RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Yeah but Tim,

 You guys have bears?!

We've got Beer, lots and lots of Beer, but no Bears!


Oh and down here in the far south we don’t' tend to warry about warm clothing 
in winter, and in the summer we've  got both men and women who don't ware much 

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Tim Kilburn
Sent: Tuesday, 19 July 2016 3:22 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

I suggest the Great White North.  No spiders of any consequence, only a few 
snow snakes in the mountains, although they're actually just stories we tell to 
freak out tourists, lots of empty space, mostly free medical care and lots of 
us tough guys who don't even bother wearing a jacket when it's below freezing.  
Then again, it's bloody hot in the summer, -45 C in the winter, not much of a 
Fall or Spring, wildfires that send us out of our city for months, lots of 
taxes and millions of mosquitos that could gang up and haul you away for 
dinner.  And, we tend to welcome anyone who'd like to brave our vast country.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Jul 18, 2016, at 02:31, Simon Fogarty  wrote:

Give it a go, but he lives in wellington, it's windy as a wind farm, 
But it is far enough away from the south island for us to not care, oh and 
you'd have to learn to speak English correctly, and be able to handle running 
naked in the snow.

Even better would be being able to play rugby in the snow, oh and if you don't 
know what rugby is, then your really in trouble, it is the biggest religion in 
NZ 
LOL.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Monday, 18 July 2016 3:09 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Aww come on, I’m going to need a Hillary / Trump escape plan!

Peter Jackson could hire me to make sure his render farms are networked 
properly.  I’d be happy to cut you in.:)  I was good enough for Dream Works so 
should be able to slide that.

> On Jul 16, 2016, at 4:02 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Scott, I'm not sure we want your kind down here in the southern hemisphere.
> 
> Specially around new Zealand we're a very clean country 
> 
> You might dirty the water!
> 
> Lol.
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Scott Granados
> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 12:10 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 
> 22
> 
> David, when that business grows large enough you need an IT department, you 
> let me know.  Would be nice to have a post hillary escape strategy.:)
> 
> haha
> 
> Good luck, sounds like interesting and rewarding work.
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> It is an expansion of my current business. I am now contracted to do some 
>> government work with those who are disabled. However, it lines me up for 
>> something which will be coming up in a couple years around technology and 
>> accessibility.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 00:59, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>>> 
>>> That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
 On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  
 wrote:
 
 Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a 
 new business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be 
 ready to capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with 
 the next business.
 
 David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
 Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
 Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
> comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
> I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for 
> a while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out 
> front and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  
> This worked for several years although there were reporters and other 
> people very interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time 
> who made it challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these 
> people close if I was able to maintain control and final approval whether 
> something would be released and I had a marketing person for a while who 
> I made 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Tim Kilburn]

I suggest the Great White North.  No spiders of any consequence, only a few 
snow snakes in the mountains, although they're actually just stories we tell to 
freak out tourists, lots of empty space, mostly free medical care and lots of 
us tough guys who don't even bother wearing a jacket when it's below freezing.  
Then again, it's bloody hot in the summer, -45 C in the winter, not much of a 
Fall or Spring, wildfires that send us out of our city for months, lots of 
taxes and millions of mosquitos that could gang up and haul you away for 
dinner.  And, we tend to welcome anyone who'd like to brave our vast country.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Jul 18, 2016, at 02:31, Simon Fogarty  wrote:

Give it a go, but he lives in wellington, it's windy as a wind farm, 
But it is far enough away from the south island for us to not care, oh and 
you'd have to learn to speak English correctly, and be able to handle running 
naked in the snow.

Even better would be being able to play rugby in the snow, oh and if you don't 
know what rugby is, then your really in trouble, it is the biggest religion in 
NZ 
LOL.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Monday, 18 July 2016 3:09 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Aww come on, I’m going to need a Hillary / Trump escape plan!

Peter Jackson could hire me to make sure his render farms are networked 
properly.  I’d be happy to cut you in.:)  I was good enough for Dream Works so 
should be able to slide that.

> On Jul 16, 2016, at 4:02 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Scott, I'm not sure we want your kind down here in the southern hemisphere.
> 
> Specially around new Zealand we're a very clean country 
> 
> You might dirty the water!
> 
> Lol.
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Scott Granados
> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 12:10 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 
> 22
> 
> David, when that business grows large enough you need an IT department, you 
> let me know.  Would be nice to have a post hillary escape strategy.:)
> 
> haha
> 
> Good luck, sounds like interesting and rewarding work.
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> It is an expansion of my current business. I am now contracted to do some 
>> government work with those who are disabled. However, it lines me up for 
>> something which will be coming up in a couple years around technology and 
>> accessibility.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 00:59, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>>> 
>>> That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
 On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  
 wrote:
 
 Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a 
 new business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be 
 ready to capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with 
 the next business.
 
 David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
 Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
 Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
> comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
> I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for 
> a while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out 
> front and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  
> This worked for several years although there were reporters and other 
> people very interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time 
> who made it challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these 
> people close if I was able to maintain control and final approval whether 
> something would be released and I had a marketing person for a while who 
> I made review everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember 
> meeting a fellow business owner later in the history of that company who 
> convinced me to completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid 
> try to convince me to use my image in marketing campaigns which I never 
> went that far but I definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that 
> person got through to me.
> Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
> submit button so you can enter in the first 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Give it a go, but he lives in wellington, it's windy as a wind farm, 
But it is far enough away from the south island for us to not care, oh and 
you'd have to learn to speak English correctly, and be able to handle running 
naked in the snow.

 Even better would be being able to play rugby in the snow, oh and if you don't 
know what rugby is, then your really in trouble, it is the biggest religion in 
NZ 
 LOL.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Monday, 18 July 2016 3:09 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Aww come on, I’m going to need a Hillary / Trump escape plan!

Peter Jackson could hire me to make sure his render farms are networked 
properly.  I’d be happy to cut you in.:)  I was good enough for Dream Works so 
should be able to slide that.

> On Jul 16, 2016, at 4:02 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Scott, I'm not sure we want your kind down here in the southern hemisphere.
> 
> Specially around new Zealand we're a very clean country 
> 
> You might dirty the water!
> 
> Lol.
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Scott Granados
> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 12:10 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 
> 22
> 
> David, when that business grows large enough you need an IT department, you 
> let me know.  Would be nice to have a post hillary escape strategy.:)
> 
> haha
> 
> Good luck, sounds like interesting and rewarding work.
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> It is an expansion of my current business. I am now contracted to do some 
>> government work with those who are disabled. However, it lines me up for 
>> something which will be coming up in a couple years around technology and 
>> accessibility.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 00:59, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>>> 
>>> That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
 On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  
 wrote:
 
 Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a 
 new business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be 
 ready to capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with 
 the next business.
 
 David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
 Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
 Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
> comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
> I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for 
> a while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out 
> front and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  
> This worked for several years although there were reporters and other 
> people very interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time 
> who made it challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these 
> people close if I was able to maintain control and final approval whether 
> something would be released and I had a marketing person for a while who 
> I made review everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember 
> meeting a fellow business owner later in the history of that company who 
> convinced me to completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid 
> try to convince me to use my image in marketing campaigns which I never 
> went that far but I definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that 
> person got through to me.
> Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
> submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the 
> box and start loading from tape.
> 
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My 
>> brother, who is two years older, is also blind.
>> 
>> We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording 
>> school for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 
>> 6th grade. The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as 
>> braille, quite well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get 
>> a healthy dose of normal (sighted) culture.
>> 
>> I attended a private highschool (the 

RE: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

You know something, I've only ever lived in NZ apart from a few holidays in 
austrailia   never really been anywhere else.

 But what I can say is 
We have no snakes except the ones we call polititians
We have a few spiders but nothing deadly just a couple that will make you sick 
for a while, although we do have one called the Avindale spider which was used 
in a movie called aracnophobia, looks mean but not a problem.
Redback spiders in central Otago but they sleep for the winter and do not much 
for summer.

We've got people with guns, but they are called farmers, or hunters or police  
sometimes a crim will get one and try something but they normally end up really 
unhappy or dead.
 This country is clean green and pretty bloody friendly to everyone except for 
aucklanders but that’s their fault no one likes them.

We're a great safe little world away from everyone.Sent: Monday, 18 July 2016 
2:41 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech 
world at only 22

You know, it’s interesting, all kidding aside I can’t imagine myself being a 
citizen of another country.  It’s funny how we attach to the places we’re born. 
I’ve also had America / Apple pie / Baseball / tea parties and liberty bells 
drilled in to my head since I can remember so it’s hard for me to imagine.  I 
could definitely see living somewhere else and working in another part of the 
world but I’m not sure about citizen.  Maybe my ideas are to outdated.


> On Jul 17, 2016, at 5:27 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Bloody government.
> 
> Oh well yor here now.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 9:33 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the 
> tech world at only 22
> 
> Yes, Simon, I could not immigrate here. I immigrated independently. Most 
> blind people who immigrate do so as the partner of a Kiwi. I did not just 
> want to come here to work. I wished to become a citizen. To do so, I needed 
> to match the immigration skills list and have enough points. Also, I needed 
> to prove I could live independently. It would have been been much easier had 
> I married a Kiwi.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 20:04, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> 
>> David, do you mean you couldn't move over here until you got a masters 
>> degree?
>> 
>> I can't believe that.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
>> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 1:02 PM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the 
>> tech world at only 22
>> 
>> Scott,
>> 
>> You always have time to go back and attend university.
>> 
>> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
>> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
>> the C- GPA drag.
>> 
>> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
>> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
>> which I graduated from when I was 27).
>> 
>> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
>> into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am 
>> blind. So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding 
>> of business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US 
>> is regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and 
>> entered an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I 
>> graduated at the top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate 
>> accreditation, and my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 
>> 40.
>> 
>> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
>> developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
>> now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree 
>>> so badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>>> 
>>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

Aww come on, I’m going to need a Hillary / Trump escape plan!

Peter Jackson could hire me to make sure his render farms are networked 
properly.  I’d be happy to cut you in.:)  I was good enough for Dream Works so 
should be able to slide that.

> On Jul 16, 2016, at 4:02 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Scott, I'm not sure we want your kind down here in the southern hemisphere.
> 
> Specially around new Zealand we're a very clean country 
> 
> You might dirty the water!
> 
> Lol.
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Scott Granados
> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 12:10 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 
> 22
> 
> David, when that business grows large enough you need an IT department, you 
> let me know.  Would be nice to have a post hillary escape strategy.:)
> 
> haha
> 
> Good luck, sounds like interesting and rewarding work.
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> It is an expansion of my current business. I am now contracted to do some 
>> government work with those who are disabled. However, it lines me up for 
>> something which will be coming up in a couple years around technology and 
>> accessibility.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 00:59, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>>> 
>>> That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
 On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  
 wrote:
 
 Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a 
 new business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be 
 ready to capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with 
 the next business.
 
 David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
 Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
 Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
> comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
> I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for 
> a while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out 
> front and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  
> This worked for several years although there were reporters and other 
> people very interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time 
> who made it challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these 
> people close if I was able to maintain control and final approval whether 
> something would be released and I had a marketing person for a while who 
> I made review everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember 
> meeting a fellow business owner later in the history of that company who 
> convinced me to completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid 
> try to convince me to use my image in marketing campaigns which I never 
> went that far but I definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that 
> person got through to me.
> Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
> submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the 
> box and start loading from tape.
> 
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My 
>> brother, who is two years older, is also blind.
>> 
>> We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording 
>> school for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 
>> 6th grade. The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as 
>> braille, quite well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get 
>> a healthy dose of normal (sighted) culture.
>> 
>> I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I 
>> was able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. 
>> Resource teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was 
>> pretty much on my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 
>> 9th grade. Note: I was registered in the nearby public highschool, so 
>> was able to see a resource teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four 
>> days per week. That person did the important braille transcription for 
>> tests. At school, however, everything was my responsibility.
>> 
>> I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so 
>> much that I decided to become a 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

You know, it’s interesting, all kidding aside I can’t imagine myself being a 
citizen of another country.  It’s funny how we attach to the places we’re born. 
I’ve also had America / Apple pie / Baseball / tea parties and liberty bells 
drilled in to my head since I can remember so it’s hard for me to imagine.  I 
could definitely see living somewhere else and working in another part of the 
world but I’m not sure about citizen.  Maybe my ideas are to outdated.


> On Jul 17, 2016, at 5:27 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Bloody government.
> 
> Oh well yor here now.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 9:33 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the 
> tech world at only 22
> 
> Yes, Simon, I could not immigrate here. I immigrated independently. Most 
> blind people who immigrate do so as the partner of a Kiwi. I did not just 
> want to come here to work. I wished to become a citizen. To do so, I needed 
> to match the immigration skills list and have enough points. Also, I needed 
> to prove I could live independently. It would have been been much easier had 
> I married a Kiwi.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 20:04, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> 
>> David, do you mean you couldn't move over here until you got a masters 
>> degree?
>> 
>> I can't believe that.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
>> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 1:02 PM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the 
>> tech world at only 22
>> 
>> Scott,
>> 
>> You always have time to go back and attend university.
>> 
>> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
>> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
>> the C- GPA drag.
>> 
>> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
>> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
>> which I graduated from when I was 27).
>> 
>> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
>> into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am 
>> blind. So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding 
>> of business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US 
>> is regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and 
>> entered an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I 
>> graduated at the top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate 
>> accreditation, and my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 
>> 40.
>> 
>> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
>> developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
>> now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree 
>>> so badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>>> 
>>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
>>> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
>>> through and do well in college.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
 
 I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
 into a college life, meet new people.
 Vaughn
 
> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> Hi Donna and Devin,
> 
> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
> other people from all walks of life.
> 
> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
> into a group living situation.
> 
> 
> 
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
> To: 

RE: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Yeah we like to make things more difficult.

 Unless your Asian, austrailian  or pacific islander 
  NZ doesn't want you unless you've got truckloads of cash, can't speak English 
well enough to say hello, don't want to live anywhere but Auckland and or feel 
you can use the government welfare systems to yor gain rather than being able 
to work and earn money the hard way.

 Davids an  oddity or am I just bias to  Asians austrailians and pacific 
islanders.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Chris Meredith
Sent: Sunday, 17 July 2016 3:59 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech 
world at only 22

Half a sec.  You lose points on the immigration scale for New Zealand if you’re 
blind?  The mind boggles just a bit.
> On Jul 16, 2016, at 5:32 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> Yes, Simon, I could not immigrate here. I immigrated independently. Most 
> blind people who immigrate do so as the partner of a Kiwi. I did not just 
> want to come here to work. I wished to become a citizen. To do so, I needed 
> to match the immigration skills list and have enough points. Also, I needed 
> to prove I could live independently. It would have been been much easier had 
> I married a Kiwi.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 20:04, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> 
>> David, do you mean you couldn't move over here until you got a masters 
>> degree?
>> 
>> I can't believe that.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
>> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 1:02 PM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the 
>> tech world at only 22
>> 
>> Scott,
>> 
>> You always have time to go back and attend university.
>> 
>> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
>> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
>> the C- GPA drag.
>> 
>> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
>> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
>> which I graduated from when I was 27).
>> 
>> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
>> into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am 
>> blind. So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding 
>> of business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US 
>> is regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and 
>> entered an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I 
>> graduated at the top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate 
>> accreditation, and my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 
>> 40.
>> 
>> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
>> developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
>> now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree 
>>> so badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>>> 
>>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
>>> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
>>> through and do well in college.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
 
 I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
 into a college life, meet new people.
 Vaughn
 
> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> Hi Donna and Devin,
> 
> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
> other people from all walks of life.
> 
> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
> into a group living situation.
> 
> 
> 
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
> Sent: Friday, 15 July 

RE: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Bloody government.
 
Oh well yor here now.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of David Chittenden
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 9:33 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech 
world at only 22

Yes, Simon, I could not immigrate here. I immigrated independently. Most blind 
people who immigrate do so as the partner of a Kiwi. I did not just want to 
come here to work. I wished to become a citizen. To do so, I needed to match 
the immigration skills list and have enough points. Also, I needed to prove I 
could live independently. It would have been been much easier had I married a 
Kiwi.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 16 Jul 2016, at 20:04, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> David, do you mean you couldn't move over here until you got a masters degree?
> 
> I can't believe that.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 1:02 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the 
> tech world at only 22
> 
> Scott,
> 
> You always have time to go back and attend university.
> 
> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
> the C- GPA drag.
> 
> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
> which I graduated from when I was 27).
> 
> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
> into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am blind. 
> So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding of 
> business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US is 
> regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and entered 
> an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I graduated at the 
> top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate accreditation, 
> and my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 40.
> 
> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
> developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
> now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree so 
>> badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>> 
>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
>> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
>> through and do well in college.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>>> into a college life, meet new people.
>>> Vaughn
>>> 
 On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
 Hi Donna and Devin,
 
 Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
 community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
 other people from all walks of life.
 
 I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
 I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
 into a group living situation.
 
 
 
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
 Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
 world at only 22
 
 Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
 since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
 
 Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
 facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like 
 to
 pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting 
 point.
 Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
 be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
 maybe 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

No, not officially. Blindness is not a reason to deny immigration. However, 
when one immigrates independently, one must prove that one is able to live 
independently. In other words, one needs to prove that one is not going to be a 
burden on society. Now, if one was a refugee, it is different, and different 
criteria apply. I can honestly say, NZ is easier than the US or Australia.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 17 Jul 2016, at 15:58, Chris Meredith  wrote:
> 
> Half a sec.  You lose points on the immigration scale for New Zealand if 
> you’re blind?  The mind boggles just a bit.
>> On Jul 16, 2016, at 5:32 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> Yes, Simon, I could not immigrate here. I immigrated independently. Most 
>> blind people who immigrate do so as the partner of a Kiwi. I did not just 
>> want to come here to work. I wished to become a citizen. To do so, I needed 
>> to match the immigration skills list and have enough points. Also, I needed 
>> to prove I could live independently. It would have been been much easier had 
>> I married a Kiwi.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 20:04, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>> 
>>> David, do you mean you couldn't move over here until you got a masters 
>>> degree?
>>> 
>>> I can't believe that.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
>>> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 1:02 PM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the 
>>> tech world at only 22
>>> 
>>> Scott,
>>> 
>>> You always have time to go back and attend university.
>>> 
>>> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
>>> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
>>> the C- GPA drag.
>>> 
>>> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
>>> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month 
>>> program which I graduated from when I was 27).
>>> 
>>> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I 
>>> looked into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I 
>>> am blind. So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent 
>>> understanding of business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest 
>>> accreditation in US is regional which is the only one accepted overseas), 
>>> and applied to and entered an online university which met the criteria. A 
>>> year later, I graduated at the top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to 
>>> the appropriate accreditation, and my grades, I easily entered a masters 
>>> program when I was 40.
>>> 
>>> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I 
>>> had developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another 
>>> way, now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
>>> 
>>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
 
 Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school 
 thing down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried 
 again, lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always 
 felt guilty about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college 
 with a degree so badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
 
 Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
 made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
 through and do well in college.
 
 
> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
> 
> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
> into a college life, meet new people.
> Vaughn
> 
>> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> Hi Donna and Devin,
>> 
>> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
>> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
>> other people from all walks of life.
>> 
>> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
>> into a group living situation.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
>> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Chris Meredith]

Half a sec.  You lose points on the immigration scale for New Zealand if you’re 
blind?  The mind boggles just a bit.
> On Jul 16, 2016, at 5:32 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> Yes, Simon, I could not immigrate here. I immigrated independently. Most 
> blind people who immigrate do so as the partner of a Kiwi. I did not just 
> want to come here to work. I wished to become a citizen. To do so, I needed 
> to match the immigration skills list and have enough points. Also, I needed 
> to prove I could live independently. It would have been been much easier had 
> I married a Kiwi.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 20:04, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> 
>> David, do you mean you couldn't move over here until you got a masters 
>> degree?
>> 
>> I can't believe that.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
>> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 1:02 PM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the 
>> tech world at only 22
>> 
>> Scott,
>> 
>> You always have time to go back and attend university.
>> 
>> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
>> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
>> the C- GPA drag.
>> 
>> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
>> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
>> which I graduated from when I was 27).
>> 
>> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
>> into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am 
>> blind. So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding 
>> of business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US 
>> is regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and 
>> entered an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I 
>> graduated at the top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate 
>> accreditation, and my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 
>> 40.
>> 
>> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
>> developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
>> now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree 
>>> so badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>>> 
>>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
>>> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
>>> through and do well in college.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
 
 I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
 into a college life, meet new people.
 Vaughn
 
> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> Hi Donna and Devin,
> 
> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
> other people from all walks of life.
> 
> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
> into a group living situation.
> 
> 
> 
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
> world at only 22
> 
> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
> 
> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like 
> to
> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting 
> point.
> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
> maybe start by taking a couple of 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Devin Prater]

I have blindsquare, but yeah it's more of knowing nonvisual cues, although I 
can follow directions well.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 16, 2016, at 5:21 PM, Jonathan Cohn  wrote:
> 
> To bring this back on topic, you seem unconfident in your mobility skills. 
> Have you attempted using any of the GPS tools available or is it more related 
> to just understanding and appreciating non-visual feedback from the 
> environment to let you know when corners or obstacles are present? 
> 
> If there are electronic tools available to help your mobility, I know we 
> could help you learn to use them on this list. If it is more of the latter, 
> sometimes you just have to practice on your own and see what happens.
> 
> I was recently with a individual who was transitioning to using a wheelchair. 
> She didn't even take a day off from work to try and use her white cane with 
> the wheel chair. 
> 
>  
> Best wishes,
> 
> Jonathan
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 14, 2016, at 10:56 AM, Devin Prater  wrote:
>> 
>> Sorry y’all, I’ve not checked my email sense early last night. After 
>> graduating the Alabama school for the blind, I was sent there. I needed 
>> independent living training, and some mobility instruction, as there was 
>> only one mobility instructor at the school for the blind, at least for most 
>> of my days there.
>> Sent from my Mac.
>> 
>> Devin Prater
>> d.pra...@me.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 14, 2016, at 7:56 AM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message 
>>> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>>> 
>>> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning 
>>> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like 
>>> to pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting 
>>> point.  Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is 
>>> going to be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of 
>>> options. Then maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would 
>>> be a good way to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is 
>>> for you.  If it's not, it will still help you come up with some better 
>>> options for yourself than what you currently have.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
 
 I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because 
 on the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in 
 a group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem 
 like group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
  
 
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater  wrote:
> 
> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty 
> cool. I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a 
> lower-middle class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama 
> school for the blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do 
> much, or didn’t know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then 
> shuttled me off to the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I 
> attend now. I know more than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these 
> blindness organizations just aren’t all that organized, at least here in 
> the state of football and rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least 
> something to happen before my family decides a group home would indeed be 
> just the spot to plop down their poor blind boy that just can’t seem to 
> learn independence and advocacy skills no matter where the Alabama 
> Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
> Sent from my Mac.
> 
> Devin Prater
> d.pra...@me.com
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Katie,
>> 
>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice 
>> braille display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid 
>> I can't help you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the 
>> VarioUltra list?  It's a great list, with some very helpful and 
>> knowledgeable folks.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi, Donna.
>>> 
>>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! 
>>> :-) its the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you 
>>> can just connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works 
>>> once the pairing is successfully connected. I can also text or email 
>>> people with just my iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I 
>>> don’t always need to constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you 
>>> can just 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Jonathan Cohn]

To bring this back on topic, you seem unconfident in your mobility skills. Have 
you attempted using any of the GPS tools available or is it more related to 
just understanding and appreciating non-visual feedback from the environment to 
let you know when corners or obstacles are present? 

If there are electronic tools available to help your mobility, I know we could 
help you learn to use them on this list. If it is more of the latter, sometimes 
you just have to practice on your own and see what happens.

I was recently with a individual who was transitioning to using a wheelchair. 
She didn't even take a day off from work to try and use her white cane with the 
wheel chair. 

 
Best wishes,

Jonathan



> On Jul 14, 2016, at 10:56 AM, Devin Prater  wrote:
> 
> Sorry y’all, I’ve not checked my email sense early last night. After 
> graduating the Alabama school for the blind, I was sent there. I needed 
> independent living training, and some mobility instruction, as there was only 
> one mobility instructor at the school for the blind, at least for most of my 
> days there.
> Sent from my Mac.
> 
> Devin Prater
> d.pra...@me.com 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 14, 2016, at 7:56 AM, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>> 
>> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message 
>> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>> 
>> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning 
>> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to 
>> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point. 
>>  Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to 
>> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then 
>> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way 
>> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If 
>> it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for 
>> yourself than what you currently have.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on 
>>> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a 
>>> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem 
>>> like group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>>>  
>>> 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater > wrote:
 
 I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty 
 cool. I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a 
 lower-middle class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama 
 school for the blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do 
 much, or didn’t know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then 
 shuttled me off to the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I 
 attend now. I know more than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these 
 blindness organizations just aren’t all that organized, at least here in 
 the state of football and rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least 
 something to happen before my family decides a group home would indeed be 
 just the spot to plop down their poor blind boy that just can’t seem to 
 learn independence and advocacy skills no matter where the Alabama 
 Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
 Sent from my Mac.
 
 Devin Prater
 d.pra...@me.com 
 
 
 
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin  > wrote:
> 
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice 
> braille display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I 
> can't help you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the 
> VarioUltra list?  It's a great list, with some very helpful and 
> knowledgeable folks.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, Donna.
>> 
>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) 
>> its the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can 
>> just connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once 
>> the pairing is successfully connected. I can also text or email people 
>> with just my iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t 
>> always need to constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can 
>> just charge the device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 
>> 12 volt charger. The only problem I 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Hey Scott,

Don't forget online options.  Most campuses offer a lot of their Gen Ed 
classes--and some other as well--online.  Obviously, you have the option of an 
online degree like David mentioned, but you also have the option of a more 
traditional degree with just completing your core requirements online.  There 
are tons of different possible configurations.  And I agree with David, by the 
way.  If this is important for you, go for it.  Like I said, you're quite 
obviously intelligent enough to do this, you just need to figure out the best 
option for you.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Jul 15, 2016, at 10:53 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> David, that’s a lot to think about there but all very true.  I actually did 
> attempt some college classes during period while I was floundering before I 
> started my first business and did very well with them.  I was lucky to live 
> near a small very high end liberal arts college and took some very 
> interesting music technology classes as well as an English class that I 
> absolutely loved.  I really hadn’t had a professor before that was very 
> inspired in literature and lucked out and took a class on World War II 
> literature taught by the dean of the department and the reading was demanding 
> but one of my favorite non technical classes of all time.
>   The school assigned a technologist to work with me in the music program 
> since screen reading wasn’t nearly as developed as it is now although from 
> what Katy was saying I probably should have looked at outspoken more.  I 
> think the big advantage for me was the class sizes were extremely small, most 
> of my classes in technology were 2 people including me and the English class 
> was large but much more fun that way do to the in class discussions.
>   If I stay up here in Massachusetts which is basically college central I 
> wonder if I should approach a school and see if they have any programs that 
> specialize in smaller sizes.  MIT has approached me several times to work for 
> them as an engineer and they offer free classes to employees.  I wouldn’t 
> object to throwing money at the problem (I’m good at that) and paying for 
> more personalized instruction since I don’t do well in a lot of large 
> lectures with white boards as we discussed earlier.
> 
> As always David, you’ve given me a lot to think about.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 9:02 PM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> Scott,
>> 
>> You always have time to go back and attend university.
>> 
>> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
>> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
>> the C- GPA drag.
>> 
>> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
>> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
>> which I graduated from when I was 27).
>> 
>> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
>> into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am 
>> blind. So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding 
>> of business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US 
>> is regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and 
>> entered an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I 
>> graduated at the top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate 
>> accreditation, and my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 
>> 40.
>> 
>> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
>> developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
>> now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree 
>>> so badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>>> 
>>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
>>> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
>>> through and do well in college.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
 
 I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
 into a college life, meet new people.
 Vaughn
 
> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> Hi Donna and Devin,
> 
> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
> community college would 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

Yes, Simon, I could not immigrate here. I immigrated independently. Most blind 
people who immigrate do so as the partner of a Kiwi. I did not just want to 
come here to work. I wished to become a citizen. To do so, I needed to match 
the immigration skills list and have enough points. Also, I needed to prove I 
could live independently. It would have been been much easier had I married a 
Kiwi.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 16 Jul 2016, at 20:04, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> David, do you mean you couldn't move over here until you got a masters degree?
> 
> I can't believe that.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
> Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 1:02 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the 
> tech world at only 22
> 
> Scott,
> 
> You always have time to go back and attend university.
> 
> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
> the C- GPA drag.
> 
> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
> which I graduated from when I was 27).
> 
> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
> into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am blind. 
> So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding of 
> business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US is 
> regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and entered 
> an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I graduated at the 
> top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate accreditation, 
> and my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 40.
> 
> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
> developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
> now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree so 
>> badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>> 
>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
>> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
>> through and do well in college.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>>> into a college life, meet new people.
>>> Vaughn
>>> 
 On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
 Hi Donna and Devin,
 
 Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
 community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
 other people from all walks of life.
 
 I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
 I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
 into a group living situation.
 
 
 
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
 Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
 world at only 22
 
 Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
 since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
 
 Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
 facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like 
 to
 pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting 
 point.
 Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
 be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
 maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
 to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
 it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
 yourself than what you currently have.
 Cheers,
 Donna
 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
 

RE: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

You guys and girls talking about community college make me think about a USA tv 
show called Communitty, all about a community college and bloody funny


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Ryan Mann
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 2:49 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech 
world at only 22

Another thing I like about community college is that the general classes are a 
lot smaller, at least at my community college.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 15, 2016, at 2:57 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> I went to a community college too for my first semester of college after I 
> graduated high school. I took a couple classes   during the fall semester 
> before I started attending Berklee in Boston for the spring semester. Its a 
> great way to transition from high school to college life and classes before 
> you attend a four year college.  Taking your general ed classes at a 
> community college  is much cheaper anyway. I took a lot of my general 
> education classes at community college during the summer.
>> Katie
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 9:53 AM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
>> 
>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>> into a college life, meet new people.
>> Vaughn
>> 
>>> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>> Hi Donna and Devin,
>>> 
>>> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
>>> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
>>> other people from all walks of life.
>>> 
>>> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>>> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
>>> into a group living situation.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
>>> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
>>> world at only 22
>>> 
>>> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
>>> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>>> 
>>> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
>>> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to
>>> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.
>>> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
>>> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
>>> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
>>> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
>>> it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
>>> yourself than what you currently have.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
>>> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
>>> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like
>>> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool.
>>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
>>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
>>> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
>>> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
>>> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more
>>> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just
>>> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and
>>> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my
>>> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their
>>> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy
>>> skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
>>> Sent from my Mac.
>>> 
>>> Devin Prater
>>> d.pra...@me.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Katie,
>>> 
>>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille
>>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help
>>> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?
>>> It's a great list, with some 

RE: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

David, do you mean you couldn't move over here until you got a masters degree?

 I can't believe that.



-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of David Chittenden
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 1:02 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech 
world at only 22

Scott,

You always have time to go back and attend university.

I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped the 
C- GPA drag.

I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
which I graduated from when I was 27).

When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am blind. 
So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding of 
business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US is 
regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and entered 
an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I graduated at the 
top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate accreditation, and 
my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 40.

The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
now is as good a time as any to go back to university.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, lost 
> focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty about 
> it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree so badly. 
>  Always felt like I let her down.
> 
> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
> through and do well in college.
> 
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
>> 
>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>> into a college life, meet new people.
>> Vaughn
>> 
>>> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>> Hi Donna and Devin,
>>> 
>>> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
>>> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
>>> other people from all walks of life.
>>> 
>>> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>>> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
>>> into a group living situation.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
>>> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
>>> world at only 22
>>> 
>>> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
>>> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>>> 
>>> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
>>> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to
>>> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.
>>> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
>>> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
>>> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
>>> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
>>> it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
>>> yourself than what you currently have.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
>>> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
>>> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like
>>> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool.
>>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
>>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
>>> blind, where 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Scott, I'm not sure we want your kind down here in the southern hemisphere.

 Specially around new Zealand we're a very clean country 

You might dirty the water!

Lol.
-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 12:10 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

David, when that business grows large enough you need an IT department, you let 
me know.  Would be nice to have a post hillary escape strategy.:)

haha

Good luck, sounds like interesting and rewarding work.

> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> It is an expansion of my current business. I am now contracted to do some 
> government work with those who are disabled. However, it lines me up for 
> something which will be coming up in a couple years around technology and 
> accessibility.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 00:59, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>> 
>> That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a 
>>> new business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be 
>>> ready to capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with 
>>> the next business.
>>> 
>>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
 
 David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
 comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
 I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for a 
 while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out 
 front and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  
 This worked for several years although there were reporters and other 
 people very interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time 
 who made it challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these people 
 close if I was able to maintain control and final approval whether 
 something would be released and I had a marketing person for a while who I 
 made review everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember 
 meeting a fellow business owner later in the history of that company who 
 convinced me to completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid 
 try to convince me to use my image in marketing campaigns which I never 
 went that far but I definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that 
 person got through to me.
 Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
 submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the 
 box and start loading from tape.
 
 
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  
> wrote:
> 
> I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My 
> brother, who is two years older, is also blind.
> 
> We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording 
> school for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 
> 6th grade. The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as 
> braille, quite well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get 
> a healthy dose of normal (sighted) culture.
> 
> I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I 
> was able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. 
> Resource teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was 
> pretty much on my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 
> 9th grade. Note: I was registered in the nearby public highschool, so was 
> able to see a resource teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four days 
> per week. That person did the important braille transcription for tests. 
> At school, however, everything was my responsibility.
> 
> I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so 
> much that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted 
> one semester at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 
> weeks. I then floundered at a community college for a few years, became a 
> massage therapist, became a technology salesperson, became an 
> accessibility interface evaluater and an accessibility advocate, failed a 
> couple businesses, then returned to university for a bachelors in 
> business admin management 

RE: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Devin,

I’m not trying to be rude here but it’s not what your mum or dad like it’s what 
you like and want to do with your life.

If you want to work with adaptive tech then you do it if you want to be a 
lawyer then do that, it’s what you want that matters don’t’ let other people 
make your chhoices for you.

Be your own person independence will take you along way in life and show those 
out there that you are able to do things without assistance.

Don’t get me wrong we all need help along the way but then so do the able 
bodied of the world also.

Good luck with what choices you make.

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Devin Prater
Sent: Saturday, 16 July 2016 7:43 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Cc: Katie Zodrow 
Subject: Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech 
world at only 22

Wow, pretty cool. Well I finally got to talk to my counsellor, and she told me 
that the Lionsworld training is in October or somewhere around there, so I 
haven’t missed it. In the meantime, I’ll try to go through college prep, or at 
least some of it, to try and learn to study better and things like that, just 
in case I have to do that in training to be an assistive technology instructor. 
Also, though, if I wind up not liking the job, I can still go through college 
afterwards to get another job. I know that won’t be easy, and my mom won’t like 
my insistence to go through with the Lionsworld training, but I’ll give it a 
try, and see where things go.
Sent from my Mac.

Devin Prater
d.pra...@me.com



On Jul 15, 2016, at 1:57 PM, Katie Zodrow 
> wrote:

I went to a community college too for my first semester of college after I 
graduated high school. I took a couple classes   during the fall semester 
before I started attending Berklee in Boston for the spring semester. Its a 
great way to transition from high school to college life and classes before you 
attend a four year college.  Taking your general ed classes at a community 
college  is much cheaper anyway. I took a lot of my general education classes 
at community college during the summer.

Katie


On Jul 15, 2016, at 9:53 AM, Vaughn Brown 
> wrote:

I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
into a college life, meet new people.
Vaughn

On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty > 
wrote:

Hi Donna and Devin,

Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
other people from all walks of life.

I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
into a group living situation.



From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
world at only 22

Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.

Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to
pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.
Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
yourself than what you currently have.
Cheers,
Donna

On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
> 
wrote:

I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like
group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?


On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
> wrote:

I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool.
I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
the adult learning 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

Wow, I would definitely take that MIT position. My understanding is the MIT 
courses tend to be rather interesting. I recently applied for a position which 
would have put me into a PhD track. Unfortunately, I did not get the position. 
That said, I have finally figured out what my PhD research will be. Now, it is 
merely a matter of charting it out and writing up a proposal. I should be able 
to use my new position significantly toward the research, so I can kill 
multiple birds with one stone. Still a few years off whilst I set up and 
establish the new business.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 16 Jul 2016, at 15:53, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> David, that’s a lot to think about there but all very true.  I actually did 
> attempt some college classes during period while I was floundering before I 
> started my first business and did very well with them.  I was lucky to live 
> near a small very high end liberal arts college and took some very 
> interesting music technology classes as well as an English class that I 
> absolutely loved.  I really hadn’t had a professor before that was very 
> inspired in literature and lucked out and took a class on World War II 
> literature taught by the dean of the department and the reading was demanding 
> but one of my favorite non technical classes of all time.
>The school assigned a technologist to work with me in the music program 
> since screen reading wasn’t nearly as developed as it is now although from 
> what Katy was saying I probably should have looked at outspoken more.  I 
> think the big advantage for me was the class sizes were extremely small, most 
> of my classes in technology were 2 people including me and the English class 
> was large but much more fun that way do to the in class discussions.
>If I stay up here in Massachusetts which is basically college central I 
> wonder if I should approach a school and see if they have any programs that 
> specialize in smaller sizes.  MIT has approached me several times to work for 
> them as an engineer and they offer free classes to employees.  I wouldn’t 
> object to throwing money at the problem (I’m good at that) and paying for 
> more personalized instruction since I don’t do well in a lot of large 
> lectures with white boards as we discussed earlier.
> 
> As always David, you’ve given me a lot to think about.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 9:02 PM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> Scott,
>> 
>> You always have time to go back and attend university.
>> 
>> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
>> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
>> the C- GPA drag.
>> 
>> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
>> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
>> which I graduated from when I was 27).
>> 
>> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
>> into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am 
>> blind. So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding 
>> of business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US 
>> is regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and 
>> entered an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I 
>> graduated at the top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate 
>> accreditation, and my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 
>> 40.
>> 
>> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
>> developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
>> now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree 
>>> so badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>>> 
>>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
>>> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
>>> through and do well in college.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
 
 I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
 into a college life, meet new people.
 Vaughn
 
> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> Hi Donna and Devin,
> 
> Devin, if your as 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

Hi Donna, you’re right of course.  It is something I would like to eventually 
succeed at though, I’m fairly good at looking at failure as just another data 
point and trying something else but that’s one that has personal significants.

On Jul 15, 2016, at 11:26 PM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Scott, you're plenty smart, and you've done quite well for yourself besides.  
> School just isn't for everyone.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 7:04 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree so 
>> badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>> 
>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
>> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
>> through and do well in college.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>>> into a college life, meet new people.
>>> Vaughn
>>> 
>>> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
 Hi Donna and Devin,
 
 Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
 community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
 other people from all walks of life.
 
 I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
 I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
 into a group living situation.
 
 
 
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
 Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
 world at only 22
 
 Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
 since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
 
 Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
 facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like 
 to
 pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting 
 point.
 Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
 be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
 maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
 to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
 it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
 yourself than what you currently have.
 Cheers,
 Donna
 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
 > wrote:
 
 I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
 the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
 group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem 
 like
 group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
 
 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
 > wrote:
 
 I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty 
 cool.
 I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
 class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
 blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
 know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
 the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more
 than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just
 aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and
 rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my
 family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down 
 their
 poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy
 skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
 Sent from my Mac.
 
 Devin Prater
 d.pra...@me.com
 
 
 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin
 > wrote:
 
 Hi Katie,
 
 Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille
 display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't 
 help
 you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?
 It's a great list, with some very 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

David, that’s a lot to think about there but all very true.  I actually did 
attempt some college classes during period while I was floundering before I 
started my first business and did very well with them.  I was lucky to live 
near a small very high end liberal arts college and took some very interesting 
music technology classes as well as an English class that I absolutely loved.  
I really hadn’t had a professor before that was very inspired in literature and 
lucked out and took a class on World War II literature taught by the dean of 
the department and the reading was demanding but one of my favorite non 
technical classes of all time.
The school assigned a technologist to work with me in the music program 
since screen reading wasn’t nearly as developed as it is now although from what 
Katy was saying I probably should have looked at outspoken more.  I think the 
big advantage for me was the class sizes were extremely small, most of my 
classes in technology were 2 people including me and the English class was 
large but much more fun that way do to the in class discussions.
If I stay up here in Massachusetts which is basically college central I 
wonder if I should approach a school and see if they have any programs that 
specialize in smaller sizes.  MIT has approached me several times to work for 
them as an engineer and they offer free classes to employees.  I wouldn’t 
object to throwing money at the problem (I’m good at that) and paying for more 
personalized instruction since I don’t do well in a lot of large lectures with 
white boards as we discussed earlier.

As always David, you’ve given me a lot to think about.




> On Jul 15, 2016, at 9:02 PM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> Scott,
> 
> You always have time to go back and attend university.
> 
> I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
> reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped 
> the C- GPA drag.
> 
> I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
> classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
> which I graduated from when I was 27).
> 
> When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
> into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am blind. 
> So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding of 
> business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US is 
> regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and entered 
> an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I graduated at the 
> top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate accreditation, 
> and my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 40.
> 
> The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
> developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
> now is as good a time as any to go back to university.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
>> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, 
>> lost focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty 
>> about it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree so 
>> badly.  Always felt like I let her down.
>> 
>> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
>> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
>> through and do well in college.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>>> into a college life, meet new people.
>>> Vaughn
>>> 
 On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
 Hi Donna and Devin,
 
 Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
 community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
 other people from all walks of life.
 
 I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
 I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
 into a group living situation.
 
 
 
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
 Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
 world at only 22
 
 Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
 since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
 
 Devon, no, I can't imagine why 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Scott, you're plenty smart, and you've done quite well for yourself besides.  
School just isn't for everyone.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Jul 15, 2016, at 7:04 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, lost 
> focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty about 
> it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree so badly. 
>  Always felt like I let her down.
> 
> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
> through and do well in college.
> 
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
>> 
>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>> into a college life, meet new people.
>> Vaughn
>> 
>> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>> Hi Donna and Devin,
>>> 
>>> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
>>> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
>>> other people from all walks of life.
>>> 
>>> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>>> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
>>> into a group living situation.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
>>> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
>>> world at only 22
>>> 
>>> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
>>> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>>> 
>>> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
>>> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to
>>> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.
>>> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
>>> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
>>> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
>>> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
>>> it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
>>> yourself than what you currently have.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
>>> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
>>> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like
>>> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool.
>>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
>>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
>>> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
>>> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
>>> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more
>>> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just
>>> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and
>>> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my
>>> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their
>>> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy
>>> skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
>>> Sent from my Mac.
>>> 
>>> Devin Prater
>>> d.pra...@me.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Katie,
>>> 
>>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille
>>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help
>>> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?
>>> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi, Donna.
>>> 
>>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its
>>> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just
>>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing
>>> is successfully 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Ryan Mann]

Another thing I like about community college is that the general classes are a 
lot smaller, at least at my community college.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 15, 2016, at 2:57 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> I went to a community college too for my first semester of college after I 
> graduated high school. I took a couple classes   during the fall semester 
> before I started attending Berklee in Boston for the spring semester. Its a 
> great way to transition from high school to college life and classes before 
> you attend a four year college.  Taking your general ed classes at a 
> community college  is much cheaper anyway. I took a lot of my general 
> education classes at community college during the summer.
>> Katie
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 9:53 AM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
>> 
>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>> into a college life, meet new people.
>> Vaughn
>> 
>>> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>> Hi Donna and Devin,
>>> 
>>> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
>>> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
>>> other people from all walks of life.
>>> 
>>> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>>> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
>>> into a group living situation.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
>>> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
>>> world at only 22
>>> 
>>> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
>>> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>>> 
>>> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
>>> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to
>>> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.
>>> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
>>> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
>>> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
>>> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
>>> it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
>>> yourself than what you currently have.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
>>> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
>>> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like
>>> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool.
>>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
>>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
>>> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
>>> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
>>> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more
>>> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just
>>> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and
>>> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my
>>> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their
>>> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy
>>> skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
>>> Sent from my Mac.
>>> 
>>> Devin Prater
>>> d.pra...@me.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Katie,
>>> 
>>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille
>>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help
>>> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?
>>> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi, Donna.
>>> 
>>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its
>>> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just
>>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing
>>> is successfully 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

Scott,

You always have time to go back and attend university.

I went to a university directly after high school and flunked out. I never 
reported that year to any other education institution. This way, I escaped the 
C- GPA drag.

I then attended community college for a few years part-time, only taking 
classes that interested me. I then went to massage school (a 9 month program 
which I graduated from when I was 27).

When I was 38, I decided I wanted to x-patriate myself from the US. I looked 
into it and discovered that I would need a masters degree because I am blind. 
So, I looked at my skills and realised I have excellent understanding of 
business. So, I located a fully accredited (highest accreditation in US is 
regional which is the only one accepted overseas), and applied to and entered 
an online university which met the criteria. A year later, I graduated at the 
top of my class with a bachelors. Thanks to the appropriate accreditation, and 
my grades, I easily entered a masters program when I was 40.

The truth is, university was much easier for me when I returned at 38. I had 
developed the drive and focus which I lacked when I was 18. Put another way, 
now is as good a time as any to go back to university.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 16 Jul 2016, at 12:04, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
> down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, lost 
> focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty about 
> it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree so badly. 
>  Always felt like I let her down.
> 
> Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have 
> made up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get 
> through and do well in college.
> 
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
>> 
>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>> into a college life, meet new people.
>> Vaughn
>> 
>>> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>> Hi Donna and Devin,
>>> 
>>> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
>>> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
>>> other people from all walks of life.
>>> 
>>> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>>> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
>>> into a group living situation.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
>>> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
>>> world at only 22
>>> 
>>> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
>>> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>>> 
>>> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
>>> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to
>>> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.
>>> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
>>> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
>>> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
>>> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
>>> it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
>>> yourself than what you currently have.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
>>> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
>>> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like
>>> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool.
>>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
>>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
>>> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
>>> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
>>> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more
>>> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just
>>> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and
>>> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

David, when that business grows large enough you need an IT department, you let 
me know.  Would be nice to have a post hillary escape strategy.:)

haha

Good luck, sounds like interesting and rewarding work.

> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> It is an expansion of my current business. I am now contracted to do some 
> government work with those who are disabled. However, it lines me up for 
> something which will be coming up in a couple years around technology and 
> accessibility.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 00:59, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>> 
>> That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a 
>>> new business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be 
>>> ready to capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with 
>>> the next business.
>>> 
>>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
 
 David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
 comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
 I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for a 
 while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out 
 front and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  
 This worked for several years although there were reporters and other 
 people very interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time 
 who made it challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these people 
 close if I was able to maintain control and final approval whether 
 something would be released and I had a marketing person for a while who I 
 made review everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember 
 meeting a fellow business owner later in the history of that company who 
 convinced me to completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid 
 try to convince me to use my image in marketing campaigns which I never 
 went that far but I definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that 
 person got through to me.
 Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
 submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the 
 box and start loading from tape.
 
 
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  
> wrote:
> 
> I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My 
> brother, who is two years older, is also blind.
> 
> We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording 
> school for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 
> 6th grade. The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as 
> braille, quite well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get 
> a healthy dose of normal (sighted) culture.
> 
> I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I 
> was able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. 
> Resource teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was 
> pretty much on my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 
> 9th grade. Note: I was registered in the nearby public highschool, so was 
> able to see a resource teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four days 
> per week. That person did the important braille transcription for tests. 
> At school, however, everything was my responsibility.
> 
> I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so 
> much that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted 
> one semester at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 
> weeks. I then floundered at a community college for a few years, became a 
> massage therapist, became a technology salesperson, became an 
> accessibility interface evaluater and an accessibility advocate, failed a 
> couple businesses, then returned to university for a bachelors in 
> business admin management followed by a masters in counseling. After I 
> completed university, I independently immigrated to New Zealand. I 
> currently work as the mental health specialist at a small doctor's clinic.
> 
> I started technology working on a PDP1170 mainframe. My first personal 
> system was a Blazie Braille 'n Speak 640 which I used to access local 
> BBSs. I then went to DOS, followed by Windows. I switched to the Mac with 
> OSX Mountain 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

Wow, I wish I was smart, I could never get the whole education school thing 
down.  I tried college, dropped out and started a business, tried again, lost 
focus, started another business and moved on.  I’ve always felt guilty about 
it.  My poor mother wanted to see me graduate college with a degree so badly.  
Always felt like I let her down.

Oh well I went the long way but my positions more recently and career have made 
up for a lot but I always wished I had the focus and stuff to get through and 
do well in college.


> On Jul 15, 2016, at 12:53 PM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
> 
> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
> into a college life, meet new people.
> Vaughn
> 
> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> Hi Donna and Devin,
>> 
>> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
>> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
>> other people from all walks of life.
>> 
>> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
>> into a group living situation.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
>> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
>> world at only 22
>> 
>> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
>> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>> 
>> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
>> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to
>> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.
>> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
>> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
>> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
>> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
>> it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
>> yourself than what you currently have.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
>> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
>> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like
>> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>> 
>> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool.
>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
>> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
>> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
>> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more
>> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just
>> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and
>> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my
>> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their
>> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy
>> skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
>> Sent from my Mac.
>> 
>> Devin Prater
>> d.pra...@me.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Katie,
>> 
>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille
>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help
>> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?
>> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, Donna.
>> 
>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its
>> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just
>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing
>> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my
>> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to
>> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the
>> device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger.
>> The only problem I have sometimes 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Good luck, Devin.
Best,
Donna
> On Jul 15, 2016, at 2:42 PM, Devin Prater  wrote:
> 
> Wow, pretty cool. Well I finally got to talk to my counsellor, and she told 
> me that the Lionsworld training is in October or somewhere around there, so I 
> haven’t missed it. In the meantime, I’ll try to go through college prep, or 
> at least some of it, to try and learn to study better and things like that, 
> just in case I have to do that in training to be an assistive technology 
> instructor. Also, though, if I wind up not liking the job, I can still go 
> through college afterwards to get another job. I know that won’t be easy, and 
> my mom won’t like my insistence to go through with the Lionsworld training, 
> but I’ll give it a try, and see where things go.
> Sent from my Mac.
> 
> Devin Prater
> d.pra...@me.com 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 1:57 PM, Katie Zodrow > > wrote:
>> 
>> I went to a community college too for my first semester of college after I 
>> graduated high school. I took a couple classes   during the fall semester 
>> before I started attending Berklee in Boston for the spring semester. Its a 
>> great way to transition from high school to college life and classes before 
>> you attend a four year college.  Taking your general ed classes at a 
>> community college  is much cheaper anyway. I took a lot of my general 
>> education classes at community college during the summer.
>>> Katie
>> 
>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 9:53 AM, Vaughn Brown >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>>> into a college life, meet new people.
>>> Vaughn
>>> 
>>> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty >> > wrote:
 Hi Donna and Devin,
 
 Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
 community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
 other people from all walks of life.
 
 I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
 I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
 into a group living situation.
 
 
 
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
 
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
 ] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
 Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
 
 Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
 world at only 22
 
 Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
 since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
 
 Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
 facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like 
 to
 pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting 
 point.
 Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
 be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
 maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
 to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
 it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
 yourself than what you currently have.
 Cheers,
 Donna
 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
 >> wrote:
 
 I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
 the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
 group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem 
 like
 group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
 
 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
 >> wrote:
 
 I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty 
 cool.
 I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
 class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
 blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
 know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
 the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more
 than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just
 aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and
 rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Katie Zodrow]

That sounds great David. Congratulations! Hope your new business goes well for 
you!
Katie

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 14, 2016, at 9:34 PM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> It is an expansion of my current business. I am now contracted to do some 
> government work with those who are disabled. However, it lines me up for 
> something which will be coming up in a couple years around technology and 
> accessibility.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 00:59, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>> 
>> That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a 
>>> new business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be 
>>> ready to capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with 
>>> the next business.
>>> 
>>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
 
 David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
 comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
 I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for a 
 while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out 
 front and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  
 This worked for several years although there were reporters and other 
 people very interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time 
 who made it challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these people 
 close if I was able to maintain control and final approval whether 
 something would be released and I had a marketing person for a while who I 
 made review everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember 
 meeting a fellow business owner later in the history of that company who 
 convinced me to completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid 
 try to convince me to use my image in marketing campaigns which I never 
 went that far but I definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that 
 person got through to me.
 Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
 submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the 
 box and start loading from tape.
 
 
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  
> wrote:
> 
> I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My 
> brother, who is two years older, is also blind.
> 
> We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording 
> school for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 
> 6th grade. The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as 
> braille, quite well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get 
> a healthy dose of normal (sighted) culture.
> 
> I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I 
> was able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. 
> Resource teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was 
> pretty much on my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 
> 9th grade. Note: I was registered in the nearby public highschool, so was 
> able to see a resource teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four days 
> per week. That person did the important braille transcription for tests. 
> At school, however, everything was my responsibility.
> 
> I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so 
> much that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted 
> one semester at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 
> weeks. I then floundered at a community college for a few years, became a 
> massage therapist, became a technology salesperson, became an 
> accessibility interface evaluater and an accessibility advocate, failed a 
> couple businesses, then returned to university for a bachelors in 
> business admin management followed by a masters in counseling. After I 
> completed university, I independently immigrated to New Zealand. I 
> currently work as the mental health specialist at a small doctor's clinic.
> 
> I started technology working on a PDP1170 mainframe. My first personal 
> system was a Blazie Braille 'n Speak 640 which I used to access local 
> BBSs. I then went to DOS, followed by Windows. I switched to the Mac with 
> OSX Mountain Lion. I wanted to support the only mainstream company that 
> was actively fully working 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Devin Prater]

Wow, pretty cool. Well I finally got to talk to my counsellor, and she told me 
that the Lionsworld training is in October or somewhere around there, so I 
haven’t missed it. In the meantime, I’ll try to go through college prep, or at 
least some of it, to try and learn to study better and things like that, just 
in case I have to do that in training to be an assistive technology instructor. 
Also, though, if I wind up not liking the job, I can still go through college 
afterwards to get another job. I know that won’t be easy, and my mom won’t like 
my insistence to go through with the Lionsworld training, but I’ll give it a 
try, and see where things go.
Sent from my Mac.

Devin Prater
d.pra...@me.com



> On Jul 15, 2016, at 1:57 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> I went to a community college too for my first semester of college after I 
> graduated high school. I took a couple classes   during the fall semester 
> before I started attending Berklee in Boston for the spring semester. Its a 
> great way to transition from high school to college life and classes before 
> you attend a four year college.  Taking your general ed classes at a 
> community college  is much cheaper anyway. I took a lot of my general 
> education classes at community college during the summer.
>> Katie
> 
>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 9:53 AM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
>> 
>> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
>> into a college life, meet new people.
>> Vaughn
>> 
>> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>> Hi Donna and Devin,
>>> 
>>> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
>>> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
>>> other people from all walks of life.
>>> 
>>> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>>> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
>>> into a group living situation.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
>>> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
>>> world at only 22
>>> 
>>> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
>>> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>>> 
>>> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
>>> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to
>>> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.
>>> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
>>> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
>>> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
>>> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
>>> it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
>>> yourself than what you currently have.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
>>> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
>>> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like
>>> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool.
>>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
>>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
>>> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
>>> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
>>> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more
>>> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just
>>> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and
>>> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my
>>> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their
>>> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy
>>> skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
>>> Sent from my Mac.
>>> 
>>> Devin Prater
>>> d.pra...@me.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin
>>> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Katie,
>>> 
>>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille
>>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help
>>> 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Katie Zodrow]

I went to a community college too for my first semester of college after I 
graduated high school. I took a couple classes   during the fall semester 
before I started attending Berklee in Boston for the spring semester. Its a 
great way to transition from high school to college life and classes before you 
attend a four year college.  Taking your general ed classes at a community 
college  is much cheaper anyway. I took a lot of my general education classes 
at community college during the summer.
> Katie

> On Jul 15, 2016, at 9:53 AM, Vaughn Brown  wrote:
> 
> I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
> into a college life, meet new people.
> Vaughn
> 
> On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> Hi Donna and Devin,
>> 
>> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
>> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
>> other people from all walks of life.
>> 
>> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>> I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
>> into a group living situation.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
>> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
>> world at only 22
>> 
>> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
>> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>> 
>> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
>> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to
>> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.
>> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
>> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
>> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
>> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
>> it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
>> yourself than what you currently have.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
>> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
>> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like
>> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>> 
>> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool.
>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
>> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
>> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
>> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more
>> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just
>> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and
>> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my
>> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their
>> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy
>> skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
>> Sent from my Mac.
>> 
>> Devin Prater
>> d.pra...@me.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Katie,
>> 
>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille
>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help
>> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?
>> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow
>> > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, Donna.
>> 
>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its
>> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just
>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing
>> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my
>> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to
>> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the
>> device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger.
>> The only problem I have sometimes is opening 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Devin Prater]

There is a dual enrollment program at the adult learning center I go to. I’ll 
talk with my rehab counsellor about it soon, assuming she’s in today.
Sent from my Mac.

Devin Prater
d.pra...@me.com



> On Jul 15, 2016, at 3:51 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Hi Donna and Devin,
>  
> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a 
> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many 
> other people from all walks of life.
>  
> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>  I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me 
> into a group living situation.
>  
>  
>  
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech 
> world at only 22
>  
> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message 
> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>  
> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning 
> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to 
> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.  
> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to be 
> much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then maybe 
> start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way to get 
> your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If it's not, 
> it will still help you come up with some better options for yourself than 
> what you currently have.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>  
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados  > wrote:
>  
> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on 
> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a 
> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like 
> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>  
>  
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater  > wrote:
>  
> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. 
> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle 
> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the 
> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t 
> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to 
> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more 
> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just 
> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and 
> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my 
> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their 
> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy skills 
> no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
> Sent from my Mac.
>  
> Devin Prater
> d.pra...@me.com 
>  
>  
>  
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin  > wrote:
>  
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  
> It's a great list, with some very  helpful and knowledgeable folks.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow  > wrote:
> 
> Hi, Donna.
> 
> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing 
> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my 
> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to 
> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the device 
> with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. The only 
> problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried opening a 
> couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. They were in .docx 
> format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open the file, I would get a 
> warning that said the file could not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the 
> lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 
> 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used 
> with braille displays. I’ll be getting some more training again with the VU 
> in 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Vaughn Brown]

I loved attending my community college. It was a great way to ease
into a college life, meet new people.
Vaughn

On 7/15/16, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> Hi Donna and Devin,
>
> Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a
> community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many
> other people from all walks of life.
>
> I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
>  I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me
> into a group living situation.
>
>
>
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech
> world at only 22
>
> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message
> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
>
> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning
> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to
> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.
>  Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to
> be much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then
> maybe start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way
> to get your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If
> it's not, it will still help you come up with some better options for
> yourself than what you currently have.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados
> > wrote:
>
> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on
> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a
> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like
> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>
>
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater
> > wrote:
>
> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool.
> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle
> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the
> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t
> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to
> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more
> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just
> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and
> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my
> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their
> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy
> skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
> Sent from my Mac.
>
> Devin Prater
> d.pra...@me.com
>
>
>
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin
> > wrote:
>
> Hi Katie,
>
> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille
> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help
> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?
> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow
> > wrote:
>
> Hi, Donna.
>
> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its
> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just
> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing
> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my
> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to
> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the
> device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger.
> The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried
> opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. They were
> in .docx format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open the file, I
> would get a warning that said the file could not be opened. Really strange.
> The VU is the lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen compared to my
> old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were the 2 previous
> notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll be getting some more training
> again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully I can find out why the
> documents were not opening from my flash drive.
>
> Katie
>
>
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin
> 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

And also to take either the ACT or the SAT exam.  Different schools have 
different minimum score requirements for those tests before one can be admitted.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Jul 15, 2016, at 3:26 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> In the US, it is necessary to either graduate from high school, or pass the 
> GED, Graduate Equivalency Deploma, a series of exams that one completes to 
> prove that one is college (higher edudation) ready. If one did not earn high 
> enough grades in high school, the only path into university is to attend a 2 
> year community college (PolyTech in NZ), and earn a minimum GPA. I believe it 
> is a B- for many universities.
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com 
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On 15 Jul 2016, at 19:59, Simon Fogarty  > wrote:
> 
>> Devin,
>>  
>> I don’t know the situation with colleges in the USA but if you have the will 
>> then there will be a way,
>>  If you wished to study at college and showed you could work at it surely it 
>> must be possible
>>  
>> Good luck
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>>  
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> ] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
>> Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 8:56 AM
>> To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries > >
>> Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at 
>> only 22
>>  
>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. 
>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle 
>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the 
>> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t 
>> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to 
>> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more 
>> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just 
>> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and 
>> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my 
>> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their 
>> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy 
>> skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
>> Sent from my Mac.
>>  
>> Devin Prater
>> d.pra...@me.com 
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>>  
>> Hi Katie,
>> 
>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
>> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  
>> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, Donna.
>> 
>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
>> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing 
>> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my 
>> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to 
>> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the 
>> device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. 
>> The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried 
>> opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. They were 
>> in .docx format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open the file, I 
>> would get a warning that said the file could not be opened. Really strange. 
>> The VU is the lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen compared to my 
>> old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were the 2 previous 
>> notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll be getting some more training 
>> again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully I can find out why the 
>> documents were not opening from my flash drive.
>> 
>> Katie
>> 
>> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Katie,
>> 
>> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
>> bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  The 
>> thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large 
>> briefcase, just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of 
>> course, all the accompanying cables and 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Very cool.  Good luck!
Donna
> On Jul 14, 2016, at 11:34 PM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> It is an expansion of my current business. I am now contracted to do some 
> government work with those who are disabled. However, it lines me up for 
> something which will be coming up in a couple years around technology and 
> accessibility.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 00:59, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>> 
>> That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a 
>>> new business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be 
>>> ready to capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with 
>>> the next business.
>>> 
>>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
 
 David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
 comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
 I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for a 
 while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out 
 front and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  
 This worked for several years although there were reporters and other 
 people very interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time 
 who made it challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these people 
 close if I was able to maintain control and final approval whether 
 something would be released and I had a marketing person for a while who I 
 made review everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember 
 meeting a fellow business owner later in the history of that company who 
 convinced me to completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid 
 try to convince me to use my image in marketing campaigns which I never 
 went that far but I definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that 
 person got through to me.
 Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
 submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the 
 box and start loading from tape.
 
 
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  
> wrote:
> 
> I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My 
> brother, who is two years older, is also blind.
> 
> We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording 
> school for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 
> 6th grade. The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as 
> braille, quite well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get 
> a healthy dose of normal (sighted) culture.
> 
> I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I 
> was able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. 
> Resource teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was 
> pretty much on my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 
> 9th grade. Note: I was registered in the nearby public highschool, so was 
> able to see a resource teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four days 
> per week. That person did the important braille transcription for tests. 
> At school, however, everything was my responsibility.
> 
> I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so 
> much that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted 
> one semester at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 
> weeks. I then floundered at a community college for a few years, became a 
> massage therapist, became a technology salesperson, became an 
> accessibility interface evaluater and an accessibility advocate, failed a 
> couple businesses, then returned to university for a bachelors in 
> business admin management followed by a masters in counseling. After I 
> completed university, I independently immigrated to New Zealand. I 
> currently work as the mental health specialist at a small doctor's clinic.
> 
> I started technology working on a PDP1170 mainframe. My first personal 
> system was a Blazie Braille 'n Speak 640 which I used to access local 
> BBSs. I then went to DOS, followed by Windows. I switched to the Mac with 
> OSX Mountain Lion. I wanted to support the only mainstream company that 
> was actively fully working toward blindness accessibility.
> 
> I am now dabbling with Android as well as 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

That depends on the university. Most community colleges will let you in. They 
have programs specifically targeted toward their community. And, as a person 
improves, they can work to develop an appropriate GPA for university. However, 
in most cases, one must either graduate from high school, or earn one's GED. My 
father dropped out from high school when he was 15, and became a carpenter. He 
worked his way up to subcontractor. He finally reached a point where he needed 
high school equivalency, or maybe it was his children getting ready to graduate 
from high school, so he spent 3 months preparing for, studying for, and passing 
the GED. After that, he was able to take a community college course around the 
next level of subcontracting so he could increase his licensure to manage the 
carpentry side of very large and involved projects.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 15 Jul 2016, at 21:21, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Interesting,
> Can you not attend a college after 21 if your high school grades weren’t high 
> enough?
>  
> You can here in NZ.
>  
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
> Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 8:27 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 
> 22
>  
> In the US, it is necessary to either graduate from high school, or pass the 
> GED, Graduate Equivalency Deploma, a series of exams that one completes to 
> prove that one is college (higher edudation) ready. If one did not earn high 
> enough grades in high school, the only path into university is to attend a 2 
> year community college (PolyTech in NZ), and earn a minimum GPA. I believe it 
> is a B- for many universities.
>  
> Kind regards,
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On 15 Jul 2016, at 19:59, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Devin,
>  
> I don’t know the situation with colleges in the USA but if you have the will 
> then there will be a way,
>  If you wished to study at college and showed you could work at it surely it 
> must be possible
>  
> Good luck
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
> Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 8:56 AM
> To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
> Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 
> 22
>  
> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. 
> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle 
> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the 
> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t 
> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to 
> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more 
> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just 
> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and 
> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my 
> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their 
> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy skills 
> no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
> Sent from my Mac.
>  
> Devin Prater
> d.pra...@me.com
>  
>  
>  
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>  
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  
> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> Hi, Donna.
> 
> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing 
> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my 
> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to 
> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the device 
> with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. The only 
> problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried opening a 
> couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. They were in .docx 
> format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open the file, I would get a 
> warning that said the file could not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Interesting,
Can you not attend a college after 21 if your high school grades weren’t high 
enough?

You can here in NZ.

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of David Chittenden
Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 8:27 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

In the US, it is necessary to either graduate from high school, or pass the 
GED, Graduate Equivalency Deploma, a series of exams that one completes to 
prove that one is college (higher edudation) ready. If one did not earn high 
enough grades in high school, the only path into university is to attend a 2 
year community college (PolyTech in NZ), and earn a minimum GPA. I believe it 
is a B- for many universities.

Kind regards,

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

On 15 Jul 2016, at 19:59, Simon Fogarty 
> wrote:
Devin,

I don’t know the situation with colleges in the USA but if you have the will 
then there will be a way,
 If you wished to study at college and showed you could work at it surely it 
must be possible

Good luck
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 8:56 AM
To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
>
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. I 
guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle class 
home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the blind, where 
teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t know what to do, 
exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to the adult learning 
facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more than I did when I left 
ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just aren’t all that organized, at 
least here in the state of football and rednecks. I just hope that I can get at 
least something to happen before my family decides a group home would indeed be 
just the spot to plop down their poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn 
independence and advocacy skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends 
him. Oh discordia.
Sent from my Mac.

Devin Prater
d.pra...@me.com



On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Katie,

Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  It's 
a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
Cheers,
Donna


On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow 
> wrote:

Hi, Donna.

Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just connect 
a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing is 
successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my iphone and 
the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to constantly use 
dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the device with a USB cable 
too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. The only problem I have 
sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried opening a couple files with 
the USB stick connected to the device. They were in .docx format, an every time 
I’d press the navistick to open the file, I would get a warning that said the 
file could not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest 
display I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote 
MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll 
be getting some more training again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully 
I can find out why the documents were not opening from my flash drive.


Katie



On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Katie,

Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how bulky 
things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  The thing 
was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large briefcase, just to 
carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of course, all the 
accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that with now carrying 
around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option of pairing the VU with 
the iPhone, the difference between then and now is really striking.
Cheers,
Donna

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Hey David,

 Great work, hope it pays off.

So long as our Gov doesn't screw things up for you.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of David Chittenden
Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 4:35 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

It is an expansion of my current business. I am now contracted to do some 
government work with those who are disabled. However, it lines me up for 
something which will be coming up in a couple years around technology and 
accessibility.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 15 Jul 2016, at 00:59, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a 
>> new business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be ready 
>> to capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with the next 
>> business.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
>>> comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
>>>  I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for a 
>>> while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out front 
>>> and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  This 
>>> worked for several years although there were reporters and other people 
>>> very interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time who made 
>>> it challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these people close if 
>>> I was able to maintain control and final approval whether something would 
>>> be released and I had a marketing person for a while who I made review 
>>> everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember meeting a fellow 
>>> business owner later in the history of that company who convinced me to 
>>> completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid try to convince me 
>>> to use my image in marketing campaigns which I never went that far but I 
>>> definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that person got through to 
>>> me.
>>>  Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
>>> submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the 
>>> box and start loading from tape.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  
 wrote:
 
 I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My brother, 
 who is two years older, is also blind.
 
 We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording 
 school for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 
 6th grade. The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as 
 braille, quite well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get a 
 healthy dose of normal (sighted) culture.
 
 I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I was 
 able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. Resource 
 teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was pretty much 
 on my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 9th grade. 
 Note: I was registered in the nearby public highschool, so was able to see 
 a resource teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four days per week. That 
 person did the important braille transcription for tests. At school, 
 however, everything was my responsibility.
 
 I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so 
 much that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted one 
 semester at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 weeks. I 
 then floundered at a community college for a few years, became a massage 
 therapist, became a technology salesperson, became an accessibility 
 interface evaluater and an accessibility advocate, failed a couple 
 businesses, then returned to university for a bachelors in business admin 
 management followed by a masters in counseling. After I completed 
 university, I independently immigrated to New Zealand. I currently work as 
 the mental health specialist at a small doctor's clinic.
 
 I started technology working on a PDP1170 mainframe. My first personal 
 system was a Blazie Braille 'n Speak 640 which I used to access local 
 BBSs. I then went to DOS, followed by Windows. I switched to the Mac with 
 OSX Mountain 

RE: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi Donna and Devin,

Devin, if your as sheltered as you make it sound, Donnas suggestion of a 
community college would be a great idea, you would also get to meet many other 
people from all walks of life.

I’ve met truckloads of people from my studies at University
 I would tell my family where to get off if my parents had tried to put me into 
a group living situation.



From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
Sent: Friday, 15 July 2016 12:56 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech 
world at only 22

Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message 
since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.

Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning 
facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to 
pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.  
Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to be 
much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then maybe 
start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way to get 
your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If it's not, 
it will still help you come up with some better options for yourself than what 
you currently have.
Cheers,
Donna

On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados 
> wrote:

I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on the 
surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a group 
home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like group 
home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?


On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater 
> wrote:

I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. I 
guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle class 
home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the blind, where 
teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t know what to do, 
exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to the adult learning 
facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more than I did when I left 
ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just aren’t all that organized, at 
least here in the state of football and rednecks. I just hope that I can get at 
least something to happen before my family decides a group home would indeed be 
just the spot to plop down their poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn 
independence and advocacy skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends 
him. Oh discordia.
Sent from my Mac.

Devin Prater
d.pra...@me.com



On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Katie,

Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  It's 
a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
Cheers,
Donna

On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow 
> wrote:

Hi, Donna.

Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just connect 
a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing is 
successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my iphone and 
the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to constantly use 
dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the device with a USB cable 
too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. The only problem I have 
sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried opening a couple files with 
the USB stick connected to the device. They were in .docx format, an every time 
I’d press the navistick to open the file, I would get a warning that said the 
file could not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest 
display I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote 
MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll 
be getting some more training again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully 
I can find out why the documents were not opening from my flash drive.

Katie


On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Katie,

Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how bulky 
things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  The thing 
was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large briefcase, just to 
carry around my PC laptop and my 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi David,

 Good luck with the new business.
 If you need staff let me know, I'm looking to get out of what I'm currently 
doing.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of David Chittenden
Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 10:34 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a new 
business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be ready to 
capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with the next 
business.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
> comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
>I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for a 
> while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out front 
> and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  This worked 
> for several years although there were reporters and other people very 
> interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time who made it 
> challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these people close if I was 
> able to maintain control and final approval whether something would be 
> released and I had a marketing person for a while who I made review 
> everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember meeting a fellow 
> business owner later in the history of that company who convinced me to 
> completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid try to convince me to 
> use my image in marketing campaigns which I never went that far but I 
> definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that person got through to me.
>Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
> submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the box 
> and start loading from tape.
> 
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My brother, 
>> who is two years older, is also blind.
>> 
>> We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording school 
>> for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 6th grade. 
>> The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as braille, quite 
>> well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get a healthy dose of 
>> normal (sighted) culture.
>> 
>> I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I was 
>> able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. Resource 
>> teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was pretty much 
>> on my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 9th grade. Note: 
>> I was registered in the nearby public highschool, so was able to see a 
>> resource teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four days per week. That 
>> person did the important braille transcription for tests. At school, 
>> however, everything was my responsibility.
>> 
>> I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so much 
>> that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted one 
>> semester at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 weeks. I 
>> then floundered at a community college for a few years, became a massage 
>> therapist, became a technology salesperson, became an accessibility 
>> interface evaluater and an accessibility advocate, failed a couple 
>> businesses, then returned to university for a bachelors in business admin 
>> management followed by a masters in counseling. After I completed 
>> university, I independently immigrated to New Zealand. I currently work as 
>> the mental health specialist at a small doctor's clinic.
>> 
>> I started technology working on a PDP1170 mainframe. My first personal 
>> system was a Blazie Braille 'n Speak 640 which I used to access local BBSs. 
>> I then went to DOS, followed by Windows. I switched to the Mac with OSX 
>> Mountain Lion. I wanted to support the only mainstream company that was 
>> actively fully working toward blindness accessibility.
>> 
>> I am now dabbling with Android as well as iOS. Because Android gives more 
>> control to the end user, I suspect it will eventually supercede Apple, so I 
>> am working with it. I remember Beta vs VHS. Sony owned both, Beta was 
>> better, so Sony licensed out VHS. Many more people worked with VHS, so it 
>> eventually surpassed Beta.
>> 
>> Personally, I much prefer Apple's stance on privacy and security. Kids, on 
>> the other hand, are so inundated with open social media, that they, for the 
>> most part, do not appear to have the same concerns. 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Interesting,

I think it really comes down to 2 main things here in nz at least,


1.   Blind persons attitude towards finding a job and hopefully bettering 
their lifestyle.

2.   The attitude of the employer and their willingness to give people a 
chance.
Part of it will also have to do with the age of the blind community in NZ

You might have beeter thoughts on this than I. From: 
macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On 
Behalf Of David Chittenden
Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 10:22 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Unfortunately, I was unable to locate any credible stats for NZ. That said, a 
person at Blind Foundation agreed that employment seems to be better from what 
they see.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

On 13 Jul 2016, at 21:28, Simon Fogarty 
> wrote:
David,

Now that your living in the land of the long white cloud,

How do you think those stats stand up against kiwi stats relating to blind / 
visually impaired getting jobs?

Cheers,


Simon f


From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
Sent: Tuesday, 12 July 2016 9:24 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Actually, those stats are from a study which is about 18 years old. Even worse, 
however, is the stats about unemployment of the blind. Those stats, often sited 
in studies across the board, come from a study published in 1995 or 1997 (I 
would need to look it up again for the exact date). The most recent info I have 
seen was published by the state of Oregon in 2007 (if memory serves) which 
places blindness unemployment rate at around 60%, not the often sited 70% to 
80%. Note: I researched this in 2012, so am unaware of any data published since 
then.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: nexu...@icloud.com
Mobile: 0450 788 988
Sent from my iPhone



David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone
On 12 Jul 2016, at 08:30, 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
> wrote:
Interesting stats they mention about correlation between braille literacy and 
employment. I just had an iOS developer reach out to me who said WWDC had a 
heavy emphasis on accessibility this year. I've never been so I can't compare. 
I hope that's true. Nothing but good can come from more developers become aware 
and care.

CB
On 7/11/16 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything about 
braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
accessibility.
http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations.

She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her grandfather 
could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide his wedding ring 
along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had a slim chance of 
survival.

It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first time 
she shattered them.

Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. But 
throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations of people 
with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and insatiably 
curious.

It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was the 
desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school.
"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."

She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her to 
figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.

"I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks I 
wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing features 
like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with my knowledge 
of computers and technology, I could help change the world for people with 
disabilities.

"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."

Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation

There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace initiatives — 
the need to include the perspectives of people with disabilities.

Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Hey Tim,

You may not have schools for the blind, but dude you guys  have great ski 
fields  in BC.


From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Tim Kilburn
Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 5:42 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Hi Scott,

I guess us Canadians are fairly progressive :).  Actually, it seems to just 
take the right leadership willing to give it a try.  When I first interviewed  
over 28 years ago for the School District I currently work for, the Assistant 
Superintendent interviewed me.  My blindness didn't seem to phase him at all, 
and he went back to the Superintendent and recommended to hire me to teach Math 
and Computer Science in our schools.  We do not have any "Schools for the 
blind" out here in the west, so my upbringing and subsequent classroom teaching 
experience was all in mainstream schools.  Yes, it took some "I'll show you" 
attitude sometimes, but that only works with open minded people in the first 
place.  Positive attitudes and perseverance go a long way and help to make 
in-roads for better acceptance and openness in the future for persons with 
various disabilities or challenges.

Oh well, enough spouting off from me for now.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Jul 13, 2016, at 23:06, Scott Granados 
> wrote:

Hi Dona, I always learn something new from these discussions and have my 
horizons widened.  On another list I learned of a low vision registered nurse 
which surprised me as well as engine rebuilders and furniture builders.

The only blind person I’ve ever ran in to in a professional setting randomly 
was in Canada.  The curator of the Alexander Graham Bell museum was blind and 
gave me quite a tour.  Got to touch a lot of the old phone equipment which for 
me was so cool since it’s the foundation of everything I work in today.  I 
haven’t met any other blind people other than on lists in customer facing 
positions.  I did see several going to work though when I worked out west.

I find myself as guilty of being surprised when someone has a job I don’t 
understand how they do and being surprised which in the same breath makes me 
even more guilty for reacting like a sited person that way.  So I like having 
my viewpoints expanded by these type of conversations on list because I think 
they help me be more open minded in life.


On Jul 12, 2016, at 11:00 PM, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Tim,

I agree.  I think it's really fun and interesting getting to know a bit about 
list members' history and early computer experiences.
Cheers,
Donna


On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:28 AM, Tim Kilburn 
> wrote:

Hi,

I love reading this personal historical info on folks.  Sure, off topic, but 
totally acceptable in my world.  The common thread here is supportive and 
progressive parents and teachers.  I really didn't use Braille until my late 
teens, probably due to having some usable sight and an immature desire to not 
be considered blind.  Consequently, my Braille is limited to Grade 1, and 
primarily only used to cheat, oops, I mean play cards with others.  I was a 
classroom teacher for about 25 years then moved into Admin as a Technology 
Consultant and Project Manager for a new Science & Tech Centre in our School 
District.  Probably 95% of my computer experience has been with Apple products 
with a smattering of Digital Equipment Main Frames and Windows.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Jul 12, 2016, at 07:53, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Anne,

That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I was 
a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the slow 
speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have been 
different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read fiction, 
which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had I had a need 
to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also been a little 
older--I would have been more driven to stick with it.

It's funny, I still have my Optacon.  It's just sitting in our basement 
gathering dust.  I probably should do something with it some day.
Cheers,
Donna
On Jul 12, 2016, at 1:19 AM, Anne Robertson 
> wrote:

I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for the 
blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which didn’t 
interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
programming.
The tool that allowed me to work on an equal 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Dear I say it but graphics design tend to use macs,
With the swift playground software development might come in to its own on the 
IOS platform.



From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 5:30 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Maurice, don’t let the rehab folks steer you wrong.  Mac skills are very 
valuable in the work place.  Many companies are going all Mac.  I worked for 
Thomson International for a while and they switched out 60,000 Dells with Macs, 
most investment firms are Mac, Juniper was all Mac, Trip Advisor all Mac, are 
you seeing a trend here?  Many companies, especially technology companies are 
using the Mac heavily.  There’s a lot of windows out there but remember, your 
Mac runs both so as you said fire up what you need at the time.  Just don’t be 
steered in to windows only, that’s becoming less and less common every day.  
Sounds like a rehab department paid off by FS to me.

On Jul 12, 2016, at 6:52 PM, maurice.mines 
> wrote:

Good afternoon, I figured I’d chime in on this thread, my computing life 
somewhat goes like this Windows for a great number of years, then I wind up 
going to grad school and switching completely to the Mac, now rehab tells me 
that in order to get any type of employment I must use Windows, instead of a 
Mac. In truth I’m quite comfortable with both operating systems. However I 
spend most of my time on the Mac side of the house, because the dictation 
software that I’m using to write this response is on the Mac side, however some 
of the applications such as a specialized application that I use for amateur 
radio stuff is on the Windows side only, and some of the wordprocessing things 
that I have to do in office are primarily on the Windows side. I guess what I’m 
getting at here is that I use whatever operating system, and applications best 
gets a particular task done. I’m not a programmer, but I’ve got this idea for 
an application in my head and in my spare time I’m trying to figure out the 
best way to maybe one day in the distant future make it into a reality. That 
will just have to come later. As far is the discussion about using braille, 
these days I’m very definitely deaf blind so you can guess that braille is a 
very large part of my computing experience due to the fact that if there’s 
something, that I just can’t hear, I have to be able to read it and not rely on 
synthetic speech. And these days I like to have my braille by a Bluetooth, 
fewer cables connecting our devices I think is a good thing from an overall 
safety standpoint however the hassles and using Bluetooth, or whatever short 
range communications method may come in the future it is likely to outweigh the 
issues of not having a physical cable between the devices. Just my thoughts on 
this. On July like afternoon in the Pacific Northwest part of the United States.

Sincerely Maurice mines.
Message number, 360-524-9331.
Amateur radio call sign, kd0iko.
note that the text of my comments have been dictated to the computer by using 
Dragon version 5 for Mac OS, if there are errors in the text of my comments 
they may be the result of either the software or the dictation process. If 
there’s something that you truly didn’t understand please let me know, I will 
do my very best to clear up any misunderstandings.
On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:28 AM, Tim Kilburn 
> wrote:

Hi,

I love reading this personal historical info on folks.  Sure, off topic, but 
totally acceptable in my world.  The common thread here is supportive and 
progressive parents and teachers.  I really didn't use Braille until my late 
teens, probably due to having some usable sight and an immature desire to not 
be considered blind.  Consequently, my Braille is limited to Grade 1, and 
primarily only used to cheat, oops, I mean play cards with others.  I was a 
classroom teacher for about 25 years then moved into Admin as a Technology 
Consultant and Project Manager for a new Science & Tech Centre in our School 
District.  Probably 95% of my computer experience has been with Apple products 
with a smattering of Digital Equipment Main Frames and Windows.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Jul 12, 2016, at 07:53, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Anne,

That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I was 
a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the slow 
speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have been 
different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read fiction, 
which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had I had a need 
to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

It’s great to hear different peoples life experiences

I seem to be one of few that come from a sighted background and have had to 
learn life again from a different angle

But what I have learnt from my experiences is that  it doesn’t matter what you 
do or try  there is always someone out there that can only see you as a 
disabled person rather than as an able bodied person with an impairment.

Since losing my sight I have started snowboarding,
I kept skiing after sight loss,
I studied and obtained my degree in IT, I have 75% of a physical education 
degree

I’ve canoe’dthe length of new zealands second longest river as the only 
blind person of a group of 10 students.
That was just under 400Kelometers

I think people need to have the guts to tell both themselves and others that 
they can do anything until they find something that they cant do.

Give anything and everything possible ago.
I’m currently trying to talk a family friend in to teaching me to fly a 
helicopter,  but he’s got some issue with being or should that be not being 
able to see the instriments

Either way I am keen to give it a try.



From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 5:07 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Hi Dona, I always learn something new from these discussions and have my 
horizons widened.  On another list I learned of a low vision registered nurse 
which surprised me as well as engine rebuilders and furniture builders.

The only blind person I’ve ever ran in to in a professional setting randomly 
was in Canada.  The curator of the Alexander Graham Bell museum was blind and 
gave me quite a tour.  Got to touch a lot of the old phone equipment which for 
me was so cool since it’s the foundation of everything I work in today.  I 
haven’t met any other blind people other than on lists in customer facing 
positions.  I did see several going to work though when I worked out west.

I find myself as guilty of being surprised when someone has a job I don’t 
understand how they do and being surprised which in the same breath makes me 
even more guilty for reacting like a sited person that way.  So I like having 
my viewpoints expanded by these type of conversations on list because I think 
they help me be more open minded in life.


On Jul 12, 2016, at 11:00 PM, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Tim,

I agree.  I think it's really fun and interesting getting to know a bit about 
list members' history and early computer experiences.
Cheers,
Donna


On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:28 AM, Tim Kilburn 
> wrote:

Hi,

I love reading this personal historical info on folks.  Sure, off topic, but 
totally acceptable in my world.  The common thread here is supportive and 
progressive parents and teachers.  I really didn't use Braille until my late 
teens, probably due to having some usable sight and an immature desire to not 
be considered blind.  Consequently, my Braille is limited to Grade 1, and 
primarily only used to cheat, oops, I mean play cards with others.  I was a 
classroom teacher for about 25 years then moved into Admin as a Technology 
Consultant and Project Manager for a new Science & Tech Centre in our School 
District.  Probably 95% of my computer experience has been with Apple products 
with a smattering of Digital Equipment Main Frames and Windows.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Jul 12, 2016, at 07:53, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Anne,

That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I was 
a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the slow 
speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have been 
different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read fiction, 
which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had I had a need 
to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also been a little 
older--I would have been more driven to stick with it.

It's funny, I still have my Optacon.  It's just sitting in our basement 
gathering dust.  I probably should do something with it some day.
Cheers,
Donna
On Jul 12, 2016, at 1:19 AM, Anne Robertson 
> wrote:

I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for the 
blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which didn’t 
interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
programming.
The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted colleagues 
was the optacon. I was able to read the 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

In the US, it is necessary to either graduate from high school, or pass the 
GED, Graduate Equivalency Deploma, a series of exams that one completes to 
prove that one is college (higher edudation) ready. If one did not earn high 
enough grades in high school, the only path into university is to attend a 2 
year community college (PolyTech in NZ), and earn a minimum GPA. I believe it 
is a B- for many universities.

Kind regards,

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 15 Jul 2016, at 19:59, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Devin,
>  
> I don’t know the situation with colleges in the USA but if you have the will 
> then there will be a way,
>  If you wished to study at college and showed you could work at it surely it 
> must be possible
>  
> Good luck
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Devin Prater
> Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 8:56 AM
> To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
> Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 
> 22
>  
> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. 
> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle 
> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the 
> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t 
> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to 
> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more 
> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just 
> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and 
> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my 
> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their 
> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy skills 
> no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
> Sent from my Mac.
>  
> Devin Prater
> d.pra...@me.com
>  
>  
>  
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>  
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  
> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> Hi, Donna.
> 
> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing 
> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my 
> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to 
> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the device 
> with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. The only 
> problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried opening a 
> couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. They were in .docx 
> format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open the file, I would get a 
> warning that said the file could not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the 
> lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 
> 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used 
> with braille displays. I’ll be getting some more training again with the VU 
> in a couple days, so hopefully I can find out why the documents were not 
> opening from my flash drive.
> 
> Katie
> 
> 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
> bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  The 
> thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large briefcase, 
> just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of course, all 
> the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that with now carrying 
> around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option of pairing the VU 
> with the iPhone, the difference between then and now is really striking.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
> 
> Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, even 
> before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is somewhat 
> similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I started 
> using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more of a 
> computer 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

I’d like to talk to her now, she sounds like a pretty smart lady.


From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Katie Zodrow
Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 9:51 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Cc: Katie Zodrow 
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

That’s cool you talked with Jordyn before she joined Apple. I knew there were 
probably some blind people working at Apple with Voiceover. It was interesting 
to read about her experience in that article. Yeah, she sounds pretty cool.
Katie
On Jul 13, 2016, at 1:55 PM, Devin Prater 
> wrote:

I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. I 
guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle class 
home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the blind, where 
teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t know what to do, 
exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to the adult learning 
facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more than I did when I left 
ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just aren’t all that organized, at 
least here in the state of football and rednecks. I just hope that I can get at 
least something to happen before my family decides a group home would indeed be 
just the spot to plop down their poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn 
independence and advocacy skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends 
him. Oh discordia.
Sent from my Mac.

Devin Prater
d.pra...@me.com



On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Katie,

Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  It's 
a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
Cheers,
Donna

On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow 
> wrote:

Hi, Donna.

Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just connect 
a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing is 
successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my iphone and 
the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to constantly use 
dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the device with a USB cable 
too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. The only problem I have 
sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried opening a couple files with 
the USB stick connected to the device. They were in .docx format, an every time 
I’d press the navistick to open the file, I would get a warning that said the 
file could not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest 
display I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote 
MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll 
be getting some more training again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully 
I can find out why the documents were not opening from my flash drive.

Katie


On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Katie,

Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how bulky 
things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  The thing 
was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large briefcase, just to 
carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of course, all the 
accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that with now carrying 
around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option of pairing the VU with 
the iPhone, the difference between then and now is really striking.
Cheers,
Donna

On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow 
> wrote:

Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.

Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, even 
before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is somewhat 
similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I started using 
computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more of a computer and 
tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer often at home and at work.

I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 months 
premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the Chicago 
suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that area for 18 
years until I was 20. My family has always been very encouraging and 
supportive. They wanted to give 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Devin,

I don’t know the situation with colleges in the USA but if you have the will 
then there will be a way,
 If you wished to study at college and showed you could work at it surely it 
must be possible

Good luck
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Devin Prater
Sent: Thursday, 14 July 2016 8:56 AM
To: 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. I 
guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle class 
home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the blind, where 
teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t know what to do, 
exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to the adult learning 
facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more than I did when I left 
ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just aren’t all that organized, at 
least here in the state of football and rednecks. I just hope that I can get at 
least something to happen before my family decides a group home would indeed be 
just the spot to plop down their poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn 
independence and advocacy skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends 
him. Oh discordia.
Sent from my Mac.

Devin Prater
d.pra...@me.com



On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Katie,

Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  It's 
a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
Cheers,
Donna

On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow 
> wrote:

Hi, Donna.

Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just connect 
a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing is 
successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my iphone and 
the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to constantly use 
dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the device with a USB cable 
too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. The only problem I have 
sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried opening a couple files with 
the USB stick connected to the device. They were in .docx format, an every time 
I’d press the navistick to open the file, I would get a warning that said the 
file could not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest 
display I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote 
MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll 
be getting some more training again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully 
I can find out why the documents were not opening from my flash drive.

Katie


On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hi Katie,

Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how bulky 
things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  The thing 
was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large briefcase, just to 
carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of course, all the 
accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that with now carrying 
around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option of pairing the VU with 
the iPhone, the difference between then and now is really striking.
Cheers,
Donna

On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow 
> wrote:

Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.

Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, even 
before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is somewhat 
similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I started using 
computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more of a computer and 
tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer often at home and at work.

I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 months 
premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the Chicago 
suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that area for 18 
years until I was 20. My family has always been very encouraging and 
supportive. They wanted to give me the best education possible, so I was 
mainstreamed in public schools from age 3 to high school. The elementary school 
I attended was a few miles away in another city from where we 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

It is an expansion of my current business. I am now contracted to do some 
government work with those who are disabled. However, it lines me up for 
something which will be coming up in a couple years around technology and 
accessibility.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 15 Jul 2016, at 00:59, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a 
>> new business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be ready 
>> to capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with the next 
>> business.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
>>> comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
>>>  I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for a 
>>> while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out front 
>>> and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  This 
>>> worked for several years although there were reporters and other people 
>>> very interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time who made 
>>> it challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these people close if 
>>> I was able to maintain control and final approval whether something would 
>>> be released and I had a marketing person for a while who I made review 
>>> everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember meeting a fellow 
>>> business owner later in the history of that company who convinced me to 
>>> completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid try to convince me 
>>> to use my image in marketing campaigns which I never went that far but I 
>>> definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that person got through to 
>>> me.
>>>  Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
>>> submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the 
>>> box and start loading from tape.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  
 wrote:
 
 I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My brother, 
 who is two years older, is also blind.
 
 We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording 
 school for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 
 6th grade. The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as 
 braille, quite well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get a 
 healthy dose of normal (sighted) culture.
 
 I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I was 
 able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. Resource 
 teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was pretty much 
 on my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 9th grade. 
 Note: I was registered in the nearby public highschool, so was able to see 
 a resource teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four days per week. That 
 person did the important braille transcription for tests. At school, 
 however, everything was my responsibility.
 
 I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so 
 much that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted one 
 semester at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 weeks. I 
 then floundered at a community college for a few years, became a massage 
 therapist, became a technology salesperson, became an accessibility 
 interface evaluater and an accessibility advocate, failed a couple 
 businesses, then returned to university for a bachelors in business admin 
 management followed by a masters in counseling. After I completed 
 university, I independently immigrated to New Zealand. I currently work as 
 the mental health specialist at a small doctor's clinic.
 
 I started technology working on a PDP1170 mainframe. My first personal 
 system was a Blazie Braille 'n Speak 640 which I used to access local 
 BBSs. I then went to DOS, followed by Windows. I switched to the Mac with 
 OSX Mountain Lion. I wanted to support the only mainstream company that 
 was actively fully working toward blindness accessibility.
 
 I am now dabbling with Android as well as iOS. Because Android gives more 
 control to the end user, I suspect it will eventually supercede Apple, so 
 I am working with it. I remember Beta vs VHS. Sony owned both, Beta was 
 better, so 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Hi, Katie,

I'm so glad you got it sorted out!  That's one thing about the VU that is both 
good and bad, a reboot or reload of a file can fix many evils. :)  It's good 
because it's an easy fix, and bad, because sometimes that's what you have to do.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Jul 14, 2016, at 7:03 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> Hi, Donna. I worked with my trainer on the VarioUltra this morning. I told 
> him the problem I had with opening documents from my flash drive. I deleted 
> the file last night from the drive and then pasted it back on the drive from 
> Dropbox this morning. I connected the USB stick and tried opening the file 
> again. Good news, it worked without any problem! I'm not sure why it didn't 
> work before, but I'm glad I can open .docx files ok now.
> Katie
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:38 AM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Katie,
>> 
>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
>> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  
>> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi, Donna.
>>> 
>>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) 
>>> its the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
>>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the 
>>> pairing is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with 
>>> just my iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always 
>>> need to constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge 
>>> the device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt 
>>> charger. The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, 
>>> I tried opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. 
>>> They were in .docx format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open 
>>> the file, I would get a warning that said the file could not be opened. 
>>> Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen 
>>> compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were 
>>> the 2 previous notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll be getting 
>>> some more training again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully I can 
>>> find out why the documents were not opening from my flash drive.
 Katie
>>> 
 On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
 
 Hi Katie,
 
 Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
 bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  
 The thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large 
 briefcase, just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and 
 of course, all the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that 
 with now carrying around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option 
 of pairing the VU with the iPhone, the difference between then and now is 
 really striking.
 Cheers,
 Donna
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
> 
> Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, 
> even before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is 
> somewhat similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I 
> started using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more 
> of a computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer 
> often at home and at work.
> 
> I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
> youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 
> months premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the 
> Chicago suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that 
> area for 18 years until I was 20. My family has always been very 
> encouraging and supportive. They wanted to give me the best education 
> possible, so I was mainstreamed in public schools from age 3 to high 
> school. The elementary school I attended was a few miles away in another 
> city from where we lived, but they had a great Special Ed program with a 
> resource room for all the kids with blindness and other disabilities. I 
> would go there if I wasn’t with the regular classroom teacher during part 
> of the day like for Reading or Math. The vision teacher in my resource 
> room and the rest of the staff at the school were all great! Besides my 
> parents helping me learn and encouraging me to be independent, The school 
> 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Katie Zodrow]

Hi, Donna. I worked with my trainer on the VarioUltra this morning. I told him 
the problem I had with opening documents from my flash drive. I deleted the 
file last night from the drive and then pasted it back on the drive from 
Dropbox this morning. I connected the USB stick and tried opening the file 
again. Good news, it worked without any problem! I'm not sure why it didn't 
work before, but I'm glad I can open .docx files ok now.
Katie
Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:38 AM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  
> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, Donna.
>> 
>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
>> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing 
>> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my 
>> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to 
>> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the 
>> device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. 
>> The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried 
>> opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. They were 
>> in .docx format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open the file, I 
>> would get a warning that said the file could not be opened. Really strange. 
>> The VU is the lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen compared to my 
>> old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were the 2 previous 
>> notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll be getting some more training 
>> again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully I can find out why the 
>> documents were not opening from my flash drive.
>>> Katie
>> 
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Katie,
>>> 
>>> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
>>> bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  
>>> The thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large 
>>> briefcase, just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of 
>>> course, all the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that 
>>> with now carrying around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option 
>>> of pairing the VU with the iPhone, the difference between then and now is 
>>> really striking.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
 On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
 
 Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
 
 Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, 
 even before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is 
 somewhat similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I 
 started using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more 
 of a computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer 
 often at home and at work.
 
 I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
 youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 
 months premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the 
 Chicago suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that 
 area for 18 years until I was 20. My family has always been very 
 encouraging and supportive. They wanted to give me the best education 
 possible, so I was mainstreamed in public schools from age 3 to high 
 school. The elementary school I attended was a few miles away in another 
 city from where we lived, but they had a great Special Ed program with a 
 resource room for all the kids with blindness and other disabilities. I 
 would go there if I wasn’t with the regular classroom teacher during part 
 of the day like for Reading or Math. The vision teacher in my resource 
 room and the rest of the staff at the school were all great! Besides my 
 parents helping me learn and encouraging me to be independent, The school 
 provided all the extra services I needed back then like reading Braille, O 
 and M skills, and basic daily living skills. I still use braille often, 
 and that skill along with the others are very important for employment and 
 being independent. In middle and high school, I worked with an itinerant 
 teacher for an hour and was in regular classes with the sighted students 
 the rest of the day.
 
 

Re: To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Devin Prater]

Sorry y’all, I’ve not checked my email sense early last night. After graduating 
the Alabama school for the blind, I was sent there. I needed independent living 
training, and some mobility instruction, as there was only one mobility 
instructor at the school for the blind, at least for most of my days there.
Sent from my Mac.

Devin Prater
d.pra...@me.com



> On Jul 14, 2016, at 7:56 AM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message 
> since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.
> 
> Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning 
> facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to 
> pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.  
> Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to be 
> much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then maybe 
> start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way to get 
> your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If it's not, 
> it will still help you come up with some better options for yourself than 
> what you currently have.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados > > wrote:
>> 
>> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on 
>> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a 
>> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like 
>> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>>  
>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty 
>>> cool. I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a 
>>> lower-middle class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama 
>>> school for the blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do 
>>> much, or didn’t know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then 
>>> shuttled me off to the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend 
>>> now. I know more than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness 
>>> organizations just aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of 
>>> football and rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to 
>>> happen before my family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot 
>>> to plop down their poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn 
>>> independence and advocacy skills no matter where the Alabama Institute 
>>> sends him. Oh discordia.
>>> Sent from my Mac.
>>> 
>>> Devin Prater
>>> d.pra...@me.com 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin > wrote:
 
 Hi Katie,
 
 Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
 display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't 
 help you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra 
 list?  It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
 Cheers,
 Donna
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow  > wrote:
> 
> Hi, Donna.
> 
> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) 
> its the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can 
> just connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the 
> pairing is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with 
> just my iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always 
> need to constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just 
> charge the device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 
> volt charger. The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. 
> Yesterday, I tried opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to 
> the device. They were in .docx format, an every time I’d press the 
> navistick to open the file, I would get a warning that said the file 
> could not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest 
> display I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the 
> BrailleNote MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used with 
> braille displays. I’ll be getting some more training again with the VU in 
> a couple days, so hopefully I can find out why the documents were not 
> opening from my flash drive.
>> Katie
> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Katie,
>> 
>> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
>> bulky things 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

That's exciting, David.  What is your new business?
Cheers,
Donna
> On Jul 14, 2016, at 5:34 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a new 
> business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be ready to 
> capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with the next 
> business.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
>> comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
>>   I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for a 
>> while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out front 
>> and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  This worked 
>> for several years although there were reporters and other people very 
>> interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time who made it 
>> challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these people close if I 
>> was able to maintain control and final approval whether something would be 
>> released and I had a marketing person for a while who I made review 
>> everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember meeting a fellow 
>> business owner later in the history of that company who convinced me to 
>> completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid try to convince me 
>> to use my image in marketing campaigns which I never went that far but I 
>> definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that person got through to 
>> me.
>>   Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
>> submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the 
>> box and start loading from tape.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My brother, 
>>> who is two years older, is also blind.
>>> 
>>> We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording school 
>>> for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 6th 
>>> grade. The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as braille, 
>>> quite well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get a healthy 
>>> dose of normal (sighted) culture.
>>> 
>>> I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I was 
>>> able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. Resource 
>>> teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was pretty much 
>>> on my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 9th grade. 
>>> Note: I was registered in the nearby public highschool, so was able to see 
>>> a resource teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four days per week. That 
>>> person did the important braille transcription for tests. At school, 
>>> however, everything was my responsibility.
>>> 
>>> I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so much 
>>> that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted one 
>>> semester at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 weeks. I 
>>> then floundered at a community college for a few years, became a massage 
>>> therapist, became a technology salesperson, became an accessibility 
>>> interface evaluater and an accessibility advocate, failed a couple 
>>> businesses, then returned to university for a bachelors in business admin 
>>> management followed by a masters in counseling. After I completed 
>>> university, I independently immigrated to New Zealand. I currently work as 
>>> the mental health specialist at a small doctor's clinic.
>>> 
>>> I started technology working on a PDP1170 mainframe. My first personal 
>>> system was a Blazie Braille 'n Speak 640 which I used to access local BBSs. 
>>> I then went to DOS, followed by Windows. I switched to the Mac with OSX 
>>> Mountain Lion. I wanted to support the only mainstream company that was 
>>> actively fully working toward blindness accessibility.
>>> 
>>> I am now dabbling with Android as well as iOS. Because Android gives more 
>>> control to the end user, I suspect it will eventually supercede Apple, so I 
>>> am working with it. I remember Beta vs VHS. Sony owned both, Beta was 
>>> better, so Sony licensed out VHS. Many more people worked with VHS, so it 
>>> eventually surpassed Beta.
>>> 
>>> Personally, I much prefer Apple's stance on privacy and security. Kids, on 
>>> the other hand, are so inundated with open social media, that they, for the 
>>> most part, do not appear to have the same concerns. Oh well, time will tell 
>>> where things actually end up going. I will enjoy the ride while I am able, 
>>> and keep playing with these wonderfully more and more accessible toys.

To Devon, (was This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Thank you, Scott.  I've been thinking about how to respond to this message 
since last night.  You hit the nail on the head.

Devon, no, I can't imagine why on earth you would be at an adult learning 
facility.  Do you have any ideas about what kind of career you might like to 
pursue?  I would suggest a visit to a community college as a starting point.  
Meet with a career counselor there, a regular career counselor is going to be 
much more likely to help you generate a broader list of options. Then maybe 
start by taking a couple of classes there.  That would be a good way to get 
your feet wet and figure out if a four-year college is for you.  If it's not, 
it will still help you come up with some better options for yourself than what 
you currently have.
Cheers,
Donna

> On Jul 13, 2016, at 11:47 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on 
> the surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a 
> group home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like 
> group home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
>  
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater > > wrote:
>> 
>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. 
>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle 
>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the 
>> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t 
>> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to 
>> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more 
>> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just 
>> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and 
>> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my 
>> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their 
>> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy 
>> skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
>> Sent from my Mac.
>> 
>> Devin Prater
>> d.pra...@me.com 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Katie,
>>> 
>>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
>>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't 
>>> help you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra 
>>> list?  It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
 On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow > wrote:
 
 Hi, Donna.
 
 Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) 
 its the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
 connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the 
 pairing is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with 
 just my iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always 
 need to constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge 
 the device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt 
 charger. The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. 
 Yesterday, I tried opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to 
 the device. They were in .docx format, an every time I’d press the 
 navistick to open the file, I would get a warning that said the file could 
 not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest display 
 I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote 
 MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used with braille displays. 
 I’ll be getting some more training again with the VU in a couple days, so 
 hopefully I can find out why the documents were not opening from my flash 
 drive.
> Katie
 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin  > wrote:
> 
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
> bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  
> The thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large 
> briefcase, just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and 
> of course, all the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare 
> that with now carrying around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the 
> option of pairing the VU with the iPhone, the difference between then and 
> now is really striking.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

Well, I just signed a new contracting agreement, so I am about to start a new 
business. If I am correct, I will preceed an upcoming trend and be ready to 
capitalise on where things appear to be headed. Here we go with the next 
business.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:59, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
> comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
>I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had for a 
> while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out front 
> and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  This worked 
> for several years although there were reporters and other people very 
> interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time who made it 
> challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these people close if I was 
> able to maintain control and final approval whether something would be 
> released and I had a marketing person for a while who I made review 
> everything to make sure no hints leaked out.  I remember meeting a fellow 
> business owner later in the history of that company who convinced me to 
> completely drop that policy and had his marketing droid try to convince me to 
> use my image in marketing campaigns which I never went that far but I 
> definitely loosened things up.  I’m glad though that person got through to me.
>Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
> submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the box 
> and start loading from tape.
> 
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My brother, 
>> who is two years older, is also blind.
>> 
>> We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording school 
>> for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 6th grade. 
>> The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as braille, quite 
>> well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get a healthy dose of 
>> normal (sighted) culture.
>> 
>> I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I was 
>> able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. Resource 
>> teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was pretty much 
>> on my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 9th grade. Note: 
>> I was registered in the nearby public highschool, so was able to see a 
>> resource teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four days per week. That 
>> person did the important braille transcription for tests. At school, 
>> however, everything was my responsibility.
>> 
>> I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so much 
>> that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted one 
>> semester at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 weeks. I 
>> then floundered at a community college for a few years, became a massage 
>> therapist, became a technology salesperson, became an accessibility 
>> interface evaluater and an accessibility advocate, failed a couple 
>> businesses, then returned to university for a bachelors in business admin 
>> management followed by a masters in counseling. After I completed 
>> university, I independently immigrated to New Zealand. I currently work as 
>> the mental health specialist at a small doctor's clinic.
>> 
>> I started technology working on a PDP1170 mainframe. My first personal 
>> system was a Blazie Braille 'n Speak 640 which I used to access local BBSs. 
>> I then went to DOS, followed by Windows. I switched to the Mac with OSX 
>> Mountain Lion. I wanted to support the only mainstream company that was 
>> actively fully working toward blindness accessibility.
>> 
>> I am now dabbling with Android as well as iOS. Because Android gives more 
>> control to the end user, I suspect it will eventually supercede Apple, so I 
>> am working with it. I remember Beta vs VHS. Sony owned both, Beta was 
>> better, so Sony licensed out VHS. Many more people worked with VHS, so it 
>> eventually surpassed Beta.
>> 
>> Personally, I much prefer Apple's stance on privacy and security. Kids, on 
>> the other hand, are so inundated with open social media, that they, for the 
>> most part, do not appear to have the same concerns. Oh well, time will tell 
>> where things actually end up going. I will enjoy the ride while I am able, 
>> and keep playing with these wonderfully more and more accessible toys.
>> 
>> As a side note: now that it has been brought to my attention, I am noticing 
>> that, in this decidely unscientificly random sampling, it appears to be 
>> those who attended normal school who seem to have adapted better to life in 
>> the 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

Please note: we were seeking the most recent study, not older studies. All 
reports more recent than the 1995 (I believe) study cited that study as the 
source. That study was the most recent.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 14 Jul 2016, at 16:34, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Hi, I’ve heard that 70% number far before the 90S.  I absolutely trust 
> david’s statements and such but I think that idea has an even earlier 
> history.  I remember hearing it from my mother in the 80S when she would 
> attend some parents conferences.  Scared the heck out of my parents and they 
> put me to work as young as possible.  Were I sited I think they would have 
> done the same thing.  Many families, sited or blind, push their kids to work 
> early, especially if they have family businesses.
> 
> I wonder how far back this stat actually goes though and like you I hope it’s 
> 60 or lower today, the lower the better.
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 10:22 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, David. I’ve also heard the same statistic for a long time that 70 
>> percent  of blind people are unemployed. I didn’t realize the study was 
>> probably from the 1990’s. I hope that number has dropped since that time as 
>> well. 60 percent is a good improvement though.
>> Katie
>>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 7:34 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi David, you know, I’ve heard that 70% number for ever, even pre 1995.  I 
>>> hope you’re right though, I’d love to see that number drop meaningfully.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Jul 11, 2016, at 5:24 PM, David Chittenden  
 wrote:
 
 Actually, those stats are from a study which is about 18 years old. Even 
 worse, however, is the stats about unemployment of the blind. Those stats, 
 often sited in studies across the board, come from a study published in 
 1995 or 1997 (I would need to look it up again for the exact date). The 
 most recent info I have seen was published by the state of Oregon in 2007 
 (if memory serves) which places blindness unemployment rate at around 60%, 
 not the often sited 70% to 80%. Note: I researched this in 2012, so am 
 unaware of any data published since then.
 
 David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
 Email: nexu...@icloud.com
 Mobile: 0450 788 988
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 
 
 David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
 Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
 Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
 Sent from my iPhone
 On 12 Jul 2016, at 08:30, 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
  wrote:
 
> Interesting stats they mention about correlation between braille literacy 
> and employment. I just had an iOS developer reach out to me who said WWDC 
> had a heavy emphasis on accessibility this year. I've never been so I 
> can't compare. I hope that's true. Nothing but good can come from more 
> developers become aware and care.
> 
> CB
> 
>> On 7/11/16 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>> Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything 
>> about braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working 
>> on accessibility.
>> http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
>> 
>> This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
>> 
>> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations. 
>> 
>> She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her 
>> grandfather could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide 
>> his wedding ring along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she 
>> had a slim chance of survival.
>> 
>> It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the 
>> first time she shattered them.
>> 
>> Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early 
>> delivery. But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy 
>> expectations of people with disabilities, motivating her to be 
>> adventurous, hands-on and insatiably curious.
>> 
>> It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it 
>> was the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, 
>> or the classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school. 
>> 
>> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users." 
>> She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling 
>> her to figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
>> 
>> "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the 
>> tasks I wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on 
>> enhancing features like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to 
>> realize that with my 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

Unfortunately, I was unable to locate any credible stats for NZ. That said, a 
person at Blind Foundation agreed that employment seems to be better from what 
they see.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 13 Jul 2016, at 21:28, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> David,
>  
> Now that your living in the land of the long white cloud,
>  
> How do you think those stats stand up against kiwi stats relating to blind / 
> visually impaired getting jobs?
>  
> Cheers,
>  
>  
> Simon f
>  
>  
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Chittenden
> Sent: Tuesday, 12 July 2016 9:24 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 
> 22
>  
> Actually, those stats are from a study which is about 18 years old. Even 
> worse, however, is the stats about unemployment of the blind. Those stats, 
> often sited in studies across the board, come from a study published in 1995 
> or 1997 (I would need to look it up again for the exact date). The most 
> recent info I have seen was published by the state of Oregon in 2007 (if 
> memory serves) which places blindness unemployment rate at around 60%, not 
> the often sited 70% to 80%. Note: I researched this in 2012, so am unaware of 
> any data published since then.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: nexu...@icloud.com
> Mobile: 0450 788 988
> Sent from my iPhone
>  
> 
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> On 12 Jul 2016, at 08:30, 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Interesting stats they mention about correlation between braille literacy and 
> employment. I just had an iOS developer reach out to me who said WWDC had a 
> heavy emphasis on accessibility this year. I've never been so I can't 
> compare. I hope that's true. Nothing but good can come from more developers 
> become aware and care.
> 
> CB
> 
> On 7/11/16 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
> Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything about 
> braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
> accessibility.
> http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
> 
> This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
> 
> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations.
> 
> She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her grandfather 
> could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide his wedding ring 
> along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had a slim chance of 
> survival.
> 
> It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first 
> time she shattered them.
> 
> Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. 
> But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations of 
> people with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and 
> insatiably curious.
> 
> It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was 
> the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
> classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school.
> 
> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her to 
> figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
> 
> "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks I 
> wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing features 
> like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with my 
> knowledge of computers and technology, I could help change the world for 
> people with disabilities.
> 
> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> 
> Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation
> 
> There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace initiatives 
> — the need to include the perspectives of people with disabilities.
> 
> Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
> component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how much 
> that can strengthen a company.
> 
> She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
> introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
> gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — and 
> she was nervous.
> 
> "You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going to 
> know unless you talk to them ... so go."
> 
> <~WRD074.jpg>
> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a driving force 
> behind accessibility of Apple products, especially for blind users.
> 
> Image: Provided 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Tim Kilburn]

Hi Scott,

I guess us Canadians are fairly progressive :).  Actually, it seems to just 
take the right leadership willing to give it a try.  When I first interviewed  
over 28 years ago for the School District I currently work for, the Assistant 
Superintendent interviewed me.  My blindness didn't seem to phase him at all, 
and he went back to the Superintendent and recommended to hire me to teach Math 
and Computer Science in our schools.  We do not have any "Schools for the 
blind" out here in the west, so my upbringing and subsequent classroom teaching 
experience was all in mainstream schools.  Yes, it took some "I'll show you" 
attitude sometimes, but that only works with open minded people in the first 
place.  Positive attitudes and perseverance go a long way and help to make 
in-roads for better acceptance and openness in the future for persons with 
various disabilities or challenges.

Oh well, enough spouting off from me for now.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Jul 13, 2016, at 23:06, Scott Granados  wrote:

Hi Dona, I always learn something new from these discussions and have my 
horizons widened.  On another list I learned of a low vision registered nurse 
which surprised me as well as engine rebuilders and furniture builders.

The only blind person I’ve ever ran in to in a professional setting randomly 
was in Canada.  The curator of the Alexander Graham Bell museum was blind and 
gave me quite a tour.  Got to touch a lot of the old phone equipment which for 
me was so cool since it’s the foundation of everything I work in today.  I 
haven’t met any other blind people other than on lists in customer facing 
positions.  I did see several going to work though when I worked out west.

I find myself as guilty of being surprised when someone has a job I don’t 
understand how they do and being surprised which in the same breath makes me 
even more guilty for reacting like a sited person that way.  So I like having 
my viewpoints expanded by these type of conversations on list because I think 
they help me be more open minded in life.

 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 11:00 PM, Donna Goodin  > wrote:
> 
> Hi Tim,
> 
> I agree.  I think it's really fun and interesting getting to know a bit about 
> list members' history and early computer experiences.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:28 AM, Tim Kilburn > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I love reading this personal historical info on folks.  Sure, off topic, but 
>> totally acceptable in my world.  The common thread here is supportive and 
>> progressive parents and teachers.  I really didn't use Braille until my late 
>> teens, probably due to having some usable sight and an immature desire to 
>> not be considered blind.  Consequently, my Braille is limited to Grade 1, 
>> and primarily only used to cheat, oops, I mean play cards with others.  I 
>> was a classroom teacher for about 25 years then moved into Admin as a 
>> Technology Consultant and Project Manager for a new Science & Tech Centre in 
>> our School District.  Probably 95% of my computer experience has been with 
>> Apple products with a smattering of Digital Equipment Main Frames and 
>> Windows.
>> 
>> Later...
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 07:53, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Anne,
>> 
>> That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I 
>> was a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the 
>> slow speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have 
>> been different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read 
>> fiction, which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had 
>> I had a need to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also been 
>> a little older--I would have been more driven to stick with it.
>> 
>> It's funny, I still have my Optacon.  It's just sitting in our basement 
>> gathering dust.  I probably should do something with it some day.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 1:19 AM, Anne Robertson >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for 
>>> the blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which 
>>> didn’t interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
>>> I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
>>> languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
>>> programming.
>>> The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted 
>>> colleagues was the optacon. I was able to read the terminal screen and 
>>> printout. I programmed the Apple ii in hexadecimal and read all the manuals 
>>> using the optacon.
>>> I 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

Maurice, don’t let the rehab folks steer you wrong.  Mac skills are very 
valuable in the work place.  Many companies are going all Mac.  I worked for 
Thomson International for a while and they switched out 60,000 Dells with Macs, 
most investment firms are Mac, Juniper was all Mac, Trip Advisor all Mac, are 
you seeing a trend here?  Many companies, especially technology companies are 
using the Mac heavily.  There’s a lot of windows out there but remember, your 
Mac runs both so as you said fire up what you need at the time.  Just don’t be 
steered in to windows only, that’s becoming less and less common every day.  
Sounds like a rehab department paid off by FS to me.

> On Jul 12, 2016, at 6:52 PM, maurice.mines  wrote:
> 
> Good afternoon, I figured I’d chime in on this thread, my computing life 
> somewhat goes like this Windows for a great number of years, then I wind up 
> going to grad school and switching completely to the Mac, now rehab tells me 
> that in order to get any type of employment I must use Windows, instead of a 
> Mac. In truth I’m quite comfortable with both operating systems. However I 
> spend most of my time on the Mac side of the house, because the dictation 
> software that I’m using to write this response is on the Mac side, however 
> some of the applications such as a specialized application that I use for 
> amateur radio stuff is on the Windows side only, and some of the 
> wordprocessing things that I have to do in office are primarily on the 
> Windows side. I guess what I’m getting at here is that I use whatever 
> operating system, and applications best gets a particular task done. I’m not 
> a programmer, but I’ve got this idea for an application in my head and in my 
> spare time I’m trying to figure out the best way to maybe one day in the 
> distant future make it into a reality. That will just have to come later. As 
> far is the discussion about using braille, these days I’m very definitely 
> deaf blind so you can guess that braille is a very large part of my computing 
> experience due to the fact that if there’s something, that I just can’t hear, 
> I have to be able to read it and not rely on synthetic speech. And these days 
> I like to have my braille by a Bluetooth, fewer cables connecting our devices 
> I think is a good thing from an overall safety standpoint however the hassles 
> and using Bluetooth, or whatever short range communications method may come 
> in the future it is likely to outweigh the issues of not having a physical 
> cable between the devices. Just my thoughts on this. On July like afternoon 
> in the Pacific Northwest part of the United States.
> 
> Sincerely Maurice mines.
> Message number, 360-524-9331.
> Amateur radio call sign, kd0iko.
> note that the text of my comments have been dictated to the computer by using 
> Dragon version 5 for Mac OS, if there are errors in the text of my comments 
> they may be the result of either the software or the dictation process. If 
> there’s something that you truly didn’t understand please let me know, I will 
> do my very best to clear up any misunderstandings.
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:28 AM, Tim Kilburn > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I love reading this personal historical info on folks.  Sure, off topic, but 
>> totally acceptable in my world.  The common thread here is supportive and 
>> progressive parents and teachers.  I really didn't use Braille until my late 
>> teens, probably due to having some usable sight and an immature desire to 
>> not be considered blind.  Consequently, my Braille is limited to Grade 1, 
>> and primarily only used to cheat, oops, I mean play cards with others.  I 
>> was a classroom teacher for about 25 years then moved into Admin as a 
>> Technology Consultant and Project Manager for a new Science & Tech Centre in 
>> our School District.  Probably 95% of my computer experience has been with 
>> Apple products with a smattering of Digital Equipment Main Frames and 
>> Windows.
>> 
>> Later...
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 07:53, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Anne,
>> 
>> That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I 
>> was a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the 
>> slow speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have 
>> been different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read 
>> fiction, which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had 
>> I had a need to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also been 
>> a little older--I would have been more driven to stick with it.
>> 
>> It's funny, I still have my Optacon.  It's just sitting in our basement 
>> gathering dust.  I probably should do something with it some day.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 1:19 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

Whoa, now that’s interesting.

I worked in music production as well and boy do I wish I knew about outspoken 
then.

I always wanted to take that program at Berkeley School of Music but I was way 
to much of a slacker to get in to a good program like that haha.  I did however 
learn the Synclavier but I used more the keyboard interface and the discrete 
buttons on the front panel instead of the Mac 2FX computer it was integrated 
with.  I also used the Fairlight CMI heavily because it was so keyboard 
(alphanumeric keyboard) driven with very well laid out pages and command 
sequences easily referenced.  I worked for a time with the folks at Wave Frame 
and staged the hardware and shipped out the configuration for a former member 
of Genesis who I knew from my time on the Fairlight platform.  I didn’t get to 
go to London to Reel World unfortunately for the installation but I’d been 
there previously for a demonstration of a CMI III.

I also specialized in the SSL mixing console for another blast from the past.  
Boy I wish I still had one.  I used a 6000E and series G later. 

Wow the British and Australians made good gear.  That’s not to say the folks in 
White River Junction Vermont (later Lebanon New Hampshire) didn’t know what 
they were doing but I always found the synclavier more complicated to use than 
the CMI.

Are you still working in the music space? I envy you if you do.  I was always a 
much better technologist than music guy though.  I actually wish I had some 
level of skill other than getting the faders set right and the right push with 
the perimetric EQ but there you go. DBX compressor anyone?


> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
> 
> Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, even 
> before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is somewhat 
> similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I started 
> using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more of a 
> computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer often at 
> home and at work.
> 
> I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
> youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 months 
> premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the Chicago 
> suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that area for 18 
> years until I was 20. My family has always been very encouraging and 
> supportive. They wanted to give me the best education possible, so I was 
> mainstreamed in public schools from age 3 to high school. The elementary 
> school I attended was a few miles away in another city from where we lived, 
> but they had a great Special Ed program with a resource room for all the kids 
> with blindness and other disabilities. I would go there if I wasn’t with the 
> regular classroom teacher during part of the day like for Reading or Math. 
> The vision teacher in my resource room and the rest of the staff at the 
> school were all great! Besides my parents helping me learn and encouraging me 
> to be independent, The school provided all the extra services I needed back 
> then like reading Braille, O and M skills, and basic daily living skills. I 
> still use braille often, and that skill along with the others are very 
> important for employment and being independent. In middle and high school, I 
> worked with an itinerant teacher for an hour and was in regular classes with 
> the sighted students the rest of the day.
> 
> one of the first computers I used in elementary school was the Apple II E 
> with that robotic sounding Echo speech synthesizer. The Alex voice and 
> synthesized speech have come a long way since then!! :-) I remember when I 
> was about four and five years old and pressing different keys on the Apple 2 
> keyboard. I thought it was really cool how the Echo synthesizer would 
> pronounce everything, and that you could change the speech rate and pitch of 
> the voice. It would always sound really funny  talking in a really high or 
> low pitch!
> 
> When I was in first grade, my parents bought an Apple II GS computer. my 
> sister and I used to play a lot of games on it and some of them had speech 
> using the Echo synthesizer so I could play them myself. I remember using the 
> old word processing programs too like Braille Edit and another one called 
> ProWord ProBraille in middle and high school. Everything was all on 3.5 inch 
> floppy disc back then, or they were on those bigger 5 and 1/4 inch diskettes. 
> During most of my elementary school years, my mom worked at a high school in 
> a resource room. She worked as a teacher assistant to the main resource 
> teacher preparing materials in Braille for the blind and visually impaired 
> students. When she would put handouts and other information in Braille for me 
> or the high school 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

Hi Dona, I always learn something new from these discussions and have my 
horizons widened.  On another list I learned of a low vision registered nurse 
which surprised me as well as engine rebuilders and furniture builders.

The only blind person I’ve ever ran in to in a professional setting randomly 
was in Canada.  The curator of the Alexander Graham Bell museum was blind and 
gave me quite a tour.  Got to touch a lot of the old phone equipment which for 
me was so cool since it’s the foundation of everything I work in today.  I 
haven’t met any other blind people other than on lists in customer facing 
positions.  I did see several going to work though when I worked out west.

I find myself as guilty of being surprised when someone has a job I don’t 
understand how they do and being surprised which in the same breath makes me 
even more guilty for reacting like a sited person that way.  So I like having 
my viewpoints expanded by these type of conversations on list because I think 
they help me be more open minded in life.

 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 11:00 PM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Hi Tim,
> 
> I agree.  I think it's really fun and interesting getting to know a bit about 
> list members' history and early computer experiences.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:28 AM, Tim Kilburn > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I love reading this personal historical info on folks.  Sure, off topic, but 
>> totally acceptable in my world.  The common thread here is supportive and 
>> progressive parents and teachers.  I really didn't use Braille until my late 
>> teens, probably due to having some usable sight and an immature desire to 
>> not be considered blind.  Consequently, my Braille is limited to Grade 1, 
>> and primarily only used to cheat, oops, I mean play cards with others.  I 
>> was a classroom teacher for about 25 years then moved into Admin as a 
>> Technology Consultant and Project Manager for a new Science & Tech Centre in 
>> our School District.  Probably 95% of my computer experience has been with 
>> Apple products with a smattering of Digital Equipment Main Frames and 
>> Windows.
>> 
>> Later...
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 07:53, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Anne,
>> 
>> That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I 
>> was a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the 
>> slow speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have 
>> been different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read 
>> fiction, which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had 
>> I had a need to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also been 
>> a little older--I would have been more driven to stick with it.
>> 
>> It's funny, I still have my Optacon.  It's just sitting in our basement 
>> gathering dust.  I probably should do something with it some day.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 1:19 AM, Anne Robertson >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for 
>>> the blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which 
>>> didn’t interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
>>> I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
>>> languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
>>> programming.
>>> The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted 
>>> colleagues was the optacon. I was able to read the terminal screen and 
>>> printout. I programmed the Apple ii in hexadecimal and read all the manuals 
>>> using the optacon.
>>> I didn’t use speech on a computer until we got a Mac, a 2SI, during the 90s 
>>> and I purchased OutSpoken.
>>> It never occurred to me that I might not be able to get a job as a blind 
>>> person once the optacon became available to me.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> 
>>> Anne
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On 12 Jul 2016, at 05:15, Donna Goodin > wrote:
 
 Hey Scott,
 
 First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  
 But ...
 
 As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, 
 math and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my 
 dad was a computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me 
 how important tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of 
 him bringing home those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my 
 brother and me to play with.  I remember going with him into the office on 
 Saturdays and seeing the computer, which was this great big behemoth that 
 took up an entire room.  I 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

David, I like your history, not to point out a bad thing but I like your 
comments on failed businesses.  I’m right there with you.
I always hid my blindness when possible while doing business.  I had 
for a while, especially during my first attempt, sited folks that I put out 
front and I mainly dealt with people through telephones or email etc.  This 
worked for several years although there were reporters and other people very 
interested in my business (an internet provider) at the time who made it 
challenging to hide.  I would actually only allow these people close if I was 
able to maintain control and final approval whether something would be released 
and I had a marketing person for a while who I made review everything to make 
sure no hints leaked out.  I remember meeting a fellow business owner later in 
the history of that company who convinced me to completely drop that policy and 
had his marketing droid try to convince me to use my image in marketing 
campaigns which I never went that far but I definitely loosened things up.  I’m 
glad though that person got through to me.
Oh and I still have a PDP 11.:) Complete with the 8 dip switches and 
submit button so you can enter in the first few bytes by hand to boot the box 
and start loading from tape.


> On Jul 13, 2016, at 12:58 AM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My brother, 
> who is two years older, is also blind.
> 
> We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording school 
> for the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 6th grade. 
> The schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as braille, quite 
> well. Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get a healthy dose of 
> normal (sighted) culture.
> 
> I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I was 
> able to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. Resource 
> teachers were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was pretty much on 
> my own, in an academically challenging environment, from 9th grade. Note: I 
> was registered in the nearby public highschool, so was able to see a resource 
> teacher there for 45 minutes per day, four days per week. That person did the 
> important braille transcription for tests. At school, however, everything was 
> my responsibility.
> 
> I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so much 
> that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted one 
> semester at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 weeks. I 
> then floundered at a community college for a few years, became a massage 
> therapist, became a technology salesperson, became an accessibility interface 
> evaluater and an accessibility advocate, failed a couple businesses, then 
> returned to university for a bachelors in business admin management followed 
> by a masters in counseling. After I completed university, I independently 
> immigrated to New Zealand. I currently work as the mental health specialist 
> at a small doctor's clinic.
> 
> I started technology working on a PDP1170 mainframe. My first personal system 
> was a Blazie Braille 'n Speak 640 which I used to access local BBSs. I then 
> went to DOS, followed by Windows. I switched to the Mac with OSX Mountain 
> Lion. I wanted to support the only mainstream company that was actively fully 
> working toward blindness accessibility.
> 
> I am now dabbling with Android as well as iOS. Because Android gives more 
> control to the end user, I suspect it will eventually supercede Apple, so I 
> am working with it. I remember Beta vs VHS. Sony owned both, Beta was better, 
> so Sony licensed out VHS. Many more people worked with VHS, so it eventually 
> surpassed Beta.
> 
> Personally, I much prefer Apple's stance on privacy and security. Kids, on 
> the other hand, are so inundated with open social media, that they, for the 
> most part, do not appear to have the same concerns. Oh well, time will tell 
> where things actually end up going. I will enjoy the ride while I am able, 
> and keep playing with these wonderfully more and more accessible toys.
> 
> As a side note: now that it has been brought to my attention, I am noticing 
> that, in this decidely unscientificly random sampling, it appears to be those 
> who attended normal school who seem to have adapted better to life in the 
> sighted world. Well, at least, those who had annoying parents that pushed, 
> and at least one resource teacher who bucked the trend. My partner, being a 
> resource teacher, tells me that the resource teachers see how it is for the 
> sighted students. Blindness specific teachers in blindness units in schools 
> are in a closed loop, so they do not see the sighted trends.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 13 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

I’m hoping there’s some hyperbole or excess here to make a point because on the 
surface your message disturbs me.  You’re far to smart to end up in a group 
home.  I’ve seen your posts here and other places, you don’t seem like group 
home material to me. How can we help avoid such a thing?
 

> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:55 PM, Devin Prater  wrote:
> 
> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. 
> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle 
> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the 
> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t 
> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to 
> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more 
> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just 
> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and 
> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my 
> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their 
> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy skills 
> no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
> Sent from my Mac.
> 
> Devin Prater
> d.pra...@me.com 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Katie,
>> 
>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
>> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  
>> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi, Donna.
>>> 
>>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) 
>>> its the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
>>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the 
>>> pairing is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with 
>>> just my iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always 
>>> need to constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge 
>>> the device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt 
>>> charger. The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, 
>>> I tried opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. 
>>> They were in .docx format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open 
>>> the file, I would get a warning that said the file could not be opened. 
>>> Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen 
>>> compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were 
>>> the 2 previous notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll be getting 
>>> some more training again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully I can 
>>> find out why the documents were not opening from my flash drive.
 Katie
>>> 
 On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin > wrote:
 
 Hi Katie,
 
 Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
 bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  
 The thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large 
 briefcase, just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and 
 of course, all the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that 
 with now carrying around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option 
 of pairing the VU with the iPhone, the difference between then and now is 
 really striking.
 Cheers,
 Donna
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  > wrote:
> 
> Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
> 
> Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, 
> even before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is 
> somewhat similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I 
> started using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more 
> of a computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer 
> often at home and at work.
> 
> I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
> youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 
> months premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the 
> Chicago suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that 
> area for 18 years until I was 20. My family has always been very 
> encouraging and supportive. 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

Katie, there are many who work for Apple and have for years, some on this list. 
 The fact is, there are many blind people in Technology in all sorts of 
capacities not just accessibility.  We’ve got some accomplished software 
developers, unix and windows systems administrators, accessibility 
professionals, database administrators, and of course network engineers (ok I’m 
showing my bias lol). Cisco Systems, a provider of routing and switching 
equipment among other things offered to provide their documentation to me years 
ago at no cost in braille.  In print their basic routing documentation filled 
several bookshelves so the braille equivalent would have been massive.  Luckily 
they also had everything searchable on CD or online so I never took them up on 
it but I was so pleased at the time they made the offer.  Cisco is one company 
that has always been accommodating. Their competitor Juniper was also very good 
and had no problem providing additional free resources but in full disclosure, 
they also hired me so I’m partial.:)

Jordan while very good to see and again she sounds like a really sharp young 
lady is by no means a new thing.  In the history of the development of the 
Internet there have been many disabled people including the blind and I know of 
several deaf engineers or business types who started or grew major networks.


> On Jul 13, 2016, at 5:50 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> That’s cool you talked with Jordyn before she joined Apple. I knew there were 
> probably some blind people working at Apple with Voiceover. It was 
> interesting to read about her experience in that article. Yeah, she sounds 
> pretty cool.
> Katie
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 1:55 PM, Devin Prater > > wrote:
>> 
>> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. 
>> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle 
>> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the 
>> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t 
>> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to 
>> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more 
>> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just 
>> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and 
>> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my 
>> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their 
>> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy 
>> skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
>> Sent from my Mac.
>> 
>> Devin Prater
>> d.pra...@me.com 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Katie,
>>> 
>>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
>>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't 
>>> help you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra 
>>> list?  It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
 On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow > wrote:
 
 Hi, Donna.
 
 Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) 
 its the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
 connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the 
 pairing is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with 
 just my iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always 
 need to constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge 
 the device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt 
 charger. The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. 
 Yesterday, I tried opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to 
 the device. They were in .docx format, an every time I’d press the 
 navistick to open the file, I would get a warning that said the file could 
 not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest display 
 I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote 
 MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used with braille displays. 
 I’ll be getting some more training again with the VU in a couple days, so 
 hopefully I can find out why the documents were not opening from my flash 
 drive.
> Katie
 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin  > wrote:
> 
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
> bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

Hi, I’ve heard that 70% number far before the 90S.  I absolutely trust david’s 
statements and such but I think that idea has an even earlier history.  I 
remember hearing it from my mother in the 80S when she would attend some 
parents conferences.  Scared the heck out of my parents and they put me to work 
as young as possible.  Were I sited I think they would have done the same 
thing.  Many families, sited or blind, push their kids to work early, 
especially if they have family businesses.

I wonder how far back this stat actually goes though and like you I hope it’s 
60 or lower today, the lower the better.

> On Jul 13, 2016, at 10:22 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> Hi, David. I’ve also heard the same statistic for a long time that 70 percent 
>  of blind people are unemployed. I didn’t realize the study was probably from 
> the 1990’s. I hope that number has dropped since that time as well. 60 
> percent is a good improvement though.
> Katie
>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 7:34 PM, Scott Granados > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi David, you know, I’ve heard that 70% number for ever, even pre 1995.  I 
>> hope you’re right though, I’d love to see that number drop meaningfully.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 5:24 PM, David Chittenden >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Actually, those stats are from a study which is about 18 years old. Even 
>>> worse, however, is the stats about unemployment of the blind. Those stats, 
>>> often sited in studies across the board, come from a study published in 
>>> 1995 or 1997 (I would need to look it up again for the exact date). The 
>>> most recent info I have seen was published by the state of Oregon in 2007 
>>> (if memory serves) which places blindness unemployment rate at around 60%, 
>>> not the often sited 70% to 80%. Note: I researched this in 2012, so am 
>>> unaware of any data published since then.
>>> 
>>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>>> Email: nexu...@icloud.com 
>>> Mobile: 0450 788 988
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com 
>>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> On 12 Jul 2016, at 08:30, 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
>>> > 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
 Interesting stats they mention about correlation between braille literacy 
 and employment. I just had an iOS developer reach out to me who said WWDC 
 had a heavy emphasis on accessibility this year. I've never been so I 
 can't compare. I hope that's true. Nothing but good can come from more 
 developers become aware and care.
 
 CB
 
 On 7/11/16 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
> Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything 
> about braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working 
> on accessibility.
> http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
>  
> 
> 
> This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
> 
> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations. 
> 
> She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her 
> grandfather could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide 
> his wedding ring along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she 
> had a slim chance of survival.
> 
> It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the 
> first time she shattered them.
> 
> Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early 
> delivery. But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy 
> expectations of people with disabilities, motivating her to be 
> adventurous, hands-on and insatiably curious.
> 
> It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it 
> was the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, 
> or the classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school. 
> 
>  <>"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users." 
> She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling 
> her to figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
> 
> "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the 
> tasks I wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on 
> enhancing features like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to 
> realize that with my knowledge of computers and technology, I could help 
> change the world for people with disabilities.
> 
> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> 
> Bringing a 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Katie Zodrow]

Hi, David. I’ve also heard the same statistic for a long time that 70 percent  
of blind people are unemployed. I didn’t realize the study was probably from 
the 1990’s. I hope that number has dropped since that time as well. 60 percent 
is a good improvement though.
Katie
> On Jul 11, 2016, at 7:34 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Hi David, you know, I’ve heard that 70% number for ever, even pre 1995.  I 
> hope you’re right though, I’d love to see that number drop meaningfully.
> 
> 
>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 5:24 PM, David Chittenden > > wrote:
>> 
>> Actually, those stats are from a study which is about 18 years old. Even 
>> worse, however, is the stats about unemployment of the blind. Those stats, 
>> often sited in studies across the board, come from a study published in 1995 
>> or 1997 (I would need to look it up again for the exact date). The most 
>> recent info I have seen was published by the state of Oregon in 2007 (if 
>> memory serves) which places blindness unemployment rate at around 60%, not 
>> the often sited 70% to 80%. Note: I researched this in 2012, so am unaware 
>> of any data published since then.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: nexu...@icloud.com 
>> Mobile: 0450 788 988
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com 
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> On 12 Jul 2016, at 08:30, 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
>> > 
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Interesting stats they mention about correlation between braille literacy 
>>> and employment. I just had an iOS developer reach out to me who said WWDC 
>>> had a heavy emphasis on accessibility this year. I've never been so I can't 
>>> compare. I hope that's true. Nothing but good can come from more developers 
>>> become aware and care.
>>> 
>>> CB
>>> 
>>> On 7/11/16 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
 Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything 
 about braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working 
 on accessibility.
 http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
  
 
 
 This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
 
 Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations. 
 
 She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her 
 grandfather could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide 
 his wedding ring along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had 
 a slim chance of survival.
 
 It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first 
 time she shattered them.
 
 Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early 
 delivery. But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy 
 expectations of people with disabilities, motivating her to be 
 adventurous, hands-on and insatiably curious.
 
 It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it 
 was the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, 
 or the classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school. 
 
  <>"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users." 
 She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her 
 to figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
 
 "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks 
 I wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing 
 features like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that 
 with my knowledge of computers and technology, I could help change the 
 world for people with disabilities.
 
 "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
 
 Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation
 
 There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace 
 initiatives — the need to include the perspectives of people with 
 disabilities.
 
 Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
 component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how 
 much that can strengthen a company.
 
 She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
 introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
 gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — 
 and she was nervous.
 
 "You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going 
 to know unless you talk to them ... so go."
 
 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Katie Zodrow]

Hi, Donna.

No, I haven’t joined the VarioUltra list yet. Thanks for telling me about it! 
I’ll probably join it this week. My trainer also told me about the VU list when 
I first started working with him. I’m glad it has been helpful for you.
Thanks.
Katie
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 4:38 AM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  
> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, Donna.
>> 
>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
>> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing 
>> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my 
>> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to 
>> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the 
>> device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. 
>> The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried 
>> opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. They were 
>> in .docx format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open the file, I 
>> would get a warning that said the file could not be opened. Really strange. 
>> The VU is the lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen compared to my 
>> old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were the 2 previous 
>> notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll be getting some more training 
>> again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully I can find out why the 
>> documents were not opening from my flash drive.
>>> Katie
>> 
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Katie,
>>> 
>>> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
>>> bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  
>>> The thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large 
>>> briefcase, just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of 
>>> course, all the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that 
>>> with now carrying around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option 
>>> of pairing the VU with the iPhone, the difference between then and now is 
>>> really striking.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
 On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
 
 Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
 
 Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, 
 even before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is 
 somewhat similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I 
 started using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more 
 of a computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer 
 often at home and at work.
 
 I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
 youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 
 months premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the 
 Chicago suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that 
 area for 18 years until I was 20. My family has always been very 
 encouraging and supportive. They wanted to give me the best education 
 possible, so I was mainstreamed in public schools from age 3 to high 
 school. The elementary school I attended was a few miles away in another 
 city from where we lived, but they had a great Special Ed program with a 
 resource room for all the kids with blindness and other disabilities. I 
 would go there if I wasn’t with the regular classroom teacher during part 
 of the day like for Reading or Math. The vision teacher in my resource 
 room and the rest of the staff at the school were all great! Besides my 
 parents helping me learn and encouraging me to be independent, The school 
 provided all the extra services I needed back then like reading Braille, O 
 and M skills, and basic daily living skills. I still use braille often, 
 and that skill along with the others are very important for employment and 
 being independent. In middle and high school, I worked with an itinerant 
 teacher for an hour and was in regular classes with the sighted students 
 the rest of the day.
 
 one of the first computers I used in elementary school was the Apple II E 
 with that robotic sounding Echo speech synthesizer. The Alex voice and 
 synthesized speech have come a long way since then!! 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Katie Zodrow]

That’s cool you talked with Jordyn before she joined Apple. I knew there were 
probably some blind people working at Apple with Voiceover. It was interesting 
to read about her experience in that article. Yeah, she sounds pretty cool.
Katie
> On Jul 13, 2016, at 1:55 PM, Devin Prater  wrote:
> 
> I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. 
> I guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle 
> class home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the 
> blind, where teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t 
> know what to do, exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to 
> the adult learning facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more 
> than I did when I left ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just 
> aren’t all that organized, at least here in the state of football and 
> rednecks. I just hope that I can get at least something to happen before my 
> family decides a group home would indeed be just the spot to plop down their 
> poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn independence and advocacy skills 
> no matter where the Alabama Institute sends him. Oh discordia.
> Sent from my Mac.
> 
> Devin Prater
> d.pra...@me.com 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Katie,
>> 
>> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
>> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
>> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  
>> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi, Donna.
>>> 
>>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) 
>>> its the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
>>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the 
>>> pairing is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with 
>>> just my iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always 
>>> need to constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge 
>>> the device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt 
>>> charger. The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, 
>>> I tried opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. 
>>> They were in .docx format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open 
>>> the file, I would get a warning that said the file could not be opened. 
>>> Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen 
>>> compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were 
>>> the 2 previous notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll be getting 
>>> some more training again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully I can 
>>> find out why the documents were not opening from my flash drive.
 Katie
>>> 
 On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin > wrote:
 
 Hi Katie,
 
 Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
 bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  
 The thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large 
 briefcase, just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and 
 of course, all the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that 
 with now carrying around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option 
 of pairing the VU with the iPhone, the difference between then and now is 
 really striking.
 Cheers,
 Donna
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  > wrote:
> 
> Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
> 
> Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, 
> even before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is 
> somewhat similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I 
> started using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more 
> of a computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer 
> often at home and at work.
> 
> I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
> youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 
> months premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the 
> Chicago suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that 
> area for 18 years until I was 20. My family has always been very 
> encouraging and supportive. They wanted to give me the best education 
> 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Devin Prater]

I talked to her years ago, before she joined Apple. Yeah, she’s pretty cool. I 
guess I’m the blindie here. I grew up a pampered kid in a lower-middle class 
home. I went and somehow graduated from the Alabama school for the blind, where 
teachers seemed to care but just couldn’t do much, or didn’t know what to do, 
exactly. As you can imagine, they then shuttled me off to the adult learning 
facility, E.H. Gentry, where I attend now. I know more than I did when I left 
ASB, sure, but these blindness organizations just aren’t all that organized, at 
least here in the state of football and rednecks. I just hope that I can get at 
least something to happen before my family decides a group home would indeed be 
just the spot to plop down their poor blind boy that just can’t seem to learn 
independence and advocacy skills no matter where the Alabama Institute sends 
him. Oh discordia.
Sent from my Mac.

Devin Prater
d.pra...@me.com



> On Jul 13, 2016, at 6:38 AM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
> display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
> you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  
> It's a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, Donna.
>> 
>> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
>> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
>> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing 
>> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my 
>> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to 
>> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the 
>> device with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. 
>> The only problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried 
>> opening a couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. They were 
>> in .docx format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open the file, I 
>> would get a warning that said the file could not be opened. Really strange. 
>> The VU is the lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen compared to my 
>> old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were the 2 previous 
>> notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll be getting some more training 
>> again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully I can find out why the 
>> documents were not opening from my flash drive.
>>> Katie
>> 
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Katie,
>>> 
>>> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
>>> bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  
>>> The thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large 
>>> briefcase, just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of 
>>> course, all the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that 
>>> with now carrying around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option 
>>> of pairing the VU with the iPhone, the difference between then and now is 
>>> really striking.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
 On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
 
 Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
 
 Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, 
 even before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is 
 somewhat similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I 
 started using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more 
 of a computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer 
 often at home and at work.
 
 I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
 youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 
 months premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the 
 Chicago suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that 
 area for 18 years until I was 20. My family has always been very 
 encouraging and supportive. They wanted to give me the best education 
 possible, so I was mainstreamed in public schools from age 3 to high 
 school. The elementary school I attended was a few miles away in another 
 city from where we lived, but they had a great Special Ed program with a 
 resource room for all the kids with blindness and other disabilities. I 
 would go there if I wasn’t with the regular classroom teacher during part 
 of the day like for Reading or Math. The vision teacher in my resource 
 room and the rest of the staff at the school were all great! Besides my 
 parents helping me learn and 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Hi Katie,

Yep, I agree with everything you pointed out.  It really is a nice braille 
display.  I haven't had the problem you describe, so I'm afraid I can't help 
you.  Have you tried calling tech support or posting the VarioUltra list?  It's 
a great list, with some very helpful and knowledgeable folks.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> Hi, Donna.
> 
> Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
> the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just 
> connect a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing 
> is successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my 
> iphone and the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to 
> constantly use dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the device 
> with a USB cable too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. The only 
> problem I have sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried opening a 
> couple files with the USB stick connected to the device. They were in .docx 
> format, an every time I’d press the navistick to open the file, I would get a 
> warning that said the file could not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the 
> lightest and smallest display I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 
> 40 and the BrailleNote MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used 
> with braille displays. I’ll be getting some more training again with the VU 
> in a couple days, so hopefully I can find out why the documents were not 
> opening from my flash drive.
>> Katie
> 
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Katie,
>> 
>> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
>> bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  The 
>> thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large 
>> briefcase, just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of 
>> course, all the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that with 
>> now carrying around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option of 
>> pairing the VU with the iPhone, the difference between then and now is 
>> really striking.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
>>> 
>>> Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, 
>>> even before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is 
>>> somewhat similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I 
>>> started using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more 
>>> of a computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer often 
>>> at home and at work.
>>> 
>>> I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
>>> youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 
>>> months premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the 
>>> Chicago suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that 
>>> area for 18 years until I was 20. My family has always been very 
>>> encouraging and supportive. They wanted to give me the best education 
>>> possible, so I was mainstreamed in public schools from age 3 to high 
>>> school. The elementary school I attended was a few miles away in another 
>>> city from where we lived, but they had a great Special Ed program with a 
>>> resource room for all the kids with blindness and other disabilities. I 
>>> would go there if I wasn’t with the regular classroom teacher during part 
>>> of the day like for Reading or Math. The vision teacher in my resource room 
>>> and the rest of the staff at the school were all great! Besides my parents 
>>> helping me learn and encouraging me to be independent, The school provided 
>>> all the extra services I needed back then like reading Braille, O and M 
>>> skills, and basic daily living skills. I still use braille often, and that 
>>> skill along with the others are very important for employment and being 
>>> independent. In middle and high school, I worked with an itinerant teacher 
>>> for an hour and was in regular classes with the sighted students the rest 
>>> of the day.
>>> 
>>> one of the first computers I used in elementary school was the Apple II E 
>>> with that robotic sounding Echo speech synthesizer. The Alex voice and 
>>> synthesized speech have come a long way since then!! :-) I remember when I 
>>> was about four and five years old and pressing different keys on the Apple 
>>> 2 keyboard. I thought it was really cool how the Echo synthesizer would 
>>> pronounce everything, and that you could change the speech rate and pitch 
>>> of the voice. It would always sound really funny  talking in a really high 
>>> or low pitch!
>>> 
>>> When I was in first grade, my parents bought an Apple 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

You guys make it sound scarey.

I lost my sight at 22 and used computers for games prior to that.

After  losing my sight I had to find something to do and ended up studying IT 
for my degree in IT, and I’m 4 papers short of a degree in physical education

I work for a state owned university  which has an equal opotunity employment 
policy unless you have a disability in which case good luck but the work only 
gets harder.

Management who have qualifications in ignorance and only care about how things 
look to their pairs and not how things will effect the customers / students.

I’m 1 of 3 staff out of 4600, that have a sight issue, 2 totals and 1 partial.

When it comes to making things bloody difficult, it’s hard to go passed an 
organisation that specialises in making technology inaccessible and old before 
it’s purchased or released to production.
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Donna Goodin
Sent: Wednesday, 13 July 2016 1:54 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Hi Anne,

That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I was 
a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the slow 
speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have been 
different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read fiction, 
which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had I had a need 
to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also been a little 
older--I would have been more driven to stick with it.

It's funny, I still have my Optacon.  It's just sitting in our basement 
gathering dust.  I probably should do something with it some day.
Cheers,
Donna
On Jul 12, 2016, at 1:19 AM, Anne Robertson 
> wrote:

I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for the 
blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which didn’t 
interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
programming.
The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted colleagues 
was the optacon. I was able to read the terminal screen and printout. I 
programmed the Apple ii in hexadecimal and read all the manuals using the 
optacon.
I didn’t use speech on a computer until we got a Mac, a 2SI, during the 90s and 
I purchased OutSpoken.
It never occurred to me that I might not be able to get a job as a blind person 
once the optacon became available to me.

Cheers,

Anne



On 12 Jul 2016, at 05:15, Donna Goodin 
> wrote:

Hey Scott,

First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  But 
...

As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, math 
and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my dad was a 
computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me how important 
tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of him bringing home 
those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my brother and me to play 
with.  I remember going with him into the office on Saturdays and seeing the 
computer, which was this great big behemoth that took up an entire room.  I 
remember him teaching me base 2 at the dinner table.  But once I got to school, 
my math and science teachers had no idea what to do with me.  Classes were 
taught almost exclusively on the blackboard, and I was bored out of my mind.  I 
grew up thinking I sucked at math, and it wasn't until I was in my thirties 
that I realized that I was actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back in the 80s, 
I went out with this total computer geek.  I was fascinated by all the stuff he 
was into, but neither he nor I knew how to make all that accessible to me.  
(And by that time, I actually owned a TSI Versabraille).  I think that had I 
been born within the last 25 years, I actually would have chosen IT--or 
something related--as a career.  Clearly something was different for you and 
John.  Maybe it was innate intelligence, maybe there was a gender bias at play, 
maybe it was opportunity, I don't know.  I do know from other posts I've seen 
from you that your parents seemed quite willing to think out of the box.  I 
grew up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, my dad was 22.  Having a 
blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited world.  I don't think my 
experience is unique.  Whatever it was that jived for you guys, didn't carry 
over to lots of blind folks.

So yes, it was a fluff piece.  And yes, I wish they'd just treat blind folks 
like everyone else.  But I also hope that there's a little Donna out there 
somewhere--or maybe little 

RE: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Simon Fogarty]

Great Chick,

And an awesome story.



