next one. And
I think it's a good idea.

I'm fine with this but only because I'm fine with not going through
the warning phase. I think there are very few LyX users that install
consecutive minor versions. Out of the 10 or so people I know running
LyX, the median LyX version is probably 2.0.5. Also, anyone on a Linux
distribution installing from their repos will have a few minor
versions skipped.


I guess that depends upon the distro: http://oswatershed.org/pkg/lyx.

So I officially suggest that we do the following: For 2.1.3, we add the 
warning;

for 2.2.0, we add the error.

Richard

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Kornel Benko]

Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 13:49:20, schrieb Richard Heck 
rgh...@lyx.org
 On 09/17/2014 11:04 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:
  On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:32 AM, Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:
  On 09/17/2014 10:30 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:
  On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:
  Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
  skost...@lyx.org
  On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:
  Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
  skost...@lyx.org
  IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
  the users should get appropriate error message (and break
  compilation).
  Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
  think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
  compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.
  In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a
  regression too.
  I am not ready to adopt this view :)
  For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
  the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
  https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
  We received a lot of reports that LyX doesn't compile my document
  anymore. Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
  the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.
  I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
Quoting Vincent:
Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major
  release we can
 error out on BibTeX errors as we do now.
  Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
  as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
  a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error.
  - I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
  with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.
 
  I think that meant we could do it in a minor version. Like the next one. 
  And
  I think it's a good idea.
  I'm fine with this but only because I'm fine with not going through
  the warning phase. I think there are very few LyX users that install
  consecutive minor versions. Out of the 10 or so people I know running
  LyX, the median LyX version is probably 2.0.5. Also, anyone on a Linux
  distribution installing from their repos will have a few minor
  versions skipped.
 
 I guess that depends upon the distro: http://oswatershed.org/pkg/lyx.
 
 So I officially suggest that we do the following: For 2.1.3, we add the 
 warning;
 for 2.2.0, we add the error.

+1

 Richard

Kornel

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Description: This is a digitally signed message part.

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 1:49 PM, Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:
 On 09/17/2014 11:04 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

 On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:32 AM, Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:

 On 09/17/2014 10:30 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

 On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:

 Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
 skost...@lyx.org

 On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko kor...@lyx.org wrote:

 Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
 skost...@lyx.org

 IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
 the users should get appropriate error message (and break
 compilation).

 Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
 think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
 compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.

 In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a
 regression too.
 I am not ready to adopt this view :)

 For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
 the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
 https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
 We received a lot of reports that LyX doesn't compile my document
 anymore. Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
 the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

 I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
   Quoting Vincent:
   Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next
 major
 release we can
error out on BibTeX errors as we do now.

 Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
 as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
 a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error.
 - I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
 with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.


 I think that meant we could do it in a minor version. Like the next one.
 And
 I think it's a good idea.

 I'm fine with this but only because I'm fine with not going through
 the warning phase. I think there are very few LyX users that install
 consecutive minor versions. Out of the 10 or so people I know running
 LyX, the median LyX version is probably 2.0.5. Also, anyone on a Linux
 distribution installing from their repos will have a few minor
 versions skipped.


 I guess that depends upon the distro: http://oswatershed.org/pkg/lyx.

That is a great resource. Thank you!

 So I officially suggest that we do the following: For 2.1.3, we add the
 warning;
 for 2.2.0, we add the error.

Sounds good.
Are there any ideas for the message? Without thinking much, I will throw out:

xyz finished with an error. This was not previously reported in LyX
so compilation is allowed to continue, but starting with LyX 2.2.0
this warning message will become an error and compilation will stop so
that the user knows to fix the issue causing the error.

Scott

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Richard Heck]

On 09/17/2014 03:02 PM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:
Are there any ideas for the message? Without thinking much, I will 
throw out: xyz finished with an error. This was not previously 
reported in LyX so compilation is allowed to continue, but starting 
with LyX 2.2.0 this warning message will become an error and 
compilation will stop so that the user knows to fix the issue causing 
the error.


Minor tweaking:

The external program
XYZ [[ probably on its own line, since these commands can be long ]]
finished with an error. Compilation will be [[ has been ?? I guess this 
depends when the warning is issued. ]] allowed to continue, but starting 
with LyX 2.2.0 this warning message will become an error and compilation 
will stop.


I don't think we need to explain in the dialog why that is. Though we 
could add something like: We suggest you find the cause of the error.


