Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
I have never noticed obvious issues with Firefox on Linux. I have had issues uploading photographs on Ebay with Chrome and some web-sites don't work properly with Chrome. Perhaps this is because website developers tend to test with IE and Firefox but not with Chrome. If it works in Firefox, it works in Chrome, that has been my experience, and it makes sense; the web is supposed to be browser agnostic, the only special case is IE6, and fortunately it doesn't seem to be much of an issue of late. I wish it's true but unfortunately it isn't. There's 2 well known issues in the chromium bug tracker since years: - starbucks.com - Outlook Web App (OWA) interface Cheers, Fathi ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
Thanks for the user agent tip. It wasn't documented in the man page (probably generated from --help). For starbucks: http://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=15945 On Tue, Dec 28, 2010 at 10:54 AM, fathi.bou...@nokia.com wrote: I have never noticed obvious issues with Firefox on Linux. I have had issues uploading photographs on Ebay with Chrome and some web-sites don't work properly with Chrome. Perhaps this is because website developers tend to test with IE and Firefox but not with Chrome. If it works in Firefox, it works in Chrome, that has been my experience, and it makes sense; the web is supposed to be browser agnostic, the only special case is IE6, and fortunately it doesn't seem to be much of an issue of late. I wish it's true but unfortunately it isn't. There's 2 well known issues in the chromium bug tracker since years: - starbucks.com I don't know what's the issue, looks fine here. - Outlook Web App (OWA) interface That's a bug for Microsoft for stupidly checking for user-agent rather than features, but you can trick it: google-chrome --user-agent='Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.12) Gecko/20101027 Fedora/3.6.12-1.fc14 Firefox/3.6.12' -- Felipe Contreras ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
On Tue, Dec 28, 2010 at 12:50 PM, fathi.bou...@nokia.com wrote: Thanks for the user agent tip. It wasn't documented in the man page (probably generated from --help). For starbucks: http://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=15945 Works fine here (8.0.552.224). -- Felipe Contreras ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
Felipe Contreras felipe.contre...@gmail.com writes: On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 3:04 AM, Lee Fisher blib...@gmail.com wrote: To be very blunt... Firefox isn't nearly as good a browser as Chrome or Chromium. That is the first time I've heard that. From everywhere I've read and talked to and experienced, Chrome is less secure and less powerful. What are you talking about? Chrome beats Firefox in almost every possible way, It seems that the page loading benchmarks are based on 'onload' firing time, which doesn't capture user's perception and isn't neutral (webkit fires it before the layout phase, while Gecko fires it after layout: http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/WebCore/dom/Document.cpp#L2128 http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/bz/archives/020434.html ) And with javascript benchmarks their numbers are very close: http://arewefastyet.com/ why do you think it's gaining market share at gigantic pace while Firefox is decreasing? 1) Windows browsers benchmarked: October 2010 edition Chrome: it's fast! http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2010/10/windows-browsers-benchmarked-october-2010-edition.ars 2) Web Browser Grand Prix: The Top Five, Tested And Ranked Any way you want to analyze the data, Google's Chrome comes out on top. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/firefox-chrome-opera,2558.html 3) Chrome only browser left standing after day one of Pwn2Own Google's Chrome browser, however, was the only one left standing—a victory that security researchers attribute to its innovative sandbox feature. http://arstechnica.com/security/news/2009/03/chrome-is-the-only-browser-left-standing-in-pwn2own-contest.ars -- Roger WANG Intel Open Source Technology Center ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 8:36 PM, Vikram Hegde vikhe...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, 2010-12-27 at 15:44 +0200, Felipe Contreras wrote: On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 3:04 AM, Lee Fisher blib...@gmail.com wrote: To be very blunt... Firefox isn't nearly as good a browser as Chrome or Chromium. That is the first time I've heard that. From everywhere I've read and talked to and experienced, Chrome is less secure and less powerful. What are you talking about? Chrome beats Firefox in almost every possible way, why do you think it's gaining market share at gigantic pace while Firefox is decreasing? 1) Windows browsers benchmarked: October 2010 edition Chrome: it's fast! http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2010/10/windows-browsers-benchmarked-october-2010-edition.ars 2) Web Browser Grand Prix: The Top Five, Tested And Ranked Any way you want to analyze the data, Google's Chrome comes out on top. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/firefox-chrome-opera,2558.html 3) Chrome only browser left standing after day one of Pwn2Own Google's Chrome browser, however, was the only one left standing—a victory that security researchers attribute to its innovative sandbox feature. http://arstechnica.com/security/news/2009/03/chrome-is-the-only-browser-left-standing-in-pwn2own-contest.ars I have noticed that newer releases of Chrome browser on Linux tend to be buggier than Firefox. Are you talking about the stable series? (8.0) I haven't noticed any. I have never noticed obvious issues with Firefox on Linux. I have had issues uploading photographs on Ebay with Chrome and some web-sites don't work properly with Chrome. Perhaps this is because website developers tend to test with IE and Firefox but not with Chrome. If it works in Firefox, it works in Chrome, that has been my experience, and it makes sense; the web is supposed to be browser agnostic, the only special case is IE6, and fortunately it doesn't seem to be much of an issue of late. -- Felipe Contreras ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
On Tue, Dec 28, 2010 at 2:26 AM, Roger WANG roger.w...@linux.intel.com wrote: Felipe Contreras felipe.contre...@gmail.com writes: On Mon, Dec 27, 2010 at 3:04 AM, Lee Fisher blib...@gmail.com wrote: To be very blunt... Firefox isn't nearly as good a browser as Chrome or Chromium. That is the first time I've heard that. From everywhere I've read and talked to and experienced, Chrome is less secure and less powerful. What are you talking about? Chrome beats Firefox in almost every possible way, It seems that the page loading benchmarks are based on 'onload' firing time, which doesn't capture user's perception and isn't neutral (webkit fires it before the layout phase, while Gecko fires it after layout: http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/WebCore/dom/Document.cpp#L2128 http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/bz/archives/020434.html ) Well, that's how everyone is running tests. And with javascript benchmarks their numbers are very close: http://arewefastyet.com/ That's Firefox 4, which is not out yet (beta). Get some results for Firefox 3.6 (stable) and you'll most likely see a _huge_ difference. -- Felipe Contreras ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
Felipe Contreras felipe.contre...@gmail.com writes: What are you talking about? Chrome beats Firefox in almost every possible way, It seems that the page loading benchmarks are based on 'onload' firing time, which doesn't capture user's perception and isn't neutral (webkit fires it before the layout phase, while Gecko fires it after layout: http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/WebCore/dom/Document.cpp#L2128 http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/bz/archives/020434.html ) Well, that's how everyone is running tests. Yeah. Everyone is doing that simply because it's easy, not necessarily mean it's right. -- Roger WANG Intel Open Source Technology Center ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
On 12/25/2010 8:34 PM, Gaveen Prabhasara wrote: On Sat, Dec 25, 2010 at 5:18 PM, Thiago Macieirathi...@kde.org wrote: On Saturday, 25 de December de 2010 07:10:59 sajeev.manikk...@nokia.com wrote: Hi, Can't Google Chrome be out of MeeGo distribution? I mean make it available as a seperate downloadable on top of MeeGo distribution. So that no special mention and projection of it required. We can. There is a netbook build without Chrome. But that doesn't help with having a nice browser by default. What about Firefox? They were co-operative as much as to have a separate Maemo version. So is there any specific reason why it's been overlooked in favour or Chrome? To be very blunt... Firefox isn't nearly as good a browser as Chrome or Chromium. ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
On 12/26/2010 01:34 PM, Robinson Tryon wrote: On Sun, Dec 26, 2010 at 9:03 AM, Arjan van de Venar...@linux.intel.com wrote: On 12/25/2010 8:34 PM, Gaveen Prabhasara wrote: On Sat, Dec 25, 2010 at 5:18 PM, Thiago Macieirathi...@kde.orgwrote: On Saturday, 25 de December de 2010 07:10:59 sajeev.manikk...@nokia.com wrote: Hi, Can't Google Chrome be out of MeeGo distribution? I mean make it available as a seperate downloadable on top of MeeGo distribution. So that no special mention and projection of it required. Yes, that's a reasonable way to resolve these two issues. We can. There is a netbook build without Chrome. The big issue here is not that we have a build with Chrome. The big issues are that the *default* build we're promoting on the *front page* of the (FOSS) MeeGo project (1) Includes a non-Free browser, and (2) Has the word Google all over the download links/surrounding text. Ummm... Looking down the right hand side of http://www.meego.com, I see: * MeeGo v1.1 SDK * MeeGo v1.1 Core Software Platform * MeeGo v1.1 for Handset * MeeGo v1.1 for Netbooks (FYI, this only has Chromium, not Chrome.) * MeeGo v1.1 for In-Vehicle Infotainment (IVI) * MeeGo v1.1 for Netbooks (Google Chrome Browser) Not only is Chrome not a default but the netbook image with Chrome is the last thing listed on the page. But that doesn't help with having a nice browser by default. What about Firefox? They were co-operative as much as to have a separate Maemo version. So is there any specific reason why it's been overlooked in favour or Chrome? To be very blunt... Firefox isn't nearly as good a browser as Chrome or Chromium. First, what's so bad about Firefox? Second, even if Firefox isn't as good as Chrome or Chromium, then why are we bundling-in Chrome and not just Chromium? If we were to use Chromium by default, then (1) We'd have a FaiF browser, and (2) We wouldn't have to display Google's name in such a visible manner for EULA notices. We *are* using Chromium by default. Go download the image and check for yourself. And for what it's worth, there's nothing that prevents you from using Firefox on MeeGo if that is your preferred browser. If you feel strongly enough to make the change, then getting it from Mozilla's site shouldn't be that much heartburn. Ryan What do people think about using Chromium by default? --R ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
To be very blunt... Firefox isn't nearly as good a browser as Chrome or Chromium. That is the first time I've heard that. From everywhere I've read and talked to and experienced, Chrome is less secure and less powerful. Besides, Firefox Mobile (Fennec) is now available for Maego and Android. http://blog.mozilla.com/blog/2010/10/07/firefox-4-beta-for-android-and-maemo/ Someone at MeeGo should ask the Mozilla team that they should target MeeGo, not just Maego. Anyway, it seems the main problem here is that the Google Chrome legal/marketing team is being unreasonably difficult for a platform branding. The MeeGo legal/marketing team should not let random packages redefine their platform. Why does Chrome merit this, unlike all other packages in the system? Dump them, because of this additional complications. If Chrome team feels MeeGo is a viable platform, they should remove these obstacles. How many components of the platform are going to cause this kind of problem until you demand this kind of nonsense to end? Besides, pushing Chrome up front so much kind of makes MeeGo feel like a Chromium-wannabe, further confusing it's current image. My $.02. :-) ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
On Sun, Dec 26, 2010 at 2:30 PM, Clark, Joel joel.cl...@intel.com wrote: Anyone who looks at www.meego.com can easily see there are several MeeGo releases which do not say (or include) Google Chrome Browser. In fact the Chrome Browser choice is at the bottom of the list. Yes, it's helpful that there are choices besides the Chrome browser. I seem to recall that in one of the first iterations of MeeGo, both the Free and non-Free builds got equal billing, so I think it's good progress that we're seeing a little clearer delineation between the default build and the Google build. Each product/device/vertical is free to choose whichever browser they want. What the netbook folks have chosen as an optional release for MeeGo 1.0 (Chrome) has little bearing on what the other devices or Meego derived products may choose. What the netbook folks choose may not influence what other MeeGo developers choose, but it may influence what visitors to the site see and what they perceive about the project. I think that's the primary concern when people see the name Google associated with certain builds of MeeGo, and when people see a non-FOSS build. Several browsers have been included in MeeGo including firefox, chromium and fennec. However as everyone has noted, those browsers did not required a EULA, so they have not been as noticeable as Chrome is for Netbooks. Yes, Firefox, Chromium, and Fennec do not have a EULA on them. But that's not just a coincidence: those browser are FOSS, while Chrome is not. Just take a look as some of the other device releases and you will see this. I'm sure the option for a Chrome download is only there because it was highly desirable to many folks. That seems like a possible explanation for the Chrome build, but I really don't know the who-and-why of that decision. Does Chrome provide significantly more functionality than Chromium? We should be happy MeeGo appeals to such a diverse community and champion inclusion over exclusion. I agree that we should try to make the MeeGo platform as flexible and inclusive as possible. But if there is brand confusion about MeeGo and Google here, it may be prudent to examine the inclusion of software that leads to such confusion. I also think that it may be helpful to define what proprietary software may be included into official MeeGo builds. The MeeGo About page says that MeeGo is an open source, Linux project which brings together the Moblin project, headed up by Intel, and Maemo, by Nokia, into a single open source activity. If the project decides to include a proprietary component in an officially-provided build, then it would be nice to provide some justification for the departure from (as others have called it) pure Open Source. Cheers, --R ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
- Original message - From: Robinson Tryon bishop.robin...@gmail.com To: Clark, Joel joel.cl...@intel.com cc: meego-...@meego.com meego-dev@meego.com Subject: Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product? Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2010 19:06:26 -0800 I agree that we should try to make the MeeGo platform as flexible and inclusive as possible. But if there is brand confusion about MeeGo and Google here, it may be prudent to examine the inclusion of software that leads to such confusion. I also think that it may be helpful to define what proprietary software may be included into official MeeGo builds. The MeeGo About page says that MeeGo is an open source, Linux project which brings together the Moblin project, headed up by Intel, and Maemo, by Nokia, into a single open source activity. If the project decides to include a proprietary component in an officially-provided build, then it would be nice to provide some justification for the departure from (as others have called it) pure Open Source. I've seen a single example of branding confusion presented from an IRC conversation, that Thiago quickly clarified. �If it's still considered an issue, reword the package description as I suggested earlier to make it clear Chrome is an included option, and we're done. As far as I'm concerned Joel and Ryan pretty much put this one to rest. �But to be sure,�I just created a bug for this; let's move the discussion there:� http://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11758 Please vote and comment. Randy -- Ovi Mail: Making email access easy http://mail.ovi.com ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
On Sat, Dec 25, 2010 at 5:18 PM, Thiago Macieira thi...@kde.org wrote: On Saturday, 25 de December de 2010 07:10:59 sajeev.manikk...@nokia.com wrote: Hi, Can't Google Chrome be out of MeeGo distribution? I mean make it available as a seperate downloadable on top of MeeGo distribution. So that no special mention and projection of it required. We can. There is a netbook build without Chrome. But that doesn't help with having a nice browser by default. What about Firefox? They were co-operative as much as to have a separate Maemo version. So is there any specific reason why it's been overlooked in favour or Chrome? -- Thiago Macieira - thiago (AT) macieira.info - thiago (AT) kde.org Senior Product Manager - Nokia, Qt Development Frameworks PGP/GPG: 0x6EF45358; fingerprint: E067 918B B660 DBD1 105C 966C 33F5 F005 6EF4 5358 ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev -- Gaveen Prabhasara ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
2010/12/26 Gaveen Prabhasara gav...@owain.org: On Sat, Dec 25, 2010 at 5:18 PM, Thiago Macieira thi...@kde.org wrote: On Saturday, 25 de December de 2010 07:10:59 sajeev.manikk...@nokia.com wrote: Hi, Can't Google Chrome be out of MeeGo distribution? I mean make it available as a seperate downloadable on top of MeeGo distribution. So that no special mention and projection of it required. We can. There is a netbook build without Chrome. But that doesn't help with having a nice browser by default. What about Firefox? They were co-operative as much as to have a separate Maemo version. So is there any specific reason why it's been overlooked in favour or Chrome? firefox is a google sponsored product too. ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
Hi Tomasz, On Fri, Dec 24, 2010 at 4:53 PM, Tomasz Sterna to...@xiaoka.com wrote: This just came on #meego @freenode [16:36:26] welfg: meego is google's company? [16:36:39] thiago: no [...] [16:41:40] welfg: Download.MeeGo v1.1 for Netbooks (Google Chrome Browser) [16:41:50] welfg: This release requires accepting the Google Chrome end user license agreement (EULA). [16:42:11] welfg: looks like made by google Is this the image we want to project? MeeGo is an Open Source Linux distribution. This means that it provides Open Source software packages conveniently installed for those who download MeeGo or those who buy a computer with MeeGo on it. Some of those Open Source software packages have end user license agreements, some don't. The Google Chrome browser is one of those that do. But the Google Chrome browser is just one of literally thousands of applications available on MeeGo and its end user license agreement has no bearing on MeeGo as a whole. Users can simply remove the browser if they don't like the agreement and download another browser whose agreement they do like, or even on without a EULA. The important point is that MeeGo is Open Source, so you're free to customize and add and remove whatever you want. In no way is MeeGo controlled by Google or any other single commercial entity. Rather MeeGo is hosted under the auspices of a foundation and policy decisions are made by the Technical Steering Committee who make their decisions out in the open in consultation with everyone in the community - including yourself if you wish to participate. So don't let someone else's casual interpretation fool you - MeeGo is pure Open Source and not part of Google. Regards, Jeremiah ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
- Original message - From: Tomasz Sterna to...@xiaoka.com To: meego-dev@meego.com Subject: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product? Date: Fri, 24 Dec 2010 16:53:01 +0100 This just came on #meego @freenode [16:36:26] welfg: meego is google's company? [16:36:39] thiago: no [...] [16:41:40] welfg: Download.MeeGo v1.1 for Netbooks (Google Chrome Browser) [16:41:50] welfg: This release requires accepting the Google Chrome end user license agreement (EULA). [16:42:11] welfg: looks like made by google Is this the image we want to project? There's no bad image projected by MeeGo here. There will always be people who, for whatever reason, can't or don't comprehend what's in front of them. In my estimation the MeeGo project has made very clear what it is and isn't, and the message is being refined as needed. In this case, I could see room for some improvement. instead of just (Google Chrome Browser), maybe the link should say (includes Google Chrome Browser) to make the situation a bit clearer. Randy -- Ovi Mail: Making email access easy http://mail.ovi.com ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
On Friday, 24 de December de 2010 16:53:01 Tomasz Sterna wrote: This just came on #meego @freenode [16:36:26] welfg: meego is google's company? [16:36:39] thiago: no [...] [16:41:40] welfg: Download.MeeGo v1.1 for Netbooks (Google Chrome Browser) [16:41:50] welfg: This release requires accepting the Google Chrome end user license agreement (EULA). [16:42:11] welfg: looks like made by google And right after that: 13:42 welfg whatever 13:42 thiago Chrome is made by google 13:42 thiago MeeGo isn't Is this the image we want to project? -- Thiago Macieira - thiago (AT) macieira.info - thiago (AT) kde.org Senior Product Manager - Nokia, Qt Development Frameworks PGP/GPG: 0x6EF45358; fingerprint: E067 918B B660 DBD1 105C 966C 33F5 F005 6EF4 5358 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
On Fri, Dec 24, 2010 at 9:02 AM, Jeremiah Foster jeremiah.fos...@pelagicore.com wrote: MeeGo is an Open Source Linux distribution. It might help us to advertise that fact a bit more -- I just glanced at the front page of www.meego.com, and I don't see the words Open Source or Free Software anywhere. The word Linux only shows up at the very bottom, in a couple of links and trademark notices. This means that it provides Open Source software packages conveniently installed for those who download MeeGo or those who buy a computer with MeeGo on it. Right. But note that MeeGo doesn't prevent vendors who ship MeeGo from including proprietary software packages (modulo the terms of the FOSS licenses). Some of those Open Source software packages have end user license agreements, some don't. The Google Chrome browser is one of those that do. I believe that the Google Chrome Browser is not Open Source, at least not in whole. From what Wikipedia says, Chromium is the FOSS browser, while Chrome (at least in terms of MeeGo) refers to a combination of Chromium + proprietary pieces. But the Google Chrome browser is just one of literally thousands of applications available on MeeGo and its end user license agreement has no bearing on MeeGo as a whole. Yes, the browser is just one of thousands of packages, and yes (AFAIK), the EULA of the browser has no bearing on MeeGo as a whole. But let's take another quick look at the front page of www.meego.com. Here's the text for Meego for Netbooks: --- Download MeeGo v1.1 for Netbooks (Google Chrome Browser) This release requires accepting the Google Chrome end user license agreement (EULA). --- In this case, the words Google Chrome appear *twice*, while the name of the kernel, the UI, or any other subproject used in MeeGo is completely absent. The important point is that MeeGo is Open Source, so you're free to customize and add and remove whatever you want. Sure. And if some vendor wants to pull the default browser from the MeeGo handset build and put in Google Chrome by default, then I guess they can do that. But when they build their images, I don't think they're going to call their product Open Source. I'm just thinking that MeeGo is a big project with a lot of funding and a lot of smart developers and other staff contributing to it. I'm concerned that it might send the wrong message to other, smaller, less-well-funded FOSS projects if MeeGo calls its product Open Source or Free Software, but then ships a proprietary application installed by default. So don't let someone else's casual interpretation fool you - MeeGo is pure Open Source and not part of Google. I think we're conflating two separate issues here: 1) The use of proprietary software in MeeGo. 2) The involvement of Google in MeeGo or in software used by MeeGo. To address point #1, if there's proprietary software in MeeGo, then describing MeeGo as pure Open Source seems inappropriate. If the MeeGo community wants to be pure Open Source, then I'm sure that the Linux Foundation will back that move. As for point #2, I don't believe that there's any direct involvement by Google in MeeGo. MeeGo just uses software authored by Google (some FOSS, some proprietary). MeeGo may be using proprietary code written and/or packaged by Google, but the choice to use such code was wholly that of the MeeGo project. Cheers, --R ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
use http://dooble.sf.net a free open source browser 2010/12/24 Tomasz Sterna to...@xiaoka.com: This just came on #meego @freenode [16:36:26] welfg: meego is google's company? [16:36:39] thiago: no [...] [16:41:40] welfg: Download.MeeGo v1.1 for Netbooks (Google Chrome Browser) [16:41:50] welfg: This release requires accepting the Google Chrome end user license agreement (EULA). [16:42:11] welfg: looks like made by google Is this the image we want to project? -- Tomasz Sterna Instant Messaging Consultant Open Source Developer http://tomasz.sterna.tv/ http://www.xiaoka.com/ ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
Re: [MeeGo-dev] Is MeeGo a Google product?
Hi, Can't Google Chrome be out of MeeGo distribution? I mean make it available as a seperate downloadable on top of MeeGo distribution. So that no special mention and projection of it required. Regards Sajeev - Original message - On Fri, Dec 24, 2010 at 9:02 AM, Jeremiah Foster jeremiah.fos...@pelagicore.commailto:jeremiah.fos...@pelagicore.com wrote: MeeGo is an Open Source Linux distribution. It might help us to advertise that fact a bit more -- I just glanced at the front page of www.meego.comhttp://www.meego.com, and I don't see the words Open Source or Free Software anywhere. The word Linux only shows up at the very bottom, in a couple of links and trademark notices. This means that it provides Open Source software packages conveniently installed for those who download MeeGo or those who buy a computer with MeeGo on it. Right. But note that MeeGo doesn't prevent vendors who ship MeeGo from including proprietary software packages (modulo the terms of the FOSS licenses). Some of those Open Source software packages have end user license agreements, some don't. The Google Chrome browser is one of those that do. I believe that the Google Chrome Browser is not Open Source, at least not in whole. From what Wikipedia says, Chromium is the FOSS browser, while Chrome (at least in terms of MeeGo) refers to a combination of Chromium + proprietary pieces. But the Google Chrome browser is just one of literally thousands of applications available on MeeGo and its end user license agreement has no bearing on MeeGo as a whole. Yes, the browser is just one of thousands of packages, and yes (AFAIK), the EULA of the browser has no bearing on MeeGo as a whole. But let's take another quick look at the front page of www.meego.comhttp://www.meego.com. Here's the text for Meego for Netbooks: --- Download MeeGo v1.1 for Netbooks (Google Chrome Browser) This release requires accepting the Google Chrome end user license agreement (EULA). --- In this case, the words Google Chrome appear *twice*, while the name of the kernel, the UI, or any other subproject used in MeeGo is completely absent. The important point is that MeeGo is Open Source, so you're free to customize and add and remove whatever you want. Sure. And if some vendor wants to pull the default browser from the MeeGo handset build and put in Google Chrome by default, then I guess they can do that. But when they build their images, I don't think they're going to call their product Open Source. I'm just thinking that MeeGo is a big project with a lot of funding and a lot of smart developers and other staff contributing to it. I'm concerned that it might send the wrong message to other, smaller, less-well-funded FOSS projects if MeeGo calls its product Open Source or Free Software, but then ships a proprietary application installed by default. So don't let someone else's casual interpretation fool you - MeeGo is pure Open Source and not part of Google. I think we're conflating two separate issues here: 1) The use of proprietary software in MeeGo. 2) The involvement of Google in MeeGo or in software used by MeeGo. To address point #1, if there's proprietary software in MeeGo, then describing MeeGo as pure Open Source seems inappropriate. If the MeeGo community wants to be pure Open Source, then I'm sure that the Linux Foundation will back that move. As for point #2, I don't believe that there's any direct involvement by Google in MeeGo. MeeGo just uses software authored by Google (some FOSS, some proprietary). MeeGo may be using proprietary code written and/or packaged by Google, but the choice to use such code was wholly that of the MeeGo project. Cheers, --R ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.commailto:MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev ___ MeeGo-dev mailing list MeeGo-dev@meego.com http://lists.meego.com/listinfo/meego-dev
