Re: [mailop] Anyone seen this "email warmup" pattern?
>> I've been catching my customers left and right lately signing up for >> some email warmup service. > > OK, I see I've been completely out of touch with that segment of the industry. Michael, another, somewhat related and somewhat new service model is the one like "MailShake", which gives the user an ESP-like interface, but then sends out the bulk email through the *user's* Gmail account, one at a time (and with no unsubscribe link, to boot). It's disgusting. Anne -- Anne P. Mitchell, Esq. Author: Section 6 of the Federal Email Marketing Law (CAN-SPAM) Board of Directors, Denver Internet Exchange Chair Emeritus, Asilomar Microcomputer Workshop Former Counsel: MAPS Anti-Spam Blacklist Location: Boulder, Colorado ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Anyone seen this "email warmup" pattern?
On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 12:35:54 -0500, Jarland Donnell via mailop wrote: >However, I have reason to suspect Active Campaign may be related. >Roughly one day prior to the relevant outbound events, users who sign up >for this begin receiving a bunch of emails from the domains that they'll >later reply to when this activity kicks into gear. I captured the >domains from the most recent event, and the first one is where I get the >idea: > >https://paste.mxrouteapps.com/?3f1e9c94725acc29#JDHaaiYp4TU9nJLfkwEieqRRu1GXXQUsvxYivhjpo4Ha Fascinating. > >> This falls more under the "fraud" category, since this is a largely >> imaginary >> strategy. > >It's refreshing to not question if I'm alone in this thought. If I have anything to say about it, you will not feel so all alone at all. > I value my >customers, that's why I value one not performing activity which puts the >others at risk. I'm not just aiming to be a good neighbor, I want to be >the best neighbor I can possibly be. Such is the nature of being society-oriented rather than self-oriented. Sometimes the rewards are not immediately apparent. This has given me much to consider, especially when noting that one of my clients appears to be trying to do this on his own. So far, a fair bit of avoidable misery. mdr -- Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -- Voltaire ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Anyone seen this "email warmup" pattern?
I take this to mean that you know they are signing up, but do not know what they are signing up to? Aye. I feel like if I track it down it might lead to more insight into how they operate, and potentially some of that might lead to more ways to proactively block them. They obviously know I'm blocking them, and they're spinning up new AWS services specifically to circumvent the block. I'm starting to suspect that they're even specifically marketing themselves to my customers in some corner of the internet. From my view they appeared overnight and began their siege quite quickly. Since 2013 not a single whisper of this until recently. However, I have reason to suspect Active Campaign may be related. Roughly one day prior to the relevant outbound events, users who sign up for this begin receiving a bunch of emails from the domains that they'll later reply to when this activity kicks into gear. I captured the domains from the most recent event, and the first one is where I get the idea: https://paste.mxrouteapps.com/?3f1e9c94725acc29#JDHaaiYp4TU9nJLfkwEieqRRu1GXXQUsvxYivhjpo4Ha This falls more under the "fraud" category, since this is a largely imaginary strategy. It's refreshing to not question if I'm alone in this thought. I value my customers, that's why I value one not performing activity which puts the others at risk. I'm not just aiming to be a good neighbor, I want to be the best neighbor I can possibly be. On 2021-08-28 09:31, Michael Rathbun via mailop wrote: On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 02:29:17 -0500, Jarland Donnell via mailop wrote: I've been catching my customers left and right lately signing up for some email warmup service. I don't know what it is. I take this to mean that you know they are signing up, but do not know what they are signing up to? What they do is they take SMTP credentials, payment, and then supposedly send a bunch of random emails hosted at other providers and mark them as not spam. This falls more under the "fraud" category, since this is a largely imaginary strategy. If the FTC were still in the enforcement game, this might be an interesting prosecution. mdr ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Anyone seen this "email warmup" pattern?
On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 09:46:59 -0500, Al Iverson via mailop wrote: >Yes, there are whispers of this in the deliverability world. Good >people always recommend against doing this because it's scummy and >unethical and even if it works today, it's not going to work tomorrow. >I am absolutely certain it's something that providers like Gmail and >Yahoo will figure out how to identify and deal with accordingly, if >they haven't already. There are several handles available for administators to grip the problem. As we saw, Hotmail figured out Boris' game quickly. A delightful prospect emerges: when you identify a batch of robot accounts on your system, you simply adjust the filters to convert them to "sudden death" spamtrap accounts, thus reducing all of that business's clients' reputations down to the "do not resuscitate" level. mdr -- My study of life and history inclines me to the apothegm "If you insist on burning bridges, it is often best to cross them before engaging the incendiaries." -- Shebardigan ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Anyone seen this "email warmup" pattern?
On Sat, Aug 28, 2021 at 2:38 AM Jarland Donnell via mailop wrote: > > I've been catching my customers left and right lately signing up for > some email warmup service. I don't know what it is. What they do is they > take SMTP credentials, payment, and then supposedly send a bunch of > random emails hosted at other providers and mark them as not spam. I'm > catching them by their email subject patterns, which you can see some of > here: Yes, there are whispers of this in the deliverability world. Good people always recommend against doing this because it's scummy and unethical and even if it works today, it's not going to work tomorrow. I am absolutely certain it's something that providers like Gmail and Yahoo will figure out how to identify and deal with accordingly, if they haven't already. Cheers, Al Iverson -- Al Iverson // Wombatmail // Chicago Deliverability: https://spamresource.com DNS Tools: https://xnnd.com ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Anyone seen this "email warmup" pattern?
On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 02:29:17 -0500, Jarland Donnell via mailop wrote: >I've been catching my customers left and right lately signing up for >some email warmup service. OK, I see I've been completely out of touch with that segment of the industry. The process of attempting to game reputation systems by sending to robot-administered accounts eventually leads to things like the Microsoft v. Boris Mizhen et al. settlement in 2010. There appear to be a number of companies that offer to accomplish this. Perhaps they also have a few tens of millions lying about unused. I see that Mailwarm.com promises to "[act] like thousands of perfect leads interacting with your emails. This parallel activity sends a positive signal to email providers and their spam filters. ... "Your email account automatically sends dozens of emails to +1000 Mailwarm's accounts, and get replies. Mailwarm daily interactions are sent according to the schedule you set." In other words, actionable fraud, against the providers and against your customers. mdr -- "There are no laws here, only agreements." -- Masahiko ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
Re: [mailop] Anyone seen this "email warmup" pattern?
On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 02:29:17 -0500, Jarland Donnell via mailop wrote: >I've been catching my customers left and right lately signing up for >some email warmup service. I don't know what it is. I take this to mean that you know they are signing up, but do not know what they are signing up to? > What they do is they >take SMTP credentials, payment, and then supposedly send a bunch of >random emails hosted at other providers and mark them as not spam. This falls more under the "fraud" category, since this is a largely imaginary strategy. If the FTC were still in the enforcement game, this might be an interesting prosecution. mdr -- "There will be more spam." -- Paul Vixie ___ mailop mailing list mailop@mailop.org https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop
