Re: [mailop] [External] Understanding why a spammer is doing this
Hi All, Thanks for the responses and suggestions. I've deleted the old DKIM DNS record, and will be implementing a system to rotate the keys every 14 days, as a starting point. To answer some questions: I don't think the emails have been modified in any way, although I haven't seen a complete copy of one. At least some of the people that get these messages are not spammer accounts, at least judging by the angry "Unsubscribe me!" emails they send our support email address. We currently sign all non X- email headers. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Understanding why a spammer is doing this
Hi All, I run groups.io, an email groups hosting service, similar to Google Groups. Over the past couple of years, we've had several instances of the following behavior: - Someone controlling several Yahoo/Hotmail/Gmail accounts will sign them up to mailing lists. Each address will sign up for 1-3 lists, via email. These are all confirmed opt-in. - Months later, they will forward the messages they've received from these lists, unmodified, to many (seemingly) random people, all at once What I'm trying to understand is what they're hoping to accomplish. I suppose it could be a straight up harassment campaign against us or the people they're forwarding the emails to. But I'm wondering if it's something different. Are they trying to somehow increase sending reputation for their email addresses, to increase their own spam email deliverability (and if so, how would that work)? Or something else? This is top of mind because it just happened again overnight. I have some spammer detection systems in place, but much of that depends on information gleaned from a web login. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] envelope or header address?
On Fri, Jul 5, 2024 at 5:31 AM Jeff Pang via mailop wrote: > > When an user requests to join mailing list, which address should we > take? The envelope address, or the header From address? > > For email subscriptions, we use the header From address. For email to a list, we look at the header From, Reply-To and then envelope address, in that order, to determine if they are a subscriber. Cheers, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Microsoft SNDS website not working
On Thu, Jun 6, 2024 at 9:11 AM Scott Mutter via mailop wrote: > Trying to add an IP address to our SNDS accounts at: > > https://sendersupport.olc.protection.outlook.com/snds/index.aspx > > Is resulting in a lot of failed page loads, a lot of having to refresh, > authorization emails seemingly not being sent. > > I have experienced that off and on over the past several months. However, it did just now work for me. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Does iCloud accept forwards?
Hi All, ICloud started deferring a lot of Groups.io email this afternoon, so I contacted their postmaster address. They responded promptly. I am just a simple unfrozen caveman lawyer, and I'm not sure I understand what's going on. I'm hoping someone might be able to help (Groups.io is an email group hosting service, similar to Google Groups). The relevant part of their response is as follows: Can you please have your email administrators check your SPF / DKIM > settings and ensure that mail sent from your domain has valid DMARC > signatures in accordance with the DMARC policies that you have defined for > your domain. > As you can see we are not able to validate your SPF and DKIM records: > > < Dkim :dkim=fail reason="signature verification failed" (2048-bit key) > header.d=groups.io header.i=@groups.io header.b=Y9CUx0w1> > > SPf:timestamp="May 16 23:14:05" lvl="5" thread="2612246/1" > uuid="caa009c7-e0a1-4d83-a0da-97716659a01f" Insert header > SRS0=b6ba=mt=groups.io=bounce+redac...@siark.com does not designate > permitted sender hosts) smtp.mailfrom="SRS0=b6ba=mt=groups.io= > bounce+redac...@siark.com">> We did in fact send an email group message, at this time, to someone at @ siark.com, with the "bounce+REDACTED" envelope from, except that our envelope from was from groups.io and didn't have the "SRS0=b4ba=mt=groups.io=" prefix. The message was sent to the group from a msn.com address. For group messages, we replace any incoming DKIM header with our own. For this particular email, we kept the original From line, originating from @msn.com, because msn.com's DMARC record is p=none. The siark.com recipient has been a member of this group since 2020. Does the above mean that the message we sent was forwarded on from siark.com to an iCloud address? If that's true, the envelope from and the message from are domains other than groups.io, so why would they associate any authentication failures to us (and start deferring email from us)? Just from the DKIM header? Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Microsoft outages?
On Tue, May 7, 2024 at 10:29 AM Jarland Donnell via mailop < mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > Hoping it’s not just me, looking for a sanity check. Our queues today > are packed with these responses from Microsoft’s mail servers: > > 451 4.7.500 Server busy. Please try again later > > We are not seeing that error and are not having any issues delivering to outlook/hotmail/msn at the moment. Cheers, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Outlook Asynchronous Bounces
On Tue, Apr 9, 2024 at 5:09 PM David Landers via mailop wrote: > Beginning today, we've observed a spike in asynchronous bounces -- > messages initially accepted for delivery but then returned as a > non-conversational bounce -- at Outlook domains (e.g. outlook.com, > hotmail.com, etc.) with the following rejection syntax: > > 532 5.3.2 STOREDRV.Deliver; Missing or bad mailbox Database property > > A quick spot check of our logs shows that we started getting that specific error message yesterday afternoon and have gotten a lot of them today. Cheers, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] is warming IPs still necessary?
On Mon, Mar 25, 2024 at 4:30 PM Gerald Oskoboiny via mailop < mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > We are planning to move the system that hosts our email > discussion lists from its old home where it has been for decades > to an EC2 instance on AWS. It does about 15k deliveries per day, > most of which go to gmail or google-hosted email systems. > > Is it still necessary to warm up new IP addresses gradually > instead of going directly to this volume of deliveries? > Yes, it's still necessary to warm up IP addresses, at least in my current experience. Our biggest problem has been with Microsoft, and their rate limiting of new IP addresses. There are others that also rate limit new IP addresses, but at least with them, you can generally find someone here on mailop that can help. We've never had a problem with Gmail/Google. Cheers, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Anyone from Microsoft?
On Wed, Mar 6, 2024 at 8:18 AM Al Iverson wrote: > Mark, the path here is the normal contact channel for Microsoft OLC > issues - http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866&clcid - and > requesting pre-emptive accommodation: > More on that here: > > https://www.spamresource.com/2021/05/requesting-pre-emptive-accommodation.html > That magic phrase tells them that you're trying to do IP warming. > They'll usually respond with a blank grid, asking you to fill in dates > and volumes, to demonstrate projected volume. > They will then adjust rate limiting accordingly. > > This is very helpful. Thank you! Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Anyone from Microsoft?
Hi All, As we continue to warm up some new mail servers, we're getting rate limited on one of them, with the following error: 451 4.7.650 The mail server [45.79.224.9] has been temporarily rate limited due to IP reputation. For e-mail delivery information, see https://postmaster.live.com (S775) [ AM7EUR06FT056.eop-eur06.prod.protection.outlook.com 2024-03-05T22:51:22.952Z 08DC3CCF8A0C7716] I have checked https://sendersupport.olc.protection.outlook.com/pm/ (which is a very flaky website; it doesn't seem to be working at the moment, but has in the past), and there are no blocks on this particular mail server, and there haven't been for days. Is there somewhere else I should be looking? Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Dot as the first character of a line ? (RFC 5321, Section 4.5.2)
On Fri, Mar 1, 2024 at 8:46 AM Cyril - ImprovMX via mailop < mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > > Upon investigation, we discovered that indeed, checking the DKIM signature > was failing because of a body mismatch. Digging further, we discovered that > a dot was removed from the message when going through our servers. > > You're talking about 'dot stuffing'. When you receive a message via SMTP, in the DATA section, if you receive a line that starts with a dot (and has additional characters after that), you remove that first dot. Then, when you send the message back out via SMTP, for lines that start with a dot, you prepend a dot before sending the line on the wire. I am pretty sure that Gmail respects all of this... Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] One click unsubscribe in mailing list messages
On Fri, Feb 23, 2024 at 3:09 PM Jay Hennigan via mailop wrote: > > There are many systems that scan links in email and falsely unsubscribe. > I'd make it two-click. When clicked, have it go to a page that says: > > You are about to unsubscribe [address] from mailing list [name of list]. > Are you sure you want to do this? [Yes] [No] > > Sorry, I misspoke/wasn't clear. It does do that now. People still click on that Yes button. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] One click unsubscribe in mailing list messages
Hi All, I run an email groups hosting service. For many years now, each group message has included a one click unsubscribe link in the message footer. We also include appropriate List-Unsubscribe-Post: List-Unsubscribe=One-Click headers. The problem with including a one-click unsubscribe link in the message bodies occurs when a group message is forwarded to someone else, and they click on the link, unsubscribing the original person. We have an easy one-click resubscribe system for this, but it's still not wonderful and occasionally causes problems/confusion. My question to you all is, do you think that the List-Unsubscribe=One-Click header is supported well enough these days such that I can replace the one-click unsub link in the message bodies with a link that requires authentication? Also, do you think doing so would adversely affect our distribution? Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] AOL/Yahoo: Confusing enhanced SMTP codes in response?
On Thu, Feb 1, 2024 at 10:12 AM Todd Herr via mailop wrote: > > I've seen as yet unconfirmed speculation that this might be the error > response Yahoo is using for those that don't comply with the new (as of > today) requirements that mail be authenticated using SPF, DKIM, and DMARC. > > See also - https://senders.yahooinc.com/best-practices/ > > We've seen this specific error message before. It doesn't appear related to specific email addresses. It may be tied to specific characteristics of a given email, but I haven't researched it enough to say for certain. We see that message sporadically. Cheers, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Spamhaus contact?
On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 4:19 PM Randolf Richardson, Postmaster via mailop < mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > > You'll likely be interested in the reputation score, which is > presently showing as "Poor" for that IP address (66.175.222.108): > > Reputation Lookup || Cisco Talos Intelligence Group > > https://www.talosintelligence.com/reputation_center/lookup?search=66.175.222.108 > > Thanks for this; I wasn't familiar with Talos Intelligence. Do they publish a blocklist? Spamhaus lifted their block last night. That caused the Talos reputation score for us to change to Good. I hope to keep it there. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Spamhaus contact?
On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 11:00 AM Udeme wrote: > Mark: looks like as of seconds ago the SBL’s been resolved & removed from > the SBL? > Yes! That's great, but unfortunately and confusingly, it's switched to a different listing instead: https://www.spamhaus.org/query/ip/66.175.222.108 Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Spamhaus contact?
Hi All, One of groups.io's servers was listed by Spamhaus starting Saturday afternoon (https://www.spamhaus.org/sbl/query/SBL638016). I've been trying to contact them ever since, but they've been silent. I am humbly asking for help. We're an email groups service, like Google Groups. Based on evidence provided by Spamhaus, it appears that some groups that migrated from Yahoo Groups when Y! Groups shut down contained some Spamhaus spamtrap addresses. On Spamhaus' suggestion, I built a reverification system late last year and tested it on a small group of users. Yesterday, I kicked off a reverification to a much larger segment of users. I then told Linode, our hosting provider, about it, and asked them to contact Spamhaus, as directed by their SBL listing. Linode did that, but has not heard back. I also tried contacting Spamhaus this morning, but haven't heard back yet. I am wondering what else I need to do. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Anyone from Virgin Media here?
Hi, Is there anyone from Virgin Media here? We're seeing throttling with the response: 421 4.1.1 MXIN503 Hourly ratelimit for your IP exceeded Thanks, Mark -- Groups.io ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] The info on Validity's charging for FBL access (Was Re: New Validity policy for paid FBL (ARF))
On Tue, Sep 12, 2023 at 3:09 PM Anne Mitchell via mailop wrote: > > From what I read into this, it likely means you are already on a paid > package, and that package includes the individual reports, and also that > now they are offering aggregated reports and you will be able to get > thosealso with your paid package (because hey, that's now the free tier > anyways). > > We have never paid Validity anything. In reference to the other thread, I have very conflicted feelings about FBLs in general (acknowledging that we are a mailing list host and not a transactional or marketing email service). I believe that the vast majority of the FBL reports that we get are mistakes, people hitting the spam button without that intent and/or automatic spam filters causing mail to be routed to spam folders and triggering FBL reports (it does happen). Also, I have never seen any information saying whether acting on FBL reports positively affects our overall deliverability or not. With that lack of information, from the beginning we implemented a system that unsubscribed people from their mailing lists upon an FBL report (we also send them a one click resubscribe email). Our users _hate_ this. We did this out of fear, mainly; fear that if we didn't, we would be blocked from sending list messages to our users. Is that a valid fear? Like I said, I have no idea. So I guess what I'm saying is that if this causes FBLs to diminish, I will not be shedding any tears. And also, I have no desire to pay Validity for this. Thanks, Mark -- Groups.io ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Was Re: New Validity policy for paid FBL (ARF)
On Tue, Sep 12, 2023 at 11:19 AM Anne Mitchell via mailop wrote: > > We just wrote up everything that we know about this, including how much > it will cost, what it actually means, what's still free, etc. It's too long > to quote here (and it contains quotes from Validity) but here it is in case > you want all of that info: > > https://www.isipp.com/blog/validity-fbl-charging-how-much-cost/ > > Thank you for writing this up, it's been confusing. We only receive individual reports and not the aggregated data (or if we do it's not sent to us). We received a slightly different email from Validity. It includes the 'login method update' but it makes no mention of upgrading our account; instead this was included: Product Enhancement: You will now have access to aggregated data insights > within the application, enabling you to gain a broader understanding of > overall trends, patterns, and customer sentiments. > You will receive an additional reminder one week before the launch with > additional information to ensure that you are well-prepared for the > transition and have all the information you need to securely log in to your > account. So maybe we won't be subject to the new fees? Like I said, it's been confusing. Mark -- Groups.io ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] warming up IPs, Microsoft?
On Mon, Mar 6, 2023 at 6:36 AM John Stoffel wrote: > > I've been using digital ocean and then moved to Linode to home my > personal domain @stoffel.org, but then I'm spending time looking to > move again because charter.net is my town Cable company and a bunch of > neighbors use @charter.net emails, and they (charter) just blanket ban > Linode IP space. > > Huh. We don't have any issues sending email to them from Linode, including a small number from one of our new IP addresses I've been trying to warm up. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] warming up IPs, Microsoft?
On Sun, Mar 5, 2023 at 1:15 PM John R Levine wrote: > > If you need a big VM there's always AWS. They do a surprisingly good job > of managing outbound mail. You get 62K messages/mo for free, then 10c per > 1000 messages sent from a VM. > For the amount of email we send, that cost structure wouldn't work for us. And I thought AWS SES didn't have a good reputation, although I admit it's been awhile since I looked. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] warming up IPs, Microsoft?
On Sun, Mar 5, 2023 at 10:20 AM John R Levine wrote: > > I've been happy with a small provider called Tektonic. If you've never > heard of them, that's a good sign. > > Thanks for the recommendation; unfortunately they wouldn't work for us. Their largest VM is less than half the size we would need for our databases, also they don't appear to have an API to provision new VMs. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] warming up IPs, Microsoft?
On Sun, Mar 5, 2023 at 8:53 AM John Levine via mailop wrote: > > I am reasonably sure that no serious mail system uses UCEPROTECT as > anything > other than a very weak signal. It's not surprising they list what other > people list, since they list about half the net. > > Agreed. I think one of our existing sending IP addresses is listed in UCEPROTECT and it's never been an issue. I did check all the new IPs against blocklists before I started trying to warm them up. >There are no 'new' IP addresses any more, and in terms of providers, > >Linode are going to reuse IPs a lot. > > I wouldn't try to send mail from Linode if I cared about it being > delivered. > > Best I can tell, in our 9+ years, being hosted by Linode has never been an issue wrt deliverability, and as a hosting provider, they've been nothing but responsive and reliable. That said, they were recently bought by Akamai, and have just raised prices. So I guess I need to start at least paying attention to other hosting options. Who do you recommend these days? Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Microsoft?
Hi All, I'm trying to warm up some new email server IP addresses, and I'm getting the following error sending to Microsoft addresses: [redacted].mail.protection.outlook.com 550 5.7.511 Access denied, banned sender[45.79.227.220]. To request removal from this list please forward this message to del...@microsoft.com. For more information please go to http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=526653. AS(1410) [ DM6NAM10FT110.eop-nam10.prod.protection.outlook.com 2023-03-04T01:00:34.878Z 08DB177D8CA1B04E] I had gone through the delisting process at https://sender.office.com as instructed, but I never heard back. It'd be difficult for me to forward these messages to del...@microsoft.com, is there another way to get these new IP addresses unblocked? For reference, the list of IPs I'm trying to warm up are: 45.79.227.220 45.79.224.9 192.53.124.123 45.79.224.7 192.53.124.254 173.255.243.56 Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Mailing Lists and domains with DMARC reject
On Fri, Mar 3, 2023 at 9:21 AM Jesse Hathaway via mailop wrote: > > 1. Rewrite the RFC5322.From address to be an address from the mailing > list domain, place the original RFC5322.From address in the Reply-To > header. Sign the message with the mailing list's DKIM key. > > This is what we do. 2. Preserve the original DKIM signing of the message by only adding > additional headers, i.e. do not modify the subject or add a trailer > message. > > This was never an option for us, as our users want a subject tag and including a footer with an unsubscribe link is table stakes for a mailing list. Does anyone have any knowledge on which methodology is the most > successful for ensuring delivery. > I can't tell you if #2 ensures better delivery, but even doing option #1 gotchas abound. Many domains, regardless of DMARC policy, do not like it if you send them an email with an RFC5322.From containing their own domain, for example. All messages to Outlook 365 domains need their Froms re-written. Many Exchange servers are set to silently drop messages unless you re-write From lines. On several occasions I have considered just re-writing ALL From lines, regardless of DMARC policy, but that is really not wonderful and when asked, our users were against that idea. It's a maze of twisty little passages... We have to keep a list of domains that require special re-writing, which is updated by hand when people complain about deliverability issues. Hope this helps. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] New Groups.io mail servers
Hi All, fyi, over the next week or two, we'll be warming up 6 additional mail servers, to complement the two that we already use. Below are all 8 IP addresses; the first two are our original servers. Cheers, Mark 66.175.222.12 66.175.222.108 45.79.227.220 45.79.224.9 45.79.224.7 192.53.124.123 173.255.243.56 192.53.124.254 ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Anyone from Spamhaus?
On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 9:13 PM Benny Pedersen via mailop wrote: > > https://multirbl.valli.org/lookup/66.175.222.12.html sorbs listed not > spamhaus > The sorbs listing dates back to the great Yahoo Groups migration of a few years ago. One of the groups that migrated over (I'm guessing), had a spamtrap email subscribed. Did sorbs ever block Yahoo? Don't know, but I was unable to get them to unblock us. Does not seem to have affected delivery. In any event, I did just receive a response from Spamhaus: "After some investigation it appears to have been a false positive. Thank you for bringing it to our attention, we have stopped the rule and are now reviewing it." They're still blocking us, but hopefully that'll be lifted shortly. So, yay? Sorry, just a bit frustrated. I do appreciate their prompt response. I'll take this opportunity to say that if any of y'all see any bad behavior from us, or have any questions about traffic from us, please do not hesitate to contact me directly (Groups.io is a one man shop). I would sincerely appreciate it. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Anyone from Spamhaus?
Hi All, Over the past couple of days, the two servers that send email for groups.io, 66.175.222.12 and 66.175.222.108, have been listed on the Spamhaus CSS blacklist a couple times each. We're an email groups hosting service, like Google Groups. Nothing has changed on our end for quite a long time with those machines, and I don't believe they're compromised. Meanwhile, the email is backing up. I've gone through the delisting process for the IPs. (I assume at some point that'll stop working). I've sent an inquiry to Spamhaus' contact form. I'm scratching my head and feeling a bit dumb. Is there anyone here from Spamhaus that could give me some more information as to what's going on and how I can fix it? Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Did Google become stricter about RFC 5322?
On Wed, Jul 13, 2022 at 8:29 AM Miles Fidelman via mailop wrote: > It's been over a month now, since Google became hostile to email lists. > I'm still dealing with the aftermath. > > How so? We haven't seen any issues. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Best practice for mailing list servers
On Mon, Jun 20, 2022 at 11:47 AM Grant Taylor via mailop wrote: > On 6/15/22 6:19 PM, Ángel via mailop wrote: > > There is a fallback of connecting to the A record on port 25 if there > > is no MX. > > When was the last time that anyone has seen the fall back to A record work? > > Just did a quick check on one of our mail servers and within the last hour we've sent email via an A record. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] 2 questions about BCC and mailing lists
On Mon, Jan 31, 2022 at 10:04 AM Geoff Mulligan via mailop < mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > 1. If a recipient on an email message is both in the To: or Cc: and on > the mailing list, should the listserver send the message to the recipient: > a) By default > b) Not by default (but configurable) > c) Never > > We always send the message back to the sender (assuming they're set to receive every message). We have an option, checked by default, where we munge the Message-ID of the email that we send back to the original sender (and only them). This is to force Gmail and others to display the message sent from us (otherwise they consider it a duplicate and don't show it). Our users really like to see their message returned from the list, as a way to know that it was actually sent successfully. > 2. If a mailing list is in the BCC: should a message be delivered to the > list: > a) Yes - always > b) No - never > c) Configurable > d) Convert it to a CC: > We do A. Cheers, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Best hosting platform was Re: [EXTERNAL] Microsoft IP Filtering - sort of full details
On Sun, Jan 16, 2022 at 6:54 PM Mary via mailop wrote: > > I'm hosted at linode and I manage 100+ mail servers there. To be honest, I > would highly suggest linode for mail server hosting, since over the past 6 > years, this is the first time I encountered a problem. > > No blocks, emails to gmail/hotmail/yahoo go to inbox, never being blocked > by spamhaus and the servers are super fast. Their API is their selling > point, since I can manage my own servers with my own tools (ansible in this > case). > This has been our experience as well over the past 7+ years. Linode has been great; no deliverability issues, very few hosting issues. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] [E] Re: What am I supposed to do with abuse complaints on legit mail?
On Mon, Jan 10, 2022 at 2:16 PM Marcel Becker via mailop wrote: > > We only send FBL/CFL reports if the user actually hits the "Report as > Spam" button in our apps. > > This is very good to know, thank you for sharing this. Only going by users telling us they never clicked the spam button, I assumed there was some automation behind the FBL reports. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] What am I supposed to do with abuse complaints on legit mail?
On Mon, Jan 10, 2022 at 11:24 AM Douglas Vought via mailop < mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > > Does anyone have any tips on handling abuse complaints on legit email? > > When we (Groups.io) receives an FBL report, we automatically unsubscribe that person from all email groups they're subscribed to. We then send them one final email with a link to re-subscribe if it was a mistake. This has been a controversial feature and a source of angst. "How dare you remove me from my groups", "Hey, you've got a bug, all my groups are gone", "I never clicked the spam button". When I was first starting out, my operating assumption was that if we did not act on the FBL reports in this way, that we'd eventually get blocked. I still don't know if that's true or not, but I'm inclined to keep the behavior; it does nobody any good if their group messages are going into spam, and I don't know of another way to get someone's attention. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Corrupt plain text email
On Thu, Sep 2, 2021 at 2:31 PM Ken Johnson via mailop wrote: > > The kind of answer I was expecting was along the lines of "Obviously your > data has been mis-interpreted as XYZZY encoding. You can read about XYZZY > encoding here ." (I did not say so, not > wanting to launch preconceptions.) > > You didn't include any of the MIME headers, which might contain some clues. Could it be something weird with format=flowed? Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] mail.ru broke mailing lists
Hi Lena, On Mon, Jul 12, 2021 at 2:27 AM Lena--- via mailop wrote: > According to Юлия П. in Abuse Team Mail.ru, > they'll not change their new unannounced policy: > messages from mailing lists (at groups.io) from authors @yandex.ru > are rejected by mail.ru though DMARC for yandex.ru is p=none. > > Thus, mail.ru became unusable for all people who participate > in discussion mailing lists. > > I've changed it so that groups.io is now re-writing the From line for all email we send to mail.ru, regardless of the sender's DMARC policy. This will allow your mail.ru members to receive messages sent through us. Relatedly, it does seem like the expectation these days is for mailing list software to re-write the From line when p=none (not just reject/quarantine, which is what we currently do). It is not uncommon for us to get enquiries from people setting up DMARC for their domains. They start with p=none, see a bunch of reports about email sent through us failing that, and then contact us about it, understandably thinking it's something that they need to contact us about fixing before they move to a more strict setting. For others here running mailing lists that pay attention to DMARC settings, do you treat p=none differently than reject/quarantine? Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Contact for Symantec?
