Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
On 02/12/2019 23:59, John Levine via mailop wrote: I warned a guy away from Hetzner and OVH if he wants to send mail so he reasonably asked what VPS provider in Europe is better for sending mail. Any suggestions? Anyone but OVH, linode, digitalocean or ec2would be a good start (for very different reasons). Not that you can't build up a decent reputation there, but you're starting from a fair way behind. I've had reasonable success with ssdnodes.com and hostus.us. Also, how different is it if at OVH and Hetzner if you use their outbound mail servers rather than trying to send directly? Better in some respects, worse in others, I'd imagine. For non-bulk mail, probably significantly better. Cheers, Steve ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
on Tue, Dec 03, 2019 at 03:27:04PM +, Chris Woods via mailop wrote: > I'd avoid Linode, Hetzner and particularly OVH. OVH in particular appears > to be a wretched hive of scum and villainy. Tempting as they may be on > price, you'll never solve deliverability issues hosting on there. Same for > EC2 and AWS. One of the longest running threads on Usenet, IIRC, was people on triangle.food talking about^W^Warguing about who had the best North Carolina BBQ (and for the record, if you hear anyone say that's what they're trying to sell you who isn't actually IN North Carolina, ask "which kind", because it comes in Eastern (vinegar and hot pepper, usually whole hog) and Western (tomato, usually smoked shoulder) styles). It's ALWAYS pork. Sorry for the nested parens. If they try to just sell you "Carolina BBQ" they obviously don't know what they're talking about because in South Carolina they use mustard in their sauce, which is an unconscionable crime and which really ought to be punishable by making them eat it. My wife is from down east NC and she prefers eastern style. I, on the other hand, am a Yankee carpetbagger from down east Maine and like both kinds. As far as I can tell the matter was never actually settled, but I will put my hand in and say that Skylight Inn in Ayden may be the best, even if their hoecake style cornbread is a bit weird, and my wife doesn't like how they do their coleslaw (too sweet, apparently). The best pie is at a place in Oxford, though, but their fried chicken is strange. Opinions vary widely. And we're suffering through a spate of some of the oldest places shutting down - we've lost Allen and Son in Pittsboro and several other vaunted joints recently, which is just horrible and a true sign that the end times may well be coming after all... This thread risks running the same fate. ALL large colo/hosting providers have enormous problems, some so bad I've taken to blocking mail from them by ASN instead of bothering to keep up with who they let robo-host last and blocking by the /28 or whatever. If I know your networks' AS# you're probably failing at managing abuse. All I can say is that the recommendation of at the very least having proper rDNS set up is a good one, as many people and orgs block generic webhost/colo rDNS by default, because if you're in such a hurry to firehose spam out of a new block that you can't even wait for the DNS to propagate, you're probably not sending anything anyone wants. But if all you're trying to do is send mail reliably, I'd suggest you just go with a reputable ESP, or several, and keep a close eye on how they're doing at managing abuse, and whether or not they've just sold out to some other company because that seems to be a harbinger of cost-cutting and abuse desks are basically viewed as a cost center. -- hesketh.com/inc. v: +1(919)834-2552 f: +1(919)834-2553 w: http://hesketh.com/ Internet security and antispam hostname intelligence: http://enemieslist.com/ ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
I have good experience using TransIP VPS. Port 25 block can be cleared with a button and reverse DNS is easy to setup. But I would not use any VPS for larger volumes or ESP services. Maarten > On 3 Dec 2019, at 00:59, John Levine via mailop wrote: > > I warned a guy away from Hetzner and OVH if he wants to send mail so he > reasonably asked what VPS provider in Europe is better for sending mail. > > Any suggestions? > > Also, how different is it if at OVH and Hetzner if you use their outbound > mail servers rather than trying to send directly? > > R's, ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
Another +1 for Mythic. I had a VPS with a host acquired by MB. They onboarded me painlessly and significantly invested in the infrastructure not long after acquisition without hiking up my pricing which I was incredibly grateful for. Upgrades went efficiently with the absolute minimum downtime; their customer service is also generally very good and clueful. However as with any host IP ranges as always will come in to play, even with a reputable provider. From personal experience I've found no netblock reputation can sometimes be as awkward to overcome as poor netblock reputation, moreso for low volume senders. I'd avoid Linode, Hetzner and particularly OVH. OVH in particular appears to be a wretched hive of scum and villainy. Tempting as they may be on price, you'll never solve deliverability issues hosting on there. Same for EC2 and AWS. On Tue, 3 Dec 2019 at 15:11, Paul Ebersman via mailop wrote: > andy> I would also recommend Mythic Beasts. We only used them to send a > andy> low volume of email, but never had problems and technically they > andy> are a capable bunch who I imagine would care about abuse. > > +1 on tech clue and caring about abuse with Mythic Beasts. > > > ___ > mailop mailing list > mailop@mailop.org > https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop > ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
In article you write: >Funny as well, almost 100% of the phishing emails sent against our Mailjet >customers are coming from Linode everyday, dmarc says. I find linode very cooperative when I report spam to them, but they appear to do nothing until someone outside complains. They also by default put all of their IPv6 customers in the same /64 which is of course always blacklisted. You can get your own /64 if you ask, but you have to ask. R's, John ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
andy> I would also recommend Mythic Beasts. We only used them to send a andy> low volume of email, but never had problems and technically they andy> are a capable bunch who I imagine would care about abuse. +1 on tech clue and caring about abuse with Mythic Beasts. ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
Am 03.12.19 um 00:59 schrieb John Levine via mailop: > I warned a guy away from Hetzner and OVH if he wants to send mail so he > reasonably asked what VPS provider in Europe is better for sending mail. > > Any suggestions? https://www.ultravps.eu/ - no issues with blacklists in their Amsterdam location. Regards Bjoern ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
On 2 Dec 2019 18:59:09 -0500 John Levine wrote: > I warned a guy away from Hetzner and OVH if he wants to send mail so > he reasonably asked what VPS provider in Europe is better for sending > mail. > > Any suggestions? Previously I would have said Bytemark (who we currently still use), but the company has recently been sold and things aren't looking so rosy (not to say that things will get worse for sending email though). I would also recommend Mythic Beasts. We only used them to send a low volume of email, but never had problems and technically they are a capable bunch who I imagine would care about abuse. Andy ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
Funny as well, almost 100% of the phishing emails sent against our Mailjet customers are coming from Linode everyday, dmarc says. Le mar. 3 déc. 2019 à 03:08, Steve Holdoway via mailop a écrit : > Well, we did leave Amazon SES a couple of years ago, and I haven't used > them since. Just like my views on KDE, it was crap at version 1, so I've > never used since (: > > Steve > > December 3, 2019 2:45 PM, "Michael Peddemors via mailop" < > mailop@mailop.org> wrote: > > > On 2019-12-02 4:53 p.m., Steve Holdoway via mailop wrote: > > > >> December 3, 2019 1:46 PM, "Luis E. Muñoz via mailop" > wrote: > >> On 2 Dec 2019, at 15:59, John Levine via mailop wrote: > >>> > >> > >> I warned a guy away from Hetzner and OVH if he wants to send mail so > > he > >> reasonably asked what VPS provider in Europe is better for sending > > mail. > >> > >> Any suggestions? > >>> I'm AWS (IPv4 and IPv6) with good results. I would go with AWS for > Europe services. Months ago did > >>> some tests from DigitalOcean ams2 VMs, but for other reasons ended up > ditching it. > >>> > >>> Best regards > >>> > >>> -lem > >> > >> I use linode. Moved away from Amazon SES with their draconian > disconnect policies. Alternatively > >> stay where you are and use a 3rd party - Sendgrid is what we moved to. > >> Steve > > > > Kind of funny, from your side Amazon SES has draconian disconnect, but a > raging problem from EC2 > > IP(s) now and complaints about slow take downs, quite a disconnect > between the two sides > > approaches.. > > > > But overall Linode is not bad as a suggestion, but often with hosting > providers, when trying to > > send email it's your neighbours which will affect your reputation.. > > > > No matter who you choose, you should ensure that things like PTR/rDNS > and 'rwhois' are provided so > > you can be as transparent as possible with your identity, so you don't > appear to be one of the fly > > by nighters that often infest VPS networks.. > > > > SendGrid used to have a great responsive abuse team, but things have > degraded of late.. If you do > > go SendGrid, go dedicated IP, and not shared services.. based on our > reports of increased leakage.. > > > > -- "Catch the Magic of Linux..." > > > > Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc. > > Visit us at http://www.linuxmagic.com @linuxmagic > > A Wizard IT Company - For More Info http://www.wizard.ca > > "LinuxMagic" a Registered TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd. > > > > 604-682-0300 Beautiful British Columbia, Canada > > > > This email and any electronic data contained are confidential and > intended > > solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are > addressed. > > Please note that any views or opinions presented in this email are solely > > those of the author and are not intended to represent those of the > company. > > > > ___ > > mailop mailing list > > mailop@mailop.org > > https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop > > ___ > mailop mailing list > mailop@mailop.org > https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop > ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
Well, we did leave Amazon SES a couple of years ago, and I haven't used them since. Just like my views on KDE, it was crap at version 1, so I've never used since (: Steve December 3, 2019 2:45 PM, "Michael Peddemors via mailop" wrote: > On 2019-12-02 4:53 p.m., Steve Holdoway via mailop wrote: > >> December 3, 2019 1:46 PM, "Luis E. Muñoz via mailop" >> wrote: >> On 2 Dec 2019, at 15:59, John Levine via mailop wrote: >>> >> >> I warned a guy away from Hetzner and OVH if he wants to send mail so > he >> reasonably asked what VPS provider in Europe is better for sending > mail. >> >> Any suggestions? >>> I'm AWS (IPv4 and IPv6) with good results. I would go with AWS for Europe >>> services. Months ago did >>> some tests from DigitalOcean ams2 VMs, but for other reasons ended up >>> ditching it. >>> >>> Best regards >>> >>> -lem >> >> I use linode. Moved away from Amazon SES with their draconian disconnect >> policies. Alternatively >> stay where you are and use a 3rd party - Sendgrid is what we moved to. >> Steve > > Kind of funny, from your side Amazon SES has draconian disconnect, but a > raging problem from EC2 > IP(s) now and complaints about slow take downs, quite a disconnect between > the two sides > approaches.. > > But overall Linode is not bad as a suggestion, but often with hosting > providers, when trying to > send email it's your neighbours which will affect your reputation.. > > No matter who you choose, you should ensure that things like PTR/rDNS and > 'rwhois' are provided so > you can be as transparent as possible with your identity, so you don't appear > to be one of the fly > by nighters that often infest VPS networks.. > > SendGrid used to have a great responsive abuse team, but things have degraded > of late.. If you do > go SendGrid, go dedicated IP, and not shared services.. based on our reports > of increased leakage.. > > -- "Catch the Magic of Linux..." > > Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc. > Visit us at http://www.linuxmagic.com @linuxmagic > A Wizard IT Company - For More Info http://www.wizard.ca > "LinuxMagic" a Registered TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd. > > 604-682-0300 Beautiful British Columbia, Canada > > This email and any electronic data contained are confidential and intended > solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. > Please note that any views or opinions presented in this email are solely > those of the author and are not intended to represent those of the company. > > ___ > mailop mailing list > mailop@mailop.org > https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
On 2019-12-02 4:53 p.m., Steve Holdoway via mailop wrote: December 3, 2019 1:46 PM, "Luis E. Muñoz via mailop" wrote: On 2 Dec 2019, at 15:59, John Levine via mailop wrote: I warned a guy away from Hetzner and OVH if he wants to send mail so > he reasonably asked what VPS provider in Europe is better for sending > mail. Any suggestions? I'm AWS (IPv4 and IPv6) with good results. I would go with AWS for Europe services. Months ago did some tests from DigitalOcean ams2 VMs, but for other reasons ended up ditching it. Best regards -lem I use linode. Moved away from Amazon SES with their draconian disconnect policies. Alternatively stay where you are and use a 3rd party - Sendgrid is what we moved to. Steve Kind of funny, from your side Amazon SES has draconian disconnect, but a raging problem from EC2 IP(s) now and complaints about slow take downs, quite a disconnect between the two sides approaches.. But overall Linode is not bad as a suggestion, but often with hosting providers, when trying to send email it's your neighbours which will affect your reputation.. No matter who you choose, you should ensure that things like PTR/rDNS and 'rwhois' are provided so you can be as transparent as possible with your identity, so you don't appear to be one of the fly by nighters that often infest VPS networks.. SendGrid used to have a great responsive abuse team, but things have degraded of late.. If you do go SendGrid, go dedicated IP, and not shared services.. based on our reports of increased leakage.. -- "Catch the Magic of Linux..." Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc. Visit us at http://www.linuxmagic.com @linuxmagic A Wizard IT Company - For More Info http://www.wizard.ca "LinuxMagic" a Registered TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd. 604-682-0300 Beautiful British Columbia, Canada This email and any electronic data contained are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. Please note that any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and are not intended to represent those of the company. ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
December 3, 2019 1:46 PM, "Luis E. Muñoz via mailop" wrote: > On 2 Dec 2019, at 15:59, John Levine via mailop wrote: > >> I warned a guy away from Hetzner and OVH if he wants to send mail so > he >> reasonably asked what VPS provider in Europe is better for sending > mail. >> >> Any suggestions? > > I'm AWS (IPv4 and IPv6) with good results. I would go with AWS for Europe > services. Months ago did > some tests from DigitalOcean ams2 VMs, but for other reasons ended up > ditching it. > > Best regards > > -lem > > ___ > mailop mailing list > mailop@mailop.org > https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop I use linode. Moved away from Amazon SES with their draconian disconnect policies. Alternatively stay where you are and use a 3rd party - Sendgrid is what we moved to. Steve ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
On 2 Dec 2019, at 15:59, John Levine via mailop wrote: I warned a guy away from Hetzner and OVH if he wants to send mail so he reasonably asked what VPS provider in Europe is better for sending mail. Any suggestions? I'm AWS (IPv4 and IPv6) with good results. I would go with AWS for Europe services. Months ago did some tests from DigitalOcean ams2 VMs, but for other reasons ended up ditching it. Best regards -lem ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
[mailop] Suggestions for VPS providers in Europe?
I warned a guy away from Hetzner and OVH if he wants to send mail so he reasonably asked what VPS provider in Europe is better for sending mail. Any suggestions? Also, how different is it if at OVH and Hetzner if you use their outbound mail servers rather than trying to send directly? R's, John ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