From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Christopher-Mark Gilland
Sent: Tuesday, 12 July 2016 11:49 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Wow!  This is incredible!  Thanks for sharing.
---
Christopher Gilland
JAWS Certified, 2016.
Training Instructor.

clgillan...@gmail.com
Phone: (704) 256-8010.
- Original Message -
From: Jonathan C. Cohn
To: Macvisionaries
Sent: Monday, July 11, 2016 2:29 PM
Subject: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything about 
braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
accessibility.
http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations.

She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her grandfather 
could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide his wedding ring 
along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had a slim chance of 
survival.

It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first time 
she shattered them.

Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. But 
throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations of people 
with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and insatiably 
curious.

It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was the 
desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school.
"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."

She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her to 
figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.

"I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks I 
wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing features 
like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with my knowledge 
of computers and technology, I could help change the world for people with 
disabilities.

"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."

Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation

There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace initiatives — 
the need to include the perspectives of people with disabilities.

Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how much 
that can strengthen a company.

She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — and she 
was nervous.

"You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going to 
know unless you talk to them ... so go."
[Image removed by sender.]

Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a driving force 
behind accessibility of Apple products, especially for blind users.

Image: Provided by Apple and Jordyn Castor

Castor told Apple reps how amazed she was by the iPad she received as a gift 
for her 17th birthday just a few years earlier. It raised her passion for tech 
to another level — mainly due to the iPad's immediate accessibility.

"Everything just worked and was accessible just right out of the box," Castor 
tells Mashable. "That was something I had never experienced before."
"I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community."

Sarah Herrlinger, senior manager for global accessibility policy and 
initiatives at Apple, says a notable part of the company's steps toward 
accessibility is its dedication to making inclusivity features standard, not 
specialized. This allows those features to be dually accessible — both for 
getting the tech to more users, as well as keeping down costs.

"[These features] show up on your device, regardless of if you are someone who 
needs them," Herrlinger tells Mashable. "By being built-in, they are also free. 
Historically, for the blind and visually impaired community, there are 
additional things you have to buy or things that you have to do to be able to 
use technology."

At that job fair in 2015, Castor's passion for accessibility and Apple was 
evident. She was soon hired as an intern focusing on VoiceOver accessibility.

As her internship came to a close, Castor's skills as an engineer and advocate 
for tech accessibility were too commanding to let go. She was hired full-time 
as an engineer on the accessibility design and 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

I guess I will chime in here. I was congenitally (born) blind. My brother, who 
is two years older, is also blind.

We started school at a blindness school, and then attended a bording school for 
the blind. My parents decided to mainstream us when I entered 6th grade. The 
schools for the blind taught me certain skills such as braille, quite well. 
Fortunately, I was mainstreamed early enough to get a healthy dose of normal 
(sighted) culture.

I attended a private highschool (the best school in the state) which I was able 
to enter because I scored well enough on the entrance exam. Resource teachers 
were not allowed to work at private schools, so I was pretty much on my own, in 
an academically challenging environment, from 9th grade. Note: I was registered 
in the nearby public highschool, so was able to see a resource teacher there 
for 45 minutes per day, four days per week. That person did the important 
braille transcription for tests. At school, however, everything was my 
responsibility.

I took a basic programming course when I was a senior. I enjoyed it so much 
that I decided to become a computer systems engineer. That lasted one semester 
at university. I broke my wrist, so could not type for 8 weeks. I then 
floundered at a community college for a few years, became a massage therapist, 
became a technology salesperson, became an accessibility interface evaluater 
and an accessibility advocate, failed a couple businesses, then returned to 
university for a bachelors in business admin management followed by a masters 
in counseling. After I completed university, I independently immigrated to New 
Zealand. I currently work as the mental health specialist at a small doctor's 
clinic.

I started technology working on a PDP1170 mainframe. My first personal system 
was a Blazie Braille 'n Speak 640 which I used to access local BBSs. I then 
went to DOS, followed by Windows. I switched to the Mac with OSX Mountain Lion. 
I wanted to support the only mainstream company that was actively fully working 
toward blindness accessibility.

I am now dabbling with Android as well as iOS. Because Android gives more 
control to the end user, I suspect it will eventually supercede Apple, so I am 
working with it. I remember Beta vs VHS. Sony owned both, Beta was better, so 
Sony licensed out VHS. Many more people worked with VHS, so it eventually 
surpassed Beta.

Personally, I much prefer Apple's stance on privacy and security. Kids, on the 
other hand, are so inundated with open social media, that they, for the most 
part, do not appear to have the same concerns. Oh well, time will tell where 
things actually end up going. I will enjoy the ride while I am able, and keep 
playing with these wonderfully more and more accessible toys.

As a side note: now that it has been brought to my attention, I am noticing 
that, in this decidely unscientificly random sampling, it appears to be those 
who attended normal school who seem to have adapted better to life in the 
sighted world. Well, at least, those who had annoying parents that pushed, and 
at least one resource teacher who bucked the trend. My partner, being a 
resource teacher, tells me that the resource teachers see how it is for the 
sighted students. Blindness specific teachers in blindness units in schools are 
in a closed loop, so they do not see the sighted trends.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 13 Jul 2016, at 15:05, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
> bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  The 
> thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large briefcase, 
> just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of course, all 
> the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that with now carrying 
> around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option of pairing the VU 
> with the iPhone, the difference between then and now is really striking.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
>> 
>> Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, even 
>> before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is 
>> somewhat similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I 
>> started using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more of 
>> a computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer often at 
>> home and at work.
>> 
>> I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
>> youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 months 
>> premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the Chicago 
>> suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that area 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Katie Zodrow]

Hi, Donna.

Yes, I’ve been learning to use the VarioUltra since May and love it! :-) its 
the best braille display for me so far. I think its great you can just connect 
a device like your phone via bluetooth and it works once the pairing is 
successfully connected. I can also text or email people with just my iphone and 
the braille display, so that’s awesome I don’t always need to constantly use 
dictation. Its really cool that you can just charge the device with a USB cable 
too instead of carrying around a 12 volt charger. The only problem I have 
sometimes is opening documents. Yesterday, I tried opening a couple files with 
the USB stick connected to the device. They were in .docx format, an every time 
I’d press the navistick to open the file, I would get a warning that said the 
file could not be opened. Really strange. The VU is the lightest and smallest 
display I’ve ever seen compared to my old Braille Lite 40 and the BrailleNote 
MPower. Those were the 2 previous notetakers I used with braille displays. I’ll 
be getting some more training again with the VU in a couple days, so hopefully 
I can find out why the documents were not opening from my flash drive.
> Katie

> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:05 PM, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Hi Katie,
> 
> Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how 
> bulky things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  The 
> thing was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large briefcase, 
> just to carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of course, all 
> the accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that with now carrying 
> around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option of pairing the VU 
> with the iPhone, the difference between then and now is really striking.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
>> 
>> Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, even 
>> before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is 
>> somewhat similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I 
>> started using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more of 
>> a computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer often at 
>> home and at work.
>> 
>> I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
>> youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 months 
>> premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the Chicago 
>> suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that area for 18 
>> years until I was 20. My family has always been very encouraging and 
>> supportive. They wanted to give me the best education possible, so I was 
>> mainstreamed in public schools from age 3 to high school. The elementary 
>> school I attended was a few miles away in another city from where we lived, 
>> but they had a great Special Ed program with a resource room for all the 
>> kids with blindness and other disabilities. I would go there if I wasn’t 
>> with the regular classroom teacher during part of the day like for Reading 
>> or Math. The vision teacher in my resource room and the rest of the staff at 
>> the school were all great! Besides my parents helping me learn and 
>> encouraging me to be independent, The school provided all the extra services 
>> I needed back then like reading Braille, O and M skills, and basic daily 
>> living skills. I still use braille often, and that skill along with the 
>> others are very important for employment and being independent. In middle 
>> and high school, I worked with an itinerant teacher for an hour and was in 
>> regular classes with the sighted students the rest of the day.
>> 
>> one of the first computers I used in elementary school was the Apple II E 
>> with that robotic sounding Echo speech synthesizer. The Alex voice and 
>> synthesized speech have come a long way since then!! :-) I remember when I 
>> was about four and five years old and pressing different keys on the Apple 2 
>> keyboard. I thought it was really cool how the Echo synthesizer would 
>> pronounce everything, and that you could change the speech rate and pitch of 
>> the voice. It would always sound really funny  talking in a really high or 
>> low pitch!
>> 
>> When I was in first grade, my parents bought an Apple II GS computer. my 
>> sister and I used to play a lot of games on it and some of them had speech 
>> using the Echo synthesizer so I could play them myself. I remember using the 
>> old word processing programs too like Braille Edit and another one called 
>> ProWord ProBraille in middle and high school. Everything was all on 3.5 inch 
>> floppy disc back then, or they were on those bigger 5 and 1/4 inch 
>> diskettes. During most of my elementary school years, my mom worked at a 
>> high 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Hi Katie,

Isn't the VarioUltra the best?  Earlier tonight I was thinking about how bulky 
things used to be.  My first braille display was a TSI Navigator.  The thing 
was huge.  I used to carry around what was basically a large briefcase, just to 
carry around my PC laptop and my braille display, and of course, all the 
accompanying cables and chargers..  When I compare that with now carrying 
around my MBA and VU,, not to mention having the option of pairing the VU with 
the iPhone, the difference between then and now is really striking.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 9:38 PM, Katie Zodrow  wrote:
> 
> Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.
> 
> Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, even 
> before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is somewhat 
> similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I started 
> using computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more of a 
> computer and tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer often at 
> home and at work.
> 
> I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
> youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 months 
> premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the Chicago 
> suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that area for 18 
> years until I was 20. My family has always been very encouraging and 
> supportive. They wanted to give me the best education possible, so I was 
> mainstreamed in public schools from age 3 to high school. The elementary 
> school I attended was a few miles away in another city from where we lived, 
> but they had a great Special Ed program with a resource room for all the kids 
> with blindness and other disabilities. I would go there if I wasn’t with the 
> regular classroom teacher during part of the day like for Reading or Math. 
> The vision teacher in my resource room and the rest of the staff at the 
> school were all great! Besides my parents helping me learn and encouraging me 
> to be independent, The school provided all the extra services I needed back 
> then like reading Braille, O and M skills, and basic daily living skills. I 
> still use braille often, and that skill along with the others are very 
> important for employment and being independent. In middle and high school, I 
> worked with an itinerant teacher for an hour and was in regular classes with 
> the sighted students the rest of the day.
> 
> one of the first computers I used in elementary school was the Apple II E 
> with that robotic sounding Echo speech synthesizer. The Alex voice and 
> synthesized speech have come a long way since then!! :-) I remember when I 
> was about four and five years old and pressing different keys on the Apple 2 
> keyboard. I thought it was really cool how the Echo synthesizer would 
> pronounce everything, and that you could change the speech rate and pitch of 
> the voice. It would always sound really funny  talking in a really high or 
> low pitch!
> 
> When I was in first grade, my parents bought an Apple II GS computer. my 
> sister and I used to play a lot of games on it and some of them had speech 
> using the Echo synthesizer so I could play them myself. I remember using the 
> old word processing programs too like Braille Edit and another one called 
> ProWord ProBraille in middle and high school. Everything was all on 3.5 inch 
> floppy disc back then, or they were on those bigger 5 and 1/4 inch diskettes. 
> During most of my elementary school years, my mom worked at a high school in 
> a resource room. She worked as a teacher assistant to the main resource 
> teacher preparing materials in Braille for the blind and visually impaired 
> students. When she would put handouts and other information in Braille for me 
> or the high school students, she would normally use either BrailleEdit or 
> another program called Bex. I remember my mom taught me how to use the 
> BrailleEdit software for word processing. You had to use three different 5.25 
> inch disks just to use the program, and they had to be used in a certain 
> order so the program could work correctly. We had the Apple II GS computer 
> until my junior year of high school. I got a desktop PC with Windows 98 and 
> JAWS after that. My parents wanted me to get my own computer before I started 
> college.
> 
> I used a Mac computer for the first time in the summer of 2000 after my first 
> semester of college and learned outSPOKEN. I attended Berklee College of 
> Music in Boston from 2000 to 2004, and almost everyone was using the Mac OS. 
> For a couple of my music tech classes, I used outSPOKEN when I was learning 
> Digital Performer and ProTools. I still used the Windows platform most of the 
> time from 1998 until  2013, then I decided to switch back over to the Mac. I 
> had worked in a couple call centers as a telephone reservations 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Hi Tim,

I agree.  I think it's really fun and interesting getting to know a bit about 
list members' history and early computer experiences.
Cheers,
Donna


> On Jul 12, 2016, at 10:28 AM, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I love reading this personal historical info on folks.  Sure, off topic, but 
> totally acceptable in my world.  The common thread here is supportive and 
> progressive parents and teachers.  I really didn't use Braille until my late 
> teens, probably due to having some usable sight and an immature desire to not 
> be considered blind.  Consequently, my Braille is limited to Grade 1, and 
> primarily only used to cheat, oops, I mean play cards with others.  I was a 
> classroom teacher for about 25 years then moved into Admin as a Technology 
> Consultant and Project Manager for a new Science & Tech Centre in our School 
> District.  Probably 95% of my computer experience has been with Apple 
> products with a smattering of Digital Equipment Main Frames and Windows.
> 
> Later...
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 07:53, Donna Goodin  > wrote:
> 
> Hi Anne,
> 
> That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I 
> was a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the 
> slow speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have 
> been different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read 
> fiction, which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had I 
> had a need to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also been a 
> little older--I would have been more driven to stick with it.
> 
> It's funny, I still have my Optacon.  It's just sitting in our basement 
> gathering dust.  I probably should do something with it some day.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 1:19 AM, Anne Robertson > > wrote:
>> 
>> I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for 
>> the blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which 
>> didn’t interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
>> I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
>> languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
>> programming.
>> The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted 
>> colleagues was the optacon. I was able to read the terminal screen and 
>> printout. I programmed the Apple ii in hexadecimal and read all the manuals 
>> using the optacon.
>> I didn’t use speech on a computer until we got a Mac, a 2SI, during the 90s 
>> and I purchased OutSpoken.
>> It never occurred to me that I might not be able to get a job as a blind 
>> person once the optacon became available to me.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> 
>> Anne
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 12 Jul 2016, at 05:15, Donna Goodin >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hey Scott,
>>> 
>>> First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  
>>> But ...
>>> 
>>> As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, 
>>> math and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my 
>>> dad was a computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me 
>>> how important tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of 
>>> him bringing home those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my 
>>> brother and me to play with.  I remember going with him into the office on 
>>> Saturdays and seeing the computer, which was this great big behemoth that 
>>> took up an entire room.  I remember him teaching me base 2 at the dinner 
>>> table.  But once I got to school, my math and science teachers had no idea 
>>> what to do with me.  Classes were taught almost exclusively on the 
>>> blackboard, and I was bored out of my mind.  I grew up thinking I sucked at 
>>> math, and it wasn't until I was in my thirties that I realized that I was 
>>> actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back in the 80s, I went out with this 
>>> total computer geek.  I was fascinated by all the stuff he was into, but 
>>> neither he nor I knew how to make all that accessible to me.  (And by that 
>>> time, I actually owned a TSI Versabraille).  I think that had I been born 
>>> within the last 25 years, I actually would have chosen IT--or something 
>>> related--as a career.  Clearly something was different for you and John.  
>>> Maybe it was innate intelligence, maybe there was a gender bias at play, 
>>> maybe it was opportunity, I don't know.  I do know from other posts I've 
>>> seen from you that your parents seemed quite willing to think out of the 
>>> box.  I grew up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, my dad was 22. 
>>>  Having a blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited world.  I don't 
>>> think my 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Katie Zodrow]

Hi Donna and Scott. I thought I would chime in too.

Yes, you're right about Apple starting accessibility over 30 years ago, even 
before we had voiceover and the mac. It sounds like my experience is somewhat 
similar to yours, even though I was born a few years later and I started using 
computers and technology at an earlier age. My dad was more of a computer and 
tech guy too, but both my parents used the computer often at home and at work.

I grew up during the 1980s and 90s. I have an older sister so I was the 
youngest and the only blind person in my family. I was born in Ohio 3 months 
premature and have been blind since birth. My family moved to the Chicago 
suburbs when I was 2, which is where I grew up. I lived in that area for 18 
years until I was 20. My family has always been very encouraging and 
supportive. They wanted to give me the best education possible, so I was 
mainstreamed in public schools from age 3 to high school. The elementary school 
I attended was a few miles away in another city from where we lived, but they 
had a great Special Ed program with a resource room for all the kids with 
blindness and other disabilities. I would go there if I wasn’t with the regular 
classroom teacher during part of the day like for Reading or Math. The vision 
teacher in my resource room and the rest of the staff at the school were all 
great! Besides my parents helping me learn and encouraging me to be 
independent, The school provided all the extra services I needed back then like 
reading Braille, O and M skills, and basic daily living skills. I still use 
braille often, and that skill along with the others are very important for 
employment and being independent. In middle and high school, I worked with an 
itinerant teacher for an hour and was in regular classes with the sighted 
students the rest of the day.

one of the first computers I used in elementary school was the Apple II E with 
that robotic sounding Echo speech synthesizer. The Alex voice and synthesized 
speech have come a long way since then!! :-) I remember when I was about four 
and five years old and pressing different keys on the Apple 2 keyboard. I 
thought it was really cool how the Echo synthesizer would pronounce everything, 
and that you could change the speech rate and pitch of the voice. It would 
always sound really funny  talking in a really high or low pitch!

When I was in first grade, my parents bought an Apple II GS computer. my sister 
and I used to play a lot of games on it and some of them had speech using the 
Echo synthesizer so I could play them myself. I remember using the old word 
processing programs too like Braille Edit and another one called ProWord 
ProBraille in middle and high school. Everything was all on 3.5 inch floppy 
disc back then, or they were on those bigger 5 and 1/4 inch diskettes. During 
most of my elementary school years, my mom worked at a high school in a 
resource room. She worked as a teacher assistant to the main resource teacher 
preparing materials in Braille for the blind and visually impaired students. 
When she would put handouts and other information in Braille for me or the high 
school students, she would normally use either BrailleEdit or another program 
called Bex. I remember my mom taught me how to use the BrailleEdit software for 
word processing. You had to use three different 5.25 inch disks just to use the 
program, and they had to be used in a certain order so the program could work 
correctly. We had the Apple II GS computer until my junior year of high school. 
I got a desktop PC with Windows 98 and JAWS after that. My parents wanted me to 
get my own computer before I started college.

I used a Mac computer for the first time in the summer of 2000 after my first 
semester of college and learned outSPOKEN. I attended Berklee College of Music 
in Boston from 2000 to 2004, and almost everyone was using the Mac OS. For a 
couple of my music tech classes, I used outSPOKEN when I was learning Digital 
Performer and ProTools. I still used the Windows platform most of the time from 
1998 until  2013, then I decided to switch back over to the Mac. I had worked 
in a couple call centers as a telephone reservations sales agent for 6 years, 
and wanted to get back into the entertainment industry doing audio production 
work and music again. I majored in Music Production and Engineering in college, 
and wanted to get back into a career I enjoy and am passionate about . Now, I 
do just about everything with the Mac and my iPhone. I received the new 
VarioUltra braille display earlier this year, and use that device with the 
iphone or when I’m at work and don’t want to use speech.

I can’t believe how far we’ve come with technology since the 1980’s! Back then, 
everything was so huge and bulky 30 years ago. Now the size of everything has 
drastically shrunk down and gotten much smaller. It will be interesting to see 
what technology changes happen during the next 30 to 40 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

Wut?  "Stupid sighted people"?  That's a little harsh, don'tcha think?  LOL! 
Smile.

---
It's all good, just am sayin'.

Christopher Gilland
JAWS Certified, 2016.
Training Instructor.

clgillan...@gmail.com
Phone: (704) 256-8010.
- Original Message - 
From: "Terje Strømberg" 

To: "Mac Group" 
Cc: "Terje Strømberg" 
Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2016 3:56 AM
Subject: Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at 
only 22





Take care

Great article. So many stupid sighted people around.



12. jul. 2016 kl. 08.19 skrev Anne Robertson :

I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools 
for the blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, 
which didn’t interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn 
physics.
I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised 
in languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into 
computer programming.
The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted 
colleagues was the optacon. I was able to read the terminal screen and 
printout. I programmed the Apple ii in hexadecimal and read all the 
manuals using the optacon.
I didn’t use speech on a computer until we got a Mac, a 2SI, during the 
90s and I purchased OutSpoken.
It never occurred to me that I might not be able to get a job as a blind 
person once the optacon became available to me.


Cheers,

Anne




On 12 Jul 2016, at 05:15, Donna Goodin  wrote:

Hey Scott,

First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post. 
But ...


As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, 
math and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my 
dad was a computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me 
how important tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of 
him bringing home those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for 
my brother and me to play with.  I remember going with him into the 
office on Saturdays and seeing the computer, which was this great big 
behemoth that took up an entire room.  I remember him teaching me base 2 
at the dinner table.  But once I got to school, my math and science 
teachers had no idea what to do with me.  Classes were taught almost 
exclusively on the blackboard, and I was bored out of my mind.  I grew up 
thinking I sucked at math, and it wasn't until I was in my thirties that 
I realized that I was actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back in the 
80s, I went out with this total computer geek.  I was fascinated by all 
the stuff he was into, but neither he nor I knew how to make all that 
accessible to me.  (And by that time, I actually owned a TSI 
Versabraille).  I think that had I been born within the last 25 years, I 
actually would have chosen IT--or something related--as a career. 
Clearly something was different for you and John.  Maybe it was innate 
intelligence, maybe there was a gender bias at play, maybe it was 
opportunity, I don't know.  I do know from other posts I've seen from you 
that your parents seemed quite willing to think out of the box.  I grew 
up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, my dad was 22.  Having a 
blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited world.  I don't think 
my experience is unique.  Whatever it was that jived for you guys, didn't 
carry over to lots of blind folks.


So yes, it was a fluff piece.  And yes, I wish they'd just treat blind 
folks like everyone else.  But I also hope that there's a little Donna 
out there somewhere--or maybe little Donna's parents--who don't buy into 
those preconceived notions about what someone who's blind can or cannot 
do, and that someday 20 years from now, that little Donna finds herself 
at the heart of technological developments.


Just an alternate perspective.
Cheers,
Donna


On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:32 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:

So here’s my problem with the article.

I think it’s fantastic what this young lady is doing, I absolutely 
support her efforts.  I also am thrilled that apple hired someone from 
our community for the design side.  I’m also happy Google does the same 
now and there’s discussion of teaching children to code.


My problem is with the reporter.  These articles are so damn fluff 
happy.  Look at Apple saving the day for blind people.  Like it’s 
something new.  Never mind you John and I built parts of the networks 
this reporter publishes on.:)  The article leads the reader to believe 
that blind people could only code until recently.  This blind guy as a 
child started coding 33+ years ago learning things like 6502 assembler, 
Apple Soft, PASCAL, then C and so forth. We used apples or PCs or what 
ever to get it done and in some ways have been directly or indirectly 
involved with the development of computers 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[maurice.mines]

Good afternoon, I figured I’d chime in on this thread, my computing life 
somewhat goes like this Windows for a great number of years, then I wind up 
going to grad school and switching completely to the Mac, now rehab tells me 
that in order to get any type of employment I must use Windows, instead of a 
Mac. In truth I’m quite comfortable with both operating systems. However I 
spend most of my time on the Mac side of the house, because the dictation 
software that I’m using to write this response is on the Mac side, however some 
of the applications such as a specialized application that I use for amateur 
radio stuff is on the Windows side only, and some of the wordprocessing things 
that I have to do in office are primarily on the Windows side. I guess what I’m 
getting at here is that I use whatever operating system, and applications best 
gets a particular task done. I’m not a programmer, but I’ve got this idea for 
an application in my head and in my spare time I’m trying to figure out the 
best way to maybe one day in the distant future make it into a reality. That 
will just have to come later. As far is the discussion about using braille, 
these days I’m very definitely deaf blind so you can guess that braille is a 
very large part of my computing experience due to the fact that if there’s 
something, that I just can’t hear, I have to be able to read it and not rely on 
synthetic speech. And these days I like to have my braille by a Bluetooth, 
fewer cables connecting our devices I think is a good thing from an overall 
safety standpoint however the hassles and using Bluetooth, or whatever short 
range communications method may come in the future it is likely to outweigh the 
issues of not having a physical cable between the devices. Just my thoughts on 
this. On July like afternoon in the Pacific Northwest part of the United States.

Sincerely Maurice mines.
Message number, 360-524-9331.
Amateur radio call sign, kd0iko.
note that the text of my comments have been dictated to the computer by using 
Dragon version 5 for Mac OS, if there are errors in the text of my comments 
they may be the result of either the software or the dictation process. If 
there’s something that you truly didn’t understand please let me know, I will 
do my very best to clear up any misunderstandings.
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 8:28 AM, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I love reading this personal historical info on folks.  Sure, off topic, but 
> totally acceptable in my world.  The common thread here is supportive and 
> progressive parents and teachers.  I really didn't use Braille until my late 
> teens, probably due to having some usable sight and an immature desire to not 
> be considered blind.  Consequently, my Braille is limited to Grade 1, and 
> primarily only used to cheat, oops, I mean play cards with others.  I was a 
> classroom teacher for about 25 years then moved into Admin as a Technology 
> Consultant and Project Manager for a new Science & Tech Centre in our School 
> District.  Probably 95% of my computer experience has been with Apple 
> products with a smattering of Digital Equipment Main Frames and Windows.
> 
> Later...
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 07:53, Donna Goodin  > wrote:
> 
> Hi Anne,
> 
> That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I 
> was a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the 
> slow speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have 
> been different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read 
> fiction, which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had I 
> had a need to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also been a 
> little older--I would have been more driven to stick with it.
> 
> It's funny, I still have my Optacon.  It's just sitting in our basement 
> gathering dust.  I probably should do something with it some day.
> Cheers,
> Donna
>> On Jul 12, 2016, at 1:19 AM, Anne Robertson > > wrote:
>> 
>> I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for 
>> the blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which 
>> didn’t interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
>> I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
>> languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
>> programming.
>> The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted 
>> colleagues was the optacon. I was able to read the terminal screen and 
>> printout. I programmed the Apple ii in hexadecimal and read all the manuals 
>> using the optacon.
>> I didn’t use speech on a computer until we got a Mac, a 2SI, during the 90s 
>> and I purchased OutSpoken.
>> It never occurred to me that I might not be able 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Tim Kilburn]

Hi,

I love reading this personal historical info on folks.  Sure, off topic, but 
totally acceptable in my world.  The common thread here is supportive and 
progressive parents and teachers.  I really didn't use Braille until my late 
teens, probably due to having some usable sight and an immature desire to not 
be considered blind.  Consequently, my Braille is limited to Grade 1, and 
primarily only used to cheat, oops, I mean play cards with others.  I was a 
classroom teacher for about 25 years then moved into Admin as a Technology 
Consultant and Project Manager for a new Science & Tech Centre in our School 
District.  Probably 95% of my computer experience has been with Apple products 
with a smattering of Digital Equipment Main Frames and Windows.

Later...

Tim Kilburn
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

On Jul 12, 2016, at 07:53, Donna Goodin  wrote:

Hi Anne,

That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I was 
a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the slow 
speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have been 
different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read fiction, 
which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had I had a need 
to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also been a little 
older--I would have been more driven to stick with it.

It's funny, I still have my Optacon.  It's just sitting in our basement 
gathering dust.  I probably should do something with it some day.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 1:19 AM, Anne Robertson  > wrote:
> 
> I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for 
> the blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which 
> didn’t interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
> I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
> languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
> programming.
> The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted 
> colleagues was the optacon. I was able to read the terminal screen and 
> printout. I programmed the Apple ii in hexadecimal and read all the manuals 
> using the optacon.
> I didn’t use speech on a computer until we got a Mac, a 2SI, during the 90s 
> and I purchased OutSpoken.
> It never occurred to me that I might not be able to get a job as a blind 
> person once the optacon became available to me.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
> 
>> On 12 Jul 2016, at 05:15, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hey Scott,
>> 
>> First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  
>> But ...
>> 
>> As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, math 
>> and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my dad was 
>> a computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me how 
>> important tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of him 
>> bringing home those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my 
>> brother and me to play with.  I remember going with him into the office on 
>> Saturdays and seeing the computer, which was this great big behemoth that 
>> took up an entire room.  I remember him teaching me base 2 at the dinner 
>> table.  But once I got to school, my math and science teachers had no idea 
>> what to do with me.  Classes were taught almost exclusively on the 
>> blackboard, and I was bored out of my mind.  I grew up thinking I sucked at 
>> math, and it wasn't until I was in my thirties that I realized that I was 
>> actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back in the 80s, I went out with this 
>> total computer geek.  I was fascinated by all the stuff he was into, but 
>> neither he nor I knew how to make all that accessible to me.  (And by that 
>> time, I actually owned a TSI Versabraille).  I think that had I been born 
>> within the last 25 years, I actually would have chosen IT--or something 
>> related--as a career.  Clearly something was different for you and John.  
>> Maybe it was innate intelligence, maybe there was a gender bias at play, 
>> maybe it was opportunity, I don't know.  I do know from other posts I've 
>> seen from you that your parents seemed quite willing to think out of the 
>> box.  I grew up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, my dad was 22.  
>> Having a blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited world.  I don't 
>> think my experience is unique.  Whatever it was that jived for you guys, 
>> didn't carry over to lots of blind folks.
>> 
>> So yes, it was a fluff piece.  And yes, I wish they'd just treat blind folks 
>> like everyone else.  But I also hope that there's a little Donna out there 
>> somewhere--or maybe little Donna's parents--who don't buy into those 
>> preconceived notions about what someone 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Hi Anne,

That's really interesting.  I didn't do as well as you with the Optacon.  I was 
a very fast braille reader, and at age 11, lacked the patience for the slow 
speed of reading with the Optacon.  But I can see where it would have been 
different having a specific purpose in mind.  I was using it to read fiction, 
which I could do much more efficiently with braille.  Probably had I had a need 
to do something specific with it--and frankly, had I also been a little 
older--I would have been more driven to stick with it.

It's funny, I still have my Optacon.  It's just sitting in our basement 
gathering dust.  I probably should do something with it some day.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Jul 12, 2016, at 1:19 AM, Anne Robertson  wrote:
> 
> I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for 
> the blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which 
> didn’t interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
> I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
> languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
> programming.
> The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted 
> colleagues was the optacon. I was able to read the terminal screen and 
> printout. I programmed the Apple ii in hexadecimal and read all the manuals 
> using the optacon.
> I didn’t use speech on a computer until we got a Mac, a 2SI, during the 90s 
> and I purchased OutSpoken.
> It never occurred to me that I might not be able to get a job as a blind 
> person once the optacon became available to me.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
> 
>> On 12 Jul 2016, at 05:15, Donna Goodin > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hey Scott,
>> 
>> First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  
>> But ...
>> 
>> As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, math 
>> and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my dad was 
>> a computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me how 
>> important tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of him 
>> bringing home those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my 
>> brother and me to play with.  I remember going with him into the office on 
>> Saturdays and seeing the computer, which was this great big behemoth that 
>> took up an entire room.  I remember him teaching me base 2 at the dinner 
>> table.  But once I got to school, my math and science teachers had no idea 
>> what to do with me.  Classes were taught almost exclusively on the 
>> blackboard, and I was bored out of my mind.  I grew up thinking I sucked at 
>> math, and it wasn't until I was in my thirties that I realized that I was 
>> actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back in the 80s, I went out with this 
>> total computer geek.  I was fascinated by all the stuff he was into, but 
>> neither he nor I knew how to make all that accessible to me.  (And by that 
>> time, I actually owned a TSI Versabraille).  I think that had I been born 
>> within the last 25 years, I actually would have chosen IT--or something 
>> related--as a career.  Clearly something was different for you and John.  
>> Maybe it was innate intelligence, maybe there was a gender bias at play, 
>> maybe it was opportunity, I don't know.  I do know from other posts I've 
>> seen from you that your parents seemed quite willing to think out of the 
>> box.  I grew up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, my dad was 22.  
>> Having a blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited world.  I don't 
>> think my experience is unique.  Whatever it was that jived for you guys, 
>> didn't carry over to lots of blind folks.
>> 
>> So yes, it was a fluff piece.  And yes, I wish they'd just treat blind folks 
>> like everyone else.  But I also hope that there's a little Donna out there 
>> somewhere--or maybe little Donna's parents--who don't buy into those 
>> preconceived notions about what someone who's blind can or cannot do, and 
>> that someday 20 years from now, that little Donna finds herself at the heart 
>> of technological developments.
>> 
>> Just an alternate perspective.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:32 PM, Scott Granados >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> So here’s my problem with the article.
>>> 
>>> I think it’s fantastic what this young lady is doing, I absolutely support 
>>> her efforts.  I also am thrilled that apple hired someone from our 
>>> community for the design side.  I’m also happy Google does the same now and 
>>> there’s discussion of teaching children to code.
>>> 
>>> My problem is with the reporter.  These articles are so damn fluff happy.  
>>> Look at Apple saving the day for blind people.  Like it’s something new.  
>>> Never mind you John and I built parts of the networks this reporter 
>>> publishes 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Hey Scott,

You know, your posts always have so much that I want to respond to, that I 
hardly know where to begin. :) 

I didn't know that your blindness was illness-related.  That truly must have 
been frightening for you and your parents.  No one has ever really figured out 
the cause of my blindness, though it wasn't for lack of trying.  My parents 
spent lots of time and money hauling me to eye-doctors all over the country 
until I got old enough to refuse to go any more.  To this day I hate 
eye-doctors. :)

It does seem like our histories are very similar.  I think, at least early on, 
my mother was sure I was going to end up selling pencils, but happily my dad 
would have none of that.  I have heard that my mom wanted to send me to the 
local school for the blind because she was afraid the kids at the regular 
school would be mean to me.  My dad said no because he figured I was going to 
have to learn to deal with the sighted world eventually, so better sooner than 
later.  To this day I'm grateful that he did that.  I, too, was mainstreamed 
and had an amazing resource teacher,.  I know that experience helped get me off 
to a good start.  It seems that my experience with language teachers parallels 
your experience with science teachers.  I always had stellar language teachers, 
and they always took a very strong interest in me.  That undoubtedly played a 
huge part in my choice of teaching language as a career.

But there was at least one key difference; my mom never went to college.  She 
has always stayed home.  I think that as a result of that, and also of the time 
period, there probably was gender bias involved, at least to some extent.  My 
mom's quite traditional - I think that well into my college years she hoped I'd 
just find a nice boy and get married. :(  So, when it came to pinball machines 
and such, my brother was the one who played, not me.  Mind you, I'm sure that 
had I asked, I would have had the opportunity, but it never occurred to me, I 
was more into music and reading and stuff.

It's funny, I remember having the same fascination with synthesizers as a kid, 
but for me, I just wanted to get my hands on one and play it.  I wasn't really 
all that curious about what made it work.

At any rate, bringing this back on topic, I didn't get my first computer till 
shortly after I was married, in my late twenties.  Prior to that I had had an 
Optacon, a Microbrailler, and a VersaBraille, but of course, those devices 
paled in comparison to the real thing.  I didn't see my first Mac until I had 
to use one for a job in 1995 or so.  It was running OutSpoken, and I absolutely 
hated it. lol  I had always been intensely braille-oriented, and I think I just 
couldn't get my head around learning a new system, with lousy speech output and 
no braille. And yes, I completely agree about the importance of braille 
literacy.

Anyway, this has gotten pretty far off-topic, so I will sign off, now.  But it 
is interesting learning about list members' different--and similar--experiences.
Cheers,
Donna

P.S.  Oh, and some day you'll have to share how you got into and out of that 
cult. :)

 

> On Jul 11, 2016, at 11:07 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Donna, it amazes me how similar our histories are.  My childhood has a lot of 
> parallels to yours.  My mother and father had me at about the same time 
> frame.  My father had just come back from Vietnam serving as a marine and my 
> mother graduated college with an Art degree.  I’m not sure if it was there 
> upbringings, the marine training or just pure luck but they seemed to get 
> ahold of things pretty quickly.  I think for both our parents having a blind 
> child was an emotional ride none of us would want to have.  I know in my case 
> they were more concerned with me surviving the illness and treatments more 
> than the blindness itself.  My mother got involved with some parents groups 
> early on and stayed home to take care of me until maybe age 10 or so with is 
> a luxury many do not have.  My dad worked for a major ship builder so had a 
> wonderful middle class job as an electrician and a fantastic union health 
> plan.  I’d have probably died with out that coverage as the costs were in the 
> 7 figure range and my parents didn’t end up spending anything for my care and 
> worked with Ronald McDonald house to stay with me when I had to go to the big 
> bad city for treatments.
>   I think the difference for me was my science teachers realized I had 
> potential at a young age.  I was given typing classes from the first grade on 
> in place of hand writing, I had an amazing resource teacher who was also 
> totally blind that made all the difference in the world, and our planetarium 
> director / 8th grade science teacher took a personal interest in me and made 
> sure I was heavily exposed to anything science like.  My parents were both 
> interested in all things science and I was exposed to everything from 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Hi David,

I've seen similar studies.  Glad we're finally figuring that out. :)

> On Jul 11, 2016, at 11:53 PM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> Donna,
> 
> I am seeing current studies which are demonstrating that younger girls 
> actually tend to have greater STEM aptitude compared with boys. Something 
> changes for most of them by the time they complete secondary school. This is 
> the subject of several current research studies.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com 
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On 12 Jul 2016, at 15:16, Donna Goodin  > wrote:
> 
>> Hey Scott,
>> 
>> First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  
>> But ...
>> 
>> As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, math 
>> and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my dad was 
>> a computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me how 
>> important tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of him 
>> bringing home those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my 
>> brother and me to play with.  I remember going with him into the office on 
>> Saturdays and seeing the computer, which was this great big behemoth that 
>> took up an entire room.  I remember him teaching me base 2 at the dinner 
>> table.  But once I got to school, my math and science teachers had no idea 
>> what to do with me.  Classes were taught almost exclusively on the 
>> blackboard, and I was bored out of my mind.  I grew up thinking I sucked at 
>> math, and it wasn't until I was in my thirties that I realized that I was 
>> actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back in the 80s, I went out with this 
>> total computer geek.  I was fascinated by all the stuff he was into, but 
>> neither he nor I knew how to make all that accessible to me.  (And by that 
>> time, I actually owned a TSI Versabraille).  I think that had I been born 
>> within the last 25 years, I actually would have chosen IT--or something 
>> related--as a career.  Clearly something was different for you and John.  
>> Maybe it was innate intelligence, maybe there was a gender bias at play, 
>> maybe it was opportunity, I don't know.  I do know from other posts I've 
>> seen from you that your parents seemed quite willing to think out of the 
>> box.  I grew up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, my dad was 22.  
>> Having a blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited world.  I don't 
>> think my experience is unique.  Whatever it was that jived for you guys, 
>> didn't carry over to lots of blind folks.
>> 
>> So yes, it was a fluff piece.  And yes, I wish they'd just treat blind folks 
>> like everyone else.  But I also hope that there's a little Donna out there 
>> somewhere--or maybe little Donna's parents--who don't buy into those 
>> preconceived notions about what someone who's blind can or cannot do, and 
>> that someday 20 years from now, that little Donna finds herself at the heart 
>> of technological developments.
>> 
>> Just an alternate perspective.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:32 PM, Scott Granados >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> So here’s my problem with the article.
>>> 
>>> I think it’s fantastic what this young lady is doing, I absolutely support 
>>> her efforts.  I also am thrilled that apple hired someone from our 
>>> community for the design side.  I’m also happy Google does the same now and 
>>> there’s discussion of teaching children to code.
>>> 
>>> My problem is with the reporter.  These articles are so damn fluff happy.  
>>> Look at Apple saving the day for blind people.  Like it’s something new.  
>>> Never mind you John and I built parts of the networks this reporter 
>>> publishes on.:)  The article leads the reader to believe that blind people 
>>> could only code until recently.  This blind guy as a child started coding 
>>> 33+ years ago learning things like 6502 assembler, Apple Soft, PASCAL, then 
>>> C and so forth. We used apples or PCs or what ever to get it done and in 
>>> some ways have been directly or indirectly involved with the development of 
>>> computers since the very beginning.  Real trail blazers like your self or 
>>> Ray Kurzweil building devices to help his child, certain musicians with 
>>> very deep pockets who brought some of the funding to the table, any blind 
>>> person at all who successfully landed a job and held it showing others in 
>>> our own little way we’re just people doing the same things that everyone 
>>> else does, try to help take care of your selves, families and participate 
>>> in our communities.
>>> I guess part of me just wishes that instead of being singled out and 
>>> made to be some sort of something special we were just dealt with and 
>>> reflected on by reporters especially as 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Terje Strømberg]

Take care

Great article. So many stupid sighted people around.


> 12. jul. 2016 kl. 08.19 skrev Anne Robertson :
> 
> I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for 
> the blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which 
> didn’t interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
> I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
> languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
> programming.
> The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted 
> colleagues was the optacon. I was able to read the terminal screen and 
> printout. I programmed the Apple ii in hexadecimal and read all the manuals 
> using the optacon.
> I didn’t use speech on a computer until we got a Mac, a 2SI, during the 90s 
> and I purchased OutSpoken.
> It never occurred to me that I might not be able to get a job as a blind 
> person once the optacon became available to me.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Anne
> 
> 
> 
>> On 12 Jul 2016, at 05:15, Donna Goodin  wrote:
>> 
>> Hey Scott,
>> 
>> First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  
>> But ...
>> 
>> As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, math 
>> and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my dad was 
>> a computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me how 
>> important tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of him 
>> bringing home those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my 
>> brother and me to play with.  I remember going with him into the office on 
>> Saturdays and seeing the computer, which was this great big behemoth that 
>> took up an entire room.  I remember him teaching me base 2 at the dinner 
>> table.  But once I got to school, my math and science teachers had no idea 
>> what to do with me.  Classes were taught almost exclusively on the 
>> blackboard, and I was bored out of my mind.  I grew up thinking I sucked at 
>> math, and it wasn't until I was in my thirties that I realized that I was 
>> actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back in the 80s, I went out with this 
>> total computer geek.  I was fascinated by all the stuff he was into, but 
>> neither he nor I knew how to make all that accessible to me.  (And by that 
>> time, I actually owned a TSI Versabraille).  I think that had I been born 
>> within the last 25 years, I actually would have chosen IT--or something 
>> related--as a career.  Clearly something was different for you and John.  
>> Maybe it was innate intelligence, maybe there was a gender bias at play, 
>> maybe it was opportunity, I don't know.  I do know from other posts I've 
>> seen from you that your parents seemed quite willing to think out of the 
>> box.  I grew up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, my dad was 22.  
>> Having a blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited world.  I don't 
>> think my experience is unique.  Whatever it was that jived for you guys, 
>> didn't carry over to lots of blind folks.
>> 
>> So yes, it was a fluff piece.  And yes, I wish they'd just treat blind folks 
>> like everyone else.  But I also hope that there's a little Donna out there 
>> somewhere--or maybe little Donna's parents--who don't buy into those 
>> preconceived notions about what someone who's blind can or cannot do, and 
>> that someday 20 years from now, that little Donna finds herself at the heart 
>> of technological developments.
>> 
>> Just an alternate perspective.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>> 
>>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:32 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> So here’s my problem with the article.
>>> 
>>> I think it’s fantastic what this young lady is doing, I absolutely support 
>>> her efforts.  I also am thrilled that apple hired someone from our 
>>> community for the design side.  I’m also happy Google does the same now and 
>>> there’s discussion of teaching children to code.
>>> 
>>> My problem is with the reporter.  These articles are so damn fluff happy.  
>>> Look at Apple saving the day for blind people.  Like it’s something new.  
>>> Never mind you John and I built parts of the networks this reporter 
>>> publishes on.:)  The article leads the reader to believe that blind people 
>>> could only code until recently.  This blind guy as a child started coding 
>>> 33+ years ago learning things like 6502 assembler, Apple Soft, PASCAL, then 
>>> C and so forth. We used apples or PCs or what ever to get it done and in 
>>> some ways have been directly or indirectly involved with the development of 
>>> computers since the very beginning.  Real trail blazers like your self or 
>>> Ray Kurzweil building devices to help his child, certain musicians with 
>>> very deep pockets who brought some of the funding to the table, any blind 
>>> person at all who successfully landed a job and held it showing 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Anne Robertson]

I grew up in England and between the ages of 7 and 17, attended schools for the 
blind where maths was taught, but the only science was biology, which didn’t 
interest me at the time. I would have preferred to learn physics.
I finished my secondary education in a mainstream school and specialised in 
languages. I studied French at university, but then I went into computer 
programming.
The tool that allowed me to work on an equal footing with my sighted colleagues 
was the optacon. I was able to read the terminal screen and printout. I 
programmed the Apple ii in hexadecimal and read all the manuals using the 
optacon.
I didn’t use speech on a computer until we got a Mac, a 2SI, during the 90s and 
I purchased OutSpoken.
It never occurred to me that I might not be able to get a job as a blind person 
once the optacon became available to me.

Cheers,

Anne



> On 12 Jul 2016, at 05:15, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Hey Scott,
> 
> First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  
> But ...
> 
> As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, math 
> and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my dad was a 
> computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me how important 
> tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of him bringing home 
> those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my brother and me to 
> play with.  I remember going with him into the office on Saturdays and seeing 
> the computer, which was this great big behemoth that took up an entire room.  
> I remember him teaching me base 2 at the dinner table.  But once I got to 
> school, my math and science teachers had no idea what to do with me.  Classes 
> were taught almost exclusively on the blackboard, and I was bored out of my 
> mind.  I grew up thinking I sucked at math, and it wasn't until I was in my 
> thirties that I realized that I was actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back 
> in the 80s, I went out with this total computer geek.  I was fascinated by 
> all the stuff he was into, but neither he nor I knew how to make all that 
> accessible to me.  (And by that time, I actually owned a TSI Versabraille).  
> I think that had I been born within the last 25 years, I actually would have 
> chosen IT--or something related--as a career.  Clearly something was 
> different for you and John.  Maybe it was innate intelligence, maybe there 
> was a gender bias at play, maybe it was opportunity, I don't know.  I do know 
> from other posts I've seen from you that your parents seemed quite willing to 
> think out of the box.  I grew up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, 
> my dad was 22.  Having a blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited 
> world.  I don't think my experience is unique.  Whatever it was that jived 
> for you guys, didn't carry over to lots of blind folks.
> 
> So yes, it was a fluff piece.  And yes, I wish they'd just treat blind folks 
> like everyone else.  But I also hope that there's a little Donna out there 
> somewhere--or maybe little Donna's parents--who don't buy into those 
> preconceived notions about what someone who's blind can or cannot do, and 
> that someday 20 years from now, that little Donna finds herself at the heart 
> of technological developments.
> 
> Just an alternate perspective.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:32 PM, Scott Granados > > wrote:
>> 
>> So here’s my problem with the article.
>> 
>> I think it’s fantastic what this young lady is doing, I absolutely support 
>> her efforts.  I also am thrilled that apple hired someone from our community 
>> for the design side.  I’m also happy Google does the same now and there’s 
>> discussion of teaching children to code.
>> 
>> My problem is with the reporter.  These articles are so damn fluff happy.  
>> Look at Apple saving the day for blind people.  Like it’s something new.  
>> Never mind you John and I built parts of the networks this reporter 
>> publishes on.:)  The article leads the reader to believe that blind people 
>> could only code until recently.  This blind guy as a child started coding 
>> 33+ years ago learning things like 6502 assembler, Apple Soft, PASCAL, then 
>> C and so forth. We used apples or PCs or what ever to get it done and in 
>> some ways have been directly or indirectly involved with the development of 
>> computers since the very beginning.  Real trail blazers like your self or 
>> Ray Kurzweil building devices to help his child, certain musicians with very 
>> deep pockets who brought some of the funding to the table, any blind person 
>> at all who successfully landed a job and held it showing others in our own 
>> little way we’re just people doing the same things that everyone else does, 
>> try to help take care of your selves, families and participate in our 
>> communities.
>>  I guess part of me just 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

Donna,

I am seeing current studies which are demonstrating that younger girls actually 
tend to have greater STEM aptitude compared with boys. Something changes for 
most of them by the time they complete secondary school. This is the subject of 
several current research studies.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 12 Jul 2016, at 15:16, Donna Goodin  wrote:
> 
> Hey Scott,
> 
> First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  
> But ...
> 
> As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, math 
> and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my dad was a 
> computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me how important 
> tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of him bringing home 
> those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my brother and me to 
> play with.  I remember going with him into the office on Saturdays and seeing 
> the computer, which was this great big behemoth that took up an entire room.  
> I remember him teaching me base 2 at the dinner table.  But once I got to 
> school, my math and science teachers had no idea what to do with me.  Classes 
> were taught almost exclusively on the blackboard, and I was bored out of my 
> mind.  I grew up thinking I sucked at math, and it wasn't until I was in my 
> thirties that I realized that I was actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back 
> in the 80s, I went out with this total computer geek.  I was fascinated by 
> all the stuff he was into, but neither he nor I knew how to make all that 
> accessible to me.  (And by that time, I actually owned a TSI Versabraille).  
> I think that had I been born within the last 25 years, I actually would have 
> chosen IT--or something related--as a career.  Clearly something was 
> different for you and John.  Maybe it was innate intelligence, maybe there 
> was a gender bias at play, maybe it was opportunity, I don't know.  I do know 
> from other posts I've seen from you that your parents seemed quite willing to 
> think out of the box.  I grew up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, 
> my dad was 22.  Having a blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited 
> world.  I don't think my experience is unique.  Whatever it was that jived 
> for you guys, didn't carry over to lots of blind folks.
> 
> So yes, it was a fluff piece.  And yes, I wish they'd just treat blind folks 
> like everyone else.  But I also hope that there's a little Donna out there 
> somewhere--or maybe little Donna's parents--who don't buy into those 
> preconceived notions about what someone who's blind can or cannot do, and 
> that someday 20 years from now, that little Donna finds herself at the heart 
> of technological developments.
> 
> Just an alternate perspective.
> Cheers,
> Donna
> 
>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:32 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> So here’s my problem with the article.
>> 
>> I think it’s fantastic what this young lady is doing, I absolutely support 
>> her efforts.  I also am thrilled that apple hired someone from our community 
>> for the design side.  I’m also happy Google does the same now and there’s 
>> discussion of teaching children to code.
>> 
>> My problem is with the reporter.  These articles are so damn fluff happy.  
>> Look at Apple saving the day for blind people.  Like it’s something new.  
>> Never mind you John and I built parts of the networks this reporter 
>> publishes on.:)  The article leads the reader to believe that blind people 
>> could only code until recently.  This blind guy as a child started coding 
>> 33+ years ago learning things like 6502 assembler, Apple Soft, PASCAL, then 
>> C and so forth. We used apples or PCs or what ever to get it done and in 
>> some ways have been directly or indirectly involved with the development of 
>> computers since the very beginning.  Real trail blazers like your self or 
>> Ray Kurzweil building devices to help his child, certain musicians with very 
>> deep pockets who brought some of the funding to the table, any blind person 
>> at all who successfully landed a job and held it showing others in our own 
>> little way we’re just people doing the same things that everyone else does, 
>> try to help take care of your selves, families and participate in our 
>> communities.
>>  I guess part of me just wishes that instead of being singled out and 
>> made to be some sort of something special we were just dealt with and 
>> reflected on by reporters especially as just another part of society.  Lest 
>> I get way to NFB here:) but there’s something to be said for being lumped in 
>> with everyone else.:)  The special attention sometimes makes us seem well 
>> special in the sense we’re not the norm, we’re almost untouchable and 
>> separate to make a reference to a really unfortunate cultural label in 
>> eastern 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

I used the information in an interview today, and one of the panelists said he 
noticed the same thing. I shifted the interview to a brief speculation on why 
this might be (I enjoy briefly redirecting interviews). The concensus of the 
panel was that the number continues being used because it is good for getting 
funding.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 12 Jul 2016, at 14:34, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Hi David, you know, I’ve heard that 70% number for ever, even pre 1995.  I 
> hope you’re right though, I’d love to see that number drop meaningfully.
> 
> 
>> On Jul 11, 2016, at 5:24 PM, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> Actually, those stats are from a study which is about 18 years old. Even 
>> worse, however, is the stats about unemployment of the blind. Those stats, 
>> often sited in studies across the board, come from a study published in 1995 
>> or 1997 (I would need to look it up again for the exact date). The most 
>> recent info I have seen was published by the state of Oregon in 2007 (if 
>> memory serves) which places blindness unemployment rate at around 60%, not 
>> the often sited 70% to 80%. Note: I researched this in 2012, so am unaware 
>> of any data published since then.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: nexu...@icloud.com
>> Mobile: 0450 788 988
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> On 12 Jul 2016, at 08:30, 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>>> Interesting stats they mention about correlation between braille literacy 
>>> and employment. I just had an iOS developer reach out to me who said WWDC 
>>> had a heavy emphasis on accessibility this year. I've never been so I can't 
>>> compare. I hope that's true. Nothing but good can come from more developers 
>>> become aware and care.
>>> 
>>> CB
>>> 
 On 7/11/16 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
 Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything 
 about braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working 
 on accessibility.
 http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
 
 This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
 
 Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations. 
 
 She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her 
 grandfather could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide 
 his wedding ring along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had 
 a slim chance of survival.
 
 It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first 
 time she shattered them.
 
 Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early 
 delivery. But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy 
 expectations of people with disabilities, motivating her to be 
 adventurous, hands-on and insatiably curious.
 
 It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it 
 was the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, 
 or the classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school. 
 
 "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users." 
 She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her 
 to figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
 
 "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks 
 I wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing 
 features like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that 
 with my knowledge of computers and technology, I could help change the 
 world for people with disabilities.
 
 "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
 
 Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation
 
 There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace 
 initiatives — the need to include the perspectives of people with 
 disabilities.
 
 Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
 component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how 
 much that can strengthen a company.
 
 She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
 introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
 gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — 
 and she was nervous.
 
 "You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going 
 to know unless you talk to them ... so go."
 
 
 
 Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

Donna, it amazes me how similar our histories are.  My childhood has a lot of 
parallels to yours.  My mother and father had me at about the same time frame.  
My father had just come back from Vietnam serving as a marine and my mother 
graduated college with an Art degree.  I’m not sure if it was there 
upbringings, the marine training or just pure luck but they seemed to get ahold 
of things pretty quickly.  I think for both our parents having a blind child 
was an emotional ride none of us would want to have.  I know in my case they 
were more concerned with me surviving the illness and treatments more than the 
blindness itself.  My mother got involved with some parents groups early on and 
stayed home to take care of me until maybe age 10 or so with is a luxury many 
do not have.  My dad worked for a major ship builder so had a wonderful middle 
class job as an electrician and a fantastic union health plan.  I’d have 
probably died with out that coverage as the costs were in the 7 figure range 
and my parents didn’t end up spending anything for my care and worked with 
Ronald McDonald house to stay with me when I had to go to the big bad city for 
treatments.
I think the difference for me was my science teachers realized I had 
potential at a young age.  I was given typing classes from the first grade on 
in place of hand writing, I had an amazing resource teacher who was also 
totally blind that made all the difference in the world, and our planetarium 
director / 8th grade science teacher took a personal interest in me and made 
sure I was heavily exposed to anything science like.  My parents were both 
interested in all things science and I was exposed to everything from UFO 
culture to the old Cosmos TV show to learning all about computers.
Luckily I was also encouraged to work at a young age and did saving up 
for my own computer in Junior High or middle school which at the time cost me 
over $3000 for an Apple 2E with all the fixings.
I have two very strong memories that I remember inspiring me as a very 
young child.  One was driving around in our chevy Nova with my dad listening to 
the Steve Miller Band being absolutely amazed with all the synthetic sounds.  
Fly like an Eagle was a trip for a young kid, was also a trip in my teenage 
years but in a much different way, lol.  I remember being absolutely driven to 
learn how it was Steve Miller was able to make all that crazy synthesizer sound.
The other was being taken to game arcades by my father at about the 
same time.  This would have been 5 years old or so.  I was amazed with pinball 
machines.  Had to learn how they worked, how they generated all the crazy 
voices and synthetic sounds.  Games like Alien poker and Time Warp were way out 
and I remember seeing the space invaders prototype when I was a few years older 
at the Big E (Newengland states fair).  I was hooked, electronics here we come. 
 I had earned EE credits by age 9 and had my general class Ham license by age 
10.  It was there I discovered hacking and phreaking and we won't go in to that 
here.:)  The drugs and girls slowed down my progress through the teens but I 
got back on track again in my early 20s.
I think an important thing is I was never over protected, at least no 
more than usual.  I was aloud to fail, get the hell shocked out of me, break 
things, learn from mistakes that sometimes resulted in lots of smoke or 
structural damage.:) I learned prisoner of war training, got waterboarded 
several times, sleep depravation, forced marches, survival training, tactics 
just short of being attached to a field telephone lol as well as learned to 
field service an M16 not much longer after I learned to walk.  My dad used to 
take me to the local reservoirs / woods and shoot guns and grenade launchers. 
(I’d like to see what would happen if I tried that today, something tells me 
the local police would object to me shooting an M79 grenade launcher off behind 
the old pumping station) (actually, come to think of it we used the older M203 
but same idea) Believe it or not, I used these skills to escape from a cult 
when I was 9 but that’s a story for another list. 
I’m not sure kids today have the same options we did, certainly not the 
same fun we did.  I think to bottom line this here the reason I got exposed to 
science and computers was a lot to do with luck.  I happened to be born and 
grow up in a town that totally drank the mainstreaming koolade and had science 
teachers who really took a personal interest.  As well as a set of parents who 
wouldn’t take no mess.:) My area was also very science focused.  We were all 
being raised to work in the Nuclear power plant or the ship yard so my little 
piece of Connecticut liked their sciences.

Oh and one more thing, for goodness sake Braille literacy is so so important.  
Even though I do not use it now much and haven’t since school it gave me that 
understanding and 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Hey Scott,

First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  But 
...

As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, math 
and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my dad was a 
computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me how important 
tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of him bringing home 
those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my brother and me to play 
with.  I remember going with him into the office on Saturdays and seeing the 
computer, which was this great big behemoth that took up an entire room.  I 
remember him teaching me base 2 at the dinner table.  But once I got to school, 
my math and science teachers had no idea what to do with me.  Classes were 
taught almost exclusively on the blackboard, and I was bored out of my mind.  I 
grew up thinking I sucked at math, and it wasn't until I was in my thirties 
that I realized that I was actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back in the 80s, 
I went out with this total computer geek.  I was fascinated by all the stuff he 
was into, but neither he nor I knew how to make all that accessible to me.  
(And by that time, I actually owned a TSI Versabraille).  I think that had I 
been born within the last 25 years, I actually would have chosen IT--or 
something related--as a career.  Clearly something was different for you and 
John.  Maybe it was innate intelligence, maybe there was a gender bias at play, 
maybe it was opportunity, I don't know.  I do know from other posts I've seen 
from you that your parents seemed quite willing to think out of the box.  I 
grew up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, my dad was 22.  Having a 
blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited world.  I don't think my 
experience is unique.  Whatever it was that jived for you guys, didn't carry 
over to lots of blind folks.

So yes, it was a fluff piece.  And yes, I wish they'd just treat blind folks 
like everyone else.  But I also hope that there's a little Donna out there 
somewhere--or maybe little Donna's parents--who don't buy into those 
preconceived notions about what someone who's blind can or cannot do, and that 
someday 20 years from now, that little Donna finds herself at the heart of 
technological developments.

Just an alternate perspective.
Cheers,
Donna

> On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:32 PM, Scott Granados  > wrote:
> 
> So here’s my problem with the article.
> 
> I think it’s fantastic what this young lady is doing, I absolutely support 
> her efforts.  I also am thrilled that apple hired someone from our community 
> for the design side.  I’m also happy Google does the same now and there’s 
> discussion of teaching children to code.
> 
> My problem is with the reporter.  These articles are so damn fluff happy.  
> Look at Apple saving the day for blind people.  Like it’s something new.  
> Never mind you John and I built parts of the networks this reporter publishes 
> on.:)  The article leads the reader to believe that blind people could only 
> code until recently.  This blind guy as a child started coding 33+ years ago 
> learning things like 6502 assembler, Apple Soft, PASCAL, then C and so forth. 
> We used apples or PCs or what ever to get it done and in some ways have been 
> directly or indirectly involved with the development of computers since the 
> very beginning.  Real trail blazers like your self or Ray Kurzweil building 
> devices to help his child, certain musicians with very deep pockets who 
> brought some of the funding to the table, any blind person at all who 
> successfully landed a job and held it showing others in our own little way 
> we’re just people doing the same things that everyone else does, try to help 
> take care of your selves, families and participate in our communities.
>   I guess part of me just wishes that instead of being singled out and 
> made to be some sort of something special we were just dealt with and 
> reflected on by reporters especially as just another part of society.  Lest I 
> get way to NFB here:) but there’s something to be said for being lumped in 
> with everyone else.:)  The special attention sometimes makes us seem well 
> special in the sense we’re not the norm, we’re almost untouchable and 
> separate to make a reference to a really unfortunate cultural label in 
> eastern societies.
>   The same thing happens with reporters who publish puff pieces on 
> artificial vision advances or medical advances that cure illnesses related to 
> blindness.  I don’t know how many articles I’ve read where some gadget is 
> going to save us from our selves and totally make it all better.  Things 
> ain’t that bad.  What’s bad is convincing the public we need to be saved.
>   Maybe I’m just becoming a grumpy old man like I was afraid of when I 
> was young.
> 
> Still, congratulations to this young lady but 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Donna Goodin]

Hey Scott,

First let me say that on a very fundamental level I agree with your post.  But 
...