A few questions: Can this only happen during compilation? Or could it 
happen during other sorts of export? Should that word be changed? Could 
it, in particular, happen during compilation of instant preview? I don't 
use that, but I can imagine it getting extremely annoying in this case 
to get that message, especially if it were caused by something in the 
preamble that was included in every single case. So, if that is an 
issue, perhaps we should disable the error for preview.


Richard

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 4:14 PM, Richard Heck rgh...@lyx.org wrote:
 On 09/17/2014 03:02 PM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

 Are there any ideas for the message? Without thinking much, I will throw
 out: xyz finished with an error. This was not previously reported in LyX so
 compilation is allowed to continue, but starting with LyX 2.2.0 this warning
 message will become an error and compilation will stop so that the user
 knows to fix the issue causing the error.


 Minor tweaking:

 The external program
 XYZ [[ probably on its own line, since these commands can be long ]]
 finished with an error. Compilation will be [[ has been ?? I guess this
 depends when the warning is issued. ]] allowed to continue, but starting
 with LyX 2.2.0 this warning message will become an error and compilation
 will stop.

 I don't think we need to explain in the dialog why that is. Though we could
 add something like: We suggest you find the cause of the error.

Sounds good.

 A few questions: Can this only happen during compilation? Or could it happen
 during other sorts of export? Should that word be changed? Could it, in
 particular, happen during compilation of instant preview? I don't use that,
 but I can imagine it getting extremely annoying in this case to get that
 message, especially if it were caused by something in the preamble that was
 included in every single case. So, if that is an issue, perhaps we should
 disable the error for preview.

Good point. I will test this.

Scott

Re: [LyX/master] print callstack on assert

[Stephan Witt]

Am 29.08.2014 um 08:28 schrieb Peter Kuemmel :

>> 
>>> It's Friday:
>>> 
 
 There are no traces of LYX_CALLSTACK_PRINTING in automake files.
>>> 
>>> Not important, automake will be dropped anyway ;)
>> 
>> So, you're working on a cmake way to produce Mac packages? When is it 
>> finished? ;)
> 
> Isn't the package created by a bash script after building?
> Or is the cmake-build broken on Mac?

Sorry, I've missed your reply.

I'm using the cmake-generator to produce a Xcode project. 
I didn't know what command line parameters I have to pass to cmake
and xcodebuild to build a reasonable LyX package.

This is what I've tried:

$ cmake ... -DLYX_INSTALL_PREFIX=/Users/Shared/LyX/cmake/LyX-2.2 -DLYX_DMG=ON
$ xcodebuild -project lyx-build/cmake/2.2.0dev/LyX.xcodeproj -target install

After this I have a working LyX2.2.app in /Users/Shared/LyX/cmake/LyX-2.2 but
cannot find any disk image.

$ xcodebuild -project lyx-build/cmake/2.2.0dev/LyX.xcodeproj -target package

looks better. I get a LyX22-2.2.0-Darwin.dmg inside install dir. It opens with
a english GNU GPL disclaimer and if I agree with it I'm able to start the LyX 
app.

Not that bad, but not production ready, I'd say. E.g. if I don't agree but do
something else I'm unable to open the disk image again. The GPL query isn't 
shown
anymore and there is no possibility to agree or disagree. The disk image isn't
usable anymore…

Stephan

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko  wrote:
> Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
> 

>> > IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
>> > the users should get appropriate error message (and break compilation).
>>
>> Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
>> think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
>> compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.
>
> In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a regression too.
> I am not ready to adopt this view :)

For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
We received a lot of reports that "LyX doesn't compile my document
anymore". Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

Are you opposed to the approach suggested there, which is to give a
warning in the next major release and in the warning state "in the
next version this will be an error and your document will not
compile"?

Scott

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Kornel Benko]

Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 

> On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko  wrote:
> > Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
> > 
> 
> >> > IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
> >> > the users should get appropriate error message (and break compilation).
> >>
> >> Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
> >> think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
> >> compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.
> >
> > In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a regression 
> > too.
> > I am not ready to adopt this view :)
> 
> For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
> the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
> https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
> We received a lot of reports that "LyX doesn't compile my document
> anymore". Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
> the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
Quoting Vincent:
"Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major release 
we can
 error out on BibTeX errors as we do now."
May I understand version 2.2 as major?

> Are you opposed to the approach suggested there, which is to give a
> warning in the next major release and in the warning state "in the
> next version this will be an error and your document will not
> compile"?

I vote for error out, if there is error in compiling.

Maybe some document option
Output -> Default Output Format:
Output -> Synchronize with Output
new Output -> Ignore errors if export file created
Output Options -> XHTML Output Options


or new
Bibliography -> Bibliography generation -> Ignore errors

> Scott

Kornel

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Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko  wrote:
> Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
> 
>> On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko  wrote:
>> > Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 
>> > 
>>
>> >> > IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
>> >> > the users should get appropriate error message (and break compilation).
>> >>
>> >> Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
>> >> think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
>> >> compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.
>> >
>> > In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a regression 
>> > too.
>> > I am not ready to adopt this view :)
>>
>> For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
>> the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
>> https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
>> We received a lot of reports that "LyX doesn't compile my document
>> anymore". Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
>> the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.
>
> I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
> Quoting Vincent:
> "Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major 
> release we can
>  error out on BibTeX errors as we do now."

Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
"as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error."
- I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.

> May I understand version 2.2 as major?

Yes.

>> Are you opposed to the approach suggested there, which is to give a
>> warning in the next major release and in the warning state "in the
>> next version this will be an error and your document will not
>> compile"?
>
> I vote for error out, if there is error in compiling.

I'm fine with this. And from what I understand so is Jürgen. I'm also
now fine with the warning -> error approach.

> Maybe some document option
> Output -> Default Output Format:
> Output -> Synchronize with Output
> new Output -> Ignore errors if export file created
> Output Options -> XHTML Output Options
>

This is a good proposal and in fact I was fearing that if we do the
warning -> error approach users will request this feature anyway. If
we do decide to do warning -> error approach, we should decide now
whether to take a hard stance on "no we will not give you the option
to ignore errors in the future" or if we will consider it if enough
users request it.

> or new
> Bibliography -> Bibliography generation -> Ignore errors

I would prefer your first suggestion above. Or a centralized place to
choose which errors to ignore. We could even add \nonstopmode to
ignore LaTeX errors. We could have a "do whatever it takes to give me
a PDF" mode.

ugh it is very painful to discuss helping users to avoid fixing errors
in their documents. But I guess many users would like it.

Scott

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Richard Heck]

On 09/17/2014 10:30 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko  wrote:

Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 


On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko  wrote:

Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak 


IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
the users should get appropriate error message (and break compilation).

Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.

In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a regression too.
I am not ready to adopt this view :)

For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
We received a lot of reports that "LyX doesn't compile my document
anymore". Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
 Quoting Vincent:
 "Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major release 
we can
  error out on BibTeX errors as we do now."

Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
"as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error."
- I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.


I think that meant we could do it in a minor version. Like the next one. 
And I think it's a
good idea. Not issuing any kind of error here is wrong. The user thinks 
everything went

well, and it did not.

Richard

Re: Torvalds says he has no strong opinions on systemd

[Richard Heck]

On 09/15/2014 12:39 PM, José Matos wrote:

While the above piece
http://www.itwire.com/business-it-news/open-source/65402-torvalds-says-he-has-no-strong-opinions-on-systemd

I noticed that Linus refers to LyX in the context of the unix way:

"And systemd is in no way the piece that breaks with old UNIX legacy. Graphical applications 
seldom worked that way (there are certainly _echoes_ of it in things like "LyX", but I 
think it's the exception rather than the rule)..."

Funny and interesting to read at the same time. :-)


Nice to see that we are on his radar somehow. And of course he's right. 
This value gets invoked here from time to time. No BibTeX editor as part 
of LyX, e.g.


Richard

Re: Torvalds says he has no strong opinions on systemd

[John Tapsell]

Oh, so that's why it's so difficult to use bibtex.  Hmm, I think then
you've just convinced me that systemd's approach is better :-)

On 17 September 2014 15:42, Richard Heck  wrote:
> On 09/15/2014 12:39 PM, José Matos wrote:
>>
>> While the above piece
>>
>> http://www.itwire.com/business-it-news/open-source/65402-torvalds-says-he-has-no-strong-opinions-on-systemd
>>
>> I noticed that Linus refers to LyX in the context of the unix way:
>>
>> "And systemd is in no way the piece that breaks with old UNIX legacy.
>> Graphical applications seldom worked that way (there are certainly _echoes_
>> of it in things like "LyX", but I think it's the exception rather than the
>> rule)..."
>>
>> Funny and interesting to read at the same time. :-)
>
>
> Nice to see that we are on his radar somehow. And of course he's right. This
> value gets invoked here from time to time. No BibTeX editor as part of LyX,
> e.g.
>
> Richard
>

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:32 AM, Richard Heck  wrote:
> On 09/17/2014 10:30 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko  wrote:
>>>
>>> Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
>>> 

 On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko  wrote:
>
> Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
> 
>>>
>>> IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
>>> the users should get appropriate error message (and break
>>> compilation).
>>
>> Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
>> think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
>> compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.
>
> In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a
> regression too.
> I am not ready to adopt this view :)

 For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
 the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
 https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
 We received a lot of reports that "LyX doesn't compile my document
 anymore". Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
 the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.
>>>
>>> I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
>>>  Quoting Vincent:
>>>  "Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major
>>> release we can
>>>   error out on BibTeX errors as we do now."
>>
>> Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
>> "as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
>> a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error."
>> - I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
>> with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.
>
>
> I think that meant we could do it in a minor version. Like the next one. And
> I think it's a
> good idea.

I'm fine with this but only because I'm fine with not going through
the warning phase. I think there are very few LyX users that install
consecutive minor versions. Out of the 10 or so people I know running
LyX, the median LyX version is probably 2.0.5. Also, anyone on a Linux
distribution installing from their repos will have a few minor
versions skipped.

> Not issuing any kind of error here is wrong. The user thinks
> everything went
> well, and it did not.

Agreed.

Scott

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Richard Heck]

On 09/17/2014 11:04 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:32 AM, Richard Heck  wrote:

On 09/17/2014 10:30 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko  wrote:

Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak


On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko  wrote:

Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak


IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
the users should get appropriate error message (and break
compilation).

Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.

In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a
regression too.
I am not ready to adopt this view :)

For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
We received a lot of reports that "LyX doesn't compile my document
anymore". Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.

I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
  Quoting Vincent:
  "Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major
release we can
   error out on BibTeX errors as we do now."

Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
"as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error."
- I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.


I think that meant we could do it in a minor version. Like the next one. And
I think it's a good idea.

I'm fine with this but only because I'm fine with not going through
the warning phase. I think there are very few LyX users that install
consecutive minor versions. Out of the 10 or so people I know running
LyX, the median LyX version is probably 2.0.5. Also, anyone on a Linux
distribution installing from their repos will have a few minor
versions skipped.


I guess that depends upon the distro: http://oswatershed.org/pkg/lyx.

So I officially suggest that we do the following: For 2.1.3, we add the 
warning;

for 2.2.0, we add the error.

Richard

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Kornel Benko]

Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 13:49:20, schrieb Richard Heck 

> On 09/17/2014 11:04 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:
> > On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:32 AM, Richard Heck  wrote:
> >> On 09/17/2014 10:30 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:
> >>> On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko  wrote:
>  Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
>  
> > On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko  wrote:
> >> Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
> >> 
>  IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
>  the users should get appropriate error message (and break
>  compilation).
> >>> Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
> >>> think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
> >>> compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.
> >> In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a
> >> regression too.
> >> I am not ready to adopt this view :)
> > For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
> > the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
> > https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
> > We received a lot of reports that "LyX doesn't compile my document
> > anymore". Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
> > the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.
>  I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
>    Quoting Vincent:
>    "Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next major
>  release we can
> error out on BibTeX errors as we do now."
> >>> Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
> >>> "as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
> >>> a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error."
> >>> - I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
> >>> with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.
> >>
> >> I think that meant we could do it in a minor version. Like the next one. 
> >> And
> >> I think it's a good idea.
> > I'm fine with this but only because I'm fine with not going through
> > the warning phase. I think there are very few LyX users that install
> > consecutive minor versions. Out of the 10 or so people I know running
> > LyX, the median LyX version is probably 2.0.5. Also, anyone on a Linux
> > distribution installing from their repos will have a few minor
> > versions skipped.
> 
> I guess that depends upon the distro: http://oswatershed.org/pkg/lyx.
> 
> So I officially suggest that we do the following: For 2.1.3, we add the 
> warning;
> for 2.2.0, we add the error.

+1

> Richard

Kornel

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Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 1:49 PM, Richard Heck  wrote:
> On 09/17/2014 11:04 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:32 AM, Richard Heck  wrote:
>>>
>>> On 09/17/2014 10:30 AM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:

 On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 10:02 AM, Kornel Benko  wrote:
>
> Am Mittwoch, 17. September 2014 um 09:06:00, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
> 
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:22 PM, Kornel Benko  wrote:
>>>
>>> Am Montag, 15. September 2014 um 14:48:32, schrieb Scott Kostyshak
>>> 
>
> IMHO, if bibtex exits with errors, the compilation _is_ not OK, so
> the users should get appropriate error message (and break
> compilation).

 Six out of seven days I wake up and I agree. But one day a week I
 think about the LyX user who upgrades and the document stops
 compiling. It's a regression from the point of view of the user.
>>>
>>> In this sense, if we correct some bad behaviour, it would be a
>>> regression too.
>>> I am not ready to adopt this view :)
>>
>> For discussion on a very similar topic (possibly a specific case of
>> the fix proposed here), see this discussion:
>> https://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-devel@lists.lyx.org/msg183570.html
>> We received a lot of reports that "LyX doesn't compile my document
>> anymore". Vincent made the reasonable decision to suggest reverting
>> the bug fix and a couple of other developers agreed.
>
> I understood it that way, that the fix were postponed only.
>   Quoting Vincent:
>   "Then, if we succeed to quickly release the next
> major
> release we can
>error out on BibTeX errors as we do now."

 Well you do not quote the part right before that which says
 "as soon as possible we replace the error by a warning when we detect
 a BibTeX error stating that in the future this will lead to an error."
 - I interpret this to mean that first we need a released LyX version
 with the warning. I also supposed that it was meant a major version.
>>>
>>>
>>> I think that meant we could do it in a minor version. Like the next one.
>>> And
>>> I think it's a good idea.
>>
>> I'm fine with this but only because I'm fine with not going through
>> the warning phase. I think there are very few LyX users that install
>> consecutive minor versions. Out of the 10 or so people I know running
>> LyX, the median LyX version is probably 2.0.5. Also, anyone on a Linux
>> distribution installing from their repos will have a few minor
>> versions skipped.
>
>
> I guess that depends upon the distro: http://oswatershed.org/pkg/lyx.

That is a great resource. Thank you!

> So I officially suggest that we do the following: For 2.1.3, we add the
> warning;
> for 2.2.0, we add the error.

Sounds good.
Are there any ideas for the message? Without thinking much, I will throw out:

"xyz finished with an error. This was not previously reported in LyX
so compilation is allowed to continue, but starting with LyX 2.2.0
this warning message will become an error and compilation will stop so
that the user knows to fix the issue causing the error."

Scott

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Richard Heck]

On 09/17/2014 03:02 PM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:
Are there any ideas for the message? Without thinking much, I will 
throw out: "xyz finished with an error. This was not previously 
reported in LyX so compilation is allowed to continue, but starting 
with LyX 2.2.0 this warning message will become an error and 
compilation will stop so that the user knows to fix the issue causing 
the error."


Minor tweaking:

The external program
XYZ [[ probably on its own line, since these commands can be long ]]
finished with an error. Compilation will be [[ has been ?? I guess this 
depends when the warning is issued. ]] allowed to continue, but starting 
with LyX 2.2.0 this warning message will become an error and compilation 
will stop.


I don't think we need to explain in the dialog why that is. Though we 
could add something like: We suggest you find the cause of the error.


A few questions: Can this only happen during compilation? Or could it 
happen during other sorts of export? Should that word be changed? Could 
it, in particular, happen during compilation of instant preview? I don't 
use that, but I can imagine it getting extremely annoying in this case 
to get that message, especially if it were caused by something in the 
preamble that was included in every single case. So, if that is an 
issue, perhaps we should disable the error for preview.


Richard

Re: [PATCH] Check exit code of LaTeX process in LaTeX::run

[Scott Kostyshak]

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 4:14 PM, Richard Heck  wrote:
> On 09/17/2014 03:02 PM, Scott Kostyshak wrote:
>>
>> Are there any ideas for the message? Without thinking much, I will throw
>> out: "xyz finished with an error. This was not previously reported in LyX so
>> compilation is allowed to continue, but starting with LyX 2.2.0 this warning
>> message will become an error and compilation will stop so that the user
>> knows to fix the issue causing the error."
>
>
> Minor tweaking:
>
> The external program
> XYZ [[ probably on its own line, since these commands can be long ]]
> finished with an error. Compilation will be [[ has been ?? I guess this
> depends when the warning is issued. ]] allowed to continue, but starting
> with LyX 2.2.0 this warning message will become an error and compilation
> will stop.
>
> I don't think we need to explain in the dialog why that is. Though we could
> add something like: We suggest you find the cause of the error.

Sounds good.

> A few questions: Can this only happen during compilation? Or could it happen
> during other sorts of export? Should that word be changed? Could it, in
> particular, happen during compilation of instant preview? I don't use that,
> but I can imagine it getting extremely annoying in this case to get that
> message, especially if it were caused by something in the preamble that was
> included in every single case. So, if that is an issue, perhaps we should
> disable the error for preview.

Good point. I will test this.

Scott