Hello, Is there anyone from Symantec here that could contact me off-list? Our server at 66.175.222.108 is receiving '500 5.7.1 Symantec Zodiac' responses from some addresses. Going to https://ipremoval.sms.symantec.com/ipr/lookup and entering the address, it says that the host has a negative reputation. I've tried submitting additional information, as requested, but no joy. Thanks, Mark https://groups.io ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] pphosted.com: 440 4.4.0 Local Policy Violation
Hello, We're getting this response when sending to att.com from 66.175.222.12 and 66.175.222.108. This is a Proofpoint response, yes? I've looked up our IP addresses on their site, and we are not being blocked. So maybe it's a rate limit? I was unable to find a technical contact on their website. Is there anyone here from there that could help? Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Yahoo and AOL slow delivery
On Wed, Feb 17, 2021 at 9:33 AM Michael E. Weisel via mailop < mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > Hi Mailop group, I hope everyone is well. I was wondering if others are > seeing much higher mail queues to @yahoo and @aol then normal that started > late yesterday but got progressively worse this morning? I wasn’t seeing > any TSS errors or backoffs, just very, very slow delivery. After a while I > saw a few timeout errors but not a lot of them. I know that sometimes VMG > makes changes that can cause this but I haven’t seen it this slow in quite > some time. I was wondering if maybe it could be weather related with ice > and snow across the US? Any others seeing similar issues over the last > 12-18 hours or so? Any insight would be super helpful. > > > We are not seeing any issues with either of those domains. Cheers, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Gosh, I love sendgrid
On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 9:53 PM Rob McEwen via mailop wrote: > > The moment "spam" gets away from "consent" and goes into "content" > (specifically *legal* content) - there are enormous problems - because > it then becomes one person's often very subjective opinion - against > another' subjective opinion - about the content. So I 100% strongly > disagree with this opinion that Sendgrid should be the political > "thought police" for LEGAL content that is sent from their platform. I've never understood this line of thinking. Sendgrid is not the government. It's a company. If you disagree with whatever choices they make about how they run their company, you can go somewhere else. Mark (whose service most definitely does not allow some types of legal content) ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] What's the point of secondary MX servers?
On Thu, Dec 17, 2020 at 1:54 PM Grant Taylor via mailop wrote: > > > Mail servers are online all the time, > > Are they? > > Can you /guarantee/ that your mail servers are accessible between three > (~9 hours a year) and four nines (~1 hour a year)? > > If this is really an issue, why don't we have backup A records as well? My website is just as important as my MXes, yet I do just fine without A record priorities... I agree with John, MX record priorities are an unneeded relic. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Looking for possible mailing list hosting
On Wed, Dec 16, 2020 at 8:35 AM Dave Shevett via mailop wrote: > > We're looking at groups.io as well - any other suggestions? > > > I'm the guy that runs groups.io. Feel free to email me off-list if you (or anyone else) have any questions. Cheers, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Anyone from Charter here?