As a kid, I somehow sort of absorbed the fact that because I was blind, math 
and the sciences weren't for me.  And this despite the fact that my dad was a 
computer guy, who spent lots of time and energy conveying to me how important 
tech would be for me..  Some of my earliest memories are of him bringing home 
those old computer punch cards and magnetic tapes for my brother and me to play 
with.  I remember going with him into the office on Saturdays and seeing the 
computer, which was this great big behemoth that took up an entire room.  I 
remember him teaching me base 2 at the dinner table.  But once I got to school, 
my math and science teachers had no idea what to do with me.  Classes were 
taught almost exclusively on the blackboard, and I was bored out of my mind.  I 
grew up thinking I sucked at math, and it wasn't until I was in my thirties 
that I realized that I was actually pretty bloody good at it.  Back in the 80s, 
I went out with this total computer geek.  I was fascinated by all the stuff he 
was into, but neither he nor I knew how to make all that accessible to me.  
(And by that time, I actually owned a TSI Versabraille).  I think that had I 
been born within the last 25 years, I actually would have chosen IT--or 
something related--as a career.  Clearly something was different for you and 
John.  Maybe it was innate intelligence, maybe there was a gender bias at play, 
maybe it was opportunity, I don't know.  I do know from other posts I've seen 
from you that your parents seemed quite willing to think out of the box.  I 
grew up in suburbia.  My mom was 20 when she had me, my dad was 22.  Having a 
blind kid pretty much rocked their young, limited world.  I don't think my 
experience is unique.  Whatever it was that jived for you guys, didn't carry 
over to lots of blind folks.

So yes, it was a fluff piece.  And yes, I wish they'd just treat blind folks 
like everyone else.  But I also hope that there's a little Donna out there 
somewhere--or maybe little Donna's parents--who don't buy into those 
preconceived notions about what someone who's blind can or cannot do, and that 
someday 20 years from now, that little Donna finds herself at the heart of 
technological developments.

Just an alternate perspective.
Cheers,
Donna

> On Jul 11, 2016, at 9:32 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> So here’s my problem with the article.
> 
> I think it’s fantastic what this young lady is doing, I absolutely support 
> her efforts.  I also am thrilled that apple hired someone from our community 
> for the design side.  I’m also happy Google does the same now and there’s 
> discussion of teaching children to code.
> 
> My problem is with the reporter.  These articles are so damn fluff happy.  
> Look at Apple saving the day for blind people.  Like it’s something new.  
> Never mind you John and I built parts of the networks this reporter publishes 
> on.:)  The article leads the reader to believe that blind people could only 
> code until recently.  This blind guy as a child started coding 33+ years ago 
> learning things like 6502 assembler, Apple Soft, PASCAL, then C and so forth. 
> We used apples or PCs or what ever to get it done and in some ways have been 
> directly or indirectly involved with the development of computers since the 
> very beginning.  Real trail blazers like your self or Ray Kurzweil building 
> devices to help his child, certain musicians with very deep pockets who 
> brought some of the funding to the table, any blind person at all who 
> successfully landed a job and held it showing others in our own little way 
> we’re just people doing the same things that everyone else does, try to help 
> take care of your selves, families and participate in our communities.
>   I guess part of me just wishes that instead of being singled out and 
> made to be some sort of something special we were just dealt with and 
> reflected on by reporters especially as just another part of society.  Lest I 
> get way to NFB here:) but there’s something to be said for being lumped in 
> with everyone else.:)  The special attention sometimes makes us seem well 
> special in the sense we’re not the norm, we’re almost untouchable and 
> separate to make a reference to a really unfortunate cultural label in 
> eastern societies.
>   The same thing happens with reporters who publish puff pieces on 
> artificial vision advances or medical advances that cure illnesses related to 
> blindness.  I don’t know how many articles I’ve read where some gadget is 
> going to save us from our selves and totally make it all better.  Things 
> ain’t that bad.  What’s bad is convincing the public we need to be saved.
>   Maybe I’m just becoming a grumpy old man like I was afraid of when I 
> was young.
> 
> Still, congratulations to this young lady but also congratulations to all the 
> 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

Hi David, you know, I’ve heard that 70% number for ever, even pre 1995.  I hope 
you’re right though, I’d love to see that number drop meaningfully.


> On Jul 11, 2016, at 5:24 PM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> Actually, those stats are from a study which is about 18 years old. Even 
> worse, however, is the stats about unemployment of the blind. Those stats, 
> often sited in studies across the board, come from a study published in 1995 
> or 1997 (I would need to look it up again for the exact date). The most 
> recent info I have seen was published by the state of Oregon in 2007 (if 
> memory serves) which places blindness unemployment rate at around 60%, not 
> the often sited 70% to 80%. Note: I researched this in 2012, so am unaware of 
> any data published since then.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: nexu...@icloud.com 
> Mobile: 0450 788 988
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> 
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com 
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> On 12 Jul 2016, at 08:30, 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
> > 
> wrote:
> 
>> Interesting stats they mention about correlation between braille literacy 
>> and employment. I just had an iOS developer reach out to me who said WWDC 
>> had a heavy emphasis on accessibility this year. I've never been so I can't 
>> compare. I hope that's true. Nothing but good can come from more developers 
>> become aware and care.
>> 
>> CB
>> 
>> On 7/11/16 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>>> Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything 
>>> about braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
>>> accessibility.
>>> http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
>>>  
>>> 
>>> 
>>> This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
>>> 
>>> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations. 
>>> 
>>> She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her 
>>> grandfather could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide 
>>> his wedding ring along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had 
>>> a slim chance of survival.
>>> 
>>> It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first 
>>> time she shattered them.
>>> 
>>> Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. 
>>> But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations 
>>> of people with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and 
>>> insatiably curious.
>>> 
>>> It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was 
>>> the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
>>> classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school. 
>>> 
>>>  <>"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users." 
>>> She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her 
>>> to figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
>>> 
>>> "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks 
>>> I wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing 
>>> features like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with 
>>> my knowledge of computers and technology, I could help change the world for 
>>> people with disabilities.
>>> 
>>> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
>>> 
>>> Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation
>>> 
>>> There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace 
>>> initiatives — the need to include the perspectives of people with 
>>> disabilities.
>>> 
>>> Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
>>> component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how 
>>> much that can strengthen a company.
>>> 
>>> She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
>>> introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
>>> gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — and 
>>> she was nervous.
>>> 
>>> "You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going 
>>> to know unless you talk to them ... so go."
>>> 
>>>  <>
>>> 
>>> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a driving 
>>> force behind accessibility of Apple products, especially for blind users.
>>> 
>>> Image: Provided by Apple and Jordyn Castor
>>> 
>>> Castor told Apple reps how amazed she was by the iPad she received as a 
>>> gift for her 17th birthday just a few years earlier. It raised her passion 
>>> for tech to another level — mainly due to the iPad's immediate 
>>> accessibility.
>>> 
>>> "Everything 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Scott Granados]

So here’s my problem with the article.

I think it’s fantastic what this young lady is doing, I absolutely support her 
efforts.  I also am thrilled that apple hired someone from our community for 
the design side.  I’m also happy Google does the same now and there’s 
discussion of teaching children to code.

My problem is with the reporter.  These articles are so damn fluff happy.  Look 
at Apple saving the day for blind people.  Like it’s something new.  Never mind 
you John and I built parts of the networks this reporter publishes on.:)  The 
article leads the reader to believe that blind people could only code until 
recently.  This blind guy as a child started coding 33+ years ago learning 
things like 6502 assembler, Apple Soft, PASCAL, then C and so forth. We used 
apples or PCs or what ever to get it done and in some ways have been directly 
or indirectly involved with the development of computers since the very 
beginning.  Real trail blazers like your self or Ray Kurzweil building devices 
to help his child, certain musicians with very deep pockets who brought some of 
the funding to the table, any blind person at all who successfully landed a job 
and held it showing others in our own little way we’re just people doing the 
same things that everyone else does, try to help take care of your selves, 
families and participate in our communities.
I guess part of me just wishes that instead of being singled out and 
made to be some sort of something special we were just dealt with and reflected 
on by reporters especially as just another part of society.  Lest I get way to 
NFB here:) but there’s something to be said for being lumped in with everyone 
else.:)  The special attention sometimes makes us seem well special in the 
sense we’re not the norm, we’re almost untouchable and separate to make a 
reference to a really unfortunate cultural label in eastern societies.
The same thing happens with reporters who publish puff pieces on 
artificial vision advances or medical advances that cure illnesses related to 
blindness.  I don’t know how many articles I’ve read where some gadget is going 
to save us from our selves and totally make it all better.  Things ain’t that 
bad.  What’s bad is convincing the public we need to be saved.
Maybe I’m just becoming a grumpy old man like I was afraid of when I 
was young.

Still, congratulations to this young lady but also congratulations to all the 
other engineers at apple some of which are on this list.  And congratulations 
to you John and others who have made countless contributions to technology in 
general.

Ah well, what’s the expression, there’s no such thing as bad publicity?  
Suppose that’s true.


  


> On Jul 11, 2016, at 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn  wrote:
> 
> Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything about 
> braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
> accessibility.
> http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr 
> 
> 
> This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
> 
> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations. 
> 
> She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her grandfather 
> could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide his wedding ring 
> along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had a slim chance of 
> survival.
> 
> It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first 
> time she shattered them.
> 
> Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. 
> But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations of 
> people with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and 
> insatiably curious.
> 
> It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was 
> the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
> classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school. 
> 
>  <>"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her to 
> figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
> 
> "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks I 
> wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing features 
> like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with my 
> knowledge of computers and technology, I could help change the world for 
> people with disabilities.
> 
> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> 
> Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation
> 
> There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace initiatives 
> — the need to include the perspectives of people with disabilities.
> 
> Keeping tabs on the needs 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22Wow!  This 
is incredible!  Thanks for sharing.
---
Christopher Gilland
JAWS Certified, 2016.
Training Instructor.

clgillan...@gmail.com
Phone: (704) 256-8010.
  - Original Message - 
  From: Jonathan C. Cohn 
  To: Macvisionaries 
  Sent: Monday, July 11, 2016 2:29 PM
  Subject: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22


  Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything about 
braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
accessibility.
  http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr


  This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
  Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations. 

  She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her grandfather 
could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide his wedding ring 
along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had a slim chance of 
survival.

  It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first 
time she shattered them.

  Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. 
But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations of 
people with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and 
insatiably curious.

  It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was 
the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school. 

"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users." 
  She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her to 
figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.

  "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks I 
wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing features 
like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with my knowledge 
of computers and technology, I could help change the world for people with 
disabilities.

  "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."

  Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation
  There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace initiatives 
— the need to include the perspectives of people with disabilities.

  Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how much 
that can strengthen a company.

  She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — and she 
was nervous.

  "You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going to 
know unless you talk to them ... so go."


   

  Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a driving force 
behind accessibility of Apple products, especially for blind users.

  Image: Provided by Apple and Jordyn Castor

  Castor told Apple reps how amazed she was by the iPad she received as a gift 
for her 17th birthday just a few years earlier. It raised her passion for tech 
to another level — mainly due to the iPad's immediate accessibility.

  "Everything just worked and was accessible just right out of the box," Castor 
tells Mashable. "That was something I had never experienced before."

"I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community." 
  Sarah Herrlinger, senior manager for global accessibility policy and 
initiatives at Apple, says a notable part of the company's steps toward 
accessibility is its dedication to making inclusivity features standard, not 
specialized. This allows those features to be dually accessible — both for 
getting the tech to more users, as well as keeping down costs.


  "[These features] show up on your device, regardless of if you are someone 
who needs them," Herrlinger tells Mashable. "By being built-in, they are also 
free. Historically, for the blind and visually impaired community, there are 
additional things you have to buy or things that you have to do to be able to 
use technology."

  At that job fair in 2015, Castor's passion for accessibility and Apple was 
evident. She was soon hired as an intern focusing on VoiceOver accessibility.

  As her internship came to a close, Castor's skills as an engineer and 
advocate for tech accessibility were too commanding to let go. She was hired 
full-time as an engineer on the accessibility design and quality team — a group 
of people Castor describes as "passionate" and "dedicated."

  "I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community," she says of her 
work. "It's incredible."

  Innovation with blind users in mind
  Increased accessibility for all users is one of Apple's 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

Actually, those stats are from a study which is about 18 years old. Even worse, 
however, is the stats about unemployment of the blind. Those stats, often sited 
in studies across the board, come from a study published in 1995 or 1997 (I 
would need to look it up again for the exact date). The most recent info I have 
seen was published by the state of Oregon in 2007 (if memory serves) which 
places blindness unemployment rate at around 60%, not the often sited 70% to 
80%. Note: I researched this in 2012, so am unaware of any data published since 
then.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: nexu...@icloud.com
Mobile: 0450 788 988
Sent from my iPhone



David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone
> On 12 Jul 2016, at 08:30, 'Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Interesting stats they mention about correlation between braille literacy and 
> employment. I just had an iOS developer reach out to me who said WWDC had a 
> heavy emphasis on accessibility this year. I've never been so I can't 
> compare. I hope that's true. Nothing but good can come from more developers 
> become aware and care.
> 
> CB
> 
>> On 7/11/16 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:
>> Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything about 
>> braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
>> accessibility.
>> http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
>> 
>> This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
>> 
>> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations.
>> 
>> She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her grandfather 
>> could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide his wedding 
>> ring along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had a slim chance 
>> of survival.
>> 
>> It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first 
>> time she shattered them.
>> 
>> Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. 
>> But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations of 
>> people with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and 
>> insatiably curious.
>> 
>> It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was 
>> the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
>> classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school.
>> 
>> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
>> She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her 
>> to figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
>> 
>> "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks I 
>> wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing features 
>> like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with my 
>> knowledge of computers and technology, I could help change the world for 
>> people with disabilities.
>> 
>> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
>> 
>> Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation
>> 
>> There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace 
>> initiatives — the need to include the perspectives of people with 
>> disabilities.
>> 
>> Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
>> component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how 
>> much that can strengthen a company.
>> 
>> She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
>> introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
>> gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — and 
>> she was nervous.
>> 
>> "You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going to 
>> know unless you talk to them ... so go."
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a driving force 
>> behind accessibility of Apple products, especially for blind users.
>> 
>> Image: Provided by Apple and Jordyn Castor
>> 
>> Castor told Apple reps how amazed she was by the iPad she received as a gift 
>> for her 17th birthday just a few years earlier. It raised her passion for 
>> tech to another level — mainly due to the iPad's immediate accessibility.
>> 
>> "Everything just worked and was accessible just right out of the box," 
>> Castor tells Mashable. "That was something I had never experienced before."
>> 
>> "I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community."
>> Sarah Herrlinger, senior manager for global accessibility policy and 
>> initiatives at Apple, says a notable part of the company's steps toward 
>> accessibility is its dedication to making inclusivity features standard, not 
>> specialized. This allows those features to be dually accessible — both for 
>> getting the tech to more users, as well 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

['Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries]

Interesting stats they mention about correlation between braille 
literacy and employment. I just had an iOS developer reach out to me who 
said WWDC had a heavy emphasis on accessibility this year. I've never 
been so I can't compare. I hope that's true. Nothing but good can come 
from more developers become aware and care.


CB

On 7/11/16 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:

This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything 
about braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple 
 working on accessibility.

http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr


  This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations.

She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her 
grandfather could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even 
slide his wedding ring along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors 
said she had a slim chance of survival.


It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the 
first time she shattered them.


Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early 
delivery. But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy 
expectations of people with disabilities, motivating her to be 
adventurous, hands-on and insatiably curious.


It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether 
it was the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second 
grade, or the classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in 
school.


"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users." 

She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling 
her to figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.


"I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the 
tasks I wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on 
enhancing features like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to 
realize that with my knowledge of computers and technology, I could 
help change the world for people with disabilities.


"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."


Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation

There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace 
initiatives — the need to include the perspectives of people with 
disabilities.


Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a 
key component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof 
of how much that can strengthen a company.


She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was 
first introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor 
went to the gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant 
would be there — and she was nervous.


"You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't 
going to know unless you talk to them ... so go."


Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a driving 
force behind accessibility of Apple products, especially for blind users.


Image: Provided by Apple and Jordyn Castor

Castor told Apple reps how amazed she was by the iPad she received as 
a gift for her 17th birthday just a few years earlier. It raised her 
passion for tech to another level — mainly due to the iPad's immediate 
accessibility.


"Everything just worked and was accessible just right out of the box," 
Castor tells /Mashable/. "That was something I had never experienced 
before."


"I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community." 

Sarah Herrlinger, senior manager for global accessibility policy and 
initiatives at Apple, says a notable part of the company's steps 
toward accessibility is its dedication to making inclusivity features 
standard, not specialized. This allows those features to be dually 
accessible — both for getting the tech to more users, as well as 
keeping down costs.


"[These features] show up on your device, regardless of if you are 
someone who needs them," Herrlinger tells /Mashable/. "By being 
built-in, they are also free. Historically, for the blind and visually 
impaired community, there are additional things you have to buy or 
things that you have to do to be able to use technology."


At that job fair in 2015, Castor's passion for accessibility and Apple 
was evident. She was soon hired as an intern focusing on VoiceOver 
accessibility.


As her internship came to a close, Castor's skills as an engineer and 
advocate for tech accessibility were too commanding to let go. She was 
hired full-time as an engineer on the accessibility design and quality 
team — a group of people Castor describes as "passionate" and "dedicated."


"I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community," she says of 
her work. "It's incredible."



Innovation with blind users in mind

Increased accessibility for all users is one of Apple's 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[David Chittenden]

Yes, they say a couple things about braille. 

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 12 Jul 2016, at 06:29, Jonathan C. Cohn  wrote:
> 
> Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything about 
> braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
> accessibility.
> http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
> 
> This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
> 
> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations.
> 
> She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her grandfather 
> could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide his wedding ring 
> along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had a slim chance of 
> survival.
> 
> It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first 
> time she shattered them.
> 
> Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. 
> But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations of 
> people with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and 
> insatiably curious.
> 
> It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was 
> the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
> classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school.
> 
> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her to 
> figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
> 
> "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks I 
> wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing features 
> like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with my 
> knowledge of computers and technology, I could help change the world for 
> people with disabilities.
> 
> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> 
> Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation
> 
> There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace initiatives 
> — the need to include the perspectives of people with disabilities.
> 
> Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
> component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how much 
> that can strengthen a company.
> 
> She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
> introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
> gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — and 
> she was nervous.
> 
> "You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going to 
> know unless you talk to them ... so go."
> 
> 
> 
> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a driving force 
> behind accessibility of Apple products, especially for blind users.
> 
> Image: Provided by Apple and Jordyn Castor
> 
> Castor told Apple reps how amazed she was by the iPad she received as a gift 
> for her 17th birthday just a few years earlier. It raised her passion for 
> tech to another level — mainly due to the iPad's immediate accessibility.
> 
> "Everything just worked and was accessible just right out of the box," Castor 
> tells Mashable. "That was something I had never experienced before."
> 
> "I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community."
> Sarah Herrlinger, senior manager for global accessibility policy and 
> initiatives at Apple, says a notable part of the company's steps toward 
> accessibility is its dedication to making inclusivity features standard, not 
> specialized. This allows those features to be dually accessible — both for 
> getting the tech to more users, as well as keeping down costs.
> 
> "[These features] show up on your device, regardless of if you are someone 
> who needs them," Herrlinger tells Mashable. "By being built-in, they are also 
> free. Historically, for the blind and visually impaired community, there are 
> additional things you have to buy or things that you have to do to be able to 
> use technology."
> 
> At that job fair in 2015, Castor's passion for accessibility and Apple was 
> evident. She was soon hired as an intern focusing on VoiceOver accessibility.
> 
> As her internship came to a close, Castor's skills as an engineer and 
> advocate for tech accessibility were too commanding to let go. She was hired 
> full-time as an engineer on the accessibility design and quality team — a 
> group of people Castor describes as "passionate" and "dedicated."
> 
> "I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community," she says of her 
> work. "It's incredible."
> 
> Innovation with blind users in mind
> 
> Increased accessibility for all users is one of Apple's driving values, under 
> the mantra "inclusion inspires innovation."
> 
> 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Katie Zodrow]

Thanks for posting the article!
 Wow!! That's great there's a really passionate young blind engineer working at 
Apple doing awesome work. I had no idea there were would be so many innovations 
for accessibility this fall with enhancing VoiceOver features. That's great! 
Thanks for sharing this.
Katie
Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 11, 2016, at 11:29 AM, Jonathan C. Cohn  wrote:
> 
> Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything about 
> braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
> accessibility.
> http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
> 
> This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22
> 
> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations.
> 
> She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her grandfather 
> could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide his wedding ring 
> along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had a slim chance of 
> survival.
> 
> It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first 
> time she shattered them.
> 
> Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. 
> But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations of 
> people with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and 
> insatiably curious.
> 
> It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was 
> the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
> classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school.
> 
> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her to 
> figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
> 
> "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks I 
> wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing features 
> like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with my 
> knowledge of computers and technology, I could help change the world for 
> people with disabilities.
> 
> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> 
> Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation
> 
> There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace initiatives 
> — the need to include the perspectives of people with disabilities.
> 
> Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
> component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how much 
> that can strengthen a company.
> 
> She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
> introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
> gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — and 
> she was nervous.
> 
> "You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going to 
> know unless you talk to them ... so go."
> 
> 
> 
> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a driving force 
> behind accessibility of Apple products, especially for blind users.
> 
> Image: Provided by Apple and Jordyn Castor
> 
> Castor told Apple reps how amazed she was by the iPad she received as a gift 
> for her 17th birthday just a few years earlier. It raised her passion for 
> tech to another level — mainly due to the iPad's immediate accessibility.
> 
> "Everything just worked and was accessible just right out of the box," Castor 
> tells Mashable. "That was something I had never experienced before."
> 
> "I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community."
> Sarah Herrlinger, senior manager for global accessibility policy and 
> initiatives at Apple, says a notable part of the company's steps toward 
> accessibility is its dedication to making inclusivity features standard, not 
> specialized. This allows those features to be dually accessible — both for 
> getting the tech to more users, as well as keeping down costs.
> 
> "[These features] show up on your device, regardless of if you are someone 
> who needs them," Herrlinger tells Mashable. "By being built-in, they are also 
> free. Historically, for the blind and visually impaired community, there are 
> additional things you have to buy or things that you have to do to be able to 
> use technology."
> 
> At that job fair in 2015, Castor's passion for accessibility and Apple was 
> evident. She was soon hired as an intern focusing on VoiceOver accessibility.
> 
> As her internship came to a close, Castor's skills as an engineer and 
> advocate for tech accessibility were too commanding to let go. She was hired 
> full-time as an engineer on the accessibility design and quality team — a 
> group of people Castor describes as "passionate" and "dedicated."
> 
> "I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community," she says of her 
> work. "It's incredible."
> 
> 

Re: This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[CHUCK REICHEL]

Hi Jonathan,
Thanks for sharing this. :)
Looks like Jordyn  is going to be a fantastic "DESIGN engineer"!
> 

Talk soon


On Jul 11, 2016, at 2:29 PM, Jonathan C. Cohn wrote:

> Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything about 
> braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
> accessibility.
> http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr
> 
> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations.
> 
> She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her grandfather 
> could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide his wedding ring 
> along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had a slim chance of 
> survival.
> 
> It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first 
> time she shattered them.
> 
> Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. 
> But throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations of 
> people with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and 
> insatiably curious.
> 
> It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was 
> the desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
> classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school.
> 
> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her to 
> figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.
> 
> "I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks I 
> wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing features 
> like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with my 
> knowledge of computers and technology, I could help change the world for 
> people with disabilities.
> 
> "I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
> 
> Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation
> 
> There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace initiatives 
> — the need to include the perspectives of people with disabilities.
> 
> Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
> component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how much 
> that can strengthen a company.
> 
> She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
> introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
> gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — and 
> she was nervous.
> 
> "You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going to 
> know unless you talk to them ... so go."
> 
> 
> 
> Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a driving force 
> behind accessibility of Apple products, especially for blind users.
> 
> Image: Provided by Apple and Jordyn Castor
> 
> Castor told Apple reps how amazed she was by the iPad she received as a gift 
> for her 17th birthday just a few years earlier. It raised her passion for 
> tech to another level — mainly due to the iPad's immediate accessibility.
> 
> "Everything just worked and was accessible just right out of the box," Castor 
> tells Mashable. "That was something I had never experienced before."
> 
> "I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community."
> Sarah Herrlinger, senior manager for global accessibility policy and 
> initiatives at Apple, says a notable part of the company's steps toward 
> accessibility is its dedication to making inclusivity features standard, not 
> specialized. This allows those features to be dually accessible — both for 
> getting the tech to more users, as well as keeping down costs.
> 
> "[These features] show up on your device, regardless of if you are someone 
> who needs them," Herrlinger tells Mashable. "By being built-in, they are also 
> free. Historically, for the blind and visually impaired community, there are 
> additional things you have to buy or things that you have to do to be able to 
> use technology."
> 
> At that job fair in 2015, Castor's passion for accessibility and Apple was 
> evident. She was soon hired as an intern focusing on VoiceOver accessibility.
> 
> As her internship came to a close, Castor's skills as an engineer and 
> advocate for tech accessibility were too commanding to let go. She was hired 
> full-time as an engineer on the accessibility design and quality team — a 
> group of people Castor describes as "passionate" and "dedicated."
> 
> "I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community," she says of her 
> work. "It's incredible."
> 
> Innovation with blind users in mind
> 
> Increased accessibility for all users is one of Apple's driving values, under 
> the mantra "inclusion inspires innovation."
> 
> Herrlinger says the company loves what it makes, and wants what it makes to 
> be available to everyone. She describes the need to 

This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

[Jonathan C. Cohn]

Well, this is interesting story. I don't believe they mention anything about 
braille. But at least it shows there are people  at Apple  working on 
accessibility.
http://mashable.com/2016/07/10/apple-innovation-blind-engineer/#RihiKu145Oqr

This blind Apple engineer is transforming the tech world at only 22

Apple engineer Jordyn Castor has never been one for limitations.

She was born 15 weeks early, weighing just under two pounds. Her grandfather 
could hold her in the palm of his hand, and could even slide his wedding ring 
along her arm and over her shoulder. Doctors said she had a slim chance of 
survival.

It was Castor's first brush with limited expectations — and also the first time 
she shattered them.

Castor, now 22, has been blind since birth, a result of her early delivery. But 
throughout childhood, her parents encouraged her to defy expectations of people 
with disabilities, motivating her to be adventurous, hands-on and insatiably 
curious.

It was that spirit that led to her interact with technology, whether it was the 
desktop computer her family bought when she was in second grade, or the 
classroom computer teachers encouraged her to use in school.

"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."
She says the adults in her life would often hand her a gadget, telling her to 
figure it out and show them how to use it. And she would.

"I realized then I could code on the computer to have it fulfill the tasks I 
wanted it to," says Castor, whose current work focuses on enhancing features 
like VoiceOver for blind Apple users. "I came to realize that with my knowledge 
of computers and technology, I could help change the world for people with 
disabilities.

"I could help make technology more accessible for blind users."

Bringing a personal perspective to Apple innovation

There's an often overlooked component of "diversity" in workplace initiatives — 
the need to include the perspectives of people with disabilities.

Keeping tabs on the needs of the blind and low-vision community is a key 
component of Apple's innovation in accessibility. Castor is proof of how much 
that can strengthen a company.

She was a college student at Michigan State University when she was first 
introduced to Apple at a Minneapolis job fair in 2015. Castor went to the 
gathering of employers, already knowing the tech giant would be there — and she 
was nervous.

"You aren't going to know unless you try," she thought. "You aren't going to 
know unless you talk to them ... so go."



Apple engineer Jordyn Castor poses for a headshot. Castor is a driving force 
behind accessibility of Apple products, especially for blind users.

Image: Provided by Apple and Jordyn Castor

Castor told Apple reps how amazed she was by the iPad she received as a gift 
for her 17th birthday just a few years earlier. It raised her passion for tech 
to another level — mainly due to the iPad's immediate accessibility.

"Everything just worked and was accessible just right out of the box," Castor 
tells Mashable. "That was something I had never experienced before."

"I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community."
Sarah Herrlinger, senior manager for global accessibility policy and 
initiatives at Apple, says a notable part of the company's steps toward 
accessibility is its dedication to making inclusivity features standard, not 
specialized. This allows those features to be dually accessible — both for 
getting the tech to more users, as well as keeping down costs.

"[These features] show up on your device, regardless of if you are someone who 
needs them," Herrlinger tells Mashable. "By being built-in, they are also free. 
Historically, for the blind and visually impaired community, there are 
additional things you have to buy or things that you have to do to be able to 
use technology."

At that job fair in 2015, Castor's passion for accessibility and Apple was 
evident. She was soon hired as an intern focusing on VoiceOver accessibility.

As her internship came to a close, Castor's skills as an engineer and advocate 
for tech accessibility were too commanding to let go. She was hired full-time 
as an engineer on the accessibility design and quality team — a group of people 
Castor describes as "passionate" and "dedicated."

"I'm directly impacting the lives of the blind community," she says of her 
work. "It's incredible."

Innovation with blind users in mind

Increased accessibility for all users is one of Apple's driving values, under 
the mantra "inclusion inspires innovation."

Herrlinger says the company loves what it makes, and wants what it makes to be 
available to everyone. She describes the need to continuously innovate with 
accessibility in mind as part of Apple's DNA.

"Accessibility is something that is never-ending," Herrlinger says. "It isn't 
something where you just do it once, check that box and then move on to do 
other things."

And it's a dedication that isn't going unnoticed by the