Hi All, It appears our mail server at 66.175.222.12 is being blocked from sending charter.net email. I haven't been able to locate a contact address for them. Is anyone from there on here? Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Trouble sending to cox.net
Hi All, Cox.net is throttling our new email server for groups.io, at 66.175.222.108, with "server temporarily unavailable" messages. If there's someone from Cox on here, can you please take a look? Thanks! Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] New mail server and Outlook
Hi All, I'm bringing up a new mail server for groups.io, 66.175.222.108. I've been slowly sending email through it for the past two weeks or so. But it's being throttled by Outlook (sample: 451 4.7.500 Server busy. Please try again later from [66.175.222.108]. (S77719) [ DM3NAM05FT012.eop-nam05.prod.protection.outlook.com]). I've registered the IP address with JMRP, although after 24 hours it still says the feed is not active. Is there anything else I need to do? Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Anyone from mixmax.com on here?
Hello, Long shot, but is anyone from mixmax.com on here? It appears they are generating emails with incorrectly escaped Content-Type headers for attachments with quotes in their file names, which is causing us to reject their (otherwise valid) messages. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Bellsouth.net contact?
On Tue, Jul 21, 2020 at 2:47 PM Lyle Giese via mailop wrote: > ATT doesn't like Linode. I know I have a server there and have not been > able to get ATT to clear their inhouse rbl entry. > > > Fair enough, but according to the abuse response I got from them, we're not on their RBL. And they're not sending back error messages, they're just timing out either on connect or after we've sent the message body. And it's not all the time, and can happen concurrently with a successful delivery (and to the same IP address). This has been going on a week or so now. Throttling? Maybe? My guess is that they have a couple stuck machines/processes. I've bumped up our max current connections to them, and now the queue is draining, albeit slowly. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Bellsouth.net contact?
Hi All, I think bellsouth.net is throttling the groups.io server at 66.175.222.12 (timeouts either on connect or after we've sent the message, but not always). I've gone through the normal channels, but there's been no response. Is there anyone here with them? Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] t-online.de outage?
Working here: $ telnet mx01.t-online.de 25 Trying 194.25.134.72... Connected to mx01.t-online.de. Escape character is '^]'. 220-mailin71.aul.t-online.de T-Online ESMTP receiver fssmtpd2025 ready. 220 T-Online ESMTP receiver ready. quit 221-2.0.0 mailin71.aul.t-online.de closing. 221 2.0.0 Closing. Connection closed by foreign host. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Secureserver & wanadoo.fr throttling
On Mon, Apr 20, 2020 at 11:37 AM rps462 wrote: > You could be hitting connection limits, recipient limits, maybe people are > flagging your stuff as spam .. who knows? If you wouldn't mind posting some > IPs that you're sending from so people can look, that'd be a start. > >> >> Sure. We've been online for about 5.5 years, and only send group email from one IP address, 66.175.222.12. We send email from ~100 domains, and from some large N of groups.io subdomains. Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Secureserver & wanadoo.fr throttling
On Fri, Apr 17, 2020 at 3:33 PM Michael Rathbun via mailop < mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > > Our normal advice is to put simultaneous connection / hourly volume > throttle > limits on the wanadoo and other finicky domains so they don't defer. We've > had no success in getting limits raised. In some cases, when excessive > simultaneous connections are detected, deferral is 100% until this > condition > subsides. > > Yeah, that's been our experience as well. We're currently limiting to 5 simultaneous connections to orange.fr/wanadoo.fr, and they're accepting about 70 emails an hour. Which, well, isn't going to cause our backlog to decrease... While I'm here, anyone from Comcast, Cox or Earthlink/Mindspring/Netcom? Same issue. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Secureserver & wanadoo.fr throttling
Hi all, Is anyone on here with Secureserver/GoDaddy or Wanadoo/Orange? We are regularly bumping up against their message/connection limits, and I was hoping we could get those raised. Also, this is my first post here, so hi. I run Groups.io. If you ever have any issues with us, please feel free to email me directly. Thanks, Mark ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
